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This transcript was created on 2026-09-03 at 06:56:57

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Hey, Joe. Hi.

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So, we're back aboard Deep Space 9 this week.

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It's season five, episode 13 for the uniform, and it 1st aired on the 3rd of February, 1997.

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Now we've done the sequel to this already, Blaze of Glory, which was fabulous.

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Rebecca.

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Go save yourself.

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Oh, thank God, all the jemadar, myself.

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Well, isn't there he's not coming?

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Where's Michael?

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He's not coming.

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So that was terribly melodramatic.

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And we did spend some time that episode talking about this episode.

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So I'm kind of glad that we did it.

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I have some weird reservations about it, which I'll get to when we talk about it.

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But I had enormous fun.

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And I think we were talking off mic just now, and each of us has another Star Trek episode that we want to liken this one too.

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Yes, yes.

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I want to hear what your one is.

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Mine is equinox part two.

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Janeway goes on a mad mission to bring down Captain Ransom, but with 0 motivation, 0 cents, and at no point.

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Do you consider her actions rational or reasonable?

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And Ronald D. Moore was there going, but why is she doing this?

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I don't understand.

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She doesn't even know this man.

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She'd never met him before.

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Why is she trying to murder members of his crew in the cargo bait?

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And I think this is doing a similar sort of thing, right?

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The great revenge tale.

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This person has betrayed me and I'm going to go after them.

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All systems go.

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But within the episode.

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It does motivate Cisco.

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It does explain how he feels about Eddington.

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You know, he's a man like me.

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He came into my life.

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I got close to him.

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I invited him into my home and then he shut all over me.

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And understandably, that makes him a bit pissed.

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And I just think this is a better version of that story.

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So I think this is like the wounded.

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And you have Captain Maxwell in his ship going from place to place doing terrible things again to the Cardassians.

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And we need to come and talk to him and explain to him that he's doing the wrong thing and that he's misguided, that he's not the hero, that he believes himself to be.

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And I think here that this episode works best, in fact, when it doesn't look like Cisco is being motivated by a personal vendetta.

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And I think that why it's a bit cloudy is because, of course, the way that he solves this week's space problem is by pretending that he's motivated by a personal vendetta so that he can manipulate Eddington into doing what he wants him to do.

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And so there's some great scenes earlier on where he's super angry, but mostly I think he's angry with himself for being fooled.

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Oh, you think it's an ego thing?

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Well, it's not an ego thing because I think that that makes him look bad as well.

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And I think the scenes where he works really well in this episode, there's one hugely hot scene, which we'll get to, where we're in the hollow suite, and he's boxing and he's talking to Dax about how he feels.

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And it's a kind of slightly obvious scene because, of course, it's set up in such a way that you can see the anger and you can see the rage because he's doing boxing in the gym.

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But when he and Dax get together and work out how to make Eddington surrender, and they do it rationally and they do it quite calmly.

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And I think that that's pretty good.

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I like the scene with him and Sanders where Sanders is another Starfleet captain who actually gets given the task of hunting down Eddington and he's not a dick about it.

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You know, he clearly, and he says this to Dax later.

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He's really angry with himself that he got taken off this assignment and got given to someone else, but he's not that.

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He doesn't play it like that with Saunders.

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Do you know what I mean?

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The 2 men understand one another, and he's resigned to the fact that Sanders has been given this job.

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And so, like, I thought all of that was really good, but what I thought was really strange, particularly given the sort of thing that you said about Star Trek the Next Generation last week, is that this is very much a space problem procedural.

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It is almost exactly like the wounded.

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And in fact, they actually lean into it because the ship is damaged in an encounter with Eddington earlier in the episode.

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And the result of that is that they have to increase the levels of technobabble to deal with the fact that there's damage being done to the ship.

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And I'm not quite sure why they do that, but I think it works really well, and I enjoyed enormous amount, I think.

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I can cancel that because I also said about last week's episode was that there was no character work in it at all, which is true.

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And in this episode, we are bursting with character in pretty much every scene, even within those techno-apple scenes at times.

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Poor old Nog having to relay messages to everybody.

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And he's trying to be a waver in Galaxy Quest.

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I've got one job to do on this bridge and I've got to do it, but the way he tries to match the tones of everybody as well.

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When Cisco's pissed, he's like, edge of room, bridge.

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But within the Technobabble stuff, you know me, I just don't give a shit about Technobabble at all.

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But when you're doing fun things, like trying to stop the defiant crashing into the upper pylons and things like that, that's really fun.

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Like, fight, if they were doing stuff like that last week, I would have, I would have had a great time with it.

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But no, they were just towing some garbage scale.

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I can't remember.

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It's even left my head already.

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Yeah, yeah.

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But it is kind of funny where I was thinking, thank God, those ships are much more automated than this normally.

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So we don't have to hear every detail about every manoeuvring thruster that gets ignited or whatever.

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But within that as well.

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You get to see them all working together in that sequence, don't you?

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Where everyone's doing their beer and to stop them from crashing straight into the bylon and going off.

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So it sort of, it feels like a triumphant moment when they just literally get the defiant off away from the station.

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It does feel different.

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You're right.

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It is all tetababble again.

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But it's...

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I don't know why, but I liked it.

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Seeing in with character as well.

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So I'll give it a pass.

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I mean, I just love I love the character threadness.

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I love the fact that they introduced Eddington at the start of series 3, right?

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And then just sat on that character for a whole season and he had a couple of appearances in season 3 and then he makes his 1st move against Cisco in the two-parter, the Dyers cast and improbable cause, yeah?

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where Starfleet basically say to Eddington, you need to stop him going off to Cardassia and stopping them from destroying the founders.

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And so he sabotages the ship.

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But at the end of that episode, he sort of says, I'm really sorry I was under orders.

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It fine.

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But it puts a seed of doubt in your head of like, okay, there's a man with his own motive sometimes.

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Then, I don't know if you remember, in the adversary, there's a couple of scenes between Eddington and Cisco where they're talking about command and Eddington is basically saying I really wanted to be in command and I'm not satisfied with where I ended up.

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Then you jump into 4 and he's in episodes like, oh, man, Bashir, funny episodes.

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So, you know, he's part of the crew.

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He's part of the family, and then bam, they come along with for the cause, with the double whammy of Cisco's girlfriend, and his other security officer are both working technically for the marquee, which then leads into this.

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It's that type of long form character arc that I just think DS9 excels at in that.

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But this wasn't the plan, I don't think.

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I just think at some point along the line they went, we've got editing there why the hell don't we make him the head of the marquee?

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That's dramatic.

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I think that they probably make the decision around about the adversary.

106
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So towards the end of his 1st season.

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So he's in a total of 9 episodes and I haven't seen all that much of him, but I do think that that introduction is really great and I love the callback to it where Odo actually tells Cisco to remind Starfleet exactly why they appointed Eddington.

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Have you reminded them?

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No, please do.

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Yeah, that was pretty great.

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And I do think that that's awesome.

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They do attempt that obviously in Voyager with Jonas, don't they, having a kind of long-term character, but he doesn't really interact with any of our bridge crew.

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And so, you know, we just had a scene. from when he's joining to when he's exposed.

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But essentially, it's just him FaceTiming a Kazon every week or whatever, but nothing really comes of it and he doesn't have any obvious relationships with any of the main characters.

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And so, you know, it's a much less well crafted thing.

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It has a very kind of rural D more vibe to it.

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You know, that sort of whole idea of, and I guess Iris Stephen Bear does this as well, doesn't he?

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Where it's kind of like, well, what can we do with this character?

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We have this person.

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He's here semi-regularly.

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We think he's really good.

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Should we do something interesting with him?

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I just think they've got a sense of occasion as well, don't they?

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Like, like, in for the cause that, to spend the 1st half of the episode absolutely convincing you that casting is up to no good.

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You ain't even looking at editing, so not for a 2nd and then halfway through the episode, it just suddenly pulls out a phaser and shoots Kira.

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And you're like, what the hell is going on?

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And then they know, right, okay, fine.

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We'll leave it half a season.

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But when he comes back, we've got to make it an event, right?

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We've got to make it that Cisco's pissed, that Eddington is doing terrible things as the head of the marquee.

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And I don't know.

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I just think there's a sense of tension and a sense that things are coming to a head with the marquee in this episode, which I really like.

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So, I mean, the McCabe are a big deal, aren't they, kind of earlier on in Deep Space Nine?

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Series 2, isn't it, towards the end of series 2, yeah.

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Yeah.

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And obviously then they get spun off into Voyager, and that doesn't really kind of go anywhere.

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I have things that I'll say about them a key because I think they're a good idea and I might have said this actually when we did Blaze of Glory.

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I think they're a good idea in all sorts of ways.

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And I don't think they intend to use them to make a political point here.

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I think that this is character stuff, but I think that they can be used to make an interesting political point.

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And I think in that 2nd last episode of TNG, which I think is called preemptive strike, They are used, I think, to make a political point, which is an interesting one.

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And obviously, in Journey's end, I think they kind of emerge from the idea of the dispossessed First Nations Americans who are being ordered off their planet as usual because of real politic, because of, you know, proper grown up political decisions that need making.

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And I think all of that stuff's super interesting.

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But they aren't really interested in it here.

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And I guess that's why perhaps the McKee thing doesn't go anywhere particularly.

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We get some good episodes out of it.

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We get some mileage out of it.

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Macacity thing.

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Obviously, these 2 Addington episodes or the 3 including for the cause.

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But essentially, it ends up being a dead end and they decide to go in another direction.

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And that's fine.

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That's how this show works.

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I get the feeling that DS 9 was like, right, there's the batten, the Marquis Voyager, and then they realise pretty quickly, the Voyager's doing absolutely nothing with it at all.

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So they're like, well, we've established a thing.

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We kind of got to sew it out.

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Yeah, yeah.

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Like, you know, so when it's very clear because we're now what?

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Voyager 3, DS 95.

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So we're 3 seasons in and they're clearly not doing anything at all.

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They've abandoned the point, I think. of the marquee crew members on Voyager.

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So they do this pair of episodes in series 5 because DS9 is in a place where it can deal with consequences like this.

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The thing I like them using the marquee for, and I think it's something you and me kind of disagree on is how it punches the virtue of the Federation.

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And I really like that.

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I liken the marquis too parter that Cisco has that big speech about it's very easy to be a saint in paradise, but the marquis are living in paradise.

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And they've had their homes torn away from them.

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You get, at the end of for the cause, Eddington says, like, the Federation are worse than the Borg, you assimilate people and they don't even know it.

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And so I do like that angle with the marquee.

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But they're not doing that here because this is a character drama 1st and foremost.

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Well, I think I think that what it is, We see Ensign Rowe, we see maybe Wesley, we see Thomas Riker.

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We see people make the decision to join the McKee because the McKee are in the right.

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And the federation is kind of like proper grown up politicians who realise that when these sort of adult negotiations take place, sometimes concessions have to be made.

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Fortunately, no one at this table doing the negotiation will have to make those concessions.

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It would be other people on different planets.

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And that's, it's like America.

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This is like, you know, and that's what Deep State sometimes does, is to critique a version of the Federation that's essentially America, and to do it from the left, where, you know, you've got a sort of liberal centrist federation that is made of serious, important grown-ups who know that decisions have to be made.

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But essentially, Michael Eddington is right, and what he does, it seems to me to be fine.

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And the one thing, the one moment where we kind of have a discussion about that is like early on in the episode where Eddington says, are you angry that I left Starfleet, or are you angry that it happened on my watch?

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And he said, you didn't leave Starfleet, you know, you stayed and you gave them information, you stayed and you betrayed us.

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And that implied to me, that if Eddington had said, actually, I'm out, what we're doing is wrong and I'm going to fight for the McKee, the way that Ensign Roe did.

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I think that, you know, Cisco wouldn't have had the problem that he had.

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And that seems to be there in the dialogue.

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But this episode doesn't lean into the fact that the Makea in the right.

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And in fact, Eddington is seen as being diluded and melodramatic and victimising these people by giving them false hope and all of those sorts of things, negative things that are said about him in a way that makes me think that they're not interested in using the McKee in the way that I kind of, I kind of like how that can be.

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I mean, I don't think that somebody like Eddington couldn't emerge from a good cause, someone who is deluded, who wants to be a celebrity who wants to be seen as the man of the people and all of this.

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I do quite like that.

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Hang on, certainly Kenneth Marshall leans into it, amazingly in this episode, arms wide.

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As well.

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I do understand what you're saying about Cisco in this.

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I don't mind these people being really flawed.

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I don't mind him being angry that he's been fooled or that he seems a bit pathetic because he's going off on a vendetta because his ego's been bruised and things like that and I know these people should be better than all of this.

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But actually, I like the parts of this episode where I'm going, I don't know that you're right.

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I'm not sure why what you're doing is actually the right thing to happen here.

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I like that.

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I like that sort of discomfort watching it.

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I have basically no problem with what he does to that Marquis colony.

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That seems to me, to be perfectly reasonable.

197
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But it's the personal grudge thing, which I find annoying.

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And he isn't always playing it like that.

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And certainly by the end of the episode in his interactions on the bridge of the Defiant with Eddington.

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He is much calmer.

201
00:17:36.480 --> 00:17:39.900
And he does land some blows on him and stuff like that.

202
00:17:39.960 --> 00:17:42.839
But, you know, that final scene is just him acting, isn't it?

203
00:17:42.900 --> 00:17:45.000
Like I'm Javert and I'm super evil.

204
00:17:45.599 --> 00:17:47.039
You know, which is awesome.

205
00:17:47.279 --> 00:17:48.119
That's tremendous.

206
00:17:48.180 --> 00:17:48.720
I love that.

207
00:17:50.039 --> 00:17:53.460
You better prepare yourself some quotes during that scene, all right.

208
00:17:53.460 --> 00:17:54.180
So good.

209
00:17:55.440 --> 00:17:59.339
Before we press play, like, this has been a really interesting conversation.

210
00:17:59.400 --> 00:18:02.940
Like, it was clearly an exercise worth doing the marquee, wasn't it?

211
00:18:03.000 --> 00:18:03.599
Oh, yeah, yeah.

212
00:18:03.599 --> 00:18:13.440
Because the character choices that people make, the moral arguments that people get to have, like, they stirred the pot in a really interesting way.

213
00:18:13.920 --> 00:18:14.940
I'm pleased they did it.

214
00:18:15.000 --> 00:18:17.700
It's much better than like introducing the mail on or something.

215
00:18:17.759 --> 00:18:18.599
Do you know what I mean?

216
00:18:18.660 --> 00:18:20.400
Like it's a only, you know?

217
00:18:25.319 --> 00:18:26.759
Oh, well, come on now.

218
00:18:26.819 --> 00:18:32.160
I'm going to try not to get too hot and bothered in this episode of this testosterone flying about the place. pretty great.

219
00:18:32.759 --> 00:18:34.440
Okay, I will count us in.

220
00:18:35.400 --> 00:18:41.579
Five, four, three, two, one, and we are off.

221
00:18:42.359 --> 00:18:43.500
Stockcave set one.

222
00:18:44.640 --> 00:18:46.200
Of course, of course.

223
00:18:46.859 --> 00:18:48.059
Very dark, isn't it?

224
00:18:48.240 --> 00:18:48.720
Yeah.

225
00:18:48.960 --> 00:18:58.200
I have to say, it's funny that this is called for the uniform, and the 1st thing that we see, Cisco, is wandering through caves, not in a uniform.

226
00:18:59.940 --> 00:19:01.319
I think that's clearly a choice.

227
00:19:01.980 --> 00:19:03.000
He looks pretty cool.

228
00:19:03.059 --> 00:19:09.119
And I like the fact that we do see these refugees living at hardship, right, at the start.

229
00:19:10.440 --> 00:19:11.160
Well, yes.

230
00:19:11.339 --> 00:19:11.759
Yes.

231
00:19:13.619 --> 00:19:14.339
Okay.

232
00:19:14.880 --> 00:19:17.940
What would you rather have those CGI people from Enterprise?

233
00:19:18.180 --> 00:19:18.960
The outlines?

234
00:19:19.319 --> 00:19:20.579
It's actually not too bad.

235
00:19:20.880 --> 00:19:22.019
It isn't too bad.

236
00:19:22.140 --> 00:19:23.700
There are some refugee camps.

237
00:19:23.759 --> 00:19:25.980
I do think the refugee camp, isn't there a refugee camp?

238
00:19:26.039 --> 00:19:31.079
There's some refugee camps with row and stuff in them that look actually pretty good in TNG.

239
00:19:31.200 --> 00:19:34.799
This is a slightly cheaper version of it because we can't go outside.

240
00:19:35.220 --> 00:19:36.420
I don't understand though.

241
00:19:36.480 --> 00:19:39.539
You're a person making the food there, sort of spooning it into the bowl.

242
00:19:39.599 --> 00:19:40.680
She's got a dirty face.

243
00:19:40.740 --> 00:19:41.579
I mean you've got water.

244
00:19:41.880 --> 00:19:43.140
You can clean your face, love.

245
00:19:43.200 --> 00:19:45.539
That's it, but she won't look like a refugee then.

246
00:19:46.319 --> 00:19:47.279
Ah, fair enough.

247
00:19:47.339 --> 00:19:48.059
Okay, enough.

248
00:19:48.839 --> 00:19:49.680
Oh, here we go.

249
00:19:49.740 --> 00:19:54.180
The gardener is about to emerge and press against Cisco's head.

250
00:19:55.079 --> 00:19:59.220
Have I tuned into an episode of TJ Brooker instead of Detect 9?

251
00:19:59.279 --> 00:19:59.940
What's going on?

252
00:20:00.119 --> 00:20:01.200
Great gun, isn't it?

253
00:20:01.259 --> 00:20:01.799
It's pretty good.

254
00:20:01.859 --> 00:20:03.420
He's putting his dustbuster away.

255
00:20:05.039 --> 00:20:10.619
And now he's got this sort of sexy Star Trek 3 gun that someone on Blue Sky identified for us.

256
00:20:11.880 --> 00:20:14.160
I'm going to try not to labour the point, right?

257
00:20:14.220 --> 00:20:22.319
But I just want to say that Kenneth Marshall and Avery Brooks have the most incredible sexual chemistry. this entire episode.

258
00:20:23.339 --> 00:20:29.099
And I had perverse thoughts about the 2 of them. all I'm going to say, all right, until maybe the end.

259
00:20:29.759 --> 00:20:31.079
He does have bad hair.

260
00:20:31.619 --> 00:20:33.299
I do think the hair is a problem.

261
00:20:34.619 --> 00:20:35.819
Would you have shaved it all off?

262
00:20:35.880 --> 00:20:39.000
Yeah, well, I did. as you know.

263
00:20:41.339 --> 00:20:42.240
I mean, look at you.

264
00:20:42.480 --> 00:20:43.799
Come on, I know, right?

265
00:20:44.160 --> 00:20:45.119
Jesus Christ.

266
00:20:48.000 --> 00:20:51.359
Now, there's a subject you know a lot about. betrayal.

267
00:20:51.599 --> 00:20:52.799
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

268
00:20:54.240 --> 00:21:13.200
So yeah, this is the other thing that I think is slightly dodgy about this, is that since, um, since for the cause, uh, 8 months have passed and Cisco has been on Eddington's studio, even though he has not been mentioned once in that entire time.

269
00:21:14.640 --> 00:21:15.599
Did you just own why?

270
00:21:15.960 --> 00:21:18.779
during all the scenes we got in those intervening episodes.

271
00:21:18.839 --> 00:21:24.299
It was the scenes that we didn't see where he went in the office and was like, have you heard anything about Michael Weddington?

272
00:21:24.359 --> 00:21:24.599
No?

273
00:21:24.660 --> 00:21:25.019
Okay.

274
00:21:25.200 --> 00:21:26.519
Back to the tripples then.

275
00:21:26.579 --> 00:21:27.000
Let's go.

276
00:21:28.859 --> 00:21:33.180
Do you think, you know, it's still serialised television, do you know what I mean?

277
00:21:33.240 --> 00:21:37.500
But it's not super serialised, it is still, you know, network TV and stuff like that.

278
00:21:38.220 --> 00:21:40.619
But they do help themselves to it.

279
00:21:41.579 --> 00:21:44.460
In Kursman Trek, there'd be a line or something in every episode.

280
00:21:44.460 --> 00:21:50.279
There'd just be a little reminder that this thing is bubbling under until they're ready to tell the episode.

281
00:21:50.519 --> 00:21:50.940
Yeah.

282
00:21:50.940 --> 00:21:51.359
Yeah.

283
00:21:51.539 --> 00:21:51.960
Yeah.

284
00:21:52.200 --> 00:22:01.500
I mean, this is reinstating. you can watch this as a standalone episode because this is reinstating absolutely what happened with the market. how they just possessed the political decisions that were made.

285
00:22:02.400 --> 00:22:09.119
And look, he's genuinely playing it as distressed by describing what's happened to the refugees.

286
00:22:09.480 --> 00:22:24.480
And Cisco does come across as unsympathetic because it is that well, sometimes, you know, important men in officers make decisions about this sort of thing and we just have to abide by it and it's your fault for not being able to accept that.

287
00:22:25.740 --> 00:22:29.519
Although, and of course, I want to get into a political argument now, all right?

288
00:22:29.819 --> 00:22:31.920
When he does say, like, they don't have to live like this.

289
00:22:31.980 --> 00:22:33.420
Like we did offer them.

290
00:22:33.420 --> 00:22:37.619
Yeah. a home and food and a comfort.

291
00:22:37.859 --> 00:22:38.819
There's a point there.

292
00:22:39.480 --> 00:22:41.039
I don't know if they're doing that in America.

293
00:22:41.339 --> 00:22:42.420
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

294
00:22:42.960 --> 00:22:45.240
I mean, it's it's true.

295
00:22:45.299 --> 00:22:47.099
The Federation does come off as better.

296
00:22:47.160 --> 00:23:00.180
But I think, and and you know, in Journey's end, of course, and with Chakotay, it becomes, you know, indigenous Americans being dispossessed of their land again, and that just adds an extra level to it.

297
00:23:01.380 --> 00:23:03.359
It's a hell of a line there though, isn't it?

298
00:23:03.420 --> 00:23:06.599
You're in a war, captain, and you're on the wrong side.

299
00:23:07.559 --> 00:23:09.119
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

300
00:23:10.619 --> 00:23:15.779
But this is where what you said comes in where he says, no, no, no, I don't see war victims.

301
00:23:15.839 --> 00:23:16.980
I see victims of you.

302
00:23:17.640 --> 00:23:19.859
And the promises that you have made to them.

303
00:23:20.880 --> 00:23:26.940
Which, you know, like is probably less politically interesting, but in terms of a character drama, maybe?

304
00:23:27.299 --> 00:23:28.799
Yeah, yeah, yeah. better approach.

305
00:23:28.799 --> 00:23:30.960
They're not trying to do the politics of it here.

306
00:23:31.019 --> 00:23:36.720
And that does exist, obviously, in other episodes about the McKee, but, you know, that's not what we're doing here.

307
00:23:36.779 --> 00:23:38.279
We're doing an Eddington thing, I think.

308
00:23:40.559 --> 00:23:50.099
I think sort of ultimately this episode is sold on how much you enjoy the relationship between Cisco and Eddington.

309
00:23:50.099 --> 00:23:52.619
And boy, the way they play it out in this.

310
00:23:53.700 --> 00:23:54.359
Something else.

311
00:23:54.960 --> 00:24:01.259
I was actually surprised, though, by how much there was that wasn't involving Eddington.

312
00:24:01.319 --> 00:24:03.660
Like, we don't see Eddington for a while after this.

313
00:24:05.759 --> 00:24:06.900
Engine room Bridge.

314
00:24:06.960 --> 00:24:07.500
Run the tiles.

315
00:24:07.740 --> 00:24:08.700
Okay, yeah, they come.

316
00:24:08.700 --> 00:24:09.599
All of that.

317
00:24:10.440 --> 00:24:11.220
A lot of that.

318
00:24:13.380 --> 00:24:13.859
Yeah.

319
00:24:13.920 --> 00:24:22.799
Well, yes, and of course, introducing the new hollow technology. the allows people to stand in the middle of the room rather than be on the screen.

320
00:24:22.920 --> 00:24:23.819
What you think about that?

321
00:24:24.359 --> 00:24:30.779
So, I think that it is somewhat...

322
00:24:30.779 --> 00:24:34.619
So, that set of the Defiant is really weird.

323
00:24:34.799 --> 00:24:36.299
It's not sort of circular.

324
00:24:36.359 --> 00:24:37.619
It's kind of long and thin.

325
00:24:37.619 --> 00:24:43.619
And at no point do you ever see a shot of the viewscreen with any of the actors in it.

326
00:24:44.279 --> 00:24:58.259
So my guess is that they haven't erected that wall and that they're shooting, they're shooting from the front into the bridge set and that they haven't put the view view screen up.

327
00:24:58.380 --> 00:25:01.980
And we do cut to the viewscreen and see things on it from time to time.

328
00:25:02.279 --> 00:25:22.559
But what we wouldn't have had are those scenes that we have in Star Trek, the Next Generation, where you have Picard standing, in the, you know, in the Enterprise Bridge, with a massive screen that dwarfs him and everyone else, and is able, you know, you are actually able to have scenes where people interact quite well.

329
00:25:22.680 --> 00:25:29.039
But what you have instead is he's got a tiny telly about the size of the one that I have in my living room over there.

330
00:25:29.039 --> 00:25:32.220
And it's really just not very impressive.

331
00:25:32.279 --> 00:25:41.339
And I had thought before, like earlier on, before we started recording, you said that there's another episode that they use this, it's in 2 episodes.

332
00:25:41.819 --> 00:25:51.119
But I thought it was erected for this precisely so that you could have those scenes between the 2 actors in the same room.

333
00:25:51.119 --> 00:25:52.980
And I think that that's the right decision.

334
00:25:53.279 --> 00:25:58.019
I think discovery makes the right decision when it comes back and just says, no, screw it.

335
00:25:58.079 --> 00:26:01.019
We've had this technology all along because it's heaps better.

336
00:26:02.099 --> 00:26:14.519
And of course, when Discovery does it, there's all interference patterns and stuff, just to remind us that they're holograms, until we go into the 32nd century, and then we have very rare interference patterns and people just act like they're in the same room.

337
00:26:14.579 --> 00:26:16.319
And that's obviously vastly better.

338
00:26:17.519 --> 00:26:22.500
You know, they're very discreetly cherry pick, DS now, don't they, uh, Kurtzman Trek?

339
00:26:22.559 --> 00:26:26.220
You know, but it's never the characters because they can't get the actors for whatever reason.

340
00:26:26.339 --> 00:26:29.880
It's not like Voyager, where they keep having Jane Wedge coaching.

341
00:26:29.880 --> 00:26:30.480
They're doing anything.

342
00:26:30.539 --> 00:26:41.460
So it's the technology or it's the changelings or it's section 31. you know, it's all things like that, you know, they're like, actually that was the most creatively interesting show.

343
00:26:41.519 --> 00:26:42.299
Let's use the ideas.

344
00:26:42.660 --> 00:26:43.259
Yeah, yeah.

345
00:26:43.319 --> 00:26:45.599
It's a shame that we don't get many of the people back.

346
00:26:46.019 --> 00:26:48.420
I mean, we get wharf, but...

347
00:26:48.480 --> 00:26:49.680
Oh, there's the view screen, did you see?

348
00:26:49.740 --> 00:26:51.240
Yeah, we did see the viewscreen, actually.

349
00:26:51.299 --> 00:26:51.839
There you go.

350
00:26:51.900 --> 00:26:53.700
There is a shot of the viewscreen there.

351
00:26:53.759 --> 00:26:54.299
I'm quite wrong.

352
00:26:54.779 --> 00:26:56.880
It is a very small set.

353
00:26:57.000 --> 00:26:57.480
Right.

354
00:26:57.480 --> 00:26:58.980
Yeah, yeah, yeah. a small set.

355
00:26:59.579 --> 00:27:08.759
I like what I like is that when they appear and disappear, they have to use a different effect, and so it looks like telly, like it looks like red, green, and blue light.

356
00:27:08.819 --> 00:27:10.440
So it looks like it's a telly thing.

357
00:27:10.500 --> 00:27:12.000
So they kind of do that.

358
00:27:12.599 --> 00:27:16.920
And I do like the thing of them pressing buttons that you don't see off camera.

359
00:27:19.079 --> 00:27:22.079
I just like, it wouldn't have the sense of drama, would it?

360
00:27:22.380 --> 00:27:27.900
If it was him talking to a bit of glass, it just wouldn't have a, well, not a glass, sorry.

361
00:27:28.859 --> 00:27:30.000
They can't afford glass.

362
00:27:30.660 --> 00:27:31.440
Yeah, whatever.

363
00:27:31.559 --> 00:27:34.619
So yeah, so that's that's Eric Pierpoint.

364
00:27:34.619 --> 00:27:35.460
Pierpoint?

365
00:27:35.460 --> 00:27:35.940
Pierpoint?

366
00:27:36.000 --> 00:27:37.740
I don't know how to say his name is Sanders.

367
00:27:37.799 --> 00:27:42.539
He 1st appears in a season season 7 episode of TNG called liaisons.

368
00:27:42.839 --> 00:27:44.759
He's one of the aliens.

369
00:27:45.779 --> 00:27:47.700
I think he's the guy in the ship.

370
00:27:48.299 --> 00:27:52.559
Um, but he is also in episodes that we have seen.

371
00:27:52.619 --> 00:27:54.180
We've seen him.

372
00:27:54.240 --> 00:27:54.720
Play before.

373
00:27:55.259 --> 00:27:57.599
He is the ferryman in Barge of the Dead.

374
00:27:58.859 --> 00:28:00.539
Oh, he's a Klingon.

375
00:28:00.660 --> 00:28:01.740
Yeah, he's a Klingon.

376
00:28:01.740 --> 00:28:02.759
He's used to a bit of latex.

377
00:28:03.299 --> 00:28:10.079
And he is reads section 31 contact Harris in Enterprise.

378
00:28:10.440 --> 00:28:15.599
Oh, do you not remember the dreadful New York backdrop that we watched an episode, didn't we?

379
00:28:15.660 --> 00:28:17.460
Where they met down a dark alley.

380
00:28:17.519 --> 00:28:18.420
They looked very dodgy.

381
00:28:18.960 --> 00:28:19.619
So fake.

382
00:28:20.640 --> 00:28:24.240
And he did his sort of terrible leather black thing.

383
00:28:24.359 --> 00:28:24.960
Yeah, yeah.

384
00:28:25.019 --> 00:28:25.680
So that was him.

385
00:28:25.799 --> 00:28:26.940
That's him. him.

386
00:28:27.000 --> 00:28:27.240
Okay.

387
00:28:27.299 --> 00:28:28.140
Oh, here we go.

388
00:28:28.200 --> 00:28:28.500
Right.

389
00:28:29.039 --> 00:28:32.700
Before you waste your time running around trying to restore computer control.

390
00:28:32.759 --> 00:28:34.140
I've already sabotaged it.

391
00:28:34.200 --> 00:28:34.740
All right?

392
00:28:37.140 --> 00:28:37.680
Shit.

393
00:28:41.400 --> 00:28:45.299
I do like, I mean, this sort of cat a mouse where he's pulling rabbits out of hats.

394
00:28:45.539 --> 00:28:48.119
I love all the ones that he does, you know?

395
00:28:49.380 --> 00:28:53.220
And of course, that's why Cisco then has to finally pull the biggest rabbit out, doesn't it?

396
00:28:53.279 --> 00:28:54.059
Yeah, yeah.

397
00:28:54.299 --> 00:29:09.599
Well, like again, you know, it just so happens that, um, Eddington has one of these on his McKee Raiders and also it's the technology that's unaffected, you know, they managed to make it work for the rest of the episode.

398
00:29:10.920 --> 00:29:14.099
And, you know, like he's lit strikingly as well in that place.

399
00:29:14.160 --> 00:29:15.119
I think it's really good.

400
00:29:15.180 --> 00:29:15.960
I think it's great.

401
00:29:16.019 --> 00:29:18.420
I think that shot of the def wonderful, isn't it?

402
00:29:18.720 --> 00:29:20.460
It's really...

403
00:29:20.579 --> 00:29:21.119
Really good.

404
00:29:21.359 --> 00:29:22.619
It's what we were talking about.

405
00:29:22.680 --> 00:29:26.759
Do you remember we were talking about one little ship where they couldn't do one ship against the mother?

406
00:29:26.880 --> 00:29:28.079
And yet they've just done it there.

407
00:29:28.440 --> 00:29:28.980
So good.

408
00:29:28.980 --> 00:29:36.000
And I think the McKee Raiders, which are obviously designs that are introduced late in TNG, are great as well. they look really good.

409
00:29:36.960 --> 00:29:39.660
They look like proper kind of spaceships, you know.

410
00:29:40.680 --> 00:29:42.119
They did that special effect short.

411
00:29:42.180 --> 00:29:50.279
Like, they had to make it look like, white, what Cisco getting punched around the face as his ships being destroyed around him?

412
00:29:50.279 --> 00:29:51.900
Yeah, it's good having him win.

413
00:29:51.960 --> 00:29:54.420
Like, it is good having him win. and he's not going to kill.

414
00:29:54.480 --> 00:29:55.200
That's the thing.

415
00:29:55.500 --> 00:29:56.579
Nathan, he's a good guy.

416
00:29:56.640 --> 00:29:57.599
When he gets angry.

417
00:29:57.720 --> 00:29:59.099
Look at Cisco's face.

418
00:30:00.180 --> 00:30:01.920
I just want to sit on him right now.

419
00:30:01.920 --> 00:30:02.819
Look at him.

420
00:30:04.920 --> 00:30:06.660
He would annihilate you, wouldn't he?

421
00:30:08.519 --> 00:30:10.380
I'm so sorry, everybody.

422
00:30:10.680 --> 00:30:13.440
You're going to have to put on a bit of this today, I'm afraid.

423
00:30:14.819 --> 00:30:16.559
Do we have a small gay following?

424
00:30:16.619 --> 00:30:16.980
I hope so.

425
00:30:17.039 --> 00:30:18.180
I think we buy.

426
00:30:22.920 --> 00:30:24.960
You guys are not going to be disappointed today.

427
00:30:25.259 --> 00:30:33.480
See, in a way, like, in a way, he should be clearly delusional.

428
00:30:33.900 --> 00:30:47.099
Like, like the way that Eddington's talking about how you're just following me and you've been after me for 8 months and I'm the person who's occupying your thoughts, I know when to walk away, it was never personal, but with you, it's personal.

429
00:30:47.160 --> 00:30:52.440
See, all of that is him being delusional, and that's how they win is by playing into that delusion.

430
00:30:52.799 --> 00:31:05.039
And so whenever Cisco plays it, whenever Avery plays it, like he really is all of those things, that kind of undermines the episode a little bit, I think. despite him being very sweaty and hot in those scenes.

431
00:31:06.299 --> 00:31:12.420
I'm going to say something that was totally bizarre now, all right, but I really noticed, and I just noticed it again then.

432
00:31:12.720 --> 00:31:16.019
That walk and talk scene was so well executed.

433
00:31:16.559 --> 00:31:18.000
They came out of the lift.

434
00:31:18.059 --> 00:31:28.259
They walked through ops, and then suddenly the cameras inside Cisco's office, so they go up the stairs from the point of view of Ops, and then they walk into the office from the point of view of Cisco's desk.

435
00:31:28.380 --> 00:31:32.460
It's really fluid in a way that no one eats tricks, it's never like that.

436
00:31:32.759 --> 00:31:35.700
It's a kind of a late 97 thing, isn't it?

437
00:31:35.759 --> 00:31:36.420
Do you know what I mean?

438
00:31:36.480 --> 00:31:38.400
Like that's what TV is doing at this point.

439
00:31:38.700 --> 00:31:39.900
It's the West Wing, yeah.

440
00:31:39.960 --> 00:31:40.859
I think maybe.

441
00:31:40.920 --> 00:31:41.640
I think maybe it is.

442
00:31:42.480 --> 00:31:43.859
I can't remember.

443
00:31:43.920 --> 00:31:45.180
We've got up our game.

444
00:31:45.420 --> 00:31:46.680
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

445
00:31:47.640 --> 00:31:48.779
It's a great set too.

446
00:31:48.900 --> 00:31:51.000
I did like Edington saying as well.

447
00:31:51.359 --> 00:31:56.220
Yeah, you don't know how hard it was to get that cascade virus past Chief O'Brien and Odo, all right.

448
00:31:56.279 --> 00:31:58.440
I had to work at least the whole season.

449
00:31:59.099 --> 00:32:00.599
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

450
00:32:02.579 --> 00:32:03.240
Bless him.

451
00:32:04.200 --> 00:32:10.559
Have we gone past a bit, yeah, where Odo goes, it's a piece of green poetry. quite a catchy piece as well.

452
00:32:10.740 --> 00:32:15.420
So that's coming later, and I also think that that's actually very good.

453
00:32:15.480 --> 00:32:23.220
That sounds like it's time wasting, but it actually anticipates like it feeds into them solving the space problem.

454
00:32:25.019 --> 00:32:28.380
Do you know, the one thing about this actor whose name I've already forgotten.

455
00:32:28.500 --> 00:32:29.039
What's his name?

456
00:32:30.539 --> 00:32:35.819
Eric Pierpoint is, when I saw a squint, I can see Sloane from section 31.

457
00:32:36.000 --> 00:32:37.140
They do look quite similar.

458
00:32:37.380 --> 00:32:39.000
Wait, who signed from?

459
00:32:39.119 --> 00:32:39.660
Oh, okay.

460
00:32:39.720 --> 00:32:41.519
Sloane's the one in this show.

461
00:32:41.700 --> 00:32:42.660
William Sadler.

462
00:32:42.720 --> 00:32:43.140
Yeah, yeah.

463
00:32:43.319 --> 00:32:46.380
No, he does join section 31, but it's in the past.

464
00:32:46.440 --> 00:32:48.960
Oh, sorry, I can see why you've got...

465
00:32:50.279 --> 00:32:53.220
He is a section. one aged layo, yeah, yeah.

466
00:32:54.059 --> 00:32:55.259
The lines are very blurred.

467
00:32:55.799 --> 00:32:57.480
Maybe that's the look they were going for.

468
00:32:57.599 --> 00:32:58.980
Him and William Sadley, you know?

469
00:32:59.039 --> 00:32:59.940
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

470
00:33:00.480 --> 00:33:03.539
So I actually average American man haircut.

471
00:33:03.960 --> 00:33:06.599
Yeah, yeah, he does have a very average American man.

472
00:33:06.660 --> 00:33:13.259
Look, but I do like this scene because Cisco is clearly disappointed and we will see that later.

473
00:33:13.559 --> 00:33:24.059
And like that look, the look where, where he says, you know, he fooled you and Cisco turns around and goes to be angry, but isn't.

474
00:33:24.119 --> 00:33:24.779
Do you know what I mean?

475
00:33:24.839 --> 00:33:25.980
Like he's not being a dick.

476
00:33:26.339 --> 00:33:28.680
And that's important, I think, to the episode.

477
00:33:28.920 --> 00:33:30.660
But he can't be Jaffair.

478
00:33:31.019 --> 00:33:34.019
I want you to think about a hypothetical scenario now.

479
00:33:34.619 --> 00:33:37.680
I imagine you really wanted to bring somebody down, yeah?

480
00:33:37.740 --> 00:33:38.220
Yeah?

481
00:33:38.339 --> 00:33:39.900
Somebody who had wronged you.

482
00:33:40.500 --> 00:33:44.400
And then someone came in at the last minute and took all the pleasure away of doing it.

483
00:33:44.460 --> 00:33:46.140
I mean it would be annoying, wouldn't it?

484
00:33:46.319 --> 00:33:48.720
No, I'd be just grateful that they did it, actually.

485
00:33:50.279 --> 00:33:51.960
It's a pity that he...

486
00:33:52.019 --> 00:33:52.859
He fucks it up.

487
00:33:54.059 --> 00:33:55.680
Yeah, go on, go and get him.

488
00:33:55.740 --> 00:33:56.460
Tell me about it.

489
00:33:57.900 --> 00:34:01.680
I want you to contact me and describe the look on his face if that's okay.

490
00:34:02.640 --> 00:34:03.900
But that doesn't end up happening.

491
00:34:04.500 --> 00:34:10.739
I do really like the bit where he says, oh, you know, if he'd fooled me like he fooled you and he goes, oh, I'm sorry.

492
00:34:11.039 --> 00:34:12.179
I shouldn't have said it like that.

493
00:34:12.780 --> 00:34:19.500
And then the way that the way that this guy turns and then says, no, I was fooled, you know, like I was fooled.

494
00:34:19.559 --> 00:34:21.179
It's Dax in this scene.

495
00:34:21.239 --> 00:34:22.380
So this seems really great.

496
00:34:22.440 --> 00:34:24.900
You're looking at how sweaty and God, he is sweaty.

497
00:34:25.019 --> 00:34:25.980
It adorable, isn't it?

498
00:34:26.219 --> 00:34:29.099
But Terry is so good in this scene.

499
00:34:29.639 --> 00:34:30.840
He's she's watching.

500
00:34:30.900 --> 00:34:32.760
Well, she's going to director Victor LeBl.

501
00:34:33.360 --> 00:34:37.320
What, you want me to hold that and deliver dialogue?

502
00:34:37.619 --> 00:34:38.820
while Avery's watching.

503
00:34:38.880 --> 00:34:41.400
Well, Avery Brooks is punching it.

504
00:34:41.460 --> 00:34:42.239
Are you mad?

505
00:34:42.719 --> 00:34:44.159
All right, I'll give it a go.

506
00:34:44.219 --> 00:34:47.280
And look, every time she winces, like, ooh, God.

507
00:34:47.340 --> 00:34:49.079
But she's kind of amused.

508
00:34:49.139 --> 00:34:49.800
Do you know what I mean?

509
00:34:49.860 --> 00:34:52.980
Like she is kind of amused and concerned.

510
00:34:53.039 --> 00:34:53.940
Like, it's really good.

511
00:34:54.300 --> 00:34:57.780
This is, you know, a long way from where she was in series one.

512
00:34:58.679 --> 00:35:05.280
This is what you and I said about the episode last week, Final Mission, was why aren't they threading this stuff through the entire episode?

513
00:35:05.820 --> 00:35:09.300
And so much of this episode is actually about Cisco and Dax, right?

514
00:35:09.420 --> 00:35:14.219
And how Dax usually goes off on these crazy revenge missions and things like this.

515
00:35:14.219 --> 00:35:16.860
Blood over them, ritual wind and things like that.

516
00:35:16.860 --> 00:35:18.780
And how Cisco's always supporting her.

517
00:35:19.320 --> 00:35:23.219
Well, now she says it's a good thing you're taking it out of the bag, Benjamin.

518
00:35:24.840 --> 00:35:26.519
Because you're going to have to let go of this one.

519
00:35:26.820 --> 00:35:29.699
I like the honesty that the 2 of them have.

520
00:35:29.760 --> 00:35:30.719
It's great, isn't it?

521
00:35:30.780 --> 00:35:31.800
It's such a good choice.

522
00:35:31.860 --> 00:35:43.860
We did it when we when we did emissary and we talked about how he's got this old friend who's a kind of mentor and we've given that role to the beautiful young science officer.

523
00:35:44.159 --> 00:35:47.639
And you think that actually is a stroke of genius and it works really well.

524
00:35:49.380 --> 00:35:53.579
Look, look, Kira's face mirrors mine when Cisco walked in there all sweaty.

525
00:35:54.179 --> 00:35:58.139
It's like, oh, that's one hell of a hot religious leader that I have.

526
00:35:59.099 --> 00:36:00.960
She goes, you've just unlocked a new kink.

527
00:36:01.139 --> 00:36:01.679
Thank you.

528
00:36:01.920 --> 00:36:04.559
Captain Cisco. sweaty messiah.

529
00:36:09.960 --> 00:36:12.960
Hey, it's better than KY covered corpse.

530
00:36:13.440 --> 00:36:14.219
Oh, that's true.

531
00:36:14.340 --> 00:36:15.000
That is true.

532
00:36:16.500 --> 00:36:19.320
Oh, no, what are they talking about, selenium...

533
00:36:19.320 --> 00:36:20.880
Yeah, yeah, see this?

534
00:36:21.179 --> 00:36:21.840
Oh boy.

535
00:36:22.260 --> 00:36:32.699
Suddenly, I think suddenly Cisco delivers a line of dialogue that doesn't belong to him because he didn't even know that this could be converted into whatever it was.

536
00:36:32.760 --> 00:36:37.800
And then later on, he says, yes, he's stolen enough to poison every Maqu colony in the Badlands.

537
00:36:37.860 --> 00:36:39.179
You can go, wait, how do you know that?

538
00:36:39.179 --> 00:36:40.440
Or whatever.

539
00:36:40.619 --> 00:36:42.840
Every Cardassian colony in the Badlands.

540
00:36:43.920 --> 00:36:46.980
Much like Tom Paris and his bizarre hobbies.

541
00:36:47.159 --> 00:36:51.420
One of Cisco's hobbies is just sitting there researching great weapons.

542
00:36:52.199 --> 00:36:57.179
Yeah, but he didn't know about this one until Dax explained it, so I don't quite know what's happening.

543
00:36:58.800 --> 00:36:59.940
Poor old no, no.

544
00:37:00.000 --> 00:37:03.480
She's like, what, all you want me to do is basically say Tetanobabble, the whole episode.

545
00:37:03.539 --> 00:37:04.199
Yeah, really?

546
00:37:04.260 --> 00:37:05.400
Is that not a waste of my talent?

547
00:37:05.760 --> 00:37:18.420
And it's the 2nd, you know, like the last deep space 9 episode that we had had her being an engineering expert talking about Shields and here she's on board the Defiant again doing that because the moment we go on board the Defiant.

548
00:37:19.320 --> 00:37:24.840
Everyone stops being what they are on the sheep and just ends up being a normal star fleet crew.

549
00:37:26.159 --> 00:37:31.320
They're, they're, um, looking to find things for knock to do now since he's come back.

550
00:37:31.380 --> 00:37:32.219
He came back in.

551
00:37:32.579 --> 00:37:34.079
Was it Rapture?

552
00:37:34.139 --> 00:37:34.980
No, the ascent.

553
00:37:35.039 --> 00:37:39.960
That's the episode where he came back from the academy, and they're sort of trying to find him a place, right?

554
00:37:40.019 --> 00:37:43.380
And eventually it's just like, whoa, he's just a defied bridge corruptor, right?

555
00:37:43.440 --> 00:37:44.219
Like that's what he does.

556
00:37:45.000 --> 00:37:46.860
But I do love what they do with him here.

557
00:37:47.460 --> 00:37:51.420
Paul Aaron is stuck saying all the techno Apple that everyone's saying to each other.

558
00:37:51.780 --> 00:37:52.739
No, it's really good.

559
00:37:52.739 --> 00:37:53.760
And it does.

560
00:37:53.820 --> 00:38:00.179
I'm, like I said, before we started watching, I couldn't really work out why they were doing it.

561
00:38:00.179 --> 00:38:02.760
Um, exactly.

562
00:38:03.780 --> 00:38:12.780
Well, was it, is it not just because it's like an extra layer of suspense in the, their, not at full capacity and yet they're still going after him?

563
00:38:12.960 --> 00:38:18.480
Or maybe that's why they can't find him because otherwise they've got this very powerful ship and why aren't you not just bringing him down?

564
00:38:18.840 --> 00:38:22.199
But I mean, we bring down an Excelsior class ship later.

565
00:38:22.260 --> 00:38:23.039
Do you know what I mean?

566
00:38:23.099 --> 00:38:25.739
And we've already brought it down once when it was at full capacity.

567
00:38:26.159 --> 00:38:35.699
But I do think that given they're not going to distress the ship in any way, it's the only way of reminding us, I guess, that the ship is damaged.

568
00:38:35.760 --> 00:38:48.420
And so they say it's going to be 2 weeks or 2.5 weeks and he's getting it out of dock in order to, so it does make the, you know, it does sell the kind of personal fentetta idea.

569
00:38:48.840 --> 00:38:50.159
Although he has drama.

570
00:38:50.159 --> 00:38:57.900
That is exactly the sort of detail that was missing last week in those tedious technobabble scenes and TNG.

571
00:38:57.960 --> 00:38:59.219
You just had not going.

572
00:38:59.280 --> 00:39:00.539
Yeah, yeah, I'm happy to do it.

573
00:39:00.599 --> 00:39:03.179
And as he walks off, he goes, exploding. exploding?

574
00:39:06.300 --> 00:39:09.780
They're just, they always remember, they always remember the characters.

575
00:39:09.840 --> 00:39:10.739
I just appreciate it.

576
00:39:11.280 --> 00:39:12.599
Oh, this is the best.

577
00:39:13.139 --> 00:39:21.840
I know, I've lost all perspective. and you should tell me to go home, to my office and behave myself and don't risk my career.

578
00:39:22.440 --> 00:39:23.219
Just watching this.

579
00:39:23.400 --> 00:39:26.159
So I watched this twice to prepare for this.

580
00:39:26.639 --> 00:39:31.679
And I thought the 1st time through that this was maybe the best scene in it.

581
00:39:32.039 --> 00:39:36.179
It's certainly, like it's, it's just excellent.

582
00:39:36.239 --> 00:39:37.980
It's Avery being great.

583
00:39:38.039 --> 00:39:39.719
It's it's Terry being great.

584
00:39:39.960 --> 00:39:46.619
And it's the middle one of the 3 scenes that they have together that are all just really incredibly good.

585
00:39:46.619 --> 00:39:49.500
And just the warmth that they have.

586
00:39:50.099 --> 00:39:53.519
He looks at her like... couldn't love her more.

587
00:39:53.579 --> 00:39:54.000
Exactly.

588
00:39:55.920 --> 00:39:57.960
And she's saying to him, like, do you know what?

589
00:39:58.500 --> 00:40:00.539
You could have supported me like this in the past.

590
00:40:01.260 --> 00:40:03.239
And he's acknowledging it. yes, yes.

591
00:40:03.360 --> 00:40:06.539
And that, there's even a little goofy smile and everything.

592
00:40:06.659 --> 00:40:07.800
It's really cute.

593
00:40:07.860 --> 00:40:09.119
Like, it's properly cute.

594
00:40:09.179 --> 00:40:11.280
The 2 of them are really enjoying that scene.

595
00:40:11.340 --> 00:40:11.760
I think.

596
00:40:12.900 --> 00:40:17.039
Oh, now I need to prepare myself for the techno apple.

597
00:40:17.099 --> 00:40:20.340
They try and get the phone thrustable get a mention.

598
00:40:21.420 --> 00:40:22.139
That's right.

599
00:40:22.260 --> 00:40:24.840
Impulse power, deteriorum, injection rates.

600
00:40:25.739 --> 00:40:26.400
My God.

601
00:40:26.460 --> 00:40:27.539
I think, do you know why?

602
00:40:27.599 --> 00:40:36.239
I reckon the techno babble man, you know, the insert techno babble here person that writes it for the Swift was like, look, you've given me nothing to do for a whole season.

603
00:40:36.480 --> 00:40:39.059
Please, will you just give me some technobabble to write?

604
00:40:40.380 --> 00:40:41.940
Only Voyager gives me any work.

605
00:40:42.420 --> 00:40:48.960
But you kind of think that if they had more money or something like that, that the ship would still be distressed in some way.

606
00:40:49.860 --> 00:40:52.380
You know, like it's absolutely pristine.

607
00:40:52.440 --> 00:41:03.960
And so the only way that we know that it's being taken out of dock and that it's not ready and it's not fixed is because we just repeatedly told that because they can't afford to show it.

608
00:41:05.579 --> 00:41:10.199
I just feel like this sequence where they nearly hit the docking pylon.

609
00:41:10.260 --> 00:41:17.340
It should be so pony, but the way the ship completely...

610
00:41:17.340 --> 00:41:20.039
Oh, I love it, though. so ridiculous.

611
00:41:20.579 --> 00:41:26.400
I think what's great is how well lit those models are, like just how tremendously well lit they are.

612
00:41:27.059 --> 00:41:29.699
Yeah, they've just kind of got there now, haven't they?

613
00:41:29.760 --> 00:41:42.179
Yeah, remember how the enterprise was always just very evenly lit all over, but you can see the shadows on the defiant change as it circles around and things and it's, you know, it's just much more interestingly lit.

614
00:41:43.019 --> 00:41:44.760
Oh, look at that POV show.

615
00:41:45.000 --> 00:41:46.260
Oh, the pylon.

616
00:41:48.059 --> 00:41:49.019
That's awesome.

617
00:41:49.079 --> 00:41:53.579
There's the, there's the viewscreen with no one in front of it.

618
00:41:54.659 --> 00:41:55.619
Half a row.

619
00:41:55.679 --> 00:41:58.619
There we go Jesus.

620
00:41:58.619 --> 00:42:05.579
Now, we weren't laughing like that with the garbage scowl last week, were we?

621
00:42:05.880 --> 00:42:06.960
That was very boring.

622
00:42:07.800 --> 00:42:08.699
Oh boy.

623
00:42:09.059 --> 00:42:10.320
Head to the Badlands.

624
00:42:10.380 --> 00:42:10.980
Oh, good.

625
00:42:11.039 --> 00:42:13.139
We've got that special effect saved from last time.

626
00:42:13.199 --> 00:42:14.219
So don't worry.

627
00:42:14.460 --> 00:42:16.139
So they look different to me this time.

628
00:42:16.199 --> 00:42:22.380
They certainly look different from the way that they looked in the caretaker.

629
00:42:23.219 --> 00:42:24.300
They laser better.

630
00:42:24.360 --> 00:42:30.840
The story is a completely I think Basic Glory has the best, so sort of columns of flames that they do.

631
00:42:31.260 --> 00:42:32.219
It's really effective.

632
00:42:33.599 --> 00:42:35.400
Oh, look at Cisco.

633
00:42:35.460 --> 00:42:36.239
Well done, people.

634
00:42:36.300 --> 00:42:37.860
And he's sort of smiling at them all.

635
00:42:38.039 --> 00:42:45.239
Yeah, I like that actually where Noggs is actually we can go to Warp 7 and it's kind of like, look at us, aren't we good?

636
00:42:45.420 --> 00:42:48.420
And I thought that that was nice to have a little moment of triumph in there.

637
00:42:49.500 --> 00:42:54.179
These bad lands look like every single, um, a normally that voyagers ever come through.

638
00:42:54.900 --> 00:42:59.219
I think that they're always trying to recreate the Mutara Nebula from Roth of Khan.

639
00:42:59.760 --> 00:43:02.940
Oh, doodle.

640
00:43:02.940 --> 00:43:03.960
Oh, God.

641
00:43:05.159 --> 00:43:07.199
That sequence is out there.

642
00:43:07.320 --> 00:43:07.739
So great.

643
00:43:07.860 --> 00:43:09.360
Well, they do it in best of both worlds too.

644
00:43:10.440 --> 00:43:11.639
That was his loin.

645
00:43:12.119 --> 00:43:13.380
Edgeborough Bridge.

646
00:43:13.500 --> 00:43:15.960
Where are those films?

647
00:43:20.280 --> 00:43:21.960
Aaron is so great.

648
00:43:22.019 --> 00:43:22.980
He really good, isn't he?

649
00:43:22.980 --> 00:43:24.539
What a loss.

650
00:43:25.739 --> 00:43:28.500
Yeah, it's Kira still don't tend to apple.

651
00:43:28.980 --> 00:43:29.940
Yep, yep.

652
00:43:30.300 --> 00:43:32.880
God knows why she's an administrator.

653
00:43:33.360 --> 00:43:37.619
Is this the dialogue scene between Cisco and Eddington in the minute where it does the wave?

654
00:43:37.920 --> 00:43:40.739
Yeah, I just think that part in gesture.

655
00:43:40.800 --> 00:43:42.300
It's just like that.

656
00:43:43.860 --> 00:43:45.599
Oh, you thought you caught me, did you?

657
00:43:45.780 --> 00:43:46.199
Sorry.

658
00:43:50.340 --> 00:43:52.199
There we didn't have him appear, did we?

659
00:43:52.440 --> 00:43:55.139
Cisco turned his chair around and he was already there.

660
00:43:55.440 --> 00:43:56.880
So he didn't have him appear.

661
00:43:57.059 --> 00:43:59.039
He was already in shot, which is pretty good.

662
00:43:59.579 --> 00:44:01.619
Again, it just makes it seem like he's there.

663
00:44:02.219 --> 00:44:13.019
Avery, all right, because with every dialogue scene they have, he has to spin his chair around right away from the crew to Eddington and he gets more melodramatic with each one.

664
00:44:15.179 --> 00:44:21.179
So there are 2 documents that Eddington Sands, right?

665
00:44:21.239 --> 00:44:26.340
One is this book, and then the other one is the Breen nursery rhyme.

666
00:44:28.679 --> 00:44:29.639
Would you like to hear it?

667
00:44:29.760 --> 00:44:34.019
Or, beep it, or, or, or, or, that's it, actually.

668
00:44:34.079 --> 00:44:39.000
Yeah, but it sort of through a brain transducer voice modulator thing.

669
00:44:40.260 --> 00:44:41.099
Um, yes.

670
00:44:41.340 --> 00:44:43.320
Are they poets in Kurtzman Trek then?

671
00:44:43.380 --> 00:44:57.840
No, but that character Locke, who you saw at the very beginning of Face the Strange, the last discovery we did, is a Breen, although, because they're not wearing helmets anymore, are they?

672
00:44:58.019 --> 00:44:59.880
Well, they're still they're still liquid.

673
00:45:01.079 --> 00:45:06.239
But they can solidify themselves so that they can appear as actors on location.

674
00:45:07.079 --> 00:45:07.679
Mostly.

675
00:45:07.920 --> 00:45:10.679
So now Eddington, and I do like these.

676
00:45:10.679 --> 00:45:13.619
He's lured them there so we can go and attack somewhere else.

677
00:45:13.800 --> 00:45:14.579
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

678
00:45:14.639 --> 00:45:16.800
Again, it's that's all fun too, isn't it?

679
00:45:16.860 --> 00:45:19.559
The cat and mouse thing is precisely it, and it is pretty good.

680
00:45:19.679 --> 00:45:25.139
But look, he's just kind of frustrated. you know, like he's not angry and that's how it has to be.

681
00:45:25.199 --> 00:45:27.599
It can't be. that he's Javert.

682
00:45:27.659 --> 00:45:36.179
Javert has to be the act that he's persuaded to put on in order to trick, in order to trick, Eddington, I think.

683
00:45:36.900 --> 00:45:39.840
I am pleased that they critique Les Miserables.

684
00:45:39.900 --> 00:45:42.179
I mean, I found it such a dirge, that book.

685
00:45:42.480 --> 00:45:51.000
So I've never read it, but the musical comes out in the 80s and is massive, like absolutely massive and I do like that.

686
00:45:51.059 --> 00:45:51.719
Have you seen it?

687
00:45:51.780 --> 00:45:52.500
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

688
00:45:52.559 --> 00:45:52.920
Yeah.

689
00:45:53.340 --> 00:45:57.659
Uh, it, it, you know, there's the post of the iconic poster.

690
00:45:57.719 --> 00:45:58.679
It was everywhere.

691
00:45:59.159 --> 00:46:15.840
And so in a way, having scenes in 1997 where um, Dax and Cisco explained to the audience what uh, Les Mis is, is a kind of depressing Star Trekie thing, isn't it, really?

692
00:46:15.840 --> 00:46:25.019
Yeah, it's just like, we can't rely on the audience to know any talk with pop culture. that's right Well, that's the other thing, which is a deliberate choice.

693
00:46:25.320 --> 00:46:31.800
You know, like if they were to do it now, someone would mention having seen the musical or heard the musical.

694
00:46:31.860 --> 00:46:32.760
Do you know what I mean?

695
00:46:32.820 --> 00:46:37.320
But it's the sort of thing where we are only allowed to do, like, classic literature.

696
00:46:37.380 --> 00:46:44.039
We can't reference pop culture at all, which is why these are all space people rather than just people, you know.

697
00:46:44.820 --> 00:46:46.139
Let's be honest, Nathan.

698
00:46:46.199 --> 00:46:53.880
And if they were to do it now, Captain Pike would be going one day more, one day more till execution.

699
00:46:53.940 --> 00:46:55.440
We'd have the songs, wouldn't we?

700
00:46:55.619 --> 00:46:56.219
We would.

701
00:46:59.340 --> 00:47:02.159
Oh, poor old um, I've forgotten his name now.

702
00:47:02.280 --> 00:47:04.019
Sanders, Kevin Sanders.

703
00:47:04.440 --> 00:47:06.659
Look, even his uniforms all dirty.

704
00:47:06.840 --> 00:47:09.179
That's the only way we can tell things are bad in this episode.

705
00:47:09.659 --> 00:47:23.519
Well, I think we have that great shot of the Malinche, which is a massive Excelsior class ship, and it does have stuff coming off it, and it's, you know, askew and stuff like that.

706
00:47:23.940 --> 00:47:26.159
And so that sort of sells a...

707
00:47:29.280 --> 00:47:33.840
But at no point, like they're working together, Cisco and this guy, right?

708
00:47:33.900 --> 00:47:36.239
At no point is there any tension here between them.

709
00:47:36.719 --> 00:47:38.519
They are both after the same goal.

710
00:47:38.639 --> 00:47:39.420
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

711
00:47:39.480 --> 00:47:40.019
And that's good.

712
00:47:40.079 --> 00:47:40.679
Do you know what I mean?

713
00:47:40.739 --> 00:47:45.599
It's not it's not Cisco getting his dick out and saying, well, you know, like I...

714
00:47:45.659 --> 00:47:50.340
I just wondered, even if this was Voyager, it would have been about false tension.

715
00:47:50.400 --> 00:47:51.119
No, I like it.

716
00:47:51.179 --> 00:47:53.280
I like that they were both kind of grown-ups about it.

717
00:47:54.539 --> 00:48:00.719
We relied on Odo back at Deep Space 9 to have his contractual obligations scene and come in and tell us about the poetry.

718
00:48:01.019 --> 00:48:12.420
Yeah, but the thing that they do with the poetry is that they make it clear what sort of messages, uh, um, Eddington sends.

719
00:48:12.900 --> 00:48:19.800
And so we have Odo, again, wonderfully appearing on the bridge here as a hologram.

720
00:48:20.039 --> 00:48:24.539
Um, Yeah, you wonder why that just didn't do that.

721
00:48:24.840 --> 00:48:27.599
A heterophonic verse. quite a catchy one too.

722
00:48:27.719 --> 00:48:29.099
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

723
00:48:29.159 --> 00:48:35.159
So, so, um, so the message is brain, right?

724
00:48:35.880 --> 00:48:38.820
Like, you can't understand the verse. all nonsense.

725
00:48:38.880 --> 00:48:40.199
There's nothing encoded in the music.

726
00:48:40.260 --> 00:48:42.059
There's nothing encoded in the metre.

727
00:48:42.119 --> 00:48:48.539
It's just a brain nursery rhyme, and so it means we're going to a brain colony, and it's a clue, and that's it.

728
00:48:49.019 --> 00:48:51.420
But Les Miserables is the same thing.

729
00:48:51.480 --> 00:48:53.460
It's just a very obvious thing.

730
00:48:53.519 --> 00:49:00.659
He sends him lame is, uh, and it's because he's saying, this is you, you are Javert.

731
00:49:00.780 --> 00:49:05.340
I am Valjean, and that's how they defeat him.

732
00:49:05.400 --> 00:49:11.159
Like, because both of those messages are just the most obvious thing that he can think of to sand.

733
00:49:12.239 --> 00:49:16.139
Do you mind amusing the literary illusions, like the comparison?

734
00:49:16.199 --> 00:49:17.039
No, not at all.

735
00:49:17.099 --> 00:49:17.699
I think it's good.

736
00:49:17.760 --> 00:49:29.940
And I think it's, I think it is, you know, the fact that they talk about French melodrama, again, you know, remember when Archer is talking to Andreas Katsullis and he can't name a single classical play or something?

737
00:49:31.139 --> 00:49:32.820
In the library, you'll find something.

738
00:49:32.880 --> 00:49:33.480
You'll find something.

739
00:49:34.679 --> 00:49:40.440
Whereas, you know, even Dax has read it and doesn't like it, like, I think that's great.

740
00:49:40.980 --> 00:49:44.579
And I do think that that makes her a little bit more relatable.

741
00:49:44.639 --> 00:49:46.320
It's kind of like, oh, 17th century.

742
00:49:46.440 --> 00:49:48.059
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

743
00:49:49.139 --> 00:49:51.000
I mean, imagine if it was Picard.

744
00:49:51.119 --> 00:49:52.920
A phone piece of mixture.

745
00:49:52.980 --> 00:49:53.460
Yeah, exactly.

746
00:49:53.519 --> 00:49:53.940
Exactly.

747
00:49:55.139 --> 00:50:00.000
So that's pretty great and Cisco's Reddit and stuff, but no one's seen the musical apparently.

748
00:50:01.559 --> 00:50:05.519
No, it's so, wow, you know, they don't have no fun in the future, do they?

749
00:50:05.579 --> 00:50:09.420
The entertainment is, I mean, what is entertainment in the future?

750
00:50:09.539 --> 00:50:10.980
I don't have TV, do they?

751
00:50:11.400 --> 00:50:12.840
No, they have the holiday.

752
00:50:12.960 --> 00:50:13.679
Hol novels.

753
00:50:13.920 --> 00:50:14.460
Yeah.

754
00:50:14.519 --> 00:50:15.179
Oh, of course.

755
00:50:15.239 --> 00:50:16.800
Yeah, I can actually be in the musical.

756
00:50:16.860 --> 00:50:17.400
They want it.

757
00:50:17.400 --> 00:50:17.940
Yeah.

758
00:50:18.000 --> 00:50:18.480
Yeah, yeah.

759
00:50:19.260 --> 00:50:22.860
Well, it's mostly, you know, shacks and doctor to Anna's sister.

760
00:50:22.920 --> 00:50:23.460
This is so funny.

761
00:50:23.519 --> 00:50:25.559
I hope you notice.

762
00:50:26.159 --> 00:50:32.820
They're trying to do sort of handheld camera work, but the set's so small. they can only move it a fraction of an inch.

763
00:50:33.119 --> 00:50:35.880
But don't move it over there or we'll see the viewscreen.

764
00:50:36.900 --> 00:50:37.920
That's right, yeah.

765
00:50:38.760 --> 00:50:40.199
We haven't put up the window, all right?

766
00:50:40.320 --> 00:50:43.559
Yeah, well, again, we don't do this map on the view screen.

767
00:50:43.619 --> 00:50:47.460
We do it in this tiny screen here in this corner of this tiny set.

768
00:50:48.300 --> 00:50:53.159
Nathan, look, there's a screen full of Dax and Kira looking absolutely magnificent.

769
00:50:53.219 --> 00:50:54.360
So aren't they fantastic?

770
00:50:55.500 --> 00:50:56.099
So great.

771
00:50:56.940 --> 00:50:57.539
So great.

772
00:50:58.260 --> 00:51:01.860
Do you know, I want to get that women of trek book that nana is so right.

773
00:51:02.760 --> 00:51:03.599
She interviews.

774
00:51:03.659 --> 00:51:07.860
People right the way back to Michelle Nichols to Kurtzman Trek action.

775
00:51:07.920 --> 00:51:08.639
Yeah, as well.

776
00:51:08.699 --> 00:51:13.619
So I want to see what journey we've gone on with the ladies over the last 30 years.

777
00:51:14.039 --> 00:51:17.880
Didn't she say that Jess Bush said, no, we wouldn't put up with any of that shit, you know?

778
00:51:21.599 --> 00:51:22.619
And good for them.

779
00:51:22.679 --> 00:51:23.340
Yeah, yeah.

780
00:51:23.519 --> 00:51:26.880
I wouldn't try and hoodwink Jess Bush.

781
00:51:26.940 --> 00:51:27.539
She's scary.

782
00:51:28.559 --> 00:51:29.820
I mean, to be fair, it.

783
00:51:30.119 --> 00:51:34.619
They've just introduced a poisonous element into the atmosphere of a planet, right?

784
00:51:34.679 --> 00:51:36.360
Which means the Kardashians have got to go.

785
00:51:36.599 --> 00:51:37.019
Yeah.

786
00:51:37.019 --> 00:51:40.440
So, Cisco is just doing the same thing.

787
00:51:40.860 --> 00:51:44.219
And in fact, it's resolved because they swap planets, right?

788
00:51:44.280 --> 00:51:50.639
Like, that's literally what happens at the end. is, oh, and by the way, the Cardassians move to this planet and we move to the other planet.

789
00:51:50.760 --> 00:52:07.980
I'm not quite sure why we say, um, there's one thing here which I think is weird, which is that Cisco does destroy a ship, like fires on a McKee ship, presumably killing everyone on board, uh, and we never say anything about that or, or like that seems like the worst thing that he does.

790
00:52:08.760 --> 00:52:10.440
And no one comments on it.

791
00:52:11.699 --> 00:52:13.860
You're right. that is strange.

792
00:52:13.920 --> 00:52:15.599
I do love those POV shots.

793
00:52:15.659 --> 00:52:17.940
So through the defiant window following the ships.

794
00:52:18.059 --> 00:52:18.840
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

795
00:52:18.900 --> 00:52:21.780
Yeah, it has a nice sense of urgency, yeah. really good.

796
00:52:21.960 --> 00:52:26.219
And again, again, when it blows up, they're shooting it from below the model.

797
00:52:26.400 --> 00:52:28.920
So it just feels really impressive.

798
00:52:29.219 --> 00:52:30.300
No, I think it's really good.

799
00:52:30.360 --> 00:52:36.840
You know, it's good visual and stuff, but it doesn't go anywhere and it seems odd and it should probably have been can't.

800
00:52:37.500 --> 00:52:38.340
But I do like this.

801
00:52:38.519 --> 00:52:43.559
But maybe at the end of the episode when Dax goes, you know, sometimes I like it when the bad guy wins.

802
00:52:43.619 --> 00:52:46.800
Oh, are you going to write the letter to all those marquee members families?

803
00:52:47.400 --> 00:52:48.480
I did that ship.

804
00:52:49.380 --> 00:52:56.880
But again, this, because this is starting to give us an idea of what Eddington thinks.

805
00:52:57.420 --> 00:53:05.519
And not for a 2nd does Cisco consider leaving the Cardassians to die and going after Eddington.

806
00:53:05.699 --> 00:53:16.679
But because Eddington thinks he's Javert, he thinks that this might even work on him, you know, that, uh, But he's not, he doesn't seem particularly fussed about missing Eddington this time.

807
00:53:16.739 --> 00:53:19.139
It's kind of like, oh, All right, I better go and save those guys.

808
00:53:19.380 --> 00:53:20.760
We've got people to say...

809
00:53:20.820 --> 00:53:30.900
Well, when he sets off the torpedo at the end, He does send him a message going, you've got a little while to get away from the planet, but I am going to poison the atmosphere.

810
00:53:31.019 --> 00:53:33.000
Yeah, which is what you will just do it.

811
00:53:33.420 --> 00:53:34.980
Like, literally what you were just doing.

812
00:53:35.039 --> 00:53:35.460
Twice.

813
00:53:35.519 --> 00:53:36.900
Doesn't he do it to 2 planets?

814
00:53:38.519 --> 00:53:39.239
I like as well.

815
00:53:40.079 --> 00:53:42.059
Now they've introduced the book. yeah.

816
00:53:42.179 --> 00:53:49.079
They've basically got carte launch from this point in the episode to make this as melodramatic as Les Miserables.

817
00:53:49.139 --> 00:53:51.119
But we know exactly what we're doing now.

818
00:53:51.539 --> 00:54:03.780
So that last scene, I mean, I can't think of many scenes in 90s trick that are as madly melodramatic as, all right, Chavette, I'll give you what you want.

819
00:54:04.739 --> 00:54:07.199
Maybe Gates that time when she went, shut up.

820
00:54:07.440 --> 00:54:08.699
But apart from that.

821
00:54:08.760 --> 00:54:17.760
Well, I mean, think about what happens with Maxwell and O'Brien, in the wounded at the end, where they sort of sing the song and they think about what the Cardassian War was like and Maxwell kind of goes.

822
00:54:17.940 --> 00:54:18.960
Understated, isn't it?

823
00:54:19.019 --> 00:54:22.320
Yeah, but Maxwell kind of goes, that's all over now, isn't it?

824
00:54:22.679 --> 00:54:24.179
you know, that's finished.

825
00:54:24.239 --> 00:54:29.280
This is, that was a time, but it's gone and I'm doing the wrong thing.

826
00:54:30.719 --> 00:54:33.360
Like I said, Nathan, DS9, it's got a sense of occasion.

827
00:54:33.480 --> 00:54:34.559
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

828
00:54:34.619 --> 00:54:36.239
I think this is this is better.

829
00:54:37.079 --> 00:54:40.139
But I do, I do like how that, that one resolves itself.

830
00:54:40.260 --> 00:54:41.099
Yeah, I did too.

831
00:54:41.159 --> 00:54:41.820
Oh, I did too.

832
00:54:41.880 --> 00:54:42.179
Yeah.

833
00:54:42.719 --> 00:54:44.460
I mean, I think TNG is better.

834
00:54:44.820 --> 00:54:48.780
Like it should be subtle. when TNG does melodrama.

835
00:54:48.840 --> 00:54:51.360
Well, it's usually in a very earnest sort of way.

836
00:54:51.539 --> 00:54:52.559
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

837
00:54:53.039 --> 00:55:04.559
But again, all of this now, here's the plot of, well, so Wikipedia doesn't start until 2001 and so, and this is 1997.

838
00:55:04.800 --> 00:55:20.280
I think we're on the internet at this and most people have seen Lame Miz, but we do have to explain what it is and what it's about and who Javert and who Valjean are for the viewers at home, which I think is...

839
00:55:20.340 --> 00:55:21.659
I will confess.

840
00:55:21.719 --> 00:55:27.360
I will confess that I am that person to talking to because I hadn't heard of Les Miserables.

841
00:55:27.420 --> 00:55:27.840
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

842
00:55:27.840 --> 00:55:28.739
I'd watch this episode.

843
00:55:28.920 --> 00:55:29.639
Well, that's it.

844
00:55:29.699 --> 00:55:30.300
So it was perfect for me.

845
00:55:30.539 --> 00:55:31.800
For a kid, do you know what I mean?

846
00:55:31.860 --> 00:55:41.159
Like that's kind of, and that's kind of, this is how I learned about Les Miserable was watching this episode is absolutely going to be a whole bunch of the audience's experience, I think, too.

847
00:55:42.599 --> 00:55:44.699
Nathan Terry's always.

848
00:55:44.760 --> 00:55:46.619
Oh, they're like cut jewels.

849
00:55:46.920 --> 00:55:47.880
Did you see are they?

850
00:55:47.940 --> 00:55:48.719
Looking at him.

851
00:55:49.199 --> 00:55:50.280
Gosh, beautiful.

852
00:55:50.340 --> 00:55:55.260
She is. she's stunning Now he's saying, it's not about the policeman.

853
00:55:55.320 --> 00:55:56.519
It's about Valjolan.

854
00:55:56.579 --> 00:55:57.480
Yeah, yeah, that's it.

855
00:55:57.539 --> 00:56:01.619
He likes Les Mis not, because it's about Cisco, because it's about him.

856
00:56:01.619 --> 00:56:07.139
And his work that out, and this is him working out how to fool him.

857
00:56:07.199 --> 00:56:11.639
And again, it's fooling him, which is what happened to him.

858
00:56:11.699 --> 00:56:16.800
You know, you had Sanders say, you know, he fooled you and stuff like that.

859
00:56:16.860 --> 00:56:17.579
Oh, sorry.

860
00:56:18.000 --> 00:56:25.199
But now Cisco gets his own back by fooling him and actually getting him into prison, which is where we next see him at the beginning of Blaze of Glory.

861
00:56:26.219 --> 00:56:27.420
I love that line.

862
00:56:27.480 --> 00:56:28.619
He's Robin Hurd.

863
00:56:28.679 --> 00:56:31.199
He's a dashing, romantic figure.

864
00:56:31.260 --> 00:56:32.519
That's how he sees himself.

865
00:56:32.880 --> 00:56:42.360
And so it makes perfect sense that we get a chance to allow Avery Brooks to finally emerge as the villain of the scene.

866
00:56:42.480 --> 00:56:43.800
Yeah, yeah, yeah, the last scene.

867
00:56:44.400 --> 00:56:45.960
I mean, do you know the bit?

868
00:56:46.260 --> 00:56:48.480
It absolutely kills me every time I see it.

869
00:56:48.599 --> 00:56:49.260
Major.

870
00:56:49.679 --> 00:56:50.639
Shut that thing off.

871
00:56:50.820 --> 00:56:53.639
Commander Worf, prepare to launch torpedoes.

872
00:56:53.880 --> 00:56:57.179
And then he goes, wait, and Cisco gives him a look.

873
00:56:57.360 --> 00:56:59.820
There's basically a massive bloody punch in the face.

874
00:57:00.780 --> 00:57:02.820
It's incredible, that last thing.

875
00:57:04.260 --> 00:57:05.340
But we're not there yet.

876
00:57:05.400 --> 00:57:05.940
Not quite.

877
00:57:07.320 --> 00:57:09.360
I'm just getting excited.

878
00:57:10.860 --> 00:57:14.880
But look at Cisco. really animated. like he loves this idea.

879
00:57:15.539 --> 00:57:18.840
He loves the idea and it's not because he really is the villain.

880
00:57:19.079 --> 00:57:32.340
In fact, the thing that sells him as being the villain is wharf objecting to the possible launch of torpedoes because remember that on Star Trek, the next generation.

881
00:57:32.519 --> 00:57:40.019
He was the one who's always wrong and who always wants to take the violent course of action and it is always overruled.

882
00:57:41.460 --> 00:57:44.340
I like the fact that Cisco doesn't tell him what he's up to.

883
00:57:44.460 --> 00:57:45.599
He's told Dax.

884
00:57:45.659 --> 00:57:48.300
These 2 are like, fucking hell, he's lost his mind.

885
00:57:48.840 --> 00:57:51.960
Look, Kira looks like, you want me to walk?

886
00:57:53.219 --> 00:58:00.719
I think part of the thing too is that maybe they shouldn't have chosen trilithium resin as the name for the poison.

887
00:58:01.619 --> 00:58:11.940
Um, because it was established as a very deadly kind of toxin to everyone sort of thing.

888
00:58:12.360 --> 00:58:13.920
But whatever. doesn't matter.

889
00:58:14.340 --> 00:58:17.280
They're just reaching back into the glossary for another name.

890
00:58:17.340 --> 00:58:19.860
Remember we 1st hear about it in Starship Mine?

891
00:58:21.420 --> 00:58:30.960
I just love the look on Wolf's face when he goes, commander, I said launch torpedoes and Wolf's going, I don't want to be an accessory to this.

892
00:58:34.019 --> 00:58:36.780
But of course, like, this is all part of the fun, right?

893
00:58:36.840 --> 00:58:38.820
That they think he's lost his mind.

894
00:58:38.880 --> 00:58:40.619
Yeah, yeah. as well as Eddington does.

895
00:58:40.739 --> 00:58:42.719
But it's to try and sell it to Edington, I think.

896
00:58:43.860 --> 00:58:44.280
Yeah.

897
00:58:45.000 --> 00:58:54.659
And actually, when the torpedoes go out, there's a really menodramatic sting of music that goes like, like, it's really over the top.

898
00:58:54.900 --> 00:59:01.559
I didn't notice who did the music here, but I thought the music was actually pretty good and it riffed on the theme quite a lot.

899
00:59:01.920 --> 00:59:02.820
Is it Jay?

900
00:59:03.480 --> 00:59:05.880
It probably is, Jay. it's good, it's usually J.

901
00:59:08.639 --> 00:59:10.139
Oh, boy, 0 boy.

902
00:59:10.199 --> 00:59:11.400
Incoming transmission.

903
00:59:11.460 --> 00:59:12.059
Here we go.

904
00:59:12.179 --> 00:59:12.900
Here we go.

905
00:59:15.599 --> 00:59:17.039
You're bluffing, all right?

906
00:59:18.780 --> 00:59:21.119
No, he's calling him Shafir for fucks.

907
00:59:21.179 --> 00:59:21.840
Yeah, no.

908
00:59:25.559 --> 00:59:27.539
What a fucking drama queen.

909
00:59:28.920 --> 00:59:32.880
You're gonna turn a whole planet of people into hopeless refugees.

910
00:59:34.139 --> 00:59:35.400
That's not all I'm going to do.

911
00:59:35.519 --> 00:59:36.300
Just minutes ago.

912
00:59:37.019 --> 00:59:40.739
I'm going to every fucking planet in the DMC, all right?

913
00:59:43.079 --> 00:59:46.800
And this is sort of like the Cisco that you see in this episode.

914
00:59:46.860 --> 00:59:49.679
It is what they didn't want for Cisco, wasn't it?

915
00:59:49.739 --> 00:59:50.519
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

916
00:59:50.519 --> 00:59:53.280
To start off with, they didn't want this aggressive bully.

917
00:59:55.139 --> 00:59:57.420
You know, fist fly and things like that.

918
00:59:57.480 --> 01:00:01.199
But come on, it plays into Avery Bruce's strengths as an actor.

919
01:00:01.500 --> 01:00:07.920
But I actually like, you know, his villain act here isn't as overtly angry as he was before.

920
01:00:08.039 --> 01:00:09.420
He's super calm.

921
01:00:09.960 --> 01:00:12.480
And look, look at what a big girl.

922
01:00:12.539 --> 01:00:13.679
Eddington's being.

923
01:00:16.559 --> 01:00:18.420
He's got his little quivering lip and stuff.

924
01:00:18.480 --> 01:00:20.340
A big girl, that's a sexist thing to say.

925
01:00:20.460 --> 01:00:23.579
But he's being a big drama queen, I guess I can say that at least.

926
01:00:24.480 --> 01:00:29.639
This pair, I promised myself, I was like, this pair would have the best revenge sex you've ever seen in your life.

927
01:00:29.820 --> 01:00:31.380
I'm telling you, it'll be amazing.

928
01:00:33.179 --> 01:00:36.960
You should have thought about that before you attacked a Federation Starfleet.

929
01:00:40.079 --> 01:00:41.820
Laying a course to track and two.

930
01:00:41.880 --> 01:00:43.860
We're gonna go and blow up a few more planets.

931
01:00:43.920 --> 01:00:48.719
Yeah, we're going to go get Nissa and Tree Mass...

932
01:00:49.860 --> 01:00:50.340
Yeah.

933
01:00:50.340 --> 01:00:53.280
Console, Cassia.

934
01:00:57.599 --> 01:00:59.820
You betrayed your uniform.

935
01:00:59.880 --> 01:01:01.320
Oh, I love all this.

936
01:01:04.500 --> 01:01:08.280
Oh, look, look at, he's like a bomb waiting to go off Cisco.

937
01:01:08.340 --> 01:01:10.139
No, this is just him doing acting, though, remember?

938
01:01:10.260 --> 01:01:12.659
This is him doing acting.

939
01:01:12.659 --> 01:01:14.219
No, acting.

940
01:01:14.219 --> 01:01:15.960
But it's Cisco doing acting.

941
01:01:16.019 --> 01:01:17.699
I don't mean it's Avery doing acting.

942
01:01:17.760 --> 01:01:20.039
It's Cisco doing the big.

943
01:01:20.099 --> 01:01:26.880
I'm, you know, like, I'm Javert and I'm going to make you, like, he's going to make him surrender.

944
01:01:27.960 --> 01:01:29.159
Oh, well, fine.

945
01:01:29.219 --> 01:01:31.199
Cisco, look at me like that then, please.

946
01:01:32.280 --> 01:01:33.179
Blazing eyes.

947
01:01:33.420 --> 01:01:35.460
Oh, right, Javert, here we go.

948
01:01:35.880 --> 01:01:37.320
I'll give you what you want.

949
01:01:38.820 --> 01:01:39.780
Why do you mean?

950
01:01:44.579 --> 01:01:45.059
Sorry.

951
01:01:45.119 --> 01:01:47.280
This is better than he's not coming back.

952
01:01:47.400 --> 01:01:47.940
All right.

953
01:01:48.239 --> 01:01:49.800
Although that was funny good as well.

954
01:01:49.920 --> 01:01:51.599
And for the same reason, I think.

955
01:01:51.659 --> 01:01:54.059
It's just, like, we get this, oh, my God.

956
01:01:54.119 --> 01:01:59.039
We get the sort of giant hilarious over the top cliche thing.

957
01:01:59.880 --> 01:02:01.679
Are they locks his fingers together?

958
01:02:01.739 --> 01:02:02.519
Very satisfied.

959
01:02:02.639 --> 01:02:04.199
Well, that went well. villain.

960
01:02:08.880 --> 01:02:12.300
And now here we are for the closing scene.

961
01:02:13.920 --> 01:02:14.400
Yeah.

962
01:02:14.460 --> 01:02:18.300
I feel like we shouldn't be having this much fun with poison planets, but they swap.

963
01:02:18.360 --> 01:02:18.960
They just swap.

964
01:02:19.199 --> 01:02:20.400
See, it just says that.

965
01:02:20.519 --> 01:02:26.519
Oh, that way very quietly just goes, oh, do. as Eddington comes out.

966
01:02:27.179 --> 01:02:28.260
Basically get rid of him.

967
01:02:28.800 --> 01:02:31.199
It's the, I trust you had a productive mission.

968
01:02:31.199 --> 01:02:34.019
And like, you don't know at this point that they're bringing him back.

969
01:02:34.380 --> 01:02:38.280
You know, like we didn't know that and we see him sort of arrive.

970
01:02:39.480 --> 01:02:42.239
And to be fair, to DS9, it could have ended here, right?

971
01:02:42.300 --> 01:02:43.260
They've got him.

972
01:02:43.320 --> 01:02:51.960
That could have been the end, but no, they did one last episode showing the consequences after this and, well, massacring the entire market.

973
01:02:52.739 --> 01:02:57.539
But that does go to show that the Jemadawa are a terrifying thought in that.

974
01:02:57.659 --> 01:02:58.139
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

975
01:02:58.199 --> 01:02:59.880
In fact, what that's what it is, isn't it?

976
01:02:59.940 --> 01:03:07.559
The Jem'adar kind of take their place, like the McKee were a previous adversary that are wiped out by the Jem'adar, and that just helps to beef up the Jem'adar.

977
01:03:07.739 --> 01:03:10.679
And I think it gives us a fight scene too. quite good.

978
01:03:11.039 --> 01:03:12.360
As hell last line.

979
01:03:12.420 --> 01:03:13.619
Oh, I love it.

980
01:03:13.679 --> 01:03:14.760
Yeah, just remember.

981
01:03:14.820 --> 01:03:17.099
Sometimes I love it when the bad guy wins.

982
01:03:17.219 --> 01:03:19.079
It's a great sax line too, isn't it?

983
01:03:19.619 --> 01:03:20.340
It is.

984
01:03:20.340 --> 01:03:22.559
Do you know, I mean, you know me.

985
01:03:22.619 --> 01:03:27.539
I love season 5 of Dick Space 9 and look at what we've done recently.

986
01:03:27.780 --> 01:03:31.800
We did that 2 passer in Purgatory Shadows, by Inferno's light.

987
01:03:31.860 --> 01:03:34.440
We've done trials and tribulations recently.

988
01:03:34.860 --> 01:03:35.940
Now we've done this.

989
01:03:36.000 --> 01:03:49.860
Like, I think this is a really confident time for Big Space 9. where, you know, there is the odd, let he who is without sin, although that does still have Vanessa Williams and Dax, who is doing the pottery scene from Ghost together.

990
01:03:49.920 --> 01:03:50.880
So we'll give it that.

991
01:03:51.480 --> 01:03:55.079
But I just think they got the characters where they want them.

992
01:03:55.139 --> 01:04:00.179
They've got the stories where they want them at this and that is just reaping a lot of awards.

993
01:04:00.239 --> 01:04:00.539
Yeah.

994
01:04:08.460 --> 01:04:12.420
It's the end of the episode, and it's time for us to work out where we're going next.

995
01:04:13.320 --> 01:04:18.300
This was your choice, naturally, an excellent episode of Deep Space 9.

996
01:04:18.360 --> 01:04:24.179
And so it's my go on the randomiser, and we are going to go back somewhere that we haven't been to for quite some time.

997
01:04:25.380 --> 01:04:29.159
We are going to watch an episode of Star Trek Picard.

998
01:04:30.059 --> 01:04:39.420
Episode 159 was our last Picard episode, and this was episode 199. 40 episodes we've done.

999
01:04:39.480 --> 01:04:40.260
It's been a while.

1000
01:04:40.320 --> 01:04:41.460
Do we hate this show so much?

1001
01:04:41.699 --> 01:04:42.360
I don't know.

1002
01:04:42.420 --> 01:04:43.739
I kind of want to eke it out.

1003
01:04:44.340 --> 01:04:45.480
But who knows?

1004
01:04:45.539 --> 01:04:46.139
Who knows?

1005
01:04:46.320 --> 01:04:47.219
Do you know why it is?

1006
01:04:47.340 --> 01:04:49.679
There's just so many 90s Treks episodes.

1007
01:04:50.039 --> 01:04:50.699
No, I know.

1008
01:04:51.000 --> 01:04:52.739
We've got to get through what we do.

1009
01:04:52.860 --> 01:05:00.480
It's also a little bit hard to watch Picard because of course, like Discovery, the basic narrative unit. of Star Trek Picard is the season rather than the episode.

1010
01:05:00.659 --> 01:05:04.199
And so we always have to spend a bit of time to orient ourselves.

1011
01:05:05.400 --> 01:05:07.380
But let's see what we come up with.

1012
01:05:08.280 --> 01:05:11.579
I like doing that though. you know, I've sort of discovered now.

1013
01:05:11.639 --> 01:05:20.340
I quite like dropping myself in the season and seeing which episodes sink or swim, you know, depending on where they are. way that no one ever watches them.

1014
01:05:20.579 --> 01:05:21.179
All right.

1015
01:05:21.360 --> 01:05:21.840
Exactly.

1016
01:05:23.400 --> 01:05:24.179
Excuse me.

1017
01:05:24.300 --> 01:05:26.699
You was the co-creator of this format, right?

1018
01:05:26.940 --> 01:05:28.320
No, it was my dumb idea too.

1019
01:05:28.500 --> 01:05:29.340
Yeah, exactly.

1020
01:05:29.760 --> 01:05:30.420
All right.

1021
01:05:30.719 --> 01:05:31.980
I'm going to press the button.

1022
01:05:34.380 --> 01:05:39.900
Your random Star Trek Picard episode is season two, episode 4 Watcher.

1023
01:05:41.519 --> 01:05:44.639
Us, 7 and Rafi, search for the detained Rios.

1024
01:05:44.639 --> 01:05:45.420
Oh, Rios.

1025
01:05:45.480 --> 01:05:46.440
Yeah, beautiful.

1026
01:05:46.500 --> 01:05:52.260
A lot attempts to enlist the help of an old friend in finding the location of the watcher.

1027
01:05:52.500 --> 01:05:59.099
Well, that does sound like a sort of uh, sort of uh, A to B sort of episode. little bit.

1028
01:05:59.159 --> 01:06:01.139
I think Ola Brady might be the watcher.

1029
01:06:01.199 --> 01:06:03.000
I think that might be what's going on here.

1030
01:06:03.239 --> 01:06:10.860
We do get to learn how evil ice is as an organisation, but that's just the news these days.

1031
01:06:10.920 --> 01:06:12.360
That was 2022.

1032
01:06:12.719 --> 01:06:14.280
Trapoliso, Nathan.

1033
01:06:14.280 --> 01:06:15.900
The last one we did was 2 of one.

1034
01:06:16.320 --> 01:06:18.599
That was also a bit of an A to B episode.

1035
01:06:18.659 --> 01:06:21.420
I feel like if we're going back to Picard after so long.

1036
01:06:21.480 --> 01:06:22.380
We should do a biggie.

1037
01:06:22.440 --> 01:06:23.219
Yeah, I think you're right.

1038
01:06:23.280 --> 01:06:27.059
I think you're right Although 2 of one did have an excellent musical number in it.

1039
01:06:27.840 --> 01:06:28.079
Yes.

1040
01:06:28.320 --> 01:06:29.039
Oh, boy.

1041
01:06:29.099 --> 01:06:30.719
I could still see her in that red dress.

1042
01:06:31.800 --> 01:06:33.960
What is it about red dresses and singing?

1043
01:06:34.019 --> 01:06:35.579
I mean, his way, 2 of one.

1044
01:06:35.639 --> 01:06:37.199
It always works. wonderful.

1045
01:06:38.460 --> 01:06:39.119
All right.

1046
01:06:39.239 --> 01:06:40.380
I think it might be this one.

1047
01:06:41.400 --> 01:06:48.300
Your random Star Trek Picard episode is season three, episode five, Imposters.

1048
01:06:49.440 --> 01:06:50.400
Imposters.

1049
01:06:50.460 --> 01:06:59.280
Picard and Riker, prepare to face consequences for their actions when they are greeted by a familiar face from the past, who is investigating a deeper threat.

1050
01:06:59.340 --> 01:07:00.300
It's the row episode.

1051
01:07:00.539 --> 01:07:01.860
Yeah, I think it might be.

1052
01:07:01.980 --> 01:07:03.780
Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1053
01:07:03.840 --> 01:07:04.800
Oh, let's do that.

1054
01:07:04.860 --> 01:07:05.400
Yeah, come on.

1055
01:07:05.460 --> 01:07:06.179
That a big...

1056
01:07:06.239 --> 01:07:07.559
Okay, yep, I think we do that one.

1057
01:07:07.619 --> 01:07:08.219
Absolutely.

1058
01:07:08.280 --> 01:07:12.179
And we've only done one episode of season 3 of Picard up till now.

1059
01:07:13.139 --> 01:07:21.719
Is this the episode where they do the unthinkable and have Picard and Riker have that massive row at the end of the episode?

1060
01:07:21.780 --> 01:07:22.860
Oh, maybe I can't remember that.

1061
01:07:22.920 --> 01:07:23.639
I think it is.

1062
01:07:24.119 --> 01:07:24.960
I can't remember.

1063
01:07:25.559 --> 01:07:32.760
It lasts for a bit and it's, that's the one point of that season where I really sat up and I was like, fucking hell, we are doing something new here.

1064
01:07:33.239 --> 01:07:35.219
I just think this season is really great.

1065
01:07:35.280 --> 01:07:42.960
And it's not just because it's the old crew doing the same old shit that they did for 7 years because it's not.

1066
01:07:43.380 --> 01:07:46.139
But it's a really long single adventure.

1067
01:07:46.199 --> 01:07:53.820
You know, we're on the Titan for hours and hours, you know, like much longer than a movie and lots and lots of things happen in that time.

1068
01:07:54.000 --> 01:07:55.199
I think it's really great.

1069
01:07:55.559 --> 01:07:57.239
It does lift its game.

1070
01:07:57.360 --> 01:08:05.820
I think as a story. and it's not just, I think, nostalgia and fan service that makes season 3 so good, but we'll see.

1071
01:08:06.300 --> 01:08:14.639
You know, you know, my general issue with 3 is the departure of all the characters from one. and two.

1072
01:08:14.699 --> 01:08:15.420
Oh, I loved.

1073
01:08:15.420 --> 01:08:16.439
Alison Peele.

1074
01:08:17.100 --> 01:08:18.960
In favour of getting marina cert.

1075
01:08:18.960 --> 01:08:20.520
It's against, but...

1076
01:08:20.579 --> 01:08:22.619
I mean, what's happening here?

1077
01:08:24.899 --> 01:08:26.460
But that sounds great.

1078
01:08:26.520 --> 01:08:31.140
I can't wait to watch that I do remember that 1st half of 3 being pretty great, actually.

1079
01:08:31.500 --> 01:08:32.399
Yeah, cool.

1080
01:08:32.460 --> 01:08:32.939
Excellent.

1081
01:08:33.000 --> 01:08:46.020
Let's do that You've been listening, Tom titled Star Trek Project with Joe Ford and Nathan Bottomley.

1082
01:08:46.199 --> 01:08:52.140
We're online at Untitled Star Trek project.com, where you can find subscription links and links to our social media accounts.

1083
01:08:52.439 --> 01:08:57.359
Our podcast artwork is by Kayla Ciceran, and the theme was composed by Cameron Lamb.

1084
01:08:57.720 --> 01:09:03.420
This episode was recorded on the 1st of September 2026 and released on the 4th of September.

1085
01:09:03.539 --> 01:09:07.260
We'll see you next time for Star Trek Picard, imposters.

1086
01:09:26.220 --> 01:09:27.180
I, uh...

1087
01:09:27.180 --> 01:09:28.260
Oh, we're out now.

1088
01:09:28.380 --> 01:09:29.279
Yeah, I...

1089
01:09:29.279 --> 01:09:33.000
So, one way she dies, where she sacrifices herself at the end, she does.

1090
01:09:33.060 --> 01:09:33.359
Yeah.

1091
01:09:33.420 --> 01:09:34.199
It's really good.

1092
01:09:34.260 --> 01:09:38.100
And then later on they kill Shelby, remember, in the kind of final battle?

1093
01:09:38.340 --> 01:09:39.779
Like in the final episode.

1094
01:09:40.199 --> 01:09:42.359
They get Elizabeth Dennahy back in and kill her.

1095
01:09:44.100 --> 01:09:45.539
Couldn't they have killed Gates?

1096
01:09:45.659 --> 01:09:46.260
No.

1097
01:09:49.500 --> 01:09:50.039
No.

1098
01:09:50.039 --> 01:09:53.579
They give her a big fucking gun.

1099
01:09:53.760 --> 01:09:54.840
Thank you for a giant gun.

1100
01:09:55.500 --> 01:09:58.380
She wouldn't have been able to show emotion while she died, wouldn't she?

1101
01:09:58.439 --> 01:09:59.640
She'd just be staring at me.

1102
01:09:59.640 --> 01:10:01.079
She would understand what was going on.

1103
01:10:01.140 --> 01:10:04.439
It's only when she's doing medicine and stuff that she's terrible.

1104
01:10:06.000 --> 01:10:10.439
They made me die when I listened back to final mission and I'm going, look at her.

1105
01:10:10.500 --> 01:10:15.180
She's vacant and you're going, no, she's, you say she's tense.

1106
01:10:16.739 --> 01:10:17.880
How can you do that?

1107
01:10:18.840 --> 01:10:20.279
She's always Ted.

1108
01:10:21.119 --> 01:10:22.680
You don't want to execute my son.

1109
01:10:23.760 --> 01:10:24.720
Oh, I don't know.

1110
01:10:24.779 --> 01:10:25.920
I think I mentioned that, didn't I?

1111
01:10:25.979 --> 01:10:27.239
You even did that line.

1112
01:10:27.600 --> 01:10:28.199
And shut up.

1113
01:10:28.260 --> 01:10:30.119
I forgot the 2nd one in a rope.

1114
01:10:30.300 --> 01:10:32.220
Good shut up. today as well.

1115
01:10:34.619 --> 01:10:36.960
Oh, gosh, justice.

1116
01:10:37.020 --> 01:10:37.439
Yeah.

1117
01:10:37.500 --> 01:10:38.220
Do you know what?

1118
01:10:38.279 --> 01:10:54.420
I think, actually, on, I might bounce us back after imposters and do a link to TNG and, because this is like TNG at its finest and then do.

1119
01:10:54.420 --> 01:11:01.079
And then do season one and say, let's go right back to the start. right, back to the start. one or two. one or two.

1120
01:11:01.859 --> 01:11:03.779
God, if we got it counted at 5 point.

1121
01:11:03.840 --> 01:11:05.760
I'll be so happy That'd be so great.

1122
01:11:06.119 --> 01:11:08.640
Holy crap, that was it. quite a bit of one.

1123
01:11:08.760 --> 01:11:09.899
We've done quite a bit of one.

1124
01:11:09.960 --> 01:11:11.399
Naked Now, Justice, Angel one.

1125
01:11:12.659 --> 01:11:14.340
Skinner for Evil, the Neutral Zone.

1126
01:11:14.880 --> 01:11:16.140
We've only done up.

1127
01:11:16.199 --> 01:11:17.520
I think of the best segue, Nathan.

1128
01:11:17.699 --> 01:11:23.699
I could do, yes, okay, let's move away from gates and go to Dr. Pulaski.

1129
01:11:24.960 --> 01:11:26.760
Fabulous Diana Moldar.

1130
01:11:26.819 --> 01:11:27.720
She is fabulous.

1131
01:11:28.619 --> 01:11:30.300
I wonder why I put the seasons there.

1132
01:11:34.619 --> 01:11:39.420
I think the podcast orders, but the season and the and the season.

1133
01:11:39.539 --> 01:11:41.880
Even a jammer gave imposters 3.5 .

1134
01:11:42.000 --> 01:11:42.899
Well, of course he does.

1135
01:11:42.960 --> 01:11:43.920
It's quite serious.

1136
01:11:43.979 --> 01:11:45.479
It's TNG characters.

1137
01:11:45.539 --> 01:11:47.579
It's 90s trek, you know, Roseback.

1138
01:11:47.699 --> 01:11:48.119
Yeah.

1139
01:11:48.119 --> 01:11:49.260
No puppets.

1140
01:11:50.340 --> 01:11:51.180
No, buddy.

1141
01:11:52.140 --> 01:11:52.920
Jeez.

1142
01:11:53.159 --> 01:11:56.220
Oh, it's a shame, you know, they weren't marketing, though.

1143
01:11:56.699 --> 01:11:57.840
I mean, someone would be making them.

1144
01:11:58.560 --> 01:12:07.199
So I actually said, yeah, anyway, like, there's a reason why I'm a little bit sad that it's only a dream.

1145
01:12:08.279 --> 01:12:11.760
And yeah, because...

1146
01:12:11.760 --> 01:12:13.800
Yeah, but in the sense that it didn't happen.

1147
01:12:13.859 --> 01:12:19.560
But it didn't happen as much as every other single episode of Star Trek, the Next Generation, didn't happen.

1148
01:12:19.859 --> 01:12:20.640
You know what I mean?

1149
01:12:20.699 --> 01:12:21.239
We saw it.

1150
01:12:21.359 --> 01:12:22.380
So it happened.

1151
01:12:23.399 --> 01:12:24.840
You can't tell these people that, though.

1152
01:12:24.899 --> 01:12:25.979
No, no.

1153
01:12:26.039 --> 01:12:29.399
And so part of it was a documentary.

1154
01:12:29.460 --> 01:12:31.380
It gives them a sop and that doesn't matter.

1155
01:12:32.939 --> 01:12:40.859
But then the other thing is, um, that there's a thing that they do that they discover because they're invulnerable.

1156
01:12:41.220 --> 01:12:57.539
So the lead, Orion Pirate's a woman, and she just cuts, Pelle is complaining or saying something, and he just, she gets her sort out and cuts her in half, and then we have a scene in Sick Bay, where they're just stitching her together, because it's all just fluff coming out.

1157
01:12:57.960 --> 01:13:06.000
Like, I think Arne's arm falls off at one point, they just sew it back on. because it's a Muppet. and they learn it's a Muppet.

1158
01:13:06.119 --> 01:13:08.939
And so, and, um, she spaces Pike.

1159
01:13:09.000 --> 01:13:14.640
She throws pike out of the airlock, and of course he's fine because he doesn't have to breathe because he's a puppet.

1160
01:13:15.539 --> 01:13:19.500
And so the final scene has them all flying through space.

1161
01:13:19.560 --> 01:13:22.439
They can fly through space because it doesn't hurt them.

1162
01:13:22.680 --> 01:13:38.279
And it's actually, Spock says, um, oh, like, Spock says something about, oh, you know, so you, um, you were all turned back or something, you know, like, um, Scotty, you got the, and, you know, fix the transporter and you're all turned back.

1163
01:13:38.340 --> 01:13:41.399
And he says, well, why haven't you, haven't you turned back?

1164
01:13:41.880 --> 01:13:43.140
Why haven't they all turned back?

1165
01:13:43.500 --> 01:13:51.659
And Tupring says, there's something that they wanted to do, and you cut to them all outside flying through space unaided.

1166
01:13:51.720 --> 01:14:00.539
And it's really sweet and kind of exciting because they've, you know, spent their life in space, but they've never been able to properly experience being in it.

1167
01:14:00.779 --> 01:14:02.760
And it's actually really very cool.

1168
01:14:04.319 --> 01:14:05.039
Hear me out.

1169
01:14:10.079 --> 01:14:11.039
That sounds great.

1170
01:14:11.100 --> 01:14:12.239
And do you know what?

1171
01:14:12.300 --> 01:14:14.100
I think I'm going to really like that episode.

1172
01:14:16.680 --> 01:14:22.739
But there are moments where you potentially have jumped the shark and a load of puppets flying from his face.

1173
01:14:22.859 --> 01:14:24.600
I mean, to the wrong mind.

1174
01:14:25.020 --> 01:14:25.680
Yeah, I know.

1175
01:14:25.680 --> 01:14:28.380
That is funzy, jumping the shark, right?

1176
01:14:28.439 --> 01:14:30.300
Like that's like, what's happening here?

1177
01:14:30.600 --> 01:14:31.560
It's wonderful.

1178
01:14:31.619 --> 01:14:33.960
It's so good It's like it's like the musical.

1179
01:14:34.319 --> 01:14:38.159
We jumped the shark with the musical and that really happened, the musical.

1180
01:14:38.159 --> 01:14:39.060
I love the musical.

1181
01:14:39.119 --> 01:14:39.899
In fact, you know what?

1182
01:14:39.960 --> 01:14:43.920
I've grown increasing fondness for the song we were most critical of.

1183
01:14:43.979 --> 01:14:44.939
I've listened back to it.

1184
01:14:45.000 --> 01:14:47.939
So many times and now I really like it, which is the last one.

1185
01:14:48.060 --> 01:14:49.439
Oh, that I came the last one.

1186
01:14:49.680 --> 01:14:50.100
Yeah.

1187
01:14:50.159 --> 01:14:50.819
Okay, cool.

1188
01:14:50.939 --> 01:14:51.359
Cool.

1189
01:14:51.779 --> 01:14:57.720
Yeah, it's I'm very often heard singing that down the aisle of Sainsbury's.

1190
01:14:58.020 --> 01:15:00.000
I just love her song so much.

1191
01:15:00.539 --> 01:15:02.640
Like, or a song.

1192
01:15:03.479 --> 01:15:06.000
Oh, I still think all systems...

1193
01:15:06.000 --> 01:15:08.100
Yeah, I was just going to say. my favourite.

1194
01:15:08.579 --> 01:15:12.539
It's just I just remember watching that going, fuck me, they're going to get away with it.

1195
01:15:13.380 --> 01:15:15.180
This is really catchy.

1196
01:15:15.840 --> 01:15:16.260
Good.

1197
01:15:16.500 --> 01:15:24.300
But I know, I know I will watch that puppet episode when we get around to it and I will absolutely love it because I love Muppets.

1198
01:15:25.739 --> 01:15:29.399
I love cartoon humour. and all of the stuff, right?

1199
01:15:29.460 --> 01:15:30.479
I know I will love it.

1200
01:15:31.920 --> 01:15:36.180
It's just been a mad season though. cartoons before.

1201
01:15:36.300 --> 01:15:44.100
Remember the end of those old scientists where the final scene they're all drinking and they've become cartoons and they're kind of going, my eyes are really big and stuff.

1202
01:15:45.539 --> 01:16:01.020
I think like, like, um, Russell's uh, 2nd iteration of Doctor Who, I think because the show Star Trek and Doctor Who have kind of been cancelled, and this is the point where they've been cancelled.

1203
01:16:01.079 --> 01:16:07.199
It just gives all those assholes carte blanche to say, this is why this is why it's been cancelled. you know what I mean?

1204
01:16:07.319 --> 01:16:14.520
But and if they're doing something that's out there instead of doing tedious... like final mission.

1205
01:16:14.579 --> 01:16:18.060
Yeah, yeah. um, then it's all fuel for the fire.

1206
01:16:18.359 --> 01:16:35.699
Well, I mean, I mean, the thing is too, that that is going back to original Star Trek, which has the Romans episode and the gangsters episode. and you kind of think, yeah, yeah, yeah. which is great with the sort of thing that, you know, TNG would gnaw off both its own legs rather than do.

1207
01:16:35.880 --> 01:16:36.720
Do you know what I mean?

1208
01:16:36.779 --> 01:16:46.020
They would just never do that because that's just silly. one at the end of two, the pilot with the beautiful 60s woman secretary, the time traveller with a cat.

1209
01:16:46.739 --> 01:16:47.100
Yeah.

1210
01:16:47.100 --> 01:16:47.520
Yeah.

1211
01:16:47.939 --> 01:16:51.600
So all they do is the ones that people would remember, you know, in the future.

1212
01:16:52.079 --> 01:16:53.939
I think their holodeck episode is great.

1213
01:16:54.000 --> 01:16:57.659
That holodeck episode, which is about original Star Trek.

1214
01:16:57.720 --> 01:17:10.920
You know, again, that was where people were losing their shit because there's that scene of Kirk in charge of the ship, like Captain Kirk in charge of the shitty ship on Final Frontier or whatever the name of the show was.

1215
01:17:11.880 --> 01:17:24.119
I'm quite pleased, actually, because I shall be able to make you eat your words of what you said earlier when we do get to this season of Strangely Worlds in Untitled Star Trek Project, because it's absolutely perfect for jumping in and just watching a song.

1216
01:17:24.119 --> 01:17:26.460
Yeah. on its own.

1217
01:17:26.520 --> 01:17:33.239
And I think actually out of context, I think these episodes may land very differently than watching them all together.

1218
01:17:33.960 --> 01:17:38.159
Yeah, I think that's possibly true, actually, because it's wacky every week.

1219
01:17:38.279 --> 01:17:40.859
And because there doesn't seem to be much of a throw line.

1220
01:17:40.920 --> 01:17:52.859
There was the kind of Roger Corby, um, uh, nurse chapel relationship thing, which runs through a few episodes and and, you know, the gamble coming back as a villain and stuff like that.

1221
01:17:52.920 --> 01:17:54.659
Like that stuff in last season.

1222
01:17:55.199 --> 01:18:09.060
And that, you know, like, um, uh, uh, um, Erica's pretty younger brother doing the documentary and Erica recovering from the, the, PTSD with the gone and stuff.

1223
01:18:09.119 --> 01:18:11.340
Like all of that stuff is there in series 3.

1224
01:18:11.579 --> 01:18:12.960
But series 4 doesn't have that.

1225
01:18:13.020 --> 01:18:16.560
The only thing is that Laan is losing her shit a bit.

1226
01:18:16.920 --> 01:18:27.899
You know, like there's a, there's a few episodes where, as if something is happening to, you know, she punches that, the dinosaur in the face in that 1st episode.

1227
01:18:28.439 --> 01:18:37.319
But she does some other things as well, which make it seem like she's a Noonian song, you know, like as if Noonian sing or whatever, like she's a she's a potential problem.

1228
01:18:38.520 --> 01:18:39.899
But that's all.

1229
01:18:40.319 --> 01:18:51.899
I mean, I have a feeling that last miniseries that they do is going to be heartbreaking because they have to dismantle this crew and get everyone where they need to be for the original series.

1230
01:18:52.619 --> 01:18:58.619
And so those characters that are a part of the original zeros, but you certainly have come to love.

1231
01:18:59.279 --> 01:19:00.779
They're all off somewhere.

1232
01:19:01.439 --> 01:19:02.760
I don't think they'll kill them.

1233
01:19:02.819 --> 01:19:03.720
They won't kill.

1234
01:19:03.779 --> 01:19:04.560
Oh, I hope not.

1235
01:19:04.560 --> 01:19:06.720
Because the show's not that sort of show.

1236
01:19:07.800 --> 01:19:08.279
I think.

1237
01:19:09.060 --> 01:19:10.380
You see, that's the other thing too.

1238
01:19:10.560 --> 01:19:17.819
That maybe Strangely Worlds operates better in an environment where there's discovery, which is too serious.

1239
01:19:17.880 --> 01:19:19.439
You know, yeah, you know.

1240
01:19:20.100 --> 01:19:21.720
And everyone was going, how refreshing.

1241
01:19:21.840 --> 01:19:23.579
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right.

1242
01:19:23.640 --> 01:19:29.579
Everyone was going, oh, this is light and fun, but now Star Trek, you know, it's the only thing that's on. you know.

1243
01:19:30.659 --> 01:19:42.539
It's just mad to think that, once upon a time, you had Doctor Who and Tortured and the Sarah Jane Adventures on, and once upon, and all those confidentials and the kiddie confidential.

1244
01:19:42.899 --> 01:19:48.119
And that once upon a time there was discovery and lower decks and strangely wells.

1245
01:19:48.239 --> 01:19:49.680
All on, and Picard.

1246
01:19:49.920 --> 01:19:52.680
Well, that year in 2022, yeah. franchises?

1247
01:19:52.739 --> 01:19:54.300
Yeah, there's nothing now.

1248
01:19:55.560 --> 01:19:57.119
TV. ruined.

1249
01:19:57.659 --> 01:19:58.079
Yeah.

1250
01:19:58.619 --> 01:20:00.420
But there's plenty for us to talk about, though.