WEBVTT

NOTE
This transcript was created on 2026-05-01 at 20:53:32

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Hey, Joe. Hi.

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We decided last episode that we would do a story from your

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favourite Star Trek series, which is Deep Space Nine.

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And we randomly selected.

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Series three, episode three, the House of Quark.

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I think we might be stretching the term randomly selected there

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because we have rolled 5 or 6 times.

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Yeah, I think it was five, you know.

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Yeah.

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But we did, we landed on what I think is, it's not, it's not like

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one of the greats, but it's a very good episode of DS9.

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Certainly, a very good one to start with.

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This is a 1st for someone who's pretty important to the history of

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deep space 9, isn't it?

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Kind of.

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It's, it's, So series 3 is where Ron Moore skips over into DS9 and

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has a profound impact on the show, like going forward.

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Um, he's involved in the search 2 parter, which kicks off the

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season.

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I think he co-writes the 2nd episode, but this is his 1st solo

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script for DS9, and it's kind of his signature move because it's a

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Klingon episode, which was absolutely his wheelhouse in Next

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Generation, and would go on to be, you know, something that he

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would do a lot in DS9 as well.

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All right, so I'll have things to say about the relationship, I

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think, between this story and Star Trek, the next generation's

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Klingon arc, because I think it sort of riffs on that sort of

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quite a lot.

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Well, he does something, he does something hugely different with

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this.

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This is the 1st Klingon comedy.

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Like Next Generation never went there.

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Next Generation, the Klingon episodes were all very, you know, uh

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like theatrical, very Shakespearean, like very like big game

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changer episodes, weren't they?

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Whereas this is a light slight character comedy that just happens

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to go to Chronos in the last in the 2nd half.

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That's a new look for the Klingons.

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Yeah, we'll see.

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I think that they are very similar to Ron Moore's Klingons in Star

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Trek, the next generation, all sorts of fun ways, but we will get

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into that when we watch the episode, which I think we might do

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now.

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I am more than ready to watch DS9?

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I'm ready.

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All right.

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Okay.

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So I'll count it in.

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Five, four, three, two, one, and we're off.

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Let's go.

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Is there anything more comforting than starting an episode of Deep

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Space 9 in Quarks?

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Have a look at this look.

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This is Morn gesticulating, doing a little gesture to Rom and

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Quark saying, I'm in there.

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I copped off.

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And if you watch DS9 from beginning to end, right, there's so many

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episodes that start with Morn, doing random things, like, and one

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he's asleep on the promenade and things like that, it's such a

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lovely running joke.

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There's also kind of a running joke about him being hot, isn't

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there?

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I think Jadzia thinks he's cute.

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It's those little wavy...

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Little brishes coming out his chin, she says, yeah.

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And Kira's like, Mourn?

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Really?

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He never shuts up as well.

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You ever had a chat with him?

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Oh, he never shuts up.

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Did you notice, um, at the beginning of this episode, when we pan

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away from Morn, the camera very slowly slides towards Quark and

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Rom?

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Yeah?

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Now, I'm bringing this up, only because you and I had many

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conversations in the past about the energetic camera work, shall

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we say, in latter-day Star Trek. doesn't stop bloody moving and

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I'll get, you know, I'm taking like vertigo sickness tablets just

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to get through an episode.

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This happens at the beginning and the end of this episode. at the

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end of the bar and the camera slides in very, very slowly.

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I hate to say it, but that sort of pedestrian pace of camera work

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that is much more my bag when it comes to Star Trek.

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So this is Les Landau, who is an absolute stalwart and has done

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heaps of Star Trek, the next generation by now.

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And yeah, it's like, you couldn't list all the Les Landau episodes

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because you would be here till the end of time.

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It directs an awful lot.

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He's like an old hand at this now.

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I think this is really, really terrific.

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So there is a little thematic thing that happens here, which is

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that Quark goes up to this guy is called something space name.

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Kozak.

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Kozak.

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So he goes up to Kozak and slam something down on the bar and you

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think he's going to go all Klingon on him.

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You know, I can deal with Klingons.

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And then immediately he starts kind of, you know, panicking and

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stuff like that.

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And this reaction is just romantic.

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Look at rom.

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You don't see, do you know what?

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You don't see blood in Star Trek very often, you know, if you, I

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don't know, if there's a book out there that would list facts, but

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um, like, do you remember that battle at the end of the Way of the

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Warrior?

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There's only the tiniest bit of, there's corpses everywhere, but

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very little blood.

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So it's worth noting that.

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It's not pink.

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Of course, I know I'm skipping ahead a little bit ahead of the

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titles, but of course, Quark finds an immediate way to exploit

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this situation for financial.

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For those of you who aren't watching at the same time, he's been

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complaining that the Dominion threat has meant that no one is

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coming to Deep Space 9 anymore.

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And so he needs to make money in some way.

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Isn't that nice, though, that we've had, so we had the search two

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parter where we went to the founder's home planet.

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We found out at the end of the last episode they were the head of

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the Dominion.

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So there's been a massive shift in the show.

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And in this episode and throughout this season, there's, it's

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quite gentle.

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It's not done, it's done kind of a bit less subtly in 4 and five.

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The Dominion is constantly mentioned.

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In this episode, Quark talks about it there and then Keiko says in

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one of those scenes, well, it just seems like everybody's

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frightened of the Dominion these days, you know.

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Things have changed. i.e. consequences are occurring in DS night

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in a way that they never did with the next generation.

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Yeah, yeah.

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No, next generation is a procedural, whereas this is sort of more

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serialised.

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What do we think of these titles?

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Oh, I mean, they're a bit laborious, aren't they?

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I prefer it when they're revisited and you get the 2 guys flying

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through space, you know, doing the upper pylons.

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Welding the pylons.

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Yeah.

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I have to say, look, you know, Star Trek, both of the previous

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Star Trek series, and I don't know about the animated series

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because it's been a long time since I've watched it, have the

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Enterprise kind of whizzing past really quickly.

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And this, you know, it's a stationary place and it's also trying

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to sell the idea that it's really distant that it's an outpost.

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And so there's nothing in the background.

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So what else are you going to do?

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You just sort of pan slowly over the model.

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But it is very stately.

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Like the camera, you know, moves very graceful.

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And the music is, you know, it's not the fastest paced music

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you've ever heard in your life, is it?

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I like it.

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I mean, I like it, and I think it's a nice bit of music, but they

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definitely give it a kick up the arse in the 2nd half of the

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show.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Oh, Quark and Rob.

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Okay.

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Can we talk about Walk and Rob, please?

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Because I think one of the unsung relationships.

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Well, Quark and his family, I would say, are pretty unsung.

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And let's not forget that Almond Shimmerman and Max Grodenchick

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played Ferengi's in the next generation in like terrible

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episodes.

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Max Gronchick's in Captain's Holiday as this like dreadful.

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Oh, yes.

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Do you remember?

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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And walks in the 1st one with the...

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The last outpost.

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Yeah, I hate two.

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It's so bad.

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To have gone from there to here where they get to play this warm

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lovely, slightly combative relationship.

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Man, they've come on in leaps and bounds.

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Obviously it's the writing that's improved as well.

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I mean, in a sense, I think that they're a kind of sitcom duo

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aren't they?

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Like you know how Quark's going to react to any sort of given

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thing.

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And here there is a kind of character arc for him.

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But he doesn't change too much.

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You know, he changes a bit, but we make it very clear at the end

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of the episode that he's the old quark as well.

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But I think that's Robert, the point, isn't it?

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And right to the end of the series.

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Like at the end of the series, when the political landscape on

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Fringenar has changed completely, and Rom is like the Nagus, Hawk's

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just like, well, this bar will be like the last outpost of the old

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for...

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So he's still clinging on to his old voice.

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Whereas rom goes on this enormous journey throughout the show. of

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like finding his confidence, saying to his brother, no, I'm not

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going to be, you know, your slave anymore.

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I'm going to go find my own way, getting a job, getting a wife, and

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then getting a planet.

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You know, like, Look at, look at Julian's face.

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Like Julian is so sceptical.

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Julian is absolutely not buying any of cork shit at all.

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And just the look on his face and this scene goes out and I think

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it's him and Odo just kind of going, can you believe this guy?

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It's really terrific.

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Well, like, you know people like this.

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I know people like this, bullshit all the time.

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But just they tell the story so well, but you just want to listen

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you know?

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Just another look from Julian.

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It's so good.

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Um, yeah, well, because because Rom is kind of hopeless at

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everything or hopeless at being a Ferengi.

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As far as Quark's concerned, he's really terrible at everything.

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And, of course, we discover that ROM is far, far more competent

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and intelligent than Quark, don't we?

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He's sort of technically competent in a way that Quark absolutely

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isn't.

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Alright.

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And he achieves all those things that Quork never does.

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He gets married to a beautiful woman.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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He becomes the negative.

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So that was Quark's long held dream for a long time.

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Oh, okay, here's Keiko.

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Now, look, we need to talk about Keiko, because I have a feeling

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that the Keiko of the next generation was quite popular and they

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moved her over here for a reason.

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Now, I can still remember people doing the cat noise because you

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know how she says, Niles, Niles, all the time. and because she's

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so miserable.

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In this show.

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I...

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I wonder about her.

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So she's introducing data's day and that's the day of their

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wedding.

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And she is kind of a bit, you know, women be crazy.

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Do you know what I mean?

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Like, um, data doesn't understand her.

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Miles doesn't understand her because she has a lady brain and she

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you know, overreacts to things and stuff.

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It's written like that though, but I think she plays it with a lot

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of warmth in the next generation.

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I think I do too. and I think she's sort of really intelligent as

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well, but she isn't in it all that much.

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I remember her giving birth on the in 10 forward in disaster

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here.

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Like, I wonder about this B plot, I have to say, because...

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It's done for us, it's done for a specific reason.

250
00:11:52.019 --> 00:11:54.419
Yeah, to write her out of the show for a bit.

251
00:11:54.480 --> 00:11:56.100
That's what I thought.

252
00:11:56.159 --> 00:12:00.419
And then I started doing a bit of reading about this and the main

253
00:12:00.419 --> 00:12:04.019
reason they took her out was because they wanted to focus on the

254
00:12:04.019 --> 00:12:08.279
Miles and Julian relationship without Keiko being, and I'm

255
00:12:08.279 --> 00:12:10.740
thinking, oh, you could still do that and have her in there as

256
00:12:10.740 --> 00:12:10.980
well.

257
00:12:11.039 --> 00:12:12.960
Like, that's a very weird way of thinking.

258
00:12:13.019 --> 00:12:15.360
So they removed her deliberately.

259
00:12:15.419 --> 00:12:18.659
So then they, you know, they have this like bachelor pad and there

260
00:12:18.659 --> 00:12:21.840
is lots of, as this season goes on, there's loads of stuff with

261
00:12:21.840 --> 00:12:23.700
and it's glorious material.

262
00:12:23.759 --> 00:12:25.919
So I kind of think they probably made a smart move.

263
00:12:26.039 --> 00:12:29.039
Don't you like the fact, though, that she's not comfortable

264
00:12:29.039 --> 00:12:29.340
there.

265
00:12:29.460 --> 00:12:30.840
There's somebody saying, do you know what?

266
00:12:30.899 --> 00:12:34.379
This is a miserable place and terrible things happen here and this

267
00:12:34.379 --> 00:12:35.759
is no way for a family to be.

268
00:12:35.820 --> 00:12:37.259
I quite like that.

269
00:12:37.320 --> 00:12:38.399
Yeah, yeah.

270
00:12:38.460 --> 00:12:42.659
I do think the B blood is sort of terribly thin and I do think

271
00:12:42.659 --> 00:12:44.100
they should go.

272
00:12:44.159 --> 00:12:49.080
He's really annoying in a way that like, I'll talk about it

273
00:12:49.080 --> 00:12:49.440
later.

274
00:12:49.500 --> 00:12:51.299
There's a scene coming up later, which I just think is

275
00:12:51.299 --> 00:12:55.139
unbelievably miserable and incredibly annoying.

276
00:12:55.200 --> 00:12:57.539
Is it when she makes her a lovely meal?

277
00:12:58.139 --> 00:13:00.360
And then, yeah, they bone.

278
00:13:00.419 --> 00:13:01.500
No, no that's okay.

279
00:13:01.559 --> 00:13:04.860
And the next morning, he's like, right, well, I'm off to work and

280
00:13:04.860 --> 00:13:07.139
he does that thing that they do in drama where they just hang out

281
00:13:07.139 --> 00:13:09.779
at the door watching the other person and the other person's not

282
00:13:09.779 --> 00:13:10.740
aware that they're watching them.

283
00:13:10.799 --> 00:13:12.299
No, she's aware.

284
00:13:12.360 --> 00:13:13.019
She's aware.

285
00:13:13.080 --> 00:13:14.399
That's the worst thing about it will get there.

286
00:13:14.460 --> 00:13:15.899
Okay, okay.

287
00:13:15.960 --> 00:13:18.360
Oh, okay, okay.

288
00:13:18.419 --> 00:13:19.559
Odo and Quark.

289
00:13:19.620 --> 00:13:22.440
Just win-win across the series.

290
00:13:22.500 --> 00:13:24.659
You can't go wrong with Odon Quark.

291
00:13:24.720 --> 00:13:27.539
Do you think they're the 2 best actors in the regular cast, like

292
00:13:27.539 --> 00:13:29.220
in the credited...

293
00:13:29.220 --> 00:13:31.440
That's a toughie.

294
00:13:31.500 --> 00:13:32.580
This is a strong cast.

295
00:13:32.639 --> 00:13:34.139
Yeah, I think.

296
00:13:34.200 --> 00:13:35.940
So you tentially.

297
00:13:36.000 --> 00:13:40.620
Oberjois was in Benson, and I actually remember that when I was a

298
00:13:40.620 --> 00:13:42.659
kid, and that's a sitcom.

299
00:13:42.720 --> 00:13:48.059
And I don't know what, um, what else Armond Shimmerman did before

300
00:13:48.059 --> 00:13:49.500
this.

301
00:13:49.559 --> 00:13:52.139
He was doing a Buffy concurrent with this, you know?

302
00:13:52.200 --> 00:13:53.220
So he was doing this.

303
00:13:53.279 --> 00:13:54.659
Buffy at the same time.

304
00:13:54.720 --> 00:13:58.139
And let's not forget his wonderful principal Snyder.

305
00:13:58.200 --> 00:13:59.159
Yeah, yeah.

306
00:13:59.220 --> 00:14:02.340
And he's a sitcom character as well in a sense in Buffy too.

307
00:14:02.399 --> 00:14:03.960
Like he's there to be funny.

308
00:14:04.019 --> 00:14:09.059
And so those 2 are like a weird sitcom odd couple.

309
00:14:09.120 --> 00:14:14.399
And I do think the fact, you know, this isn't a procedural, there's

310
00:14:14.399 --> 00:14:17.279
no problem to solve that the crew has to solve.

311
00:14:17.340 --> 00:14:21.899
It's entirely about, you know, Quark being a fish out of water

312
00:14:21.899 --> 00:14:24.240
quite getting into scrapes by telling lies.

313
00:14:24.299 --> 00:14:25.740
It's a classic sitcom plot.

314
00:14:26.399 --> 00:14:29.580
But it's not doing the next gen thing, is it?

315
00:14:29.639 --> 00:14:31.259
of habit of like working to a formula.

316
00:14:31.379 --> 00:14:35.399
I think this story goes off on some weird angles that you don't

317
00:14:35.399 --> 00:14:36.059
expect it to.

318
00:14:36.120 --> 00:14:37.379
And that's very refreshing.

319
00:14:37.440 --> 00:14:43.019
DS9 does not feel the need to tell stories entirely through the

320
00:14:43.019 --> 00:14:45.840
eyes of the regulars because Quark's not really one of the

321
00:14:45.840 --> 00:14:46.559
regulars, is he?

322
00:14:46.620 --> 00:14:47.519
the guy that runs the bar.

323
00:14:47.580 --> 00:14:49.620
Yeah, I know, but he's in the opening credits.

324
00:14:49.679 --> 00:14:53.039
Like he's one of the kind of main characters in the ensemble.

325
00:14:53.100 --> 00:14:57.720
But, I mean, Star Trek will have Star Trek the Next Generation

326
00:14:57.720 --> 00:15:02.039
will have, you know, like a data episode or a Geordie episode or

327
00:15:02.039 --> 00:15:07.200
whatever, but usually it's the usual space problem that they come

328
00:15:07.200 --> 00:15:12.059
across and it, you know, the main character for this episode is

329
00:15:12.059 --> 00:15:14.039
you know, crucial to the solution.

330
00:15:14.100 --> 00:15:15.899
Here, there's no space problem.

331
00:15:15.960 --> 00:15:20.940
In fact, it's quite shocking when we end up in Cisco's office a

332
00:15:20.940 --> 00:15:23.639
bit later on and they're doing Starfleet shit, you know?

333
00:15:23.700 --> 00:15:27.120
I don't think there's any techno babble in this episode.

334
00:15:27.179 --> 00:15:30.600
And in fact, sort of season 3 onwards of GS9.

335
00:15:30.779 --> 00:15:33.419
The Techno Battle just gets lesser and as you go along, I think

336
00:15:33.419 --> 00:15:37.080
Star Trek fans get a bit confused watching some of it, like, well

337
00:15:37.080 --> 00:15:37.620
where's the ships?

338
00:15:37.679 --> 00:15:38.879
Where's the techno battle, you know?

339
00:15:38.940 --> 00:15:40.620
This character drama.

340
00:15:40.679 --> 00:15:41.399
What's this all about?

341
00:15:41.460 --> 00:15:43.139
I need to just talk about this scene very quickly.

342
00:15:43.200 --> 00:15:43.860
Yeah, yeah.

343
00:15:43.980 --> 00:15:49.500
When Quark tries to say Kapla in a minute, it's so funny.

344
00:15:49.500 --> 00:15:52.379
It's so good, isn't it?

345
00:15:52.440 --> 00:15:57.720
But the comic performers of the Klingon. where he's like, I hope

346
00:15:57.720 --> 00:16:00.419
you're not saying this. and then it just suddenly goes, on the

347
00:16:00.419 --> 00:16:04.559
other hand, it's really, it's a very funny performance from this

348
00:16:04.559 --> 00:16:04.799
guy.

349
00:16:05.820 --> 00:16:10.379
What it's doing, I think, is it's doing what Ron Moore does in

350
00:16:10.379 --> 00:16:14.159
Star Trek the Next Generation, which is he creates the Klingon

351
00:16:14.159 --> 00:16:17.940
society, like Klingon society, really, doesn't he?

352
00:16:18.000 --> 00:16:24.779
And, and what we discover is all the honour stuff is a facade and

353
00:16:24.779 --> 00:16:29.220
it's being wielded by the characters in order to get, like for

354
00:16:29.220 --> 00:16:30.779
political ends, let's say.

355
00:16:30.840 --> 00:16:35.220
And so, you know, Worf accepts discommendation at the end of, what

356
00:16:35.220 --> 00:16:36.179
series four?

357
00:16:36.240 --> 00:16:39.120
No, at the, yeah, anyway, I can't remember.

358
00:16:39.179 --> 00:16:39.899
Sins of the Father.

359
00:16:39.960 --> 00:16:40.259
Yeah.

360
00:16:40.320 --> 00:16:43.799
He's been discommended from the Klingon Empire and we'll get that

361
00:16:43.799 --> 00:16:45.000
in a 2nd later.

362
00:16:45.059 --> 00:16:49.019
But it's all done for a political purpose, right?

363
00:16:49.080 --> 00:16:51.240
And you've got the jockeying for power and all of that.

364
00:16:51.299 --> 00:16:52.379
Here.

365
00:16:52.440 --> 00:16:57.779
We think that I assume that De Gore, De Gore.

366
00:16:57.840 --> 00:16:58.919
Is that his name?

367
00:16:59.340 --> 00:17:02.220
Yeah, was being honest, right?

368
00:17:03.120 --> 00:17:06.299
that his family's honour was at stake.

369
00:17:06.359 --> 00:17:11.160
And so Quark now has to say that he bested him in combat.

370
00:17:11.220 --> 00:17:15.359
And then later on, we discovered that that's all bullshit, and the

371
00:17:15.359 --> 00:17:18.779
purpose of it is so that he can take over.

372
00:17:18.779 --> 00:17:25.740
I mean, that marvellously outrageous suggestion that a Klingon has

373
00:17:25.740 --> 00:17:29.220
used what financial means to bring down a great house.

374
00:17:29.279 --> 00:17:31.380
Yeah, but at the end of this.

375
00:17:31.440 --> 00:17:34.680
And I don't want to even skip ahead, but Corp literally pulls that

376
00:17:34.680 --> 00:17:40.019
facade down when he says, no, I'm here to be executed and fine, if

377
00:17:40.019 --> 00:17:42.839
that's the case, do it, but I'm not going to fight you.

378
00:17:42.900 --> 00:17:44.460
I'm not going to pretend, just kill me.

379
00:17:44.519 --> 00:17:45.539
Yeah, yeah.

380
00:17:45.599 --> 00:17:49.440
So it's the same thing, but done for a sort of comedy effect.

381
00:17:49.500 --> 00:17:54.720
I mean, the, the, the Klingons in this episode go on about honour

382
00:17:54.720 --> 00:17:59.339
but the rules they sort of bring to bear are kind of made up and

383
00:17:59.339 --> 00:18:00.059
arbitrary.

384
00:18:00.119 --> 00:18:04.319
They're sort of space rules and they're all being kind of wielded

385
00:18:04.319 --> 00:18:06.900
in order to kind of gain political power.

386
00:18:06.960 --> 00:18:09.480
All right, so we just soft focussed away.

387
00:18:09.539 --> 00:18:12.240
Miles and Coco boning.

388
00:18:12.299 --> 00:18:13.799
I don't want watch that.

389
00:18:13.859 --> 00:18:16.980
Thank you very much. honestly. don't get me wrong.

390
00:18:17.039 --> 00:18:18.539
Rosin Chow, it's very attractive.

391
00:18:18.599 --> 00:18:20.039
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

392
00:18:20.099 --> 00:18:22.619
Yeah, she's... honestly.

393
00:18:22.680 --> 00:18:26.759
I'm just a bit worried that they, she has to be doing bonsai.

394
00:18:26.819 --> 00:18:29.099
They just kind of, I just kind of think, okay.

395
00:18:29.160 --> 00:18:32.759
You really believe it, relationship, though, you know, I think

396
00:18:32.759 --> 00:18:35.339
they have very good chemistry pair of them.

397
00:18:35.400 --> 00:18:40.380
Well, this, so that thing where she reacts to him pulling away

398
00:18:40.380 --> 00:18:43.680
from her with sort of dismay and she kind of stumbles a little

399
00:18:43.680 --> 00:18:43.920
bit.

400
00:18:43.980 --> 00:18:45.240
I think that's very good.

401
00:18:45.299 --> 00:18:48.359
Then he's standing at the door and then she sits down just looking

402
00:18:48.359 --> 00:18:51.539
miserable and going, I'm going to sit in this dark room for 8

403
00:18:51.539 --> 00:18:52.799
hours while you're away.

404
00:18:53.339 --> 00:18:55.680
And he's watching her.

405
00:18:55.740 --> 00:18:58.559
And it's kind of like, can you not do a better job of pretending

406
00:18:58.559 --> 00:18:59.759
to be happy at least?

407
00:18:59.819 --> 00:19:01.140
so miserable.

408
00:19:01.200 --> 00:19:02.339
What's wrong?

409
00:19:02.339 --> 00:19:05.160
all the bloody stops for the nothing.

410
00:19:06.000 --> 00:19:09.420
Don't you sit there and pretend to me you haven't done this.

411
00:19:09.480 --> 00:19:10.619
I have absolutely...

412
00:19:10.680 --> 00:19:13.259
I have absolutely been Keiko in this scene, all right?

413
00:19:13.500 --> 00:19:15.480
Oh, my God.

414
00:19:15.539 --> 00:19:19.019
Oh, Mary K. as grill car.

415
00:19:19.079 --> 00:19:21.720
She is bloody brilliant in this.

416
00:19:21.839 --> 00:19:27.299
The way she comes in here, and she's quite gentle, approaches Cork

417
00:19:27.299 --> 00:19:29.700
and he thinks, okay, we have a civilised conversation and out

418
00:19:29.700 --> 00:19:33.599
comes the knife, defend just out. hilarious.

419
00:19:33.660 --> 00:19:36.900
And he tumbles over the bloody bar and all the latinum's flying

420
00:19:36.900 --> 00:19:37.319
everywhere.

421
00:19:37.380 --> 00:19:39.420
I think glasses break as well.

422
00:19:39.480 --> 00:19:45.299
You watch. absolutely. died like a warrior.

423
00:19:45.359 --> 00:19:47.039
I'm saying my picks, you know?

424
00:19:50.099 --> 00:19:54.299
Clark's actually sort of kind of acting normally for a 2nd.

425
00:19:54.359 --> 00:19:56.339
This is so clever, Israel.

426
00:19:56.339 --> 00:19:57.420
She gets the knife.

427
00:19:59.160 --> 00:20:03.359
It's just like, and why is she doing it?

428
00:20:03.480 --> 00:20:09.420
He thinks she's getting revenge, but she is proving that he's not

429
00:20:09.420 --> 00:20:14.039
going to have fought Kozak in battle because he's so pathetic, you

430
00:20:14.039 --> 00:20:14.279
know.

431
00:20:14.339 --> 00:20:15.299
So good.

432
00:20:15.359 --> 00:20:16.740
Oh, you need to prove it.

433
00:20:16.799 --> 00:20:17.279
Look at that.

434
00:20:17.339 --> 00:20:19.559
But don't you think it's hilarious how the knife is like double

435
00:20:19.559 --> 00:20:21.960
dramatic because the knife itself is dramatic.

436
00:20:22.019 --> 00:20:24.359
And then all of a sudden these 2 forks either side come out.

437
00:20:25.380 --> 00:20:28.259
Klingos, man, they love a bit of drama.

438
00:20:28.319 --> 00:20:29.160
They do.

439
00:20:29.160 --> 00:20:31.920
Just anyway, he pushes away the knife.

440
00:20:32.460 --> 00:20:34.559
You could just get out of my face.

441
00:20:35.039 --> 00:20:39.119
But what's lovely here, what Romaw does here with these 2

442
00:20:39.119 --> 00:20:42.119
characters is obviously initially they can't bear each other.

443
00:20:42.180 --> 00:20:43.079
They want to be around each other.

444
00:20:43.140 --> 00:20:44.279
I want to get married to each other.

445
00:20:44.339 --> 00:20:49.440
Um, It's that culture clash of bringing together these 2 races

446
00:20:49.440 --> 00:20:53.400
very disparate races that learn from each other and learn each

447
00:20:53.400 --> 00:20:54.240
other's strengths.

448
00:20:54.299 --> 00:20:57.839
And I know that's old hat, but when it's done this confidently, who

449
00:20:57.839 --> 00:20:58.259
cares?

450
00:20:58.259 --> 00:20:59.099
And this well played.

451
00:21:01.200 --> 00:21:05.279
Like, cork never, ever stops being a frank in this, does it?

452
00:21:05.339 --> 00:21:06.240
He never, ever stops.

453
00:21:06.299 --> 00:21:07.619
His weapon is his brain.

454
00:21:07.740 --> 00:21:11.640
And he's constantly using that throughout to try and because now

455
00:21:11.640 --> 00:21:13.319
from now on when he's on Kronos.

456
00:21:13.380 --> 00:21:17.039
He's basically, you know, there's a there's a knife to his throat

457
00:21:17.039 --> 00:21:19.859
at all times and he's got to try and duck away from that.

458
00:21:19.920 --> 00:21:26.640
Well, I think the genius of this episode is mashing up Quark and

459
00:21:26.640 --> 00:21:27.240
the Klingons.

460
00:21:27.299 --> 00:21:30.480
So we've always seen the Klingons over against the Federation.

461
00:21:30.960 --> 00:21:36.599
And now we get someone who seems kind of uniquely poorly suited to

462
00:21:36.599 --> 00:21:37.440
dealing with them.

463
00:21:37.980 --> 00:21:42.660
And, you know, right back from, what's the one in series 2 of Star

464
00:21:42.660 --> 00:21:46.619
Trek, the Next Generation where Riker goes on board the on

465
00:21:46.619 --> 00:21:47.160
exchange?

466
00:21:47.220 --> 00:21:48.539
Matter of honour.

467
00:21:48.599 --> 00:21:49.619
Matter of honour?

468
00:21:49.680 --> 00:21:50.039
right.

469
00:21:50.099 --> 00:21:53.460
And so the way that you deal with Klingons is by being violent.

470
00:21:53.519 --> 00:21:57.720
You know, the Vulcan Hello. you hit you hit them 1st and so he's

471
00:21:57.720 --> 00:22:02.160
he's uniquely unsuitable to deal with them.

472
00:22:02.220 --> 00:22:06.000
And he operates in a different register because he is a sitcom

473
00:22:06.000 --> 00:22:11.700
character because he's devious and silly and funny and they're

474
00:22:11.700 --> 00:22:14.700
serious and ridiculous and kind of self-important.

475
00:22:14.759 --> 00:22:17.160
Like, he shows them up.

476
00:22:17.220 --> 00:22:19.140
He makes them look sillier.

477
00:22:19.680 --> 00:22:23.220
In a way...

478
00:22:23.279 --> 00:22:25.980
Well, in a way that next generation could never possibly afford to

479
00:22:25.980 --> 00:22:26.220
do.

480
00:22:26.819 --> 00:22:29.039
You know, they're too important.

481
00:22:29.099 --> 00:22:31.980
If you'd have said to me after, like, redemption.

482
00:22:32.039 --> 00:22:34.619
Oh yeah, you know, we're going to skip over the DS 9 now and do a

483
00:22:34.619 --> 00:22:35.700
Klingon comedy.

484
00:22:35.700 --> 00:22:38.579
I'd laugh in your face and say, how could you possibly do that?

485
00:22:38.640 --> 00:22:43.019
And all you need to do is to plop quark in amongst a lot of

486
00:22:43.019 --> 00:22:43.559
Klingons.

487
00:22:43.559 --> 00:22:44.640
And it's suddenly very funny.

488
00:22:44.700 --> 00:22:48.839
That bit later on where Quarks explaining like all the financial

489
00:22:48.839 --> 00:22:54.059
ways that Kozak, no Kozak, the gore, has brought down Grouka's

490
00:22:54.059 --> 00:22:57.720
house with, and Garan just sort of throws the thing aside and goes

491
00:22:57.720 --> 00:22:58.140
enough.

492
00:22:58.200 --> 00:22:59.880
I'm not listening to this anymore, you know?

493
00:22:59.940 --> 00:23:02.039
This isn't how we do things here, you know?

494
00:23:02.220 --> 00:23:06.299
So here's a very romantic moment because Quark is going to get

495
00:23:06.299 --> 00:23:06.420
married.

496
00:23:06.480 --> 00:23:08.460
He doesn't realise it.

497
00:23:08.519 --> 00:23:11.400
There's a point to be made about Klingon wedding ceremonies here

498
00:23:11.400 --> 00:23:13.980
because I know you remember the wedding of Dax and Wharf, which is

499
00:23:13.980 --> 00:23:16.980
this overly elaborate theatrical affair with this crazy

500
00:23:16.980 --> 00:23:20.700
metaphorical story of 2 hearts coming together and it's all very

501
00:23:20.700 --> 00:23:21.180
open.

502
00:23:21.240 --> 00:23:24.180
I think this is like the Klingon civil ceremony.

503
00:23:24.240 --> 00:23:26.819
Well, you know, the cheap, the cheap ass Klingon ceremony, where

504
00:23:26.819 --> 00:23:28.859
they... office wedding.

505
00:23:28.920 --> 00:23:31.859
Knife to the throw, a quick kiss, you're married.

506
00:23:32.220 --> 00:23:36.299
And that's actually Klingon for you may kiss the bribe there.

507
00:23:36.359 --> 00:23:37.019
We just saw that.

508
00:23:37.079 --> 00:23:38.579
Which is spits.

509
00:23:38.579 --> 00:23:41.160
You don't often see characters in Star Trek spitting either.

510
00:23:41.220 --> 00:23:45.119
Well, that's done deliberately, isn't it?

511
00:23:45.180 --> 00:23:47.940
Because then that's contrasted with later when she really kisses

512
00:23:47.940 --> 00:23:48.720
him, you know?

513
00:23:48.779 --> 00:23:50.519
Yeah, it's kind of hard, actually.

514
00:23:50.579 --> 00:23:52.079
I buy it.

515
00:23:52.140 --> 00:23:52.740
We'll get there.

516
00:23:53.039 --> 00:23:56.759
Well, I complained about that chased kiss in yesterday's

517
00:23:56.759 --> 00:23:57.180
enterprise.

518
00:23:57.240 --> 00:23:58.859
I thought this one was a bit hotter.

519
00:23:58.920 --> 00:24:02.160
Yeah, I think it is harder than yesterday's surprising.

520
00:24:02.160 --> 00:24:03.299
I'm not kissing your light, Nathan.

521
00:24:04.920 --> 00:24:07.740
All right, we're back from the ad break.

522
00:24:07.859 --> 00:24:11.099
And now look, here are people that aren't covered in latex

523
00:24:11.099 --> 00:24:11.880
talking.

524
00:24:11.880 --> 00:24:14.339
And it is kind of like the 1st time.

525
00:24:14.400 --> 00:24:15.960
It's so weird.

526
00:24:16.079 --> 00:24:19.200
This is like the 1st time it's a Star Trek episode.

527
00:24:19.259 --> 00:24:20.339
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

528
00:24:20.400 --> 00:24:21.900
They're all in Starfleet uniforms.

529
00:24:21.960 --> 00:24:24.779
You know, we saw Julian in the earlier scene and some other

530
00:24:24.779 --> 00:24:28.500
Starfleet people in the background, you know, and we've had Keiko

531
00:24:28.500 --> 00:24:29.400
and Miles, I guess.

532
00:24:29.460 --> 00:24:33.359
But this, we're in an office talking space things, and we've got

533
00:24:33.359 --> 00:24:37.319
pads in front of us and stuff, and we're, you know, this is what

534
00:24:37.319 --> 00:24:39.839
the focus of the episode would be if it was Star Trek the Next

535
00:24:39.839 --> 00:24:40.259
Generation.

536
00:24:40.680 --> 00:24:44.579
Although, I love the fact that Kiro clearly misses the cues here.

537
00:24:44.640 --> 00:24:46.920
She's like, well, I'm not going to letting the boys talk.

538
00:24:46.980 --> 00:24:50.099
I'm working, you know. so good.

539
00:24:50.160 --> 00:24:53.279
She's once seen and she manages to steal it.

540
00:24:53.339 --> 00:24:55.799
She's spinning it off as she leaves.

541
00:24:56.039 --> 00:24:58.440
Is it Nana or Nana?

542
00:24:58.500 --> 00:25:00.059
I think it's Nana.

543
00:25:00.119 --> 00:25:00.539
I don't know.

544
00:25:00.599 --> 00:25:01.079
I don't know.

545
00:25:01.380 --> 00:25:03.480
We'd better work it out.

546
00:25:03.539 --> 00:25:05.339
We were doing this for a long time.

547
00:25:05.759 --> 00:25:09.720
Oh, Brian, having the weird suggestion.

548
00:25:09.779 --> 00:25:12.359
Well, we're going to give Keiko a cargo base, as you can turn it

549
00:25:12.359 --> 00:25:13.200
into a garden.

550
00:25:13.259 --> 00:25:15.960
I worked on the Enterprise, we're on DS9 now.

551
00:25:16.019 --> 00:25:20.759
Yeah, I mean, she worked in the arboretum on the Enterprise.

552
00:25:20.819 --> 00:25:22.559
Like, do you remember that set, though?

553
00:25:22.559 --> 00:25:23.700
Oh, it was so bad.

554
00:25:23.759 --> 00:25:24.779
It's terrible.

555
00:25:24.839 --> 00:25:25.859
Yeah.

556
00:25:25.859 --> 00:25:28.680
Although they could probably do with, you know, a bit of foliage

557
00:25:28.680 --> 00:25:29.400
on DS9.

558
00:25:29.579 --> 00:25:31.200
Yeah, yeah, yeah, tying up a little bit.

559
00:25:31.259 --> 00:25:33.119
Turn the fucking lights up at some point.

560
00:25:33.180 --> 00:25:35.279
I'm sorry, I'm going to argue this point.

561
00:25:35.339 --> 00:25:36.299
Have you ever seen what time?

562
00:25:36.299 --> 00:25:37.500
For the drama.

563
00:25:37.559 --> 00:25:38.940
I like the movie lighting.

564
00:25:40.619 --> 00:25:46.019
In fact, I was noticing it in the O'Briens quarters earlier on, you

565
00:25:46.019 --> 00:25:48.779
know, the way that there's kind of everything seems to be lit

566
00:25:48.779 --> 00:25:50.519
through grills and stuff like that.

567
00:25:50.579 --> 00:25:53.519
It just makes it sort of slightly interesting, super impractical.

568
00:25:53.579 --> 00:25:57.420
But it does make for interesting scenes.

569
00:25:57.480 --> 00:25:58.500
Just like this.

570
00:25:58.500 --> 00:26:02.819
Look at this soft Cisco with hair.

571
00:26:03.000 --> 00:26:07.019
I mean, series 4 that, they completely revolutionise this

572
00:26:07.019 --> 00:26:07.740
character, don't they?

573
00:26:07.859 --> 00:26:10.619
And Avery Brook literally just jumps out of the closet with lots

574
00:26:10.619 --> 00:26:15.059
of energy. able to look like how he wants to look, you know?

575
00:26:15.720 --> 00:26:18.960
He's quite eccentric, Avery Brooks, isn't he?

576
00:26:19.019 --> 00:26:20.940
Like he's Fabulously so...

577
00:26:21.000 --> 00:26:22.559
Did you see that documentary where he's there?

578
00:26:22.559 --> 00:26:23.940
and Shatner's trying to ask him.

579
00:26:23.940 --> 00:26:25.200
Yeah, captains, isn't it?

580
00:26:25.259 --> 00:26:26.940
And he's just playing like jazz.

581
00:26:27.000 --> 00:26:29.099
He's going, no, I'm just going to play jazz.

582
00:26:29.160 --> 00:26:30.839
He was amazing.

583
00:26:30.900 --> 00:26:31.500
Good.

584
00:26:31.559 --> 00:26:35.220
And I think he becomes just incredibly charming and sexy by the

585
00:26:35.220 --> 00:26:38.460
end of this, but he is very restrained as well.

586
00:26:38.640 --> 00:26:43.619
And this scene, I think, is, again, part of the tedious B plot.

587
00:26:43.680 --> 00:26:46.920
Okay, back to the picture of Kronos.

588
00:26:46.980 --> 00:26:48.779
I like the Matt work, though.

589
00:26:48.839 --> 00:26:51.240
And I think they get better at doing it as they go along.

590
00:26:51.299 --> 00:26:55.740
Cardassia and Bajor, particularly when they have like the, it's a

591
00:26:55.740 --> 00:26:59.460
beautiful picture every time and they just, they move a few bits

592
00:26:59.460 --> 00:26:59.819
don't they?

593
00:26:59.819 --> 00:27:03.299
Water, waterfalls and things like that, just to make it feel as if

594
00:27:03.299 --> 00:27:06.240
it's a moving image rather than a photograph.

595
00:27:06.299 --> 00:27:11.819
I think, you know, they lent into this because it had gone down so

596
00:27:11.819 --> 00:27:13.500
well in Star Trek the Next Generation.

597
00:27:13.559 --> 00:27:17.099
I think they won Emmys and stuff for the design of the Klingon

598
00:27:17.099 --> 00:27:18.000
home world in that.

599
00:27:18.059 --> 00:27:22.140
The only time this appears in DS9, you know, weirdly enough

600
00:27:22.140 --> 00:27:24.599
because the Klingons have a big role in DS9, but it's the only

601
00:27:24.599 --> 00:27:25.619
time we go to Kronos.

602
00:27:25.740 --> 00:27:26.400
Right.

603
00:27:29.519 --> 00:27:32.640
In those robes, like, no, no, no.

604
00:27:33.480 --> 00:27:36.359
Oh, and now look at Gauron.

605
00:27:36.420 --> 00:27:42.779
And so Gowron is, when he 1st appears, he is so weird looking.

606
00:27:42.779 --> 00:27:45.660
And it's not just the sort of bug eyes, but the teeth as well.

607
00:27:45.720 --> 00:27:49.799
He's a little bit animalish, and of course, you know, Duras is a

608
00:27:49.799 --> 00:27:53.759
known quantity and Gower on is just kind of weird and upsetting.

609
00:27:53.759 --> 00:27:57.000
And so here he gets to be in a sitcom.

610
00:27:57.660 --> 00:28:00.420
And he's very, very funny as well.

611
00:28:00.480 --> 00:28:03.960
Did you say he's weird when he when he starts in the show?

612
00:28:04.019 --> 00:28:05.039
He's weird throughout.

613
00:28:05.099 --> 00:28:09.720
I mean, why the Warrior, when he's on that screen, a glory to your

614
00:28:09.720 --> 00:28:10.079
heart.

615
00:28:10.140 --> 00:28:10.859
That's right.

616
00:28:10.980 --> 00:28:15.839
He is the most mad eccentric you are going to find in Star Trek.

617
00:28:15.839 --> 00:28:18.839
And I think it's fabulous that he's the head of the Klingons, you

618
00:28:18.839 --> 00:28:19.019
know?

619
00:28:19.079 --> 00:28:21.779
I think I've seen him without makeup and he looks completely

620
00:28:21.779 --> 00:28:22.619
unremarkable.

621
00:28:22.680 --> 00:28:24.059
You have.

622
00:28:24.119 --> 00:28:27.779
He is without makeup as the person who's counting the money in

623
00:28:27.779 --> 00:28:29.039
bada bing bada bang.

624
00:28:29.039 --> 00:28:32.220
And you can tell that's him because of the crazy eyes.

625
00:28:35.519 --> 00:28:38.460
I do think it is just so strange.

626
00:28:38.519 --> 00:28:43.680
How many scenes here have everyone in just hours and hours of

627
00:28:43.680 --> 00:28:44.460
makeup?

628
00:28:44.519 --> 00:28:47.339
It's uh, it's really very bizarre.

629
00:28:47.460 --> 00:28:49.920
Michael, is it Michael Westmore that does the makeup?

630
00:28:49.980 --> 00:28:50.640
that's right.

631
00:28:50.700 --> 00:28:52.859
He must have been a busy man.

632
00:28:52.920 --> 00:28:58.500
It's just, you know, for on Next Generation, there would be one or

633
00:28:58.500 --> 00:29:01.680
2 people in the room for budgetary reasons and that's sort of

634
00:29:01.680 --> 00:29:02.339
basically it.

635
00:29:03.000 --> 00:29:07.680
There's actually a very cute story that Mary Adams tells that

636
00:29:07.680 --> 00:29:10.799
before they started filming this, Almond Shimmer went up to her

637
00:29:10.799 --> 00:29:14.940
and said, it is agonising being inside that makeup.

638
00:29:15.000 --> 00:29:19.200
And if you need a moment, if you are, you know, if you're feeling

639
00:29:19.200 --> 00:29:22.259
anxious about it all, because, you know, they did like 14 hour

640
00:29:22.259 --> 00:29:25.140
days or something in that makeup, sweating themselves.

641
00:29:25.200 --> 00:29:26.819
He said, just come and find me.

642
00:29:26.880 --> 00:29:27.359
I'll help you.

643
00:29:27.420 --> 00:29:30.119
And she said that going into other shows, because obviously this

644
00:29:30.119 --> 00:29:33.599
is a guest part in, you know, an ensemble show, that there was

645
00:29:33.599 --> 00:29:36.599
never that kind of consideration and that was one of the kindest

646
00:29:36.599 --> 00:29:39.420
moment that she's had from another actor to come up to her like

647
00:29:39.420 --> 00:29:40.200
before they started.

648
00:29:40.380 --> 00:29:44.579
And Armin Shimmerman absolutely seems to be that man, if you see

649
00:29:44.579 --> 00:29:47.700
him in interviews and things like that, you know. very thoughtful

650
00:29:47.700 --> 00:29:48.900
very kind actor.

651
00:29:48.960 --> 00:29:49.500
Yeah.

652
00:29:50.039 --> 00:29:52.740
He's really good in this scene.

653
00:29:52.799 --> 00:29:57.660
I think this scene is one of the best scenes in the episode and it

654
00:29:57.660 --> 00:30:03.660
is because it's the kind of, you know, it's the moment where Quark

655
00:30:03.660 --> 00:30:07.859
decides, no, I'm going to solve this problem myself, but in a sort

656
00:30:07.859 --> 00:30:09.180
of Ferengi way.

657
00:30:09.240 --> 00:30:12.539
You know, Grillk has got nothing.

658
00:30:12.599 --> 00:30:13.440
I'm going to work with her.

659
00:30:13.500 --> 00:30:14.759
I'm gonna kind of help her out.

660
00:30:14.819 --> 00:30:19.200
And I think I think the way the 2 of them play it, you know

661
00:30:19.200 --> 00:30:20.880
they're no longer antagonistic.

662
00:30:20.940 --> 00:30:25.920
She's initially sort of suspicious and a bit revolted by him and

663
00:30:25.920 --> 00:30:28.740
now the 2 of them are going to work together and I just think the

664
00:30:28.740 --> 00:30:31.200
way the dynamic changes.

665
00:30:31.259 --> 00:30:34.680
She can't quite get rid of her to stay because she's like, you

666
00:30:34.680 --> 00:30:37.440
mean the Gora's been lying and scheming like a...

667
00:30:37.440 --> 00:30:40.200
And it's like, yes, like a Ferengi.

668
00:30:40.259 --> 00:30:41.700
Yeah, he's proud of it.

669
00:30:41.759 --> 00:30:43.380
I really like that as well.

670
00:30:43.440 --> 00:30:48.599
It's that, that, that, you know, yes, we are like that and I'm

671
00:30:48.599 --> 00:30:51.539
absolutely happy that we're like that, you know.

672
00:30:51.599 --> 00:30:52.680
Look what we can do.

673
00:30:52.740 --> 00:30:56.339
We can bring down your entire house, you know, just by basically

674
00:30:56.339 --> 00:30:57.059
fiddling the books.

675
00:31:00.119 --> 00:31:03.480
I don't think I'm going to be bold and say I don't think Arman

676
00:31:03.480 --> 00:31:05.099
Shimmerman ever gives a bad performance.

677
00:31:05.160 --> 00:31:09.299
I think he is astonishingly good throughout this entire run.

678
00:31:09.359 --> 00:31:12.420
He's given some pretty thankless kind of...

679
00:31:12.539 --> 00:31:16.619
I mean, this is quite a good sitcom episode, but I know that a lot

680
00:31:16.619 --> 00:31:19.980
of the Ferengi episodes are not particularly popular.

681
00:31:20.039 --> 00:31:24.900
And we did roll profit and lace, I think, last time and rejected

682
00:31:24.900 --> 00:31:25.200
it.

683
00:31:25.259 --> 00:31:27.779
Well, you know, I've got a theory about that as well.

684
00:31:27.839 --> 00:31:33.180
I think that the Ferengi episodes are unpopular in America, because

685
00:31:33.180 --> 00:31:38.220
I've read a few American review sites where and Jammers reviews is

686
00:31:38.220 --> 00:31:41.759
one, where they're really not popular at all, whereas in England, I

687
00:31:41.759 --> 00:31:45.359
remember in a lot of magazines at the time, these were all really

688
00:31:45.359 --> 00:31:46.079
quite popular.

689
00:31:46.140 --> 00:31:50.339
And a lot of the Ferengi humour is very much like an English

690
00:31:50.339 --> 00:31:51.000
sitcom.

691
00:31:51.059 --> 00:31:51.599
Right.

692
00:31:51.599 --> 00:31:54.539
It's pointing out the failings of society.

693
00:31:54.599 --> 00:31:57.299
American sitcoms are all about, you know, like celebrating how

694
00:31:57.299 --> 00:32:01.440
fabulous we are and overplaying jokes and walking in a room and

695
00:32:01.440 --> 00:32:03.900
everyone's cheering and in it boring.

696
00:32:03.960 --> 00:32:06.240
Whereas English sitcoms, think of things like one foot in the

697
00:32:06.240 --> 00:32:08.700
grave and things like that, it's talking about like the darker

698
00:32:08.700 --> 00:32:10.619
side of human nature.

699
00:32:10.680 --> 00:32:12.960
And the Ferengi episodes lean into that.

700
00:32:12.960 --> 00:32:16.859
And there's also like repeated sayings in Ferengi episodes that

701
00:32:16.859 --> 00:32:18.299
that happens in English sitcoms as well.

702
00:32:18.660 --> 00:32:23.279
I think I think depending on where your audience is. and what

703
00:32:23.279 --> 00:32:23.940
they're used to watching.

704
00:32:24.059 --> 00:32:27.299
Well, depending on how you feel about bringing this.

705
00:32:27.359 --> 00:32:28.200
I really like them.

706
00:32:28.259 --> 00:32:31.319
I think they're very stagey, very theatrical, but just very

707
00:32:31.319 --> 00:32:31.859
witty.

708
00:32:31.980 --> 00:32:36.599
Um, and because there's always great actors like Armand Shimmerman

709
00:32:36.599 --> 00:32:39.240
Match Squad Chick, um, Aaron Eisenberg.

710
00:32:39.299 --> 00:32:43.319
I mean, if you've got a witty script and you've got great actors

711
00:32:43.319 --> 00:32:46.559
I'm there, you know, I think they're much better than people say.

712
00:32:46.619 --> 00:32:53.940
I think too that as sort of science fiction fans, we tend to want

713
00:32:53.940 --> 00:32:55.380
our shows not to be ridiculous.

714
00:32:55.440 --> 00:32:58.440
Like we don't want them to take place in a ridiculous world.

715
00:32:58.500 --> 00:33:01.079
And I kind of think that if you're watching Star Trek without

716
00:33:01.079 --> 00:33:01.740
attitude.

717
00:33:01.799 --> 00:33:05.579
You're going to be kind of constantly disappointed because we've

718
00:33:05.579 --> 00:33:08.519
just had this whole episode where people with latex on their face

719
00:33:08.519 --> 00:33:10.559
are kind of shouting at one another and stuff.

720
00:33:10.619 --> 00:33:13.200
You know, the premise is inherently ridiculous, I think.

721
00:33:13.259 --> 00:33:15.420
I wouldn't suggest that they watch lower decks then.

722
00:33:15.480 --> 00:33:16.619
Well, that's it.

723
00:33:16.680 --> 00:33:20.039
That's why I love lower decks as well, because lower decks

724
00:33:20.039 --> 00:33:24.119
absolutely kind of makes the universe ridiculous.

725
00:33:24.180 --> 00:33:26.099
Or leads into how ridiculous it is.

726
00:33:26.160 --> 00:33:27.480
I know you as well.

727
00:33:27.539 --> 00:33:32.339
I know you really like fun over the top stuff, which, you know, the

728
00:33:32.339 --> 00:33:33.180
Ferengi episodes are.

729
00:33:33.299 --> 00:33:36.779
When you and I were talking about like a top 10 list of Star Trek

730
00:33:36.779 --> 00:33:37.200
episodes.

731
00:33:37.259 --> 00:33:40.380
You are throwing out things like Bada Bing, Bada bang, and take me

732
00:33:40.380 --> 00:33:43.140
out to the hollow suite, which, you know, are literally unique to

733
00:33:43.140 --> 00:33:44.099
your list, I think.

734
00:33:44.160 --> 00:33:45.720
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

735
00:33:45.779 --> 00:33:50.579
Yeah. just kind of leaning into the ones that have fun, you know

736
00:33:50.579 --> 00:33:52.980
and do fun things with the characters.

737
00:33:53.759 --> 00:33:57.240
But it's always nice because then the actors get to loosen up a

738
00:33:57.240 --> 00:33:57.420
bit.

739
00:33:57.480 --> 00:33:58.559
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

740
00:33:58.619 --> 00:33:59.579
And that's always fun.

741
00:33:59.640 --> 00:34:01.799
I mean, look at the end of better being better bang, for God's

742
00:34:01.799 --> 00:34:03.900
sake, with Avery singing.

743
00:34:03.960 --> 00:34:05.039
So tremendous.

744
00:34:05.099 --> 00:34:08.579
To some people, though, that would be the Nadir on Star Trek, you

745
00:34:08.579 --> 00:34:08.760
know.

746
00:34:08.820 --> 00:34:10.500
No, I love that star.

747
00:34:10.500 --> 00:34:11.159
It's beautiful.

748
00:34:11.219 --> 00:34:12.119
Just awesome.

749
00:34:13.619 --> 00:34:17.280
He should have met our forces in battle, she said.

750
00:34:20.340 --> 00:34:22.559
Oh, dear, this blocking is so great.

751
00:34:22.619 --> 00:34:24.960
I love it when characters talk to the back of each other's heads.

752
00:34:25.079 --> 00:34:26.699
No one ever does that in that.

753
00:34:26.760 --> 00:34:29.460
There is a lot of that in 90s track.

754
00:34:29.639 --> 00:34:31.380
Unfortunately.

755
00:34:31.440 --> 00:34:34.019
It's just where TV was at the time, though, wasn't it?

756
00:34:34.079 --> 00:34:34.920
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

757
00:34:34.980 --> 00:34:36.239
No, no, it's standard.

758
00:34:36.300 --> 00:34:41.639
And see, I really, really like this because she is really warming

759
00:34:41.639 --> 00:34:42.059
to him.

760
00:34:42.239 --> 00:34:45.300
He's starting to like her.

761
00:34:45.360 --> 00:34:51.659
She's smiling and really like really warmly and genuinely as... when

762
00:34:51.659 --> 00:34:52.980
you think she's coming in for a kiss.

763
00:34:53.099 --> 00:34:53.880
Oh yeah.

764
00:34:54.599 --> 00:34:58.320
I really am very grateful for all you've done, Quark.

765
00:34:58.380 --> 00:35:01.739
That is why I'm going to let you take your hand off my thigh

766
00:35:01.739 --> 00:35:06.000
instead of shattering every bone in your body.

767
00:35:06.059 --> 00:35:07.559
Oh my god.

768
00:35:07.559 --> 00:35:11.099
She smiles at the end of it and he laughs like she doesn't play it

769
00:35:11.099 --> 00:35:12.239
as a threat at all.

770
00:35:12.300 --> 00:35:13.800
Oh, good.

771
00:35:15.119 --> 00:35:17.639
Let's go talk to the council.

772
00:35:17.760 --> 00:35:19.559
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

773
00:35:19.619 --> 00:35:21.960
They go off like a happily married couple.

774
00:35:22.320 --> 00:35:24.539
It's so tremendous.

775
00:35:24.599 --> 00:35:27.360
And look, he talks about column J.

776
00:35:27.420 --> 00:35:31.619
So these people all have iPhones in this scene and they have Excel

777
00:35:31.619 --> 00:35:37.619
on them and he's directing their attention to the figures in

778
00:35:37.619 --> 00:35:38.340
column J.

779
00:35:38.400 --> 00:35:40.139
It's so tremendously great.

780
00:35:41.099 --> 00:35:45.420
There's just the look on Garon's face, like the sheer astonishment

781
00:35:45.420 --> 00:35:45.719
you know?

782
00:35:46.320 --> 00:35:50.039
He hurls his iPhone seeks to the floor.

783
00:35:50.099 --> 00:35:53.519
It just goes to show that Robert O'Reilly is capable of doing like

784
00:35:53.519 --> 00:35:56.099
really good comedy, you know, and they haven't lent into that

785
00:35:56.099 --> 00:35:56.639
until this point.

786
00:35:56.880 --> 00:36:01.739
Whereas this, I'm sorry, this, the gore, that's an entirely comic

787
00:36:01.739 --> 00:36:03.420
performance from beginning to end, you know?

788
00:36:03.480 --> 00:36:06.539
Yeah, yeah. because it's just giant and blustering and he's like a

789
00:36:06.539 --> 00:36:09.960
big stupid Klingon, like in a ridiculous Klingon.

790
00:36:10.019 --> 00:36:11.519
I think he's really terrific.

791
00:36:11.579 --> 00:36:13.500
And he ends up sort of being the butter thing.

792
00:36:13.559 --> 00:36:16.619
Do you know, there was there was actually no intention to bring

793
00:36:16.619 --> 00:36:18.719
Garon over to DS 9.

794
00:36:18.780 --> 00:36:22.739
Ron Moore insists. and there's a quote from Ira Bear saying that

795
00:36:22.739 --> 00:36:25.800
he thinks that Ron Moore and Gowron. got a secret pact that

796
00:36:25.800 --> 00:36:27.300
they're going to go everywhere together.

797
00:36:27.360 --> 00:36:30.900
And then he says, well, they've never been seen together.

798
00:36:30.960 --> 00:36:33.179
I think Ron might actually be Gal Rob.

799
00:36:36.059 --> 00:36:37.980
Oh, okay.

800
00:36:38.039 --> 00:36:39.179
Bringing in Rob.

801
00:36:39.239 --> 00:36:40.860
So you need a new element now, don't you?

802
00:36:40.920 --> 00:36:43.500
Because things are kind of starting to resolve, so you need a

803
00:36:43.500 --> 00:36:44.219
complication.

804
00:36:44.280 --> 00:36:47.519
Um, Oh, I love Rob so much.

805
00:36:47.579 --> 00:36:50.400
And the scene in a 2nd where he's like, right, we're going to go.

806
00:36:50.460 --> 00:36:51.900
Oh it's just been out where we're going to go.

807
00:36:51.960 --> 00:36:52.980
We're gonna leave her to it.

808
00:36:53.039 --> 00:36:55.980
And Grillka's like, um, he's like, yeah, what do I owe?

809
00:36:56.039 --> 00:36:56.940
I don't know her anything like that.

810
00:36:57.000 --> 00:36:59.400
And Rom's agreeing with him at every single point.

811
00:36:59.460 --> 00:37:03.719
But the look on Rom's face is basically saying to Cork, you've got

812
00:37:03.719 --> 00:37:04.139
to stay.

813
00:37:04.199 --> 00:37:06.659
You're better than this, like help her out, you know?

814
00:37:06.719 --> 00:37:13.440
I actually think it's also being played in that way by Shimmerman

815
00:37:13.440 --> 00:37:13.800
too.

816
00:37:13.860 --> 00:37:15.840
So he's sneaking off.

817
00:37:15.900 --> 00:37:18.179
He hasn't learnt a valuable lesson about honour.

818
00:37:18.239 --> 00:37:21.719
He sees his life, you know, under threat, and so he's going to

819
00:37:21.719 --> 00:37:22.800
kind of disappear.

820
00:37:22.920 --> 00:37:27.420
But, and he's explaining it here, to Grillka, and Grillka is

821
00:37:27.420 --> 00:37:28.739
telling him to kind of piss off.

822
00:37:29.340 --> 00:37:36.119
But as he talks about abandoning her and, you know, what does it

823
00:37:36.119 --> 00:37:36.360
matter?

824
00:37:36.420 --> 00:37:39.900
It's just one woman's house falling and you can sense him trying

825
00:37:39.900 --> 00:37:40.800
to convince himself.

826
00:37:40.860 --> 00:37:45.000
Like he's not, he isn't just straightforwardly saying, I'm bailing

827
00:37:45.000 --> 00:37:45.360
here.

828
00:37:45.420 --> 00:37:48.900
He is actually realising that it matters to him.

829
00:37:48.960 --> 00:37:50.159
What happens to her?

830
00:37:50.219 --> 00:37:51.840
Did you hear that insult?

831
00:37:51.900 --> 00:37:52.559
How cutting?

832
00:37:52.619 --> 00:37:56.280
All you've got, instead of a heart, is a piece of latter, and it's

833
00:37:56.280 --> 00:38:02.039
a pretty small one at that. don't lean into that interpretation

834
00:38:02.039 --> 00:38:03.300
but it's clearly in the script.

835
00:38:03.360 --> 00:38:05.340
You know exactly what she's saying there.

836
00:38:05.400 --> 00:38:06.360
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

837
00:38:10.380 --> 00:38:14.039
Yeah, so look, he's saying, all right, let's go.

838
00:38:14.099 --> 00:38:16.079
Like, he's convincing himself to go.

839
00:38:16.199 --> 00:38:20.880
And he's almost kind of goading ROM, who will say whatever, you

840
00:38:20.880 --> 00:38:24.780
know, he thinks Quack wants to hear, like goading ROM into making

841
00:38:24.780 --> 00:38:25.980
it okay for him to go.

842
00:38:27.900 --> 00:38:32.039
Like, she's trying to make us feel guilty because he obviously

843
00:38:32.039 --> 00:38:33.059
feels guilty.

844
00:38:33.119 --> 00:38:33.659
It's terrific.

845
00:38:33.780 --> 00:38:37.980
Max Grunging has this amazing way of looking totally dense with

846
00:38:37.980 --> 00:38:38.699
nuance.

847
00:38:38.760 --> 00:38:43.019
I don't know how he does it. terrific.

848
00:38:43.079 --> 00:38:46.320
Yes, that look where he just sort of gives him side eye just to

849
00:38:46.320 --> 00:38:49.079
check. whether he's gonna do the right thing or not.

850
00:38:49.139 --> 00:38:49.559
Come on.

851
00:38:49.619 --> 00:38:50.699
Are you really going to do this?

852
00:38:51.780 --> 00:38:54.000
Oh, dear God.

853
00:38:54.059 --> 00:38:59.219
And this is, this is my favourite scene of the whole pizza, the

854
00:38:59.219 --> 00:39:04.320
climax, where Quark absolutely just refuses to use the ballet and

855
00:39:04.320 --> 00:39:05.579
throws it aside straight away.

856
00:39:05.639 --> 00:39:10.800
And you know if you give Almond Shimmerman, a scene where he's

857
00:39:10.800 --> 00:39:14.460
basically going to bring down the Klingon empire and expose them.

858
00:39:14.519 --> 00:39:17.400
He's absolutely going to nail it and he does.

859
00:39:18.780 --> 00:39:19.920
There's Garon looking crazy.

860
00:39:21.719 --> 00:39:25.199
Yeah, and so we think Quark was going to bail here.

861
00:39:25.260 --> 00:39:28.199
Notice the difference in the way that he just strides into the

862
00:39:28.199 --> 00:39:32.280
room whereas he was kind of, you know, he looked uncomfortable in

863
00:39:32.280 --> 00:39:34.980
the robes, he looked like an idiot, and now he just kind of

864
00:39:34.980 --> 00:39:37.380
strides in, and the camera loves him.

865
00:39:37.440 --> 00:39:37.800
Look at that.

866
00:39:37.980 --> 00:39:41.460
And I think as well, like, they're trying to sell you on the idea

867
00:39:41.460 --> 00:39:44.159
that he's actually genuinely going to fight him, you know, which

868
00:39:44.159 --> 00:39:46.980
makes the moment where he throws the bat lift more impactful.

869
00:39:47.039 --> 00:39:49.980
I really like De Gore, son of whatever.

870
00:39:49.980 --> 00:39:55.500
Like, the other Klingons play it like it's the worst possible

871
00:39:55.500 --> 00:39:56.579
insult.

872
00:39:56.639 --> 00:39:59.940
In the last scene, we had the worst insult you could say to a

873
00:39:59.940 --> 00:40:00.539
Ferengi.

874
00:40:00.599 --> 00:40:02.820
Now we've got the worst insult you can say to a Klingon.

875
00:40:02.880 --> 00:40:04.619
All you need is someone to go.

876
00:40:06.360 --> 00:40:10.860
I think we throw to a reaction of some of the assembled kind of

877
00:40:10.860 --> 00:40:14.039
guest actors in Klingon makeup trying to look concerned.

878
00:40:14.099 --> 00:40:15.420
It's awesome.

879
00:40:15.480 --> 00:40:16.920
Yep, there he goes.

880
00:40:16.980 --> 00:40:17.579
He's thrown it.

881
00:40:17.639 --> 00:40:19.500
In fact, I'm sure they are.

882
00:40:19.500 --> 00:40:24.000
The, the, the, the, is quoted as saying that he loved the script

883
00:40:24.000 --> 00:40:29.699
because it allowed Quark to be heroic, but absolutely be himself.

884
00:40:29.760 --> 00:40:30.900
Yeah.

885
00:40:30.960 --> 00:40:33.000
And he doesn't get to do that very often, does he?

886
00:40:33.059 --> 00:40:37.440
Like there's there's a bit later on in series 6 where he has to be

887
00:40:37.440 --> 00:40:41.159
the one to help rescue them all so Rom can bring down the

888
00:40:41.159 --> 00:40:42.300
minefield.

889
00:40:42.360 --> 00:40:45.719
And and Rob's going to Cork, like, you know, you've got to do it.

890
00:40:45.780 --> 00:40:47.760
The fate of the whole alpha quadrant is on your shoulders.

891
00:40:47.760 --> 00:40:49.679
And he's like, well, boy, are they going to be disappointed?

892
00:40:49.739 --> 00:40:52.440
You always know he's going to come good.

893
00:40:52.500 --> 00:40:53.159
You just know.

894
00:40:53.280 --> 00:40:54.719
Yeah, yeah, of course he is.

895
00:40:54.780 --> 00:40:55.440
Of course he is.

896
00:40:55.500 --> 00:40:58.079
Because he can't lose our sympathy.

897
00:40:58.139 --> 00:41:00.659
But he, here it is.

898
00:41:00.719 --> 00:41:05.039
It's the opposite of what Riker does in a matter of honour, which

899
00:41:05.039 --> 00:41:07.500
is step up and start beating the crap out of them.

900
00:41:07.559 --> 00:41:10.079
Do you think there's an assumption that people have watched that?

901
00:41:10.139 --> 00:41:17.340
No, but I do think that I do think that it's a proper Ferengi way

902
00:41:17.340 --> 00:41:17.760
of doing it.

903
00:41:17.820 --> 00:41:24.179
He doesn't learn about Klingon culture so that he can operate on

904
00:41:24.179 --> 00:41:24.900
their terms.

905
00:41:24.960 --> 00:41:29.400
He learns about their culture and then is still completely himself

906
00:41:29.400 --> 00:41:31.079
in the way that he brings it down.

907
00:41:31.139 --> 00:41:37.079
So again, we've already established that an honourable death is

908
00:41:37.079 --> 00:41:39.900
different from an accidental one.

909
00:41:39.960 --> 00:41:42.780
And so that's the only option that he leaves de gore.

910
00:41:42.840 --> 00:41:45.300
It's like you don't get to kill me in battle.

911
00:41:45.360 --> 00:41:47.699
Uh, you'll just have to.

912
00:41:47.760 --> 00:41:48.659
I'm not going to fight you.

913
00:41:48.719 --> 00:41:51.539
You'll just have to murder me and obviously you won't get any

914
00:41:51.539 --> 00:41:52.199
honour from that.

915
00:41:52.260 --> 00:41:55.619
And so he's understood the rules of honour, but he doesn't kind of

916
00:41:55.619 --> 00:41:56.159
play along.

917
00:41:56.219 --> 00:41:59.460
But I think more people should do this. you know, point out.

918
00:41:59.519 --> 00:42:02.099
I think Edgerie does this in series 7 where she says the whole

919
00:42:02.099 --> 00:42:05.519
thing about Clinton Society is a massive facade and you basically

920
00:42:05.519 --> 00:42:09.239
just murder each other when you murder your way into power, you

921
00:42:09.239 --> 00:42:10.920
know, like more people need to say this to them.

922
00:42:10.980 --> 00:42:12.239
Have a look at this.

923
00:42:12.300 --> 00:42:17.519
So this is the discommendation scene that Warf undergoes in Star

924
00:42:17.519 --> 00:42:19.559
Trek the Next Generation. see them there.

925
00:42:19.619 --> 00:42:20.699
They're so bloody dramatic.

926
00:42:20.760 --> 00:42:23.099
Arms up and alternating their backs on him, you know?

927
00:42:23.159 --> 00:42:26.579
But it's this big giant moment, but instead it's done for this

928
00:42:26.579 --> 00:42:30.719
sort of schlubby loser comedy character who's just been defeated

929
00:42:30.719 --> 00:42:31.380
by Quark.

930
00:42:31.440 --> 00:42:34.980
And Gowron's line of, you know, if you can tell me, you can stand

931
00:42:34.980 --> 00:42:37.500
there and murder that pathetic little man.

932
00:42:37.500 --> 00:42:38.639
It's so great.

933
00:42:38.699 --> 00:42:42.840
I actually quite like how Garon kneels down so that they're at eye

934
00:42:42.840 --> 00:42:43.679
level as well.

935
00:42:43.739 --> 00:42:45.000
I think that's really great.

936
00:42:45.059 --> 00:42:47.340
Well, and he brings him up, doesn't he, as well?

937
00:42:47.400 --> 00:42:48.000
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

938
00:42:48.000 --> 00:42:49.079
Brings him up to his.

939
00:42:49.380 --> 00:42:51.539
What I really like about this.

940
00:42:51.599 --> 00:42:54.539
This is a very this is a very gentle comedy.

941
00:42:54.599 --> 00:42:58.260
There are more obvious DS9 comedy, as you go, Arman Bashir, take

942
00:42:58.260 --> 00:43:00.539
me out to the whole suite. things like that.

943
00:43:00.599 --> 00:43:02.519
This is all rooted in character here.

944
00:43:02.579 --> 00:43:06.420
It's not like some massive high concept comedy, is it, that they

945
00:43:06.420 --> 00:43:07.079
would do later on.

946
00:43:07.139 --> 00:43:08.460
Yeah, yeah.

947
00:43:08.519 --> 00:43:12.780
But it's a classic sitcom in that, you know, he tells a lie that

948
00:43:12.780 --> 00:43:18.780
gets out of control. he ends up in a situation that's uncongenial

949
00:43:18.780 --> 00:43:19.320
to him.

950
00:43:19.380 --> 00:43:21.360
He works out the rules and he gets out of it.

951
00:43:21.420 --> 00:43:25.619
And yeah, so it's a standard plot. could literally be the pilot of

952
00:43:25.619 --> 00:43:26.519
a sitcom, isn't it?

953
00:43:26.579 --> 00:43:28.500
There are so many sitcoms where you have the odd couple coming

954
00:43:28.500 --> 00:43:31.380
together and learning to navigate life.

955
00:43:31.440 --> 00:43:35.280
And we get there for one episode, but with Mira K. Adams and Arman

956
00:43:35.280 --> 00:43:35.760
and Shimmerman.

957
00:43:35.820 --> 00:43:36.119
How wonderful.

958
00:43:36.239 --> 00:43:38.280
Well, I think it's, I love this.

959
00:43:38.340 --> 00:43:39.119
Where she hits him.

960
00:43:39.179 --> 00:43:40.679
It's on him.

961
00:43:40.739 --> 00:43:42.179
That's it.

962
00:43:42.239 --> 00:43:43.019
That was a divorce.

963
00:43:43.079 --> 00:43:45.659
Everything's so violent in Klingon society.

964
00:43:46.019 --> 00:43:48.900
Oh, and this is the kiss.

965
00:43:48.960 --> 00:43:51.059
Like that's so great.

966
00:43:51.119 --> 00:43:54.300
And then she smiles gorgeously.

967
00:43:54.360 --> 00:43:57.659
And you see, she she held onto his bottom lip a little bit there.

968
00:43:57.719 --> 00:44:00.360
Oh, she got disentangled the teeth.

969
00:44:01.619 --> 00:44:03.659
Deep got caught.

970
00:44:03.719 --> 00:44:07.139
And then and then quite gives this, I've still got it, smile.

971
00:44:07.199 --> 00:44:08.699
Have a look at what he does here.

972
00:44:10.139 --> 00:44:12.179
Well, I mean, they revisit this, don't they?

973
00:44:12.239 --> 00:44:17.460
They revisit this in series 5. lovingly rubbing the cheek that she

974
00:44:17.460 --> 00:44:17.699
hit.

975
00:44:19.440 --> 00:44:24.300
Oh, and this sequence at the end between Cork and Rom.

976
00:44:24.360 --> 00:44:25.380
Oh no, we're not quite there yet.

977
00:44:25.440 --> 00:44:26.760
It's KK O'Brien first.

978
00:44:26.820 --> 00:44:29.400
Off you go to do your movies, Rosvin Chow.

979
00:44:29.460 --> 00:44:30.840
Yeah, did she do movies?

980
00:44:30.900 --> 00:44:32.099
What does she do?

981
00:44:32.159 --> 00:44:35.159
I've no idea, but she has done an awful lot.

982
00:44:35.219 --> 00:44:38.940
I've seen her turn up in like, I say bit parts, you know, 2 or 3

983
00:44:38.940 --> 00:44:41.519
scenes in a lot of movies, you know, she's one, I think she's one

984
00:44:41.519 --> 00:44:42.659
of those actresses who's never at work.

985
00:44:42.960 --> 00:44:45.179
I think she is really great.

986
00:44:45.239 --> 00:44:53.099
It is, you know, Uh, She is frequently absent from Deep Space 9

987
00:44:53.099 --> 00:44:53.460
isn't she?

988
00:44:53.519 --> 00:44:55.800
She is after this.

989
00:44:55.860 --> 00:44:58.619
She comes back to that period where Kira's pregnant.

990
00:44:58.679 --> 00:44:59.940
Oh yeah, okay.

991
00:44:59.940 --> 00:45:00.840
With her baby.

992
00:45:00.900 --> 00:45:01.920
Oh, yes, of course.

993
00:45:01.920 --> 00:45:05.579
She's around for about half a season there and then after Kira has

994
00:45:05.579 --> 00:45:05.940
the baby.

995
00:45:06.000 --> 00:45:09.179
I think she's in 2 episodes after that and then that's all we

996
00:45:09.179 --> 00:45:09.659
feel.

997
00:45:09.719 --> 00:45:10.619
She kind of disappears.

998
00:45:10.679 --> 00:45:11.219
Yeah, yeah.

999
00:45:11.579 --> 00:45:15.659
She has like a one scene moment in the last episode just to remind

1000
00:45:15.659 --> 00:45:19.320
us all that she exists. and O'Brien has a family and all of this.

1001
00:45:19.380 --> 00:45:20.519
I do like this though.

1002
00:45:20.579 --> 00:45:23.880
I think and I think DS9 leans into this quite a bit of, um, this

1003
00:45:23.880 --> 00:45:24.840
does happen, doesn't it?

1004
00:45:24.900 --> 00:45:27.360
Like, like, people do go to work in other countries and things

1005
00:45:27.360 --> 00:45:30.300
like that and but families still take, and they find a way to work

1006
00:45:30.300 --> 00:45:31.019
around it and.

1007
00:45:32.219 --> 00:45:35.519
Yeah, it's not, okay, this subplot's not going to set anyone's

1008
00:45:35.519 --> 00:45:35.940
world on fire.

1009
00:45:36.000 --> 00:45:36.840
No, no.

1010
00:45:36.900 --> 00:45:38.880
And it is very sort of linear and straightforward.

1011
00:45:39.000 --> 00:45:45.179
I guess the best thing is, is Julian's thing earlier on where he

1012
00:45:45.179 --> 00:45:50.460
says you're giving her a hobby and she needs a job, to read proper

1013
00:45:50.460 --> 00:45:50.940
purpose.

1014
00:45:51.000 --> 00:45:55.440
She can't just be dicking around in a in a spare cargo bay.

1015
00:45:55.500 --> 00:45:57.179
And I kind of like that.

1016
00:45:57.239 --> 00:46:01.139
I, this subplot has a function and it fulfils that function and

1017
00:46:01.139 --> 00:46:03.780
that's to get her gone so they can explore that friendship between

1018
00:46:03.780 --> 00:46:04.920
Bashir and O'Brien.

1019
00:46:04.980 --> 00:46:09.480
There are plenty of B plots that are just there to kill time, you

1020
00:46:09.480 --> 00:46:09.719
know?

1021
00:46:09.780 --> 00:46:10.320
Yeah.

1022
00:46:10.320 --> 00:46:14.400
Thematically, it's got nothing to do with the main plot as well, I

1023
00:46:14.400 --> 00:46:14.639
guess.

1024
00:46:14.699 --> 00:46:20.340
But in season 3 of DS9, there are some, there are way better B

1025
00:46:20.340 --> 00:46:20.760
plots.

1026
00:46:20.820 --> 00:46:23.760
Like there's one episode where the entire B plot is Nog trying to

1027
00:46:23.760 --> 00:46:26.460
bribe Cisco to get him into Starfleet.

1028
00:46:26.460 --> 00:46:28.800
That is just gorgeous.

1029
00:46:28.920 --> 00:46:29.340
Yeah.

1030
00:46:29.400 --> 00:46:31.079
I love this.

1031
00:46:31.139 --> 00:46:35.340
See, Rom is a terrible Ferengi, because he says, you know, there's

1032
00:46:35.340 --> 00:46:38.579
more to life than money or something like that, which is great.

1033
00:46:38.639 --> 00:46:42.539
But, you know, we circle background to the respect thing, you know

1034
00:46:42.539 --> 00:46:48.179
that, that, Quark was kind of revelling in the story that he'd

1035
00:46:48.179 --> 00:46:51.420
killed the Klingon, not just because it got his customers to come

1036
00:46:51.420 --> 00:46:54.780
back, but because it made him look cool.

1037
00:46:54.780 --> 00:46:56.219
And it's the same with this.

1038
00:46:56.280 --> 00:47:00.059
You know, now he's got a story where he was genuinely heroic and

1039
00:47:00.059 --> 00:47:03.719
stood up to a scary Klingon or knelt down in front of him anyway.

1040
00:47:03.840 --> 00:47:08.460
So, it's one of these things where it's sort of circulate.

1041
00:47:08.519 --> 00:47:11.280
He is in the same position at the end as he was at the beginning.

1042
00:47:11.340 --> 00:47:15.480
He has been kind of changed by the experience, but not that much

1043
00:47:15.480 --> 00:47:19.380
and he's still going to be the same loveable sitcom character that

1044
00:47:19.380 --> 00:47:20.940
he is in every episode.

1045
00:47:21.360 --> 00:47:25.260
The interesting thing about these two, though, is that no matter

1046
00:47:25.260 --> 00:47:29.340
how badly Cork treats from, and even when he says, like, I want

1047
00:47:29.340 --> 00:47:31.019
you to tell me a story and it's like, well, fine, I'm going to

1048
00:47:31.019 --> 00:47:31.920
take it out of your paycheque, though.

1049
00:47:31.980 --> 00:47:33.059
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right.

1050
00:47:33.119 --> 00:47:34.320
From loves him.

1051
00:47:34.380 --> 00:47:35.940
He just adores him.

1052
00:47:36.000 --> 00:47:38.820
And that never changes around, no matter how, and court got some

1053
00:47:38.820 --> 00:47:40.260
terrible things to him along the way.

1054
00:47:40.320 --> 00:47:43.260
And that leads us that beautifully.

1055
00:47:43.320 --> 00:47:46.260
I just think the 2 actors together are terrific.

1056
00:47:46.320 --> 00:47:48.119
Wasn't that fun?

1057
00:47:48.239 --> 00:47:49.320
That's a really fun.

1058
00:47:49.380 --> 00:47:50.639
It is really good.

1059
00:47:50.699 --> 00:47:54.179
And it's in exactly the right place in the season as well.

1060
00:47:54.239 --> 00:47:57.780
You know, we set up the threat and we have a big two-part event

1061
00:47:57.780 --> 00:48:01.500
and then we come back and just, you know, it's life on the station

1062
00:48:01.500 --> 00:48:05.219
and the crazy things that can, that Deep Space 9 can do.

1063
00:48:05.280 --> 00:48:06.539
I guess.

1064
00:48:06.840 --> 00:48:09.719
Do you remember what the other Ferengi episode is this season?

1065
00:48:10.619 --> 00:48:16.079
Uh, no, it's family business and that's in the last third.

1066
00:48:16.139 --> 00:48:17.460
It's the 1st one with Ishka.

1067
00:48:17.519 --> 00:48:20.579
Oh, okay.

1068
00:48:20.639 --> 00:48:21.840
She's dressed as a man or something?

1069
00:48:21.900 --> 00:48:22.679
Is that it?

1070
00:48:22.739 --> 00:48:24.960
Yeah, and it's almost in like the same position on the other end

1071
00:48:24.960 --> 00:48:25.440
of the season.

1072
00:48:25.500 --> 00:48:26.280
Right, right.

1073
00:48:26.340 --> 00:48:28.739
We kind of go a whole year without really catching up with them

1074
00:48:28.739 --> 00:48:29.159
that much.

1075
00:48:29.280 --> 00:48:34.199
I think this is a stronger episode, though, overall, I would say.

1076
00:48:34.260 --> 00:48:35.400
Yeah.

1077
00:48:39.719 --> 00:48:43.980
Why are you insisting that we do our Voyager episode for episode

1078
00:48:43.980 --> 00:48:44.400
three?

1079
00:48:44.460 --> 00:48:49.980
Well, I mean, we've done we've done next gen, we've done Deep

1080
00:48:49.980 --> 00:48:50.699
Space 9.

1081
00:48:50.760 --> 00:48:54.059
So the logical next step is to do Voyager.

1082
00:48:54.119 --> 00:48:57.119
And I think we said in our 1st episode that kind of 90s trek is

1083
00:48:57.119 --> 00:48:58.860
our one true love.

1084
00:48:59.579 --> 00:49:03.000
So I think we do need to do Voyager.

1085
00:49:03.059 --> 00:49:05.820
If we follow that pattern, you know where we're going next then

1086
00:49:05.820 --> 00:49:06.179
don't you?

1087
00:49:06.300 --> 00:49:07.920
Discovery.

1088
00:49:07.980 --> 00:49:10.139
No enterprise would be the next.

1089
00:49:10.199 --> 00:49:12.300
Oh my god, I've completely forgotten about enterprise.

1090
00:49:12.360 --> 00:49:13.380
Well, there's no rules.

1091
00:49:13.500 --> 00:49:16.920
We'll we'll come up with a different rationale next episode, I

1092
00:49:16.920 --> 00:49:17.219
reckon.

1093
00:49:18.059 --> 00:49:22.079
I am frothing at the mouth because I love pressing this button.

1094
00:49:22.139 --> 00:49:24.360
So you just tell me when to go.

1095
00:49:24.420 --> 00:49:28.860
Okay, so people at home, don't forget it's untitled Star Trek

1096
00:49:28.860 --> 00:49:32.820
Project.com slash randomiser and you can use it yourself.

1097
00:49:32.880 --> 00:49:35.280
We've only got Voyager selected, right?

1098
00:49:35.340 --> 00:49:36.960
Yeah, do yourself a favour.

1099
00:49:37.019 --> 00:49:38.099
You want this to work out well.

1100
00:49:38.159 --> 00:49:39.480
Don't just select voyager.

1101
00:49:39.539 --> 00:49:39.780
Okay.

1102
00:49:39.900 --> 00:49:40.199
Okay.

1103
00:49:40.260 --> 00:49:40.559
Right.

1104
00:49:40.619 --> 00:49:41.760
Let's, you ready for this?

1105
00:49:41.820 --> 00:49:42.539
I'm ready.

1106
00:49:44.340 --> 00:49:49.500
Ooh, okay, so it's selected prototype from season two.

1107
00:49:49.559 --> 00:49:54.360
That's the one where Balanatorius activates a appallingly designed

1108
00:49:54.360 --> 00:49:58.739
robot and there's a great big robot Civil War occurring.

1109
00:49:58.800 --> 00:49:59.280
Remember this one?

1110
00:49:59.340 --> 00:50:00.599
I actually do.

1111
00:50:00.659 --> 00:50:02.280
Yeah, I do remember.

1112
00:50:02.340 --> 00:50:05.340
It's directed by Jonathan Frakes, that one.

1113
00:50:05.400 --> 00:50:07.199
That also could look good.

1114
00:50:07.260 --> 00:50:07.980
What do you think?

1115
00:50:08.039 --> 00:50:09.780
It doesn't look good.

1116
00:50:09.840 --> 00:50:13.980
And Jonathan Frakes actually famously criticised the design of the

1117
00:50:13.980 --> 00:50:16.980
robots and cut away from them as much as he could.

1118
00:50:17.039 --> 00:50:18.719
I think I'm going to press the button again.

1119
00:50:18.780 --> 00:50:19.619
Oh, okay.

1120
00:50:20.940 --> 00:50:22.679
Oh my.

1121
00:50:22.739 --> 00:50:26.099
Okay, season 6 is the Voyager conspiracy.

1122
00:50:26.159 --> 00:50:27.840
Oh my god.

1123
00:50:27.900 --> 00:50:29.519
Do you remember that one?

1124
00:50:29.579 --> 00:50:30.960
Yeah, it's terrible.

1125
00:50:31.019 --> 00:50:35.159
It's basically 7 of 9 talking non-support, Jerry Ryan.

1126
00:50:35.219 --> 00:50:37.500
No wonder she preferred doing Picard.

1127
00:50:37.559 --> 00:50:38.099
I telling you now.

1128
00:50:38.159 --> 00:50:39.059
All right, let's press again.

1129
00:50:39.119 --> 00:50:40.440
Oh, no.

1130
00:50:40.500 --> 00:50:43.500
I mean, this would be a good place to start because it's a really

1131
00:50:43.500 --> 00:50:44.400
dreadful episode.

1132
00:50:44.460 --> 00:50:45.780
Is it threshold?

1133
00:50:45.840 --> 00:50:48.059
and the gray from season three.

1134
00:50:48.119 --> 00:50:49.860
With the cube.

1135
00:50:49.860 --> 00:50:51.960
Holodeck one, Civil War.

1136
00:50:52.019 --> 00:50:54.119
Yeah. no that's upsetting.

1137
00:50:54.239 --> 00:50:55.440
Okay, I'll push it again.

1138
00:50:55.500 --> 00:50:57.239
Oh gosh.

1139
00:50:57.300 --> 00:50:59.460
I mean, I don't know how we could have got worse.

1140
00:50:59.519 --> 00:51:04.019
We're now in a Harry Kim episode in series 5 called The Disease.

1141
00:51:04.739 --> 00:51:06.420
Do you remember?

1142
00:51:06.480 --> 00:51:09.719
That's the one where he goes up to chain where and he's like, for

1143
00:51:09.719 --> 00:51:13.019
5 years, I have said, yes, ma'am, and no, ma'am, to everything you

1144
00:51:13.019 --> 00:51:13.440
say.

1145
00:51:13.500 --> 00:51:14.400
Oh, it's just awful.

1146
00:51:14.460 --> 00:51:15.239
Okay, let's press again.

1147
00:51:15.300 --> 00:51:16.320
Okay.

1148
00:51:16.380 --> 00:51:18.599
No, no, this is a good place to start, I think.

1149
00:51:18.659 --> 00:51:20.639
Lineage in season 7.

1150
00:51:20.639 --> 00:51:25.920
And it's the episode where Tom and Blana find out that they're

1151
00:51:25.920 --> 00:51:26.519
having a baby.

1152
00:51:26.940 --> 00:51:30.059
Oh, I think I remember this.

1153
00:51:30.239 --> 00:51:33.539
It's typical, but it's extremely good.

1154
00:51:33.599 --> 00:51:35.820
It's very well written and it's very well acted.

1155
00:51:35.880 --> 00:51:37.019
Okay.

1156
00:51:37.079 --> 00:51:37.559
All right.

1157
00:51:37.619 --> 00:51:38.760
Well, I think we go with that then.

1158
00:51:38.880 --> 00:51:39.539
Lineage.

1159
00:51:39.599 --> 00:51:43.079
Okay, and it's one of the few moments in season 7 that is actually

1160
00:51:43.079 --> 00:51:43.559
worth watching.

1161
00:51:43.619 --> 00:51:44.940
So hurrah for us.

1162
00:51:54.000 --> 00:51:57.119
You've been listening to Untitled Star Trek project with Joe Ford

1163
00:51:57.119 --> 00:51:58.559
and Nathan Bottomley.

1164
00:51:58.619 --> 00:52:02.519
You can find us online at untitledstar trekproject.com where you

1165
00:52:02.519 --> 00:52:05.820
can find links to our Twitter, Facebook, and YouTube channel.

1166
00:52:05.880 --> 00:52:09.239
Our podcast artwork is by Kayla Ciceran, and the theme was

1167
00:52:09.239 --> 00:52:10.619
composed by Cameron Lamb.

1168
00:52:10.679 --> 00:52:15.059
This episode was recorded on the 27th of September 2021 and

1169
00:52:15.059 --> 00:52:16.619
released on the 12th of November.

1170
00:52:16.679 --> 00:52:20.519
We'll see you next time for Voyages lineage.