WEBVTT NOTE This transcript was created on 2026-05-01 at 21:50:25 1 00:00:21.899 --> 00:00:24.539 Hey, Joe. Hi. 2 00:00:24.660 --> 00:00:26.519 So I've got a question for you. 3 00:00:26.579 --> 00:00:29.219 Oh, yeah, we're heading to this week's episode. 4 00:00:29.280 --> 00:00:30.000 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 5 00:00:30.059 --> 00:00:31.920 And it's about Kurtzman Trek. 6 00:00:31.980 --> 00:00:33.060 Mm-hmm. 7 00:00:33.060 --> 00:00:36.659 Because we are taking another deep dive into modern trek now. 8 00:00:37.619 --> 00:00:43.979 Why is Lower Decks the best iteration of Kurtzman Trek? 9 00:00:44.039 --> 00:00:48.000 You know, I actually think it is possible that it seriously is. 10 00:00:48.060 --> 00:00:53.939 I think clearly discovery is the kind of flagship show, and it's 11 00:00:53.939 --> 00:00:56.759 the one they're spending the most money on and that is the one 12 00:00:56.759 --> 00:01:02.520 that's most like a Star Trek show, but it kind of flailed about 13 00:01:02.520 --> 00:01:07.439 for a bit and had all those production problems and it's only 14 00:01:07.439 --> 00:01:11.219 really kind of settled down to be sort of consistent. 15 00:01:11.280 --> 00:01:17.159 And I loved it all the way through, but it would not be unfair to 16 00:01:17.159 --> 00:01:21.060 say that it took a while to work out what it was going to do. 17 00:01:21.120 --> 00:01:26.519 Whereas lower decks, I think, came out of the gate, all guns 18 00:01:26.519 --> 00:01:30.659 blazing after they'd had some experience producing Star Trek. 19 00:01:30.719 --> 00:01:33.000 And I think it's really consistent. 20 00:01:33.060 --> 00:01:35.700 I think it's properly good Star Trek. 21 00:01:35.760 --> 00:01:42.719 And I think that it just adores all the various versions of Star 22 00:01:42.719 --> 00:01:44.400 Trek that have happened throughout the year. 23 00:01:44.459 --> 00:01:47.219 So it's hard not to really like it a great deal. 24 00:01:47.280 --> 00:01:52.260 Well, if I think about all the other Kurtzman shows, like Picard 25 00:01:52.260 --> 00:01:57.420 obviously, for an episode or two. had a massive love letter to TNG 26 00:01:57.420 --> 00:02:00.659 when it brought Riker and Troy into the show and data. 27 00:02:00.719 --> 00:02:05.700 And, um, Discovery had the whole of season two, which was a huge 28 00:02:05.700 --> 00:02:09.659 love letter to the original series with Spark and Pike and number 29 00:02:09.659 --> 00:02:10.620 one. 30 00:02:10.680 --> 00:02:13.319 Um, and oh my god, we sure am I forgetting here. 31 00:02:13.379 --> 00:02:15.539 I feel like there's a Kirkman show, I'm forgetting. 32 00:02:15.599 --> 00:02:18.000 No, then it's just lower decks, isn't it? 33 00:02:18.060 --> 00:02:19.379 That's it. 34 00:02:19.439 --> 00:02:23.639 But the thing that lower decks can do because it's set in that 90s 35 00:02:23.639 --> 00:02:27.300 trek universe is it can just overload. 36 00:02:27.360 --> 00:02:32.340 It's with like tons of Easter eggs and treats for the fans, so 37 00:02:32.340 --> 00:02:33.240 many references. 38 00:02:33.240 --> 00:02:35.699 And it doesn't just confine itself to 90s track, either. 39 00:02:35.759 --> 00:02:41.340 You know, it does, there is lots of fanfare to the original series 40 00:02:41.340 --> 00:02:41.699 as well. 41 00:02:41.759 --> 00:02:43.740 Even Enterprise. 42 00:02:43.800 --> 00:02:47.099 They even, you know, venerate enterprise on the odd occasion. 43 00:02:47.159 --> 00:02:48.659 God bless them. 44 00:02:48.719 --> 00:02:52.139 I think it still works as a Star Trek show even if you don't 45 00:02:52.139 --> 00:02:54.180 really know Star Trek all that well. 46 00:02:54.240 --> 00:02:59.759 And it doesn't rely exclusively on just kind of callbacks to 47 00:02:59.759 --> 00:03:00.719 previous episodes. 48 00:03:00.780 --> 00:03:02.159 I think it's funny in its own right. 49 00:03:02.219 --> 00:03:07.620 Oh, and each episode is like a plot in its own right, there's 50 00:03:07.620 --> 00:03:09.539 genuine character development. 51 00:03:09.599 --> 00:03:11.460 So it does work on that level. 52 00:03:11.520 --> 00:03:15.180 But let's be honest, if you're a Trek fan, you're going to get the 53 00:03:15.180 --> 00:03:16.020 most out of this. 54 00:03:16.080 --> 00:03:18.000 Yeah, 0 yeah, absolutely. 55 00:03:18.060 --> 00:03:19.860 I think that's definitely right. 56 00:03:19.919 --> 00:03:23.219 I mean, let's compare it, say, to the Orville, which both of us 57 00:03:23.219 --> 00:03:26.879 watched, and I think both of us quite liked it, is that? 58 00:03:26.879 --> 00:03:30.539 I thought it took like half a season to find its groove. 59 00:03:30.599 --> 00:03:34.439 Like there was a couple of very, very early episodes where the 60 00:03:34.439 --> 00:03:38.280 comedy, they were kind of feeling their way into science fiction 61 00:03:38.280 --> 00:03:38.939 comedy. 62 00:03:39.000 --> 00:03:43.259 But I thought the 2nd season was amazing. 63 00:03:43.319 --> 00:03:45.960 And when they realised they could do genuinely like dramatic 64 00:03:45.960 --> 00:03:48.060 episodes, that two-parter. 65 00:03:48.120 --> 00:03:51.240 What's the Android character's name? 66 00:03:51.300 --> 00:03:52.319 Isaac? 67 00:03:52.379 --> 00:03:55.139 And they basically did like a take on the best of both whales. 68 00:03:55.199 --> 00:03:59.520 But with this enormous budget. you know, and gags as well. 69 00:03:59.580 --> 00:04:01.500 Ah, it was just amazing TV. 70 00:04:01.560 --> 00:04:02.460 Yeah. 71 00:04:02.520 --> 00:04:05.879 And I mean, that's a love letter to 90s Star Trek too, isn't it? 72 00:04:05.939 --> 00:04:08.280 But I think this is better than that. 73 00:04:08.340 --> 00:04:11.819 And I think it's funnier, and I think it's sure of what it wants 74 00:04:11.819 --> 00:04:12.419 to do. 75 00:04:12.479 --> 00:04:16.980 And I kind of miss the fact, you know, the thing about the Orville 76 00:04:16.980 --> 00:04:20.939 is it's very Star Trek like, but it's not Star Trek, and it 77 00:04:20.939 --> 00:04:22.620 doesn't take place in that world. 78 00:04:22.620 --> 00:04:29.399 And however much it might owe to 90s trek, it's not Star Trek. 79 00:04:29.459 --> 00:04:33.360 Well, you know what lower decks can do, that no other Star Trek 80 00:04:33.360 --> 00:04:36.779 show can do, it has an unlimited budget. 81 00:04:36.839 --> 00:04:38.160 Like, it's animated. 82 00:04:38.220 --> 00:04:41.339 No, but so it can be as weird as they want it to be. 83 00:04:41.399 --> 00:04:43.860 You know, it can be as visually stunning. 84 00:04:43.920 --> 00:04:45.300 Some of the set pieces. 85 00:04:45.360 --> 00:04:47.399 I know they're animated, but they look amazing. 86 00:04:47.459 --> 00:04:51.600 They can do like 100s of ball cubes coming out of nowhere and 87 00:04:51.600 --> 00:04:54.360 having a master space battle because, you know, that don't cost 88 00:04:54.360 --> 00:04:58.079 any more than just, you know, drawing the bridge. right. 89 00:04:58.139 --> 00:04:58.860 That's right. 90 00:04:58.920 --> 00:05:04.019 And I think I think the set pieces in this are often visually 91 00:05:04.019 --> 00:05:05.100 arresting. 92 00:05:05.160 --> 00:05:06.060 Yeah. 93 00:05:06.120 --> 00:05:06.720 Yeah. 94 00:05:06.779 --> 00:05:10.740 You know, there is another thing that I sneakily like about it 95 00:05:10.800 --> 00:05:15.240 which is that I think it probably annoys a lot of Star Trek fans. 96 00:05:15.300 --> 00:05:21.779 And the reason it does is that it's canon, whatever that means. 97 00:05:21.839 --> 00:05:26.759 And so these things are really happening in the same world as the 98 00:05:26.759 --> 00:05:30.540 Adventures of Kirk and Picard and Janeway and all of that. 99 00:05:30.600 --> 00:05:32.279 But they're ridiculous. 100 00:05:32.339 --> 00:05:34.319 Not anything, though. 101 00:05:34.379 --> 00:05:37.259 It annoys them because it isn't the best of the best. 102 00:05:37.319 --> 00:05:40.079 And like the episode that we're about to go into. 103 00:05:40.139 --> 00:05:43.860 Like the big twist in this episode, spoiler, before we even get 104 00:05:43.860 --> 00:05:48.300 there, is this ship is chosen for all these tests because they're 105 00:05:48.300 --> 00:05:48.899 a bit shit. 106 00:05:48.959 --> 00:05:51.720 Yeah, yeah, I don't think they're going to fail. 107 00:05:51.779 --> 00:05:54.839 I mean, we talked about that last week when we did take me out to 108 00:05:54.839 --> 00:05:55.680 the hollow suite. 109 00:05:55.740 --> 00:06:00.660 What was fun about that is in a franchise that is overwhelmingly 110 00:06:00.660 --> 00:06:04.019 about how competent the characters are, or at least depends 111 00:06:04.019 --> 00:06:06.180 strongly on how competent the characters are. 112 00:06:06.240 --> 00:06:11.339 Seeing them fail at something like the baseball game is actually 113 00:06:11.339 --> 00:06:13.079 really fun and refreshing. 114 00:06:13.139 --> 00:06:17.879 And, you know, having these guys who aren't dumb or hopeless or 115 00:06:17.879 --> 00:06:18.540 anything like that. 116 00:06:18.600 --> 00:06:22.740 Like our 4 main characters in lower decks are all kind of super 117 00:06:22.740 --> 00:06:25.560 loveable and good at their jobs. 118 00:06:25.620 --> 00:06:28.860 They're just not in charge and it is kind of nice. 119 00:06:28.920 --> 00:06:32.639 I love how they make so many mistakes, but they always come good 120 00:06:32.639 --> 00:06:35.699 and it's always, it always, always due to their competence that 121 00:06:35.699 --> 00:06:37.860 they, that they are very good at what they do. 122 00:06:39.120 --> 00:06:44.759 But also as well, like you said in discovery that one of the best 123 00:06:44.759 --> 00:06:47.879 things about discovery was it wasn't about the bridge crew. 124 00:06:47.939 --> 00:06:53.279 Um, and that is true, but all the characters in discovery, they're 125 00:06:53.279 --> 00:06:56.699 kind of like important to the ship, you know, they, they, and then 126 00:06:56.699 --> 00:06:58.860 eventually now they've all got important roles. 127 00:06:58.920 --> 00:07:01.199 Now Burnham is the captain in Discovery. 128 00:07:01.319 --> 00:07:01.920 Yeah, yeah. 129 00:07:01.980 --> 00:07:04.680 But when it started, it wasn't that, though, was it? 130 00:07:04.740 --> 00:07:08.339 You know, there was Ensign Tilly, there was Michael who had no 131 00:07:08.339 --> 00:07:09.180 rank at all. 132 00:07:09.240 --> 00:07:14.279 There was the guy who ran the mushroom farm, you know, like it 133 00:07:14.279 --> 00:07:18.180 wasn't the normal bridge crew, so it wasn't a normal Star Trek 134 00:07:18.180 --> 00:07:21.420 show and it's gradually turned itself into a Star Trek show. 135 00:07:21.480 --> 00:07:24.000 But the premise of this is deliberately. 136 00:07:24.060 --> 00:07:26.519 This is about the lower decks crew. 137 00:07:26.579 --> 00:07:29.339 It's deliberately not about the important people. 138 00:07:29.399 --> 00:07:32.939 And what's the most interesting thing you could possibly do is do 139 00:07:32.939 --> 00:07:37.259 90s trek, but show behind the scenes. of the grunts of what they 140 00:07:37.259 --> 00:07:37.920 get out to. 141 00:07:37.980 --> 00:07:39.839 And like one of the funniest jokes in this. 142 00:07:39.899 --> 00:07:42.240 And I'll mention it now because I probably won't be able to have 143 00:07:42.240 --> 00:07:44.759 time during the episode because there's so many gags in this 144 00:07:44.759 --> 00:07:45.000 episode. 145 00:07:45.120 --> 00:07:50.399 One of the funniest jokes I found in this was when the bridge crew 146 00:07:50.399 --> 00:07:53.279 having to do tests as the lower decks crew. 147 00:07:53.339 --> 00:07:54.240 Yeah. 148 00:07:54.240 --> 00:07:56.220 And they're in the middle of a battle simulation. 149 00:07:56.279 --> 00:07:59.040 They like, right, you need to go to the cargo bay and you need to 150 00:07:59.040 --> 00:08:03.720 stack up these hexagonal pods and that's all you've got to do. 151 00:08:03.720 --> 00:08:07.019 And they were like, and one guy goes, why the fuck did they design 152 00:08:07.019 --> 00:08:07.860 them this way? 153 00:08:07.860 --> 00:08:10.439 Because every time the ship rocks, they all fall over again. 154 00:08:10.500 --> 00:08:13.259 And I'm just like, 0 my god, that's so funny. 155 00:08:13.319 --> 00:08:14.579 You know. 156 00:08:14.639 --> 00:08:15.240 So good. 157 00:08:15.300 --> 00:08:18.000 Because every time you were in TNG, every time you went to the 158 00:08:18.000 --> 00:08:20.339 cargo bank, there was those things all stacked up. 159 00:08:20.459 --> 00:08:21.660 Yep, yep. 160 00:08:21.720 --> 00:08:23.939 Did one fall on wolfs back at one point? 161 00:08:24.000 --> 00:08:28.860 We'll come to that because that is an episode that gets explicitly 162 00:08:28.860 --> 00:08:30.660 referenced in this show. 163 00:08:30.779 --> 00:08:32.519 The joy of this. 164 00:08:32.700 --> 00:08:35.399 It's not just, it's irreverent. 165 00:08:35.460 --> 00:08:39.059 It is that it is a fresh take on something we already know really 166 00:08:39.059 --> 00:08:39.360 well. 167 00:08:39.419 --> 00:08:40.379 Yeah. 168 00:08:40.440 --> 00:08:44.159 And I would have thought this impossible until I saw this, and I 169 00:08:44.159 --> 00:08:47.580 wasn't convinced at all this was going to work when I went into 170 00:08:47.580 --> 00:08:47.879 it. 171 00:08:48.179 --> 00:08:54.840 It's doing the rick and Morty thing of having, you know, like a 172 00:08:54.840 --> 00:08:58.259 100 gags a minute and just one idea after another. 173 00:08:58.320 --> 00:09:01.799 They just, it's like someone's got a machine gun of conceptions 174 00:09:01.799 --> 00:09:07.259 and they're just firing at you, and each episode, it just, I think 175 00:09:07.259 --> 00:09:12.179 they're packed for 20 minutes, they're packed, and one lower decks 176 00:09:12.179 --> 00:09:18.840 episode at 20 minutes long, has more ideas, I'd say, potentially 177 00:09:18.840 --> 00:09:19.860 than a season. 178 00:09:19.919 --> 00:09:22.259 That 1st season of Enterprise, you know? 179 00:09:22.320 --> 00:09:26.460 Or at least a handful of episodes. what was that one we watched 180 00:09:26.460 --> 00:09:27.059 Strange New Worlds. 181 00:09:27.120 --> 00:09:29.159 There was nothing in that at all. 182 00:09:29.220 --> 00:09:31.259 Every one of these episodes is packed. 183 00:09:31.320 --> 00:09:32.519 Yeah. 184 00:09:32.580 --> 00:09:33.419 Yeah. 185 00:09:33.480 --> 00:09:38.039 And manages to do, I think, a proper Star Trek plot with some kind 186 00:09:38.039 --> 00:09:39.659 of character beat as well. 187 00:09:39.720 --> 00:09:43.500 In a way that 90s Star Trek or next gen at least doesn't always 188 00:09:43.500 --> 00:09:43.980 manage. 189 00:09:44.039 --> 00:09:47.940 Like NextGen is very frequently just about our space problem and 190 00:09:47.940 --> 00:09:49.740 how we solve the space problem. 191 00:09:49.799 --> 00:09:52.559 And sometimes we get a character arc. 192 00:09:52.620 --> 00:09:56.399 But because this is a sort of 25 minute cartoon, and that's part 193 00:09:56.399 --> 00:10:00.480 of the genre, and we have a good set of characters even after only 194 00:10:00.480 --> 00:10:04.440 what we've had 20 episodes, like very well drawn characters with 195 00:10:04.440 --> 00:10:08.220 interesting relationships with each other and so on. 196 00:10:08.279 --> 00:10:10.679 I think it, I think it's working really well. 197 00:10:10.740 --> 00:10:12.899 Even more surprising now. 198 00:10:12.960 --> 00:10:14.759 I promise we'll go into the episode in a minute. 199 00:10:14.820 --> 00:10:18.360 I said we've pad out the beginning here because the episode is 200 00:10:18.360 --> 00:10:19.259 only 20 minutes long. 201 00:10:19.320 --> 00:10:21.059 But this isn't panic. 202 00:10:21.120 --> 00:10:22.259 This is intelligent discussion. 203 00:10:22.320 --> 00:10:23.639 That's right. 204 00:10:23.700 --> 00:10:30.419 Um, is that genuine character development is possible. within this 205 00:10:30.419 --> 00:10:36.840 comedic show, and I remember at the end of series one, there was a 206 00:10:36.840 --> 00:10:40.379 I think it was the penultimate episode where, oh my word, Mariner 207 00:10:40.379 --> 00:10:45.659 and her mother, the captain, were battling it out, and it was an 208 00:10:45.659 --> 00:10:49.200 extended form of therapy that took place as a, like a fight 209 00:10:49.200 --> 00:10:53.580 between the 2 of them, and it was vicious and nasty, and speaking 210 00:10:53.580 --> 00:10:56.700 of somebody who had a very combative relationship with his mother 211 00:10:56.759 --> 00:11:00.960 I could absolutely see myself in Mariner and the struggles that 212 00:11:00.960 --> 00:11:04.679 she was going through and and they reached this like fabulously 213 00:11:04.679 --> 00:11:05.580 touching resolution. 214 00:11:05.639 --> 00:11:07.139 This is a comedy. 215 00:11:07.200 --> 00:11:10.139 This is a Star Trek comedy and this is genuinely moving. 216 00:11:10.259 --> 00:11:14.700 I think that that relationship, that primary relationship between 217 00:11:14.700 --> 00:11:22.559 Mariner and Freeman is so good, and it continues to develop, and 218 00:11:22.559 --> 00:11:24.539 it doesn't tend to sort of retread itself. 219 00:11:24.600 --> 00:11:26.639 It doesn't tend to go over familiar ground. 220 00:11:26.700 --> 00:11:31.139 Like there is a kind of standard way that Mariner annoys Freeman 221 00:11:31.139 --> 00:11:36.240 and vice versa, but they have a very clear affection for one 222 00:11:36.240 --> 00:11:39.600 another, which I think is really lovely and, you know, for 223 00:11:39.600 --> 00:11:42.419 instance, in this particular episode, I think is a source of a lot 224 00:11:42.419 --> 00:11:43.620 of its warmth, I think. 225 00:11:44.580 --> 00:11:50.820 Well, okay, well, I mean, I think we have, because I know people 226 00:11:50.820 --> 00:11:53.100 out there that have watched a lot of trek that I haven't given 227 00:11:53.100 --> 00:11:53.399 this. 228 00:11:53.399 --> 00:11:57.720 The liar day. you know, I haven't given this a shot. and I'm 229 00:11:57.720 --> 00:12:02.159 hoping, just with this one episode alone, that they may be take a 230 00:12:02.159 --> 00:12:05.519 little dive into lower decks after hearing the one. 231 00:12:05.580 --> 00:12:07.200 I mean, you talk about plots. 232 00:12:07.259 --> 00:12:09.419 There's about 18 plots in this one, isn't it? 233 00:12:09.480 --> 00:12:11.639 All recycled from old Star Trek episodes. 234 00:12:12.659 --> 00:12:14.580 Yeah, yeah. 235 00:12:14.639 --> 00:12:16.019 Well, we'll definitely get to that. 236 00:12:16.080 --> 00:12:19.379 All right, so I'm going to count us in. shall I do that? 237 00:12:19.440 --> 00:12:20.159 I'm ready. 238 00:12:20.220 --> 00:12:22.740 I've got my finger hovering over the play button. 239 00:12:22.860 --> 00:12:25.139 I just want to say one last thing before we go in. 240 00:12:25.200 --> 00:12:25.980 Yeah. 241 00:12:25.980 --> 00:12:29.279 I could have sworn I saw boy in this butthole in this, you know. 242 00:12:31.620 --> 00:12:35.580 I've seen that picture doing the rounds on Twitter, you know, of 243 00:12:35.580 --> 00:12:36.659 his legs up in the air. 244 00:12:36.779 --> 00:12:38.700 It's so bad. 245 00:12:38.759 --> 00:12:43.259 We'll point it out when it comes, it's terrifying in all kinds of 246 00:12:43.259 --> 00:12:43.559 ways. 247 00:12:43.620 --> 00:12:44.820 Oh, terrifying. 248 00:12:44.879 --> 00:12:45.899 Is that what you found? 249 00:12:45.960 --> 00:12:47.340 Well, yeah, kind of. 250 00:12:47.399 --> 00:12:48.840 All right. 251 00:12:48.899 --> 00:12:49.919 I'm going to count us in. 252 00:12:49.980 --> 00:12:57.120 Five, four, three, two, one, and we're off. 253 00:12:57.179 --> 00:13:00.059 Oh, I've got a little Amazon original thing happening first. 254 00:13:00.120 --> 00:13:01.259 Me too. 255 00:13:01.320 --> 00:13:02.399 Okay. 256 00:13:02.759 --> 00:13:07.200 Oh, that um, that 90s aesthetic. 257 00:13:07.259 --> 00:13:08.879 It's just immediately obvious, isn't it? 258 00:13:08.940 --> 00:13:09.779 with the Cerritos. 259 00:13:09.840 --> 00:13:13.679 Yeah, yeah, but the, you know, this thing looks like the Botany 260 00:13:13.679 --> 00:13:19.200 Bay from the Neutral Zone in series one of Star Trek, the Next 261 00:13:19.200 --> 00:13:19.679 Generation. 262 00:13:19.919 --> 00:13:24.419 And this gag, this 1st gag about the time loop. 263 00:13:24.480 --> 00:13:27.720 I'm getting a distress call from Bakersfield. 264 00:13:28.259 --> 00:13:30.179 And it's the same distress call. 265 00:13:30.240 --> 00:13:31.440 It's so cheesy. 266 00:13:31.500 --> 00:13:32.460 Like it's... 267 00:13:32.580 --> 00:13:34.740 But that literally lets you lets you know what you're in for. 268 00:13:35.580 --> 00:13:37.259 And there we go. 269 00:13:37.919 --> 00:13:40.620 This is the premise of the show, isn't it? 270 00:13:40.679 --> 00:13:42.059 Oh, they won't leave us behind. 271 00:13:42.120 --> 00:13:42.960 Six hours later. 272 00:13:43.019 --> 00:13:43.620 They come back. 273 00:13:44.580 --> 00:13:46.320 So good. 274 00:13:46.559 --> 00:13:51.779 So yeah, these are our main 4 characters of Tandy, Rutherford 275 00:13:51.779 --> 00:13:53.519 Mariner, and Boemla. 276 00:13:53.580 --> 00:13:57.539 And I think all of them are really, really terrific. 277 00:13:57.600 --> 00:14:01.259 And the relationship between Tandy and Rutherford, I think, is 278 00:14:01.259 --> 00:14:01.919 particularly sweet. 279 00:14:01.980 --> 00:14:03.840 All right, opening credits. 280 00:14:03.899 --> 00:14:08.820 I am going to tell you that not only does this start with a riff 281 00:14:08.820 --> 00:14:13.019 on the original Star Trek theme, you know, like the those notes at 282 00:14:13.019 --> 00:14:16.440 the very beginning of the original Star Trek theme, but it also 283 00:14:16.440 --> 00:14:18.720 references Star Trek the animated series. 284 00:14:18.779 --> 00:14:21.480 And I'm going to tell you later how I know that. 285 00:14:21.539 --> 00:14:22.919 Look at this. 286 00:14:22.980 --> 00:14:25.019 This is deliberately taking the piss out of Voyager, because 287 00:14:25.019 --> 00:14:27.600 Voyager goes over an ice planet, but it certainly doesn't crash in 288 00:14:27.600 --> 00:14:29.279 the cell, into the planet, as it goes. 289 00:14:29.340 --> 00:14:30.000 Yeah, yeah. 290 00:14:30.059 --> 00:14:32.879 And this one, they've redone these credits and they've redone the 291 00:14:32.879 --> 00:14:35.580 Cerritos model for series two. 292 00:14:35.639 --> 00:14:38.639 So these credits have the pack led ships in it, and they're the 293 00:14:38.639 --> 00:14:41.039 big bad that's revealed at the end of series one. 294 00:14:41.460 --> 00:14:44.519 Isn't it marvellous, though, the fact that they could have like 295 00:14:44.519 --> 00:14:46.860 you know, they can do anything dynamic that they want, and yet 296 00:14:46.860 --> 00:14:49.919 they're still doing the ship going very gracefully over camera. 297 00:14:49.980 --> 00:14:51.600 This is supposed to be 90s straight. 298 00:14:51.659 --> 00:14:54.360 Oh, my God, that alien sucking on the missiles. 299 00:14:54.419 --> 00:14:58.620 And the way he looks out of the audience. hilarious. 300 00:14:58.679 --> 00:15:02.159 Yeah, he looks at the camera. it's wonderful What's going on 301 00:15:02.159 --> 00:15:02.399 here? 302 00:15:03.120 --> 00:15:06.899 And the music again is also incredibly 90s trick. 303 00:15:06.960 --> 00:15:09.840 We need to talk about that music, you know, particular moment. 304 00:15:10.019 --> 00:15:13.679 And the fact, I was going to say, the fact that I didn't get why 305 00:15:13.679 --> 00:15:15.480 this was called I excretus. 306 00:15:15.539 --> 00:15:18.480 Obviously, until the gag hits at the end. 307 00:15:18.539 --> 00:15:20.039 Yeah, it was such a funny joke. 308 00:15:23.100 --> 00:15:24.000 Oh, dear. 309 00:15:24.059 --> 00:15:32.399 So, um, I have the impression that Dr. Tana is actually from a 310 00:15:32.399 --> 00:15:37.019 race that's been in Star Trek elsewhere, the cat people. 311 00:15:37.080 --> 00:15:41.879 But I can't remember, I should really have looked that up 312 00:15:41.879 --> 00:15:42.720 beforehand. 313 00:15:42.779 --> 00:15:46.080 But what we have here is the premises being explained. 314 00:15:46.139 --> 00:15:50.100 So we have someone coming along to test them by running them 315 00:15:50.100 --> 00:15:51.419 through simulations. 316 00:15:51.480 --> 00:15:59.100 And this person is a Pandronian, we're just hearing that now. 317 00:15:59.100 --> 00:16:00.059 Trifected. 318 00:16:00.120 --> 00:16:02.039 So the head, the body and the legs. 319 00:16:02.100 --> 00:16:03.299 All work. 320 00:16:03.299 --> 00:16:11.039 So I have to say that I watched an episode of the animated series 321 00:16:11.039 --> 00:16:14.039 called BEM. 322 00:16:14.100 --> 00:16:16.440 I thought it was BM for Bundo Monster. 323 00:16:16.500 --> 00:16:17.220 It's actually time. 324 00:16:17.279 --> 00:16:20.580 And that introduces the Pandronians and there is just one 325 00:16:20.580 --> 00:16:24.120 Pandronian character called Bem that is like her. 326 00:16:24.179 --> 00:16:27.179 And so he splits himself into bits. 327 00:16:27.240 --> 00:16:31.620 When we saw her, when we saw her legs, there were little arms 328 00:16:31.620 --> 00:16:39.419 coming out of the legs and in this episode, Bem sneaks up to Kirk 329 00:16:39.419 --> 00:16:45.000 and Spock and replaces their phases and tricorders with dummies. 330 00:16:45.059 --> 00:16:47.759 No, their faces and communicators with dummies. 331 00:16:47.820 --> 00:16:51.299 It's we will talk more about it later, but... 332 00:16:51.360 --> 00:16:53.220 Did you see the name of some of those simulations then? 333 00:16:53.279 --> 00:16:55.980 What was called, what was called Cause and Effect? 334 00:16:56.039 --> 00:16:57.480 They're using actual episode time. 335 00:16:57.539 --> 00:16:58.139 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 336 00:16:58.200 --> 00:16:58.500 Yeah. 337 00:16:58.559 --> 00:17:01.559 But there's other ones like there's like carbon-based life forms 338 00:17:01.559 --> 00:17:04.380 and stuff like that, but there's all references to like they're 339 00:17:04.380 --> 00:17:06.839 just... 340 00:17:06.960 --> 00:17:08.640 So great. 341 00:17:08.819 --> 00:17:11.700 Oh, no, that was called Caretaker. 342 00:17:13.500 --> 00:17:17.460 Evolution, chain of command, hero worship. 343 00:17:17.519 --> 00:17:18.900 Oh my God. 344 00:17:18.960 --> 00:17:21.359 I mean, talking about on the nose. 345 00:17:21.420 --> 00:17:23.579 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 346 00:17:24.180 --> 00:17:28.859 But I think this, and I do have a question about this after the 347 00:17:28.859 --> 00:17:29.220 episode. 348 00:17:29.279 --> 00:17:33.059 I think I'll wait till after the episode, but this does lead into 349 00:17:33.059 --> 00:17:38.460 something that this show does an awful lot and that is the, you 350 00:17:38.460 --> 00:17:43.920 know, riffing on cliches, trek cliches and making making jokes out 351 00:17:43.920 --> 00:17:44.220 of them. 352 00:17:44.279 --> 00:17:48.119 So essentially on TNG, DS9, Voyager and Enterprise. 353 00:17:48.180 --> 00:17:50.519 They treat a lot of these premises very seriously. 354 00:17:50.579 --> 00:17:54.240 Lower decks comes along and just rips the shit out of him. 355 00:17:54.299 --> 00:17:55.019 Yeah. 356 00:17:55.019 --> 00:17:59.220 So we're in the mirror universe now for Mariner's 1st thing. 357 00:17:59.279 --> 00:18:01.740 And they're all going, they're all going, oh, I'm so horny. 358 00:18:01.799 --> 00:18:02.640 I want talk to somebody. 359 00:18:02.700 --> 00:18:04.440 This is great. 360 00:18:04.920 --> 00:18:07.619 This is this is so good. 361 00:18:07.680 --> 00:18:10.019 Oh, you could lose a whole day to that cycle. 362 00:18:10.079 --> 00:18:11.099 I'm horny. 363 00:18:11.160 --> 00:18:13.440 I want to torture someone and then when I torture someone, I get 364 00:18:13.440 --> 00:18:14.460 horny. 365 00:18:14.519 --> 00:18:18.779 And like it's just making fun of how every, you know, like they're 366 00:18:18.779 --> 00:18:22.079 evil and sort of highly sexualised in the merry universe. 367 00:18:22.140 --> 00:18:22.500 It' wonderful. 368 00:18:22.559 --> 00:18:24.960 It's so funny as well, the way that she's caught out. 369 00:18:25.019 --> 00:18:26.940 It's like, she's using the wrong hand. 370 00:18:27.900 --> 00:18:29.819 Yeah, so simple. 371 00:18:29.880 --> 00:18:33.299 But it's the wrong hand because it's the mirror universe, right? 372 00:18:33.359 --> 00:18:34.980 And she's the reflection of her. 373 00:18:35.039 --> 00:18:38.940 What he says here, right, about, oh, have you got to kill the 374 00:18:38.940 --> 00:18:40.799 captain or find a way to get a promotion? 375 00:18:40.859 --> 00:18:44.400 That's literally what Hoshi says in the Enterprise mirror episode 376 00:18:44.400 --> 00:18:44.640 you know. 377 00:18:44.700 --> 00:18:48.180 Well, I mean, that's the premise in the very 1st one in Star Trek 378 00:18:48.180 --> 00:18:50.640 in Mirror, Mirror, where it's like dead man's boots. 379 00:18:50.700 --> 00:18:53.819 Like you have to knife someone and kill them in order to get a 380 00:18:53.819 --> 00:18:54.240 promotion. 381 00:18:54.900 --> 00:18:58.200 So this is our 1st failed mission. 382 00:18:58.619 --> 00:19:02.099 But I like the fact the 2nd she goes into the Mirror University 383 00:19:02.099 --> 00:19:04.740 relation, she just goes, oh, I've just got to be a bit evil 384 00:19:04.740 --> 00:19:04.980 right? 385 00:19:05.039 --> 00:19:06.539 She'll be fine. 386 00:19:09.599 --> 00:19:10.859 Oh, my God. 387 00:19:10.859 --> 00:19:14.519 Okay, so this is this is basically the episode of DS9, Sons of 388 00:19:14.519 --> 00:19:18.420 Mogue, where Worf's brother wants to be killed and he has to go 389 00:19:18.420 --> 00:19:20.279 out with a knife. 390 00:19:20.339 --> 00:19:23.819 But there's an episode of Star Trek, the Next Generation from 391 00:19:23.819 --> 00:19:27.839 series five, I want to say, called ethics, literally called ethics 392 00:19:27.839 --> 00:19:32.759 where Warp's back is broken when a big thing falls on him for no 393 00:19:32.759 --> 00:19:37.500 reason in one of those big stacked containers, plastic containers 394 00:19:37.500 --> 00:19:39.599 in cargo bay falls, I don't even breaks his spine. 395 00:19:39.599 --> 00:19:41.339 And it's all about... 396 00:19:41.339 --> 00:19:45.059 He says he broke his back picking up a peanut. 397 00:19:45.119 --> 00:19:46.920 I don't know what that's a reference to. 398 00:19:46.980 --> 00:19:50.880 And then these people who run in wearing the stupid red surgeon's 399 00:19:50.880 --> 00:19:51.240 uniform. 400 00:19:51.299 --> 00:19:53.640 That's what they're wearing in that episode, isn't it? 401 00:19:53.700 --> 00:19:55.200 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 402 00:19:55.259 --> 00:19:56.220 But they're also wearing it. 403 00:19:56.279 --> 00:19:59.339 You know, like Pulaski is wearing one when she operates on 404 00:19:59.339 --> 00:20:03.420 Picard's heart in whatever that dreadful episode is. 405 00:20:03.480 --> 00:20:06.779 I mean, do you remember that FX and you've got Dr. Bev being all 406 00:20:06.779 --> 00:20:08.099 pious and... 407 00:20:08.160 --> 00:20:11.160 Yeah, with the woman who wants to try out a new technology on 408 00:20:11.160 --> 00:20:11.579 Wolf. 409 00:20:11.700 --> 00:20:16.140 Yeah, but also, like Riker says no, he's not going to do it. 410 00:20:16.200 --> 00:20:19.380 You know, like, and so that's... 411 00:20:19.380 --> 00:20:22.259 Whereas in DS9, of course, Wolf literally just picks up the knife 412 00:20:22.259 --> 00:20:22.859 and stabs him. 413 00:20:23.400 --> 00:20:25.859 And this inspector of the gun now. 414 00:20:25.859 --> 00:20:26.880 Inspector of the gun. 415 00:20:26.940 --> 00:20:32.160 And look at all, like you can see the, the, um, timber props 416 00:20:32.160 --> 00:20:37.500 holding up the fronts of the buildings because it is just on the 417 00:20:37.500 --> 00:20:40.859 Paramount lot, like they're not actual hole buildings and stuff. 418 00:20:40.920 --> 00:20:44.819 Oh, the choke later on, because I would probably forget where she 419 00:20:44.819 --> 00:20:45.900 goes on about us. 420 00:20:45.960 --> 00:20:49.319 Just 2.5 years of lessons, Mariner, and you fell off the horse 421 00:20:49.319 --> 00:20:49.619 really. 422 00:20:49.799 --> 00:20:52.440 Well, the horse is just stamping us. 423 00:20:52.500 --> 00:20:55.980 She goes, I would never get stabbed by a horse and she goes, no, no 424 00:20:55.980 --> 00:20:57.839 that wasn't that wasn't one of the corrupted ones. 425 00:20:57.900 --> 00:20:58.859 That was you. 426 00:20:59.279 --> 00:21:04.259 Oh, and he's, Rutherford is so adorable. 427 00:21:04.319 --> 00:21:09.539 So this is Eugene Cordero, who played Pillboy in The Good Place 428 00:21:09.539 --> 00:21:11.400 and who played... 429 00:21:11.880 --> 00:21:17.460 Yeah, yeah, and who plays Josh's boss in crazy ex-girlfriend. 430 00:21:17.640 --> 00:21:19.259 I had no idea. 431 00:21:19.259 --> 00:21:23.099 And like, I just think he's absolutely adorable. 432 00:21:23.160 --> 00:21:26.220 And this, you know, he's absolutely ready and willing to sacrifice 433 00:21:26.220 --> 00:21:27.420 his life in this thing. 434 00:21:27.420 --> 00:21:31.500 And of course, the ship blows up, even though he's such a good guy 435 00:21:31.559 --> 00:21:34.680 really good about all of these different missions. is we think we 436 00:21:34.680 --> 00:21:35.940 kind of know the cliches. 437 00:21:36.000 --> 00:21:38.519 And I was kind of nodding along with them, Dan. 438 00:21:38.579 --> 00:21:39.059 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 439 00:21:39.119 --> 00:21:41.039 This is what happens in the episode and actually that's not the 440 00:21:41.039 --> 00:21:42.720 way out and that's not how you pass. 441 00:21:42.779 --> 00:21:45.180 So it's subverting the cliche, it's quite a lot. 442 00:21:45.240 --> 00:21:46.799 Okay, I need to talk about this. 443 00:21:46.859 --> 00:21:48.660 I need to talk about the sequence on the ball queue. 444 00:21:48.720 --> 00:21:51.660 But this is a riff on either best of both worlds. 445 00:21:51.720 --> 00:21:52.680 I think it's better both worlds. 446 00:21:52.799 --> 00:21:58.920 Yeah, I've got later design elements. from later on. 447 00:21:58.980 --> 00:22:03.359 Like that, the, uh, plasma things and stuff, I don't know. 448 00:22:03.359 --> 00:22:04.380 And the ball. 449 00:22:04.380 --> 00:22:05.579 Spheres are from Voyager. 450 00:22:05.640 --> 00:22:06.539 They didn't come along. 451 00:22:06.599 --> 00:22:10.500 But the babies are from the season 2 TNG episodes. 452 00:22:10.500 --> 00:22:15.359 Yeah, Q. But, no, I said, I wanted to talk about this about the 453 00:22:15.359 --> 00:22:15.779 music here. 454 00:22:15.900 --> 00:22:21.119 Because what they do is explicitly reference the music from best 455 00:22:21.119 --> 00:22:24.839 of both worlds in a really playful way and the attention to detail 456 00:22:24.839 --> 00:22:28.319 in that because I sat up and was like, that's the music from best 457 00:22:28.319 --> 00:22:28.859 of both worlds. 458 00:22:28.920 --> 00:22:30.180 I've got the soundtrack to that. 459 00:22:30.240 --> 00:22:33.779 And I think I think if you are going to do this, if you are going 460 00:22:33.779 --> 00:22:39.240 to do a love letter to 90s trek as a TV show, then you need to get 461 00:22:39.240 --> 00:22:40.079 the details right. 462 00:22:40.140 --> 00:22:42.480 And they're absolutely doing that. 463 00:22:42.539 --> 00:22:47.160 And then we go through the simulation again, over and over again 464 00:22:47.160 --> 00:22:50.579 faster and faster, and each time through the music is faster as 465 00:22:50.579 --> 00:22:50.940 well. 466 00:22:51.000 --> 00:22:52.859 So it's making fun of the music. 467 00:22:52.920 --> 00:22:58.259 And and just also just making fun of what Star Trek, you know, what 468 00:22:58.259 --> 00:22:59.339 Star Trek is. 469 00:22:59.400 --> 00:23:02.460 So he escapes, he gets 74%. 470 00:23:02.519 --> 00:23:05.279 Now he's saving babies and drones and stuff like that. 471 00:23:06.359 --> 00:23:09.119 The expectation was to get 100%, though, was that he had to teach 472 00:23:09.119 --> 00:23:10.440 the ball queen empathy. 473 00:23:10.500 --> 00:23:12.180 Oh, and Peter at chess. 474 00:23:12.240 --> 00:23:14.519 It's so great. 475 00:23:14.579 --> 00:23:19.259 Now, here we are in the naked now, naked time simulation. 476 00:23:19.319 --> 00:23:21.180 This is just blissful. 477 00:23:21.900 --> 00:23:25.920 Look, there's men snogging and having sex. 478 00:23:25.980 --> 00:23:27.180 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 479 00:23:27.240 --> 00:23:32.400 There's some jet naked looking fantastic. an interracial male 480 00:23:32.400 --> 00:23:33.000 couple. 481 00:23:33.059 --> 00:23:36.480 Yeah, yeah, an Andorian and a trail. where you start and where I 482 00:23:36.480 --> 00:23:36.900 begin. 483 00:23:37.920 --> 00:23:40.079 And it's ransom. 484 00:23:40.140 --> 00:23:41.160 Oh my god. 485 00:23:41.220 --> 00:23:44.160 So, uh, Tahana and Shaq's fucking. 486 00:23:44.220 --> 00:23:45.359 Is that what we to understand? 487 00:23:45.420 --> 00:23:47.940 Because they do get in bed together later. 488 00:23:48.180 --> 00:23:52.920 When the cat literally puts her claws into his native body. 489 00:23:52.980 --> 00:23:54.900 Such a funny visual gag. 490 00:23:55.140 --> 00:23:57.420 Oh my god. 491 00:23:57.660 --> 00:23:59.519 It is so good. 492 00:23:59.579 --> 00:24:03.599 Now they're having they're having a meal in the captain's quarters 493 00:24:03.599 --> 00:24:08.759 and it just reminds me of the giant meal in Saru's quarters. 494 00:24:08.819 --> 00:24:15.119 In, in, uh, in, uh, forget me not from a few weeks ago, because 495 00:24:15.119 --> 00:24:19.799 there's even like a big tray of like crab claws and stuff, which 496 00:24:19.799 --> 00:24:21.420 just make it look like alien food. 497 00:24:21.480 --> 00:24:25.259 I love the fact as well that like she's like, 0 my god, this is 498 00:24:25.259 --> 00:24:26.039 pesto. 499 00:24:26.099 --> 00:24:29.039 Like, what sort of food are they getting in the lower deck? 500 00:24:29.039 --> 00:24:30.960 Yeah, they can't get pesto. 501 00:24:31.019 --> 00:24:32.339 But she likes it because she's green. 502 00:24:32.400 --> 00:24:34.380 I think it might be a slightly racist joke I think. 503 00:24:34.440 --> 00:24:35.279 Okay, do you think? 504 00:24:35.339 --> 00:24:36.779 Maybe, maybe. 505 00:24:38.039 --> 00:24:39.839 This is great. 506 00:24:39.900 --> 00:24:42.000 And then in a second, obviously, yeah. 507 00:24:42.119 --> 00:24:47.339 So we we jump to the senior officers. doing the lower deck 508 00:24:47.339 --> 00:24:48.000 simulations. 509 00:24:48.059 --> 00:24:51.480 And the joke is initially, you know, they think they're winging 510 00:24:51.480 --> 00:24:51.660 it. 511 00:24:51.720 --> 00:24:55.500 But actually, when the shit hits the fan, they're really rubbish 512 00:24:55.500 --> 00:24:56.759 at doing the media tasks. 513 00:24:56.819 --> 00:25:00.900 No, here they are, you know, bragging about how easy you have it 514 00:25:00.900 --> 00:25:05.759 as a lower decker and wondering why they ever kind of never 515 00:25:05.759 --> 00:25:06.299 decided. 516 00:25:06.359 --> 00:25:08.039 Oh, here we go, shacks. 517 00:25:08.160 --> 00:25:10.079 Yeah, but look, excuse me. 518 00:25:10.140 --> 00:25:12.359 My cat absolutely sleeps on my arse like that. 519 00:25:12.420 --> 00:25:13.619 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 520 00:25:13.799 --> 00:25:18.240 But I mean, that's a rich vein of jokes, isn't it? 521 00:25:18.299 --> 00:25:22.500 You know, how cat-like taana is with her scratching poles and... 522 00:25:22.500 --> 00:25:24.359 Okay, that's something that lowered... you do. 523 00:25:24.420 --> 00:25:26.940 You can have a character that's a cat and it's not embarrassing 524 00:25:26.940 --> 00:25:27.960 makeup or anything like that. 525 00:25:28.019 --> 00:25:28.799 Yeah, yeah. 526 00:25:28.859 --> 00:25:31.319 Oh, God, here they are. those hexagonal things. 527 00:25:31.740 --> 00:25:33.480 That's it. 528 00:25:33.539 --> 00:25:36.599 But the things that they're missing out on. 529 00:25:36.660 --> 00:25:39.900 So here this is Klingon attack, and there's a Klingon attack 530 00:25:39.900 --> 00:25:43.200 happening in the corridor that when the door opens, and then later 531 00:25:43.200 --> 00:25:46.799 on the door opens and clearly the Star Trek, the next generation 532 00:25:46.799 --> 00:25:48.660 episode, Cupid is going on. 533 00:25:49.380 --> 00:25:53.579 Like, look, here he is with the sort of Robin Hood hats and stuff 534 00:25:53.579 --> 00:25:54.119 like that. 535 00:25:54.180 --> 00:25:57.059 It's just so absurd. 536 00:25:58.980 --> 00:26:04.319 Do you think, like, do you mean, do you think, uh, Star Trek fans 537 00:26:04.319 --> 00:26:06.420 don't have much of a sense of humour? 538 00:26:06.480 --> 00:26:08.279 I think that's why some people rejected this a little bit. 539 00:26:08.339 --> 00:26:12.359 Well, no, but I think it's a way of watching Star Trek where the 540 00:26:12.359 --> 00:26:15.480 memory alpha way of watching Star Trek where it's a series of 541 00:26:15.480 --> 00:26:18.119 historical events that take place in the future. 542 00:26:18.359 --> 00:26:20.039 And if the events are ridiculous. 543 00:26:20.099 --> 00:26:23.819 And let's face it, this is not the only Star Trek series to be 544 00:26:23.819 --> 00:26:24.480 ridiculous. 545 00:26:24.779 --> 00:26:28.079 Well, I mean, they all touch on the ridiculous. 546 00:26:28.140 --> 00:26:30.240 We watch baseball the other week, you know? 547 00:26:30.240 --> 00:26:30.960 Yeah, yeah. 548 00:26:31.019 --> 00:26:32.279 In the middle of a war. 549 00:26:32.339 --> 00:26:34.140 Yeah, that's right. 550 00:26:34.200 --> 00:26:38.039 But, but, you know, like a lot of the ridiculousness comes from 551 00:26:38.039 --> 00:26:42.240 the characters noticing what happens to people in Star Trek, you 552 00:26:42.240 --> 00:26:42.480 know. 553 00:26:42.839 --> 00:26:48.420 I mean, I don't think there is a show, another show as meta as 554 00:26:48.420 --> 00:26:50.759 this, about his own franchise. 555 00:26:50.819 --> 00:26:52.200 I can't think of one. 556 00:26:52.259 --> 00:26:56.220 No, but, you know, if you worked on the Enterprise, you know, you'd 557 00:26:56.220 --> 00:26:57.900 be taken over, but oh, here we go. 558 00:26:57.960 --> 00:27:00.420 We were imagining Shaq's naked. 559 00:27:00.480 --> 00:27:02.700 It's like a nice bubble bar, I'll tell you. 560 00:27:02.759 --> 00:27:05.220 Yeah, yeah, Shax is a bit of a daddy. 561 00:27:05.279 --> 00:27:07.380 I, you know, anyway. 562 00:27:08.220 --> 00:27:11.640 It's a thing, you know. 563 00:27:11.640 --> 00:27:12.420 Don't judge me. 564 00:27:14.819 --> 00:27:19.259 Yeah, but, you know, life on a starship would be absurd. 565 00:27:19.319 --> 00:27:22.380 You'd be taken over by a godlike entity one week. you know, the 566 00:27:22.380 --> 00:27:22.799 next week. 567 00:27:22.859 --> 00:27:25.619 We're all playing Robin Hood, you know, the next week. 568 00:27:25.680 --> 00:27:28.559 We're at war with the Klingons or whatever. like it's chilli. 569 00:27:28.680 --> 00:27:31.019 It literally like points out to me. 570 00:27:31.079 --> 00:27:34.740 Oh my god, we spent like 7 seasons of Voyager going through these 571 00:27:34.740 --> 00:27:35.579 absurd plots. 572 00:27:35.640 --> 00:27:36.900 But take it all very seriously. 573 00:27:36.960 --> 00:27:38.220 Yeah, yeah. 574 00:27:38.279 --> 00:27:41.039 Like, how are we ever forwarded to thinking any of this, you know 575 00:27:41.039 --> 00:27:42.539 Janeway turning into a couple of lizards. 576 00:27:42.599 --> 00:27:44.039 Yes, that's right. 577 00:27:44.099 --> 00:27:47.579 Now, one thing which I think is a serious error. 578 00:27:47.640 --> 00:27:55.380 So the USS Cerritos bar has the Cerritos sort of, um, emblem logo 579 00:27:55.380 --> 00:28:00.960 thing, but it has a stick with 2 olives in it stuck out of it and 580 00:28:00.960 --> 00:28:06.240 you should never ever have a martini with an even number of 581 00:28:06.240 --> 00:28:06.720 olives. 582 00:28:06.779 --> 00:28:08.460 That's an atrocity. 583 00:28:08.519 --> 00:28:09.960 It's just a rule. 584 00:28:10.019 --> 00:28:12.059 Okay. one or three. 585 00:28:12.299 --> 00:28:14.160 That upsets me every time. 586 00:28:14.279 --> 00:28:15.420 Oh, there's an Andorian. 587 00:28:15.480 --> 00:28:17.220 Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's Jen. 588 00:28:17.279 --> 00:28:18.180 That's Jennifer. 589 00:28:18.240 --> 00:28:23.819 But I think as well, this show populates its episodes with as many 590 00:28:23.819 --> 00:28:26.339 aliens from across the Star Trek franchise. 591 00:28:26.400 --> 00:28:27.720 Well, there's a Tamarian. 592 00:28:27.779 --> 00:28:30.779 The Tamarian security officer is in the background of that shot. 593 00:28:30.839 --> 00:28:34.740 Yeah, they're like the pack-leds feature quite a bit, don't they? 594 00:28:34.799 --> 00:28:36.960 Yeah, yeah, they're the big band at the moment. 595 00:28:37.019 --> 00:28:42.119 We find out that their their home planet is called PackLed Planet 596 00:28:42.119 --> 00:28:43.680 in a later episode. 597 00:28:43.980 --> 00:28:46.980 It's like the Ogron planet in Doctor Who. 598 00:28:47.039 --> 00:28:50.339 That's right It's just that's the best we can do. 599 00:28:50.400 --> 00:28:53.099 That's imaginative their planet names are. 600 00:28:53.160 --> 00:28:57.599 Now, in the in the Star Trek, the animated series thing with the 601 00:28:57.599 --> 00:29:02.460 Pandronian, in it, the Pandronian was experimenting on Spock and 602 00:29:02.460 --> 00:29:04.740 Kirk as well, or kind of testing them out. 603 00:29:04.799 --> 00:29:09.599 And so clearly, this horrible Pandronian has the job of doing that 604 00:29:09.599 --> 00:29:11.519 and that's where they got the idea from. 605 00:29:11.579 --> 00:29:16.380 But the body separation thing, her outfit, the fact that she's got 606 00:29:16.380 --> 00:29:19.500 a dog's nose, like they're all taken from this. 607 00:29:20.519 --> 00:29:23.880 It's not a terrible episode, but it's not great. 608 00:29:23.940 --> 00:29:27.420 And it is, it's Star Trek for children, I think, in a way that 609 00:29:27.420 --> 00:29:28.140 this isn't at all. 610 00:29:28.200 --> 00:29:32.160 I mean, this is sex jokes and can be really quite violent at times 611 00:29:32.160 --> 00:29:32.700 as well. 612 00:29:32.759 --> 00:29:34.859 I'm slightly disappointed. 613 00:29:35.400 --> 00:29:37.079 They swear. 614 00:29:37.079 --> 00:29:39.599 Black hole in space is not the only black hole we've seen in this 615 00:29:39.599 --> 00:29:40.380 episode, is it? 616 00:29:40.920 --> 00:29:42.900 Yeah, well, this is coming up. 617 00:29:42.960 --> 00:29:48.000 But I do like I do like the joke here that, you know, I took me a 618 00:29:48.000 --> 00:29:50.039 long time to find a ship that's incompetent. 619 00:29:50.099 --> 00:29:53.700 So we knew that you would all fail the tests, you know? 620 00:29:53.759 --> 00:29:58.859 But it's also too, that Freeman and Mariner know how an episode of 621 00:29:58.859 --> 00:30:01.500 a cartoon or an episode of Lower Decks works. 622 00:30:01.559 --> 00:30:04.140 And so they come in and say, we've worked it out. 623 00:30:04.200 --> 00:30:05.640 The tests aren't real. 624 00:30:05.700 --> 00:30:08.460 It was all just designed to get us to empathise with each other so 625 00:30:08.460 --> 00:30:10.200 that we work together better as a crew. 626 00:30:10.259 --> 00:30:13.380 And you can imagine a Star Trek episode like that as well. 627 00:30:13.440 --> 00:30:16.019 Um, but they're wrong. 628 00:30:16.079 --> 00:30:16.740 She's... 629 00:30:16.799 --> 00:30:18.240 And also, but just also the... 630 00:30:18.299 --> 00:30:19.740 The odds are against us here. 631 00:30:19.799 --> 00:30:23.039 Like we found, we're at this percentage, we're, you know, we're 632 00:30:23.039 --> 00:30:26.099 going to, and then it's like to rise up above that. 633 00:30:26.160 --> 00:30:27.720 That's very Star Trek, isn't it? 634 00:30:27.779 --> 00:30:29.220 And then tend to win anyway. 635 00:30:29.279 --> 00:30:33.720 And I love the fact that he has to, he has to fail, doesn't he? 636 00:30:33.779 --> 00:30:36.900 Or he has to not succeed in order for them to have time. 637 00:30:36.960 --> 00:30:38.160 So. 638 00:30:39.480 --> 00:30:41.640 He's just got 100% in the drill. 639 00:30:41.700 --> 00:30:43.859 He's finally done it. about to shut it off. 640 00:30:43.920 --> 00:30:45.900 He ends up with 8% at the end. 641 00:30:45.960 --> 00:30:48.539 And it's Boimler, who's absolutely ambitious. 642 00:30:48.599 --> 00:30:53.460 He's desperate to, you know, please the commanding officers. you 643 00:30:53.460 --> 00:30:55.980 know, he absolutely wants to do the right thing all the time. 644 00:30:56.039 --> 00:31:00.000 And so to have him, you know, get a similar... 645 00:31:00.000 --> 00:31:01.980 I can't give you anything more original trait, you know, than a 646 00:31:01.980 --> 00:31:02.759 floating head like that. 647 00:31:02.819 --> 00:31:08.099 Yeah, well, I mean, the, in fact, the Pandronian in the animated 648 00:31:08.099 --> 00:31:10.380 series could detach its arms. 649 00:31:10.440 --> 00:31:13.980 It gets referred to as a colony organism. 650 00:31:14.039 --> 00:31:18.779 So they're like separate entities or something that are all joined 651 00:31:18.779 --> 00:31:19.500 together into a body. 652 00:31:19.559 --> 00:31:21.599 And again, this is great. 653 00:31:21.660 --> 00:31:24.960 So they know, basically, what they've got to do is scare. 654 00:31:25.019 --> 00:31:27.000 The Pandronian, don't they? 655 00:31:27.059 --> 00:31:30.779 And to basically, you know, um, making sure they succeed at the 656 00:31:30.779 --> 00:31:31.200 tests. 657 00:31:31.200 --> 00:31:35.039 And they go through another whole reef of Star Trek cliches. 658 00:31:35.160 --> 00:31:37.619 The crystalline entity and all of that. 659 00:31:37.680 --> 00:31:40.079 No, it's a whole series of crystalline entities. 660 00:31:40.140 --> 00:31:41.640 It's unconsuming a rogue planet. 661 00:31:41.700 --> 00:31:44.700 It's too crystalline and he's getting frisky. 662 00:31:44.759 --> 00:31:47.819 It's like, oh, we're going to head towards this black hole and 663 00:31:47.819 --> 00:31:50.460 there's all this time madness going on around it. 664 00:31:50.519 --> 00:31:53.279 I'm just like, oh, you are Taylor pissed too much now, I'll tell 665 00:31:53.279 --> 00:31:53.759 you. 666 00:31:55.019 --> 00:31:56.640 That's it. 667 00:31:56.700 --> 00:32:00.720 I mean, there's 800 episodes at this point that they can just make 668 00:32:00.720 --> 00:32:02.759 fun of and they absolutely do. 669 00:32:02.819 --> 00:32:06.299 And some films, speaking of which, here's Alice Craig. 670 00:32:06.359 --> 00:32:08.819 Yeah, she's actually surprisingly. her voice. 671 00:32:08.880 --> 00:32:11.759 But that's what I mean about attention to detail. 672 00:32:11.819 --> 00:32:14.160 Anyone could have voiced that and done a good impression. 673 00:32:14.220 --> 00:32:19.920 Well, even Voyager didn't have Alice Krieg, the 1st time the Bork 674 00:32:19.920 --> 00:32:21.299 Queen appeared, they had someone else. 675 00:32:21.359 --> 00:32:22.500 Do you know what? 676 00:32:22.559 --> 00:32:25.079 They even went to the length of having a character and having 677 00:32:25.079 --> 00:32:26.400 Jeffrey Coombs play him. 678 00:32:26.400 --> 00:32:29.339 Because, you know, the Jeffrey Coombs has played a 100 characters 679 00:32:29.339 --> 00:32:30.119 in Star Trek. 680 00:32:30.180 --> 00:32:31.500 So he plays a character. 681 00:32:31.559 --> 00:32:32.339 He has been in this. 682 00:32:32.400 --> 00:32:33.119 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 683 00:32:33.180 --> 00:32:33.599 Yeah. 684 00:32:34.859 --> 00:32:40.319 But again, like, like, you know, the crystal entity in TNG was a 685 00:32:40.319 --> 00:32:44.099 you know, a ropey old CGI, and it wasn't terrible, but it wasn't 686 00:32:44.099 --> 00:32:44.339 great. 687 00:32:44.400 --> 00:32:48.000 They can make it visually, really interesting in this. 688 00:32:48.059 --> 00:32:48.779 Look at the hat. 689 00:32:48.839 --> 00:32:49.619 That looks astonishing. 690 00:32:49.680 --> 00:32:50.640 Yeah, looks amazing. 691 00:32:50.700 --> 00:32:54.299 Well, you know, like they're able to do sort of textures and 692 00:32:54.299 --> 00:32:56.039 reflections and all sorts of things. 693 00:32:56.099 --> 00:32:58.019 So it's visually superb, I think. 694 00:32:58.079 --> 00:33:01.079 Nathan, do you know why Lower Decks is my favourite Catsman 695 00:33:01.079 --> 00:33:01.319 track? 696 00:33:01.380 --> 00:33:02.099 Why that? 697 00:33:02.160 --> 00:33:06.299 Because it's just so fun. so enjoyable to watch. 698 00:33:06.359 --> 00:33:09.420 It's the anti-Picard, which is so bloody miserable. 699 00:33:09.480 --> 00:33:12.000 Yeah, yeah, they're killing a champ and killing. 700 00:33:12.059 --> 00:33:15.660 Yeah, all these other characters and stuff. 701 00:33:15.720 --> 00:33:18.119 I watched this on it. a bit like Jodie Whitaker's dogs. 702 00:33:18.240 --> 00:33:20.519 I watch this and it's like watching a ray of sunshine. 703 00:33:20.579 --> 00:33:21.119 I just love it. 704 00:33:21.180 --> 00:33:24.960 Like, you know, sometimes it's to be entertained is enough. 705 00:33:25.019 --> 00:33:25.980 You know? 706 00:33:26.039 --> 00:33:29.819 But I think I think it's also clever and satisfying as well. 707 00:33:29.880 --> 00:33:33.539 Like, I think, you know, this is this is fun and entertaining 708 00:33:33.539 --> 00:33:34.680 but... 709 00:33:34.680 --> 00:33:35.880 Lloyd, Rick and Morty. 710 00:33:35.940 --> 00:33:39.420 You can absolutely, you can go in and you can, you know, marvel at 711 00:33:39.420 --> 00:33:42.720 the massive high concepts they're playing about with and, you know 712 00:33:42.720 --> 00:33:43.740 the fun. 713 00:33:43.799 --> 00:33:47.579 But ultimately, I find it very entertaining to watch. 714 00:33:47.640 --> 00:33:48.660 And I, I don't know. 715 00:33:48.720 --> 00:33:50.940 I think that's an underrated virtue in television. 716 00:33:51.000 --> 00:33:52.799 No, I think it's super important. 717 00:33:52.859 --> 00:33:57.779 And also, I think that there's a, like, it's still got that Star 718 00:33:57.779 --> 00:34:03.359 Trek spirit, like there's still a kind of warmth and optimism and 719 00:34:03.359 --> 00:34:08.159 you know, it's still positive, despite, you know, the violence and 720 00:34:08.159 --> 00:34:09.480 all of that. 721 00:34:09.539 --> 00:34:13.380 The older I've got, the more sort of daft I want TV experience. 722 00:34:13.440 --> 00:34:14.760 Life is so bloody serious. 723 00:34:14.820 --> 00:34:16.920 So I want to have a bit of fun with my telly. 724 00:34:21.360 --> 00:34:24.900 I mean, the alien is so ridiculous. 725 00:34:25.019 --> 00:34:27.119 We are going to go. 726 00:34:27.179 --> 00:34:28.019 There we go. 727 00:34:28.139 --> 00:34:30.539 They're going into the path of black hole. 728 00:34:30.599 --> 00:34:31.559 But hang on a minute. 729 00:34:31.619 --> 00:34:33.420 There isn't time. 730 00:34:33.480 --> 00:34:34.559 Oh, yeah, no, there is, look. 731 00:34:34.619 --> 00:34:35.340 No, no. 732 00:34:35.400 --> 00:34:37.800 No, that's just that's just gravity things. 733 00:34:37.860 --> 00:34:40.920 We'll find out that Mariner was lying about the time quakes. 734 00:34:40.980 --> 00:34:44.219 She admits to just it being normal black hole. 735 00:34:44.280 --> 00:34:46.500 They know the cliches themselves. 736 00:34:46.559 --> 00:34:47.699 Yeah. yeah. 737 00:34:47.760 --> 00:34:48.900 Oh yeah, yeah, absolutely. 738 00:34:49.679 --> 00:34:56.699 So the alien. like the separating alien, um, we are going to do 739 00:34:56.699 --> 00:34:59.940 the animated series at some and it'll be interesting to see what 740 00:34:59.940 --> 00:35:03.780 we think of it, but it does just seem like sort of Star Trek for 741 00:35:03.780 --> 00:35:04.380 children. 742 00:35:04.440 --> 00:35:08.400 And they do have an alien on the bridge as well, which they could 743 00:35:08.400 --> 00:35:08.940 never. 744 00:35:09.000 --> 00:35:11.039 So, I'd be interesting to see that because I don't think that's 745 00:35:11.039 --> 00:35:14.039 altogether a terrible premise, you know, not true children. 746 00:35:14.099 --> 00:35:14.880 No. 747 00:35:15.480 --> 00:35:18.179 Oh no, he's been turned. 748 00:35:18.239 --> 00:35:22.320 Look, he's, he's, so the, so the joke is, is that he is basically 749 00:35:22.320 --> 00:35:24.000 loquitous a Borg now. 750 00:35:24.059 --> 00:35:25.440 But because he's so crap. 751 00:35:25.500 --> 00:35:26.579 Well, yeah. 752 00:35:26.579 --> 00:35:28.619 He's called I Excr... 753 00:35:28.619 --> 00:35:29.880 Excr... 754 00:35:29.940 --> 00:35:31.199 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 755 00:35:31.260 --> 00:35:34.500 But the joke is a riff on Iborg, isn't it? 756 00:35:34.559 --> 00:35:35.940 The episode eyeball. 757 00:35:36.000 --> 00:35:37.739 Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 758 00:35:37.860 --> 00:35:39.000 Yeah. 759 00:35:39.059 --> 00:35:41.519 And maybe like I, Claudius and other titles like that. 760 00:35:41.579 --> 00:35:44.280 Well, I, Iborg is probably a roof on eye, Claudius too. 761 00:35:44.340 --> 00:35:45.179 Can I ask you a question? 762 00:35:45.239 --> 00:35:49.380 Do you think someone's written out like a book with all the jokes 763 00:35:49.380 --> 00:35:51.300 of this and all the in references? 764 00:35:51.360 --> 00:35:52.440 I bet someone ask. 765 00:35:52.980 --> 00:35:56.280 And they're updating it every year and flogging it again. 766 00:35:56.340 --> 00:35:59.039 There he got 78%. 767 00:35:59.099 --> 00:35:59.639 Bless him. 768 00:35:59.760 --> 00:36:02.579 I've got 7 alpha when you know 8%. 769 00:36:03.780 --> 00:36:09.719 Memory alpha has a lot of links to other things that get reference 770 00:36:09.719 --> 00:36:12.599 so it does mention, it does sort of reference things. 771 00:36:12.659 --> 00:36:14.940 But this, like, I think this is nice. 772 00:36:15.000 --> 00:36:18.659 So they have learned something about each other. 773 00:36:18.719 --> 00:36:23.940 So it has worked, the way that Mariner and Freeman thought it was 774 00:36:23.940 --> 00:36:27.179 working. you know, inadvertently done that. 775 00:36:27.239 --> 00:36:30.780 Well, they basically, the lower decks people basically say, oh 776 00:36:30.780 --> 00:36:32.880 maybe it is quite hard being a bridge officer. 777 00:36:32.940 --> 00:36:35.880 The bridge officers say, well, maybe they aren't quite as shit as 778 00:36:35.880 --> 00:36:36.599 we thought they were. 779 00:36:36.659 --> 00:36:37.619 Yeah, yeah. 780 00:36:37.679 --> 00:36:40.800 Well, and that thing, because it is a sort of running theme that 781 00:36:40.800 --> 00:36:44.519 they don't get told stuff. 782 00:36:44.579 --> 00:36:48.599 They get left out of the loop and things happen to the bridge crew 783 00:36:48.599 --> 00:36:51.900 that they're never privy that they're never privy to. 784 00:36:52.800 --> 00:36:54.840 But you know what, as well? 785 00:36:54.960 --> 00:36:58.380 You remember we ended, take me out to the holosuite on that 786 00:36:58.380 --> 00:37:00.719 agonising, everyone laughing their heads off. 787 00:37:00.780 --> 00:37:02.039 We just got that again here. 788 00:37:02.159 --> 00:37:06.360 Yeah, except that it does end with an actual joke, which is, you 789 00:37:06.360 --> 00:37:10.079 know, Shaq says, oh, there's one thing the Borg left you as that 790 00:37:10.079 --> 00:37:11.340 hearty appetite. 791 00:37:11.400 --> 00:37:14.699 And then you hear him after we go to the credits, you hear Boimler 792 00:37:14.699 --> 00:37:18.780 go, they took everything I have, which... 793 00:37:18.780 --> 00:37:23.460 He's a line from family, I think, or possibly 1st contact. 794 00:37:24.059 --> 00:37:27.300 I didn't wait around for that, so I didn't feel it. 795 00:37:28.800 --> 00:37:29.820 Was it after all these credits? 796 00:37:29.940 --> 00:37:31.619 No, no, no, no, no, no. 797 00:37:31.679 --> 00:37:32.760 Just since we fade to black. 798 00:37:33.360 --> 00:37:37.260 I just thought it was a terrible joke and I was like, no, no, no. 799 00:37:37.260 --> 00:37:40.079 We play with it as well. 800 00:37:40.139 --> 00:37:43.440 But if there's any show, if there's any Star Trek show that could 801 00:37:43.440 --> 00:37:49.800 get away with ending on a crap joke and a laugh, it's this. you 802 00:37:49.800 --> 00:37:51.960 could say, well, it's being very meta doing that. 803 00:37:52.500 --> 00:37:55.440 No, but they actually are not a proper joke. 804 00:37:55.500 --> 00:37:56.880 It's really great. 805 00:37:56.940 --> 00:38:01.619 Okay, I've got a question for you coming out of this. 806 00:38:01.679 --> 00:38:05.639 And that is, is about, because this episode is the most, I think 807 00:38:05.639 --> 00:38:12.059 lower Dexian lower decks episode, as in, it is literally playing 808 00:38:12.059 --> 00:38:15.239 out scenes from 90s strict and lots of them. 809 00:38:15.239 --> 00:38:20.639 And that is kind of like, this shows back, you know? 810 00:38:20.699 --> 00:38:21.599 Yeah. 811 00:38:21.659 --> 00:38:24.360 Is that exhaustible? 812 00:38:24.480 --> 00:38:26.760 Like, how far can you go with that? 813 00:38:26.820 --> 00:38:29.639 You know, at what point do you say, all right, well, we've kind of 814 00:38:29.639 --> 00:38:31.860 done this, taking the piss out of 90 straight for a long time. 815 00:38:31.920 --> 00:38:34.139 At what point do you was like, okay, this is getting a bit tired 816 00:38:34.139 --> 00:38:34.500 now? 817 00:38:34.559 --> 00:38:36.179 How'd you keep that fresh? 818 00:38:36.239 --> 00:38:41.099 Well, I think the way they keep it fresh is by having worthwhile 819 00:38:41.099 --> 00:38:44.820 things of their own and so they have started to do that. 820 00:38:44.880 --> 00:38:47.940 So series 2 ends on a cliffhanger. 821 00:38:48.000 --> 00:38:50.400 We had the development at the end of series one with the 822 00:38:50.400 --> 00:38:52.019 introduction of a new big bad. 823 00:38:52.079 --> 00:38:55.619 This is like, let me get all memory alpha on you. 824 00:38:55.679 --> 00:38:57.840 This is set after nemesis. 825 00:38:57.900 --> 00:39:01.320 And so as far as 24th century trek goes. 826 00:39:01.380 --> 00:39:04.019 This is the 1st I'm shaking my head at you right now. 827 00:39:04.079 --> 00:39:06.300 Canonising lower decks. 828 00:39:06.360 --> 00:39:10.800 So this is the furthest that we've gone in the 24th century, and 829 00:39:10.800 --> 00:39:12.900 so they can change things. 830 00:39:12.960 --> 00:39:16.440 Oh, I didn't realise this was set after all of next year. 831 00:39:16.500 --> 00:39:18.239 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 832 00:39:18.300 --> 00:39:18.599 Yeah. 833 00:39:18.659 --> 00:39:20.639 So it's set off the nemesis. 834 00:39:20.699 --> 00:39:22.739 So it set after Deep Space 9 ends as well. 835 00:39:22.800 --> 00:39:26.880 So, look, that's the greatest gift this could ever give us, is 836 00:39:26.880 --> 00:39:29.579 that Nemesis wasn't the end of 90s trek. 837 00:39:29.639 --> 00:39:31.559 That's right That's right. 838 00:39:31.619 --> 00:39:34.739 And so and so now we have the future. 839 00:39:34.800 --> 00:39:39.539 And, well, you know, I guess we've got Picard, but this charts 840 00:39:39.539 --> 00:39:43.199 this in a very sort of Star Treky way, in that we have a new big 841 00:39:43.199 --> 00:39:43.679 bad. 842 00:39:43.739 --> 00:39:46.440 There's some political complications and stuff. 843 00:39:46.500 --> 00:39:53.460 But also as well, the characters are strong in themselves. 844 00:39:53.519 --> 00:39:56.219 They're not really just riffs on anything. 845 00:39:56.280 --> 00:39:59.639 They're strong characters with defined relationships with each 846 00:39:59.639 --> 00:40:00.059 other. 847 00:40:00.119 --> 00:40:04.079 The comedy comes from the way they interact with one another, and 848 00:40:04.079 --> 00:40:05.039 so does the warmth. 849 00:40:05.099 --> 00:40:09.900 It's not all just the joke of recognising a Star Trek reference. 850 00:40:09.960 --> 00:40:13.559 The humour only, it's like the Buffy effect, isn't it? 851 00:40:13.619 --> 00:40:16.320 Like, I remember with Buffy, I instantly love those characters 852 00:40:16.320 --> 00:40:19.500 because they were funny and they were losers. 853 00:40:19.500 --> 00:40:21.480 And this show has got both those things. 854 00:40:21.539 --> 00:40:23.099 They're both losers and they're funny. 855 00:40:23.159 --> 00:40:25.320 You know, they're the lower decks people and they're hilarious. 856 00:40:25.380 --> 00:40:29.940 But you can weaponize that if you want to. 857 00:40:30.000 --> 00:40:32.699 And now, like, look at the Simpsons where it's killed off 858 00:40:32.699 --> 00:40:35.159 characters and it's impacted. 859 00:40:35.219 --> 00:40:36.780 Like, they could do that here, I think. 860 00:40:36.840 --> 00:40:38.460 And it would... 861 00:40:38.460 --> 00:40:40.320 I mean, I know you probably wouldn't want them to. 862 00:40:40.380 --> 00:40:41.280 No. 863 00:40:41.340 --> 00:40:44.219 I mean, they killed off shacks at the end of series one. 864 00:40:44.280 --> 00:40:49.079 He died saving Rutherford, the Bajoran security officer, but he's 865 00:40:49.079 --> 00:40:49.920 obviously bad. 866 00:40:50.400 --> 00:40:52.199 Why is he back? 867 00:40:52.260 --> 00:40:52.920 I thought he'd left. 868 00:40:53.039 --> 00:40:57.000 No, so he's killed at the end of series one and then we do have an 869 00:40:57.000 --> 00:41:01.559 episode of series 2 where we discover that he's come back to life 870 00:41:01.559 --> 00:41:07.800 and we don't know how and Rutherford's consumed with curiosity 871 00:41:07.800 --> 00:41:09.300 about how he came back. 872 00:41:09.360 --> 00:41:13.320 And there's one speech where I think Mariner burns through about 5 873 00:41:13.320 --> 00:41:17.340 or 6 different possible ways he could have come back in just one 874 00:41:17.340 --> 00:41:23.219 speech, which are always that other characters have come back in 875 00:41:23.219 --> 00:41:24.539 Star Trek episodes. 876 00:41:24.599 --> 00:41:26.460 And it turns out he's not allowed to know. 877 00:41:26.519 --> 00:41:31.500 And so we never find out. essentially, it's just a thing that 878 00:41:31.500 --> 00:41:34.199 happens to major characters in Star Trek. 879 00:41:34.260 --> 00:41:38.280 They just get fired onto a Genesis planet and then they're back 880 00:41:38.280 --> 00:41:39.300 with us for the next film. 881 00:41:39.360 --> 00:41:44.159 I think with that episode there, it's smartly written. 882 00:41:44.219 --> 00:41:46.139 It's very funny. 883 00:41:46.559 --> 00:41:49.019 Jesus, the naked time section. 884 00:41:49.079 --> 00:41:50.519 I mean it's hilarious. 885 00:41:50.639 --> 00:41:52.500 It's very nostalgic. 886 00:41:52.559 --> 00:41:56.940 You know, it has huge love for 90s trek and it says something 887 00:41:56.940 --> 00:41:59.400 about the characters and takes, it gives them all a bit of 888 00:41:59.400 --> 00:41:59.760 development. 889 00:41:59.820 --> 00:42:01.199 Like, that's just good telly. 890 00:42:01.260 --> 00:42:03.360 Yeah, it's very warm too. 891 00:42:03.420 --> 00:42:05.760 Like, I think that's very affectionate towards the characters. 892 00:42:05.820 --> 00:42:06.960 It's not mean spirited. 893 00:42:07.019 --> 00:42:10.500 You mentioned Rick and Morty, which, you know, has perfect. 894 00:42:10.559 --> 00:42:12.840 I think it is kind of... 895 00:42:12.960 --> 00:42:14.099 I haven't, yeah. 896 00:42:14.159 --> 00:42:17.400 I'm watching through the Big Bang at the moment and a Big Bang 897 00:42:17.400 --> 00:42:22.440 Theory and I do, I like it a lot and I do like what, it is a bit 898 00:42:22.440 --> 00:42:24.239 nasty at times and a bit. 899 00:42:24.659 --> 00:42:25.980 Yeah, unpleasant. 900 00:42:26.039 --> 00:42:26.880 There's none of that here. 901 00:42:26.940 --> 00:42:30.420 You can literally just, you can, you can relax into this and just 902 00:42:30.420 --> 00:42:31.500 have fun with it. 903 00:42:31.559 --> 00:42:34.800 It can be very violent in the way that Rick and Morty can be very 904 00:42:34.800 --> 00:42:38.699 violent, but it's not nasty in the way that Rick and Morty is. 905 00:42:38.760 --> 00:42:41.340 And part of the pleasure, I think, of freaking Morty is the 906 00:42:41.340 --> 00:42:44.880 transgressive pleasure of enjoying something that's a bit nasty 907 00:42:44.880 --> 00:42:48.119 you know, it's a feature, not a bug. 908 00:42:48.239 --> 00:42:51.239 I think I'm gonna go for the last line here. 909 00:42:51.300 --> 00:42:51.780 Okay? 910 00:42:51.840 --> 00:42:52.920 Okay. 911 00:42:52.920 --> 00:42:55.860 Can Star Trek have a successful comedy series? 912 00:42:55.920 --> 00:42:57.360 Yes, it can. 913 00:43:00.420 --> 00:43:05.699 Okay, it's time for us to go to Untitled Star Trek Project.com 914 00:43:05.699 --> 00:43:09.840 slash Randomiser and pick our next episode. 915 00:43:09.960 --> 00:43:13.800 Joe, which series are we choosing from for next week? 916 00:43:13.860 --> 00:43:17.820 Well, I don't think I'm experiencing enough pain at the moment, so 917 00:43:17.820 --> 00:43:22.440 I have this somewhat quirky desire to watch another Voyager 918 00:43:22.440 --> 00:43:22.860 episode. 919 00:43:22.980 --> 00:43:24.239 Oh my god. 920 00:43:24.300 --> 00:43:26.219 But I do have a reason for that. 921 00:43:26.280 --> 00:43:27.420 Okay. 922 00:43:27.480 --> 00:43:31.019 Well, because I think generally speaking, Voyager V is one way or 923 00:43:31.019 --> 00:43:31.800 the other, right? 924 00:43:31.860 --> 00:43:34.320 And we hit upon an episode. 925 00:43:34.380 --> 00:43:36.539 The 1st one where it was Khan of Middling, you know? 926 00:43:36.599 --> 00:43:41.159 It was it was worthy and it was a lot of fun. 927 00:43:41.219 --> 00:43:43.019 It had lots to say. 928 00:43:43.079 --> 00:43:47.039 But it was also mired in terrible cliches. 929 00:43:47.099 --> 00:43:52.500 Whereas I think Voyager can actually be super fun when it's really 930 00:43:52.500 --> 00:43:53.159 shit. 931 00:43:53.219 --> 00:43:55.800 And when it's really fantastic. 932 00:43:56.219 --> 00:43:57.599 Yeah. 933 00:43:57.659 --> 00:44:00.420 And it can do both of those things. 934 00:44:00.480 --> 00:44:02.880 With alarming frequency, yeah. 935 00:44:04.079 --> 00:44:05.579 All right. 936 00:44:05.639 --> 00:44:07.019 So it's just Voyager then. 937 00:44:07.079 --> 00:44:08.340 Just Voyager. 938 00:44:08.400 --> 00:44:08.639 Yes. 939 00:44:08.699 --> 00:44:09.300 All right. 940 00:44:09.360 --> 00:44:09.900 Okay. 941 00:44:10.440 --> 00:44:12.599 I want you to press the button. 942 00:44:12.659 --> 00:44:14.940 I'm doing it right now. 943 00:44:15.539 --> 00:44:19.440 Oh, Jesus Christ. the episode after the last one we did. 944 00:44:19.500 --> 00:44:21.000 Oh, show me what's that? 945 00:44:21.059 --> 00:44:24.119 It's called prophecy and it's unbelievably shit. 946 00:44:24.179 --> 00:44:26.460 But I feel like series 7 again. 947 00:44:26.519 --> 00:44:27.960 Maybe we shouldn't do that again. 948 00:44:28.019 --> 00:44:29.699 Yeah, let's not. we re-roll. 949 00:44:29.699 --> 00:44:32.039 Early Voyager's got Cesca in it. 950 00:44:32.099 --> 00:44:33.719 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 951 00:44:33.780 --> 00:44:36.719 And they still give lines to Chakotay back then. 952 00:44:36.780 --> 00:44:38.880 It's obscenious now, I'm saying. 953 00:44:38.940 --> 00:44:39.179 Okay. 954 00:44:39.239 --> 00:44:40.440 I'm pressing again. 955 00:44:40.679 --> 00:44:42.900 Another series 7 episode. 956 00:44:42.960 --> 00:44:44.460 Oh, this can't be true. 957 00:44:44.519 --> 00:44:45.179 Natural law. 958 00:44:45.239 --> 00:44:46.380 It's a Chakose episode. 959 00:44:46.440 --> 00:44:51.119 The tail end of series 7 where he's romancing 7 of 9. is 960 00:44:51.119 --> 00:44:52.260 abominable. 961 00:44:52.320 --> 00:44:53.639 Yep, no, gross. 962 00:44:53.760 --> 00:44:54.659 Okay. 963 00:44:54.719 --> 00:44:56.820 Oh, yeah, okay. 964 00:44:56.880 --> 00:44:57.659 This is a goodie. 965 00:44:57.719 --> 00:44:58.440 This is a good idea. 966 00:44:58.500 --> 00:45:00.000 And it is fun as well. 967 00:45:00.059 --> 00:45:05.159 It's season three, episode four, and it's called The Swarm. 968 00:45:05.219 --> 00:45:07.619 Do you remember anything about the sword? 969 00:45:07.679 --> 00:45:08.760 Yes, I think I do. 970 00:45:08.820 --> 00:45:10.440 I think I do. 971 00:45:10.500 --> 00:45:11.639 Dual plots. 972 00:45:11.699 --> 00:45:15.300 So it's got a swarm that attacks Voyager. 973 00:45:15.360 --> 00:45:17.880 So there's some like quite nice set pieces in it, but it's got a 974 00:45:17.880 --> 00:45:21.599 2nd plot where the doctor is suffering from amnesia. 975 00:45:21.659 --> 00:45:26.820 Oh, which means Robert Picardo is a big part of this episode. 976 00:45:26.880 --> 00:45:28.559 All right, I'm sold. 977 00:45:28.619 --> 00:45:30.599 You had played Robert Picardo. 978 00:45:30.659 --> 00:45:31.139 There we go. 979 00:45:31.380 --> 00:45:33.000 Brilliant. 980 00:45:33.059 --> 00:45:36.840 But also as well, it like, I've seen to recall the 2 plots that 981 00:45:36.840 --> 00:45:40.440 have nothing to do with each other whatsoever or the resolutions. 982 00:45:40.500 --> 00:45:44.219 And so it's also Voyager sort of floundering a little bit as 983 00:45:44.219 --> 00:45:44.460 well. 984 00:45:44.519 --> 00:45:46.260 But it is quite fun. 985 00:45:46.260 --> 00:45:49.559 And it gives us a lot to talk about because it's that point where 986 00:45:49.559 --> 00:45:53.880 they jettisoned all of the Archie stuff that they were doing in 987 00:45:53.880 --> 00:45:56.460 series one and 2 and just said, right, we're just going to have 988 00:45:56.460 --> 00:45:56.760 some fun. 989 00:45:56.880 --> 00:45:58.679 Okay, all right. 990 00:45:58.739 --> 00:46:00.420 All right, I'm up for that for sure. 991 00:46:09.480 --> 00:46:13.679 You've been listening to Untitled Star Trek Project with Joe Ford 992 00:46:13.679 --> 00:46:15.000 and Nathan Bottomley. 993 00:46:15.059 --> 00:46:19.260 You can find us online at untitledstar trekproject.com, where you 994 00:46:19.260 --> 00:46:22.320 can find links to our Twitter, Facebook, and YouTube channel. 995 00:46:22.380 --> 00:46:26.519 Our podcast artwork is by Kayla Ciceran, and the theme was 996 00:46:26.519 --> 00:46:28.260 composed by Cameron Lamb. 997 00:46:28.320 --> 00:46:32.940 This episode was recorded on the 6th of December 2021 and released 998 00:46:32.940 --> 00:46:34.500 on the 24th of December. 999 00:46:34.559 --> 00:46:38.579 We'll see you next time for Voyages, the Swarm.