Hey, Joe. Hi.
So, after last week's triumphant episode of Star Trek Picard, we
decided to give Star Trek the next generation ago, and there's
roughly a 50% chance, I think, of getting an acceptable episode.
Oh, you think as high as that, do you?
Yeah.
But I think we've got one of the greats and one of that is
actually a lot better than even I remember.
I held it in sort of quite high regard before, but I thought this
was better than I remember.
So this is series four, episode seven, reunion, and it's the 2nd
one in a row that we have done directed by Jonathan Frakes.
So we watch one from 2023 that he directed and this is one that he
directed in 1990, just when he's starting out as a director.
And obviously the one in 2023 was technically more competent, but
you can see signs of the greatness to come in the direction of
this as well, I think.
I went exploring online to see how I felt about this because I
knew I'd written 2 reviews about this.
And one I gave it 10 out of 10 and the other one I gave it 5 stars
out of 5 stars.
I've always loved this.
It's truly in TNG's era of confidence, isn't it?
We've gone through the very, very rough patch of one and two.
Three is the show pulling its act together and now four is
essentially just producing one banger after another.
Yeah, this is Star Trek, the Next Generation's imperial phase, I
think.
But it's doing something interesting because Star Trek is a
procedural, as we said many times, and it was aiming for
syndication, which meant that it had to be able to be watched in
kind of any order.
But what we're getting now is the 3rd Klingon episode in a row
that, um, you do technically have to watch in order for them to
make sense.
Well, but there's enough sort of said.
I mean, we kind of get it.
So in series one, we had Heart of Glory, which isn't about
anything and doesn't end up going anywhere.
Series 2 has the emissary, like towards the end, and so that's
where Kayla is introduced.
And then last year we had Duras and Kempeck in Sins of the Father
and we do a surprising thing at the end of that episode, which is
we change the actual kind of nature of the character.
So he's no longer just a sort of Klingon foundling who has joined
Starfleet.
He's actually been rejected by his society.
So all of that stuff explored his backstory and stuff, but then
changed the character.
And we've had that mentioned from time to time, I think, his
discommodation.
And this is where it's truly explored, isn't it?
That concept.
Yeah.
So, okay, maybe maybe you don't have to watch them in order, but
it's so much more satisfying if you do it.
I remember watching this when I was a nipper and it was like
chapters in a book, you know, the different Klingon episodes.
And I think it was really the only part of TNG that was doing
that.
And it's Ron Moore's influence for the most part because I think
it's in 3 when Ron Moore comes in and he starts writing
essentially every single Klingon episode.
So he's driving that narrative right through until series 7.
So here he gets one of the story credits, but is that right?
And not a teleplay credit?
I can't remember.
But him and Braga are both involved, but there's a larger number
of people, apparently, but everything is building on this one
thread.
And it's something that is normal for Star Trek now, but kind of
unusual.
Well, I mean, for a show that is not serialised.
It's absolutely normal to have like a guest star who turns up once
a year and we do the Luaksana Troy episode every season, for
instance.
But what this decides to do is to do the Klingon episode, but have
them all build on one another and to have some political thing
happen.
We've already established right away that the Federation is now at
peace with the Klingons and they're allies, and that's something
that's established.
You know, it's one of the basic things about Star Trek, the next
generation, and something that says something about what sort of
show it is.
And then we have the Romulans, who are obviously reintroduced at
the end of series one and who are now kind of involved as well.
We don't see any of them here, but they're involved in the
assassination plot and they're trying to get Duras to succeed
Cempeck.
And all of that stuff is so deep space 9 because again, you have a
sort of geopolitical thing happening.
It's not just we were at war with the Klingons and now we're not
or something like that.
It's there are big powers, and they tend to be what the Romulans
the Klingons, the Vulcans, later on the Cardassians get added to
the mix and so on.
But not the town rights or the Andorians, oddly.
And so all of that stuff is, there's a direct line here to Deep
Space 9, isn't there?
and the way Deep Space 9 functions.
And again, it is more, and Ira Bear as well, who I think has some
part of unification and things like that.
You can see that sort of thinking in this way now, aren't they?
Empires rather than just the ship and that's what they take across
to Deep Space 9.
It's extraordinarily good this, isn't it, as well?
Just as a piece of drama in its own right.
What you said there about consequences.
Wolf really is like the one character on this show that has
consequences as a character, isn't it?
Like, if Kayla comes in in this episode, she dies.
Alexander comes in and then he goes on and he's a father.
Like, as a result of being the central figure of this Klingon saga
that's running through the next generation.
Worf is the one character that's actually getting some development
as they go along.
So no wonder he heads over to DS9 as well.
Yeah, yeah.
I mean, Commander Data has an episode each year and an episode
with a family member.
Do you know what I mean?
Like we have law and we have brothers and we have Noni and Suns.
That's kind of a backstory rather than development.
He doesn't change his character.
No, that's exactly right.
It doesn't change the character.
And even when something like Troy gets a promotion in one episode
she's still Troy from week to week, you know?
Whereas Wolf has to learn to be a father in season 5 and 6 in some
pretty interminable scenes, I'll be honest.
Yeah, no, it doesn't always work, but it is a surprising thing and
it's a thing that this show, I don't think, ever intended to do
but then finds itself doing.
And that's a good thing and that plays into every Star Trek that
comes afterwards, I think.
This is Bragger's 1st script.
Ah, that's something I did glean from memory alpha.
And no wonder they wanted him back after this because it's a
bloody good script.
Um, I've got some quotes before we go into the episode, um, because
everyone's got something to say about Kayla and her eventual
demise in this episode.
Michael Pilla says, I killed Kayla.
The original idea was about Worf's kid and bringing Kayla back, who
was having a relationship with Duras.
But when we started talking about how to make the story work, I'm
the one that says she should die, you wanted to get to a place
where Warf was going to have to take Duras apart and there's no
real good reason for him to do it unless she died.
He had it coming.
Bill says.
Yeah.
Rob Moore then goes on to add, we love Susie and that character
but it worked because you cared about her and we made an effort
not to do it capriciously and for no reason, just to get her off
the show so Worf wouldn't have to deal with her.
Anybody who watches that episode is moved and outraged by the
killing of Kayla.
You're mad and you need the same vengeance that Worf does.
If we've tapped into those feelings.
So when Worf goes back to his quarters and grabs that sword and
the audience is screaming for Duras's head, then you've done it.
I remember feeling that and I remember feeling there was no way
back for warf.
That was what was exciting when I 1st watched this.
I was like, if he does this, that's his career done, he's done on
this show.
I remember and I was sort of screaming at him not to do it because
I was like, oh, no, I love Wolf at this point.
We'll get there, but what I think is the best thing about this
episode is that this is a show that almost always resolves itself
in a talky scene.
And so having it resolve itself in a bit of action that is
surprising because we even give him a way out of it.
We have this bit of dialogue where Riker says, you know, we'll
have to use maximum stun on him, and they arrive in time to stop
him, and you think that that's how it's going to be resolved, and
it's not resolved that way.
And I think it's such a surprise for that action, you know, for an
action thing, a bit of violence to resolve an episode.
It nearly never happens.
It so good.
It's so refreshing.
I remember being shocked when I was younger by the sight of how
much blood there was around KR.
It was such a sort of visceral visual shock that I was like, what
is going on?
Suddenly I was out of cosy next generation territory and in
something a bit more dangerous.
You know?
I remember being so excited in that climax. in a way that most
next generation climax where they waved the techno babble stick
where I was just going, oh, please, you know.
Yeah, it was so good.
And what pleases me is because we've done a lot of these now.
And there's been plenty of times where I've said to you, oh, that
one's great, you know. and then we've watched it and it turned out
no, it's a part of crap.
This is still great.
I still have the same reaction when I watched it today. thank
goodness It's really good.
Well we should probably watch the thing.
What do you think?
Yeah.
I will count us in then.
Five, four, three, two, one.
And we're off.
Okay.
Stock Enterprise shot for the 1st year.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's just straight from Encounter at Far Point again.
Did you say to me they never shot it again?
Um, no, but they, it's very rare for an episode of Star Trek, The
Next Generation, not to have footage in it that was shot for, for
an encounter a car, for...
Encounter it far, Q, we used to call it.
Oh, look, this, he's sporting the Wesley Cup that I asked my
hairdresser for, do you see?
Make me look like this geek.
Ah, look, that ship is so beautiful, isn't it?
No wonder we keep coming back to that.
By the time we got to generations and we could shoot it, big
budget, it looked amazing, the Klingon design.
Yeah, no, but this is the big cruiser rather than the uh, rather
than the warbird, which we get known, what are they called?
I can't remember what they call, but whatever, the Klingon.
Yeah.
Is it Warbird?
One of the Romulans called?
I rely on you for these sort of details, yeah.
I can remember.
Usually you're hot on ship design.
Yeah, no.
I think what's great about that is that when she appears, she's
massive.
Do you know what I mean?
Like, she appears on that massive screen and she's huge, and then
we get this sort of little conversation, and then as he says, you
know, Captain out or whatever, she just blinks very slowly, and
she's kind of like completely in control of that conversation.
She's very good.
She is like the living embodiment of I don't give a shit character
isn't she?
She's so smooth.
Yeah, she's smooth, but she, she's smart and she, like, she's
really good.
Like, I think I think she's just tremendous.
We'll talk about it as we go through it, but she's shown to be
just a fantastic mother as well in this as well as being a
brilliant sort of politician as well. just amazingly good.
I love warfare. like, excuse me, sir.
Because Wolf looks down at something shorter.
Like Worf looks down at Alexander before we see what he's reacting
to.
He's really good.
My one complaint about this episode is it is that dream.
Remember that cod electronic romantic music we had for the Troy
episode recently?
There's a bit more of that going on in here as well.
During the domestic scenes, there is some good music, though.
It's usually the sort of the grandiose Klingon music that's really
good, I think.
Yeah.
Can I just say the bit where Wolf said to Picard, oh, so, yeah, it
feels as if I should be allowed off this assignment.
My ex squeeze is about to beam on the ship and Picard goes, will
you pull yourself together?
Lieutenant Worf.
You don't decide you're not going to be on an assignment just
because she's your ex.
Oh, it's great.
It's so good.
It's also that you're not going to skulk.
You're not going to skulk around every time we deal with
Klingons.
You know, all of that stuff is really good, I think.
Warfish laws to confront so much in this episode and Dawn plays it
all brilliantly, you know?
Yeah, yeah.
Having to face his ex and his kid in his workplace, you know?
Yeah.
Whilst digging in with that whole sort of dishonour plot as well.
So the kid was conceived 2 years ago in series 2, episode 20.
Well, where he's grown very fast then.
Yeah.
And he will continue to grow very fast.
He is an adult by the time he appears, sort of an adolescent by
the time he appears in Deep Space 9, which is like 10 years or
something.
With a completely different cadence to his voice.
Yeah, yeah.
And this is the 1st Alexander.
He'll be recast when he becomes a semi regular.
And that's Brian Bonsall, who was the tiny Keaton in family ties
in the last season.
And he also grew very quickly.
So that was a baby and then the next season it was a five-year-old
or something.
So, you know me?
not above criticising child actors and things. because I feel like
there are some great child actors out there.
Unfortunately, Brian Bosnell or Bonzo, whatever his name is. he's
not one of them This child cannot act.
And unfortunately, we do have scenes many scenes in season 5 and 6
that are bombed because he is, God, he's just lifeless, isn't he?
I think he's cute in, what's the higher the fewer?
What that one?
Oh, cost of living?
Cost of living?
So fun.
No, but Major Barrett is playing all of those.
She's putting in all the work.
Of course she is.
I call it the Hannah Hate effect.
She's adorable.
She's gorgeous.
She's absolutely gorgeous, but...
You can't criticise her acting.
She's like, fine. or something.
He's in my womb Tell me a storm.
She's tiny.
She's manuscule.
I just I wasn't above, you know, being me.
So, so I really, I like this, I like this a lot.
And so she's our 1st half Klingon, isn't she?
I think so, yeah.
I think so.
Yeah.
And so clearly, you know, liking this character probably leads us
to B'lana eventually.
It means Susie Paxton gets to be sexy because it's only half the
level of makeup.
They've got to put on her face.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
And she's so relaxed.
Like, she's terribly smart.
All of this stuff, she's super competent.
And later when she investigates.
It, one of those scenes that it's a great Star Trek
investigation.
You know, something that would be someone sitting at a computer or
going through filing cabinets or something is just her talking to
the computer.
And so we get to, you know, Star Trek can dramatise a thing like
that.
Um, Uh, and she's smart and she gets there and it's the fact that
she gets so close is what kills her, which I think is really great
too.
That investigation scene, which just looks like either exposition
or explaining what her character is thinking, actually plays a
huge part in how the episode ends up moving.
Okay, Brent Spider and they're saying, he's like, no, I'm the one
that normally does the exposition.
I'm just sitting in doing nothing right now. while this guest
actor's coming in and taking my job.
No, she is she is hyper-competent though, isn't she?
Everything she does.
I mean, I love the bit in the turbo lift we just had there, where
she goes to Walt.
You're not going to bite me for old time's sakes, you know.
Bite on the cheek.
Who hasn't sent that to an ex in the past, you know?
Oh, these things, yeah.
Now, can I ask you a question about, yeah, people sort of use the
word Shakespearean to describe any sort of drama that's operatic
in television these days.
Does this have Shakespearean leanings?
Because I'm not really much an expert.
Is it aiming for that though?
No, I don't think so.
It's a little bit, I guess, it's Shakespeare in the sense that
Shakespeare has sort of history plays.
Do you know what I mean?
And, you know, things about kings and stuff like that.
I mean, this is this is sort of like I, Claudius or something in a
way, isn't it?
So, so I love the fact that, like, he looks really sick, probably
sick.
He's been poisoned and he goes, it's in the wine and then he
drinks the wine because if you fuck it, like I'm a waste of wine.
I'm dead anyway, which I think is really great.
He plays the whole scene as if I cannot be bothered with this
fucking culture anymore.
Give me some more work.
Get some more poison in it, you know?
He's really good in this.
So he is in Star Trek five as a Klingon, is he the Klingon
ambassador in Star Trek five?
Okay.
Anyway, he's in Star Trek 5.
And so he comes back for sins of the Father, and it's all that, the
thing about sins of the Father is, and it is, is that it's kind of
Klingon real politic, you know, like it's not honour or anything
like that.
It's like we're just going to let Worf take the fall because he's
in the Federation anyway and we can't afford to have the House of
Duras dishonoured.
And the joy of this is watching Susie Plaxen's character, Kayla
unpick the mystery of what happened there and figure it out.
And obviously that's what signs her death warrant.
But that episode completely informs this one.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, it's brilliant, isn't it?
She finds out what happens.
But she also does talk.
I think she's given the chance to talk about honour being an
excuse or like a pretext or something.
It's something we come back to in that brilliant speech adversary
taxes, isn't it?
That's mine.
Yeah.
And she sort of says, isn't it?
You've got this mad piratical culture where you get ahead by
murdering the person in charge.
Well, he sort of plays this scene as if he's been sick to death of
looking over his shoulder his whole life, but the next person
coming up behind him with a bat left.
I think he wants out.
Well, he's lost.
Do you know what I mean?
He lost.
I think he's gone.
He's had enough.
Yeah.
And of course, you've got Patrick Stewart here. you know, playing
it with every bit of intensity that he would bring to a
Shakespearean drama.
But the thing that I like about it too is that he's on the back
foot, he's not in control of this situation at all.
Garon, uh, um, Ken Pack, it just makes him do, you know, makes him
agree to whatever he wants because he's kind of completely out of
his depth.
What I really like about these Klingon episodes is very often TNG
is like from the point of view of the ship and the characters on
the ship.
And I know we're getting some of that here.
Whereas these episodes, it's more from the point of view of the
Klingon culture, redemption certainly is, since the father
certainly is.
And that's really quite repressing because then it makes the
Enterprise cruise sort of characters in the Klingon story rather
than the other way around.
It gives us a different sort of look at them.
I guess it's something that even Star Trek, the original series
understands, is that there's, and perhaps it only properly happens
in a muck time, although I could be wrong, where having an alien
as one of your regular characters, gives you the chance to
actually kind of explore an alien culture or something like that
or, you know, to do something a little bit more political.
It's essentially the premise that DS Noise build, is it?
You take all these outcasts from all these different societies
bring them all together and tell a story which is not really about
the federation.
Most of the DS 90 is done through a prism of other cultures.
Yeah, which is why you get such interesting views of the
federation in that.
It's the only way that you could conceivably do, you know, the big
geopolitical thing is by having each person.
Do you know what I mean?
Like each player is represented.
There he is having another drink.
Why not?
But TNG, TNG is so the Federation, isn't it?
It's so from that point of view.
This is why we get a bit wearisome with it at times because we're
you know, the prime directors seems to tire us in knots and make
things overly complicated, that should be very simple.
I love this shot.
Oh, the kids are little, he's trying to growl.
Bless.
He's terrible.
I did notice in that last scene as well.
There was an excellent low angle shot with some very dramatic
lighting behind.
I can't remember what the, what's his name?
The Klingon.
Ken Peck.
Oh, he's dead now, so don't matter.
But now we're getting the ceiling and stuff.
Do you know what I mean?
We're getting we're shooting it from little Alexander's point of
view, looking up. enormous in the ceiling.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
Jonathan Franks just isn't interested in pointing shoot, is he?
I mean, we get there in the end with discovery and that drone
zooming about the place, but this is sort of the level I like, you
know, I love that shot where wharf stops and then the little boy
moves and just keeps walking out of shot is terribly cute.
I love that she's intense in her work and the 2nd Alexander runs
in.
She's a mother.
She grabs hold of him.
She puts him on her knee and there's a familiarity between the 2
actors that you don't often get between a child and an adult.
Usually you can tell that the child's never met the actor before
and they're sort of looking off camera at their parents going, well
what's going, you really feel like they're mother and child.
Yeah.
But I love the way that she plays with him as well.
Like, our, you know, whose ways.
You mean Klingon ways, you know, um, I'm going to be facetious.
That outfit does her figure no good asshole.
It's hideous, that outfit.
Yeah, maybe they didn't want to do sexy Klingon quite so much.
I think it's okay.
I mean, she's very tall.
She's fabulously impressively tall.
So she's in another role.
She's, of course, the famous Dr. Salah in the schizoid man.
So she comes a Vulcan.
Yeah, another one that could have come back again and again and
what she's mentioned over and over again as later series 7, she's
still on board.
I think there's a mention in, yesterday's Enterprise, you hit
here.
Dr. Salah, please come to this.
Yeah, over and over again.
You hear her being paged.
There's plaxen saying, no, I'm sorry.
My career has gone on to greater things now.
I can't come back and play that.
But, I mean, this, you know, they, it is actually a big call and
they're right.
We like her a lot.
She's really lively in a way that the regulars aren't.
Yeah, compare her to Dr. Bev and Troy.
Exactly.
And so you kind of just deciding we're going to kill her and we
won't have Susie back next year.
That's a big call, I think.
Sort of annoying, though.
You know, because I said to you, that Warf definitely has a type
right?
He likes strong commanding women in control of their own minds who
don't put up with his shit.
That's Kayla, and that's definitely Dax.
Well, Dax obviously is a regular on DS9.
So we get to a point where we have a Kayla-esque character as a
regular.
So it's sort of annoying that we're not getting it here.
Yeah.
So I, I like the guy who plays duras.
I think it's something a bit sexy about him.
I don't know what to do.
I know too.
He's he's really young.
He seems young to me.
And so he's, you know, like, and we learn later, don't we, that
he's being kind of manipulated by his sisters and they're really
in charge?
Look how he's back lit there.
Frakes is trying to make his appearance on the screen as imposing
as possible.
Like his silhouette is picked out in the light in a really great
way.
But we often don't get this right.
When Duras sees wharf going up the ramp to his station.
He looks at wharf from the from the screen where we can't manage
to do that with 7 and Neelix when they're talking to one another
over Zoom at the end of series 7 of.
I said to you in the episode we did last week, which was called, no
win scenario.
That Freights is an actors director, and they also say that.
And that he gets all the reaction shots perfect.
Well, he was even doing it here.
I think he knows the frustration maybe that actors have.
Yeah, yeah.
When they watch it back and go, well, I was doing great working.
Why didn't you do a reaction shot?
And so he's getting it all in there early.
Good bloke.
Top bloke.
Excellent director.
Yeah, and just lovely apparently, I think.
Yeah, it's an unusual mix, isn't it?
Highly talented and really nice.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
I do love this as well.
The whole Juros Gauron thing.
Like, who is it?
Who's murdered him?
Who is trying to take control?
So we've got a murder mystery and we've got a romance, you know
we've got a tragedy come in. all in here.
But, I mean, this kind of works, this episode, even if you haven't
seen sins of the Father, and it's partly because this scene tells
us what, um, what she's about to find out.
So we have this scene, and this scene is an interpersonal one
where we have, you know, some conflict between wharfs roll as a
Starfleet officer and his role as a Klingon, and in a sense, the
same sort of conflict that, that, um, Picard has, because he knows
about Jurosa's background as well.
Do you know what I mean?
And so it's going to be hard for him to be impartial in this as
well.
And then this is all the information that, um, we find out, um
that she finds out, do you know what I mean?
She's finding out what's being told to us here.
So it all kind of works.
And I also think too, that the 1st death of a Klingon that we have
in this episode is by poison, and it's dishonourable, the next
death of a Klingon or 2 Klingons, I think, is it, in the explosion
is also not an honourable death.
It's a sneaky, you know, there's a bomb been planted secretly.
Um, is it this scene?
Yeah, it is.
I love the fun...
It's just pain in the share.
He's still getting paid.
Here's our 1st shot of Garon.
The camera's slightly out of focus there, Jonathan.
Can I just say, Fraxie?
The MVP of this episode is Robert O'Reilly.
What an acting choice.
It's so brilliant, isn't it?
Because we are inclined to not want Jurass to be the guy. and so
it's got to be Garon because we've just had a whole scene that
way.
Klingon Empire.
Is this guy?
That's right.
Most psychotic eyes you've ever seen.
Such a weirdo.
Creon Empire is doomed.
It's really funny, isn't it?
It's really great.
What's great is he's clearly made some choices here, Robert
O'Brieny.
And he does, he just...
It completely doubles down on them when he goes on with the role
and he just makes them bigger and bigger.
He's really good.
In fact, his eyes are so recognisable when we saw him in Balla
Bing Balla bang as the money counter.
We knew it was him straight away from his eyes.
Yeah, no, he's brilliant.
He's really really good.
That's very, Do you think the way the camera moved there, just to
get them all in shot.
That's very theatrical.
We're back in the 90s there.
Yeah.
Oh, but look, this look at the lighting, though.
I always loved.
Remember we talked about the lighting on the Klingon ship in the
voyage home.
I love, it's just so much moodier, more athletes very than on a
Federation ship, until you probably get to Voyager.
That's when they, oh, wow, look at that.
That explosion is great.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
They do know how to do a good explosion.
Do you remember when we had a big slow motion explosion at the
beginning of Rox and Shoals?
And there's a great one in the Dogs of War as well.
They can do.
I mean, they know they haven't got very big explosives in the
studio.
They need to make it more dramatic, so they do it in slow motion.
But it looks good.
I think it looks good Oh, dude, these dreadful quarters in the
enterprise.
I know we said that they were, you know, the height of luxury when
we were younger, but now they do look like a hotel room of the
period, don't they?
No, it's sort of like the flimsiest IKEA I found it show.
You've never seen.
Flat packed hotels.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Well, that's because that's exactly what they are.
But I love all this intrigue, and this is something that DS9
grabbed hold of and ran with, you know, all this political
intrigue.
I love this though.
This is them actually not talking about that at all, but talking
about their relationship.
And I love this too, because we saw him, didn't we, in the
emissary?
Um, we saw him uh, start the oath.
Um, And her saying, no, no, you've got to be joking.
I'm not getting married, blah, blah, blah.
And now she's starts it, doesn't she?
And he says no.
I can actually tell you the stark contrast between Gene Roddenbury
and Michael Pillar's visions for TNG.
Gene Robinbury.
The only time we sort of saw a Klingon and a Klingon Woman reward
was that one that was pouring at him in hide and queue, going, wow
you know?
and it was it was gross and not sexy at all.
And pillar comes in and he goes, no, he's a character.
We'll give him a romantic backstory.
And it's a mature relationship with a likeable person and it works
brilliantly.
See, I suppose, sorry, go on.
No, this is what prompts her to investigate, isn't it?
Well, because he's shutting her down.
Yeah.
Yeah, completely.
Yeah, so it's not...
She knows him.
So she knows that he's not capable of the things that he's been
accused of.
His dad's been accused of.
Yeah, well, she she says to him that she can't understand how it
can possibly have happened and she wants to know what it was and
he refuses to tell her.
And so he, she's investigating that uh, when Duras is alerted by
someone on the Klingon home world.
Can I ask you a question?
Why is it?
Because we've only seen Kayla twice, yeah.
So why are these scenes we've just seen between Worf and Kayla?
So convincing as a romantic couple where so many couples in TNG.
It feels so artificial.
So why does this work?
I wonder when it's a male regular and a female guest star.
I think romances.
I'm just pulling this one out of the air.
I think that romance is work better on the show.
And I think partly it's because they're really gross and icky
about female sexuality sort of generally.
Uh, I think there's something, do you know what I mean?
Like, think about Wendy Hughes and Picard, think about Vash and
Picard.
Um, like they're not embarrassing.
Whenever it's a romantic, um, totally coming in, it's all, the
romantic is always a very confident character and it's weird
because when you have a man coming in, being extremely confident
and domineering to a woman, it is a hit them.
Uncomfortable.
When it's a woman coming in and being dominating to a man, it's
interesting.
Yes, here we go.
I'm sorry.
I can't discuss it.
She wants to know.
So that's what's happening.
She'll go off and get herself killed trying to find out.
I suppose the Shakespearean part of this is the tragedy at the end
where we know if she finds out the information she's doomed, you
know?
Yeah, but I don't think we do know that.
Do you know what I mean?
This is just the sort of scene that we have all the time.
You know, remember Darmok, where Darmok is a frozen dessert on
some planet?
I'm sorry, dear ass.
Oh, God, this is great.
And it is, I'll tell you what, it's a much needed levity in this
very serious episode.
Look at the look of these boys.
Look at the look at the security guys.
They're such like quarterbacks.
They're, like, someone who peaked in high school there, the white
guy, and then there's a sort of slightly darker skinned one who's
more attractive, but...
There was a quote about his eyes, about his acting choice, you
know, because they must have been like, what is he doing?
No, they must have gone, oh, yes, this is brilliant.
You know, like...
Utterly rigid then.
The only beacon on his face were those 2 orbs.
So I love this too.
I love how she deals with it.
It's like that could take hours and she goes, days, you know
depending on how cooperate, if you are.
It's so good She's so great.
Oh, no, here we go, back to Alexander.
This is our 1st bat left.
Yeah.
Yeah, so...
The very 1st one.
The 1st one.
And it's the 1st time the name is used.
And I think it's, it's super important because, of course, Worf
couldn't have gone onto the ship and shot him with a gun. right?
He had to do it like this because this is an expression of his
Klingon character, you know, um, And it's not because we
understand it as well.
Do you know what I mean?
It's not some weird ass shame culture Klingon made up thing.
It's like this man killed the woman I love and I'm going to go and
kill him.
It's a superb design as well, isn't it?
I can see why it never went anywhere.
I mean, I do like it when they half it, you know, and they've got
one in each hand.
That's pretty cool as well.
But, The whole thing about it being an extension of your arm, you
sort of curve it in your arm.
So it absolutely works on that level.
It's really good.
It's a lot better than the whatever the fuck it is that the
Klingons have.
No, the Vulcans have.
Oh this.
I like to make that garrod on Juros both visited her to convince
that the other one was the murderer.
This is her him offering her a job, isn't it?
You're like, have a lovely job.
Remember, in the future, he does exactly the same to Worf, doesn't
he?
Way of the Warrior.
To basically get him out of the way.
I mean, I think he ends up being a reasonable guy, doesn't he?
Gauron.
Well, I mean, he does he does take the Federation and the Klingons
back to war.
Admittedly, there is a changing, pulling his strings, but sure.
But generally speaking, he's all right.
He gets that great speech.
Do remember that?
Five years ago, nobody knew about Deep Space 9 or the wormhole.
All our hopes rest here.
It's great.
It's really good, though, this, because like making Gauron
obviously a terrible person.
Um, is a great choice because we know that it can't be Jurass
because he's a terrible person.
We sort of think, oh, well, let's hope Duras doesn't get it.
But then Carol comes along, it looks like an absolute weirdo or
anything.
Oh, that smile.
I'm sorry, that's teeth.
She just said, 10 pack was old and weak.
I am not. she's so powerful.
Honestly.
I do love a good, strong woman on the telly, you know.
Oh, look, poor Jonathan's back is hurting.
So he's standing like that.
He's breaking his back trying to make this show dramatic for one
witch.
Oh, yeah, yeah.
Oh, Romulans.
Romulans.
And actually that that thread that runs through, I think it's like
three, four, five.
They kind of lose the Romulans towards the end, don't they?
Yeah, and DS9 doesn't really touch them very much until the last 2
seasons.
I had thought when I was watching this through, before it had
ended, do you know what I mean?
I saw this before, uh, you know, series 7 had aired.
I'd assumed that the ending would be about the Romulans in some
way because they had been, and particularly with, um, Selar with
um, uh, you know, Denise Crosby's character.
Like I thought that, do you know what I mean?
Because it starts with the Kleons being on our side, I thought
that maybe it would end with us making a deal with the Romulans
you know, to show that that's what the show's about.
Instead, it's about a big arse swirly thing and queue and stuff.
In a TV show that's effectively a soap opera that somehow resets
every week, Denise Crosby turning up as a Romulan is the most soap
opera twist I ever could have had.
Such a great cliffhanger.
But I mean, I'll be honest, though her performance, as the Romulan
is, is, is down there.
She does, there is a little bit of sort of camp nonsense there, but
it's a little bit...
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
TNG is too embarrassed to do camp.
I think it is.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
That's what that needed, I think.
Oh, there's some good music here now.
The sort of suspense music is she's sort of figuring out what
happened.
Yeah, this is great, isn't it?
I love this.
Where's her story now, isn't it?
And then it's weird how then her narrative ends, obviously, because
she dies and then it becomes wolf story.
Yeah.
I just, I don't feel like they're playing by the usual TNG rules
at all.
No, no.
And I think that's exactly it.
I think that's because it's actually really rare to have a scene
that doesn't have one of our regulars in it.
And that was almost a rule.
Another thing that DS9 absolutely ran with in its later season
isn't it?
What is Garron doing?
He's so great.
Oh, he's doing the judge.
Frustrating to the singing.
Even how he sits down is a little bit camp, isn't it?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
No, he's magnificent.
He's like, I'm not going to be playing this too seriously, all
right?
I'm going to have some fun.
There's almost like a slight exaggeration in everything he does.
I'm I'm reading duress.
He's kind of like, he's like the large adult son.
Do you know what I mean?
Like he's just there because his father, you know, and he's he's
not a proper adult.
He sort of, he's sort of, you know, Donald Trump junior.
I think.
You know, he's just a sort of worthless individual who's ended up
in this situation because his family has manoeuvred him there.
Look how dumb he looks.
Like, he just says this sort of slack jawed, open-mouthed kind of
thing.
He's...
And I'll take it down to the most childish level we could possibly
do on this.
I feel like like Duras is someone in like sort of almost a
position of power with the smallest cock in the Klingon Empire.
Whereas Gowron knows, he knows he's got the biggest cock in the
Klingon Empire.
And Caras himself that way.
Yeah.
It's a great contrast.
It's so fun.
Yeah, look at him.
Look at him.
I could have gone with Juros and Gowron being the 2 in the every
time we go back to the Cleon Empire, you know?
They're always trying to bloody murder each other.
Brilliant.
And Worf's having it go at them.
He's not needling them.
Yeah, it's kind of funness, isn't it?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
But Duras is doing a great job.
The guy who plays Jurass is actually pretty good and he's kind of
taking a backseat to Gower on here, but he's pretty great.
I think what we expect is a sort of functional plot resolution to
this.
Yeah.
At the end, like TNG normally does. tidies it up in the last 2.5
minutes. voiceover from Captain Picard and then often to the next
jolly adventure.
Instead, what they give us. where this is going is that K-la finds
out that Wharf accepted Duras's discommendation and then she lets
the, the everyone know.
And so Garon takes over and Duras loses.
And that's where we're heading isn't it?
Interesting is.
Yeah, for sure.
Yeah, yeah.
And what happens is that exactly happens, i.e. Gowron takes
commands, but the method we get there is far more shocking.
Yeah.
Well, it brings it.
It balls it all down to a character level and that's my end to
Star Trek.
And so that's why I'm so invested in the climax.
And look at her looking at like at the computer. she's so fabulous
Like she's not a space person.
That's the other thing.
She's a little bit more modern.
She seems like a...
Imagine.
Yes, McFadden doing these things.
In fact, you don't...
You don't need to imagine it because we saw it in Remember Me
where she was walking around on her own, figuring things out.
Yeah, yeah.
Yes here we go.
And the other thing is, what, it feels so well plotted because all
of these pieces just sort of slot into place, don't they?
Yeah, it becomes inevitable, doesn't it?
It's like, yeah, why didn't we figure out this is where we were
heading?
Because it happens on the ship.
Well, and because that's not what TNG does.
No, that's why.
That's why.
Exactly right.
We couldn't foresee that they'd have a dramatic climax and
satisfying.
Yeah, so this is her winning, isn't it?
This is her winning?
Winning and then losing... was a trainer.
He really is.
He is the large adult son.
What happened?
My father wasn't a trailer.
She emasculates him now in such a powerful life.
Yeah, look how pathetic he looks.
So what does he does?
He murders a woman. know Yeah, look, she's right in his face.
She's not scared of her.
That's right.
She thinks she's winning.
This is her winning.
But I don't think even she foresees that he would kill her.
No, but we certainly don't.
Where does this scene end?
That'll be interesting to see.
That's it.
That's the scene ending, right?
No, not Dr. Ben.
Go back to the other screen.
But we don't that's where that scene ends, right?
And so the murder is a real shock, I think.
In fact, Nathan, this is a brilliant contrast, because suddenly
we've got Dr. Bevan Riker talking about a bomb going off and the
plot logistics and this is our normal TNG episode, literally
coming straight after this incredible TNG episode that's playing
out in front of us.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
There you go.
There's a picture of a the bones in an arm for some reason
dinosaur scans.
She's doing diner scans, which is exciting.
We've got to give her something to do, though.
Gates has gone up here, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, I think these 2 work really well, actually, I think.
Oh, until they started snogging in that episode.
Remember?
Oh, yeah, that was pretty dreadful.
Oh, would you know the 2 of them?
Were there this low angle shot of Wolf again?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Because we're with the sun.
It's how we get both of them in shot.
And that is a real shock.
And look at all the blood.
It's the bloody handprint on that old TNG furniture.
It's almost like it feels completely wrong, doesn't it?
Now, these, the close-up of Alexander's face is not a great idea
because he obviously can't act and we don't want to see him crying
because that would be too yucky.
Like, we couldn't see him distressed at his murdered mother.
So instead we just see him staring fairly disinterestedly into the
middle distance.
Um, It's just, it's the blood.
Yeah.
But I also like that she's not able to say very much.
Like she says maybe one or 2 things and that's it.
You know, and that's her dying, but the hand, like the dream...
I usually want to compare DS9 to TNG and DS9's favour, but this is
so much more powerful than Jadzia Daxi's death.
Oh yeah, yeah.
Our children would have been so beautiful.
It would have been so beautiful.
I'd rather she just did what Kaylo did and didn't say a lot, you
know, it just expired.
That was really good.
Like, that was properly good.
It's so visceral, that blood.
It's horrible.
There's so much of it.
It's brilliant.
Him saying to Alexander, look, look.
This is your 1st view of death.
Look.
I think it's so it's that Klingon thing about getting revenge on
the people that, you know, betray your house.
It's really alien, isn't it?
Like, it is, like, that's him being very Klingon, you know, like
like we've seen her interacting with her some the way that a sort
of American mother of the time would do, um, and that now he's
showing death, you know. just comes in the shot, doesn't talk to
the wharf.
She literally, she pulled that bit of furniture aside.
She goes, we're not having real drama here.
Excuse me, I'm gonna back on me.
Oh, great.
And now this, this, I remember my blood pumping, thinking, what is
Worf gonna do?
Look how red looks the red light on the walls.
Look at the red light on my walls.
Great.
And he takes his sash off that no one else wears.
Oh does he take his little badge off?
Yeah, he does.
So yeah, so this was the point where I was like, there's no coming
back from this now.
You're going to go and...
Well, except he's going to be stopped.
They're going to stop him, though.
Do you know what I mean?
Like, I think at this point they're going to stop him.
They don't.
No, I know, but we think they are.
I was like, did you watch the end?
Yeah, I've seen this before.
But we're so used as well. on TNG, because we are federation
focussed.
We're so used to the alien characters sort of being punished if
they don't toe the line.
That's the way of TNG.
Is that if you don't behave like a good human being, even though
you're a Klingon.
And he's literally being a Klingon through and through here.
So that's why after he did it.
Yeah, he takes off the Federation thing, picks up the big Klingon
knife and heads off to get him, you know?
It's actually a bit of, you know, Picard goes, oh, we put a note
in your file. or something.
It's not really enough, is it?
He has to be back next week and it won't come up again next week.
So.
Oh, that handsome Klingon guy.
Yeah, and that, because he doesn't know about Kayla, and so he
doesn't expect any response from Worf, even though he's walking
here with a big bat left. was my mate.
So suddenly they all start handing in weapons.
You're dead, mate.
You better stop defending yourself.
Oh, dear.
Oh no, look, he's only got a sword.
Wolf's got the ballet, you'll be fine. batless, yeah. yeah that's
right.
And this, you know, well, he's coming back with us.
Well, stunning. do you know what I mean?
Uh, get on with the show.
It's not a bad fight as well, Nation.
It a pretty good... really good.
It's in a very confined space and I don't think that that was
Patrick Massette there.
I think that might have been a stunt double.
What's great about it is you can really feel the aggression
between the 2 of them. like the blows are hard.
And I like this too.
The king, kill me and you'll be a traitor forever is pretty good
too.
That's great.
So they come in.
Come in in time.
Then we cut, and then we see the reaction. which is really great.
Like, the reaction shot is so good from...
That's great again.
I'm going to have the reaction shot here.
All right.
But Brent does a great reaction shot as well.
And Brent turns straight to Jonathan to see, how are you
responding to this?
It's really good.
And then a very un TNG shot of the bat left embedded in his chest
and more blood.
I know, I know.
It's so great.
Oh, this might be one of my absolute favourites, you know, that
we've done so far.
It is really good.
It's not Dharmok, but it is superb, I think.
Yeah, this is the one, this is the one note that feels a bit tough
you know, like, Mr. Worf.
I'm going to put a reprimand in your file for murdering that man
back to work.
No, that's right.
Mind you, pretty much every, they had to sort of get this out of
the way.
Every single member of the DS9 crew was a murderer in one way or
another.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, but they all had a mention on their file.
Maybe they put a clause in the prime murder and the cause of duty
is acceptable and then a couple of clauses. you know?
Well, I mean, the thing is because it is acceptable in a Klingon.
Like he hasn't broken Klingon law.
He behaved appropriately for a Klingon.
So there are no diplomatic, um, uh, you know, there's no no sort
of particular problem there.
He did the right thing as far as that's concerned.
You know, as Stuart is kind of with a stare there.
He's looking disappointed.
He's looking understanding because he gets why Worf did it.
And he's looking all forested as well.
He's doing quite a lot with his eyes in that scene.
Except he's much smaller than wharf in this shot, which I think is
really interesting.
Do you know what I mean?
You've got a profile of warf.
Like, it's quite, I don't know, and he's slight, he's out of focus
in the foreground, because he's just taking it, and then we get
back to just us talking again.
Do you know what I mean?
Like, now we're just talking as, you know, colleagues and not as
you know, your commanding officer telling you off.
Yeah, it's super interesting, isn't it?
Later on, they they sort of, they double down on war dishonour as
well, don't they?
When he refuses to go to invade Cardassia.
So his name's even more mud amongst the Klingon Empire.
Yeah, they do it again.
He gets discommended once more.
And then what's great is when Gauron sees a political opportunity
because Martox becoming very popular in the Dominion War, he goes
oh, well, if you're a mate of Martox, you're all right by me.
Oh, Garam can snip out a political advantage at any move, got it.
See, this is...
Paul, that's not him.
This is a kid called John Stoyer.
Oh, is it?
Yeah, yeah.
I have... you say that earlier?
No, no.
Oh, we got it wrong, yeah?
No, Brian Bonsall will play him later.
He gets 3 cast as Brian Bonsor, but this is not him.
So 3 people, I think, end up playing.
Look how convinced I was that it was the same actor.
No, no, no, no, because he's a little bit more annoying.
I think, um, that he's a little...
A little bit less talented.
Yeah, well, I don't think this kid's very talented, but he's not
called upon to do very much.
I do like the are you my father and he says yes.
That's pretty good.
And I do like the fact that Wolf recognises I can't give you the
life you deserve here.
I don't feel, it doesn't feel like I'm just shunting you off of my
parents.
You're cramping my style.
I've got a career.
Do you remember the kid in the book?
Is it the bonding, the kid, whose mother dies, who never gets
mentioned again?
We have that special ceremony and he'll be his best friend and
then we never see him again.
What's great is when Wolf's parents show up with Alexandra and say
no, it's time you start accepting your responsibilities.
We're leaving him here, the little shit, all right?
Warp's mother is so great.
She does too. episodes, doesn't she?
She does family.
And then she does the one where she brings Alexander back.
There he is.
One of the biggest surprises I had when I was doing my 2nd round
of reviews on Star Trek was just how many subtle narratives there
were running through TNG.
How many recurring characters we keep coming back to and how they
sort of gently have stories playing out?
And obviously DS9 does that to an extreme later.
They sort disobey all the rules.
But this is, as we said at the beginning.
This is the strongest example of that.
And as a result, I think wharf outs this show, possibly as the
most impressive character.
Certainly in terms of development.
Yeah, he was nearly not kind of going to be in every episode.
Like he wasn't going to be one of the kind of main characters.
I don't know.
I think, you know, like Star Trek, the Next Generation could have
had more semi-regulars, but basically what do we get?
We get Barclay, we get um, Alyssa Agawa.
That's about it, really.
And, And I think that's a shame.
I think it would have been more interesting with more people.
Star Trek always seems slightly ridiculous because it's the same 7
people doing literally everything on the ship and you wonder what
else everyone else is doing.
I think it's, I think it's the the POVs that we talked about
there.
That's the biggest difference in this.
You have a Geordie Aquiao or something like that.
You have a Jordan the Forge investigates episode and every scene
is from Geordie La Forge's point of view as he goes from console
to console trying to figure out what's going on.
Whereas this switched POVs all the time throughout.
And as a result, it feels bigger.
It feels more interesting to watch.
Yeah, yeah.
And proper things happened.
And those things do end up having an effect on the character and
they don't properly take and run with, you know, death of Kayla
but they end up finding a way to bring Alexander back in and
stuff.
I think, you know, um, and certainly this will all culminate in
the big cliffhanger at the end of this season, won't it?
Yeah, this is redemption at the end of this season.
Yeah, of course it is. yeah.
Yeah.
Well, listen, can I give the final word on reunion to Jonathan
Frakes himself, director of this episode, who is quoted as saying
Rick's been throwing me some nice episodes?
Three people got killed.
There was murder and there was revenge.
I've been lucky.
Susie was great.
A lot of people are sorry she's dead.
It's a character that people really loved or hated because she was
so big and shameless in her performance and I loved it.
Oh wonderful.
Four people died actually, Jonathan, but who's counting?
But, you know, like poor people died in home soil, ugly bags of
mostly water.
It certainly wasn't as memorable as reunion.
No, exactly.
All right, it's the end of the episode, and it's time for us to
work out what we're going to do next time.
I had the good fortune to roll reunion last time, so it's your
turn now, Joe. What series are we doing?
Astonishingly.
We haven't actually been to DS 9 for, I think, 11 episodes.
Oh, wow.
I was looking at the randomiser earlier.
We've done original series.
We've done a couple of Kurtzman's across series.
We've done a movie, we've done a few TNGs, and we've definitely
done a few voyages, but we haven't really done a DS9 for quite
some time.
And this must be redressed.
Okay.
We nearly did it deep, so it's not this time.
I just don't want to follow up a classic... with a shit...
If wishes were horses.
After I've said that, you know, TNG laid down all these
foundations and DS9 ran with them, I'm going to get something like
oh, no, celess or something, aren't I?
Well, are you ready?
I'm ready.
I did not get celess.
Oh.
Did you get if wishes were horses?
I did get a season one episode.
Oh, is it good?
Your random Star Trek, Deep Space 9 episode is season one, episode
19.
Duet.
Have we done that?
No, we did progress.
We did progress.
Duets, the other major Kira episode.
The one that everyone loves.
I think that I ended up watching that at around about the same
time as we were watching progress and that might be why I thought
we'd already covered it.
What do you think?
I think we probably do it.
I have already pressed the button and do you know why?
It's because I think we've done quite a fair few of DS9's accepted
classics.
And I feel like we should leave some of them, you know, for about
5 years down the line.
Otherwise we'll be left with nothing but a man alone and, you know
resurrection and stuff.
Okay.
Oh, yeah, okay, let's do this.
This is a fun one.
Your random Star Trek this place on our episode is season seven
episode six, Treachery, Faith, and the Great River.
Ooh, okay, I'm up for that for sure.
You know why we should do that?
It's because the A-plot is all Renee Aubergonois, and the B-plot
is all Aaron Eisenberg, and we've lost both of them and we'll get
to say lovely things about both of them in this.
Okay, that's brilliant.
Awesome. looking forward to that.
And there's 2 Wayons talking to each other in it, and, you know
what more do we need?
Well, let's do it then.
Let's do it.
Just for the sequence where Wayo looks at Damar and says, my
predecessor's deaf in a transporter accident.
Highly suspicious. wonderful.
You've been listening to entitled Star Trek Project with Joe Ford
and Nathan Bottomley.
We're online at entitled Star Trek project.com, where you can find
subscription links and links to our social media accounts.
Our podcast artwork is by Kayla Ciceran, and the theme was
composed by Cameron Lamb.
This episode was recorded on the 10th of January 2024 and released
on the 12th of January.
We'll see you next time for Star Trek Deep Space 9, Treachery
Faith, and the Great River.
I haven't thought what I'll say, but I always end up saying
something, so I think we'll be OK. You nap hand at this now.
Ah, dear.
I spent some time reorganising the website in a way that no one
will know about except me, and if I've done it right, it will have
actually no effect on the actual website that's produced.
Does it help the admin of the website?
It does a little bit.
It means I have to do slightly less work each episode, but we
probably need to do about a 1000 episodes in order to make up for
the time that I spent actually doing the thing.
Well, by the end, we would have done over a 1000 episodes.
So, you know, like...
You'll just have to wait a long time for that reward.
So it's really hot here and Alfie has just crashed on the floor
behind me.
I can't even show he's just completely passed out.
Look how young he looks.
Look how young he looks directing it.
Oh my god.
Well, we actually see him in it.
So that maybe that's not that much of a surprise.
Being exactly that young.
He's really good.
Holy crap.
And so, yes. well.
We'll talk about it, but yeah, it's great.
It's a good choice.
Yeah, I was really surprised, actually.
I thought reunion was kind of good but anyway, I'll save it.
Well, I checked out my review because I obviously written my
original review and then I read another review and on both of them
I gave it a 10 and 5 stars.
Yeah, okay.
I've always loved this.
I've got a memory.
I have a memory.
Of this.
Yeah.
You're going to do a Siheart moment of youth.
I am.
Yeah.
I will start then.
Hey, Joe. Hi.
So after last week's triumphant episode of Star Trek Picard.