Deja Q

Hey, Joe. Hi. So, we are back in Star Trek, the Next Generation's imperial phase. This, for me, all hail. Season three. This for me is Star Trek at its greatest. This is what really brought me in. I 1st watched series one and loved that, but obviously it was terrible. But watching series 3 is what sort of cemented me as a fan. And that season, maybe 34 and 5, perhaps 6, I think, is, you know as good as Star Trek gets. But, uh, like everything is just sort of going incredibly well. And this, I think, is really remarkable in that it absolutely highlights all of Star Trek's flaws and makes fun of them. comments on them a lot. Yeah, yeah. In some great dialogue. Yeah. So this is deja Q, which is about halfway through series three. We have had 3 Q episodes before this, Encounter at FarPoint, hide and queue in series one, and Qhu in series two. And so this becomes an annual thing, doesn't it? We get John Delancey back as queue each year. They're basically getting better and better, these cute episodes as they go along. And in fact, I think they're putting in the punters now because this is the 2nd highest rated episode of series 3 after yesterday's enterprise. I think John Delancey, because he was there in those previous episodes, people are starting to go, oh, man, he was a really fun character. I mean don't get me wrong. This season's getting sort of 10000000 viewers, which is the sort of viewing figures that DS9 and Voyager would have wept over if they'd have ever got them, you know? But these are pushing towards 12 million. This is yesterday's enterprise, which is huge. That's huge for genre television in America. But I remember it being this big. Like I remember that time, like when this was airing, how huge this was. You know, this was my last year at university, like I was an adult by this point. And, you know, like I remember getting tapes from the US because they hadn't been shown here and seeing episodes with friend of the podcast, James Farrow, you know, showing me all of this sort of stuff. And like this, you know, The Q trajectory, this is where Q lands, I think, properly. So in the 1st episode, he's here to judge humanity and he's threatening and odd, but he's not funny the way that he is here. He's certainly not funny in hide and cue. He's threatening in Qhu and Qhu benefits enormously from the introduction of the Borg. Like that makes it a really proper event. And he's great in it. Rot Berry in encounter a PowerPoint. Roddenberry is doing that sort of almighty god figure that he loved in TOS. And then they handed the role to John Delancey, who's really a funny bloke. And I think they changed the trajectory very quickly because in hide and cue, even though a lot of the comedy doesn't land, There is a lot of comedy in that episode. Right. So they're sort of trying to play to his strengths. And then calm Q-hoo. There's a quote on memory alpha where they say Maurice Hurley saw Q as he always wanted Q to be somebody that was teaching humanity a lesson. So that's absolutely what Q-hoo is about him saying, you know, it's a dangerous place out there. You know, be careful because you're going to get a bloody nose every now and again. Oh, by the way, here's the Borg. Whereas the creators of series 3, their take on cue was that he was a trickster and that he would come along and just sort of sturdy ants nest every now and again and have fun with the people on the Enterprise, which is basically what we do from this point on. Yeah. So what we have here with Star Trek the Next Generation is because it's a show about competent people solving space problems and because everyone's their job. And because it's the 24th century and we're all space people, we're not really relaxed, we don't do pop culture references. You know, everyone has a bit of a stick up there, Bart. That means that when Q comes along, his job is to puncture all of that and undermine it. And so he just annoys everyone. very well. And so, like, that's a weakness of Star Trek, the Next Generation that space people thing. Like, I think that the the idea of competent people solving space problems is what Star Trek is, you know, that's what the original show was. That's what Strange New Worlds is doing. But for like 179 episodes, that is a bit wearying. if that's all we are doing and no one's sure. We've had moments. When we did disaster, there were moments where people would chill. We were talking about Riker in that episode and people were like we were like, oh, it's so refreshing to see the charm of this actor, this man coming through on the screen and not just being some robot going through the procedural. Yeah. Yeah. But I mean, I mean, at this moment, like this episode has them solving a space problem, which is an asteroid is going to crash into... the moon is going to crash into the planet Briel 4. Let it happen. She's very boring. And there's no way that at this time that would have been sufficient premise for a Star Trek, the next generation episode because in season 3, we're doing things like yesterday's enterprise and the offspring and sins of the father and captain's holiday, hollow pursuits, the most toys, we've got Sarek, you know the enemy. All of these things are huge and they're all really super memorable, at least for me, because this is where I kind of came in. So, so the Brielle 4 plot is boring, and it is the sort of thing that they would, you know, give a 5 minute scene to in a lower deck episode, if that, you know, in order to make fun of it. And so... Just 2 of you on this move? Blow it up. That's right. That's right. So, so it is like it's kind of making fun of Star Trek by having such a kind of boring and routine problem. Um, but then it gives Q the role of fixing the problem that they have, which I think is really great. So this is an episode where Q is human, naturally as a newly minted human, who else to get him to follow around the ship, but data, and the 2 of them work really well together. Yeah, it's really... This is the data. We've done a lot, TNG, and I have not seen a lot of the data that everybody fell in love with. This is it. I love their relationship in this and how good, isn't it? They're teaching each other what it's like to be human because neither of them are very good at it. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I think, you know, like there is something here as well that is a little bit touching. Like the end of it, I think, works really well because you've got Hugh realising that he's a failure as a human and the data who isn't human is able to be a better human than him. And he kind of sees kind of the moral value of being human in a way. And so he just goes off and sacrifices himself. And he kind of refuses to make it a noble self-sacrifice either. He keeps undermining it. It's really terrific. Like I think it is really quite good. The best line you said earlier, everyone's got a bug up there, but no one can really say their feelings about people. And unfortunately, you know, they spent enough time with Q now that they actually do secretly care about him a little bit. So the best line that the whole episode is where Picard goes tractor him in, you know, it is a perfectly good shuttle. We don't want to lose that. I think that's really great because he's making an excuse to Riker because he's doing it because he really cares. It's, and it's a, it's a rare moment of subtext. Very rare. Well, I have to say as well, like, I can only imagine that the producers and that were just delighted at the episodes that were being churned out at this point were halfway through this year, and like you said, it is one gem after another after 2 very inconsistent to poor years of next generation. And at this point, they're just, it feels confident. There's just something in the air that they can do anything right now and, you know, bringing in this sitcom actor at the end of this episode and completely rejecting the entire main cast, the climax of the story. You know, it just feels like they can do it. And from scene to scene, I just found this really funny. I was watching this at 4 AM this morning. I woke up my arm because I was laughing so hard at parts. And the lines are, they're not always like, you know, gut splittingly funny. But I do think there's a lot of clever lines in this and you give it to people like Whoopi Goldberg, John Delancey, you know? Even Gates McFadden gets a comedy line in this, for God's sake. I think she's really good in this episode. He says to me, what is it? Have they exiled you back to this ship or something like that? I was like, oh please. No, I just thought this was delightful. Of all the next chance we've done so far. This would rank in my top 3 that we've done. I love watching this back. And thank God, it's one where I said was good and it was still good. You know, time has not lied to me. No, no. All right. do you think? Well, we shall go in, but before we do, I just want to give you a little peek into what we could have had had the original production team had their way. Michael Piller recalls on memory alpha, our 1st take on it was that Q lost his powers, came aboard and developed a whole story about how we were about to come into war with the Klingons. Where's that come from? It turns out that Q didn't really lose his powers after all. And he was just playing with us, pulling our strings just so that he could make himself a hero, become an officer and prove his value. That would gut the entire episode of its emotional work, right? But they realise this. It goes, it wasn't a bad story, but ultimately we sat down with Gene and Rick and Gene said, my God, in a moment of, you know, just realising what Star Trek is about. He says, if you're going to do a story godlike and brought to earth, then do it. Do a story about what it's like to lose everything that you are and having to discover your own humanity. He kind of threw cold water on us and suggested we do it straightforward and that's what we did. We made it a comedy. We made it fun, but I think it has some extraordinary things to say about humanity. Good on Eugene Roddenbury because that original one wouldn't have been as fun for one. It wouldn't have been as moving for another. And it just wouldn't have felt like Star Trek in the way that this does. Yeah, this is properly good in Star Trek, isn't it? I just think it's just an ingenious premise to take a god, make him a human and see a day in his life. Well, let's go and sing a day in his life. I think we should. I'll kind of see. Five, four, three, two, one and we're off. So we don't have the usual opening shot. This is a new effect though. They're splashing out. Yeah, they're feeling confident. No, no, no, no. It's a new effect for the for the high definition remastering. Oh, they were definitely feeling flash for that. Yeah, yeah, because it was much later. So here we are in the very boring Star Trek, the Next Generation environmental disaster storyline. Yes. Now, again, it feels like it does feel like this is what the episode's going to be like for a couple of minutes, doesn't it? We're like, 0 God, no, please. And look at these people, like fucking hell, what were they thinking? Like the close-up, really. I can't they're in the distance. Oh boy. No, there they are. Look, look, look. So it's the mouth. It's the mouth. are so bad. Like they've got these tiny little mouths. And so they've got latex covering their mouths. They just look stupid. I know they're facing planetary destruction, but they just have a sombre look about them, don't they? I can't imagine them smiling too much. Yeah, it's just... I don't know. dimples. Oh, those horrible look. The mouth is like one of those leeches. Oh no, it's horrible. it's really gross Imagine the 2 of them kissing. I know you see, there's all sorts of things that they're not going to be able to do with those tiny mouths. It's terrible. They're just dreadful. Could we possibly care about these people? Like, I just couldn't bring myself to care about them. Yeah, yeah. And that's part of the problem, I think. Like you would do something. If you're a good rider, you would just do something that made them seem human, that made them seem relatable, that made them seem relaxed. Instead, they're just sort of exposition dumps. They're explaining the situation here Now, like, there's plenty of technobabble here, but I do like, uh, he does the technobabble, and then he says it would be like an ant trying to push a tricycle which I think, okay. They love a good... I love a good metador in the next generation. What they do do here, though, is what you talked about last week. No, sorry, week before in Meridian, is they get the focus right right? Well they've got they've got the space problem here. But actually, the focus of the episode is cute with the space problem as something for them to sort out on the side, whereas in Meridian, it was a big space problem and the romance was an afterfall. that's right. That's right. Well, I mean, this doesn't have a B plot, does it? I mean, maybe the space problem's the beep part. I think it is kind of... Why does Geordie La Forge constantly shout out its technobabble lines in this? Is it just to add some urgency to that dull plot? Yeah, I think, like, I always sort of view, um, he's the guy on location and oh, here we go. So this is John Delantey actually naked. He's trying to see... He tries to shoot the scene with a modesty pouch on, but it can't work and so he just drops his robe and he's got his dick out apparently, in reality. The actors. Nobody knew. Patrick Stewart was like, what is going on on my bridge? You couldn't do that now. Like, this is not in 90. You absolutely wouldn't be able to get away with that. You're in trouble for that. Yeah. It's a funny animal, total. Couldn't they do a dramatic zoom on Stuart's face when it happened? Oh, dude, but like, thank God he's here though, right? You know, after that. Two minutes of technobabble. He shows some awareness of the genre because he smiles and says red alert. You know, he's kind of aware that he's playing into the opening credits. You know, as a formal, like I always kind of think that he should have a little bit more awareness that he's on a TV show as an omnipotent deity. And obviously he's not that right now, but he certainly knows what's going to happen. I think it's so funny that effectively, he's a child that's been so naughty. He's had all of his toys taken off him by his parents. you know? Yeah. And as we see later with the, I forget what that cloud creature's called. Calamarine. Yeah. So if they're not watching him, He was about to do something terrible sort of at the end of the episode, wasn't he? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But it's so nice to have a naughty character in the next generation. It's like you said, you know, with Marina so. Everyone's so bloody serious in this thing. It's nice to see someone having fun. Yeah. Like Star Trek should be fun and it can be fun. And anyone that says it shouldn't be fun. Wow. Well, I mean, that's what Strange New World is doing. Like Strange New World is properly fun. Like those, it has funny episodes. It has funny lines. It has genuinely relaxed and likeable characters. Star Trek the Next Generation eventually has relaxed and likeable characters. I mean, I like these characters, but they're not very. change chill. Change that opening captain's log there. He goes, you know, we've still got no idea of the cause of this environmental disaster, but queues come along now. So the episode's going to get pretty good. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm not sure about this outfit. Are you looking at his dick in this outfit? I couldn't take my eyes off his stick. And of the other queue when it came wrong later in the episode. I mean, that is a terrible design, isn't it? It's not good, is it? I don't know what they're thinking. We've watched episodes where people have been cinched so much that their dicks vanish and now there is ones that accentuate everything. Well, I don't think it accentuates it. I think it is kind of held in a bit by the costume, but it is kind of terrible. It's not flattering either too. It's Les Landau directing this episode. We've done a couple of it so far, you know, he's our sort of box standard. Get Leslie. He'll do it on budget, director. But I actually think he gauges the tone of this really well. Yeah, well, I like, so I like this. So he's... I start before you defrocks. a lumping human being. That's how I feel every day, if I want to. Troy actually looks quite amused by all of this. Yeah, yeah. She gets a bit of a zinger in a bit later where she says, oh, I am sensing something. I would normally call it being terrified. You know, she's terrible later yet, but... The conclusion I draw later, which is correct, he became human because he knew he's pissed off all of these species and there is no production. No chance that they might protect him if he's charming enough. What he dismissed was the Picard face palm meme. Did you notice that? Yes, I did. He's like, are you not aware we've got all this boring tet babble to get through with no time for this queue? But that's the actual, so it's great to know that the face palm meme is a reaction to John Delancey's cue. Yeah. Nah, that name has gone on to have a life of his own, isn't it? Cue the miserable cue, the desperate... What must I do to convince you people? Die. No, it goes, have you eaten any good books lately, Worf? In fact, there's a load of great gags at water expense sorts. Have you never heard of the boy who cried wharf? It goes a war boy. I actually think those lines are pretty terrible and we are grading on a curve. No, I think they're very far offence. No, no, no. was laughing as well. I was laughing as well disappointed me, Jean-Luc. very disappointed. That's really funny. That's really bad. And then the complaint about being claustrophobic. Like, just how annoying he is as a human and how self-concerned he is. This is a great shot. Where he, yeah, but where he now lays out all of the problems with being a human. Do you think so? that he doesn't want to, he has to not be naked, like some stupid thing about human morality. It's like I'm going to walk around with these clothes on. You know, not sure we could have, you know, put things in front of his bits throughout the entire episode. I love how he says having a breath and then having a pimple? No, he says bad breath and having to bathe, but I think he looks at wolf. Yeah, I think wolf should have come into shot a bit earlier there. But it is pretty great having him stalking around the outside of the turbo lift and then eventually coming face to face with wharf is trying. That's pretty good. And now he's decided he should have been a Klingon. He's really basically a Klingon, and then later on he's going, as a fellow Klingon, speaking to the captain on my behalf. It's like really great. He's so annoying. And the eternally grateful, I would be eternally grateful, which admittedly doesn't mean as much as it used to, which again, I think is a brilliant line. I know more than you could win a beauty contest. I do know what you mean because there is a scene in Purgatory Shadow that we did where Garak tries to convince Worf to put in a commendation for him, to Captain Cisco, and it is much wittier and better written than this. Yeah, for instance. Yeah, he has so much charisma. Yeah that's it. He could spin a lot. Yeah, terrible line and make it very funny. The boy who cried wolf. Yeah that's terrible. Just immediately how annoyed he is, like immediately he's locked up. Although, we've seen the media very often, do we? Sorry? We're in the we're in the brick now. Oh, he goes, Romulan. I should have said Romulan. Oh, boy. We get Don Delancey back as Q. Remember? We did that episode at the end of series 2 of Picard. Ah, yeah. They absolutely had... Well, no, it's not, but he's great. and making making this about the relationship between the 2 of them, because I think that was always a thing, and that's why Q doesn't properly work on Voyager and obviously doesn't work in that shitty episode of Deep Space 9. Um, Because it's Picard, you know, like he's Picard's friend and things like tapestry, where he does this whole thing just to teach Picard about respecting his own youth, you know, like, um, it's so good. I do agree with you. I do agree that his story is with Jean-Lou Picard, but I think he has great chemistry, John DeLancey, with Kate Mulgrew. So I'll wash those scenes till the cows come home. He lives in the bulk of where he's really sexist the whole time and you kind of think, come on. Yes, Madam Captain. No, but Death Witch is a great episode, though. It really does have a lot to say that episode. I hope we get it one day Oh, dear, look, they've somehow managed to make the bridge even brighter than it normally is. I have thought that was impossible. Look at Riker's post and I look at it, it's crutched now. Look at him. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, this HD in this Bright Lion does no one any favours, does it? No, it's really rough, isn't it? It looks practically vanished because he's an albino. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, here comes the little cloud race that want a tortured Q. Yeah but it sort of disappears. Is it done to them? Has he just been... He's been playing about them the way they've been tormenting Picard and the Enterprise, I guess. I mean, you would, wouldn't you, have you had Q's powers? No, no, I don't think I would torment people. I think I would... Which would be for the beach on a Greek island somewhere and... The whole universe at your disposal. I don't need the whole universe. He goes, I'm sitting here alone, helpless, ball to tears. Well, the self-pity thing is really enjoyable. It's really great. And just the fact that he's unable to see that his problems are less important than the giant, you know, moon falling out of the sky thing. Oh, I like the fact that obviously because he's a small bloke. What they say is IQ's 205 or something like that. They realise they realise they have a terrible situation and actually he could help. But I love his description. His description of this terrible thing that he's undergoing. And Picard just immediately goes, yes, Q, you fell asleep. The life was oozing out of me. How terrific. How do you can you stand? just goes, yes, you get used to it. Like, the card is really funny here because he's he's not convinced and he absolutely refuses at any point to play along with him, even when Q comes to him in his ready room and says, I'm going to go and just kill myself or whatever. I'm done. You know, I am a failure as a human being. He doesn't help. He doesn't console him. He just doesn't engage and it's really good. Like, it's really properly good. And so when he saves him, when he tries to save him, it comes as a great... Yeah. I love it. It doesn't happen too often, the characters surprise me. The next generation. And it's great how embarrassed he is about it. Like, he has to justify himself to Riker. really good. Just get him out of that fuck. costume. God, he looks ridiculous. So bad. even Jake Sisco didn't look that bad. Oh, date is coming along now. Yeah, so they remember to give this episode some heart, but they do it with the one character that hasn't got a heart. It's wonderful. Like, he is the character with the most heart. That's the thing about him, isn't it? There's a line, I remember, in the new Star Trek program guide by Paul Connell Keith topping and mine day. They said it's the one where he says about, I'll say it when it comes up. It's about Q being human and it's something that data's always saw. And on that page, it's a bit shonky, the line. But the way Brent Spaner delivers it. It's gorgeous. It sounds like poetry. Yeah, yeah. It's also because he doesn't deliver it with any rancour, you know like he's not jealous and he's not PC. You know, it's you. What is it? You have achieved in dishonour what I have always learned. Yeah, yeah. It means you have... Here it is. I have always... required to be. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Which is a bit of a... It's cheap. Look, you get a gray reaction from John DeLancey at lands, and there's a couple of times where people say things to him, and he learns. Do you know what I mean? Like the thing about the gods is that they don't care about people and they don't learn and they don't change and they only care about themselves. And you get some of that from Q, but Q properly learns in this episode. But these things are so sweet because if you had paired him up with any other member of the queue. The crew, there would have been disdain, you know, and they would have been suspicious. Whereas they don't have none of that. I have no emotion. So it's just really cute between the 2 of them. I really loved it. For a 2nd I was like, oh, can you join the crew? Like, I know he won't, but, like, for a bit. Like, I think that Q is affected by what data says about not... That's why I get him the gift of this. Yeah, yeah, the gift, which is great. He doesn't have to do that, does he? You could just be right see, yeah. Yeah, it's really good. He gives Riker a little gift as well, isn't he? Picard a cigar. My lovely friends, thanks for looking after me. I'm off. Oh, no, here we go. Technabble City. Oh, no, he gets a wonderful line about his stomach rumbling doesn't he? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, he's hurt his back at this point. rumbling. I feel your pain cue, aren't you? Yeah, yeah. You can't straighten up, can he? He can't even straighten up, yeah. In fact, there's a gag in a minute, right? which I thought on the page, that's not very funny. You know the whole thing about, I'm hungry, and so he orders 10 desserts. And then that's it. You don't hear nothing. And then at the end of the scene, the 2 people are sad in there. With 10 desserts. And it should be terrible, but actually, because I'd forgotten about the joke at that point. did make me laugh. It is kind of terrible. The desserts look delicious. Like, no, hang on. Remember that for what Japan's are, all right. This is good stuff. Yeah, yeah, that's true. Oh, change the gravitational constant of the universe. Now that's how God would think, right? Yeah, exactly right. That's how you saw the situation. That's a good idea. Like, it gives Geordie the idea. So by putting as much of the of the moon in the front lobe of the Enterprise's warp field, they make it possible to move it. And it's described, we see a visual of it, and it's described in a simpler enough way that we kind of get it. And so with the technobabble. All that has to happen is we need to know what the characters want. Do you know what I mean? Like what the characters want. What are they trying to do? And the technobabble is just there to make it sound like they... I'm glad there's a visual, though. Because I'll stop listening, just like I, just stop listening to you just then when you were saying, oh, I don't know why. My brain just turns off. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Do you know what I think, right? I think that the actors love working with John Talazi so much because when they see that he's in it, you know, on the castles at the front. They like, oh, we're can have some fun in this episode. So look at Gates McFadden here. Yeah, she's really getting into it. Like, she's enjoying herding him. Your bedside manner is admirable, doctor. But again, I think with Gates, when Gates knows what the lines are doing. She's fine and it's when she's given exposition that she's really shit at her. She's given exposition 80% of the time, Mr. Trump. I know. She could have been the best character on this show. Yeah, it is. It is. No, but, like you said, with LaVar Burton. He can deliver exposition. as if he's talking about going shopping or something like that. very naturalistic. So my theory about him shouting the exposition is that it's almost always because he's talking to someone who's not in the room with him. And so he's, you know, he's our guy on location and we're in the studio and it's like, and what's happening down in engineering? And then you've got Geordie with his face. He's looking towards us, but not at us, and he's talking to someone who's in a completely different room as if he's... Yeah, recently it doesn't quite... It feels weird, is because they're all talking in a very flat sort of story. And he's shouting out every line like this. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like the badge is just there on his chest. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right. But he's doing all the fucking work. They're all sitting there in a chair. Like, he's the one who has to do everything. I think LeVar Burton is the Tim Ross of this show in that he could have been given incredible things to do because I've seen him do amazing things elsewhere. And heart, you know, most of the time, he's very competently delivering a ton of tether babble. But, like, this is the show for that, and he does that incredibly well, I think. But yeah, it's like, I remember him in Picardo's talent, no. Well, no, but I mean, this is sort of Star Trek, isn't it, at this point? Like, that's what it kind of is. Look at this 10 chocolate. Hey, you know what? I realised watching this. I love this bar because it gives them a chance to underlie it. Yes. And they never do that on this. You go and watch Picard. So many scenes are lit like this from below and sort of practically within the set. This is the one place on the Enterprise where they do that. they do that. Yeah, that's on the tables on the bar. Oh, my God. Here comes Gynan. I hear the queue continue and kicked you out. It drums you out. There you go. She's wonderful. So great. She picks up that falcon, stabs it into his hand like she means it. It's true. She goes, you're just one of the boys, aren't you? But so so we have that sort of slightly stupid scene in Hugh Hu where they're kind of... Oh, wow. For some reason, I don't quite know what that is. This is great. And that's just a day's film filming with Whoopi, isn't it? all she's in. Yeah, she just, um, and this is kind of... I don't think they ever seen it again after this. It's really sad. They're brilliant together. Yes. Oh, the whole centuries are being omnipotent. That's dumb to your head, cues. says you're a loser. You're only going to survive on the charity of others. And I think that's unfair because he is smart and he's, you know he's working, but she knows that he's not going to fit in, you know. From now on, I'll do missionary work, okay? Oh, that line is a bit much. The robot that teaches the course and humanity. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, go on. Drive the point home. That's the lack of subjects, T and G I'm used to. Yeah, exactly right. Exactly right. But this, that you're pitiful, and that's what he decides, like he eventually decides that he agrees with her. But so there was something about her being a dangerous creature both in this and in human, the hero, the hero, the Sundays, with a little cherry on this hole, each one. I'm hungry. well framed shot too, isn't it? Um, yeah. Yeah, it's a little bit cheesy. But remember, there was a... a... a dangerous creature. She's a dangerous creature and that never pays off. No. At this point, we don't know who she is, remember? By the time we get to Times Arrow. She's just someone who's having a laugh in history. Yeah, yeah, that's right. And then in generations, she's completely she's a solved problem isn't she? She's an LA who's been in the nexus. Actually, no, I think he's right, because we don't all be Goldberg to be a villain, do we? or a problem? No. We just wanted to make it more dangerous. And they're gesturing at it, but it never goes anywhere. But I just have strong memories of not knowing what she was. Do you know what I mean? Like that not being a thing that I knew. Star Trek fans like the ambiguity of the lions. I think, you know, where you can write, you know, 15 spinoff books about it, to try and explain it. We'll never have to read those, but. Oh, here come. What are they called? The calamarine. Yeah. Can I tell you what, right? Alamorain is what they shout out in Move Along Home. I love Marine. Oh, increasing to 40%. here we go. Back to regular DNG. So they're increasing the shields to get the calamari now, I guess. At least Q's being tortured at the same time. You know, that's quite fun. kind of fun. I just love it when he has the cloud in the palm of his hand though. It just goes, it turns it away, does it? It just vanishes. The fact that he has no fucking humility at all. The 2nd he gets his powers back, he's like, oh, great, right. Here we go. I haven't learned a lesson. No, but you would. I think that's I think that's pretty great. But Corbin Burnson comes in and prevents him from doing it. Every time we see that rock, I'm scared we're going to see those people getting down on the planet. Yeah, they are terrible, Mr. and Mrs. Boring. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, where are they on the Bo Mars scale? 8 or nine. I mean, it's so high. It's the, yeah, pretty high. The sort of fluquo mouth. Yeah, yeah. Like they're trying to deliver dialogue with half of their mouths sort of glued, shut with latex. It's bad. You wouldn't want them. I'm sorry to go here, but you would have wanted them... Oh, yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah. How do they reap notice? We don't want to know. They don't do that. Michael Westmore, try again. It's really bad. It's been since Michael Westmore as well. Well, we've decided a couple of weeks ago, didn't we? Mid-season, Michael Westmore, as well. Everything's very ugly and a bit desperate. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, they just look stupid. It would have been great if they'd just been like green people if they'd just been an Orion, right? Do you know what I mean? Like if you want to make them aliens. Like, the thing that I like is that they work with aliens every day. Do you know what I mean? You've got data calling them doctor and stuff like that. They're scientists and things like that, that's a thing and that's a thing that Star Trek should be doing because that's what it's about. They can't all be humans. They're going to all be those colonists from, um, devil's due with the stupid jumpsuits on. Yeah, they have to be aliens, but these are pretty... We do do call this for stupid jumpsuits quite a lot, though. We do. That's right. They had a standing order with the gap. I'm telling you. And this is where it's becoming real, isn't it? Like, this is what they are. I just mean here. He goes, well, that's not what I signed up for protecting you. I'm not going to be doing that. Oh, come on. So is so is Picard. just saying I'm dumping you at the nearest Starbase, you know. It's John Delansey. Come on. Yeah, if we... No, when Data's speaking up to defend him. Are they really cool? The Bre-L with L, yeah. Yeah, they have an apostrophe, don't know. Oh, there you go, Lala Beaumar. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But at least, you know, it's separating 2 vowels, the Bre-L, they abuse punctuation in the alien races with Star Trek. They really do. So, but see, like Geordie's talking to these people, but he's not in the room with them, and it's one of the things that he does really well, I think, and he does it more than anyone else. Like everyone's up here sitting in comfy chairs and he's down there doing work while and explaining to them what he's doing. It doesn't look too uncomfortable with engineering though. No, that's true. It is... Not like, except when things are original enterprise. We have to crawl all over it all the time. They're doing a lot of these sort of, they really have mastered these tracking shots, aren't they, down the corridor? That's a simple thing to say. There's a lot of... There's a couple in there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. By the time you get to the later seasons. Those cameras are zooming around those corridors like you wouldn't believe. But look how much corridor there is. Like they're not running out of corridor and they're not walking particularly slowly. Oh, they go and run in circles, though. I don't think in that shot. Oh, maybe I should have paid closer attention. There wasn't a cut, though. There was no point where anyone walked in front of the camera, so there was no camera. And here we don't open the door, so we don't move anymore. Do you know what I mean? We don't go out onto the bridge or anything like that. So this scene ends in the in the turbo lift. It's difficult to work in a group when you're omnipotent. He says. There they are on the ties have reached 10 metres. That's pretty good for surfing, that is. Yeah, again, because they can't show us that they can't afford to show us that. All they can do is tell us about it. Oh, this woman at the back end. No, she's sort of holding her hands together, frustrating her. Please help us, Captain Picard. And look at her now. There is one extra person walking about behind them just to show that it's a fully populated planet. It is. There's at least 4 people. You don't blow up the moon when there's four. Only when there's two. Yes. See, with a name like Calamarine. You think the makeup would be like calamari, right? No, no, no, the clown people. We never actually see them. They're just a cloud. These are the brown. I'm getting very confused. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, cues now joining the engineering team to now count. Yeah, and so he comes in and just takes control because he's the smartest person in the room, so obviously he's going to be in charge. And we had that conversation about him not being able to do, like he can help, but he can't get this. I don't give him tank smarter than it. Yeah, a 1000000000 times. You step aside gracefully, you know. Oh, Q, get to the controls or get the hell out of here. Am I watching Babble or 5 now? No, I just think it's really great. I don't know what that means. I think it's great though. But everyone is horrible to him except for data. It's lovely. I know. I love it. And data's the one telling everyone. No, he is human. No, he is trying. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I feel as if they has genuine stakes in Q and this friendship. And Brent Spiner does it all without really displaying much of an emotion. It is such a skill. He's really great, isn't he? I can't understand why by the time he got to, you know, after the movie. I'm never putting that fucking makeup on again. I had enough, you know. He did, though. Never say never. You did. You did a payoff for enough money. You did. Do you think that's a dynamic shot? You know, the rock heading towards the planet and the little cloud there. I mean, that's a better version of what they were actually able to achieve in the 1980s, though, you know, because we're behind the rock. It doesn't seem to be moving. That's the idea is it's supposed to be moving, right? But it would have been a physical prop. Like the rock would have been an actual kind of painted polystyrene thing that they were shooting. You know, the same way that the planet was a big round polystyrene ball, that they projected the surface onto um back in the day. So there was no computer generated imagery at this point. It was all water. That would have been someone's job to make that polystyrene rock you know, just like, man, they must have been heady times for that special effects, man. Yeah, so this is these are the replacement effects for the high definition. I'm assuming that's what you're watching. That's what I'm watching. HD version, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's why whenever we do DSI and Voyager, I'm always just so irritated by the fuzziness of the SD. Yeah, yeah. Never mind. one day. They are getting better at doing these things now where you can just put it all for a processor and make it shut up or anyways. The AI is taking over. God, I sound like an old man. will come. I think it will. That's a very nice shot there at the Enterprise. It's not the original shot at all, but that is a beautiful shot surprise me. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I wonder who this lovely lady is at the con right here on the road. She doesn't get to do anything. What is it that Wesley stay on? She gets a lean forward then. She leaned forward briefly. She looks across at the other guy. A highlight of her career. They're being scanned again by the Calamarina, aren't they? Oh, so this is pretty good, I think. So, so now we have the situation where, in fact, Q. presence is interfering with a mission and is causing the mission to fail because the moment they lower their shields to do the thing, Q gets attacked. Do you think they winched him up in the air there? Yes. Like genuinely. I think they've hit, yep, they've winch. It looks great, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. A good physical effect. Yeah, so then obviously Q then makes a decision, even though he's not going to say I care about you people. So I'm going off. He's just like, it's easier with me gone, Jean-Luc. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I like that a lot. And then it gets undermined in that scene with Q2, which is pretty great as well. It's actually, whoa, you know, might not like this. Like, Q not saying, I care about you people. That's where I'm going. Picard, not saying I care about Q. That's why I'm bringing him back. It is quite touching and less saccharine than everybody explicitly stating their emotions in Kurt, which they love one another like on Discovery. unendurable on Discovery at times. Sometimes I could do it without subtext. No one does it to no one does it to Giorgio, though. you know, like Michael clearly loves Shawjo in a way, but they don't have gloopy conversations about it. interestingly. Lower decks does that extremely well. The subtext thing. Because very often the characters, I don't really want to say what they're feeling. And so they do something that shows what they're feeling, although they still have great moments. Yeah, those 4 love one another. psychological insight and emotional drama for a cartoon. I'm also with this, which is actual live action TV. Well, live action is probably overstating. Slightly comatose action... in the sets talking to one another. Oh, God, when I was a kid, you know, I was desperate to know what was in those kind of jars. Yeah, they look great, don't they? So I think this scene is really proper. It's wonderful. In fact, I think the rest of the episode now is pretty much all great. Oh, he's sitting down, thank God. Yeah, yeah, we don't have to look at his dick. It's, it's just the, it's Picard's refusal to, um, to really engage. you know what I mean? Or just, you know, he lets him speak and he listens to him, but he doesn't participate in the conversation that no more me, imagine no more me, and no one would have missed me and he just doesn't say a thing. And that's really portrayed well. I can remember as a kid the 1st time I recognised what death was and it profoundly changed how I looked at things, you know? And he's playing it. hes not overplaying this. He's not doing this for comedy now. He's playing this as a dramatic role for this scene. I feel ashamed, he says. I am not your father confessor. You will received no absolution from me. He just refuses to join in. He refuses to help. He's still, you know, you are a problem and you are still the problem. You are standing in the way of us doing our job and our job is saving 1000000s of people and you're here talking about yourself you know, like this is still poor behaviour. Although, he goes, I won't participate in this joke, queue. And he goes, if this is a joke, the joke's on me. All right? I don't know. I think maybe, maybe I would have liked to have seen a little more empathy from Picard. I think this works really well because I think too, the other thing that happens is the relationship grows. Don't you think? Like the relationship grows. By the time we get to tapestry, where he takes it back to his path. It's beautiful. In fact, it's almost a bit of a shame in all good things that it takes a bit of a backstep in that. Exactly that. In fact, it's a little bit striking in context. isn't it all good things? It's just, oh, cue's back like this again. This is really good. I love this scene. And I think it's genius not giving not giving any reply to data. I know. Yeah. Yeah, I thought that was really clever. Just believe me, you're missing nothing. But look at the smile. Look at the smile. Oh, that line, but if it means anything to you, You're a bad human than I. how he delivers it too, just with that subtle smile. It's wonderful. I don't think TNG is thoughtful as this usually. Not often anyway. Yeah, they were really, Gene Roddenbury really made a good call strip it back. Don't make it about a war, make it about the people involved. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. I've given you so many of these ghastly godlike beings over the years. Now let's see what they're really about. Oh, wonderful. stolen the shuttle. Shut off and identify yourself. He's so good. Really? There we go. just can't get used to following orders. That's the reason he's going. That's crazy out this way. Yeah, you're right. He totally rejects the self-sacrifice, doesn't he? Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's clearly what he's doing in a way. It's a bit on the nose, he goes, please don't fall back on, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah. Obvious cliches. My life as a human being has been a dismal failure. Does he smile and undermine it? There is something like I think... Yes, here you go. This is so unusual now. This scene in the show. As a human, I would have died of boredom. That's a gray line. But just to neither any of the regulars in this scene. It's so weird, right? It's like, it means cues important. That shot is great too. He's that almost one of our ensemble now. Yeah, yeah. But this shot, where I think the thing where the thing's coming after him is pretty good. The one where it comes down over the camera. Yes, this. Beam it back. And then he loves a good shuttle. And Riker's looking at him judgementally. Pretty good. And then weirdly, another striking thing about the scene in this shot. It feels like it's been ripped out of a sitcom. Because it is 2 comedy actors. Yeah, saying comedy lines. So Corbin Burnson is huge at the moment. He is in LA law. And I never watched LA law, but it's very 80s, and it obviously had Diana Muldar in it. Remember, she was the one who gets shoved down the lift shaft. Well, she just opens the door, walks into a lift, but it isn't there and she just falls to death. And the only scene that I ever watched of LA law. That's what happened. It's just like, shit, that's a thing. So he's playing it as if he's in a completely different show. And I think that works really well. I think we see another performance in the next generation like this ever. It really stood out as something striking. It's a little bit like Matt Frewer does it a little bit. you know what I mean? Like it is a little bit of a sort of, but there's a very relaxed comedy thing to it. But what I really like is when he realises he's done a selfless act, you know, and he goes, ah, tiny bit, tiny bit selfless, and he's kind of like... body language. and like we were on a crew of people that barely move. And his arms are wave and he's looking at his hands like, oh, I've got hands. What's going on? He's overdoing that a little bit, I think. Yeah, and I agree, but it's refreshing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, it is like the whole point. I think, you know, and he's understood it, is that these 2 are relaxed. In fact, in this one, it's our cue who is got the stick up his bum. Isn't he compared to the compared to the other queue? The other cue's much more relaxed, whereas our cue's been hanging out with humans a bit and is, you know, being a little bit more stiff. Um, the way he delivers the line as well of, um, you got your powers back. It's like, it's so casual. But the other thing too, which I think is super important is that he tells Q that they tried to rescue him. Yeah. Yeah, you know, that he said, no, no, I'm going off. I'm going to sacrifice myself, and I'll take the calamarine away so that you can save this planet. Um, but he, he knows that they, at least it was a teeny bit selfless, wasn't it? That's my problem. I can't go back to the computer and tell them that. There's got to be inquests and exclamations. Oh, man. And we see that. We see that in Voyager, right? And they're very boring. But this is kind of cute as well because he thinks he's an art of failure as a human being, and he refuses to frame his self sacrificing those terms. Like, do you know what I mean? He just says I would have died of border, my machine human, all of that sort of thing. But then he kind of goes, actually, it was selfless. I was pretty good, wasn't I? That's what David did. You know, I said, what's me of? This reminds me of. I'm going to make a talk to reference. of a way old doctor reference. Tara of the autons. when that fella turns up and just delivers a load of exposition and tells the doctor and then pops off again exactly the same thing. Oh, look at his head in the air. sticking through the bulkhead. Try and stay out of trouble, he says, as is off. Now we're back in a proper queue episode, you know, and Q takes over the show because he's omnipotent, which is pretty great, so they don't know what's hit them. Like, it's very clever that they take away all of this, you know the fact that he can come on with a Mexican band and they make it and all these things, they take away all of the fun stuff around you and he's still all the funnest things. Yeah. Yeah. I do think I do think a lot of it is John Delancey, though. Oh, no, absolutely it is, which is why you're getting back in Picard, you know. It's a personality. You just can't contain, is it? They try. I'm immortal again. Omnipotent again. The cigar is pretty funny. I don't need your fantasy women. Excuse me, you don't usually complain, Riko. What are you talking about? She's brought her tits with her, this one on the left. That's a cheek. I mean, look, this is what I mean about. of them have any body language. They're so still. Oh, it's lovely when Picard's really pissed off and everyone's having fun. I feel like celebrating. I doubt. Yeah, but they're still in the middle of the thing. Do you know what I mean? They're still in the middle of this sort of boring episode, this boring. wave that away already. It's already done They don't know that. And I think that's great as well. Like he just does that on the way out and he doesn't comment on it. He doesn't draw their attention to it. He doesn't ask to be thanked. He just does it on the way out. And I actually think that final line is a bit of a shame that they have to tell us, you know. That's the difference between this and Q Hu though. And Maurice Hurley's approach and this approach, and this approach we want to leave you as our friend and he does something nice for them. And Q who, he takes him to a region of space where the Borg, slice open a section and murder people. And at the end, he goes, well, Yeah, that's the universe. They're 2 very different takes. I'm not sure which one I prefer actually. I like this, though. Oh, it's so overdone though. They just can't do comedy on the bridge, can they? Well, it's it's Brent. I mean, when Brent, like Brent pulls this shit in generations, when he gets the emotion... Oh, that where he turns around and you think he's finished, he turns around, he looks at Picard and then just roars with laughter I think he's really great. Like that's that's pretty good. And then... I can't decide whether this is a very or worse comedy scene than the one we saw at the end of disaster with all the kids on the bridge. They're like pretty terrible. I think it's a great gift. Remember when he tries to give them more gifts in hide and cue? Oh, terrible. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. But that gift is perfect. And it's seeded in early. Do you know what I mean? I never know what it's like to laugh. Oh, Jesus Christ. The most faithless runner. Captain Picard. I don't know how you did it, even though they still can't raise a smile because of their sucker mouth teeth, you know? No, yeah, yeah. Oh no, she's trying to smile. The woman's trying to smile. tragic. Poor Deanna Troy has done fuck all in this episode, is she? She got that one line. This is the episode where Q is human. They've given it all to data. Well, the women have had one tiny scene each, haven't they essentially? More than they often get, you know? Yeah, yeah, that's true. That is true. I'm not saying that's a good thing, by the way. No, no, it's a terrible thing. Yep. Oh, it was fun. Let's swap off now to the next place. Oh, no, he's got to have the cigar yet, hasn't he? Yeah, yeah. And I think this is a bit shit because perhaps there's a residue of humanity in cue after all. Like, do we need that? Do we have to have that? It's just like Spock sneaking out to us in that animated series episode, isn't it? You know? Lucifer wasn't evil after all. That's right You could have just had the joke with the cigar. Even though that isn't that funny. But that's a bad joke as well. like it is supposed to slightly undermine the character developer we've had with Q or whatever. Do you know what I mean? Like the humanising of Q, but it is a little bit crap, I think. I would, there's too many jokes in that last scene. I would have restructured it. I would have had the sequence where the woman comes up on the screen and goes, Captain Picard. A miracle's happened. Get that over and done with, then do data laughing and end on that. Yeah. Because that's the best part of that scene. you know, because that's the most touching part. Apparently it's the most funniest part. So end on a high. I do think, though, that, you know, we start with him not giving a shit about that, you know, like he's more concerned about sleeping and and being hungry and having back pain and he's constantly derailing conversations about the main situation. You know, the Bra L 4 situation. And so to have him casually fix it without saying anything. I think he's really great. And I think it's a shame that they have to hang a lantern on it really. The reason the whole episode pays off, isn't it, is that in the 1st half of the episode, everyone's being a bit mean to each other. In the 2nd half of the episode, we realise everybody cares about each other. That's a lovely payoff. Yeah, yeah, I agree. I agree. Yeah, no, I think that's a that is a pretty excellent episode. And even in the context of a really strong season. That's pretty great, isn't it? It is familiar. Yeah, I'll just repeat why I said it at the start. Yeah, I think this is top 3 of the next genes we've done so far. And I can only guarantee the next one won't be as good. All right, it's the end of the episode, and it is time for us to work out where we're going next. This was your choice, Joe. and an excellent choice. So it's my turn to come and completely stuff it up with something ridiculous and terrible. And so where else will we go, but Star Trek Enterprise. I knew it. I knew you were going to say. You're the only person that takes us to Enterprise. Okay. Yeah, no, very intrigued. Kind of intrigued. And we are still a little bit behind on our coverage of enterprise. So we have to eat our vegetables eventually and that Star Trek Enterprise. So I have picked it on the randomiser. And can I just remind people, if you go to untitled Star Trek project.com slash randomiser, you can, like us, pick a random Star Trek episode from any series. So if you're kind of wondering what you want to watch and Agonising choice. The agonising choice of 1000s of different episodes. I actually went up into my cupboard yesterday and found my old box where I'd written down to that point, every episode of Star Trek on bits of paper, and told them up and put them in a box. I just had to wait to meet you, really. I do a randomiser. A small shout out to Dave Rennie, who, in fact, regularly uses the randomiser and often tweets about the episodes that he got as well. Yeah, yeah. So there's 940 episodes at the moment as we record. that you can choose from, but I'm going to choose from the 97 episodes of Enterprise that exist, and here am I pressing the most 100. Stalling, isn't it? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Your random Star Trek Enterprise episode is minefield. Season 2, episode 3. Well, it looks like it's the great bomb dissection episode from Enterprise. Jammer gives it 3 stars, which is not promising because we don't use slightly. It's a bit of a bam, he reckons. And 2 stars better than the magics of Makers 2. Yeah, all right. I'm gonna pick another one. Silent enemy, season one, episode 12. Oh, do you know, series one is such a blank spot to me because I never get through it. Let's have a quick look. He says, silent enemy, might as well be called the McGuffin enemy because that's what the enemy here is, big McGuffin. Well, that's most Star Trek episodes, isn't it? Average, he says, 2.5 stars. It doesn't as good as Ben. We do have to, yeah. We have to do average ones. We do have to do average ones, but you know what? After doing such a great TNG. Let's try and find something. All right. I think you're right Ah, we've rolled this one before. and I am intrigued. This is season two, episode two, carbon Creek. Why did we do that one? I can't even remember. I think we thought it was a little bit low-key. can't remember, but we did decide against it. Jama gives this one star less than Bem, one. 5 stars out four. It was originally 2 stars, but changed his mind. I didn't mind this, but I still think you should roll again. Okay. Season one, episode 15 Shadows of Pajam, and we've mentioned Pajam. I can't even remember what it is. Is it a? It was in, it was in the Vulcan. Yeah, the in series 4, wasn't it? Jama says it's mediocrity at its finest. Oh, dear. That's what we're tuning in for. Perfectly. Yes. Maybe one more time. Try another one. Let's make it this one, though. whatever you hit. Season four, episode 18, in a mirror darkly. Yes. Oh, yes, let's do it. Is that a one part episode? It's a two-part episode. It's got the corn in it. They make Hoshi look like a sexy bitch and she's evil. Please let's do it. Both of those episodes, you know, if it's a two-parter. So what's the other episode called? Do you know? It's called Inner Mirror Darkly part two. Oh, okay. That's imaginative. Listen to this, though. Listen to this. I know how it starts. It has its own opening titles. It does. And that's one of many things that gets right. In the mirror universe. Archer stages a power play to take over the enterprise, initially under the command of Captain Forrest, and diverts it deep into Folian space. We see the folian web again as well. brilliant. Do you remember them really leaning into TOS at this point? And this is the one time, I swear, it's the one time where Enterprise chills the fuck out for a couple of episodes and has fun. Oh, please let's do that. let's do that. That's a brilliant idea. That's awesome. Brilliant. You've been listening to untitled Star Trek Project with Joe Ford and Nathan Bottomley. We're online at untitled Star Trek Project.com, where you can find subscription links and links to our social media accounts. Our podcast artwork is by Kayla Ciceran, and the theme was composed by Cameron Lam. This episode was recorded on the 30th of July, 2024, and released on the 9th of August. We'll see you next time for Star Trek Enterprise, Inner Mirror Darkly, and Inner Mirror Darkly, Part 2. I love doing that, you know, it's like, I'm, like, collecting my thoughts, you know. You just get all these random messages from me about the episode. Yeah, no, that was good. That was good. Did you did you press the other record as well? I did. I did. Excellent. I'm just gonna take all of the big list of episodes. Copy. And then just paste it in here. Season two. Did you watch the... Did you watch the, um, um, recording? Yeah. Did you watch that clip that I sent you from Strange New World? I had already seen it. Okay, okay. I wanted because you were quite quick. It is, I think, absolutely brilliant, like so great. And like, um, what's her face? I can't even remember that character's name. Is it Pella? What's she called? The engineering woman? The lanthanite, the woman from Kimmy Schmidt? Okay. You know, she says, oh, it doesn't work on me that that looked like so much fun. And then she goes, um, it's like when I took LSD in the 1960s and the 1990s and then last July, like it didn't work on me. Like, I just think she's the best thing ever, and I'm hugely excited that she's in it because Scotty's in that clip, and I thought that, you know, Scotty would replace her and we wouldn't get Scott, we wouldn't get her in series 3, but I'm really glad she's in series 3 because I think she's fucking magnificent. to watch series two. Yeah, which is really good in series too. But I mean, clearly the episode that they're doing is the sort of annual sex comedy or annual comedy about, you know, Spock as a Vulcan. Suddenly everybody is a Vulcan. Suddenly, everybody's Vulcan, and they're better at being a Vulcan than him. Like, that's the point. Like, and even that 4.5 Vulcans to beam down, you know, and they just solve the problem in in like 30 seconds and then being back up and presumably the rest of the episode is just them being Vulcans and being better at it than Spark. But all of these people losing their shit online about it being racist to Vulcans. Have you seen that? They do know it's not a real species, right? crazy. It's so crazy. They're kind of going, but you couldn't, what about culture? You know, it's not just DNA, it's culture. You don't get that from a hyper, hyper spray. I mean, you can't get DNA. Have you seen Genesis? Yeah, that's right. You could do a lot with a hyper spray. Oh my god. And when Riker and Troy became the Mintarkins, who watches the watches? Yeah, but they didn't become, you know, Mint Harkins, they just put their ears on them. Do you know what I mean? But this is them becoming Valcans and you've got, you know, Pike with massively tall hair and and like, you know, brave hair. These are people that only watch Star Trek and it is their entire life and their houses have been turned into Starships and they wear the uniforms. It's a sense of perspective whatsoever. But it's also a way of watching Star Trek too. Do you know what I mean? where the races are kind of real. And, and so, so, this is, you had this conversation with me. You know, and you go, no, no, this pretend person that they're saying is real is no less real than the real the pretend people you're watching all the time. But these people don't think that. No, they do think they are watching future history take place. That's right. So it's like a Vulcan isn't really an alien race in an ancient culture. It's a type of character that we get on Star Trek. And so we get, you know, like them being that type of character. The fact that you would even need to spell that out is astonishing. Like, what did they think of Wedge Doodge? Do you remember that episode of Lower Decks? It's 3 ships and it's like the... The Falcon ship and the, and the, and the Klingon ship and I guess the, you know, the Cerritos. And but that makes fun of the Falcans as well in the same way. Just think there's no, there's no point trying to rationalise with these people. because you never will make them. anything that is not their point of view. But it's kind of like a bad way of watching television, like an in a bit. But that's a lot of television family. That's a lot. I think that's a small amount. I think that's the majority of the fans. Yeah, those people that go to conventions that consider this an enormous culture rather than a television show. Yeah, I do. I think you and me are the outliers in Star Trek fan community. Because, I mean, the show could do both. Do you know what I mean? And it's entirely possible that that episode lands on. actually being a Vulcan isn't just having the years and that stupid thing and the giant thing. Of course he's going to do that, right? That's just that. So it's almost certainly going to be that. And it's going to be that because he's grown up Vulcan and it dealt with issues of identity and stuff like that. He's a real Vulcan in a way that they aren't. Like that's almost certainly how the TV episode's going to go. But because they're so bad at watching TV. They can't even kind of work that out. It's very odd. I will say one thing. I am a little bored of Spock wrestling with his Vulcan heritage now. I mean, we've done this a long, long, long, long, long, long. We've got a great new actor in the park, but we are sort of. We're going over old grounds with better writers. So that's a good thing, but it is kind of... Concept thing, like the 1st episode where he swaps bodies with Dupreme, which is just unbelievably great. And then the 2nd episode where he becomes human just in time to meet his in-laws and he has to pretend to be Vulcan because he becomes human. Like, again, is so funny and so ridiculous. Like, Spocks do ridiculous things in the original series, lest these Star Trek fans forget, you know? Yeah. Like, it's not like this is a new idea, you know. Spock the centre of a Star Trek comedy and doing crazy wacky things with him. But I think it's taking the piss. It ain't. It's having fun with the character. Yeah, exactly. Have fun with Star Trek fans.