WEBVTT

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This transcript was created on 2026-05-01 at 21:09:27

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Hey, Joe. Hi.

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So, this is a very special episode for you and me, isn't it?

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Because in some ways, Bata Bing batter bang is responsible for the

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birth of this very podcast.

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It is, yes.

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I was planning on creating an offshoot of my podcast, Hammersmith

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Blunt Penknife, bringing in contributors to choose other shows

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than Doctor Who and their top 10 favourite episodes of whatever

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show they pick.

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We chose between us, DS9, and your top 10 list came through, and

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may I say it was a very eclectic list of episodes.

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A huge controversial.

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It was a controversial list.

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Well, it was the correct answer to the question.

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Well, indeed.

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It did include, it did include things like the visitor and stuff

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and things like that.

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It also included take me out to the Hall of Suite and Bada bang.

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And did it include in the Pale Moonlight because I think we

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contributed 5 each?

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May have.

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I'm not sure But certainly take me out to the Hollow Suite was

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one.

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And this was one and we tried to record an episode on this.

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I remember watching it sort of frantically trying to finish my 2nd

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watching just before recording started.

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And, uh, and something didn't work out.

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I can't remember what exactly.

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I don't think it was recorded, but somehow, between us doing the

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1st episode we recorded and this one that we didn't, untitled Star

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Trek project was born.

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Well, I think it was born.

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My memory is that it was actually born in the conversation that we

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had after we discovered we weren't going to be able to record it

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for some reason and I can't remember what the reason was.

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But initially, we'd had ideas of going through all of Deep Space.

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Yeah.

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But, you know, I mean, there is the podcast Random Trek by Scott

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McNulty, please call me Scott.

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Call us.

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Scott.

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And so it's not entirely an original idea, but I guess we're doing

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a commentary and we're choosing it on air.

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So we have some kind of accountability.

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So this, for me, is one of my favourite ones because one of the

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things that I like is when Star Trek kind of goes off piece and

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does something a little bit unusual.

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And it is possible to imagine a heist episode of Star Trek just

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played straight, but having it played in this sort of ocean's 11

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kind of way is terrific.

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It's hugely stylish, isn't it?

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It allows them to really like lean into the era.

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Like, there's a quote on a memory alpha where, I think it's Renee

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Eshire Vere says, we don't do call in Star Trek very much.

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We don't do it very well.

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No, they're not cool.

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But this is one time where we made, you know, where they're

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walking across a promenade, and they're all in their finery, about

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to go into the casino with that riff on the DS9 theme playing, and

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he goes, and that was just insanely cool, you know?

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Yeah, yeah.

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And I think too, you know, there's a tendency for fans in

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particular because we have been a persecuted minority watching

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sort of weird ass things that everyone else thinks are kind of

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stupid.

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We kind of get very self-conscious about whether something that we

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watch is silly or not.

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And that's absolutely the wrong approach to take with Star Trek.

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Star Trek is frequently silly.

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You know, even Strange New Worlds, which is a well-made, beautiful

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looking modern program, just very frequently goes, ah, we're doing

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Star Trek, remember, it's got to be silly.

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And so I don't think this is any less serious or less important

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than the weighty episodes.

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Uh, you know, that are about the world.

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I think this is probably an Ira Bears quote as saying on memory

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alpha, that these episodes, these funny, charming episodes that

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raise a laugh are far harder to put together than the visitor in

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the Power Moon.

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Like, that's just people talking in rooms.

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Here, you've got to get the editing right, the music right.

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It's got to be funny, you've got to put a bit of them for energy

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into the script.

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The actors have got to deliver it like perfectly if it's a

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comedy.

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And I feel DS 9.

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It is quite serious for the most part, and it's dealing with a lot

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of serious things.

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But when they do a comedy.

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They utterly commit to the genre that they are playing out.

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So if they're going to do a bond pastage.

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They are going to rock a bottom passage.

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They're going to do, you know, a high story in the 50s, then

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they're really going to lean into it.

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I don't think there's a DS9 comedy beyond profit and lace, which

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is very misjudged.

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That actually doesn't succeed.

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It is very offensive.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Well, you know, also we're in a situation now where we're about to

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enter a run of like 10 episodes that's highly serialised that

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leads up to the finale and that wraps up all of these plot threads

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that have developed over the past 7 years.

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And so this is, in a way, our last chance for hang time with these

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people.

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Yeah, and just to have a lot of fun, those 10 episodes are

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incredibly darker times than serious.

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And I can't think of anything more 4th wall than Avery Brooks and

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James Darren at the end of this episode singing the best is yet to

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come.

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Yeah.

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And then looking straight out of the audience and smiling.

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Yeah, it's great.

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Look, I think it's as charming as hell.

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I'm absolutely excited to watch it again.

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But before we go in, yeah, I've got a question I want to ask you

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because my other half is not a Star Trek fan and a friend of ours

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Siheart, who has kind of dipped into Star Trek. both find the idea

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of these holodeck episodes, all of them, without fail, agonising

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and that it's embarrassing that the show is, you know, departing

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from what they should be doing.

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Like, you know, here in the middle of a war.

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They spending time helping out Vic Fontaine.

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Yeah.

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And I think you've got something to say about that.

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Well, it just, it strikes me that that point of view is the point

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of view expressed by Cisco in this episode where he initially, and

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there's a reason for it, it's not what it is on the surface, but

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he initially is slightly irritated by the fact that they're all

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talking about this computer game and that they're all talking

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about Vic like he's a real person.

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And so for some people.

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Because remember the thing here is the safeties don't

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malfunction.

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Nothing goes wrong on the holodeck.

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And that's deliberate.

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He says, we deliberately didn't want to do a holodeck in

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jeopardy.

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We just wanted them to go in and, you know, basically and but help

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their friend as well.

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You know.

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Yeah, yeah.

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And and the thing is too, that in the context of a television

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program, Vic Fontaine is as real as everyone else on the show, you

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know, he's just an actor playing a part just like all of the

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others.

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And if we care what happens to Cisco and Kira and Odo, if we can

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be emotionally affected by what ends up happening to them or cross

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you know, when things don't turn out for them the way we envisaged

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then how is that different from them owing Vic Fontaine things, you

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know?

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It's not at all.

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In fact, I've got a quote for you here, and it's my favourite

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quote I've ever handed you, okay?

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So it says on memory effort.

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In fact, I receive them bear. saw the story. something of his

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commentary on how invested Star Trek fans can become in the

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characters in the same way that viewers have invested in the

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artifice of Star Trek and care about the characters who aren't

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real.

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We decided to do about a show about our characters care about the

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thick.

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So it's absolutely in the DNA of this episode, what you just

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said.

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Yeah.

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And one of the things that the holodeck is always enabled is that

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it has allowed us a visual way to depict the characters having

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downtime and being entertained.

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And, you know, we watch TV.

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We read books, but you don't see people on TV watching TV and

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reading books because that would be boring to look at.

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And so this makes that visible to a TV viewing audience.

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And it's very frequently used, even in non-holodeck episodes.

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We see people on the holodeck and that's used as a device to tell

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us how they're feeling or what they're thinking about.

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Do you know what?

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Do you know what?

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I hit my other behalf.

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I said, yeah, you think it's terrible at the day, go off onto the

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holodeck into this fancy world and blah, blah.

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And I said, well, how's that any different from you?

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Dressing up as your favourite character from Doctor Who and going

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to a convention?

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Is exactly the same thing.

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Now shut him up.

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Exactly.

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Yeah.

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But there's also another quote very quickly.

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I want to read to you Because this was something that I had

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considered going in.

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I think initially I found Cisco bringing up the idea of black

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people populating Vic's lounge in the 1950s when that absolutely

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isn't what would have happened a bit on the nose.

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But DeWitt, Douglas Kilgore, I'm not sure who that is.

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It's quoted as saying the situation is remarkable, not only as a

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scene in Star Trek, but also in the world of commercial

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television.

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Cisco is not explaining himself to a white outsider, human or

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alien, but to a woman from his own background.

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He includes her in his historical concerns through his use of the

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possessive pronoun hour.

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And Yates responds in kind, putting forth a different perspective

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from within their shared community of concern.

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Rank and gender, introduce complicating dynamics, but the communal

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rhetoric is a bit wordy, this.

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The communal rhetoric renders the debate as internal, indicative

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of how black people position themselves both in the productive

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reality of the show and in the fictive future of its narrative.

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Crucially, these black characters are allowed to remember and

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speak in a way that was unavailable to Uhura and Zulu 2 decades

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earlier.

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The production environment for racial representation has changed

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that much at least.

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Because that ends up being the big thing about Deep Space 9

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doesn't it?

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Because every main character. everyone in the opening titles has a

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group of secondary characters surrounding them.

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And for Cisco, that's his son and his girlfriend, both of whom are

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black.

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And so the reason that Ahura never had these conversations was

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there were basically no other black regulars or semi-regulars on

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the cast.

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So there was no one that she could talk to about that.

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And what it would have been, would be a black character explaining

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to a white character for the benefit of a predominantly white

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audience.

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And so it would still have centred white people.

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And I think that political discussion is actually really properly

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great.

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And it's still...

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We adds a little substance to what's a bit of fluff, really

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doesn't it?

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Yeah, but I mean, it's still an issue.

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I don't know whether we've talked about colourblind casting before

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on the podcast or not.

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I don't think we have no.

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No, probably not.

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But things like Bridgerton, for instance, where it's set in the

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regency period, but there's heaps of black characters and race

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doesn't kind of come up.

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I know it's sort of comes up.

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But it doesn't really come up.

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And that kind of erases black people's experience in how black

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people's history differs from white people's history.

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It just says, and look, colourblind casting enables you to cast

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fantastic black actors.

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Look at the David Copperpell that came out.

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Yeah, yeah.

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Yeah, yeah, that's right, with Dave Patel. amazing.

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He was terrific in that.

253
00:12:21.059 --> 00:12:24.899
And so you do want to do it because there are lots of historical

254
00:12:24.899 --> 00:12:29.759
stories, but this kind of critiques that.

255
00:12:29.820 --> 00:12:35.460
So we have a version of the 50s or 60s in Las Vegas where not only

256
00:12:35.460 --> 00:12:39.240
are there black characters, but there are sort of aliens and

257
00:12:39.240 --> 00:12:44.399
everything like that and no one cares, and that does need to be

258
00:12:44.399 --> 00:12:44.820
addressed.

259
00:12:44.879 --> 00:12:48.840
I think the episode does need to address it because otherwise it's

260
00:12:48.840 --> 00:12:50.039
kind of whitewashing history.

261
00:12:50.100 --> 00:12:52.919
But also as well, it's a fantasy environment.

262
00:12:52.980 --> 00:12:56.340
So Cassidy's argument that it just depicts things how they should

263
00:12:56.340 --> 00:12:56.759
have been.

264
00:12:57.240 --> 00:13:00.059
That's a valid enough answer, you know?

265
00:13:00.120 --> 00:13:02.100
Yeah, I think so too.

266
00:13:02.159 --> 00:13:06.720
But I think Cisco is right to be a bit thing about it.

267
00:13:06.779 --> 00:13:09.299
And I really like how Koi is about it.

268
00:13:09.360 --> 00:13:12.360
He doesn't want to have the conversation he just presents as being

269
00:13:12.360 --> 00:13:17.100
a bit grumpy about his senior staff spending so much time and

270
00:13:17.100 --> 00:13:20.039
effort on something that excludes him.

271
00:13:20.100 --> 00:13:22.919
He's never been depicted at Vic's before.

272
00:13:23.039 --> 00:13:26.639
You know, they did that because Iobear says that they deliberately

273
00:13:26.639 --> 00:13:31.379
had Cisco critiquing Vig, because they wanted him to be the voice

274
00:13:31.379 --> 00:13:35.940
of the fans that were so against that character.

275
00:13:36.000 --> 00:13:39.299
And they were like, they were like, if we can win Cisco over

276
00:13:39.299 --> 00:13:43.200
throughout this episode, maybe and make it a, you know, a great

277
00:13:43.200 --> 00:13:46.139
fun episode, then maybe we'll take the fans with us.

278
00:13:46.200 --> 00:13:47.879
And I think a lot of them got there, you know.

279
00:13:48.240 --> 00:13:51.120
And, you know, we've talked about fiction here.

280
00:13:51.179 --> 00:13:52.200
We've talked about race.

281
00:13:52.259 --> 00:13:56.279
Let's not forget this episode also is about them dressing up in

282
00:13:56.279 --> 00:14:01.259
fabulous clothes and robbing £1000000 from the mob, which is...

283
00:14:01.320 --> 00:14:02.159
It's so great.

284
00:14:02.220 --> 00:14:05.940
And it's absolutely a proper heist. really cool. should we?

285
00:14:05.940 --> 00:14:06.539
I think we should.

286
00:14:06.600 --> 00:14:07.500
I am ready.

287
00:14:07.559 --> 00:14:07.980
All right.

288
00:14:08.039 --> 00:14:11.759
Shame we can't hear the music because for ones, you can't

289
00:14:11.759 --> 00:14:13.259
criticise the music for once.

290
00:14:13.799 --> 00:14:16.200
Go on, admit it. sort of.

291
00:14:16.200 --> 00:14:19.500
So, it's a fantastic score.

292
00:14:19.559 --> 00:14:23.340
Yeah, but I think I think it highlights the fact that they've

293
00:14:23.340 --> 00:14:26.519
deliberately chosen elsewhere to make the music as boring as

294
00:14:26.519 --> 00:14:31.919
possible and then they kind of go, actually let's get some real

295
00:14:31.919 --> 00:14:34.200
atmosphere happening here and do that with the music.

296
00:14:34.259 --> 00:14:36.960
And it just makes me think you could have been doing that.

297
00:14:38.340 --> 00:14:42.000
And interestingly, this is the episode that wins the award for

298
00:14:42.000 --> 00:14:42.299
music.

299
00:14:42.360 --> 00:14:45.840
Yeah, well, there's completely only one that could.

300
00:14:46.440 --> 00:14:49.799
That's completely unlike anything else they do.

301
00:14:49.860 --> 00:14:53.759
Yeah, well, they don't give an award for a 52nd sting that leads

302
00:14:53.759 --> 00:14:55.500
into a commercial break normally.

303
00:14:55.559 --> 00:14:56.460
All right.

304
00:14:56.519 --> 00:14:58.379
I'm gonna canvass in.

305
00:14:59.940 --> 00:15:02.159
I'm going to count us in.

306
00:15:02.220 --> 00:15:08.279
Five, four, three, two, one, and we're off.

307
00:15:08.940 --> 00:15:10.620
Off we go.

308
00:15:10.620 --> 00:15:13.559
We have a focus on a...

309
00:15:13.620 --> 00:15:13.980
Yeah.

310
00:15:16.019 --> 00:15:19.440
Jimmy Darrett is charming as hell, isn't he?

311
00:15:19.500 --> 00:15:21.720
Yeah, he really is.

312
00:15:21.779 --> 00:15:23.220
And like, he's a good singer.

313
00:15:23.279 --> 00:15:24.480
He's terribly charming.

314
00:15:24.539 --> 00:15:27.840
He's obviously doing a sort of Frank Sinatra thing here.

315
00:15:28.080 --> 00:15:31.620
And that thing we've talked about before, that extension of them

316
00:15:31.620 --> 00:15:36.000
loving the work. absolutely beams off the screen.

317
00:15:36.059 --> 00:15:37.320
You can tell, they love working with him.

318
00:15:37.379 --> 00:15:38.220
He loves working with them.

319
00:15:38.279 --> 00:15:42.240
And let's not forget, he had to be convinced to do this because he

320
00:15:42.240 --> 00:15:45.240
initially said, oh, I don't want to do Star Trek and I don't want

321
00:15:45.240 --> 00:15:47.220
to do singing either because I've done that, that part of my

322
00:15:47.220 --> 00:15:47.879
career is over.

323
00:15:47.940 --> 00:15:49.919
And then he got the script for his way.

324
00:15:50.039 --> 00:15:52.980
And he was like, get my agent on the phone.

325
00:15:53.039 --> 00:15:54.299
Quick, I want to do this.

326
00:15:54.419 --> 00:15:56.879
Yeah, he was super excited.

327
00:15:56.940 --> 00:15:59.220
He wasn't the only person they considered and they did actually

328
00:15:59.220 --> 00:16:03.179
briefly consider Frank Sinatra Jr. who was around in a bit of a

329
00:16:03.179 --> 00:16:04.019
Star Trek fan.

330
00:16:04.080 --> 00:16:06.480
So I can't remember why that didn't turn out.

331
00:16:06.659 --> 00:16:09.360
But you know what, you always think they use him?

332
00:16:09.419 --> 00:16:11.759
They use him extremely well.

333
00:16:11.820 --> 00:16:14.580
Like, I think in his way, obviously that the purpose there is to

334
00:16:14.580 --> 00:16:16.080
bring, and Kira together.

335
00:16:16.139 --> 00:16:19.019
They have him singing a wonderful song in Tears and the Prophets.

336
00:16:19.080 --> 00:16:24.360
Here's to the losers when Hawk and Bashir. have both lost backs

337
00:16:24.360 --> 00:16:25.440
and they're going to have a baby.

338
00:16:25.500 --> 00:16:30.539
Um, to help Wolf get over his grief in imaging the sand.

339
00:16:30.539 --> 00:16:34.740
And then, uh, for Nog, when he lost his leg, in his only a paper

340
00:16:34.740 --> 00:16:35.159
moon.

341
00:16:35.220 --> 00:16:36.360
I mean, it's not all fluff.

342
00:16:36.419 --> 00:16:38.639
No, and that end.

343
00:16:38.700 --> 00:16:42.960
I mean, that song, the way you look tonight, which I just think is

344
00:16:42.960 --> 00:16:44.820
beautiful.

345
00:16:44.879 --> 00:16:50.820
The way Kira smiles at him when he comes out, it's...

346
00:16:50.879 --> 00:16:54.659
I think that that is a super affecting final scene, and his

347
00:16:54.659 --> 00:16:57.360
inclusion in the show is worth it just for that, I think.

348
00:16:57.419 --> 00:17:02.879
So now it's been turned into a sort of early 60s style kind of

349
00:17:02.879 --> 00:17:07.380
burlesque sex thing with all of these attractive ladies.

350
00:17:07.440 --> 00:17:10.740
It's the pornniest music I've ever heard come into TV.

351
00:17:10.799 --> 00:17:15.660
Okay, sleazy as hell, you know, and they're mucky.

352
00:17:15.720 --> 00:17:17.940
Look at them putting their legs in the air and their stockings all

353
00:17:17.940 --> 00:17:23.759
on display. so good And so we've now got Frankie Ines, who's our

354
00:17:23.759 --> 00:17:25.559
villain and Cheech.

355
00:17:25.619 --> 00:17:27.359
He's big dumb henchman.

356
00:17:27.480 --> 00:17:31.019
They are stereotypes, but they cast them brilliantly.

357
00:17:31.079 --> 00:17:36.059
Oh, like they're comedy, you know, they're comedy mobsters.

358
00:17:36.059 --> 00:17:40.140
And, you know, Frankie I is a bit threatening, but certainly

359
00:17:40.140 --> 00:17:42.900
Cheech is a sort of comedy sidekick.

360
00:17:43.019 --> 00:17:47.099
I mean, it literally has a cartoon scene later where he shoves a

361
00:17:47.099 --> 00:17:49.140
cheesesteak all the way down a man's throat.

362
00:17:49.200 --> 00:17:50.880
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

363
00:17:50.940 --> 00:17:51.720
Yeah.

364
00:17:51.779 --> 00:17:53.940
Straight out of a bloody comic.

365
00:17:55.079 --> 00:17:57.240
I love this as well though.

366
00:17:57.299 --> 00:18:00.420
I love the fact because we've been having these conversations

367
00:18:00.420 --> 00:18:04.380
about Bashir's friend giving him all these different programs all

368
00:18:04.380 --> 00:18:05.039
the time and that.

369
00:18:05.099 --> 00:18:07.259
So it's not unusual.

370
00:18:07.319 --> 00:18:11.759
Felix, yeah, to to spring this jack in the box on them and say

371
00:18:11.759 --> 00:18:13.019
right, put your way out of this.

372
00:18:13.079 --> 00:18:13.859
I love this.

373
00:18:14.519 --> 00:18:19.559
I love that, that, uh, Miles wants to delete them from the program

374
00:18:19.559 --> 00:18:22.799
so he says, computer, delete character Frankie Eisen, sorry I

375
00:18:22.799 --> 00:18:23.819
didn't catch your name.

376
00:18:26.460 --> 00:18:30.299
And so the guy tells him he's cheat and he tries to delete him and

377
00:18:30.299 --> 00:18:31.079
obviously...

378
00:18:31.140 --> 00:18:32.220
It says in that accent, doesn't he?

379
00:18:32.279 --> 00:18:34.140
What's a holo sweets?

380
00:18:34.200 --> 00:18:34.920
Yeah.

381
00:18:34.920 --> 00:18:37.980
Goodness, no.

382
00:18:38.039 --> 00:18:41.400
You know, you always say to me, in the pre-credit sequence, you

383
00:18:41.400 --> 00:18:42.779
need to know what the episode's going to be about and you

384
00:18:42.779 --> 00:18:44.160
absolutely do here, you know?

385
00:18:44.220 --> 00:18:48.119
Well, in fact, the last shot, the final shot is Sheesh, isn't it?

386
00:18:48.180 --> 00:18:53.519
Holding, holding Vic by the lapels about to sort of shake him in

387
00:18:53.519 --> 00:18:57.420
what is a sort of comedy, you know, it's light.

388
00:18:57.480 --> 00:18:58.680
It's...

389
00:18:58.680 --> 00:19:00.000
It's Ocean's 11.

390
00:19:00.240 --> 00:19:05.940
And this is obviously well before the Ocean's 11 remakes came

391
00:19:05.940 --> 00:19:06.299
about.

392
00:19:06.359 --> 00:19:10.019
It's the original Ocean's 11. which was, again, getting a cast of

393
00:19:10.019 --> 00:19:13.319
just great actors together to do a heist movie and have a lot of

394
00:19:13.319 --> 00:19:14.460
fun, and that's what this is.

395
00:19:14.519 --> 00:19:18.059
And when I was watching this, like, for the 3rd time this week

396
00:19:18.059 --> 00:19:19.319
because I love it so much.

397
00:19:19.680 --> 00:19:22.559
I was like, okay, this is actually all just set in one room.

398
00:19:22.619 --> 00:19:26.579
You know, it's clearly like a contained set, but it's being shot

399
00:19:26.579 --> 00:19:31.259
kind of so imaginatively and with such energy that you don't kind

400
00:19:31.259 --> 00:19:32.039
of notice, you know?

401
00:19:35.220 --> 00:19:39.119
So the opening credits are as slow as usual.

402
00:19:39.180 --> 00:19:42.299
Yeah, this is the one part of the episode is a little bit dreary

403
00:19:42.299 --> 00:19:42.960
unfortunately.

404
00:19:43.140 --> 00:19:45.119
Nice sedate.

405
00:19:45.180 --> 00:19:47.940
But I'll tell you one thing I did notice about this episode

406
00:19:47.940 --> 00:19:48.480
again.

407
00:19:48.539 --> 00:19:49.559
Watch as we go through.

408
00:19:49.619 --> 00:19:54.299
One was the very suffuse lighting throughout.

409
00:19:54.359 --> 00:19:59.160
And the dinner scene between Cisco and Cassidy's candle lit, all

410
00:19:59.160 --> 00:20:00.420
the scenes in Vic's.

411
00:20:00.480 --> 00:20:04.680
It's got it's got a nice sort of glow about it, this episode.

412
00:20:04.740 --> 00:20:08.759
But also the intimacy between the regulars and how much they touch

413
00:20:08.759 --> 00:20:12.660
each other and how this, you know, we watched Dramatis Persona the

414
00:20:12.660 --> 00:20:12.900
other day.

415
00:20:12.960 --> 00:20:15.000
And I know they were behaving a bit out of character.

416
00:20:15.059 --> 00:20:18.599
But, you know, there was no sense of sort of family or community.

417
00:20:18.720 --> 00:20:19.619
Here.

418
00:20:19.680 --> 00:20:21.599
It feels like one big family.

419
00:20:21.660 --> 00:20:24.180
And I love the fact that before we go into those 10 episodes at

420
00:20:24.180 --> 00:20:25.019
the end.

421
00:20:25.079 --> 00:20:29.339
We get them all at the bar having a moment together, you know, it's

422
00:20:29.339 --> 00:20:29.579
lovely.

423
00:20:29.759 --> 00:20:31.619
Yeah, I agree.

424
00:20:31.680 --> 00:20:34.859
It's one of the things you can do with these ensemble shows.

425
00:20:35.039 --> 00:20:36.900
Is every now and again.

426
00:20:36.900 --> 00:20:38.519
Sorry.

427
00:20:38.640 --> 00:20:41.759
Well, particularly this ensemble show though, because everyone's

428
00:20:41.759 --> 00:20:42.359
so strong.

429
00:20:42.420 --> 00:20:46.319
And, you know, we even have people who aren't in the opening

430
00:20:46.319 --> 00:20:51.059
credits like Cassidy and Nog playing a huge part because they're

431
00:20:51.059 --> 00:20:52.200
just part of the thing.

432
00:20:52.259 --> 00:20:55.799
I love the fact that Cassidy's presence in this.

433
00:20:55.859 --> 00:20:57.059
It'd take me out to the holo suite.

434
00:20:57.119 --> 00:20:58.619
Oh, right, she's coming back to the station.

435
00:20:58.680 --> 00:21:00.119
I going to get her involved in the baseball.

436
00:21:00.240 --> 00:21:01.980
She's just in there straight away, you know?

437
00:21:02.039 --> 00:21:04.380
With no question.

438
00:21:04.440 --> 00:21:05.880
We know she does a Cisco. yeah.

439
00:21:05.940 --> 00:21:09.180
And that's the best thing about the one of the best things about

440
00:21:09.180 --> 00:21:11.940
the last 2 seasons that she suddenly had a massively active part

441
00:21:11.940 --> 00:21:12.539
in the show.

442
00:21:12.539 --> 00:21:15.599
And boy, did she bring some charisma with her?

443
00:21:15.660 --> 00:21:17.460
She's so good.

444
00:21:17.519 --> 00:21:19.200
We've talked about the or before.

445
00:21:19.259 --> 00:21:24.720
I still haven't watched any of series 3 and she is the best person

446
00:21:24.720 --> 00:21:26.460
in it, I think, easily.

447
00:21:26.519 --> 00:21:27.480
She's so great.

448
00:21:27.539 --> 00:21:29.400
Just terrifically strong.

449
00:21:29.460 --> 00:21:31.799
Okay, so now here's our scene in Ops.

450
00:21:31.799 --> 00:21:34.920
And everyone's talking about Vic.

451
00:21:34.920 --> 00:21:37.980
And it is, it is if they're watching.

452
00:21:38.039 --> 00:21:39.660
It as if they're all watching a TV show.

453
00:21:39.720 --> 00:21:42.240
You know, one of those TV shows that suddenly everyone's watching

454
00:21:42.240 --> 00:21:45.660
and talking about and that's when that used to happen.

455
00:21:45.720 --> 00:21:46.559
No, no.

456
00:21:46.619 --> 00:21:48.720
That actually happened to me in my old workplace, when everyone

457
00:21:48.720 --> 00:21:49.859
was talking about EastEnders.

458
00:21:49.980 --> 00:21:52.559
And I walked into the road and everyone's terribly concerned about

459
00:21:52.559 --> 00:21:53.759
this person they're talking about.

460
00:21:53.819 --> 00:21:55.619
And I went, oh God, who's this?

461
00:21:55.680 --> 00:21:57.839
And I was like, oh, sorry, we're talking about EastEnders last

462
00:21:57.839 --> 00:21:58.019
night.

463
00:21:58.079 --> 00:22:00.900
But it was as real as this, you know?

464
00:22:00.960 --> 00:22:02.099
Yeah.

465
00:22:02.160 --> 00:22:06.420
I like the quick reminder of all the good that it's done for

466
00:22:06.420 --> 00:22:06.779
everybody.

467
00:22:06.839 --> 00:22:09.599
And it's one of those, you know, we're going to catch you up with

468
00:22:09.599 --> 00:22:12.720
where this character's been in case you haven't watched before.

469
00:22:12.779 --> 00:22:18.420
Yeah, and it's, it's not, it's not tired exposition.

470
00:22:18.480 --> 00:22:21.480
Like it is, it's worth having.

471
00:22:21.539 --> 00:22:24.720
It's kind of worth having in the episode even if it wasn't here to

472
00:22:24.720 --> 00:22:25.319
catch us up.

473
00:22:25.380 --> 00:22:28.680
I do love the bit where Cisco just walks in, no, and goes, well

474
00:22:28.680 --> 00:22:29.579
when you're going to go back to work.

475
00:22:29.640 --> 00:22:30.299
Come on.

476
00:22:30.359 --> 00:22:30.900
Yeah.

477
00:22:30.900 --> 00:22:34.920
He's, he's, you know, my other half and Sihar.

478
00:22:34.980 --> 00:22:37.440
Stop arsing around talking about hollow sweets, you know?

479
00:22:37.500 --> 00:22:38.339
That's right.

480
00:22:38.460 --> 00:22:41.400
What do you think of Kira's season 7 look?

481
00:22:41.519 --> 00:22:47.880
I don't like the hair, but I do like... do like the outfit.

482
00:22:48.779 --> 00:22:52.380
I love it when they put her in the Starfleet uniform in the last

483
00:22:52.380 --> 00:22:53.099
couple of episodes.

484
00:22:53.819 --> 00:22:55.500
Oh, okay.

485
00:22:55.559 --> 00:22:56.519
I'd forgotten that happens.

486
00:22:56.579 --> 00:22:57.539
Is that what they do?

487
00:22:57.599 --> 00:22:58.559
Oh, she looks sad.

488
00:22:58.559 --> 00:23:00.240
She is hell in that uniform, Jack.

489
00:23:00.480 --> 00:23:01.920
Yeah.

490
00:23:01.920 --> 00:23:04.799
There's a couple of times where this happens, you know, not

491
00:23:04.799 --> 00:23:07.500
because I realise there's a, there's an episode where Kira is the

492
00:23:07.500 --> 00:23:10.500
one where she finds out that her mum potentially has been having

493
00:23:10.500 --> 00:23:11.940
it off with Dakart in the past.

494
00:23:11.940 --> 00:23:14.640
And they're all, they're all chatting away about something

495
00:23:14.640 --> 00:23:17.940
ridiculous and she walks in and she's like, I'm waiting for you

496
00:23:17.940 --> 00:23:18.660
all to go back to work.

497
00:23:18.720 --> 00:23:21.000
And it's just little moments like that that I love.

498
00:23:21.059 --> 00:23:22.440
It feels very real, you know?

499
00:23:22.500 --> 00:23:23.460
Yeah.

500
00:23:23.519 --> 00:23:26.160
I don't think you'd have it in the next generation, you know?

501
00:23:26.220 --> 00:23:28.799
They wouldn't be having a fun conversation in the 1st place.

502
00:23:28.859 --> 00:23:30.359
No, that's right.

503
00:23:30.420 --> 00:23:34.500
Or a kind of terrible fun conversation or voyager the same, you

504
00:23:34.500 --> 00:23:38.759
know, like they're just not as cohesive enough a team.

505
00:23:38.819 --> 00:23:42.299
Now, Nathan, we were talking the other day that there was no, there

506
00:23:42.299 --> 00:23:46.440
was no mature relationships in 90s Trek.

507
00:23:46.440 --> 00:23:47.880
Exhibit 8.

508
00:23:47.940 --> 00:23:48.779
This is the one.

509
00:23:48.839 --> 00:23:49.380
Yeah.

510
00:23:49.440 --> 00:23:50.579
I think this is the one.

511
00:23:50.640 --> 00:23:54.180
I think Tom and Balana is insufferable almost impossible to

512
00:23:54.180 --> 00:23:54.420
watch.

513
00:23:54.480 --> 00:23:57.960
But these 2 are really great.

514
00:23:58.019 --> 00:24:01.019
Let's not even go into 7 and Chakotay, eh?

515
00:24:01.079 --> 00:24:02.279
Oh, yuck.

516
00:24:02.339 --> 00:24:04.259
Thank God we only have a couple of episodes of that.

517
00:24:04.319 --> 00:24:09.119
But like, I've heard reviewers. say that this is a very boring

518
00:24:09.119 --> 00:24:13.319
relationship, but I think they have like honest and like real

519
00:24:13.319 --> 00:24:16.319
conversations, you know, about marriage, about settling down.

520
00:24:16.440 --> 00:24:19.319
They have a troubled start with their relationship.

521
00:24:19.380 --> 00:24:20.279
I love the episode.

522
00:24:20.339 --> 00:24:22.380
Do you remember the episode where she says she's going to move on

523
00:24:22.380 --> 00:24:24.839
the station and he says, that's a big step.

524
00:24:24.900 --> 00:24:26.400
And she's like, what do you mean by that?

525
00:24:26.460 --> 00:24:27.299
It's a big step.

526
00:24:27.359 --> 00:24:30.359
And then she goes through him. you are afraid of commitment.

527
00:24:32.099 --> 00:24:39.299
But like, remember the last time we did a series 7 episode, he was

528
00:24:39.299 --> 00:24:42.839
trying to manipulate her into coaching the team.

529
00:24:42.900 --> 00:24:45.480
She just wanted to vote by bringing flowers.

530
00:24:45.539 --> 00:24:46.259
Yeah, that's right.

531
00:24:46.380 --> 00:24:50.819
You know, like it's, it is proper and sensible and not

532
00:24:50.819 --> 00:24:51.480
adolescent.

533
00:24:51.539 --> 00:24:52.319
Oh, here we are.

534
00:24:52.440 --> 00:24:55.680
This is as high stakes as we get here because he comes out now

535
00:24:55.680 --> 00:24:56.819
covered in blood, doesn't he?

536
00:24:56.880 --> 00:24:59.579
Yeah, but of course he's fake and so is the blood.

537
00:24:59.640 --> 00:25:00.960
But we like fake.

538
00:25:01.019 --> 00:25:02.160
We don't want him to get beat up.

539
00:25:02.220 --> 00:25:02.940
Yeah, yeah.

540
00:25:03.000 --> 00:25:03.660
No, that's right.

541
00:25:03.720 --> 00:25:04.319
That's right.

542
00:25:04.380 --> 00:25:06.359
Felix is a nasty man honestly.

543
00:25:06.420 --> 00:25:07.500
Yeah.

544
00:25:07.559 --> 00:25:11.099
Well, I don't think he was expecting Vic to become self-aware

545
00:25:11.099 --> 00:25:12.420
probably, when he wrote the program.

546
00:25:12.779 --> 00:25:14.400
Oh, man.

547
00:25:14.460 --> 00:25:17.579
See, everyone's sort of their their usual D space 9 characters at

548
00:25:17.579 --> 00:25:20.039
the moment, but later on when they're in the heist, they really

549
00:25:20.039 --> 00:25:21.240
get into their roles, don't they?

550
00:25:21.299 --> 00:25:22.380
Yeah, yeah.

551
00:25:22.440 --> 00:25:25.799
I mean, they're there in their uniforms and stuff just so that we

552
00:25:25.799 --> 00:25:27.119
know that it's Star Trek.

553
00:25:27.180 --> 00:25:31.440
I mean, the fact that this is a very Star Trek looking set is a

554
00:25:31.440 --> 00:25:33.299
usual brown colours.

555
00:25:33.359 --> 00:25:36.059
And then the characterised 90s track.

556
00:25:36.119 --> 00:25:39.480
But, you know, like with gorgeous 60s furniture in the background

557
00:25:39.480 --> 00:25:41.819
within the TV over Julian's left shoulder.

558
00:25:41.880 --> 00:25:43.740
It is only a paper moon.

559
00:25:43.799 --> 00:25:45.900
It's all very sort of art deco.

560
00:25:45.960 --> 00:25:49.200
It's beautiful to look at. like something that's come out of, you

561
00:25:49.200 --> 00:25:49.920
know, a Bond movie.

562
00:25:49.980 --> 00:25:51.420
Yeah.

563
00:25:51.480 --> 00:25:52.319
Yeah.

564
00:25:52.380 --> 00:25:54.480
No, I mean, that's the thing.

565
00:25:54.539 --> 00:25:59.339
This era has just never been anything other than immensely stylish

566
00:25:59.339 --> 00:26:00.720
and incredibly stylish.

567
00:26:00.720 --> 00:26:05.400
And, you know, 90 strike has a pretty bad record with casual

568
00:26:05.400 --> 00:26:06.599
clothes, doesn't it?

569
00:26:06.660 --> 00:26:07.500
They always.

570
00:26:07.500 --> 00:26:09.420
They look terrible.

571
00:26:09.480 --> 00:26:12.660
I can't think of anyone who wore any clothes that I would wear, you

572
00:26:12.660 --> 00:26:12.839
know.

573
00:26:12.900 --> 00:26:15.720
They all look a bit, you know, that that awful kid in that time

574
00:26:15.720 --> 00:26:18.720
travel episode of Voyager, that, like, they've come out of the gap

575
00:26:18.720 --> 00:26:21.539
and it's all just all weird colours and that, you know?

576
00:26:21.599 --> 00:26:27.119
But when it is successful, it kind of, you know, goes with the

577
00:26:27.119 --> 00:26:32.039
idea that Star Trek was created in the 60s and so the casual

578
00:26:32.039 --> 00:26:35.759
clothes should kind of have a bit of a 60s feel to them and that

579
00:26:35.759 --> 00:26:37.319
does kind of work, I think.

580
00:26:37.380 --> 00:26:40.619
Like, you know that scene later on, that glorious moment where

581
00:26:40.619 --> 00:26:44.279
they're going down the promenade in slow motion to the revised DS

582
00:26:44.279 --> 00:26:44.700
9.

583
00:26:44.759 --> 00:26:46.079
I want to see how they're dressed.

584
00:26:46.140 --> 00:26:47.579
I want to fuck every single one of them.

585
00:26:47.640 --> 00:26:48.240
I'm telling you.

586
00:26:48.299 --> 00:26:49.079
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

587
00:26:49.920 --> 00:26:50.460
All of them.

588
00:26:50.519 --> 00:26:51.480
Oh, here we go.

589
00:26:51.539 --> 00:26:52.500
The sleazy girls are back.

590
00:26:52.559 --> 00:26:55.440
So I adore this scene.

591
00:26:55.500 --> 00:27:00.779
So this is them scoping out the place prior to our, you know, the

592
00:27:00.779 --> 00:27:03.180
get plan explained to a scene.

593
00:27:03.240 --> 00:27:05.160
Go, don't, Kira.

594
00:27:05.160 --> 00:27:07.440
This is adorable.

595
00:27:07.500 --> 00:27:10.799
This is another grown-up adult scene because he's staring at the

596
00:27:10.799 --> 00:27:15.059
ladies, the sexy ladies on the stage and instead of being

597
00:27:15.059 --> 00:27:19.019
irritated by that, Kira just thinks it's adorable and hilarious

598
00:27:19.019 --> 00:27:23.640
and she smiles, that beautiful nun of visitor smile and just pats

599
00:27:23.640 --> 00:27:24.960
him on the shoulder and says, you have fun.

600
00:27:25.019 --> 00:27:26.160
I'll go and do my thing.

601
00:27:26.220 --> 00:27:27.900
It's adorable.

602
00:27:28.019 --> 00:27:32.759
So they can't do it. grown-up sexuality can do it.

603
00:27:33.240 --> 00:27:36.900
I want you, you compare it to like that, you know, god awful

604
00:27:36.900 --> 00:27:40.319
juvenile jealousy between Tom Paris and Neelix and stuff like

605
00:27:40.319 --> 00:27:40.500
that.

606
00:27:40.559 --> 00:27:43.799
It's like, oh, that's the other end of the scale, isn't it?

607
00:27:43.859 --> 00:27:45.000
Yeah, absolutely.

608
00:27:45.059 --> 00:27:47.940
Oh, this is fun when he when he does his little hand trick.

609
00:27:48.000 --> 00:27:49.140
Oh no, is it not quite yet?

610
00:27:49.259 --> 00:27:53.819
No, but the, like, so Cheech is talking to a bunch of other

611
00:27:53.819 --> 00:27:57.779
mobsters and telling a hilarious tale about how you whacked the

612
00:27:57.779 --> 00:28:00.839
wrong guy, which is because they're awful.

613
00:28:00.900 --> 00:28:02.279
They're all called poorly.

614
00:28:02.339 --> 00:28:05.519
Too many guards, too...

615
00:28:05.759 --> 00:28:08.940
Oh, look at Kira, doesn't she look hot?

616
00:28:09.000 --> 00:28:10.799
Yeah, beautiful.

617
00:28:10.859 --> 00:28:12.119
Oh, look at her hair now.

618
00:28:12.240 --> 00:28:14.880
All up with a little tiara holding it in together.

619
00:28:14.940 --> 00:28:16.200
Yeah, yeah, beautiful.

620
00:28:16.259 --> 00:28:18.180
And just beautifully 60s as well.

621
00:28:18.240 --> 00:28:18.720
It's wonderful.

622
00:28:18.839 --> 00:28:21.480
Doesn't this feel very bond, you know, with the casino in there

623
00:28:21.480 --> 00:28:21.839
and everything.

624
00:28:21.900 --> 00:28:22.619
Yeah.

625
00:28:22.680 --> 00:28:23.579
Yeah.

626
00:28:23.579 --> 00:28:27.839
But, I mean, Do you know what?

627
00:28:27.900 --> 00:28:30.059
Some of this dialogue is threatening the guy.

628
00:28:30.119 --> 00:28:34.559
No, look at a minute, where she goes, my talent lies in another

629
00:28:34.559 --> 00:28:34.980
direction.

630
00:28:35.039 --> 00:28:36.839
Oh, that's a good title for a book.

631
00:28:36.900 --> 00:28:38.160
Maybe I'll buy it from you.

632
00:28:38.220 --> 00:28:39.240
I was going, oh God.

633
00:28:39.480 --> 00:28:44.519
Yeah, but it should be ripe and cliche because it is a cheesy

634
00:28:44.519 --> 00:28:48.359
heist movie someplot on the holodeck that Felix has written for

635
00:28:48.359 --> 00:28:48.539
them.

636
00:28:48.599 --> 00:28:51.900
I think Felix has got a little taste of melodrama, you know, is

637
00:28:51.900 --> 00:28:52.920
there at the keyboard, you know?

638
00:28:52.980 --> 00:28:57.720
Yeah, but I mean, you know, the show does science fiction cliches

639
00:28:57.720 --> 00:28:59.940
when it's playing it straight.

640
00:29:00.000 --> 00:29:03.000
And so when it's doing a heist movie, it's got to do the heist

641
00:29:03.000 --> 00:29:06.180
movie. tropes and cliches and that way of speaking.

642
00:29:06.240 --> 00:29:07.380
I think it's really great.

643
00:29:07.440 --> 00:29:11.759
And it's not the sort of dialogue you normally get in Star Trek

644
00:29:11.759 --> 00:29:12.480
Deep Place 9.

645
00:29:12.539 --> 00:29:13.380
That's what's fun about it.

646
00:29:13.500 --> 00:29:14.700
It's not crap.

647
00:29:14.759 --> 00:29:15.900
It's cheesy.

648
00:29:15.960 --> 00:29:21.059
You know, it's cheesy and kind of period and cliched and stuff.

649
00:29:23.579 --> 00:29:25.859
Oh, no, no, the dialogue.

650
00:29:25.920 --> 00:29:27.960
But it's absolutely what you've got.

651
00:29:28.019 --> 00:29:31.619
Here's, you know, one special effect for Budder Bing Bellabang

652
00:29:31.680 --> 00:29:32.700
special effect, he goes.

653
00:29:32.700 --> 00:29:33.960
Odo's hand.

654
00:29:34.380 --> 00:29:36.900
Elongating to reach a glass.

655
00:29:36.960 --> 00:29:39.000
It's not very good, is it?

656
00:29:39.059 --> 00:29:42.839
I'm not sure why that would convince them that he's a sound guy

657
00:29:42.839 --> 00:29:44.519
that he can stretch his arm out like that.

658
00:29:44.579 --> 00:29:47.039
No, I just think it's...

659
00:29:47.039 --> 00:29:48.839
But he does get the fabulous nickname stretch.

660
00:29:48.900 --> 00:29:50.400
Stretch, yeah.

661
00:29:50.880 --> 00:29:52.500
So good.

662
00:29:52.619 --> 00:29:54.599
Oh, and he brings in Edgerie, doesn't she?

663
00:29:54.660 --> 00:29:57.779
She looks cute as a button, you know, cocktail waitress dress.

664
00:29:57.839 --> 00:30:00.539
And again, her hair, her 60s hair is pretty great.

665
00:30:00.599 --> 00:30:03.359
And honestly, at this point, Nicole de Boa is part of this

666
00:30:03.359 --> 00:30:04.140
ensemble.

667
00:30:04.200 --> 00:30:05.519
She's...

668
00:30:05.579 --> 00:30:08.700
Yeah, well, we already saw that in hollow sweet, I think.

669
00:30:08.759 --> 00:30:10.680
I think she's adorable.

670
00:30:10.740 --> 00:30:14.880
Does she only gets really one episode, which is not all that great

671
00:30:14.880 --> 00:30:15.420
isn't it?

672
00:30:15.480 --> 00:30:18.240
It's like, oh, the one with the one with family business.

673
00:30:18.299 --> 00:30:20.519
It may as well be an episode of family affairs.

674
00:30:20.579 --> 00:30:21.420
It feels like, yeah.

675
00:30:21.480 --> 00:30:26.279
It feels very sort of 3 o'clock in the afternoon drama, doesn't

676
00:30:26.279 --> 00:30:26.460
it?

677
00:30:26.640 --> 00:30:28.019
Yeah.

678
00:30:28.079 --> 00:30:29.220
I can't remember what it's called.

679
00:30:29.279 --> 00:30:30.240
I cannot remember what it's called.

680
00:30:30.299 --> 00:30:31.980
It's called family business.

681
00:30:32.039 --> 00:30:33.779
No, that's in season three.

682
00:30:33.960 --> 00:30:35.880
What's it called?

683
00:30:35.940 --> 00:30:38.940
It's it's before Emperor's New Cloak.

684
00:30:39.000 --> 00:30:41.160
I see, absolutely, it's gone.

685
00:30:41.220 --> 00:30:44.279
But she gets the, the one with giran, which I quite like.

686
00:30:44.339 --> 00:30:48.180
The one after the opening 2 parter, where she's kind of

687
00:30:48.180 --> 00:30:51.240
establishing herself on the station, and then she goes, Garak

688
00:30:51.240 --> 00:30:52.859
takes her out by calling her pathetic.

689
00:30:52.920 --> 00:30:54.240
Yeah.

690
00:30:54.240 --> 00:30:57.000
And I think she gets that one other as well.

691
00:30:57.059 --> 00:30:59.759
Well, I think she's always, I think she's very good, and I think

692
00:30:59.759 --> 00:31:03.000
people give her a rough ride because she isn't Jazia.

693
00:31:03.119 --> 00:31:04.500
Yeah.

694
00:31:04.559 --> 00:31:08.220
Look, I mean, it was a shame that Terry Farrell left.

695
00:31:08.279 --> 00:31:09.660
She's obviously terrific.

696
00:31:09.720 --> 00:31:11.460
Imagine her in a cocktail dress.

697
00:31:11.640 --> 00:31:13.500
Yeah, yeah.

698
00:31:13.559 --> 00:31:19.740
But then what she goes and does Becca or something with Ted

699
00:31:19.740 --> 00:31:20.279
Danson.

700
00:31:20.339 --> 00:31:22.079
She realised...

701
00:31:22.079 --> 00:31:23.819
For a while, but she gets kicked off it, I think.

702
00:31:23.880 --> 00:31:26.940
I know, but she did enough seasons and you get enough per episode

703
00:31:26.940 --> 00:31:30.180
I think, to justify not doing one more season of this.

704
00:31:30.420 --> 00:31:31.980
Yeah, yeah.

705
00:31:32.039 --> 00:31:35.160
I love all the look in their eye here, though. absolutely loving

706
00:31:35.160 --> 00:31:38.279
the fact that they're going to have to pull one over on the mob

707
00:31:38.279 --> 00:31:38.640
you know?

708
00:31:39.599 --> 00:31:40.980
Yeah.

709
00:31:41.039 --> 00:31:42.180
It's just...

710
00:31:42.180 --> 00:31:46.500
Well, I love how they take it in a different direction and we

711
00:31:46.500 --> 00:31:49.980
obviously lose something by not having Chadseer there because just

712
00:31:49.980 --> 00:31:52.559
Terry Ferrell, so he's superbly great.

713
00:31:52.619 --> 00:31:59.519
But I think Nicole DeBor is really, you know, she's sweet and sort

714
00:31:59.519 --> 00:32:01.859
of elf and unlikeable and bubbly.

715
00:32:01.920 --> 00:32:06.299
Very like that character on discovery, you know, a little bit

716
00:32:06.299 --> 00:32:07.380
androgynous as well.

717
00:32:08.220 --> 00:32:09.240
Oh, okay, like Adira.

718
00:32:09.299 --> 00:32:09.720
Yeah, yeah.

719
00:32:09.779 --> 00:32:10.500
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

720
00:32:10.559 --> 00:32:13.440
Yeah, and younger too than Terry, I think.

721
00:32:13.740 --> 00:32:15.779
This is so great.

722
00:32:15.839 --> 00:32:18.839
So they're going to steal a $1000000 from the mob.

723
00:32:18.900 --> 00:32:19.799
It's a highest.

724
00:32:19.859 --> 00:32:22.200
It's so, it's just charming as hell.

725
00:32:24.000 --> 00:32:26.099
So we go to an ad break.

726
00:32:26.099 --> 00:32:29.220
Oh, I did find that a bit a bit cringy, where they're all just

727
00:32:29.220 --> 00:32:32.099
going, oh, ha, ha, ha, ha, we're going to have so much fun. you

728
00:32:32.099 --> 00:32:32.279
know.

729
00:32:32.339 --> 00:32:35.339
It's a bit like the scene in Take Me Out to the Hollow Suites.

730
00:32:35.400 --> 00:32:36.240
Niners.

731
00:32:36.299 --> 00:32:37.019
Woo!

732
00:32:37.200 --> 00:32:38.940
I love that though.

733
00:32:39.000 --> 00:32:42.059
I think the final scene's a bit cringe.

734
00:32:42.119 --> 00:32:45.000
This one nails the end of it really well, I think.

735
00:32:45.059 --> 00:32:49.680
Now, we've got this man in the count room here, but do you know

736
00:32:49.680 --> 00:32:51.539
who's in the count room later on in the episode?

737
00:32:51.660 --> 00:32:57.299
Yes, and I had forgotten, and I think that the 1st time you told

738
00:32:57.299 --> 00:32:58.140
me who it was.

739
00:32:58.200 --> 00:33:00.299
It's the only thought.

740
00:33:00.299 --> 00:33:01.500
Surely not.

741
00:33:01.559 --> 00:33:06.660
And then this time I thought, how the hell did I not notice that?

742
00:33:06.720 --> 00:33:07.319
But you know what?

743
00:33:07.380 --> 00:33:10.440
He didn't know at this point if Gowran was going to be in the last

744
00:33:10.440 --> 00:33:11.279
10 episodes.

745
00:33:11.339 --> 00:33:16.440
So he said to Ira Bear, can I please go under the pseudonym, sire

746
00:33:16.440 --> 00:33:17.400
Nara.

747
00:33:19.559 --> 00:33:24.000
Oh, all these scenes were Cassidy and this fabulously handsome

748
00:33:24.000 --> 00:33:24.539
guard.

749
00:33:24.599 --> 00:33:26.579
I love them so much.

750
00:33:26.640 --> 00:33:28.259
Nathan, did you go there?

751
00:33:28.319 --> 00:33:31.019
high school in Northfield, Carolina?

752
00:33:31.619 --> 00:33:33.599
She's so great.

753
00:33:33.660 --> 00:33:37.859
And she's doing a period accent as if she's like a, you know, like

754
00:33:37.859 --> 00:33:41.339
a black woman in a, in a film from the 60s where she's kind of

755
00:33:41.339 --> 00:33:43.859
really, she's absolutely playing the accent.

756
00:33:43.920 --> 00:33:46.140
I mean, look, it's just alive.

757
00:33:46.200 --> 00:33:47.759
She looks gorgeous.

758
00:33:47.759 --> 00:33:48.299
She's beautiful.

759
00:33:48.359 --> 00:33:52.380
She's also the best kind of the episode for me, which later on

760
00:33:52.380 --> 00:33:52.920
when she goes.

761
00:33:52.980 --> 00:33:56.579
I needed that money to buy a gift for my mama.

762
00:33:57.000 --> 00:33:59.339
It's so funny.

763
00:33:59.400 --> 00:34:00.119
So funny.

764
00:34:00.180 --> 00:34:01.259
Oh, here we are.

765
00:34:01.319 --> 00:34:06.539
Here's the Philadelphia cheese steak guy and cheese.

766
00:34:06.599 --> 00:34:07.380
You are fired.

767
00:34:07.440 --> 00:34:10.320
Yeah, we know we know he's a monster because you can shove a whole

768
00:34:10.320 --> 00:34:10.980
state gun.

769
00:34:11.039 --> 00:34:12.119
Oh, look at Ezra.

770
00:34:12.300 --> 00:34:13.739
Yeah.

771
00:34:13.800 --> 00:34:17.519
You know, you know when they sort of take off their tops and all

772
00:34:17.519 --> 00:34:19.139
those spots go right down the neck.

773
00:34:19.199 --> 00:34:21.840
Yeah, very sexy, isn't it?

774
00:34:21.900 --> 00:34:25.199
I'm not quite sure why That happens.

775
00:34:25.320 --> 00:34:27.000
We get naked men.

776
00:34:27.059 --> 00:34:29.099
Don't we get naked trill guys in the holiday?

777
00:34:29.219 --> 00:34:32.820
We go to the Herbition spa in Way of the Warrior, and there's 2

778
00:34:32.820 --> 00:34:36.480
very muscly men that Kira goes off with at the end of the scene.

779
00:34:36.539 --> 00:34:40.679
Yeah, imagine having the job of painting the spots on. rubbing

780
00:34:40.679 --> 00:34:41.340
them off.

781
00:34:41.400 --> 00:34:42.960
I volunteer, but they wouldn't have me.

782
00:34:43.019 --> 00:34:43.860
They wouldn't have me.

783
00:34:43.920 --> 00:34:45.239
In this state.

784
00:34:45.300 --> 00:34:46.619
Okay.

785
00:34:46.679 --> 00:34:51.239
So they're getting Esrie in now, so she's got, what's she going to

786
00:34:51.239 --> 00:34:51.420
do?

787
00:34:51.480 --> 00:34:52.860
She's going to poison the drinks.

788
00:34:53.340 --> 00:34:59.340
Yeah, so it's complicated, but it's all very carefully, carefully

789
00:34:59.340 --> 00:35:00.539
explained to us.

790
00:35:00.599 --> 00:35:04.980
And the, you know, the convention is that you get a voiceover

791
00:35:04.980 --> 00:35:06.719
explaining the role.

792
00:35:06.719 --> 00:35:12.780
As we watch people doing the thing that they need to be doing so

793
00:35:12.780 --> 00:35:16.440
that when it inevitably goes wrong, we know what's supposed to be

794
00:35:16.440 --> 00:35:16.860
happening.

795
00:35:16.920 --> 00:35:18.599
Like we can tell that it's gone wrong.

796
00:35:18.719 --> 00:35:21.840
And then the smarts is how they improvise around those problems.

797
00:35:21.960 --> 00:35:25.440
But it does mean as well that they have to, because this isn't

798
00:35:25.440 --> 00:35:26.280
just a voiceover.

799
00:35:26.340 --> 00:35:27.360
We get to see it as well.

800
00:35:27.420 --> 00:35:28.320
Obviously it's television.

801
00:35:28.380 --> 00:35:30.780
So they're having to film this bloody heist twice.

802
00:35:30.840 --> 00:35:32.159
Yeah, yeah.

803
00:35:32.219 --> 00:35:33.059
But that's standard.

804
00:35:33.119 --> 00:35:34.260
That's what you do in a highest.

805
00:35:34.320 --> 00:35:37.980
Do you see it go right while they do their voiceover explaining

806
00:35:37.980 --> 00:35:38.699
the plot?

807
00:35:38.760 --> 00:35:41.760
And then you see it go wrong when it actually happens?

808
00:35:42.719 --> 00:35:44.699
There is another reason.

809
00:35:44.760 --> 00:35:45.840
Sorry, go on, go on.

810
00:35:45.900 --> 00:35:46.800
You know what?

811
00:35:46.800 --> 00:35:49.679
I just think that's a bit unusual for Deep So for Star Trek in

812
00:35:49.679 --> 00:35:53.099
this era because normally what you see on TV is what's happening.

813
00:35:53.159 --> 00:35:58.380
You know, it's not normally things that people are imagining or

814
00:35:58.380 --> 00:35:59.880
that kind of thing.

815
00:35:59.940 --> 00:36:04.800
It's normally the cameras telling the truth in Star Trek, but not

816
00:36:04.800 --> 00:36:05.099
here.

817
00:36:05.519 --> 00:36:09.300
I was going to say, there is another motive behind doing these

818
00:36:09.300 --> 00:36:13.019
holiday episodes, and that is that they have these agonisingly

819
00:36:13.019 --> 00:36:14.940
long hours that they do this show for.

820
00:36:15.000 --> 00:36:17.820
And this is a chance them to kick back and have a bit of fun, you

821
00:36:17.820 --> 00:36:18.119
know?

822
00:36:18.179 --> 00:36:20.699
And I think that's a good excuse as well.

823
00:36:20.760 --> 00:36:23.699
Yeah, give the actors something fun to do.

824
00:36:23.760 --> 00:36:26.880
And we talked about how, you know, possession acting sometimes

825
00:36:26.880 --> 00:36:27.539
does that.

826
00:36:27.599 --> 00:36:31.739
But this is, you know, a completely different premise.

827
00:36:31.800 --> 00:36:33.840
Well, like, take me out to the holosuite.

828
00:36:33.900 --> 00:36:36.900
It was like a sports team film, you know.

829
00:36:36.960 --> 00:36:38.219
Here we go.

830
00:36:38.280 --> 00:36:39.000
This is the scene.

831
00:36:39.059 --> 00:36:42.239
Yeah, oh, this is, yeah, yeah.

832
00:36:42.300 --> 00:36:45.780
And it feels like a probably adult conversation, doesn't it?

833
00:36:45.840 --> 00:36:46.980
It doesn't get hysterical.

834
00:36:47.760 --> 00:36:50.579
It's not a, come on, B'lana.

835
00:36:50.639 --> 00:36:51.239
Talk to me.

836
00:36:52.860 --> 00:36:58.199
Yeah, I mean, it's still very TVish. still a bit expositional, um

837
00:36:58.199 --> 00:37:03.659
but like they both have very clear points of view, and they're

838
00:37:03.659 --> 00:37:07.260
both correct in all sorts of ways.

839
00:37:07.320 --> 00:37:11.159
You know, like they're, they both have true things to say.

840
00:37:11.579 --> 00:37:15.780
I love other conventions. television.

841
00:37:15.840 --> 00:37:16.800
Sorry.

842
00:37:16.860 --> 00:37:19.500
It's just that we only need this scene between them.

843
00:37:19.500 --> 00:37:24.300
We know Cisco is gonna be on board in the next scene, you know?

844
00:37:24.360 --> 00:37:28.800
If he wasn't, then this episode wouldn't deliver, I don't think.

845
00:37:29.039 --> 00:37:35.460
Yeah, I think maybe the one thing that a lie that it allides, which

846
00:37:35.460 --> 00:37:42.539
is a little bit of a shame, is why does Cisco agree to help out?

847
00:37:42.960 --> 00:37:50.519
And that look on Avery's face there is, he's acting like her.

848
00:37:51.539 --> 00:37:58.019
Her final point has hit home that the only reason now someone

849
00:37:58.019 --> 00:38:01.679
wouldn't be allowed in Vic's isn't because they're black, it's

850
00:38:01.679 --> 00:38:03.659
because they...

851
00:38:03.659 --> 00:38:05.519
And choosing not to be there.

852
00:38:05.579 --> 00:38:09.780
They're choosing to be excluded, to continue to be excluded the

853
00:38:09.780 --> 00:38:13.139
way that they would have been excluded in 1962.

854
00:38:13.320 --> 00:38:16.260
And yeah, I don't know.

855
00:38:16.320 --> 00:38:19.440
I think it would have been nice if his reason for going was that

856
00:38:19.440 --> 00:38:22.380
he loved everyone here and wanted to hang out with them.

857
00:38:22.500 --> 00:38:26.699
But I do like that objection, and I do understand the objection as

858
00:38:26.699 --> 00:38:26.880
well.

859
00:38:26.940 --> 00:38:31.260
Yeah, but I think I'm, I, I am on Casting's point of view.

860
00:38:31.320 --> 00:38:34.199
The way they craft the dialogue in that scene, no, man, it's so

861
00:38:34.199 --> 00:38:35.639
bloody obviously he's got to walk in that door.

862
00:38:35.699 --> 00:38:36.840
What are we going to do?

863
00:38:36.900 --> 00:38:38.280
We need one more person.

864
00:38:38.340 --> 00:38:39.719
Oh, who's going to help us?

865
00:38:39.780 --> 00:38:42.059
And then they all sort of wait a second, you know?

866
00:38:42.719 --> 00:38:47.940
I think too, that, that, you know, the acceptability, the question

867
00:38:47.940 --> 00:38:51.420
about whether it's acceptable to participate in fix as a black

868
00:38:51.420 --> 00:38:54.780
person is one that only a black person can answer.

869
00:38:54.840 --> 00:39:00.780
And so having the 2 points of view, having both Cassidy and, and

870
00:39:00.780 --> 00:39:06.539
um, And Ben talk, you know, like just talk about that and present

871
00:39:06.539 --> 00:39:08.039
the different points of view is exactly right.

872
00:39:08.099 --> 00:39:12.360
So this is the us explaining.

873
00:39:12.420 --> 00:39:15.900
So is the exposition of what they're supposed to be doing if it

874
00:39:15.900 --> 00:39:17.159
all goes absolutely right.

875
00:39:17.280 --> 00:39:19.739
And I'm sorry, watch the camera work.

876
00:39:19.800 --> 00:39:21.719
It is all over the place.

877
00:39:21.780 --> 00:39:26.639
It's over those tables, up in the ceiling, close ups, zooming

878
00:39:26.639 --> 00:39:27.000
around.

879
00:39:27.059 --> 00:39:31.199
It's it's not quite your discovery camera, but for the time, it is

880
00:39:31.199 --> 00:39:33.420
a lot more imaginative than what we normally get.

881
00:39:33.480 --> 00:39:38.280
Is it supposed to emphasise the complexity of the plan?

882
00:39:38.340 --> 00:39:42.659
The fact that the camera has to follow people around as they move

883
00:39:42.659 --> 00:39:47.519
through space because the whole plan is so carefully.

884
00:39:47.519 --> 00:39:49.980
Like it's kind of supposed to be a bit fluid, you know?

885
00:39:50.039 --> 00:39:51.179
Yeah, yeah.

886
00:39:51.239 --> 00:39:51.659
Yeah.

887
00:39:51.719 --> 00:39:54.300
Yeah, but it is not how, sadly.

888
00:39:54.360 --> 00:39:56.940
Not that Team State is normally direct.

889
00:39:57.360 --> 00:39:58.800
No.

890
00:39:58.860 --> 00:40:01.260
And that is a bit of a problem, isn't it?

891
00:40:01.320 --> 00:40:05.340
When you can highlight really creative direction in a comedy

892
00:40:05.340 --> 00:40:09.000
episode that isn't really there in the, you know, what are the

893
00:40:09.000 --> 00:40:09.480
biggies.

894
00:40:09.539 --> 00:40:10.019
Yeah.

895
00:40:10.079 --> 00:40:10.739
Yeah.

896
00:40:10.800 --> 00:40:13.380
We watched in the Power Moonlight, which was a great episode, but

897
00:40:13.380 --> 00:40:15.719
they did The Direction was quite static.

898
00:40:15.960 --> 00:40:20.099
Yeah, and I thought made some odd choices as well.

899
00:40:20.159 --> 00:40:22.260
I thought there were some problems.

900
00:40:22.320 --> 00:40:23.760
That was her 90s trek moment then.

901
00:40:23.760 --> 00:40:25.559
She leaned over and he looked right up her skirt.

902
00:40:25.619 --> 00:40:26.519
Right down, yeah.

903
00:40:26.880 --> 00:40:30.179
Well, it's also very 1962 moment, I think.

904
00:40:33.179 --> 00:40:35.699
Oh, Cassidy is the victim.

905
00:40:35.760 --> 00:40:37.079
Oh, it's just so noveless.

906
00:40:37.139 --> 00:40:38.639
This thing here.

907
00:40:38.760 --> 00:40:41.280
Yeah, she's trying to cry.

908
00:40:42.420 --> 00:40:48.119
But the great thing is that she doesn't kind of blow it.

909
00:40:48.300 --> 00:40:51.900
She doesn't kind of, because when she actually does that thing.

910
00:40:51.960 --> 00:40:56.159
When we see her do it. it's even better And in fact, there's

911
00:40:56.159 --> 00:40:59.340
something super presentational because this is selling us with

912
00:40:59.340 --> 00:41:00.539
what's going to happen.

913
00:41:00.599 --> 00:41:02.340
We aren't hearing any of the dialogue.

914
00:41:02.400 --> 00:41:05.519
And so her doing that comedy burst into tears.

915
00:41:05.579 --> 00:41:06.960
And it would be so perfect.

916
00:41:07.019 --> 00:41:08.639
In a regular episode of Star Trek.

917
00:41:08.699 --> 00:41:10.800
It would be inconceivably bad to have a scene like that.

918
00:41:10.920 --> 00:41:14.400
But in a comedy scene like this, it is amazingly good.

919
00:41:14.460 --> 00:41:17.940
I just love the way in the real world where she's like supposedly

920
00:41:17.940 --> 00:41:20.340
bawling her eyes out the 2nd she realises they're out.

921
00:41:20.400 --> 00:41:22.380
She sort of wipes her eyes and goes, oh, see you.

922
00:41:22.440 --> 00:41:23.340
She's off.

923
00:41:25.019 --> 00:41:27.780
He looks up and she's gone, I think.

924
00:41:27.840 --> 00:41:28.920
I know.

925
00:41:28.980 --> 00:41:32.280
So is the idea here that Odo is actually the briefcase.

926
00:41:32.340 --> 00:41:33.239
Yeah.

927
00:41:33.300 --> 00:41:34.500
Oh okay.

928
00:41:34.619 --> 00:41:36.900
So they all get a job, don't they?

929
00:41:37.019 --> 00:41:37.440
So hang on.

930
00:41:37.500 --> 00:41:42.599
Nog is the fake security guard who's going to open The save.

931
00:41:42.659 --> 00:41:44.460
Ojo is the one who's going to carry the money away.

932
00:41:44.579 --> 00:41:47.880
Cisco's a high roller that's distracting a lot.

933
00:41:47.940 --> 00:41:48.960
So he's distracting everyone.

934
00:41:49.019 --> 00:41:53.340
Kira's the sexy, sultry bird there.

935
00:41:53.400 --> 00:41:54.539
Frankie eyes.

936
00:41:54.599 --> 00:41:55.800
Mm-hmm.

937
00:41:56.099 --> 00:41:58.079
What's Bashir doing?

938
00:41:58.139 --> 00:41:59.340
Oh, he's got the...

939
00:41:59.400 --> 00:42:03.059
It's the one who puts the ipecac in the in the martini. and then

940
00:42:03.059 --> 00:42:08.039
you've got Ezri delivering it. getting rid of this 2nd guy in the

941
00:42:08.039 --> 00:42:08.519
count room.

942
00:42:08.699 --> 00:42:11.280
And so it's all...

943
00:42:11.340 --> 00:42:11.820
Sorry.

944
00:42:11.880 --> 00:42:13.019
This montage.

945
00:42:13.079 --> 00:42:15.420
I freaking love this montage.

946
00:42:15.480 --> 00:42:19.559
This is everything I adore about DS9 and this cast of characters.

947
00:42:19.619 --> 00:42:20.460
Look at that.

948
00:42:20.519 --> 00:42:23.639
Rashir and O'Brien together concocting some scheme.

949
00:42:24.179 --> 00:42:26.699
No practising his move, really.

950
00:42:26.699 --> 00:42:27.780
Practising on the safe.

951
00:42:27.840 --> 00:42:30.179
And then it's just a door.

952
00:42:30.239 --> 00:42:32.219
Look, it's a door in the bar.

953
00:42:32.280 --> 00:42:34.320
It's just a door frame that's in the barn.

954
00:42:34.380 --> 00:42:35.340
It's wonderful.

955
00:42:35.400 --> 00:42:36.599
Oh, it's in the wardrobe.

956
00:42:36.659 --> 00:42:39.119
And then he opens the door and then entries there inside.

957
00:42:39.179 --> 00:42:40.440
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

958
00:42:40.500 --> 00:42:41.760
As if she was in the in the safe.

959
00:42:41.880 --> 00:42:48.719
But this next bit now, I a door where Odo helps Kira put her dress

960
00:42:48.719 --> 00:42:49.139
on.

961
00:42:49.199 --> 00:42:50.760
Oh, look at her hair.

962
00:42:50.820 --> 00:42:53.099
Look how sexy she is and that smile.

963
00:42:53.219 --> 00:42:55.079
He kisses her on the shoulder.

964
00:42:55.800 --> 00:43:00.360
And then Cassidy comes up to Cisco and sorts out his... is weirdly

965
00:43:00.360 --> 00:43:03.960
practising throwing dice as if you can be good or bad at that

966
00:43:04.019 --> 00:43:05.340
don't quite know what's happening.

967
00:43:05.400 --> 00:43:06.900
Oh, okay.

968
00:43:06.960 --> 00:43:08.940
You see, a picture of me, of cool. here we go.

969
00:43:09.000 --> 00:43:10.019
He's Avery Brooks.

970
00:43:10.079 --> 00:43:12.300
There they go, walking down the promenade.

971
00:43:12.300 --> 00:43:14.039
And this bit of music.

972
00:43:14.159 --> 00:43:16.139
Just terrific.

973
00:43:16.199 --> 00:43:17.519
God, I couldn't love them more.

974
00:43:17.579 --> 00:43:20.219
Look at the look on Cassidy's face.

975
00:43:21.480 --> 00:43:24.360
Quark, kind of like they're spending money in that other bar.

976
00:43:25.019 --> 00:43:26.639
Do you know what?

977
00:43:26.699 --> 00:43:27.840
They walk in slow motion then.

978
00:43:27.900 --> 00:43:30.360
The look on Cassidy's face was pure fucking sass.

979
00:43:30.420 --> 00:43:31.920
No, you mess with me, all right?

980
00:43:32.400 --> 00:43:34.139
She's so good.

981
00:43:34.199 --> 00:43:35.699
Oh, there's more.

982
00:43:35.760 --> 00:43:36.539
Yep.

983
00:43:36.599 --> 00:43:37.320
Yep.

984
00:43:37.380 --> 00:43:39.420
Yeah, he just nods.

985
00:43:39.480 --> 00:43:39.780
Yep.

986
00:43:39.840 --> 00:43:41.099
Oh here we go.

987
00:43:41.159 --> 00:43:43.380
Okay, so the heist is on.

988
00:43:43.440 --> 00:43:44.880
Yeah.

989
00:43:44.940 --> 00:43:50.940
And so it initially goes wrong in just one small way, and they

990
00:43:50.940 --> 00:43:56.760
recover from it, and you kind of, that's, like, I just think

991
00:43:56.760 --> 00:44:00.179
that's terribly good because it goes spectacularly wrong in a

992
00:44:00.179 --> 00:44:03.539
couple of ways too, or 3 things happen that they don't expect.

993
00:44:03.599 --> 00:44:05.219
But the 1st one is gray.

994
00:44:05.340 --> 00:44:08.940
We've already been privy to the, obviously, the jack in the box

995
00:44:08.940 --> 00:44:11.880
and we know that Felix will throw in a few curveballs.

996
00:44:11.940 --> 00:44:16.860
So then later on when he throws in Zemo, whoa, that's just him

997
00:44:16.860 --> 00:44:18.659
being a bit a little bit naughty, isn't it, at that point?

998
00:44:18.719 --> 00:44:21.780
But it's also doing what a heist has to do.

999
00:44:21.840 --> 00:44:26.519
Like, there's no fun in us hearing the plan explain, and then they

1000
00:44:26.519 --> 00:44:28.980
go and do the plan and it just works.

1001
00:44:29.039 --> 00:44:29.699
That's boring.

1002
00:44:29.760 --> 00:44:34.139
What the point is, the reason we've seen it go right is so that we

1003
00:44:34.139 --> 00:44:36.659
can more easily tell when it's going wrong later.

1004
00:44:36.719 --> 00:44:39.420
There are so many camera salves here.

1005
00:44:39.480 --> 00:44:43.500
I just watching the camera go from character to character, fading

1006
00:44:43.500 --> 00:44:45.840
in and out, moving around.

1007
00:44:45.900 --> 00:44:48.960
It's just not how Star Trek is shot in the 90s.

1008
00:44:49.079 --> 00:44:50.099
No.

1009
00:44:50.159 --> 00:44:51.420
It's lovely.

1010
00:44:51.480 --> 00:44:55.320
There's a wonderful shot where the camera zooms right over the

1011
00:44:55.320 --> 00:44:59.340
crabs table in a bit, which is lovely.

1012
00:44:59.400 --> 00:45:04.500
Do you know, Paramount was so happy with how handsome this episode

1013
00:45:04.500 --> 00:45:11.340
looks that it was originally supposed to, I believe, last, but

1014
00:45:11.340 --> 00:45:13.320
they held it back because they wanted it to be in the February

1015
00:45:13.320 --> 00:45:17.219
sweet states because they thought this was the zinger in the

1016
00:45:17.219 --> 00:45:17.760
middle of the season.

1017
00:45:17.820 --> 00:45:19.679
They were like, this is the one we really want to showcase.

1018
00:45:21.360 --> 00:45:25.679
Hey, Nathan, we could we could play foot season for the table.

1019
00:45:25.739 --> 00:45:27.059
Yeah, yeah.

1020
00:45:27.119 --> 00:45:29.280
Kira's just so gorgeous.

1021
00:45:29.340 --> 00:45:33.119
There's something about that, that guard there, that buttoned up

1022
00:45:33.119 --> 00:45:34.559
guard that Cassidy flirts with.

1023
00:45:34.619 --> 00:45:36.000
He's very handsome, isn't he?

1024
00:45:36.059 --> 00:45:36.539
It's hot.

1025
00:45:36.599 --> 00:45:36.780
Yeah.

1026
00:45:36.780 --> 00:45:37.199
Yeah.

1027
00:45:37.260 --> 00:45:42.599
So, but this is so one of the count guys is going to call his mom

1028
00:45:42.599 --> 00:45:44.579
which means they've got 8 minutes, right?

1029
00:45:44.639 --> 00:45:46.260
because that's how long it takes.

1030
00:45:46.320 --> 00:45:51.599
Then the 1st thing happens here where the guy barrels into Ezri

1031
00:45:51.599 --> 00:45:52.380
spilling a drink.

1032
00:45:52.440 --> 00:45:55.800
And she looks really, she's absolutely selling.

1033
00:45:55.860 --> 00:45:57.420
What the fuck do we do now?

1034
00:45:57.480 --> 00:45:58.980
Which is really...

1035
00:45:59.039 --> 00:46:00.659
Like, you can't just get 2 more drinks?

1036
00:46:00.719 --> 00:46:01.380
You know?

1037
00:46:01.380 --> 00:46:02.159
No.

1038
00:46:02.219 --> 00:46:05.099
Well, but it's so the timing is super tight.

1039
00:46:05.159 --> 00:46:08.039
That was what, you know, like it's absolutely choreographed.

1040
00:46:08.099 --> 00:46:09.960
Each step depends on the previous one.

1041
00:46:11.579 --> 00:46:14.340
She improvises brilliantly, doesn't she?

1042
00:46:14.340 --> 00:46:15.599
She has to improvise too.

1043
00:46:15.659 --> 00:46:16.139
Yeah.

1044
00:46:16.199 --> 00:46:18.300
So they all bring something.

1045
00:46:18.300 --> 00:46:19.320
We're okay for now.

1046
00:46:19.380 --> 00:46:20.940
We're okay for now.

1047
00:46:21.000 --> 00:46:22.980
Julian solved that one.

1048
00:46:23.039 --> 00:46:27.119
Ezri goes in, and then suddenly, instead of the guy who always has

1049
00:46:27.119 --> 00:46:28.559
a martini every night.

1050
00:46:28.619 --> 00:46:31.139
She's concentrating on the martini.

1051
00:46:31.199 --> 00:46:33.000
She looks up and it's Gowron.

1052
00:46:33.059 --> 00:46:35.940
You're not Howard, and Goward is so...

1053
00:46:35.940 --> 00:46:36.659
His accent as well.

1054
00:46:36.719 --> 00:46:39.659
He goes, he's out with the flu.

1055
00:46:39.719 --> 00:46:43.139
You know, he's full on gangster dog.

1056
00:46:43.199 --> 00:46:46.559
He's doing absolute comedy gangster accent.

1057
00:46:46.619 --> 00:46:48.239
It's so It's really funny.

1058
00:46:48.300 --> 00:46:50.159
It's really good.

1059
00:46:50.159 --> 00:46:51.960
Like this.

1060
00:46:52.019 --> 00:46:57.659
The way so the way that she gets him to drink it, is she's on, I

1061
00:46:57.659 --> 00:46:59.159
really beeped you, mind if I drink it?

1062
00:46:59.219 --> 00:47:02.760
And then he says, oh, that's the saddest story overhoid.

1063
00:47:04.559 --> 00:47:06.420
He drinks it.

1064
00:47:06.480 --> 00:47:08.219
All right, so that problem solved.

1065
00:47:08.280 --> 00:47:10.619
So, Julie, that lovely shot over the table.

1066
00:47:11.400 --> 00:47:13.380
I've never got to stop going on about the music and the camera

1067
00:47:13.380 --> 00:47:15.960
work because it's a one time I can bloody do it. much fun.

1068
00:47:16.019 --> 00:47:16.860
Yeah that's right.

1069
00:47:17.639 --> 00:47:21.960
Okay, so now that's everything's going to plan now.

1070
00:47:22.019 --> 00:47:23.219
Okay.

1071
00:47:23.280 --> 00:47:24.780
So we've got rid of Howard.

1072
00:47:24.840 --> 00:47:25.920
We've got not Howard.

1073
00:47:25.980 --> 00:47:28.019
We've got rid of Gowron and the other guy.

1074
00:47:29.099 --> 00:47:29.820
Cassidy's turn.

1075
00:47:29.880 --> 00:47:31.980
That man, that man over there.

1076
00:47:32.039 --> 00:47:33.840
It's not a stack of my chips.

1077
00:47:34.079 --> 00:47:35.639
You know what?

1078
00:47:35.699 --> 00:47:38.039
The thing is, though, she's not obnoxious, isn't she?

1079
00:47:38.099 --> 00:47:38.699
This character.

1080
00:47:38.760 --> 00:47:40.079
That's what I love about it.

1081
00:47:40.260 --> 00:47:42.239
She's really good.

1082
00:47:42.300 --> 00:47:44.940
Because you remember when do you remember when she was at the

1083
00:47:44.940 --> 00:47:46.800
table and she's going 24?

1084
00:47:46.860 --> 00:47:48.059
You're busted?

1085
00:47:48.119 --> 00:47:48.599
you know?

1086
00:47:49.019 --> 00:47:50.699
Oh right.

1087
00:47:50.760 --> 00:47:52.739
So now the man's Garon's.

1088
00:47:52.800 --> 00:47:54.360
Yep, now so everything's going to plan.

1089
00:47:54.420 --> 00:47:55.440
He's getting sick.

1090
00:47:56.099 --> 00:47:58.199
Nogs going in to crack the safe.

1091
00:47:58.260 --> 00:48:01.079
And Odo's already there as the trade that Ezri brought in.

1092
00:48:01.559 --> 00:48:03.420
Jesus Christ.

1093
00:48:03.539 --> 00:48:05.460
Doesn't he slide off the table, isn't it?

1094
00:48:05.519 --> 00:48:05.880
that right?

1095
00:48:05.940 --> 00:48:07.920
Yeah, I hadn't realised, but maybe you're right.

1096
00:48:07.980 --> 00:48:09.179
Maybe he used to try.

1097
00:48:09.239 --> 00:48:11.699
Yeah, now we don't see it this time.

1098
00:48:11.760 --> 00:48:16.139
And so this is the 2nd thing that goes wrong is that Nog hasn't

1099
00:48:16.139 --> 00:48:17.400
practised on the right safe.

1100
00:48:17.460 --> 00:48:19.920
It's an auto relock. tumbler.

1101
00:48:19.980 --> 00:48:24.179
So that presumably means, like, we don't need to know what that

1102
00:48:24.179 --> 00:48:24.480
is.

1103
00:48:24.539 --> 00:48:25.079
Who cares?

1104
00:48:25.139 --> 00:48:28.260
But what I'm thinking is, it must mean that if he gets halfway

1105
00:48:28.260 --> 00:48:30.360
through and then gets it wrong, he has to go back to the beginning

1106
00:48:30.360 --> 00:48:31.139
or something.

1107
00:48:31.440 --> 00:48:35.039
Did you know, did you know with this episode, it was supposed to

1108
00:48:35.039 --> 00:48:38.460
be a bit of a metaphor as well of the arc in season 6 when the

1109
00:48:38.460 --> 00:48:41.940
Dominion took over the station, the mob taken over the bar, and

1110
00:48:41.940 --> 00:48:45.059
then them all happened to work together to try and get them gone?

1111
00:48:45.119 --> 00:48:45.840
And get rid of it.

1112
00:48:45.900 --> 00:48:46.260
Yeah.

1113
00:48:46.320 --> 00:48:49.619
So if you'd done this in series 6, they would have played it like

1114
00:48:49.619 --> 00:48:50.760
that, I think.

1115
00:48:51.420 --> 00:48:52.320
Yeah, yeah.

1116
00:48:53.099 --> 00:48:56.579
Oh, Kira, honestly, you flirt like mad.

1117
00:48:56.639 --> 00:48:57.300
But you know what?

1118
00:48:57.360 --> 00:48:58.500
Nan a visitor says.

1119
00:48:58.559 --> 00:49:01.260
So she's quoted as saying, you might think this is out of

1120
00:49:01.260 --> 00:49:04.980
character for Kira, but actually during the occupation, She would

1121
00:49:04.980 --> 00:49:09.239
have had to have flirted her way with a lot of Cardassian men in

1122
00:49:09.239 --> 00:49:12.179
order to gain access to areas and do terrorist acts and things

1123
00:49:12.179 --> 00:49:12.539
like that.

1124
00:49:12.599 --> 00:49:15.840
So, you know, even in a bit of fluff, she's there giving it a

1125
00:49:15.840 --> 00:49:17.099
character rationally.

1126
00:49:17.159 --> 00:49:17.579
Yeah.

1127
00:49:17.639 --> 00:49:19.079
They're good actors.

1128
00:49:19.139 --> 00:49:19.920
That's why.

1129
00:49:19.980 --> 00:49:22.079
But I mean, she's beautiful.

1130
00:49:22.139 --> 00:49:25.500
That song is at his way where she's singing fever. fever.

1131
00:49:25.559 --> 00:49:26.400
Yeah.

1132
00:49:26.400 --> 00:49:29.940
I've said it before, but I think I was so hot.

1133
00:49:30.000 --> 00:49:31.559
Oh my goodness.

1134
00:49:31.619 --> 00:49:32.219
Yeah.

1135
00:49:32.219 --> 00:49:33.239
She's smoking.

1136
00:49:33.780 --> 00:49:37.619
I was trying to play the piano, but he can't keep his eyes off

1137
00:49:37.619 --> 00:49:37.920
her.

1138
00:49:38.039 --> 00:49:41.280
Well, no. not a stupid man.

1139
00:49:41.340 --> 00:49:42.599
Yeah.

1140
00:49:42.599 --> 00:49:45.659
And the thing is, like, we, honestly, there's so much going on and

1141
00:49:45.659 --> 00:49:47.940
we keep cutting back to Nog yanking up that safe.

1142
00:49:48.000 --> 00:49:48.539
Yeah.

1143
00:49:48.539 --> 00:49:52.320
Yeah, but like I find that properly tense.

1144
00:49:52.380 --> 00:49:55.679
I think because they've emphasised that they have 8 minutes and no

1145
00:49:55.679 --> 00:49:57.780
more and nothing's happening.

1146
00:49:57.840 --> 00:50:02.219
They're all sitting there waiting for the next thing to happen and

1147
00:50:02.219 --> 00:50:05.940
nothing, nothing is happening and here's...

1148
00:50:06.659 --> 00:50:09.360
There genuinely is wall-to-wall music throughout this entire

1149
00:50:09.360 --> 00:50:10.019
heist.

1150
00:50:10.079 --> 00:50:10.920
Like, it doesn't stop.

1151
00:50:11.039 --> 00:50:13.559
Oh yeah, he's great, isn't he?

1152
00:50:13.619 --> 00:50:14.760
is so good.

1153
00:50:14.820 --> 00:50:18.300
Now, he has been in Star Trek before.

1154
00:50:19.139 --> 00:50:25.980
He's in, yeah, he's in a series 3 episode of Star Trek, the Next

1155
00:50:25.980 --> 00:50:28.139
Generation, called the Vengeance Factor.

1156
00:50:28.260 --> 00:50:28.980
Oh, wow.

1157
00:50:28.980 --> 00:50:33.179
And he's got like alien face space makeup on.

1158
00:50:33.239 --> 00:50:37.500
But he's a very distinguished, very, very prolific character act.

1159
00:50:37.559 --> 00:50:41.340
He has some pedigree doing movies of this ilk as well, which is

1160
00:50:41.340 --> 00:50:43.139
why they pulled him in and they knew he could do it.

1161
00:50:43.199 --> 00:50:44.699
Oh, he's fabulous.

1162
00:50:44.760 --> 00:50:47.460
I love him when he goes, when were you in Miami?

1163
00:50:48.000 --> 00:50:50.940
It's really funny, you see?

1164
00:50:50.940 --> 00:50:53.039
Because he's so fucking old.

1165
00:50:53.039 --> 00:50:55.440
I like the bimbories river, huh?

1166
00:50:55.500 --> 00:50:56.820
You ain't no no.

1167
00:50:57.300 --> 00:51:00.840
That's so great. funny.

1168
00:51:00.900 --> 00:51:01.739
And you know what?

1169
00:51:01.800 --> 00:51:05.039
Even the music here reminds me of TOS is kind of going, dunno.

1170
00:51:05.039 --> 00:51:08.219
It's a very over the top.

1171
00:51:08.280 --> 00:51:09.360
But you know what?

1172
00:51:09.420 --> 00:51:10.440
We want it a bit over the top.

1173
00:51:10.500 --> 00:51:14.159
Well, they're doing a comedy sting to go into the ad break to make

1174
00:51:14.159 --> 00:51:16.920
fun of the fact of how they normally go into the ad break with

1175
00:51:16.920 --> 00:51:18.300
just a really shitty stick.

1176
00:51:18.420 --> 00:51:21.179
Oh, see, now their time's up.

1177
00:51:21.239 --> 00:51:24.840
Their time's up because the other guy, his phone call's finished

1178
00:51:24.840 --> 00:51:28.019
and now he's going back, Julian spots it.

1179
00:51:28.079 --> 00:51:29.880
How do we stop him?

1180
00:51:29.940 --> 00:51:32.519
He says that Frankie eyes is outside.

1181
00:51:32.579 --> 00:51:35.400
He wants to chat with you. and he's like, okay, yeah.

1182
00:51:35.400 --> 00:51:36.719
I've not done anything wrong.

1183
00:51:36.780 --> 00:51:38.940
And he goes, then you've got nothing to worry about.

1184
00:51:40.139 --> 00:51:43.980
It's the one time sitting out the deal pulls off an accent quite

1185
00:51:43.980 --> 00:51:44.159
well.

1186
00:51:44.219 --> 00:51:45.840
Oh, does he try doing an accent?

1187
00:51:45.900 --> 00:51:46.500
I forgot.

1188
00:51:46.619 --> 00:51:48.900
You've got nothing to worry about.

1189
00:51:48.960 --> 00:51:51.780
You know, he's like...

1190
00:51:51.780 --> 00:51:52.920
I love Sidix, normal.

1191
00:51:52.980 --> 00:51:54.000
Sid's normal accent.

1192
00:51:54.059 --> 00:51:58.440
I like Cisco's diversionary tactic of just throwing all the money

1193
00:51:58.440 --> 00:51:58.920
up in the air.

1194
00:51:59.039 --> 00:52:02.400
Yeah, that's an absolute low rent.

1195
00:52:02.460 --> 00:52:06.119
So that's the 2nd thing that turns up that goes wrong and it's

1196
00:52:06.119 --> 00:52:11.159
really bad because it means that they have to do this while Zemo's

1197
00:52:11.159 --> 00:52:11.460
here.

1198
00:52:11.519 --> 00:52:13.860
And Vic is absolutely. nailing it.

1199
00:52:13.920 --> 00:52:16.260
So Vic gets to be clever now.

1200
00:52:16.320 --> 00:52:19.679
Yeah, they all play their part by flirting with Zemo's

1201
00:52:19.679 --> 00:52:20.039
girlfriend.

1202
00:52:20.099 --> 00:52:23.460
He's clearly fucked Semo's girlfriend, apparently.

1203
00:52:24.000 --> 00:52:26.940
She does not seem to recall it, though, you know.

1204
00:52:28.440 --> 00:52:30.119
Frankie.

1205
00:52:30.239 --> 00:52:31.559
The money, Frankie.

1206
00:52:31.559 --> 00:52:33.239
Your grandpa?

1207
00:52:34.860 --> 00:52:36.900
You've done it now.

1208
00:52:36.960 --> 00:52:37.980
Bury him.

1209
00:52:38.340 --> 00:52:40.440
Oh, I love it.

1210
00:52:41.340 --> 00:52:44.400
It's such a funny role.

1211
00:52:44.460 --> 00:52:45.480
He's so great.

1212
00:52:45.539 --> 00:52:47.579
Now, Cisco's just throwing money.

1213
00:52:47.639 --> 00:52:49.980
He can't think of anything else to do. create a diversion, all

1214
00:52:49.980 --> 00:52:50.159
right?

1215
00:52:50.219 --> 00:52:51.000
I just throw a bunch of money.

1216
00:52:51.119 --> 00:52:53.760
And there's a ton of shrewd and obvious, but...

1217
00:52:53.880 --> 00:52:55.739
They must have been throwing fucking money up all afternoon

1218
00:52:55.739 --> 00:52:58.980
because there's a ton of shots there of people scrabbling about on

1219
00:52:58.980 --> 00:52:59.940
the floor picking up notes.

1220
00:53:00.000 --> 00:53:01.920
He looks super anxious too.

1221
00:53:01.980 --> 00:53:04.860
Like he's throwing money, but he's absolutely, there's not a smile

1222
00:53:04.860 --> 00:53:06.659
on his face. really anxious about it working.

1223
00:53:06.719 --> 00:53:09.179
This goes on for much longer than you expect.

1224
00:53:09.239 --> 00:53:13.320
Like, I think we cut back to Nog there expecting him.

1225
00:53:13.380 --> 00:53:15.420
You know, why are we saying?

1226
00:53:15.480 --> 00:53:16.739
Where's your suspense, though, isn't it?

1227
00:53:16.800 --> 00:53:19.079
It's like, 0 my god, they're not going to make it, you know.

1228
00:53:19.139 --> 00:53:20.159
Yeah.

1229
00:53:20.159 --> 00:53:22.500
Funny way to run a casino.

1230
00:53:23.519 --> 00:53:25.619
He's so great.

1231
00:53:26.820 --> 00:53:28.800
Every notice that it's gone horribly wrong.

1232
00:53:28.860 --> 00:53:30.360
Yeah, that's right.

1233
00:53:30.420 --> 00:53:31.320
What the hell are we doing now?

1234
00:53:31.380 --> 00:53:33.480
I think Nog's got a fucking nerve here, Gary.

1235
00:53:33.539 --> 00:53:34.559
Yeah, piece of cake.

1236
00:53:34.619 --> 00:53:35.940
You took yourself.

1237
00:53:35.940 --> 00:53:37.500
It was supposed to take you 30 seconds.

1238
00:53:37.559 --> 00:53:38.460
We took you 7 minutes.

1239
00:53:38.519 --> 00:53:39.840
Yeah, yeah.

1240
00:53:39.900 --> 00:53:41.099
More than 8 minutes, I think.

1241
00:53:41.159 --> 00:53:45.119
I think we only just, well, we had to distract the other count guy

1242
00:53:45.119 --> 00:53:45.719
from going back.

1243
00:53:45.780 --> 00:53:47.159
What's the funniest thing of all?

1244
00:53:47.280 --> 00:53:50.579
Oh, no, it's not funnier than Casta Yates and her crying, which is

1245
00:53:50.579 --> 00:53:51.239
coming up right now.

1246
00:53:51.300 --> 00:53:53.159
That's hilariously funny.

1247
00:53:53.219 --> 00:53:59.099
It's when they open the safe up, the huge TOS dramatic close-ups

1248
00:53:59.099 --> 00:54:02.820
on everyone's face when they realise they're in the sewer, you

1249
00:54:02.820 --> 00:54:03.000
know?

1250
00:54:03.059 --> 00:54:05.400
Yeah, they're going to be busted.

1251
00:54:05.460 --> 00:54:08.460
The safe has no back wall, but they could have just gone in and

1252
00:54:08.460 --> 00:54:10.800
got the money out of the back of the safe.

1253
00:54:10.860 --> 00:54:12.900
It's probably on the floor.

1254
00:54:12.960 --> 00:54:14.699
It's so great.

1255
00:54:14.760 --> 00:54:16.019
I just think that's really funny.

1256
00:54:16.079 --> 00:54:17.039
Oh, here she goes.

1257
00:54:17.099 --> 00:54:20.519
Oh, new to that money to buy gift for my mama.

1258
00:54:20.579 --> 00:54:22.079
I love it so much.

1259
00:54:22.139 --> 00:54:23.400
So funny.

1260
00:54:23.460 --> 00:54:25.019
All right.

1261
00:54:25.079 --> 00:54:28.440
And so now she's seen that everything's going okay. and she just

1262
00:54:28.440 --> 00:54:28.980
wanders off.

1263
00:54:29.039 --> 00:54:30.599
Like, doesn't say anything.

1264
00:54:30.960 --> 00:54:34.440
We get a comedy look to camera by the guard.

1265
00:54:34.500 --> 00:54:38.159
By the handstream security and the dick dastardly cartoon.

1266
00:54:39.900 --> 00:54:42.119
Now Kira's like, go on.

1267
00:54:42.179 --> 00:54:43.139
Show him the count room.

1268
00:54:43.199 --> 00:54:45.659
Oh, yeah, because she knows that it's gone okay.

1269
00:54:45.719 --> 00:54:46.559
She's seen.

1270
00:54:46.619 --> 00:54:47.099
Yeah, yeah.

1271
00:54:47.159 --> 00:54:48.599
It is, it's back.

1272
00:54:48.659 --> 00:54:49.800
They've won, haven't they?

1273
00:54:49.860 --> 00:54:50.460
They've won now.

1274
00:54:50.579 --> 00:54:52.260
Oh, no, she looks good.

1275
00:54:52.260 --> 00:54:56.519
As they walk out of the bar in slow motion and they all turn round

1276
00:54:56.519 --> 00:54:58.860
at the bar looking smug as hell.

1277
00:54:58.920 --> 00:55:00.840
It's so cool.

1278
00:55:01.199 --> 00:55:03.539
Where's my money, Nathan?

1279
00:55:04.500 --> 00:55:06.659
He's so great.

1280
00:55:06.780 --> 00:55:10.260
And then we cut to the sexy ladies miming shooting someone with a

1281
00:55:10.260 --> 00:55:10.559
gun.

1282
00:55:10.619 --> 00:55:14.699
Which looks like what's going to happen to Frankie now?

1283
00:55:14.760 --> 00:55:17.099
is allowed the casino to be robbed.

1284
00:55:17.159 --> 00:55:19.739
Oh, I just love it when they all turn around here.

1285
00:55:19.800 --> 00:55:25.980
Oh, yeah, the walk of shame as Zemo is as Zemo escorts Frankie

1286
00:55:25.980 --> 00:55:26.820
Eyes out of the bar.

1287
00:55:27.480 --> 00:55:31.019
The way, honestly, no one looks cooler than Cisco.

1288
00:55:31.079 --> 00:55:31.980
Look at how he turns around.

1289
00:55:32.039 --> 00:55:33.659
Oh, yeah.

1290
00:55:35.039 --> 00:55:37.260
You're out of it, boy.

1291
00:55:37.320 --> 00:55:38.579
It's kind of like he knows.

1292
00:55:38.639 --> 00:55:40.199
It's like Frankie knows.

1293
00:55:40.260 --> 00:55:42.659
He's been defeated by all of these people.

1294
00:55:44.639 --> 00:55:47.940
Oh, and then back to Vic Fontaines again.

1295
00:55:48.059 --> 00:55:52.500
Yeah, which happens right behind you now on the zinc call here.

1296
00:55:52.559 --> 00:55:53.099
Yeah, yeah.

1297
00:55:53.159 --> 00:55:53.760
Yeah.

1298
00:55:53.820 --> 00:55:57.539
It does make Vic Fontaine seem rather tame, though, doesn't it?

1299
00:55:57.599 --> 00:56:00.239
Yeah, there's no editude anymore, is there?

1300
00:56:00.300 --> 00:56:00.780
No.

1301
00:56:00.960 --> 00:56:02.579
And it's a tiny room now.

1302
00:56:02.639 --> 00:56:04.739
Look, it seems to be a much tinier room.

1303
00:56:04.800 --> 00:56:06.900
And this...

1304
00:56:06.960 --> 00:56:07.800
Oh my god.

1305
00:56:07.860 --> 00:56:10.139
Has any episode ever ended better than this?

1306
00:56:10.199 --> 00:56:18.179
I am a massive fan of musicals and like music like this in Star

1307
00:56:18.179 --> 00:56:18.539
Trek.

1308
00:56:18.599 --> 00:56:20.760
And so we get 2 numbers here.

1309
00:56:20.820 --> 00:56:26.280
And I think that there's a musical in series 2 of Picard, where Dr

1310
00:56:26.280 --> 00:56:31.920
Girati sings this sexy song at a party and people were going, how

1311
00:56:31.920 --> 00:56:32.519
does that happen?

1312
00:56:32.579 --> 00:56:35.880
That makes no sense and she kind of, I was just kind of going, who

1313
00:56:35.880 --> 00:56:36.480
gives a shit?

1314
00:56:36.539 --> 00:56:37.739
It's so great.

1315
00:56:37.800 --> 00:56:43.320
You know, absolutely that one of the best things in Picard. 7 in

1316
00:56:43.320 --> 00:56:44.039
the killing game?

1317
00:56:44.099 --> 00:56:46.860
No, no, you are my son, someone.

1318
00:56:46.920 --> 00:56:50.280
And in Tinker Tenor, Dr. Spy.

1319
00:56:50.340 --> 00:56:52.139
He sings that opera.

1320
00:56:52.199 --> 00:56:56.639
It's like, um, Tuvok, you understand, you are a Vokan man.

1321
00:56:57.360 --> 00:57:01.619
You have just gone without 47 years about.

1322
00:57:01.679 --> 00:57:06.059
It's so funny Now, why can't they sing?

1323
00:57:06.119 --> 00:57:07.920
Like it's delightful.

1324
00:57:07.980 --> 00:57:09.659
Avery Brooks's voice.

1325
00:57:09.780 --> 00:57:13.500
Oh, yeah, and you've got you've got Jimmy Darren, who we've heard

1326
00:57:13.500 --> 00:57:16.380
singing in a bunch of episodes and then Avery starts singing and

1327
00:57:16.380 --> 00:57:17.039
he's great.

1328
00:57:17.099 --> 00:57:18.900
When he hits the rock, so good.

1329
00:57:18.960 --> 00:57:21.840
Where's till I draw you down.

1330
00:57:21.900 --> 00:57:23.760
Oh, he's so good.

1331
00:57:23.820 --> 00:57:26.400
He's just got that fantastic tenor voice.

1332
00:57:26.460 --> 00:57:28.019
It's so terrific.

1333
00:57:28.260 --> 00:57:30.840
The funniest bit is when he goes, what is that?

1334
00:57:30.900 --> 00:57:32.940
Oh, nothing I can hear.

1335
00:57:33.480 --> 00:57:38.760
There's a great quote on memory alpha where Avery Brooks says, you

1336
00:57:38.760 --> 00:57:40.199
know, and they were like, can you sing?

1337
00:57:40.260 --> 00:57:42.420
And he stared at them askance.

1338
00:57:42.480 --> 00:57:44.159
Like, can I sing?

1339
00:57:44.219 --> 00:57:47.039
And, you know, and he's like, you know, tell him, tell him to come

1340
00:57:47.039 --> 00:57:47.280
around.

1341
00:57:47.340 --> 00:57:48.360
We'll practice it on the piano.

1342
00:57:48.420 --> 00:57:49.739
And they're like, what key do you want to do it?

1343
00:57:49.800 --> 00:57:51.719
And he went, well, what key do you want to do it in?

1344
00:57:51.840 --> 00:57:52.860
I can sing in all of them.

1345
00:57:53.280 --> 00:57:59.519
He's, I think his musical talents actually outstripped his acting

1346
00:57:59.519 --> 00:58:00.000
talents.

1347
00:58:00.119 --> 00:58:02.940
So he'd done a lot of this before Star Trek.

1348
00:58:03.179 --> 00:58:05.280
It's so good.

1349
00:58:05.340 --> 00:58:08.880
And look, we just panning slowly across these people that we

1350
00:58:08.880 --> 00:58:09.300
love.

1351
00:58:09.300 --> 00:58:13.019
And none a visitor, I have to think that that's her reaction

1352
00:58:13.019 --> 00:58:14.820
rather than Kira's reaction.

1353
00:58:14.880 --> 00:58:16.500
It's so beautiful.

1354
00:58:16.559 --> 00:58:17.519
I almost tear up.

1355
00:58:17.579 --> 00:58:18.420
She loves it.

1356
00:58:18.719 --> 00:58:20.639
Look at caffidine.

1357
00:58:20.699 --> 00:58:22.500
You're an acid. boyfriend.

1358
00:58:22.559 --> 00:58:26.579
Well, excuse me, we know, you know, because in that interview, she

1359
00:58:26.579 --> 00:58:30.539
said, this sexy, amazing boyfriend, Captain Sisco.

1360
00:58:30.599 --> 00:58:34.139
And my real life husband was really jealous every time I slog him

1361
00:58:34.139 --> 00:58:35.219
because I meant it every time.

1362
00:58:37.920 --> 00:58:40.320
Oh, they're all laughing.

1363
00:58:40.380 --> 00:58:41.039
Come on.

1364
00:58:41.099 --> 00:58:41.699
I know.

1365
00:58:41.760 --> 00:58:45.300
And the previous, like, let's go out to the hollow suite.

1366
00:58:45.360 --> 00:58:49.320
No, take me out to the hollow suite, is that awful, you know, crap

1367
00:58:49.320 --> 00:58:52.139
joke at the end where they're all laughing at something that's not

1368
00:58:52.139 --> 00:58:54.360
at all funny and it's super miserable.

1369
00:58:54.420 --> 00:58:58.679
But this is so much fun. so much better.

1370
00:58:58.739 --> 00:59:01.440
Cisco, this loose and enjoying himself.

1371
00:59:01.500 --> 00:59:02.940
Like, it's very rare.

1372
00:59:03.059 --> 00:59:07.559
And I think that image of a white man and a black man singing and

1373
00:59:07.559 --> 00:59:09.900
having fun with their arms around each other.

1374
00:59:09.960 --> 00:59:13.380
I cannot imagine a more perfect way to end a Star Trek episode.

1375
00:59:13.619 --> 00:59:17.880
They're also both sort of wonderfully middle-aged and so it does

1376
00:59:17.880 --> 00:59:20.340
have that sort of late rat pack sort of vibe.

1377
00:59:20.400 --> 00:59:23.940
You know, there's a, yeah, it's just terrific.

1378
00:59:24.000 --> 00:59:25.019
So, so great.

1379
00:59:25.079 --> 00:59:28.559
I can't imagine anyone watching that and not coming away with a

1380
00:59:28.559 --> 00:59:29.340
smile on their face.

1381
00:59:29.519 --> 00:59:32.940
But I actually think that that episode is better.

1382
00:59:33.000 --> 00:59:36.780
It's certainly more entertaining than some of the really, like, I

1383
00:59:36.780 --> 00:59:39.840
love to be made to feel stuff by Star Trek, and there are some

1384
00:59:39.840 --> 00:59:43.199
deep so sign episodes that I think are very, you know, everyone

1385
00:59:43.199 --> 00:59:46.739
says the visitor, and that was in our top 10, because of course it

1386
00:59:46.739 --> 00:59:46.980
was.

1387
00:59:47.039 --> 00:59:47.699
It's really great.

1388
00:59:48.659 --> 00:59:51.719
Okay, I can name that.

1389
00:59:51.780 --> 00:59:54.000
That's right. past tense.

1390
00:59:54.000 --> 00:59:55.079
Yeah.

1391
00:59:55.139 --> 00:59:57.300
But something doesn't have to be heavy to be good.

1392
00:59:57.360 --> 01:00:00.780
You know, it's not good because it deals with serious things.

1393
01:00:00.840 --> 01:00:03.420
It's good because it's sort of entertaining and fun and well

1394
01:00:03.420 --> 01:00:03.960
made.

1395
01:00:03.960 --> 01:00:05.940
And that's what this is.

1396
01:00:06.000 --> 01:00:08.219
This made me feel a lot of things.

1397
01:00:08.280 --> 01:00:11.820
It made me feel extremely happy and jolly and I was having a bad

1398
01:00:11.820 --> 01:00:14.099
day when I watched it the 1st time and I was having a great day

1399
01:00:14.099 --> 01:00:14.760
when I finished.

1400
01:00:14.820 --> 01:00:16.860
Yeah, no, I think it's just terrific.

1401
01:00:17.099 --> 01:00:21.599
Do you think, like, comedy episodes in general then, that that is

1402
01:00:21.599 --> 01:00:22.260
just a good idea.

1403
01:00:22.260 --> 01:00:25.139
In Sonia, that's something that they should pursue more of, or

1404
01:00:25.139 --> 01:00:30.179
should it be the occasional, like, one off or a couple of times a

1405
01:00:30.179 --> 01:00:30.360
year?

1406
01:00:30.480 --> 01:00:34.920
I think that they shouldn't forget that it's a TV show and so it

1407
01:00:34.920 --> 01:00:36.599
and they don't, but we do.

1408
01:00:36.659 --> 01:00:39.599
You know, people watching Star Trek.

1409
01:00:39.659 --> 01:00:44.219
Memory Alpha people, watching Star Trek think that it's, you know

1410
01:00:44.219 --> 01:00:48.059
real events in the future happening to imaginary people.

1411
01:00:48.119 --> 01:00:52.079
And that's not what it is.

1412
01:00:52.139 --> 01:00:57.300
Um, and I think that they have done comedy episodes in New Trek

1413
01:00:57.360 --> 01:00:58.139
absolutely.

1414
01:00:58.199 --> 01:01:03.599
So, you know, late in series one of Strange New Worlds, there's an

1415
01:01:03.599 --> 01:01:08.219
episode called the Elysian Kingdom, which in which everyone is

1416
01:01:08.219 --> 01:01:13.380
sort of taken over by characters in a fantasy story, written by

1417
01:01:13.380 --> 01:01:14.940
Benny Russell.

1418
01:01:15.000 --> 01:01:22.739
And it has, it has fantastic scenes. is so funny in it.

1419
01:01:22.800 --> 01:01:27.239
Like, the whole thing is really quite funny and silly and, you

1420
01:01:27.239 --> 01:01:29.340
know, seemingly fluffy and inconsequential.

1421
01:01:29.340 --> 01:01:34.139
And then it absolutely goes for a gut punch at the end and he ends

1422
01:01:34.139 --> 01:01:35.099
up being incredibly moving.

1423
01:01:35.159 --> 01:01:36.719
Like it does a really good job.

1424
01:01:36.780 --> 01:01:38.699
But it does the comedy very well.

1425
01:01:39.300 --> 01:01:46.019
Yeah, so so I think Star Trek should do all of those things, it is

1426
01:01:46.019 --> 01:01:50.820
super flexible, you know, it can do whatever it wants, and it

1427
01:01:50.820 --> 01:01:54.360
should try to be entertaining in as many ways as possible, because

1428
01:01:54.360 --> 01:01:57.719
Star Trek is a little bit like Doctor Who in some senses where you

1429
01:01:57.719 --> 01:02:01.500
shouldn't know what you're going to get when you tune in every

1430
01:02:01.500 --> 01:02:01.800
week.

1431
01:02:02.039 --> 01:02:07.980
And I think I'm going to be bold now and you know how much I love

1432
01:02:07.980 --> 01:02:09.059
Deep Space 9.

1433
01:02:09.119 --> 01:02:15.300
But I think on the whole, in 90s trek, the comedy episodes of Deep

1434
01:02:15.300 --> 01:02:18.539
Space 9 far outstrip what the other shows are doing.

1435
01:02:18.599 --> 01:02:24.059
And I think it's primarily because of the quality of the actors

1436
01:02:24.059 --> 01:02:28.679
and how, like, you know, Kira and our membership, she's the bond

1437
01:02:28.679 --> 01:02:29.699
girl for and through.

1438
01:02:29.760 --> 01:02:31.139
She's amazingly good.

1439
01:02:31.199 --> 01:02:33.179
You know, they all commit to the comedy.

1440
01:02:33.239 --> 01:02:39.000
So episodes like the Nagus, like Little Green Men, the magnificent

1441
01:02:39.000 --> 01:02:39.960
Verengi.

1442
01:02:40.019 --> 01:02:43.079
Take me out to the holiday suite in the cards, you know, they are

1443
01:02:43.079 --> 01:02:44.820
just absolute gems.

1444
01:02:45.059 --> 01:02:49.139
Well, I think the other thing is too, that, you know, we've talked

1445
01:02:49.139 --> 01:02:52.500
about how Star Trek shows tend to have people who are defined by

1446
01:02:52.500 --> 01:02:56.340
their jobs and what they're good at doing. because it's primarily

1447
01:02:56.340 --> 01:02:57.900
about solving space problems.

1448
01:02:57.960 --> 01:03:01.679
So your characters contribute to the solution in various ways.

1449
01:03:01.739 --> 01:03:07.139
I think here the characters are much more like sitcom characters

1450
01:03:07.139 --> 01:03:12.480
because they have an outlook, a well-defined outlook that we're

1451
01:03:12.480 --> 01:03:13.619
aware of.

1452
01:03:13.679 --> 01:03:17.219
And they tend to react in ways that we can predict.

1453
01:03:17.280 --> 01:03:21.059
We kind of know how Quark will react to something or how Odo will

1454
01:03:21.059 --> 01:03:21.840
react to something.

1455
01:03:21.840 --> 01:03:23.699
They have very well-defined points of view.

1456
01:03:23.820 --> 01:03:27.119
And having those well-defined points, if you means you can play

1457
01:03:27.119 --> 01:03:29.760
off that and play with it and make them do different things.

1458
01:03:29.820 --> 01:03:32.039
But they're like sitcom characters.

1459
01:03:32.099 --> 01:03:35.039
And so they slot very easily into a comedy premise.

1460
01:03:40.320 --> 01:03:44.039
It's that time of the episode, and we are going to pick our next

1461
01:03:44.039 --> 01:03:46.019
Star Trek episode to talk about.

1462
01:03:46.079 --> 01:03:51.900
I'm here on Untitled Star Trek project.com slash Randomiser, and I

1463
01:03:51.900 --> 01:04:00.059
am going to choose an episode from 90s trek.

1464
01:04:00.119 --> 01:04:01.619
All of 90s track.

1465
01:04:01.679 --> 01:04:03.480
All of 90s track.

1466
01:04:03.539 --> 01:04:06.599
So next gen, Deep Say 9 Voyager or Enterprise.

1467
01:04:06.659 --> 01:04:08.760
Oh, I'll be down for any of them, mate.

1468
01:04:08.820 --> 01:04:10.199
Yeah, me too.

1469
01:04:10.260 --> 01:04:12.900
I think it'd be fun to do something that we know well.

1470
01:04:13.019 --> 01:04:17.099
I actually think by default of the fact that that was sheer heaven

1471
01:04:17.099 --> 01:04:21.659
to watch that whatever you choose is going to be slightly more

1472
01:04:21.659 --> 01:04:22.559
disappointing than this.

1473
01:04:22.619 --> 01:04:23.340
Yeah.

1474
01:04:23.400 --> 01:04:24.179
But you never know.

1475
01:04:24.239 --> 01:04:24.960
You never know.

1476
01:04:25.079 --> 01:04:26.940
We even had a good voyager the other week.

1477
01:04:27.000 --> 01:04:28.199
Yeah, we did too.

1478
01:04:28.320 --> 01:04:29.460
Absolutely we did.

1479
01:04:29.519 --> 01:04:31.380
All right, here goes, pressing the button.

1480
01:04:32.099 --> 01:04:34.019
Ooh.

1481
01:04:34.079 --> 01:04:35.639
This is actually a good one.

1482
01:04:35.699 --> 01:04:36.840
Okay.

1483
01:04:36.900 --> 01:04:38.280
That's a big promise.

1484
01:04:38.400 --> 01:04:44.099
Yeah, so this is Star Trek, the Next Generation, season four

1485
01:04:44.099 --> 01:04:49.980
episode 12, the Wounded, was a very good episode.

1486
01:04:50.039 --> 01:04:51.119
It is good.

1487
01:04:51.179 --> 01:04:53.880
So it's the 1st really big O'Brien episode.

1488
01:04:53.940 --> 01:04:57.360
It comes just after date's day, I think. think it's the 1st time

1489
01:04:57.360 --> 01:04:58.739
we see the Cardassians as well.

1490
01:04:58.800 --> 01:05:04.860
Yeah, with Mark Alamo as some gull random guy this week with a

1491
01:05:04.860 --> 01:05:05.579
sort of funny thing.

1492
01:05:05.699 --> 01:05:09.539
The makeup is really off though, compared to what happens later.

1493
01:05:09.599 --> 01:05:12.840
Yeah, and the costume is not what we end up with.

1494
01:05:12.900 --> 01:05:16.380
I think they've got sort of Beaumarish things going around their

1495
01:05:16.380 --> 01:05:16.860
heads.

1496
01:05:16.920 --> 01:05:20.519
There's a thing on their face, like some sort of a strange visor

1497
01:05:20.519 --> 01:05:21.119
thing on their face.

1498
01:05:21.179 --> 01:05:21.719
What do you think?

1499
01:05:21.780 --> 01:05:23.820
We will have to rate them on the bow Moscow, then.

1500
01:05:23.880 --> 01:05:24.539
You are aware of this.

1501
01:05:24.599 --> 01:05:25.559
We will, yeah.

1502
01:05:25.619 --> 01:05:29.099
But this makes for a very boring kind of end of the episode

1503
01:05:29.099 --> 01:05:32.579
choosing another episode thing, but I mean, those people who

1504
01:05:32.579 --> 01:05:35.760
listen to Untitled Star Trek Project and complain that it's not

1505
01:05:35.760 --> 01:05:38.099
random because we just keep picking until...

1506
01:05:38.219 --> 01:05:39.599
Yeah, someone said that to me this week, you know.

1507
01:05:39.659 --> 01:05:40.920
Still not cheating.

1508
01:05:40.980 --> 01:05:42.360
What do reckon?

1509
01:05:42.420 --> 01:05:44.400
Well, I think you should press it again and we should choose

1510
01:05:44.400 --> 01:05:45.420
between the 2 about that.

1511
01:05:45.480 --> 01:05:46.980
No, we're not allowed to do that.

1512
01:05:47.039 --> 01:05:47.880
This is it.

1513
01:05:47.940 --> 01:05:49.800
It's gone if I press it again, it's gone.

1514
01:05:49.860 --> 01:05:51.119
Say it again, go on.

1515
01:05:51.179 --> 01:05:53.699
No, I'm going to say the wounded, right?

1516
01:05:53.760 --> 01:05:55.619
We definitely do it.

1517
01:05:55.679 --> 01:05:59.159
And then I'm going to press it again and see what would have

1518
01:05:59.159 --> 01:06:00.719
happened if I'd agreed.

1519
01:06:00.780 --> 01:06:03.119
It'll be like devil's Jew or Fairhaven.

1520
01:06:03.179 --> 01:06:03.780
Or something like that.

1521
01:06:03.840 --> 01:06:04.619
I love Devil's Jew.

1522
01:06:04.739 --> 01:06:05.579
That might be that.

1523
01:06:05.639 --> 01:06:06.300
Let's have a look then.

1524
01:06:06.360 --> 01:06:07.800
It's going to be rocks and shoals.

1525
01:06:07.860 --> 01:06:11.579
That's season 6, episode two. phenomenally good.

1526
01:06:11.639 --> 01:06:14.760
But we can't have 2 phenomenally good DSIs in a row.

1527
01:06:14.820 --> 01:06:17.280
No, so, okay, so let's do that.

1528
01:06:17.340 --> 01:06:18.420
We'll do the wounded.

1529
01:06:18.480 --> 01:06:23.880
And this is just, this is beyond the point where TNG's knocked out

1530
01:06:23.880 --> 01:06:26.639
a whole year's worth of decent material.

1531
01:06:26.699 --> 01:06:28.980
And halfway through the next year.

1532
01:06:29.039 --> 01:06:31.920
They've done best of both worlds, family, all this fantastic

1533
01:06:31.920 --> 01:06:32.460
stuff.

1534
01:06:32.519 --> 01:06:35.159
They're kind of riding high mid-season four.

1535
01:06:35.280 --> 01:06:38.699
Yeah, no, season 4, they've already done best of both worlds.

1536
01:06:38.760 --> 01:06:40.139
So they're having absolutely...

1537
01:06:40.199 --> 01:06:42.480
Yeah, they're in that, they're in the ascension, you know?

1538
01:06:42.539 --> 01:06:46.019
Yeah, three, four, and five, I think, are really incredibly strong

1539
01:06:46.019 --> 01:06:47.219
in 60s as well.

1540
01:06:47.280 --> 01:06:51.539
Like this is absolutely from the golden era of Star Trek, the Next

1541
01:06:51.539 --> 01:06:51.900
Generation.

1542
01:06:51.960 --> 01:06:56.099
However, we have also revisited episodes where I have said

1543
01:06:56.099 --> 01:06:58.679
absolutely amazing, like power play.

1544
01:06:58.739 --> 01:07:00.659
Maybe it's terrible.

1545
01:07:00.719 --> 01:07:01.260
Oh yeah.

1546
01:07:01.559 --> 01:07:03.480
I think it's pretty good.

1547
01:07:03.539 --> 01:07:04.739
There is some singing.

1548
01:07:05.099 --> 01:07:08.699
We will get calm column singing.

1549
01:07:08.760 --> 01:07:10.679
Yeah, just enjoyable, is there?

1550
01:07:10.739 --> 01:07:11.460
I'm telling you.

1551
01:07:11.519 --> 01:07:12.059
No.

1552
01:07:12.119 --> 01:07:13.079
That's true.

1553
01:07:13.139 --> 01:07:16.860
I think, you know, we haven't done like a good, a really sort of

1554
01:07:16.860 --> 01:07:18.719
gritty episode for a while.

1555
01:07:18.719 --> 01:07:21.599
And this is some good serious drama, I think.

1556
01:07:21.659 --> 01:07:25.440
Well, Star Trek, the next generation.

1557
01:07:25.500 --> 01:07:31.739
Yeah, it's a great generation scale. it's serious drama You are

1558
01:07:31.739 --> 01:07:32.039
rude.

1559
01:07:40.199 --> 01:07:44.460
You've been listening to Untitled Star Trek Project with Joe Ford

1560
01:07:44.460 --> 01:07:48.300
and Nathan Bottomley, where online at Untitled Star Trek Project

1561
01:07:47.579 --> 01:07:50.579
com where you can find links to our Twitter, Facebook, and YouTube

1562
01:07:50.579 --> 01:07:51.119
channel.

1563
01:07:51.179 --> 01:07:54.960
Our podcast artwork is by Kayla Sisrin, and the theme was composed

1564
01:07:54.960 --> 01:07:56.219
by Cameron Lamb.

1565
01:07:56.280 --> 01:08:00.480
This episode was recorded on the 13th of July 2022 and released on

1566
01:08:00.480 --> 01:08:01.440
the 15th of July.

1567
01:08:01.440 --> 01:08:05.099
We'll see you next time for Star Trek the Next Generation, the

1568
01:08:05.099 --> 01:08:05.820
Wounded.

1569
01:08:24.300 --> 01:08:26.460
I think that's a good end, yeah.

1570
01:08:26.520 --> 01:08:27.359
Yeah, I think so.

1571
01:08:27.420 --> 01:08:30.720
We talked for quite a long time about at the beginning.

1572
01:08:30.840 --> 01:08:31.800
That was so much fun.

1573
01:08:31.920 --> 01:08:32.399
Holy shit.

1574
01:08:32.460 --> 01:08:33.119
That's a good episode.

1575
01:08:33.180 --> 01:08:37.800
Yeah, I think this is going to be a good USDV episode as well.

1576
01:08:37.859 --> 01:08:39.300
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1577
01:08:39.359 --> 01:08:41.880
Well, last week we were just sort of fucking bitching about how

1578
01:08:41.880 --> 01:08:42.720
shit the show was.

1579
01:08:42.779 --> 01:08:44.460
I love listening back to that one.

1580
01:08:44.520 --> 01:08:46.319
Oh my god.

1581
01:08:46.380 --> 01:08:47.340
It was enough.

1582
01:08:47.399 --> 01:08:51.239
Because we really attacked it with some thought, you know, it

1583
01:08:51.239 --> 01:08:52.680
wasn't just a bitch fesse.

1584
01:08:52.739 --> 01:08:55.380
It was like, this is why this is truly awful.

1585
01:08:58.500 --> 01:08:59.399
It was your turn.

1586
01:08:59.520 --> 01:09:02.279
Yeah, oh, oh, shit, it is too.

1587
01:09:02.340 --> 01:09:02.640
Yeah.

1588
01:09:02.699 --> 01:09:07.979
I'm going to need some kind of device to show the thing on.

1589
01:09:08.039 --> 01:09:09.000
Wait a sec.

1590
01:09:09.060 --> 01:09:09.899
Safari up.