WEBVTT

NOTE
This transcript was created on 2026-05-01 at 20:50:41

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Hey, Joe. Hi.

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So this week we're back aboard the original USS Enterprise, no

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bloody A, no bloody D, and we are watching the Savage Curtain

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which is series 3, episode 22 of the original series, and I

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believe that was your choice, Joe. right.

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And it was 1st broadcast on the 7th of March 1969, which is just

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mere weeks before I come into the world.

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This is the 3rd last episode of Star Trek, and they politely delay

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the very last episode so that it can air in a world in which I

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already exist.

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Isn't that wonderful?

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May also have had something to do with the death of President

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Eisenhower as well.

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I said, you didn't know, Nathan.

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I said to you, well, we're going to do the original series.

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It's going to swing one of 2 ways, so usually they're either very

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good indeed or absolutely ghastly.

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And this one is absolutely ghastly.

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Yeah.

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So this falls into the complete failure mode of series 3.

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And what series 3 frequently does is it just puts the crew of the

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Enterprise under the control of some godlike alien beings and then

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just sort of tortures them until sort of 5 minutes before the end

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of the episode when it all stops and they go back to the bridge

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and end the episode.

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And we did the empath, which is largely that and whom God's

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destroy is like that.

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Which at least the green woman exploding.

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That's true.

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That true.

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It's not as boring as this.

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This has the steaming Pooh monster.

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So, yeah.

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Yeah.

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And so these manages to be quite boring and sort of dumb as well.

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And like, the thing that it made me think of more than anything

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else was arena, which is this premise, but done well and

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intelligently, I think, like on location and with a more exciting

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monster and just sort of better action and kind of a better idea

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of what's going on.

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Do you know what I mean?

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Like the metrons are doing something sensible, something pretty

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similar to this, but much, much less dumb than what the...

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God, we didn't rope this, Nathan, when you were here.

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Yeah, yeah.

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So, I mean, this, I just think this is this is shockingly

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terrible.

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The other one that it reminds me of is who mourns for adonize.

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When is that?

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My knowledge of TOS isn't strong enough.

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Yeah, mine isn't either.

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And of course, Plato's stepchildren is like this too, where it is

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just there's an all powerful alien being that just sort of

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torments them until it's time to end the episode.

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That's why this reminds me so much of Isetu, of Mike.

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Height and Q from TNG season one, which is an, oh, you know, a

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godlike being, taking people to the dreadful studio backdrop

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planetary landscape set, and just weird people.

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What is it in that?

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It's pig monsters, isn't it?

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in revolution costumes and things stabbing Wesley Crussoff through

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the chest and things like that.

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Well, you know, take out Wesley Crusher and put in Abraham

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Lincoln.

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It's basically the same story isn't it?

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But this is the period where Roddenberry had kind of lost control

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of the show, hadn't he?

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Freiburger had come in and so I didn't think he'd done that much

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in season three.

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I know Gene Coon left, but I didn't think Ron and Beer would wrote

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that many scripts, but if this is an example of what he's

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delivering in the dying throes of TOS, they may I say that the the

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axe came down at just the right time.

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Because I was like, okay, initially I was on board for 2.5 seconds

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when the absurd image of Abraham Lincoln, in its chair, flying

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through space, in the orbit of this planet, I was like, that's

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really fucking stupid.

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But it's weird.

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It's different.

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Great.

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We might be able to do something with this.

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But sort of 10 minutes into the episode, we're down on that planet

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and it's just a series of protracted and badly staged fights for

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40 minutes before the episode just ends with the most generic and

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simple homily at the end of the episode.

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Well, I didn't think it even, you don't think it even rates as a

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homily.

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No, I didn't say it's terrible.

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It's not about anything.

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We don't reach any conclusions at all.

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We don't learn anything about good or evil.

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Like, it's so nothing.

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Like, it's really bad.

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But like in arena, we learn something about the difference between

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Kirk and the Gorn and that's something that's relevantly different

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and you can see what the episode is trying to bring out.

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Here, presumably, like, why is it called the Savage Curtain?

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Do you know what I mean, rather than the ferocious wallpaper or

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something?

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I think I saw Juno, you draw back the savage curtain and oh, is

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the line between good and evil a lot thinner than we thought?

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Is that what they're trying to say?

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It's got to be that.

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So a curtain conceals something, doesn't it?

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And so the idea is that between good and evil, there's not that

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much difference.

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And it gestures at that a little bit.

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There's a time when the X, they're called X-Calbians.

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It's not actually set in dialogue, but that's what they're

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called.

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When the...

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No.

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This is she apostrophe.

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The actual particular X-Calbian here is called Yarnik.

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And so when Yarnick stops, thinks, and says, actually, you guys

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use the same kind of tricks, you know, good and evil don't seem to

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be all that different, uh, you know, what?

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What about that statement, though?

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What are you trying to say?

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I don't know.

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Good people are capable of doing bad things of bad people are

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capable.

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Yeah, we know that.

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People are.

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Yeah, yeah, but...

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But good and bad people both get up in the morning and have

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shelves and breakfast and like all of these onto things. produce

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their own ex-calibians, then have a shame.

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I will never not get intense joy from hearing you saying things

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like Yarnik and Excalpions, you know?

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You're the smartest man, I know.

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The fact that you talk about this once a week is just little

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sleep.

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Nonsense.

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But we don't learn anything about the characters in this either.

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And you can at least usually guarantee. you can have some fun with

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the 3 main regulars, but McCoy is prickly as hell in this and

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really not fun to be around.

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I hate Scotty in this episode.

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He's just throwing sass left, right, and centre.

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There's nothing happening with Kirk and Spock down on the planet

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you know?

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There's no character through line there at all.

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At least in hide and cue, you know, we learned that Tasha Yar

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wants to fuck Picard.

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Oh, if you weren't a captain, you know, it's terrible, but we

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learned something.

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I don't want to hear that.

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Don't worry, Nathan, it's all right to cry in a penalty box.

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Okay.

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Okay, good.

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Yeah.

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I mean, the greatest joy I took from this was that monster.

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I mean, every time that, I've quite liked the voice as well, but

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that, yeah, great steaming...

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We can't call it a poo throughout the entire episode.

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What should we call it?

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an ex-calbian.

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Don't be racing.

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Affluent.

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So the the Excalbians do appear in a graphic in Caicos classroom

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in early deep space.

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Yeah.

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No way.

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Yeah, I've seen a picture.

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So there's an Ex-Calvian.

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And the Excalbion skeletal structure, it's it's on a, um, original

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series on Deep Space 9, you know?

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Yeah, yeah, they do.

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They do.

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And of course, an ex-calbian skeleton is used by Tandy to escape

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from a room on a starship in an episode, a very early episode of

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Lower Decks.

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I'm wondering if the pitch for lower decks was, you know, how many

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of the shittest elements of the original Star Trek and TAOS can we

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get in this show and actually make fun?

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Turns out all of them, it turns out.

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I mean, they're all there.

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Yeah, so, like, this is this is pretty terrible, and this is Star

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Trek when Star Trek fails, I think.

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And it doesn't fail because it's ridiculous.

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It doesn't fail because, say, it's got Abraham Lincoln in it

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because I was actually quite enjoying that bit, but it fails

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because it doesn't go anywhere and it's dumb and it isn't about

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anything and it's the same thing that we've done over and over

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again at this point.

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I didn't think it was particularly well executed, however, though

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when we're down on the planet, I've seen pretty good fights.

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Arena, you know?

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We've seen pretty good fights on TOS and we've seen that they can

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execute stuff, even on the planetary landscape sometimes.

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But there's just a feeling of that will do about all of this.

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Yeah.

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Like, remember, we said that there were all sorts of dumb things

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about obsession and we thought that like I feared going in that

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that was actually going to be a bit stupid.

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And because it had that good guest character in it.

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And because it was well directed and because the dicaronium cloud

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monster thing was reasonably interesting.

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Um, like that ended up being quite good.

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That's certainly a lot better than this.

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POV shots off the cloud moving about, approaching and killing

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people.

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But the thing that it made me think of as well was the Galileo 7.

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Because remember that the way that they had just stage hands

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throwing spears from off camera onto the set.

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I'm not calling them.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Yeah, but not hurling spears.

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Do you know what I mean?

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Just kind of gently throwing them.

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Just, you know, this is all throwing sticks at one another and

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throwing rocks and stuff and the fights are really badly and

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boringly staged and there's no tension or anything.

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Whereas, you know, arena was really quite tense and sort of

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interesting, even though that did involve, you know, throwing

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giant polystyrene rocks at each other and stuff.

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Like, he was dumb as well in all sorts of ways.

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But this was sort of dumb and I think you're right, just half

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hearted.

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No one's really doing their best work here.

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You say this was 69?

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Yeah, yeah.

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So it's the 3rd last episode.

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So it's interesting.

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Like, I know we occasionally do Star Trek, Doctor Who parallels.

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But across the ponds, right?

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In 69.

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Doctor Who is also all kind of on its last leg.

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The ratings are going down.

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And there's the very real possibility that it could be cancelled.

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But that show's delivering stuff like the invasion, the mind

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robber and the war games. you know, some of the very best stories

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that they ever did.

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Like, yeah, it is disheartening to see a show that was once firing

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on all cylinders, kind of just churning out nonsense now, and

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assuming that people are going to consume it.

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Freiburger.

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It was a bad...

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It was a bad call, but in that seat, wasn't it?

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Well, anytime it happens.

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Yeah that's right.

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But because I think what he wants is monsters and cheap action and

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stuff.

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I think, you know, and he must have had some kind of brief to

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reduce the budget as well because everything just looks much

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crappier than it has in the life.

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You know, those people that are celebrating the death of Star Trek

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Academy.

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Is it Star Trek that they want?

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Yeah, this is what they want.

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Monsters making Abraham Lincoln and Genghis Khan fight against

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each other on a panto set.

254
00:12:31.740 --> 00:12:33.360
Bring back the Excalbians.

255
00:12:33.419 --> 00:12:35.700
Woosh, we go and watch them.

256
00:12:35.820 --> 00:12:37.259
I think we should.

257
00:12:37.320 --> 00:12:38.340
All right.

258
00:12:38.399 --> 00:12:41.159
I will count it in.

259
00:12:41.580 --> 00:12:48.179
Five, four, three, two, one, and we're off.

260
00:12:48.240 --> 00:12:49.200
Here we go.

261
00:12:49.200 --> 00:12:53.039
So we have a thrilling new planet in the original.

262
00:12:53.100 --> 00:12:56.879
It's just the red planet that they're always going around.

263
00:12:56.940 --> 00:12:59.940
But this is a thrilling lava planet.

264
00:13:01.440 --> 00:13:04.379
Oh, God, Shatner looks so bored.

265
00:13:05.340 --> 00:13:08.940
You wait, you wait until the last suit.

266
00:13:09.000 --> 00:13:12.360
He's got a wry smile on his face as he's delivering that terrible

267
00:13:12.360 --> 00:13:13.019
dialogue.

268
00:13:13.139 --> 00:13:15.000
Yeah, yeah.

269
00:13:15.059 --> 00:13:17.580
So he doesn't know it's being cancelled, apparently.

270
00:13:17.639 --> 00:13:19.320
As late as this.

271
00:13:19.379 --> 00:13:23.759
Yeah, as late as this, I think they may be actually shooting

272
00:13:23.759 --> 00:13:26.940
turnabout intruder when they discover that they're not making next

273
00:13:26.940 --> 00:13:28.019
week's episode.

274
00:13:28.259 --> 00:13:32.580
So no one knows at this point that it's over.

275
00:13:32.639 --> 00:13:37.559
Nemoy, Nemoy's interviewed. got captain's logs, which I was

276
00:13:37.559 --> 00:13:40.259
flicking through the other day, and in a lot of these season 3

277
00:13:40.259 --> 00:13:42.059
episodes, he said he was just so embarrassed.

278
00:13:42.120 --> 00:13:46.019
He was so embarrassed by the quality of what they were doing and

279
00:13:46.019 --> 00:13:48.779
the things he was being asked to do in half of these episodes.

280
00:13:48.779 --> 00:13:54.419
Yeah, I mean, look at, like, look at, say the devil in the dark

281
00:13:54.419 --> 00:13:54.720
right?

282
00:13:54.779 --> 00:13:56.879
Where he has to unmode over a duvet.

283
00:13:56.940 --> 00:13:57.720
Do you know what I mean?

284
00:13:58.080 --> 00:14:01.259
There are ridiculous things happening there.

285
00:14:01.320 --> 00:14:03.539
But people's hair.

286
00:14:03.600 --> 00:14:05.399
It means something.

287
00:14:05.460 --> 00:14:06.480
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

288
00:14:06.539 --> 00:14:06.960
That's right.

289
00:14:07.019 --> 00:14:10.379
Like I've said before, I maintain that Star Trek doesn't fail when

290
00:14:10.379 --> 00:14:13.559
it's ridiculous because it's frequently ridiculous to great

291
00:14:13.559 --> 00:14:14.159
effect.

292
00:14:14.220 --> 00:14:16.440
You know, that works really well.

293
00:14:16.500 --> 00:14:19.740
In a sense, it's often what they're aiming for.

294
00:14:19.799 --> 00:14:22.200
But here, what are they aiming for?

295
00:14:22.259 --> 00:14:25.620
They're just aiming for reaching the closing credits along.

296
00:14:25.679 --> 00:14:27.720
How is McCoy doing it?

297
00:14:27.840 --> 00:14:30.659
He walks in and he goes, for God's sakes, what are these poppycock

298
00:14:30.659 --> 00:14:32.220
orders that they're having us do?

299
00:14:32.340 --> 00:14:35.580
And then he stands there sort of looking really pissed off.

300
00:14:35.639 --> 00:14:36.659
You're the fucking doctor.

301
00:14:36.720 --> 00:14:38.340
Just go and mend somebody's neat.

302
00:14:38.460 --> 00:14:39.240
Train a patient.

303
00:14:39.299 --> 00:14:40.440
Why?

304
00:14:40.440 --> 00:14:41.159
Oh, here we go.

305
00:14:41.220 --> 00:14:42.779
It comes so brown, Lincoln.

306
00:14:42.840 --> 00:14:43.860
Now this is awesome.

307
00:14:43.919 --> 00:14:46.320
Now this is a new effect, isn't it?

308
00:14:46.379 --> 00:14:48.059
The sort of the halo effects.

309
00:14:48.120 --> 00:14:50.159
Yes, yeah.

310
00:14:50.279 --> 00:14:53.700
And I think probably the Starfield is new too.

311
00:14:53.759 --> 00:15:00.179
Look at the reaction shots of everybody like, oh, my God. it be?

312
00:15:01.919 --> 00:15:04.379
Captain Kirk, I believe.

313
00:15:05.519 --> 00:15:09.659
So I think that this is quite a charming performance.

314
00:15:09.779 --> 00:15:15.299
And I do like the idea that he's here.

315
00:15:15.299 --> 00:15:19.679
And I also like, I think the conflict about the way that Kirk

316
00:15:19.679 --> 00:15:23.759
treats him is dumb and just conflict for the sake of conflict, but

317
00:15:23.759 --> 00:15:27.779
I do think it's interesting that Kirk Knott, for a 2nd, doesn't

318
00:15:27.779 --> 00:15:32.100
believe for a 2nd that this is actually Abraham Lincoln, but knows

319
00:15:32.100 --> 00:15:35.340
that he believes that he's Abraham Lincoln and so just goes along

320
00:15:35.340 --> 00:15:35.759
with it.

321
00:15:35.820 --> 00:15:39.960
I know, but it makes that. seems so odd where he goes, I feel as

322
00:15:39.960 --> 00:15:41.340
if I really met him, you know?

323
00:15:41.399 --> 00:15:44.100
And now I know...

324
00:15:44.100 --> 00:15:47.279
Everything, you know, how bad it was when he died in real life.

325
00:15:47.340 --> 00:15:50.279
What are you talking about?

326
00:15:50.279 --> 00:15:54.360
After Spock just said, they pulled him out of our brains, you know

327
00:15:54.360 --> 00:15:55.620
is a version of him.

328
00:15:55.679 --> 00:15:57.000
Only you think of.

329
00:15:57.059 --> 00:16:01.860
But like, do you remember when Samuel Clements was brought on

330
00:16:01.860 --> 00:16:03.779
board TNG in Times Arrow?

331
00:16:03.840 --> 00:16:04.259
right?

332
00:16:04.320 --> 00:16:04.980
Yeah, yeah.

333
00:16:04.980 --> 00:16:07.740
Well, they didn't beam him down to a planet and have him fight in

334
00:16:07.740 --> 00:16:08.580
Genghis Khan.

335
00:16:08.639 --> 00:16:11.639
No, they had him walking around the ship, looking at the future

336
00:16:11.639 --> 00:16:16.139
and going, my God, maybe things are better now, you know, maybe we

337
00:16:16.139 --> 00:16:17.100
were doing things wrong.

338
00:16:17.340 --> 00:16:22.259
And there's an awareness of what Samuel Clements was about, I

339
00:16:22.259 --> 00:16:22.620
think.

340
00:16:22.679 --> 00:16:24.600
And there is a little bit of an awareness here.

341
00:16:24.659 --> 00:16:29.279
In that interaction between him and Ahura, which is very dated and

342
00:16:29.279 --> 00:16:32.340
obviously uses what we would regard as sort of unfortunate

343
00:16:32.340 --> 00:16:33.899
language, but...

344
00:16:33.899 --> 00:16:35.100
I mean, I like the fact she owns it.

345
00:16:35.159 --> 00:16:38.159
She just goes...

346
00:16:38.340 --> 00:16:44.700
But, but, you know, like Lincoln, you know, is most famous for

347
00:16:44.700 --> 00:16:48.960
being the president during the Civil War, you know, and and

348
00:16:48.960 --> 00:16:53.820
fighting on the, you know, against the slavers of the South.

349
00:16:53.879 --> 00:16:58.320
You know, so I thought that that, and you know, this is in the

350
00:16:58.320 --> 00:17:00.480
middle of the civil rights era.

351
00:17:00.539 --> 00:17:07.019
So I think that like Kirk's regard for Lincoln and Nechelle, like

352
00:17:07.019 --> 00:17:10.859
Ahura's regard for him as well, works, you know, and is very

353
00:17:10.859 --> 00:17:11.279
timely.

354
00:17:11.279 --> 00:17:13.920
It's the 1st 10 minutes though, isn't it?

355
00:17:13.980 --> 00:17:15.240
Yeah, that's right.

356
00:17:15.299 --> 00:17:15.720
That's right.

357
00:17:15.779 --> 00:17:19.079
Also, the other thing that I think is bad is the makeup job, like

358
00:17:19.079 --> 00:17:22.019
they can't just say this is an actor, we'll put a beard on him and

359
00:17:22.019 --> 00:17:23.819
that'll make him look like Lincoln.

360
00:17:23.880 --> 00:17:26.460
So they have to give him this sort of false lip.

361
00:17:26.519 --> 00:17:29.519
You know, like the lower lip has to be sort of palty and produced

362
00:17:29.519 --> 00:17:32.400
because he looks like that in the photos and they have to give him

363
00:17:32.400 --> 00:17:33.660
and it just looks terrible.

364
00:17:33.720 --> 00:17:36.059
Like, it looks as bad as the Klingon maker.

365
00:17:36.119 --> 00:17:38.039
I don't think they've put enough slap on Shatner.

366
00:17:38.099 --> 00:17:39.599
I think he looks quite tired.

367
00:17:39.660 --> 00:17:41.460
It's the end of the season, I suppose.

368
00:17:41.519 --> 00:17:44.640
The only person who doesn't is in the shower, who always looks

369
00:17:44.640 --> 00:17:45.240
beautiful.

370
00:17:45.299 --> 00:17:46.799
Can I also write?

371
00:17:46.859 --> 00:17:50.759
This, this, um, this turd creature, the ex-scalpion, whatever he's

372
00:17:50.759 --> 00:17:51.420
called.

373
00:17:51.539 --> 00:17:55.859
If you sort of pulling these things out of their minds, yeah. and

374
00:17:55.859 --> 00:17:59.279
sort of making them real so then he can fight, you know, have them

375
00:17:59.279 --> 00:18:01.319
fight against each other down on the planet, yeah?

376
00:18:01.380 --> 00:18:04.200
Well, why doesn't he just have Abraham Lincoln appear on the

377
00:18:04.200 --> 00:18:04.440
ship?

378
00:18:04.500 --> 00:18:06.839
Why does he have him flying through space?

379
00:18:07.140 --> 00:18:12.299
Well, he wants a good cliffhanger going into the opening credits, I

380
00:18:12.299 --> 00:18:13.259
think, is probably.

381
00:18:13.319 --> 00:18:17.220
You did message me and say, yeah, the ex-Calpians realise there

382
00:18:17.220 --> 00:18:21.059
was 5 minutes left at the end of the episode and went, well, that's

383
00:18:21.059 --> 00:18:21.420
it.

384
00:18:21.480 --> 00:18:22.559
I suppose that's the end of this.

385
00:18:22.680 --> 00:18:26.640
Ah, I do like that new effect of the planetary surface.

386
00:18:26.700 --> 00:18:30.000
It reminds me a bit of the survivors, you know, where they had

387
00:18:30.000 --> 00:18:31.500
that one patch of the planet.

388
00:18:31.559 --> 00:18:35.160
Yeah, yeah, on that sort of devastated landscape.

389
00:18:35.220 --> 00:18:40.920
The, I mean, there is something in arena, the crew of the

390
00:18:40.920 --> 00:18:45.180
Enterprise are watching the episode that we're watching.

391
00:18:45.240 --> 00:18:47.880
Remember, they're watching it on telly, and they're watching it

392
00:18:47.880 --> 00:18:49.019
here too.

393
00:18:49.079 --> 00:18:53.819
And there's some talk about how other ex-calbians are watching

394
00:18:53.819 --> 00:18:54.240
this.

395
00:18:54.240 --> 00:19:01.859
And our ex-calbion, Yarnex, says something about, and like he

396
00:19:01.859 --> 00:19:05.700
calls this a drama, like he's staging a drama for the ex-calbians

397
00:19:05.700 --> 00:19:09.720
to watch, and there's a moral message, you know, who is which is

398
00:19:09.720 --> 00:19:12.119
stronger, good or evil.

399
00:19:12.180 --> 00:19:17.099
So there's a way in which this is setting itself up, like the, the

400
00:19:17.099 --> 00:19:22.200
the Excalbians are staging this as a TV program to teach them

401
00:19:22.200 --> 00:19:24.240
anywhere. an audience.

402
00:19:24.299 --> 00:19:24.960
No.

403
00:19:25.019 --> 00:19:28.500
Do we maybe need to cut to a couple of turd monsters watching this

404
00:19:28.500 --> 00:19:29.400
on their tellies?

405
00:19:29.460 --> 00:19:31.440
Yeah, eating popcorn.

406
00:19:31.500 --> 00:19:34.619
But I don't want to know what circuses.

407
00:19:34.680 --> 00:19:37.980
Well, do you remember bread and circuses, which was much cleverer

408
00:19:37.980 --> 00:19:40.559
than that because it had TV cameras and stuff.

409
00:19:40.980 --> 00:19:46.319
But there is something better about having them stage it as a TV

410
00:19:46.319 --> 00:19:48.119
show with a moral message.

411
00:19:48.420 --> 00:19:52.200
But it does kind of...

412
00:19:52.200 --> 00:19:54.960
I think you got... wink a bit more of the audience to get that

413
00:19:54.960 --> 00:19:55.680
across, though.

414
00:19:55.740 --> 00:19:58.440
It has a low opinion of the audience.

415
00:19:58.500 --> 00:19:59.339
Do you know what I mean?

416
00:19:59.400 --> 00:20:02.519
Because, like, do we decide that good is better than bad because

417
00:20:02.519 --> 00:20:03.539
good wins.

418
00:20:03.599 --> 00:20:06.240
Like that's kind of the message, you know?

419
00:20:06.299 --> 00:20:11.460
Like, it's, people, one of the reasons that I hated Rise of

420
00:20:11.460 --> 00:20:16.380
Skywalker is that Ray beats Palpatine because she has better force

421
00:20:16.380 --> 00:20:17.819
lightning than he does.

422
00:20:17.880 --> 00:20:23.819
You know, there's, whereas, um, Luke beats Palpatine, because he

423
00:20:23.819 --> 00:20:27.599
throws his lightsaber away and refuses to fight, and he takes a

424
00:20:27.599 --> 00:20:28.859
moral stand.

425
00:20:28.859 --> 00:20:31.079
Two very different creatives there, isn't it?

426
00:20:31.140 --> 00:20:31.799
That's right.

427
00:20:31.859 --> 00:20:32.579
Yeah, that's right.

428
00:20:32.579 --> 00:20:36.119
But, but good doesn't, shouldn't win because it shouldn't

429
00:20:36.119 --> 00:20:37.920
shouldn't win because it's stronger.

430
00:20:37.980 --> 00:20:39.720
It should win because it's good.

431
00:20:39.839 --> 00:20:43.680
And it's not just the fact that the good guys are standing at the

432
00:20:43.680 --> 00:20:46.019
end. that means that good is better than evil.

433
00:20:46.079 --> 00:20:48.240
It's that good is better than evil.

434
00:20:48.299 --> 00:20:49.740
The good guys are better than the bad guys.

435
00:20:49.799 --> 00:20:52.200
Yeah, dramatically right, and a better version. this episode.

436
00:20:52.259 --> 00:20:53.519
I mean I would absolutely love it.

437
00:20:53.579 --> 00:20:57.720
If it was, you know, properly, we were seeing the TV show being

438
00:20:57.720 --> 00:20:58.980
beamed to the Excalpions.

439
00:20:58.980 --> 00:21:03.059
I'd love for the director, you know, our Excalpion Yarnick to go

440
00:21:03.059 --> 00:21:05.880
oh, my God. the show's ending in 5 minutes.

441
00:21:05.940 --> 00:21:07.259
Can we wrap this up, please?

442
00:21:07.319 --> 00:21:07.619
Come on.

443
00:21:07.680 --> 00:21:08.400
Yeah.

444
00:21:08.400 --> 00:21:11.880
We need to cut to the adverts soon.

445
00:21:11.940 --> 00:21:14.460
I mean, did you hear Scotty as well?

446
00:21:14.519 --> 00:21:17.940
He's like, what the hell am I doing here in my dress uniform?

447
00:21:18.000 --> 00:21:21.000
Like, when did these people become so fucking opinionated?

448
00:21:22.200 --> 00:21:25.799
There was a time in series one, you know, you bring on a court

449
00:21:25.799 --> 00:21:26.279
martial.

450
00:21:26.339 --> 00:21:28.019
Have you even looked at Kirk in the wrong way?

451
00:21:28.079 --> 00:21:28.859
Yeah.

452
00:21:28.920 --> 00:21:31.380
Oh, God, that eye makeup.

453
00:21:31.440 --> 00:21:33.599
Like the makeup is so bad, isn't it?

454
00:21:33.660 --> 00:21:35.880
I think it looks like he's got a skin disease.

455
00:21:36.000 --> 00:21:41.099
Giving Scotty that. more dominant role in season 3 was a mistake.

456
00:21:41.160 --> 00:21:44.339
He works much better as comic relief, doesn't he?

457
00:21:44.400 --> 00:21:45.539
Yeah, yeah.

458
00:21:45.660 --> 00:21:46.200
Yeah.

459
00:21:46.259 --> 00:21:46.980
Yeah.

460
00:21:47.039 --> 00:21:51.119
Well, you know, since I am here and you can touch me and scan me.

461
00:21:53.759 --> 00:21:56.339
But he's charming, isn't he?

462
00:21:56.400 --> 00:21:59.039
Like, he's quite charming and I really like Kirk's reaction as

463
00:21:59.039 --> 00:21:59.279
well.

464
00:21:59.339 --> 00:22:01.740
Kirk is actually kind of a bit smitten with him.

465
00:22:03.059 --> 00:22:08.759
So his name is Lee Berger, but I don't know anything about him.

466
00:22:08.819 --> 00:22:11.880
I feel like he should have had a career after this, he could do

467
00:22:11.880 --> 00:22:12.539
anything.

468
00:22:14.339 --> 00:22:18.420
He costarred with James Cromwell on something.

469
00:22:18.480 --> 00:22:22.799
He was in Falcon Crest, Perry Mason, the Adams family.

470
00:22:22.859 --> 00:22:24.900
He's a that guy. just everything.

471
00:22:24.960 --> 00:22:25.859
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

472
00:22:25.859 --> 00:22:28.019
Um, he was in North and South.

473
00:22:28.019 --> 00:22:30.240
Oh, with Jonathan Frakes.

474
00:22:30.480 --> 00:22:33.180
Who's the guy at the backu of the gun?

475
00:22:33.240 --> 00:22:34.920
You know, the security officer.

476
00:22:34.980 --> 00:22:36.180
Yeah, yeah.

477
00:22:36.240 --> 00:22:37.500
He gets a name.

478
00:22:37.559 --> 00:22:40.920
He gets introduced to Abraham Lincoln. are we supposed to know

479
00:22:40.920 --> 00:22:41.220
him?

480
00:22:43.079 --> 00:22:47.220
He's wearing red, so I'm assuming this isn't going to wear well

481
00:22:47.220 --> 00:22:47.940
for him.

482
00:22:48.059 --> 00:22:50.940
No, he survives the episode, I think.

483
00:22:51.119 --> 00:22:54.539
Scotty, we're in a kill.

484
00:22:54.539 --> 00:22:55.980
I love that, though.

485
00:22:56.039 --> 00:22:56.759
That's awesome.

486
00:22:56.880 --> 00:22:58.019
That's the nice thing about it.

487
00:22:58.079 --> 00:23:02.880
Do you prefer the dress uniforms from TOS, sort of zip up ones, or

488
00:23:02.880 --> 00:23:05.759
do you prefer the ones from 90s trek, you know, where they were

489
00:23:05.759 --> 00:23:06.839
all sort of wearing skirts?

490
00:23:08.519 --> 00:23:15.240
So they do tone the skirts down a bit after season one of TNG

491
00:23:15.240 --> 00:23:15.720
don't they?

492
00:23:15.779 --> 00:23:20.339
But, like, they're really quite long in season one of TNG, and

493
00:23:20.339 --> 00:23:21.000
they're kind of terrible.

494
00:23:22.920 --> 00:23:26.819
Yeah, I like the I like the white ones that they wear at the

495
00:23:26.819 --> 00:23:29.339
wedding in nemesis, you know, like the late ones.

496
00:23:29.400 --> 00:23:31.920
That's a sexy shot, the planet there.

497
00:23:31.980 --> 00:23:34.500
Did you see you could see all the sort of crust of the planet

498
00:23:34.500 --> 00:23:35.640
glowing?

499
00:23:35.700 --> 00:23:36.779
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

500
00:23:36.839 --> 00:23:40.200
It's not original Fabulous.

501
00:23:40.680 --> 00:23:44.279
They put they put a lot of effort into making it.

502
00:23:44.339 --> 00:23:46.319
I mean do you remember some of these prints back in the day?

503
00:23:46.380 --> 00:23:48.779
I mean, it's so sharp now.

504
00:23:48.839 --> 00:23:50.460
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

505
00:23:50.519 --> 00:23:51.299
They were really poor.

506
00:23:51.359 --> 00:23:54.000
Some of them were in really bad condition. really remember that.

507
00:23:54.059 --> 00:23:57.660
So is that all he has to do, just turn up and be a bit charming

508
00:23:57.660 --> 00:23:59.880
and then everyone will believe you're Abraham Lincoln?

509
00:23:59.940 --> 00:24:03.359
Yeah, well, no one believes that it's Abraham Lincoln, though. and

510
00:24:03.359 --> 00:24:03.960
that's the thing.

511
00:24:04.019 --> 00:24:04.740
No one's taken in.

512
00:24:04.799 --> 00:24:06.779
Like, people don't think he's Abraham Laken.

513
00:24:06.839 --> 00:24:09.359
And generally is known for flying through space in a chair, you

514
00:24:09.359 --> 00:24:09.599
know?

515
00:24:09.660 --> 00:24:10.799
That's right.

516
00:24:10.859 --> 00:24:12.960
But all of this stuff is actually quite fun.

517
00:24:13.019 --> 00:24:16.500
You know, like, I think that it is a little bit like, it's like a

518
00:24:16.500 --> 00:24:20.099
pointless version. on the consoles.

519
00:24:20.160 --> 00:24:24.779
So one of them is the guy on the left is called Hadley, and he's

520
00:24:24.779 --> 00:24:28.259
in a bunch of episodes, including Mirror, Mirror, like he's in a

521
00:24:28.259 --> 00:24:30.059
few episodes, and he has a name.

522
00:24:31.140 --> 00:24:32.220
Here we go.

523
00:24:32.279 --> 00:24:34.859
Oh, forgive me, my dear. let's not say the word.

524
00:24:34.920 --> 00:24:40.740
Yeah, let's not say the word, but, but there, and like it's a word

525
00:24:40.740 --> 00:24:44.579
he's, you know, he's from a period when the word was used, Sherlock

526
00:24:44.579 --> 00:24:47.279
like a Conan Doyle uses the word inner Sherlock Holmes as a

527
00:24:47.279 --> 00:24:47.519
story.

528
00:24:47.579 --> 00:24:48.420
It's the normal word.

529
00:24:48.480 --> 00:24:50.700
But she's so charming.

530
00:24:50.759 --> 00:24:55.619
Precisely how Samuel Chemist is used in Times Arrow to explain, no

531
00:24:55.619 --> 00:24:56.759
things aren't like that anymore.

532
00:24:56.819 --> 00:24:58.319
We're better.

533
00:24:58.380 --> 00:24:59.700
You know, we're more.

534
00:24:59.819 --> 00:25:03.240
Yeah, this is what the episode should have been.

535
00:25:03.299 --> 00:25:04.500
That's right.

536
00:25:04.559 --> 00:25:06.900
Because Clemence is also politically progressive.

537
00:25:06.960 --> 00:25:07.859
Do you know what I mean?

538
00:25:07.859 --> 00:25:09.359
and tries not to be racist.

539
00:25:09.420 --> 00:25:12.359
I mean, Huckleberry Finn is still problematic, racially speaking

540
00:25:12.359 --> 00:25:17.819
but he's sort of on the side of angels, you know, in a way, you

541
00:25:17.819 --> 00:25:21.660
know, like he's suspicious of religion, he fits into that kind of

542
00:25:21.660 --> 00:25:26.400
that Star Trek kind of ethos, that humanist ethos.

543
00:25:26.460 --> 00:25:28.380
So they understand Clements in a way.

544
00:25:28.440 --> 00:25:31.440
And, you know, Lincoln's a little bit more obvious a character.

545
00:25:31.440 --> 00:25:34.380
It's much funnier, probably, from Jerry Harvey.

546
00:25:34.380 --> 00:25:34.980
Of course, as well.

547
00:25:35.039 --> 00:25:38.039
You're telling me the things aren't like that anymore.

548
00:25:39.119 --> 00:25:41.039
Okay, that's right.

549
00:25:42.539 --> 00:25:46.619
You're right about the makeup, the foundation around his eyes.

550
00:25:46.680 --> 00:25:47.819
Oh, bad.

551
00:25:47.819 --> 00:25:51.119
Around his eyes. different colour to the rest of his face.

552
00:25:51.539 --> 00:25:55.259
But I think that's ageing makeup that they have under his eyes.

553
00:25:55.380 --> 00:25:58.500
Like, I think that it's really quite shockingly bad.

554
00:25:59.400 --> 00:26:01.680
Yeah, why do that?

555
00:26:01.799 --> 00:26:03.420
Like maybe give him the mould.

556
00:26:03.480 --> 00:26:04.200
Do you know what I mean?

557
00:26:04.259 --> 00:26:05.339
don't have to do anything else.

558
00:26:05.400 --> 00:26:09.660
Like, you know, there's no, it's not Abraham Lincoln, all of the

559
00:26:09.660 --> 00:26:11.700
people at home know that Abraham Lincoln's long dead.

560
00:26:11.759 --> 00:26:13.500
The fuck was he doing that?

561
00:26:13.559 --> 00:26:17.220
It was just walking up and down in a sort of 2 metre square.

562
00:26:17.279 --> 00:26:20.640
Oh, he has been there for 2 hours, apparently.

563
00:26:20.700 --> 00:26:21.660
Oh, okay, right.

564
00:26:21.660 --> 00:26:22.799
Walking up and down.

565
00:26:22.859 --> 00:26:24.059
Yeah.

566
00:26:24.119 --> 00:26:27.000
And they have an invented site to site transport or those personal

567
00:26:27.000 --> 00:26:30.059
transporters like they have in discovery where he could just pop

568
00:26:30.059 --> 00:26:33.660
down to lunch and then sort of turn up again immediately.

569
00:26:33.720 --> 00:26:36.839
Or that direction engineer.

570
00:26:36.839 --> 00:26:37.740
That's great.

571
00:26:37.799 --> 00:26:38.220
I love it.

572
00:26:41.039 --> 00:26:45.420
Spock is the only person that comes out is with any dignity at

573
00:26:45.420 --> 00:26:45.599
all.

574
00:26:45.660 --> 00:26:48.119
Well, and Kirk, I think, does too.

575
00:26:48.180 --> 00:26:49.740
I think, you know, Kirk, isn't?

576
00:26:49.740 --> 00:26:54.059
Well, I mean, no, but it's just a way that the seriousness he

577
00:26:54.059 --> 00:26:59.460
takes the stuff on the planet is, it achieves a kitch grandeur, I

578
00:26:59.460 --> 00:26:59.640
think.

579
00:26:59.700 --> 00:27:02.880
Yeah, well, I'm not sure about great.

580
00:27:04.619 --> 00:27:12.359
Oh, but this is, you know, you know when Jama says like, oh, TOS

581
00:27:12.359 --> 00:27:14.099
episodes are about, oh, not a jammer.

582
00:27:14.160 --> 00:27:16.440
No, it's Scotland penalty, remember?

583
00:27:16.500 --> 00:27:17.099
He's right.

584
00:27:17.160 --> 00:27:21.059
I think we probably should be down on the planet by now.

585
00:27:21.119 --> 00:27:22.380
But we're 15 minutes in.

586
00:27:22.980 --> 00:27:24.779
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

587
00:27:24.839 --> 00:27:25.980
We are 15 minutes.

588
00:27:26.039 --> 00:27:28.559
Look, I think this is probably half an hour too long.

589
00:27:28.619 --> 00:27:32.940
Like, I think there's probably enough here. like for a anime

590
00:27:32.940 --> 00:27:33.900
series episode.

591
00:27:35.099 --> 00:27:38.819
Like, this is charming enough, but it is marking time.

592
00:27:38.880 --> 00:27:42.000
And the conflict that is central to it.

593
00:27:42.059 --> 00:27:46.200
Like, why is Kirk treating him as if he's Abraham Lincoln when he

594
00:27:46.200 --> 00:27:48.059
clearly isn't, is just dumb.

595
00:27:48.119 --> 00:27:52.440
Like, you know, he's the captain, shut up and is he doing any

596
00:27:52.440 --> 00:27:52.920
harm?

597
00:27:52.980 --> 00:27:53.400
No.

598
00:27:53.460 --> 00:27:54.599
So what's the problem?

599
00:27:54.720 --> 00:27:59.279
Abraham Lincoln has always been a personal hero of yours.

600
00:27:59.339 --> 00:28:00.660
Since when?

601
00:28:01.019 --> 00:28:03.299
Never been mentioned before.

602
00:28:03.420 --> 00:28:07.319
He's also a big fan of 20th century trucks as well.

603
00:28:07.380 --> 00:28:08.880
Okay, many people know that.

604
00:28:08.940 --> 00:28:10.559
Well, it's on Paris then, wouldn't he?

605
00:28:10.619 --> 00:28:11.579
Does he like cartoons?

606
00:28:11.579 --> 00:28:12.960
He does.

607
00:28:13.619 --> 00:28:14.279
Yep, yep.

608
00:28:14.339 --> 00:28:15.299
B movies.

609
00:28:16.079 --> 00:28:20.160
Look, now, they're having a protracted conversation as to whether

610
00:28:20.160 --> 00:28:21.299
to beam down on our.

611
00:28:21.420 --> 00:28:22.380
We know you're going down there.

612
00:28:22.440 --> 00:28:23.220
Just get on with that.

613
00:28:23.279 --> 00:28:23.819
Just came down.

614
00:28:23.880 --> 00:28:24.599
Can we just do it?

615
00:28:24.660 --> 00:28:26.220
What do you imagine all those little badges are?

616
00:28:26.279 --> 00:28:27.660
You know, they've got on their dress uniform.

617
00:28:28.140 --> 00:28:31.019
And merits for their medals.

618
00:28:31.079 --> 00:28:32.460
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

619
00:28:32.519 --> 00:28:35.400
A bit 5 years long.

620
00:28:35.400 --> 00:28:38.519
That's a sort of stitching I did when I was 5 years old, though

621
00:28:38.519 --> 00:28:38.819
you know?

622
00:28:38.880 --> 00:28:40.619
It's, yeah, yeah.

623
00:28:40.680 --> 00:28:46.259
I don't think it was intended to be seen on quite so good screen.

624
00:28:46.259 --> 00:28:49.859
In high definition would be like, yes.

625
00:28:49.920 --> 00:28:53.640
They never imagined this would be a high death.

626
00:28:55.680 --> 00:29:00.119
I mean, the fact that we get to see the Pooh monster in HD is just

627
00:29:00.119 --> 00:29:00.720
delightful.

628
00:29:00.779 --> 00:29:04.619
And like, I think it's like, it's a terrible design and it looks

629
00:29:04.619 --> 00:29:06.180
like a poo and what were they thinking?

630
00:29:06.240 --> 00:29:07.079
No, but it's weird.

631
00:29:07.140 --> 00:29:08.400
I like weird.

632
00:29:08.460 --> 00:29:09.660
Yeah, yeah, weird as well.

633
00:29:09.720 --> 00:29:11.039
It's sort of almost, isn't it?

634
00:29:11.099 --> 00:29:11.400
You know?

635
00:29:11.460 --> 00:29:12.180
That's all weird.

636
00:29:12.240 --> 00:29:13.680
It is like armus.

637
00:29:13.740 --> 00:29:16.859
It's less weird than Armas because Armas is liquid.

638
00:29:16.920 --> 00:29:17.940
Do you know what I mean?

639
00:29:18.000 --> 00:29:19.740
Like it's kind of liquid. of evil.

640
00:29:19.799 --> 00:29:21.059
Yeah, yeah.

641
00:29:21.119 --> 00:29:24.359
I mean, but the gone, you know, like the gone is so much better

642
00:29:24.359 --> 00:29:27.660
than this, even though it's a rubber lizard wearing a cocktail

643
00:29:27.660 --> 00:29:27.960
dress.

644
00:29:28.019 --> 00:29:29.039
Well done.

645
00:29:29.099 --> 00:29:30.779
We'll boom down immediately.

646
00:29:30.900 --> 00:29:31.859
That took him 5 minutes.

647
00:29:31.920 --> 00:29:33.660
That's not immediately.

648
00:29:33.660 --> 00:29:36.960
Like immediately now that we've had this long conversation.

649
00:29:37.019 --> 00:29:38.099
Oh, dear.

650
00:29:38.160 --> 00:29:39.240
Now watch out, Abraham.

651
00:29:39.299 --> 00:29:42.000
You may end up with a spear on your back if you go down there

652
00:29:42.000 --> 00:29:42.180
okay?

653
00:29:42.240 --> 00:29:43.140
Oh my god.

654
00:29:43.200 --> 00:29:45.779
Oh, I can't wait till we see the fights together.

655
00:29:46.440 --> 00:29:48.900
I mean, they're terrible, aren't they?

656
00:29:48.960 --> 00:29:49.859
They're so bad.

657
00:29:50.460 --> 00:29:53.640
What if they beam into a pool of lava?

658
00:29:53.700 --> 00:29:55.559
I swear we don't see any lava, do we?

659
00:29:55.619 --> 00:29:59.160
No, no, because they're on that big area of the planet, which

660
00:29:59.160 --> 00:30:00.299
doesn't have water on it.

661
00:30:00.359 --> 00:30:00.960
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

662
00:30:01.019 --> 00:30:04.980
Yeah, they've they've terraformed it so that it looks like the set

663
00:30:04.980 --> 00:30:06.359
or paramount.

664
00:30:06.480 --> 00:30:09.660
I think Roddenberry's starting point for this was wouldn't it be

665
00:30:09.660 --> 00:30:12.900
cool if Abraham Linton beamed on to the Enterprise.

666
00:30:12.960 --> 00:30:14.160
Oh yeah, yeah.

667
00:30:14.220 --> 00:30:16.440
And turns out, yes, it would be cool.

668
00:30:16.500 --> 00:30:17.339
That's it.

669
00:30:17.400 --> 00:30:20.460
Did you see that dramatic zoom in on the equipment?

670
00:30:20.940 --> 00:30:21.779
Yeah, yeah.

671
00:30:21.839 --> 00:30:23.940
Yeah, it's one of those things.

672
00:30:24.000 --> 00:30:27.539
But it's a still and they've zoomed in on the still. you know what

673
00:30:27.539 --> 00:30:27.779
I mean?

674
00:30:27.839 --> 00:30:29.579
Like they haven't actually zoomed the camera.

675
00:30:29.700 --> 00:30:31.140
And they do that a little bit.

676
00:30:31.200 --> 00:30:33.900
Look at that Mandarin sky, isn't it?

677
00:30:33.960 --> 00:30:34.259
beautiful.

678
00:30:34.319 --> 00:30:35.940
Ah, beautiful.

679
00:30:36.000 --> 00:30:37.319
What weather we having?

680
00:30:38.339 --> 00:30:39.359
Fuck Kurtzman Trek.

681
00:30:39.420 --> 00:30:41.400
I mean, I just believe I'm on an alien planet.

682
00:30:41.700 --> 00:30:43.920
Yes, yes, exactly.

683
00:30:43.980 --> 00:30:47.160
It looks just like all the others, though, weirdly enough.

684
00:30:47.220 --> 00:30:49.140
The same rocks and everything.

685
00:30:49.380 --> 00:30:51.299
Exactly the same.

686
00:30:51.359 --> 00:30:54.119
It's like stock cave set number one.

687
00:30:54.180 --> 00:30:54.839
You know.

688
00:30:54.900 --> 00:30:56.759
What's the last year, Wes, we did Arena.

689
00:30:56.819 --> 00:30:57.960
Was that the last US we did?

690
00:30:58.079 --> 00:30:59.940
Oh, I can't remember.

691
00:31:00.000 --> 00:31:00.720
It might have been.

692
00:31:00.779 --> 00:31:03.420
Might have been. that location.

693
00:31:03.420 --> 00:31:04.079
We do get that.

694
00:31:04.140 --> 00:31:07.079
You know, when he was growing up on all of those rocks with that

695
00:31:07.079 --> 00:31:10.319
enormous polystyrene rock, he was going to throw on the...

696
00:31:10.380 --> 00:31:11.339
So good.

697
00:31:11.400 --> 00:31:13.619
It had scaled, didn't it?

698
00:31:13.680 --> 00:31:17.279
They could do long shots and they could shoot up at the sky and it

699
00:31:17.279 --> 00:31:18.180
was so impressive.

700
00:31:18.240 --> 00:31:19.259
Well, you said at the beginning.

701
00:31:19.319 --> 00:31:20.039
Do you know what I mean?

702
00:31:20.099 --> 00:31:24.059
The set that was left over from something, some film production

703
00:31:24.059 --> 00:31:25.859
and they're shooting on that, remember?

704
00:31:25.920 --> 00:31:27.180
At the beginning of Arena.

705
00:31:27.240 --> 00:31:27.960
Amazing.

706
00:31:28.019 --> 00:31:31.859
Who's the, um, I, sorry, I may have drifted away from the episode

707
00:31:31.859 --> 00:31:32.700
a little bit.

708
00:31:32.759 --> 00:31:33.599
So help me out here.

709
00:31:33.660 --> 00:31:37.259
Who's the sort of witch that appears in this episode?

710
00:31:37.319 --> 00:31:41.819
So her name is Zora.

711
00:31:41.880 --> 00:31:43.319
Zora.

712
00:31:43.380 --> 00:31:47.519
Yeah, same name as the Discovery computer.

713
00:31:47.579 --> 00:31:52.019
Oh, look, here's Surak or Surak, depending on who you are on what

714
00:31:52.019 --> 00:31:53.279
point of the episode we're in.

715
00:31:53.339 --> 00:31:56.039
And this is him appearing for the 1st time.

716
00:31:56.220 --> 00:32:00.059
He will obviously become very important.

717
00:32:00.119 --> 00:32:04.680
We will see him in enterprise, won't we?

718
00:32:04.740 --> 00:32:07.319
And in various other things, like his proper canon.

719
00:32:07.380 --> 00:32:08.279
Yeah, yeah.

720
00:32:08.339 --> 00:32:09.960
Look at Georgia.

721
00:32:10.019 --> 00:32:13.859
He's been left in charge of the Enterprise, Sulu, and he's taken

722
00:32:13.859 --> 00:32:16.319
every 2nd he can for being in that chair.

723
00:32:16.380 --> 00:32:18.420
Oh no, here comes Scotty.

724
00:32:18.900 --> 00:32:21.660
No, don't put Jimmy in the chair.

725
00:32:21.779 --> 00:32:22.859
Get out the chair.

726
00:32:23.099 --> 00:32:24.480
Ive got a better com over than you.

727
00:32:24.539 --> 00:32:28.740
He's McCoy I'm always drawn to Michelle, though.

728
00:32:28.799 --> 00:32:31.259
Gosh, he's stunning.

729
00:32:31.319 --> 00:32:34.079
She's got great hair this episode.

730
00:32:34.140 --> 00:32:37.799
No, this season, I think... season 3, yeah.

731
00:32:37.859 --> 00:32:38.579
Yeah.

732
00:32:38.579 --> 00:32:40.980
It is not logical.

733
00:32:40.980 --> 00:32:41.700
It is wearing a lovely dress.

734
00:32:41.759 --> 00:32:43.200
That you are sirak.

735
00:32:43.259 --> 00:32:45.180
Yes, very.

736
00:32:45.240 --> 00:32:47.160
You can do that, can't you?

737
00:32:47.220 --> 00:32:50.640
Oh, the makeup on Lincoln's even worse down on the planet.

738
00:32:50.700 --> 00:32:52.500
Oh, yeah, I can do the spot salute.

739
00:32:52.559 --> 00:32:53.400
Oh, hang on.

740
00:32:53.460 --> 00:32:54.240
Okay we go.

741
00:32:54.299 --> 00:32:55.980
Well, no, sorry.

742
00:32:55.980 --> 00:32:56.700
Eventually.

743
00:32:56.759 --> 00:32:58.619
After a couple of goes.

744
00:32:59.940 --> 00:33:02.400
Who would we see then, Nathan?

745
00:33:02.460 --> 00:33:03.900
If it was us down on this planet?

746
00:33:03.960 --> 00:33:05.579
Who would be your great hero?

747
00:33:05.940 --> 00:33:08.700
Oh, I don't know.

748
00:33:08.759 --> 00:33:09.960
Who would be my great hero?

749
00:33:10.019 --> 00:33:14.099
We come down to the planet to be Tom Baker..

750
00:33:15.839 --> 00:33:18.119
Nowadays, Jesus Christ.

751
00:33:18.180 --> 00:33:19.799
Yeah, poor old Tom.

752
00:33:19.920 --> 00:33:21.119
At least he's still with us.

753
00:33:21.480 --> 00:33:26.759
Yeah, it's very period dress, isn't it, that Surak is wearing.

754
00:33:26.819 --> 00:33:33.420
So Surak is in, is he in or is it's his Kartra in that enterprise

755
00:33:33.420 --> 00:33:35.339
episode that we did, I can't even remember.

756
00:33:35.400 --> 00:33:36.660
Do we actually meet him?

757
00:33:36.720 --> 00:33:39.119
you honestly expect me to remember Enterprise episodes?

758
00:33:39.180 --> 00:33:40.859
Now I'll never forget this.

759
00:33:40.920 --> 00:33:41.759
This is a pretty good one.

760
00:33:42.180 --> 00:33:47.160
Look at how he starts as a rock and then unfolds himself.

761
00:33:47.279 --> 00:33:48.660
Yeah.

762
00:33:48.660 --> 00:33:50.819
I love his little claws.

763
00:33:50.819 --> 00:33:53.099
I like his sort of overhanging belly as well.

764
00:33:53.160 --> 00:33:54.599
I do empathise, yeah.

765
00:33:54.660 --> 00:33:55.380
Yeah.

766
00:33:55.380 --> 00:33:58.259
That's what I'm like when I'm getting up in the morning.

767
00:33:58.319 --> 00:34:00.180
Oh, my God.

768
00:34:00.240 --> 00:34:02.759
Our world is called Excalbion.

769
00:34:02.880 --> 00:34:03.420
There you go.

770
00:34:04.019 --> 00:34:07.500
Excalpions from Excalpia, is it?

771
00:34:07.559 --> 00:34:09.659
It is used in dialogue.

772
00:34:09.719 --> 00:34:12.420
Well, the Romulans are from Romulus. makes sense.

773
00:34:12.480 --> 00:34:16.199
No, I understand that they've made him smoke to make it more

774
00:34:16.199 --> 00:34:17.219
visually interesting.

775
00:34:17.340 --> 00:34:19.260
I mean, it's quite interesting already.

776
00:34:19.980 --> 00:34:25.559
But because he does look like something that has...

777
00:34:25.559 --> 00:34:27.900
Thank you. was trying to be diplomatic.

778
00:34:27.960 --> 00:34:29.639
Why is that?

779
00:34:29.639 --> 00:34:30.480
Adding the smoke.

780
00:34:30.539 --> 00:34:35.460
Adding the smoke is just, well, the finishing touch, isn't it?

781
00:34:35.519 --> 00:34:39.420
Maybe the actor is actually allowed to smoke in the costume.

782
00:34:39.480 --> 00:34:43.139
You know, you know how in Doctor Who, the actors used to hide in

783
00:34:43.139 --> 00:34:45.719
the Dalek shells, because you weren't allowed to smoke in the

784
00:34:45.719 --> 00:34:48.719
studio, so you could smoke in the Dalek shells be unseen.

785
00:34:48.840 --> 00:34:51.179
That does look like the actor's smoking in there, doesn't it?

786
00:34:51.239 --> 00:34:55.139
He's got 5 fabulous eyes that glow every time he talks.

787
00:34:55.500 --> 00:34:59.039
So I think the idea was that he was going to be an insect monster

788
00:34:59.039 --> 00:35:01.380
of some kind, but we couldn't have afforded that.

789
00:35:01.800 --> 00:35:04.079
Is that Genghis Khan?

790
00:35:07.320 --> 00:35:10.860
Of the 4 evil people, 2 of them are in blackface.

791
00:35:11.280 --> 00:35:18.960
Genghis Khan, Genghis Khan is like Asian, clearly, but he's

792
00:35:18.960 --> 00:35:20.159
painted much darker.

793
00:35:20.219 --> 00:35:21.420
You can see that there.

794
00:35:21.480 --> 00:35:24.840
Colonel Green would come back to him in a minute.

795
00:35:24.960 --> 00:35:27.900
She is, I don't know, what the hell is this?

796
00:35:27.900 --> 00:35:28.980
Somewhat of tiger.

797
00:35:29.039 --> 00:35:32.460
Yeah, she needs... a good night's sleep.

798
00:35:32.519 --> 00:35:34.079
And this is Kayless.

799
00:35:34.500 --> 00:35:37.440
Nobody has good mate Kayla.

800
00:35:37.440 --> 00:35:39.599
Look at look at the Excalpion.

801
00:35:39.659 --> 00:35:41.099
Oh, he's going.

802
00:35:41.219 --> 00:35:44.639
Oh, that Kayless, that's Kayless, right?

803
00:35:44.699 --> 00:35:49.920
From Sword of K-S from Forgotten Air or whatever, rightfully. that

804
00:35:49.920 --> 00:35:50.400
what it's called?

805
00:35:50.460 --> 00:35:51.059
Yeah.

806
00:35:51.119 --> 00:35:52.860
So that's Kayles.

807
00:35:52.980 --> 00:35:56.940
But he's a white guy in blackface, right?

808
00:35:57.000 --> 00:36:00.539
Because he's he's he's in other Star Trek episodes.

809
00:36:00.539 --> 00:36:03.420
And I think he's a body double for the original pike.

810
00:36:03.480 --> 00:36:04.380
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

811
00:36:04.440 --> 00:36:04.800
Yeah.

812
00:36:04.860 --> 00:36:08.099
So they're all blacked up to look evil, right?

813
00:36:08.159 --> 00:36:10.860
where we have some nice white people over here.

814
00:36:11.039 --> 00:36:18.360
Green, who is a bit swarthy, but not blacked up, is actually, so

815
00:36:18.360 --> 00:36:23.039
Colonel Green, who leads a genocidal war in the, I think the early

816
00:36:23.039 --> 00:36:29.400
21st century, in, we've actually seen him before, because in

817
00:36:29.400 --> 00:36:37.079
demons, which is the 3rd last episode of Enterprise, Paul Weller's

818
00:36:37.079 --> 00:36:40.739
character is watching a recording of Colonel Green, played by

819
00:36:40.739 --> 00:36:41.219
someone different.

820
00:36:41.280 --> 00:36:46.440
Ah, giving a speech after the 3rd 3rd World War, saying that we

821
00:36:46.440 --> 00:36:51.119
can't tolerate mutants and genetically impure people. and he's

822
00:36:51.119 --> 00:36:53.940
giving that speech on...

823
00:36:54.000 --> 00:36:55.980
When Enterprise does kiss his sort of pass.

824
00:36:56.039 --> 00:36:57.900
It's never as fun as Kersman Trek, is it?

825
00:36:57.960 --> 00:36:59.039
It's sort of boring, actually.

826
00:36:59.099 --> 00:37:00.300
That's right.

827
00:37:00.300 --> 00:37:02.400
That's so boring.

828
00:37:02.460 --> 00:37:06.239
Did you see what the Excalpion said, there he goes. you know, the

829
00:37:06.239 --> 00:37:09.960
confrontation of 2 opposing philosophies.

830
00:37:10.019 --> 00:37:11.880
Good and evil.

831
00:37:12.179 --> 00:37:14.099
Why are we doing?

832
00:37:14.460 --> 00:37:16.320
It's so complex.

833
00:37:16.320 --> 00:37:21.900
And we're going to boil it down to blacks versus whites on this

834
00:37:21.900 --> 00:37:23.940
dreadful studio backdrop.

835
00:37:24.059 --> 00:37:24.599
Thank you very much.

836
00:37:24.659 --> 00:37:25.739
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

837
00:37:25.800 --> 00:37:29.880
But it is, I mean, I think it is making fun of itself as a TV

838
00:37:29.880 --> 00:37:30.539
show.

839
00:37:30.599 --> 00:37:31.440
Do you know what I mean?

840
00:37:31.559 --> 00:37:34.980
Because the good people will win at the end because being good is

841
00:37:34.980 --> 00:37:38.940
good and the characters that we like to watch on telly are good

842
00:37:38.940 --> 00:37:40.920
and they're going to be in it next week.

843
00:37:40.980 --> 00:37:43.320
So they'll survive. you know what I mean?

844
00:37:43.380 --> 00:37:46.320
Like, it's as complex as that.

845
00:37:46.380 --> 00:37:49.800
And if it was commenting on telly and how kind of shit it was.

846
00:37:49.860 --> 00:37:51.360
Yeah, I could get behind doing that.

847
00:37:51.420 --> 00:37:55.679
Well, I mean, this is doing quite a good job of demonstrating how

848
00:37:55.679 --> 00:37:57.300
shit can be.

849
00:37:57.300 --> 00:38:00.900
Like...

850
00:38:01.320 --> 00:38:05.760
But it is almost having some aspiration to actually do that

851
00:38:05.760 --> 00:38:06.480
deliberately.

852
00:38:06.780 --> 00:38:11.519
Oh, I mean, if they'd made that really apparent, I would have

853
00:38:11.519 --> 00:38:12.960
given this 5 stars.

854
00:38:13.019 --> 00:38:16.800
Yeah, yeah, but it's too boring and stupid.

855
00:38:16.860 --> 00:38:19.739
Like it's it's only kind of vaguely hinted at.

856
00:38:19.860 --> 00:38:24.420
Look at these people Oh, good and evil. is strange to them.

857
00:38:24.480 --> 00:38:25.800
Oh, thank you, Spock.

858
00:38:25.920 --> 00:38:27.420
Oh, yeah, yeah.

859
00:38:27.480 --> 00:38:28.980
I love watch telly.

860
00:38:29.039 --> 00:38:32.159
Look at her hands on hips. straight from the latest panto.

861
00:38:32.219 --> 00:38:34.079
Oh my god.

862
00:38:34.139 --> 00:38:36.360
Lincoln's makeup is so hideous.

863
00:38:36.420 --> 00:38:38.579
It's so bad, isn't it?

864
00:38:38.639 --> 00:38:40.320
It's really, really, very bad.

865
00:38:40.380 --> 00:38:43.440
Are they sort of shining an orange light on here as well to

866
00:38:43.440 --> 00:38:46.019
suggest there's a sort of dawn light on the planet.

867
00:38:46.079 --> 00:38:49.559
Or is it like, because it's a lava planet.

868
00:38:49.619 --> 00:38:50.219
Ah, yeah.

869
00:38:50.219 --> 00:38:54.960
So the other thing, and I don't know how true this is, but memory

870
00:38:54.960 --> 00:39:00.239
alpha suggests that the outfit that Colonel Green is wearing is

871
00:39:00.239 --> 00:39:06.840
redressed and made up to be the outfit that, um, Robin Williams

872
00:39:06.840 --> 00:39:12.719
wears as more, uh, in Mork and Mindy.

873
00:39:12.780 --> 00:39:15.960
They put, you know, they put the silver triangle, the upside down

874
00:39:15.960 --> 00:39:17.940
silver triangle on the front of it and stuff.

875
00:39:18.000 --> 00:39:20.519
But it seems to have the same collar and stuff.

876
00:39:20.579 --> 00:39:21.960
Oh, nice.

877
00:39:21.960 --> 00:39:24.179
I bloody love Malcolm Mindy when I was younger.

878
00:39:24.239 --> 00:39:26.039
Oh, are we doing a podcast about that?

879
00:39:26.820 --> 00:39:30.119
Every episode was at least entertaining.

880
00:39:30.719 --> 00:39:36.599
I'd love to see... a random collection of characters.

881
00:39:36.659 --> 00:39:37.980
That's right.

882
00:39:38.039 --> 00:39:42.659
All just standing around incredibly undramatically looking Super

883
00:39:42.659 --> 00:39:43.199
Bowl.

884
00:39:43.260 --> 00:39:46.500
But this is where just throwing in sort of disparate elements

885
00:39:46.500 --> 00:39:47.340
isn't fun.

886
00:39:47.400 --> 00:39:48.719
You know?

887
00:39:48.780 --> 00:39:50.940
Because you haven't given something to do.

888
00:39:51.059 --> 00:39:52.019
Now what do we do?

889
00:39:52.079 --> 00:39:56.940
Well, what we're going to do is we get them to limply throw spears

890
00:39:56.940 --> 00:39:59.219
at one another in a boring way.

891
00:39:59.280 --> 00:40:01.559
And now we're watching him on telling...

892
00:40:01.619 --> 00:40:04.800
Well, we watching that on the screen as well. as a TV show.

893
00:40:04.860 --> 00:40:06.360
I think we were.

894
00:40:07.440 --> 00:40:10.739
I don't think the people on the Enterprise were, were they?

895
00:40:10.800 --> 00:40:14.099
Like, I think that that's an arena that introduces that as an

896
00:40:14.099 --> 00:40:14.340
idea.

897
00:40:14.400 --> 00:40:18.059
I don't know. and listen to our unstyled Star Trek.

898
00:40:18.119 --> 00:40:20.460
I won't watch the episode But I'll go back and listen to it and

899
00:40:20.460 --> 00:40:22.079
say, I'm sure we'll comment.

900
00:40:22.139 --> 00:40:24.480
I don't think that's a terrible episode either, like Bread and

901
00:40:24.480 --> 00:40:24.960
Circuses.

902
00:40:24.960 --> 00:40:25.860
Like, it's not...

903
00:40:25.860 --> 00:40:30.119
No, I think that whole idea of it being a TV show was obviously

904
00:40:30.119 --> 00:40:31.800
more explicit because you saw the cameras.

905
00:40:31.860 --> 00:40:35.519
Yeah, but I think we did cut to people watching it so we could see

906
00:40:35.519 --> 00:40:36.480
people's reactions.

907
00:40:36.539 --> 00:40:39.659
Whereas, I mean, here.

908
00:40:39.719 --> 00:40:42.059
What the fuck is going on here?

909
00:40:42.179 --> 00:40:44.460
Fuck, man, stop wrestling with that poor woman.

910
00:40:45.179 --> 00:40:48.360
She needs a good night's sleep. leave her alone.

911
00:40:48.420 --> 00:40:52.260
I like to think, you know, that there's a small subset of Star

912
00:40:52.260 --> 00:40:55.920
Trek fans that turn up at their conventions dressed as scalpions.

913
00:40:56.159 --> 00:41:03.719
You know, they sort of waddle in with the claws in a big doodle.

914
00:41:03.780 --> 00:41:08.219
Can I tell you a very funny story that I heard William Shatner?

915
00:41:08.280 --> 00:41:11.280
William Shatner say on an interview I was watching this week.

916
00:41:11.340 --> 00:41:16.980
He was going, so it was after Star Trek, and he was at a funfair

917
00:41:16.980 --> 00:41:24.119
with his kids, and this big muscly bloke started giving them grief

918
00:41:24.119 --> 00:41:27.480
and he had 2 mates with him, and he thought to himself, this is

919
00:41:27.480 --> 00:41:29.159
probably all a lie, but it's a great story.

920
00:41:29.460 --> 00:41:32.280
He thought, no way.

921
00:41:32.340 --> 00:41:35.039
I can still remember all the stunts from Star Trek.

922
00:41:35.099 --> 00:41:39.480
I could take them, apparently, grab the bar and try to do that

923
00:41:39.480 --> 00:41:42.420
kick he just did there, you know, where you sort of throw them

924
00:41:42.420 --> 00:41:42.900
away from you.

925
00:41:42.960 --> 00:41:47.219
Wait, but he face palmed in front of them both and embarrassed

926
00:41:47.219 --> 00:41:50.159
himself so much that they all just went, oh, you're right.

927
00:41:50.219 --> 00:41:51.780
Well...

928
00:41:51.900 --> 00:41:54.539
Actually, maybe that is fun.

929
00:41:54.599 --> 00:41:58.739
I just love the idea of him doing kirk style stunts at a fun

930
00:41:58.739 --> 00:41:59.219
thing.

931
00:42:00.239 --> 00:42:05.219
Oh, say, did you see Shatner gave him a little like a push?

932
00:42:05.280 --> 00:42:07.139
Don't way. you're mean.

933
00:42:07.260 --> 00:42:08.940
Well, to the Excalpion.

934
00:42:09.000 --> 00:42:11.940
Yeah, well, you don't want to touch somebody made out of lava.

935
00:42:12.000 --> 00:42:12.719
No, I know.

936
00:42:12.719 --> 00:42:13.619
Don't wash your hands.

937
00:42:13.679 --> 00:42:15.599
Oh, I thought it made up of poo.

938
00:42:15.659 --> 00:42:17.159
Like, I wash your hands.

939
00:42:17.219 --> 00:42:20.099
The more I look at it, the more I like it, actually, that

940
00:42:20.099 --> 00:42:20.820
monster.

941
00:42:20.880 --> 00:42:24.659
So it was going to be, did I say it was going to be an insectoid

942
00:42:24.659 --> 00:42:29.820
which kind of works with the extra eyes, like a, like a spider and

943
00:42:29.820 --> 00:42:31.679
the little claw thing, like that.

944
00:42:31.739 --> 00:42:31.980
Yeah.

945
00:42:32.039 --> 00:42:33.119
Why did they go for poo?

946
00:42:33.179 --> 00:42:33.900
instead then.

947
00:42:33.960 --> 00:42:35.039
Cheaper.

948
00:42:35.099 --> 00:42:36.000
Oh, fair.

949
00:42:36.239 --> 00:42:38.639
I think, you know, like that.

950
00:42:38.639 --> 00:42:42.360
I want to hear the conversation between the special effects team

951
00:42:42.360 --> 00:42:44.099
as they're putting that together.

952
00:42:46.739 --> 00:42:49.139
So what is it we're going for?

953
00:42:49.199 --> 00:42:52.380
What sort of molten lava with arms and claws?

954
00:42:52.440 --> 00:42:56.219
We want a sort of spinning head with lights and it can smoke, you

955
00:42:56.219 --> 00:42:56.519
know?

956
00:42:56.940 --> 00:43:00.000
Why isn't it orange is the problem?

957
00:43:00.000 --> 00:43:01.199
Why is it brown?

958
00:43:01.260 --> 00:43:02.099
That's the problem.

959
00:43:02.159 --> 00:43:03.420
Who's orange?

960
00:43:03.480 --> 00:43:04.440
devil in the dog.

961
00:43:04.500 --> 00:43:09.420
It had all sort of orange seams running through it, didn't it?

962
00:43:09.480 --> 00:43:10.920
Like it was lava.

963
00:43:10.980 --> 00:43:11.880
Yeah, yeah, like it was wrong.

964
00:43:11.940 --> 00:43:15.059
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. swim through rock.

965
00:43:15.119 --> 00:43:15.960
Yeah.

966
00:43:16.019 --> 00:43:18.179
Oh, I feel so sorry for everyone on the ship.

967
00:43:18.239 --> 00:43:20.099
They've just got nothing to do, but stand around.

968
00:43:20.099 --> 00:43:22.199
Yeah, yeah.

969
00:43:22.260 --> 00:43:24.360
They're not even getting to watch the telly all that much.

970
00:43:24.420 --> 00:43:25.980
Oh my god, this is so bad.

971
00:43:26.039 --> 00:43:30.719
And again, like the stakes are just so pretend, you know, like, oh

972
00:43:30.719 --> 00:43:33.599
we'll blow the ship up unless you play our game.

973
00:43:33.659 --> 00:43:35.940
Is that cool enough to fight?

974
00:43:36.000 --> 00:43:37.139
Come on now.

975
00:43:37.199 --> 00:43:38.099
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

976
00:43:38.159 --> 00:43:40.739
I don't know. says Captain Kirk, really.

977
00:43:40.800 --> 00:43:43.980
And then so Kirk says, yeah, you know, like I can't let all these

978
00:43:43.980 --> 00:43:45.780
people die, blah, blah, blah.

979
00:43:45.840 --> 00:43:50.340
Oh, they're trying to add, you know, disengaged on the sales, you

980
00:43:50.340 --> 00:43:51.659
know, would be marooned in space.

981
00:43:52.019 --> 00:43:56.880
So you could always separate the Nacelles. like discovery where

982
00:43:56.880 --> 00:44:00.659
the Nasselles are just sort of travelling along near the ship, you

983
00:44:00.659 --> 00:44:02.519
know, like in the 32nd century.

984
00:44:02.579 --> 00:44:06.719
Why is it these godlike aliens, yeah, X scalpions and people like

985
00:44:06.719 --> 00:44:06.960
that?

986
00:44:07.019 --> 00:44:11.099
They always seem to have powers. that allow us to just make the

987
00:44:11.099 --> 00:44:13.800
episode last sort of 10, 15 minutes longer all the time.

988
00:44:13.860 --> 00:44:17.940
Your communications equipment no longer works because I say so

989
00:44:17.940 --> 00:44:19.019
Captain Kirk, you know?

990
00:44:19.079 --> 00:44:19.920
Okay.

991
00:44:19.920 --> 00:44:21.480
You couldn't beam your stuff over.

992
00:44:22.500 --> 00:44:25.079
It looks like the Shellyac.

993
00:44:25.139 --> 00:44:26.039
Do you remember the Shelliac?

994
00:44:26.099 --> 00:44:26.699
Who are they?

995
00:44:26.760 --> 00:44:29.039
It's in series two.

996
00:44:29.099 --> 00:44:34.260
They're sort of aliens that look like a big black shape in a black

997
00:44:34.260 --> 00:44:36.539
sequined ball gown.

998
00:44:36.599 --> 00:44:39.300
Sounds marvellous. semi-darkness.

999
00:44:39.360 --> 00:44:41.639
The Shelleyac corporate.

1000
00:44:41.699 --> 00:44:43.500
I can't even it's season two, I think.

1001
00:44:43.559 --> 00:44:46.559
I don't know what it is, but they're intransigent aliens of some

1002
00:44:46.559 --> 00:44:46.800
kind.

1003
00:44:46.860 --> 00:44:52.739
You know, obviously, I would never, ever advocate for blackface.

1004
00:44:52.800 --> 00:44:57.780
If you are going to do it, you need to do it better than that.

1005
00:44:58.320 --> 00:45:02.519
Various parts of his face are various shades of dark, aren't

1006
00:45:02.519 --> 00:45:02.760
they?

1007
00:45:02.820 --> 00:45:04.619
It's just so slap down.

1008
00:45:04.679 --> 00:45:05.579
Why have they done that?

1009
00:45:05.639 --> 00:45:09.480
I mean, like they give darker skin, don't they, to some of the

1010
00:45:09.480 --> 00:45:10.260
Klingons.

1011
00:45:10.320 --> 00:45:13.739
They want to make the Clons look foreign and they want to make the

1012
00:45:13.739 --> 00:45:15.480
alien races racialized.

1013
00:45:15.599 --> 00:45:16.380
Do you know what I mean?

1014
00:45:16.440 --> 00:45:18.780
They want to give them human racial characteristics.

1015
00:45:18.840 --> 00:45:22.860
I mean, I think, I think because they racialize data because they

1016
00:45:22.860 --> 00:45:28.380
see data, you know, as possibly being someone who could be on the

1017
00:45:28.380 --> 00:45:31.739
receiving end of racism in the 24th century, and so they give him

1018
00:45:31.739 --> 00:45:34.260
different skin colour and eye colour.

1019
00:45:34.320 --> 00:45:35.099
Do you know what I mean?

1020
00:45:35.159 --> 00:45:36.900
like to make it like a race.

1021
00:45:36.960 --> 00:45:40.079
And so they're doing that with the Klingons, but like, is it

1022
00:45:40.079 --> 00:45:43.260
because this is the most evil of the Klingons.

1023
00:45:43.320 --> 00:45:44.159
Trouble of triples.

1024
00:45:44.219 --> 00:45:45.960
They sort of orange in now, aren't they?

1025
00:45:46.019 --> 00:45:46.920
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1026
00:45:46.920 --> 00:45:48.900
They don't really settle on a look.

1027
00:45:48.960 --> 00:45:53.039
I mean, I know we moan about the pasties on their forehead in 90s

1028
00:45:53.039 --> 00:45:55.139
trek, but at least they all had a look.

1029
00:45:55.199 --> 00:45:55.980
It was uniform.

1030
00:45:56.039 --> 00:45:56.579
Yeah.

1031
00:45:56.579 --> 00:45:57.480
Yeah.

1032
00:45:57.539 --> 00:46:01.199
You know, it's this sort of forest glade that we've come to now on

1033
00:46:01.199 --> 00:46:02.699
the lava planet.

1034
00:46:02.760 --> 00:46:05.039
There's just a few potted plants about the place.

1035
00:46:05.099 --> 00:46:06.840
Well, no, they had that.

1036
00:46:06.900 --> 00:46:07.619
They did have that.

1037
00:46:07.679 --> 00:46:10.980
Sometimes they wheel in the aspadistras from the production office

1038
00:46:10.980 --> 00:46:12.659
and dot them around the scene.

1039
00:46:15.719 --> 00:46:20.159
Can't we have lush, aggressive vegetation in there, shit?

1040
00:46:20.400 --> 00:46:21.059
Oh my god.

1041
00:46:21.840 --> 00:46:24.599
I'm just dying of boredom here at this point.

1042
00:46:24.659 --> 00:46:25.260
Where are we?

1043
00:46:25.320 --> 00:46:26.159
How long have we got?

1044
00:46:26.219 --> 00:46:27.420
I don't think so.

1045
00:46:27.420 --> 00:46:29.579
So that'd be loads of fights, but nothing's happened for 15

1046
00:46:29.579 --> 00:46:29.940
minutes.

1047
00:46:30.000 --> 00:46:31.739
No, they're all standing around.

1048
00:46:31.800 --> 00:46:32.760
They're all standing around.

1049
00:46:32.820 --> 00:46:36.719
Like, again, we're just sort of talking and talking.

1050
00:46:37.019 --> 00:46:44.039
So Surak or Surak, like this is all important backstory that we

1051
00:46:44.039 --> 00:46:45.480
didn't know or did we know?

1052
00:46:45.539 --> 00:46:46.440
Like, I don't know.

1053
00:46:46.500 --> 00:46:47.940
Like, it is kind of interesting.

1054
00:46:48.000 --> 00:46:51.539
It comes in very late and doesn't really get picked up up on

1055
00:46:51.539 --> 00:46:56.460
properly until later, but the idea that the Vulcans were really

1056
00:46:56.460 --> 00:47:01.679
passionate and just learn to rein it in and that Vulcans aren't

1057
00:47:01.679 --> 00:47:02.639
emotionless.

1058
00:47:02.699 --> 00:47:04.320
They're controlled.

1059
00:47:04.320 --> 00:47:08.699
And the reason they are is because Surak's philosophy came and

1060
00:47:08.699 --> 00:47:11.820
taught them logic and taught them to control their emotions and

1061
00:47:11.820 --> 00:47:12.960
that makes them more interesting.

1062
00:47:13.079 --> 00:47:14.219
Okay, important to the story?

1063
00:47:14.280 --> 00:47:18.900
Is that where we're going to land at the end if we use logic, then

1064
00:47:18.900 --> 00:47:22.739
we won't succumb to our, you know, animalistic tendencies.

1065
00:47:22.860 --> 00:47:27.000
No, and it's really boring, and then, and then like, I don't know

1066
00:47:27.000 --> 00:47:30.360
like Surak goes off and gets himself killed or whatever, and Spot

1067
00:47:30.360 --> 00:47:31.619
goes, oh, well...

1068
00:47:31.679 --> 00:47:33.360
That's the best scene in the whole episode.

1069
00:47:33.420 --> 00:47:35.579
No, he says...

1070
00:47:35.639 --> 00:47:36.659
He knew what he was getting into.

1071
00:47:36.840 --> 00:47:39.119
Yeah, bless him.

1072
00:47:39.179 --> 00:47:42.360
Yeah, but is there something here?

1073
00:47:42.360 --> 00:47:45.840
Because we're having a conversation between like what we should do

1074
00:47:45.840 --> 00:47:53.219
and like the thing that separated Kirk from the Gorn in arena was

1075
00:47:53.219 --> 00:47:57.179
that he wasn't desperate to kill the Gorn necessarily.

1076
00:47:57.239 --> 00:48:01.440
And like he does fight to disable him and stuff like that, but he

1077
00:48:01.440 --> 00:48:03.300
doesn't he doesn't do the killing blow.

1078
00:48:03.360 --> 00:48:06.239
You know, when he's given the chance to kill him, he refuses.

1079
00:48:06.300 --> 00:48:12.900
Um, whereas here, he is happy to kind of kill because the ship's

1080
00:48:12.900 --> 00:48:13.500
at stake.

1081
00:48:13.559 --> 00:48:17.039
But there's on the good side, there's some sort of conversation

1082
00:48:17.039 --> 00:48:19.260
about whether that's the right course of action.

1083
00:48:19.320 --> 00:48:23.760
And then we are going to get the ex-calpion saying, good and evil

1084
00:48:23.760 --> 00:48:29.280
are the same, turns out, but then we're just all going to, like...

1085
00:48:29.280 --> 00:48:30.480
He did just suggest that.

1086
00:48:30.480 --> 00:48:36.000
He said, well, maybe it's our working towards peace that's being

1087
00:48:36.000 --> 00:48:36.480
tested.

1088
00:48:36.539 --> 00:48:39.960
So he's made a suggestion of what the episode might be about, but

1089
00:48:39.960 --> 00:48:43.199
actually, and then it immediately cuts to a shot of the

1090
00:48:43.199 --> 00:48:46.500
turdballster going, hmm, no.

1091
00:48:46.559 --> 00:48:47.880
Maybe that is what this is about.

1092
00:48:50.940 --> 00:48:52.920
Oh, God like that, Klingon.

1093
00:48:52.980 --> 00:48:53.880
Look at him.

1094
00:48:55.320 --> 00:48:59.400
That's all I'm trying to make defences, but they've got this pokey

1095
00:48:59.400 --> 00:49:01.920
corner of the studio and a few sticks.

1096
00:49:01.980 --> 00:49:03.300
Yeah, yeah.

1097
00:49:03.360 --> 00:49:07.559
But they haven't learned too that like a spear can't be just sort

1098
00:49:07.559 --> 00:49:11.699
of tossed gently onto the set because it looks really shit.

1099
00:49:11.760 --> 00:49:13.980
Like, you've really got to hurt her.

1100
00:49:14.039 --> 00:49:16.079
Oh, dear OT.

1101
00:49:16.139 --> 00:49:18.360
She looks like she's come straight out of Hansel and Krow, that

1102
00:49:18.360 --> 00:49:19.019
woman, doesn't she?

1103
00:49:19.079 --> 00:49:20.880
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1104
00:49:20.940 --> 00:49:21.599
She's a witch.

1105
00:49:21.659 --> 00:49:22.739
Do you know what I mean?

1106
00:49:22.800 --> 00:49:23.760
Like, she's not a bat.

1107
00:49:23.820 --> 00:49:24.780
She's not a fighter.

1108
00:49:24.840 --> 00:49:29.039
She kills people with poison, which is also a very, you know

1109
00:49:29.039 --> 00:49:32.940
traditionally female way of killing people, whereas it would have

1110
00:49:32.940 --> 00:49:34.739
been more interesting if she'd been a warrior.

1111
00:49:34.800 --> 00:49:37.019
Who are the real people on the planet?

1112
00:49:37.079 --> 00:49:39.059
Just Kirk and Spock?

1113
00:49:39.119 --> 00:49:39.960
Yes.

1114
00:49:40.019 --> 00:49:43.800
And everybody else is just a figment of imagination. yeah?

1115
00:49:43.860 --> 00:49:47.699
Yeah, I don't know where Zora and Kayles come from, though.

1116
00:49:47.760 --> 00:49:48.780
Do you know what I mean?

1117
00:49:48.840 --> 00:49:50.039
made out of then.

1118
00:49:50.579 --> 00:49:53.340
They're made out of X-Calpions.

1119
00:49:53.400 --> 00:49:57.960
Oh, they are ex-scalpions. in the shape of serac and all the

1120
00:49:57.960 --> 00:49:58.139
rest.

1121
00:49:58.199 --> 00:49:59.159
I think so.

1122
00:49:59.219 --> 00:49:59.760
Right.

1123
00:49:59.880 --> 00:50:00.239
Right.

1124
00:50:00.300 --> 00:50:00.719
Okay.

1125
00:50:00.780 --> 00:50:04.860
What, made to think that they genuinely are those people, because

1126
00:50:04.860 --> 00:50:07.380
they were just having conversations, if they genuinely were those

1127
00:50:07.380 --> 00:50:07.619
people.

1128
00:50:07.679 --> 00:50:08.400
Yeah.

1129
00:50:08.460 --> 00:50:09.480
I don't know.

1130
00:50:09.539 --> 00:50:12.360
Oh, Gene, you didn't think this one through, did you?

1131
00:50:12.420 --> 00:50:13.619
No one's thinking it through.

1132
00:50:13.679 --> 00:50:16.559
No wonder he ended up in that corner office, you know, with

1133
00:50:16.559 --> 00:50:17.099
nothing to do.

1134
00:50:17.159 --> 00:50:21.480
Yeah, I have to say that I would soon have the conversation about

1135
00:50:21.480 --> 00:50:26.039
Surax, philosophy and Vulcan history, then the conversation about

1136
00:50:26.039 --> 00:50:29.880
are they really, you know, who they think they are, which is super

1137
00:50:29.880 --> 00:50:30.239
boring.

1138
00:50:30.300 --> 00:50:35.219
You might think at this point, that Star Trek has sort of run out

1139
00:50:35.219 --> 00:50:36.179
of ideas, right?

1140
00:50:36.239 --> 00:50:40.679
That like we, maybe we covered the, the gamut of what this show

1141
00:50:40.679 --> 00:50:42.000
can do creatively.

1142
00:50:42.059 --> 00:50:43.559
What's astonishing is.

1143
00:50:43.619 --> 00:50:49.019
It's gone on for another 60 years and all of those different shows

1144
00:50:49.019 --> 00:50:50.940
that have shown all of those different sides.

1145
00:50:51.000 --> 00:50:54.239
So I think the lesson to be learnt, really, is they just weren't

1146
00:50:54.239 --> 00:50:55.019
trying hard enough here.

1147
00:50:55.679 --> 00:51:00.960
Yeah, or it might be a Freiburger problem, I think, and it might

1148
00:51:00.960 --> 00:51:03.179
be a production team problem as well.

1149
00:51:03.239 --> 00:51:06.119
Well, when, what about Day of the Dove?

1150
00:51:06.179 --> 00:51:10.079
What about the one in the western town, the stuff that peaks

1151
00:51:10.079 --> 00:51:13.139
through that is actually competent and watchable.

1152
00:51:13.199 --> 00:51:17.699
Yeah, Spectre of the Ghani series 3, and it's great, you know, and

1153
00:51:17.699 --> 00:51:22.079
it is also like weird aliens pitting them against each other.

1154
00:51:22.139 --> 00:51:22.980
Do you know what I mean?

1155
00:51:22.980 --> 00:51:24.000
In a fake world?

1156
00:51:24.059 --> 00:51:25.320
That season three, isn't it?

1157
00:51:25.380 --> 00:51:26.579
Yep, yep.

1158
00:51:26.639 --> 00:51:27.179
I think so.

1159
00:51:27.360 --> 00:51:31.559
Yeah, so like there's a lot of decent stuff here.

1160
00:51:31.619 --> 00:51:35.099
And I think even like even turnabout intruder, which is the final

1161
00:51:35.099 --> 00:51:38.579
episode, which is a horrific reactionary episode about how

1162
00:51:38.579 --> 00:51:42.000
terrible women are and how they should return to the kitchen and

1163
00:51:42.000 --> 00:51:44.880
stop trying to do proper people's jobs.

1164
00:51:44.940 --> 00:51:47.519
Like an awful, you know, episode.

1165
00:51:47.579 --> 00:51:50.820
Did I ever acknowledge that in later tracks?

1166
00:51:50.880 --> 00:51:55.139
No, no, they just...

1167
00:51:55.199 --> 00:52:03.179
No, because Captain Giorgio is a decorated Starfleet captain 10

1168
00:52:03.179 --> 00:52:04.980
years before this, remember?

1169
00:52:05.039 --> 00:52:06.059
So they just ignore it.

1170
00:52:06.119 --> 00:52:08.039
Which is exactly what they should do.

1171
00:52:08.099 --> 00:52:10.260
But even that episode is better.

1172
00:52:10.320 --> 00:52:11.340
Do you know what I mean?

1173
00:52:11.400 --> 00:52:15.599
than this, which is just retreading something that we've done a

1174
00:52:15.599 --> 00:52:18.179
100 times before only more boringly.

1175
00:52:18.300 --> 00:52:23.460
I just think they think by putting these random elements together

1176
00:52:23.460 --> 00:52:28.019
in this setting where they fight against each other, that's a good

1177
00:52:28.019 --> 00:52:28.980
hour telly.

1178
00:52:29.039 --> 00:52:33.599
That's a fun hour, telly, but it's just, I mean, because there's

1179
00:52:33.599 --> 00:52:34.739
no laughs in it either.

1180
00:52:34.860 --> 00:52:38.760
Everyone's making this absurd situation so seriously.

1181
00:52:38.820 --> 00:52:40.380
Yeah, yeah.

1182
00:52:40.440 --> 00:52:44.460
Where's Shatner's sort of laconic smile of like, oh, please, what's

1183
00:52:44.460 --> 00:52:44.880
happening here?

1184
00:52:44.940 --> 00:52:45.840
Yeah, yeah.

1185
00:52:45.900 --> 00:52:47.280
Yeah.

1186
00:52:47.340 --> 00:52:48.840
No, I mean this.

1187
00:52:48.900 --> 00:52:50.639
Oh, and so what, he's gonna go?

1188
00:52:50.699 --> 00:52:51.360
Who's gonna go?

1189
00:52:51.420 --> 00:52:54.780
Like, like, um, Spock's not going to go.

1190
00:52:55.800 --> 00:52:59.039
Kirk is because Kirk cares and Spock's kind of going, oh, yeah

1191
00:52:59.039 --> 00:52:59.820
he's not even real.

1192
00:52:59.880 --> 00:53:01.440
And so I don't care.

1193
00:53:01.500 --> 00:53:04.380
I am not sensitive to it, Captain.

1194
00:53:04.440 --> 00:53:07.019
Oh, because he's being tortured now, isn't he?

1195
00:53:07.079 --> 00:53:10.440
Yeah, but he doesn't believe in Surak, though.

1196
00:53:10.500 --> 00:53:13.980
Because he says that at Surak, you know, Vocal wouldn't scream

1197
00:53:13.980 --> 00:53:14.400
like that.

1198
00:53:14.460 --> 00:53:18.300
And he's right, you know, like it isn't Surak.

1199
00:53:18.360 --> 00:53:19.199
I don't know.

1200
00:53:19.260 --> 00:53:21.000
But Kirk knows he's not real.

1201
00:53:21.059 --> 00:53:22.800
Why is he going to rescue him?

1202
00:53:22.860 --> 00:53:24.480
He knows he's an ex scalpion.

1203
00:53:24.539 --> 00:53:26.340
Yeah, no, what?

1204
00:53:26.460 --> 00:53:27.000
Yeah, does he?

1205
00:53:27.059 --> 00:53:27.599
I don't know.

1206
00:53:27.659 --> 00:53:28.440
Whatever.

1207
00:53:31.800 --> 00:53:34.800
If he doesn't play the game, I don't know.

1208
00:53:34.860 --> 00:53:38.760
We're literally bleeding IQ points, the more we watch this.

1209
00:53:38.820 --> 00:53:41.340
Oh, look at that makeup.

1210
00:53:41.400 --> 00:53:42.780
Look at that fucking makeup.

1211
00:53:42.840 --> 00:53:45.300
Like, they've blanked up his, like, it's old, isn't it?

1212
00:53:45.360 --> 00:53:46.800
He does now look.

1213
00:53:46.860 --> 00:53:47.940
Black.

1214
00:53:48.000 --> 00:53:49.260
He looks like a Klingon.

1215
00:53:49.380 --> 00:53:49.980
Yeah.

1216
00:53:50.039 --> 00:53:50.760
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1217
00:53:50.820 --> 00:53:52.559
Like it's terrible.

1218
00:53:52.619 --> 00:53:53.880
Look at that massive lip.

1219
00:53:53.940 --> 00:53:54.420
I know.

1220
00:53:54.480 --> 00:53:58.619
It's so bad Nobody has a bottom lip that big and a top lip that

1221
00:53:58.619 --> 00:53:59.039
small.

1222
00:53:59.099 --> 00:54:00.420
Yeah.

1223
00:54:00.480 --> 00:54:03.900
You know, he does have that jutting bottom leap in the photos.

1224
00:54:03.960 --> 00:54:04.679
Do you know what I mean?

1225
00:54:04.800 --> 00:54:08.219
They're the big things is that mole on his cheek and the lip.

1226
00:54:08.280 --> 00:54:11.639
But it's just like, just cast a fucking actor and get him to

1227
00:54:11.639 --> 00:54:12.719
pretend to be.

1228
00:54:12.780 --> 00:54:15.119
Like, it's not even Abraham Lincoln anybody.

1229
00:54:15.539 --> 00:54:18.480
I can't let you risk it, Mr. President.

1230
00:54:18.539 --> 00:54:20.639
I'm no longer the president.

1231
00:54:20.760 --> 00:54:23.340
Let me go and get a spear in the back, okay?

1232
00:54:23.639 --> 00:54:25.079
Yeah.

1233
00:54:25.139 --> 00:54:28.920
I mean, you do call, you do call former presidents, Mr. President

1234
00:54:28.920 --> 00:54:29.639
in the United States.

1235
00:54:29.699 --> 00:54:32.099
Oh, with areas, if you don't stop calling them.

1236
00:54:32.159 --> 00:54:33.900
Relax, every time I see the monster.

1237
00:54:34.860 --> 00:54:37.139
He's reassuring presence.

1238
00:54:37.260 --> 00:54:40.079
Well, he's left boring than the rest of it.

1239
00:54:40.800 --> 00:54:44.880
I wish he sort of got up, though, and sort of waddled about a bit

1240
00:54:44.880 --> 00:54:45.179
you know?

1241
00:54:45.239 --> 00:54:46.559
Yeah, no, he can't.

1242
00:54:47.460 --> 00:54:51.300
I wonder if they've ever interviewed at a convention, the man who

1243
00:54:51.300 --> 00:54:52.559
played the Excalpion.

1244
00:54:52.619 --> 00:54:55.260
Imagine the poor person inside that costume.

1245
00:54:55.320 --> 00:55:00.179
So we think he's called Yanos Prohaska.

1246
00:55:00.239 --> 00:55:00.960
Yanos.

1247
00:55:00.960 --> 00:55:02.099
Absolutely, sir.

1248
00:55:02.159 --> 00:55:03.599
He doesn't do the voice.

1249
00:55:03.659 --> 00:55:05.340
He doesn't do the voice.

1250
00:55:06.119 --> 00:55:08.280
Does he do anything else?

1251
00:55:08.340 --> 00:55:10.260
He is.

1252
00:55:12.360 --> 00:55:17.880
He is a monster in he's a monster in the cave.

1253
00:55:17.940 --> 00:55:19.199
Oh my gosh.

1254
00:55:19.260 --> 00:55:21.179
What is the monster in the cage?

1255
00:55:21.239 --> 00:55:23.760
Anyway, he's a monster in the cage.

1256
00:55:23.820 --> 00:55:26.639
He's like a giant chicken of some kind.

1257
00:55:26.699 --> 00:55:28.619
Uh, yeah.

1258
00:55:28.619 --> 00:55:32.820
To be fair, right, as ineptly executed as all this is.

1259
00:55:32.880 --> 00:55:34.320
There was an attempt there.

1260
00:55:34.380 --> 00:55:36.300
Look, to show some depth in the set.

1261
00:55:36.360 --> 00:55:38.460
There's several relators to the set there.

1262
00:55:38.519 --> 00:55:39.480
Yeah.

1263
00:55:39.539 --> 00:55:42.179
I feel sorry for that. woman, she don't get a line, does she?

1264
00:55:42.300 --> 00:55:46.500
No, but neither does um, there's, I don't think um, Finger gets a

1265
00:55:46.500 --> 00:55:47.039
line, does he?

1266
00:55:47.099 --> 00:55:48.179
There's um...

1267
00:55:48.239 --> 00:55:50.219
Sorry, we can't afford to pay you for a line, so.

1268
00:55:50.699 --> 00:55:51.119
No, no.

1269
00:55:51.719 --> 00:55:56.400
They're just hurling polystarium rocks across the side.

1270
00:55:56.460 --> 00:55:57.659
What is going on?

1271
00:55:57.719 --> 00:56:01.440
That rock just bounced off the other, off the other polystrone

1272
00:56:01.440 --> 00:56:01.800
rock.

1273
00:56:01.860 --> 00:56:05.280
And then again, we're gently throwing spears at each other.

1274
00:56:05.340 --> 00:56:07.619
God, it's a fight to the death, isn't it?

1275
00:56:07.679 --> 00:56:09.300
It's so boring.

1276
00:56:09.360 --> 00:56:10.019
What are we doing?

1277
00:56:10.079 --> 00:56:11.039
Oh, my God.

1278
00:56:11.039 --> 00:56:13.199
Zoom in on Surak dead.

1279
00:56:13.260 --> 00:56:15.000
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1280
00:56:15.059 --> 00:56:17.159
And again, it's not a real zoom in too.

1281
00:56:17.219 --> 00:56:18.599
It's like a post.

1282
00:56:18.659 --> 00:56:21.420
It's like zooming in on a on a steel on a film still.

1283
00:56:21.480 --> 00:56:22.500
So, man.

1284
00:56:22.559 --> 00:56:25.199
Do you think drive over in his voice was like, I can see it.

1285
00:56:25.199 --> 00:56:26.099
Just cut it together.

1286
00:56:26.099 --> 00:56:26.519
It's fine.

1287
00:56:26.639 --> 00:56:28.440
We're nearly done.

1288
00:56:28.619 --> 00:56:33.360
Space 1999 series 2 and he thinks his stuff's great.

1289
00:56:33.420 --> 00:56:34.980
I just imagine him.

1290
00:56:35.039 --> 00:56:38.880
I imagine him being like Ed Wood in the film.

1291
00:56:38.940 --> 00:56:39.960
Do you know what I mean?

1292
00:56:40.019 --> 00:56:42.000
Oh, that's marvellous, you know, terrific.

1293
00:56:42.059 --> 00:56:42.659
Well done, everyone.

1294
00:56:42.719 --> 00:56:44.760
I like JNT when he saw the Merka.

1295
00:56:44.820 --> 00:56:46.139
There's an obscure reference.

1296
00:56:46.199 --> 00:56:46.800
Wow, wonderful.

1297
00:56:46.800 --> 00:56:47.699
Terrific stuff.

1298
00:56:47.760 --> 00:56:50.039
Oh, look at the lip there.

1299
00:56:50.099 --> 00:56:50.639
Look at the lip.

1300
00:56:50.699 --> 00:56:52.380
It's falling off.

1301
00:56:52.440 --> 00:56:53.880
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1302
00:56:53.940 --> 00:56:54.599
Oh my god.

1303
00:56:55.199 --> 00:56:57.059
Jesus Christ.

1304
00:56:57.119 --> 00:56:59.219
Oh, never moan about Odo's makeup again.

1305
00:56:59.280 --> 00:57:01.739
Oh, I will.

1306
00:57:01.800 --> 00:57:03.360
I know you will.

1307
00:57:03.420 --> 00:57:05.159
Turns out he's dead.

1308
00:57:05.340 --> 00:57:07.260
Help me, Spock.

1309
00:57:07.320 --> 00:57:07.739
Please.

1310
00:57:10.019 --> 00:57:11.760
He was dead.

1311
00:57:11.760 --> 00:57:13.860
I'm sure why we care.

1312
00:57:13.920 --> 00:57:15.000
We don't.

1313
00:57:15.059 --> 00:57:17.699
Clearly we don't. supposed to.

1314
00:57:17.760 --> 00:57:19.980
We're going to rescue him, for God's sakes.

1315
00:57:20.039 --> 00:57:21.480
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, no.

1316
00:57:21.480 --> 00:57:22.139
Oh my god.

1317
00:57:22.139 --> 00:57:24.000
God, shut up, throw the spear.

1318
00:57:24.059 --> 00:57:25.920
Throw it at Kayla.

1319
00:57:25.980 --> 00:57:27.599
I'm better than racist.

1320
00:57:27.659 --> 00:57:30.179
Oh, is it the bit where Lincoln dies?

1321
00:57:30.239 --> 00:57:31.199
Yes.

1322
00:57:31.199 --> 00:57:32.639
No.

1323
00:57:34.260 --> 00:57:36.659
Oh, no, gentlemen.

1324
00:57:36.719 --> 00:57:39.960
I've got a problem There's a spear in my back.

1325
00:57:42.119 --> 00:57:43.739
Okay.

1326
00:57:43.800 --> 00:57:44.940
Will you ask me this?

1327
00:57:45.000 --> 00:57:48.719
Who the fuck walks out of a clearing as if they're just, oh, go

1328
00:57:48.719 --> 00:57:53.340
for a stroll and then face palms with a bloody spear in their

1329
00:57:53.340 --> 00:57:53.579
back.

1330
00:57:53.880 --> 00:57:58.440
He does put his hands out to protect himself as he does.

1331
00:57:58.500 --> 00:58:02.039
I like to think that the ex-scalpion has a moment of sort of, you

1332
00:58:02.039 --> 00:58:03.659
know, he understands drama, you know.

1333
00:58:03.719 --> 00:58:07.920
If I've sort of walk out, and then I fall with the spear. as a

1334
00:58:07.920 --> 00:58:08.400
good shock.

1335
00:58:08.519 --> 00:58:10.739
Yeah, we would go right now.

1336
00:58:10.739 --> 00:58:12.480
We're having a bit of a problem. a sense of occasion.

1337
00:58:12.539 --> 00:58:15.179
A really boring brawl, though.

1338
00:58:15.239 --> 00:58:19.199
Is it a music like...

1339
00:58:19.199 --> 00:58:21.900
The music is pretty good as usual, I think.

1340
00:58:21.900 --> 00:58:25.260
The one myself kind of admiring the music, but it isn't the amok

1341
00:58:25.260 --> 00:58:26.760
time music, I'm afraid.

1342
00:58:27.000 --> 00:58:28.739
What exactly?

1343
00:58:28.800 --> 00:58:31.079
You know, um, Yarne Karak Scalpion.

1344
00:58:31.139 --> 00:58:32.400
I just can't get over those names.

1345
00:58:32.519 --> 00:58:35.639
Was he sort of getting from all of this ultimately?

1346
00:58:36.420 --> 00:58:38.340
A TV show.

1347
00:58:38.400 --> 00:58:41.579
He's producing a TV show for the other Excalibions to watch, I

1348
00:58:41.579 --> 00:58:42.300
think.

1349
00:58:42.300 --> 00:58:43.679
Yeah, it's this entertainment for them then.

1350
00:58:43.739 --> 00:58:45.179
Yeah, yeah.

1351
00:58:45.239 --> 00:58:46.980
Like it is for us, as you can see.

1352
00:58:47.039 --> 00:58:49.500
I reckon there's Excalbion podcasts.

1353
00:58:49.500 --> 00:58:51.300
Pocometry podcasts.

1354
00:58:53.280 --> 00:58:57.539
That's right. podcast about other podcasts.

1355
00:58:57.599 --> 00:58:59.039
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1356
00:58:59.039 --> 00:59:02.219
What do you think of untitled Star Trek project?

1357
00:59:02.280 --> 00:59:03.780
Five stars.

1358
00:59:04.619 --> 00:59:06.780
So wait, what happened there?

1359
00:59:06.840 --> 00:59:07.440
Who did he kill?

1360
00:59:07.500 --> 00:59:09.000
The others just ran away.

1361
00:59:09.059 --> 00:59:09.539
Oh, yeah.

1362
00:59:09.599 --> 00:59:11.159
It's 5 minutes from the end of the episode.

1363
00:59:11.219 --> 00:59:12.119
The others ran away.

1364
00:59:12.179 --> 00:59:14.820
Apparently, what we've learned from evil is that evil people run

1365
00:59:14.820 --> 00:59:16.199
away when they're cornered.

1366
00:59:16.260 --> 00:59:20.219
You have failed to demonstrate any difference between your 2

1367
00:59:20.219 --> 00:59:21.059
philosophies.

1368
00:59:21.119 --> 00:59:23.159
You both achieved the same results.

1369
00:59:23.219 --> 00:59:24.780
Do you have an explanation?

1370
00:59:24.840 --> 00:59:26.519
No, neither do you.

1371
00:59:26.579 --> 00:59:27.539
Oh, well.

1372
00:59:27.599 --> 00:59:28.079
Yeah.

1373
00:59:28.139 --> 00:59:29.880
Okay, we're done then.

1374
00:59:34.019 --> 00:59:37.619
Gestures very emphatically, doesn't he, Yarnack?

1375
00:59:37.679 --> 00:59:38.219
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1376
00:59:38.280 --> 00:59:40.380
I just don't understand any of this.

1377
00:59:40.500 --> 00:59:42.960
Like, what's the point of this conversation now?

1378
00:59:43.019 --> 00:59:46.320
Like, is this guy a bad person?

1379
00:59:46.440 --> 00:59:48.599
No, what have we learned?

1380
00:59:48.840 --> 00:59:51.539
How many people have you done this to?

1381
00:59:51.599 --> 00:59:54.539
What gives you the right to hand out life and death?

1382
00:59:54.599 --> 00:59:56.460
We need to know new things.

1383
00:59:56.519 --> 00:59:59.579
He goes, oh, okay.

1384
01:00:00.360 --> 01:00:00.960
You came in peace?

1385
01:00:01.019 --> 01:00:02.159
Well, you can go in peace.

1386
01:00:02.219 --> 01:00:02.579
Yeah, goodbye.

1387
01:00:02.699 --> 01:00:06.239
So this is an absolute nothing conversation that's about nothing

1388
01:00:06.239 --> 01:00:10.920
and he turns into a rock again, and then we go up, do we have a

1389
01:00:10.920 --> 01:00:13.679
racist gag at Spock's expense before we...

1390
01:00:13.739 --> 01:00:16.800
It'd be funny if we stayed with the Ex-Scalpion as he beamed off.

1391
01:00:16.860 --> 01:00:19.380
He went back to his studio and he was like, right, did you get

1392
01:00:19.380 --> 01:00:20.280
enough for an episode there?

1393
01:00:20.400 --> 01:00:21.719
Okay, good.

1394
01:00:21.780 --> 01:00:22.440
All right.

1395
01:00:22.559 --> 01:00:23.820
It ain't a great episode.

1396
01:00:23.880 --> 01:00:25.139
We've had better, but...

1397
01:00:25.139 --> 01:00:27.840
By no means, covered together.

1398
01:00:27.900 --> 01:00:29.820
It's just dismal.

1399
01:00:30.239 --> 01:00:33.000
And this is just Jim.

1400
01:00:33.059 --> 01:00:35.519
Shatner excited that the whole thing's over.

1401
01:00:35.579 --> 01:00:37.860
Yeah, it's got a massive grid on his face.

1402
01:00:37.920 --> 01:00:40.380
Everything's back to normal.

1403
01:00:40.440 --> 01:00:41.460
War power's back.

1404
01:00:41.519 --> 01:00:42.119
Yeah.

1405
01:00:42.119 --> 01:00:44.340
We were never in any danger of any kind.

1406
01:00:44.400 --> 01:00:47.400
No, everything happened.

1407
01:00:47.460 --> 01:00:49.739
Everything's just reversed itself for no reason.

1408
01:00:49.800 --> 01:00:51.239
What did we learn?

1409
01:00:51.300 --> 01:00:53.099
Any explanation?

1410
01:00:53.099 --> 01:00:55.019
he says to Mrs. Spark?

1411
01:00:55.079 --> 01:00:56.340
Have you got anything for you?

1412
01:00:56.820 --> 01:00:58.079
You only got conjecture, he says.

1413
01:00:58.139 --> 01:00:58.860
Just conjecture.

1414
01:00:58.920 --> 01:01:04.019
I think this episode was about rearranging molecules into whatever

1415
01:01:04.019 --> 01:01:05.400
fashion they designed.

1416
01:01:05.460 --> 01:01:06.659
There we go.

1417
01:01:06.719 --> 01:01:07.559
That's great.

1418
01:01:07.619 --> 01:01:09.000
We can do that too.

1419
01:01:09.059 --> 01:01:13.320
So you're saying that the sort of representations were, as we

1420
01:01:13.320 --> 01:01:14.460
perceive them, yes.

1421
01:01:14.519 --> 01:01:17.699
And then what's so interesting.

1422
01:01:17.760 --> 01:01:18.960
No.

1423
01:01:20.400 --> 01:01:23.760
I feel as if I actually met Lincoln, you know.

1424
01:01:23.820 --> 01:01:27.000
Yeah, I feel like it too, just watching this.

1425
01:01:27.059 --> 01:01:28.619
Mostly his lower lip, though.

1426
01:01:29.280 --> 01:01:34.500
In a sense, they were real in what, perhaps they weren't in the

1427
01:01:34.500 --> 01:01:37.079
sense that they were on telly on NBC.

1428
01:01:37.139 --> 01:01:39.719
So hard in March, 1969.

1429
01:01:39.900 --> 01:01:42.360
So hard for me to watch him die again, you know?

1430
01:01:42.599 --> 01:01:44.880
Did he watch him die the 1st time?

1431
01:01:44.940 --> 01:01:46.079
everyone went through.

1432
01:01:46.079 --> 01:01:47.039
He wasn't born.

1433
01:01:47.940 --> 01:01:52.500
And then her account said, oh, sir, we're ready for the next

1434
01:01:52.500 --> 01:01:53.340
episode now.

1435
01:01:53.400 --> 01:01:55.440
All right, well, everybody will go.

1436
01:01:55.500 --> 01:01:55.739
Bye.

1437
01:01:55.980 --> 01:01:59.519
It doesn't come to any conclusions at all.

1438
01:01:59.579 --> 01:02:00.599
No, nothing.

1439
01:02:00.659 --> 01:02:01.920
No it's not about anything.

1440
01:02:01.980 --> 01:02:03.239
Like, it's not about anything.

1441
01:02:03.300 --> 01:02:05.940
Rotten berry, try harder.

1442
01:02:06.239 --> 01:02:07.980
Yeah, yeah.

1443
01:02:08.039 --> 01:02:09.059
Oh my god.

1444
01:02:09.119 --> 01:02:11.039
It really is just using up running time.

1445
01:02:11.099 --> 01:02:13.920
It's just doing the thing that we've done over and over and over

1446
01:02:13.920 --> 01:02:14.280
again.

1447
01:02:14.340 --> 01:02:15.719
It's nothing.

1448
01:02:15.780 --> 01:02:19.619
He even says as if, you know, he's put away a file.

1449
01:02:19.679 --> 01:02:21.780
Well, continue to the next assignment.

1450
01:02:21.840 --> 01:02:22.380
Let's go.

1451
01:02:22.500 --> 01:02:24.059
The next episode.

1452
01:02:24.119 --> 01:02:24.780
Off we go.

1453
01:02:24.840 --> 01:02:26.820
That's quite a good final shot.

1454
01:02:26.880 --> 01:02:29.940
It's a beautiful, yeah, but not the actual final shot.

1455
01:02:30.000 --> 01:02:30.659
Not the original.

1456
01:02:30.719 --> 01:02:31.019
No.

1457
01:02:31.079 --> 01:02:32.159
Oh there he is.

1458
01:02:32.219 --> 01:02:33.659
Fred Freiberg.

1459
01:02:33.719 --> 01:02:34.980
Hi, Fred.

1460
01:02:35.519 --> 01:02:40.079
Well, I did say I was going to talk to you very briefly about the

1461
01:02:40.079 --> 01:02:43.980
differences of our Fred and Maurice Hurley from the Next

1462
01:02:43.980 --> 01:02:44.579
Generation.

1463
01:02:44.579 --> 01:02:45.659
Okay.

1464
01:02:45.659 --> 01:02:47.519
Very divisive producers.

1465
01:02:47.579 --> 01:02:49.619
The difference between the 2 of them is.

1466
01:02:49.679 --> 01:02:54.119
I think Hurley genuinely looked at season one of the next

1467
01:02:54.119 --> 01:02:59.400
generation and made changes of things that he thought didn't

1468
01:02:59.400 --> 01:02:59.820
work.

1469
01:02:59.880 --> 01:03:04.019
And I know like he took out gates and he brought in Diana Mulder.

1470
01:03:04.079 --> 01:03:06.719
I mean, I think that was a savvy move, but a lot of people don't.

1471
01:03:06.780 --> 01:03:08.519
But he didn't think she was working.

1472
01:03:08.579 --> 01:03:10.500
He didn't think she was given good performances.

1473
01:03:10.559 --> 01:03:13.320
So he said, right, let's replace her with somebody who we know is

1474
01:03:13.320 --> 01:03:14.099
a good actor.

1475
01:03:14.159 --> 01:03:18.900
You go to the child and suddenly there's a different look to the

1476
01:03:18.900 --> 01:03:19.139
show.

1477
01:03:19.199 --> 01:03:20.400
Do you know what I mean?

1478
01:03:20.460 --> 01:03:23.940
They've added 10 forwards somewhere for everybody to relax in

1479
01:03:23.940 --> 01:03:24.840
which was a great move.

1480
01:03:25.559 --> 01:03:29.579
And the standard of the episodes are genuinely better.

1481
01:03:29.639 --> 01:03:32.699
I know there's some bad ones, but there are some great episodes in

1482
01:03:32.699 --> 01:03:33.599
series 2 as well.

1483
01:03:33.659 --> 01:03:34.440
Measure of a Man.

1484
01:03:34.500 --> 01:03:39.300
Um, Qhu, you know, some some really great songs.

1485
01:03:39.360 --> 01:03:40.139
There's three.

1486
01:03:40.320 --> 01:03:42.960
I like peak performance as well.

1487
01:03:43.019 --> 01:03:44.159
Don't you like peak performance?

1488
01:03:44.219 --> 01:03:44.699
Yeah.

1489
01:03:44.760 --> 01:03:45.420
No, it's terrible.

1490
01:03:45.480 --> 01:03:45.840
Wow.

1491
01:03:45.840 --> 01:03:47.340
It's quite fun.

1492
01:03:47.460 --> 01:03:50.280
Where was Freiburger comes in?

1493
01:03:51.119 --> 01:03:56.579
Freitburger comes in and says, God, everything that made Star Trek

1494
01:03:56.579 --> 01:03:57.000
great.

1495
01:03:57.059 --> 01:03:58.980
I don't want to do any of that anymore.

1496
01:03:59.820 --> 01:04:02.699
No, I don't think that's it.

1497
01:04:02.760 --> 01:04:05.940
I think that he genuinely thinks that Star Trek is about

1498
01:04:05.940 --> 01:04:10.500
omnipotent alien entities bringing you down to a planet and then

1499
01:04:10.500 --> 01:04:13.980
torturing you until it's time for the episode to end.

1500
01:04:14.039 --> 01:04:14.940
And it is a lot.

1501
01:04:15.000 --> 01:04:18.659
But what he hasn't noticed about it is that it's normally better

1502
01:04:18.659 --> 01:04:24.000
than this and certainly better than the other episodes where it

1503
01:04:24.000 --> 01:04:28.320
happens in series 3 that there's just something unpleasant about

1504
01:04:28.320 --> 01:04:29.340
watching it happen.

1505
01:04:29.400 --> 01:04:33.480
Like I thought whom gods destroy. while it did have an exploding

1506
01:04:33.480 --> 01:04:34.500
green woman in it.

1507
01:04:34.619 --> 01:04:36.960
No, but we said in that as well, nothing happens.

1508
01:04:37.019 --> 01:04:38.579
It's boring.

1509
01:04:38.639 --> 01:04:40.320
We said the same thing in the empath.

1510
01:04:40.380 --> 01:04:43.500
Nothing happens for long...

1511
01:04:43.559 --> 01:04:45.360
Like, you need incident in television.

1512
01:04:45.420 --> 01:04:47.159
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1513
01:04:47.219 --> 01:04:50.280
And you need some kind of, like, people need to want something and

1514
01:04:50.280 --> 01:04:51.539
they need to be proper obstacles.

1515
01:04:51.599 --> 01:04:54.480
You don't just, it is just a series of aliens.

1516
01:04:54.539 --> 01:04:57.960
And I know that that's where we start with the cage as well, isn't

1517
01:04:57.960 --> 01:04:58.139
it?

1518
01:04:58.199 --> 01:05:02.639
Where it's, you know, powerful aliens capturing us and making us

1519
01:05:02.639 --> 01:05:04.079
play tricks and stuff.

1520
01:05:04.139 --> 01:05:07.199
But like, it's just that too often.

1521
01:05:07.260 --> 01:05:09.599
And here, they think that that's enough.

1522
01:05:09.659 --> 01:05:11.880
There's nothing for us to learn here.

1523
01:05:11.940 --> 01:05:13.920
This isn't about anything.

1524
01:05:13.980 --> 01:05:16.860
It is just about filling in running time.

1525
01:05:16.920 --> 01:05:18.360
And so it's glacially slow.

1526
01:05:18.360 --> 01:05:21.420
And no one's really caring at this point.

1527
01:05:21.480 --> 01:05:23.219
The fight scenes are terrible.

1528
01:05:23.639 --> 01:05:26.579
It's just terribly boring, I think.

1529
01:05:26.639 --> 01:05:30.420
Think of the last time the Freiburger doesn't touch the original

1530
01:05:30.420 --> 01:05:34.800
series, Assignment Earth, that is packed full of incident.

1531
01:05:34.800 --> 01:05:37.079
There's so much story going on.

1532
01:05:37.139 --> 01:05:41.340
By the end of it, we're climbing up a fucking rocket with a cat on

1533
01:05:41.340 --> 01:05:42.900
his back trying to stay.

1534
01:05:42.900 --> 01:05:43.800
We're taking off.

1535
01:05:43.860 --> 01:05:47.400
You know, like, and it's also charming and funny as well.

1536
01:05:47.460 --> 01:05:51.420
Like, it's charming and funny. you know, those gorgeous sets.

1537
01:05:51.539 --> 01:05:57.719
I think there's something very, very sad. about a show that

1538
01:05:57.719 --> 01:06:04.380
delivered really good stuff on a regular basis, limping to a

1539
01:06:04.380 --> 01:06:04.920
conclusion.

1540
01:06:05.159 --> 01:06:11.880
And looking across the shows, I think Voyager ends up there in

1541
01:06:11.880 --> 01:06:16.139
season seven, a lot of season 7 is pretty standard stuff.

1542
01:06:16.199 --> 01:06:21.000
I think TNG certainly ends there where they just sort of realise

1543
01:06:21.000 --> 01:06:25.260
they've got other shows to make and they're not delivering their

1544
01:06:25.260 --> 01:06:26.159
best anymore.

1545
01:06:26.219 --> 01:06:30.599
But I mean, I think the problem here is that when Star Trek fails

1546
01:06:30.599 --> 01:06:34.199
because it's early, when Star Trek fails, it's just not making

1547
01:06:34.199 --> 01:06:35.340
acceptable television.

1548
01:06:35.400 --> 01:06:40.440
Like, I don't think the best episodes of series...

1549
01:06:40.559 --> 01:06:41.039
I don't know.

1550
01:06:41.099 --> 01:06:47.099
Well, though, but a magical brick. terrible.

1551
01:06:47.579 --> 01:06:53.519
I love I love where there's a mask incident on board the Cerritos

1552
01:06:53.519 --> 01:06:54.059
remember?

1553
01:06:57.840 --> 01:07:01.380
And what's what is the character called?

1554
01:07:01.440 --> 01:07:03.900
Like, Carol Freeman's, it's Mookie or something?

1555
01:07:03.960 --> 01:07:05.280
So funny.

1556
01:07:05.340 --> 01:07:07.500
The fact it's just a subline.

1557
01:07:07.559 --> 01:07:08.460
I don't know even.

1558
01:07:08.579 --> 01:07:09.059
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1559
01:07:09.119 --> 01:07:09.900
Just in the beginning.

1560
01:07:09.960 --> 01:07:16.739
But, like, at least it's trying to do something weird and it's do

1561
01:07:16.739 --> 01:07:19.559
like, yes, I think probably that is kind of just...

1562
01:07:19.619 --> 01:07:22.980
This is true, that'd be weird and memorable and all of that.

1563
01:07:23.039 --> 01:07:26.760
Lincoln flying through space, all these rando characters fighting

1564
01:07:26.760 --> 01:07:30.179
on a planet with a big poo monster is trying to be weird.

1565
01:07:30.239 --> 01:07:34.019
It is, but it just ends up just being incredibly boring.

1566
01:07:34.019 --> 01:07:37.679
And I don't think anything quite fails in the same way as Star

1567
01:07:37.679 --> 01:07:38.639
Trek fails.

1568
01:07:38.760 --> 01:07:42.300
And I think because when Star Trek fails, it's not making

1569
01:07:42.300 --> 01:07:43.739
competent television at all.

1570
01:07:43.800 --> 01:07:47.340
Like sometimes Star Trek makes bad television and sometimes it's

1571
01:07:47.340 --> 01:07:48.179
sort of incompetent.

1572
01:07:48.239 --> 01:07:53.579
Very often, the bad Star Trek episodes of like 90s trek are some

1573
01:07:53.579 --> 01:07:55.199
of the most fun to watch, you know?

1574
01:07:55.260 --> 01:07:56.340
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1575
01:07:56.460 --> 01:07:57.360
I'm certain to talk about.

1576
01:07:57.420 --> 01:07:59.519
Sure, sure.

1577
01:07:59.579 --> 01:08:02.519
But I think this is, we've seen this so many times before, I

1578
01:08:02.519 --> 01:08:02.760
think.

1579
01:08:02.820 --> 01:08:06.719
I think I'll end on what I said I was going to start with, which

1580
01:08:06.719 --> 01:08:10.019
is a grand statement about untitled Star Trek project itself.

1581
01:08:10.079 --> 01:08:12.900
Had we rolled.

1582
01:08:12.960 --> 01:08:18.060
The Savage Curtain as our 1st episode of Untitled Star Trek

1583
01:08:18.060 --> 01:08:18.479
Project.

1584
01:08:18.539 --> 01:08:19.560
Oh my god.

1585
01:08:19.560 --> 01:08:21.300
I fear it may have been our last.

1586
01:08:22.560 --> 01:08:25.560
We may have gone life too short.

1587
01:08:25.680 --> 01:08:31.079
Fortunately, we rolled yesterday's Enterprise, and here we are, 100

1588
01:08:31.079 --> 01:08:35.760
and help me out. 85 episodes later.

1589
01:08:35.819 --> 01:08:36.659
You know?

1590
01:08:36.720 --> 01:08:39.600
I think that's about the right point that the savage curtain can

1591
01:08:39.600 --> 01:08:41.640
turn up and we can still continue.

1592
01:08:49.020 --> 01:08:52.739
All right, it's the end of the episode and it's time for us to

1593
01:08:52.739 --> 01:08:54.060
work out where we're going next.

1594
01:08:54.119 --> 01:08:56.880
It's my turn on the randomiser.

1595
01:08:56.939 --> 01:09:00.960
I'm not trusting you with it at all this week, Joe. No, I think

1596
01:09:00.960 --> 01:09:01.739
that's wise.

1597
01:09:01.800 --> 01:09:06.300
Now, ordinarily, I would head straight to Star Trek Enterprise, but

1598
01:09:06.300 --> 01:09:08.460
we desperately need something watchable.

1599
01:09:09.479 --> 01:09:11.159
After that.

1600
01:09:11.220 --> 01:09:13.800
So let's not do that.

1601
01:09:13.859 --> 01:09:21.840
Let's choose from the 3 main 90s Star Trek scene.

1602
01:09:21.899 --> 01:09:23.819
It still could be touch and go.

1603
01:09:23.880 --> 01:09:26.579
Good, yeah, there's a high chance that it'll be something

1604
01:09:26.579 --> 01:09:27.060
terrible.

1605
01:09:27.119 --> 01:09:29.220
But let's see what we can do.

1606
01:09:29.279 --> 01:09:35.100
So, I've got Star Trek, The Next Generation, Star Trek, Voyager.

1607
01:09:35.220 --> 01:09:36.000
Oh, great.

1608
01:09:36.000 --> 01:09:37.619
My favourite period.

1609
01:09:37.680 --> 01:09:38.100
Come on.

1610
01:09:39.479 --> 01:09:41.279
Ooh.

1611
01:09:41.340 --> 01:09:42.659
This is not bad.

1612
01:09:42.720 --> 01:09:47.460
Your random Star Trek Voyager episode is season five, episode

1613
01:09:47.460 --> 01:09:48.359
six.

1614
01:09:48.420 --> 01:09:49.859
Timeless.

1615
01:09:49.979 --> 01:09:57.420
Oh, that's actually a very, very good episode of always.

1616
01:09:57.479 --> 01:09:58.619
Yeah.

1617
01:09:58.680 --> 01:10:03.239
All those things I complained about in the series finale done so

1618
01:10:03.239 --> 01:10:03.840
much better.

1619
01:10:04.079 --> 01:10:08.699
Yeah, the best Harry Kim episode by a country mile.

1620
01:10:08.760 --> 01:10:12.840
And I just remember it being visually spectacular as well in a way

1621
01:10:12.840 --> 01:10:17.340
that, you know, like enterprise is more ambitious than Voyager

1622
01:10:17.340 --> 01:10:21.359
sometimes with its visuals, but I think that, you know, timeless

1623
01:10:21.359 --> 01:10:22.979
is pretty stunningly great.

1624
01:10:23.039 --> 01:10:27.060
Such a savvy move as well, because it ties into the premise of the

1625
01:10:27.060 --> 01:10:29.340
show because they think they're going home because they found all

1626
01:10:29.340 --> 01:10:33.300
of these wormholes and it's Harry that has done all the

1627
01:10:33.300 --> 01:10:34.859
calculations and all the extra work.

1628
01:10:34.859 --> 01:10:38.100
Because he so bad he wants to get home to his mummy.

1629
01:10:38.220 --> 01:10:38.640
Yeah.

1630
01:10:38.699 --> 01:10:44.039
And so he's responsible for the ship going under the ice and

1631
01:10:44.039 --> 01:10:48.359
everyone dying, which makes that older Harry Kim, the best acting

1632
01:10:48.359 --> 01:10:49.020
opportunity.

1633
01:10:49.079 --> 01:10:51.180
I think Garrett Wang ever had.

1634
01:10:51.300 --> 01:10:54.119
Can we can we stop this early?

1635
01:10:54.180 --> 01:10:55.739
in our choosings?

1636
01:10:55.800 --> 01:10:59.460
Well, look, I have to say that I feel like it's been a while since

1637
01:10:59.460 --> 01:11:03.180
I've had control of the randomiser it hasn't really, but I'm

1638
01:11:03.180 --> 01:11:04.380
prepared to stop here.

1639
01:11:04.439 --> 01:11:05.520
Oh my god.

1640
01:11:05.579 --> 01:11:06.119
Okay.

1641
01:11:06.180 --> 01:11:08.220
Let's do it Yeah, I'm prepared to stop here.

1642
01:11:08.279 --> 01:11:13.260
Let's do that I think, um, one, we need a big win for Voyager

1643
01:11:13.260 --> 01:11:16.560
because we've done mostly terrible Voyager episodes lately.

1644
01:11:16.619 --> 01:11:19.800
Series 5 is my favourite season of Voyager.

1645
01:11:19.859 --> 01:11:23.880
I think that's when they're at their height, but this is a proper

1646
01:11:23.880 --> 01:11:25.979
like event episode.

1647
01:11:26.039 --> 01:11:29.640
When you're opening up on that scene in engineering.

1648
01:11:29.699 --> 01:11:30.359
I can still see it.

1649
01:11:30.420 --> 01:11:31.920
It's all in slow motion.

1650
01:11:31.979 --> 01:11:35.640
There's sort of bunting and streaming going down in slow mode.

1651
01:11:35.699 --> 01:11:36.479
Everyone's clapping.

1652
01:11:36.479 --> 01:11:38.100
They're going home because they're going home.

1653
01:11:38.159 --> 01:11:38.819
Yeah.

1654
01:11:38.880 --> 01:11:39.720
It's massive.

1655
01:11:39.840 --> 01:11:42.000
It's directed by Lavar as well.

1656
01:11:42.060 --> 01:11:42.899
Okay, wild.

1657
01:11:42.960 --> 01:11:43.439
Awesome.

1658
01:11:43.500 --> 01:11:44.159
Yeah, okay.

1659
01:11:44.220 --> 01:11:44.819
Oh, yeah.

1660
01:11:44.939 --> 01:11:46.319
Yeah, let's do it for sure.

1661
01:11:55.380 --> 01:11:58.199
You've been listening to entitled Star Trek Project with Joe Ford

1662
01:11:58.199 --> 01:12:02.159
and Nathan Bottomley, where online at untitled Star Trek Project

1663
01:12:01.380 --> 01:12:04.680
com where you can find subscription links and links to our social

1664
01:12:04.680 --> 01:12:05.460
media accounts.

1665
01:12:05.520 --> 01:12:09.180
Our podcast artwork is by Kayla Ciceran, and the theme was

1666
01:12:09.180 --> 01:12:10.920
composed by Cameron Lahn.

1667
01:12:10.979 --> 01:12:15.180
This episode was recorded on the 24th of March 2026 and released

1668
01:12:15.180 --> 01:12:16.739
on the 27th of March.

1669
01:12:16.800 --> 01:12:20.460
We'll see you next time for Star Trek Voyager, Timeless.

1670
01:12:38.520 --> 01:12:39.359
That's a good choice.

1671
01:12:39.479 --> 01:12:41.760
What mind if I got...

1672
01:12:41.819 --> 01:12:45.060
I mean, if I, you know, that doesn't even mean anything, I'm gonna

1673
01:12:45.060 --> 01:12:46.380
see what happens next.

1674
01:12:46.439 --> 01:12:48.779
Dramatis persona.

1675
01:12:51.960 --> 01:12:53.579
That's good.

1676
01:12:53.819 --> 01:12:56.340
That was episode 31.

1677
01:12:56.579 --> 01:12:58.319
We did that so long ago now.

1678
01:12:58.439 --> 01:13:01.380
How does it feel that long ago, does it?

1679
01:13:01.439 --> 01:13:03.000
So episode 31.

1680
01:13:03.300 --> 01:13:07.560
So that is June 2022.

1681
01:13:08.399 --> 01:13:10.380
Nearly 4 years ago.

1682
01:13:10.439 --> 01:13:11.579
22.

1683
01:13:11.819 --> 01:13:12.659
Are you serious?

1684
01:13:12.720 --> 01:13:13.680
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1685
01:13:13.739 --> 01:13:15.239
We talked about that clock.

1686
01:13:15.300 --> 01:13:18.000
I was still a manager then for fuck's sake.

1687
01:13:18.060 --> 01:13:18.960
Oh my goodness.

1688
01:13:20.279 --> 01:13:22.739
I still had hope for the future.

1689
01:13:22.979 --> 01:13:24.420
Stop.

1690
01:13:24.420 --> 01:13:32.279
So we started recording in late 2021 and we had maybe 5 in the can

1691
01:13:32.279 --> 01:13:34.319
by the time we released.

1692
01:13:34.380 --> 01:13:40.199
So we recorded episode one on Tuesday the 21st of September 2021.

1693
01:13:40.500 --> 01:13:45.659
But I don't know when we recorded ourselves rolling yesterday's

1694
01:13:45.659 --> 01:13:48.300
Enterprise because we did that a week earlier.

1695
01:13:50.039 --> 01:13:52.560
Yeah, but our 1st...

1696
01:13:52.560 --> 01:13:55.800
Those, I think that what we just watched, those are the toughest

1697
01:13:55.800 --> 01:13:56.819
ones to talk about.

1698
01:13:56.819 --> 01:14:03.119
Yeah, because there's nothing thematic going on, there's no

1699
01:14:03.119 --> 01:14:05.460
character journeys going on.

1700
01:14:05.520 --> 01:14:07.859
There's no purpose to it.

1701
01:14:07.920 --> 01:14:11.579
It's like, what do you talk about beyond literally what is on the

1702
01:14:11.579 --> 01:14:11.819
screen?

1703
01:14:11.880 --> 01:14:18.720
And like I had to, I had to, um, I had to make up. you know, like

1704
01:14:18.720 --> 01:14:20.279
something for the thing to be about.

1705
01:14:20.340 --> 01:14:22.500
He's what it could have been about, that wasn't.

1706
01:14:22.560 --> 01:14:25.619
So who wants for Adonise, which is just another one where you've

1707
01:14:25.619 --> 01:14:29.699
got a godlike entity kind of torturing them until the episode

1708
01:14:29.760 --> 01:14:30.239
ends.

1709
01:14:30.420 --> 01:14:34.319
Uh, I think it's my Roddenbury.

1710
01:14:34.380 --> 01:14:37.020
So he seems to have one idea.

1711
01:14:37.560 --> 01:14:40.020
No, it's Gene Coon.

1712
01:14:40.079 --> 01:14:41.159
It's Gene Coon.

1713
01:14:41.220 --> 01:14:43.020
Oh, it's got the glowing green hand.

1714
01:14:43.079 --> 01:14:44.220
The great hand.

1715
01:14:44.279 --> 01:14:45.479
Oh...

1716
01:14:45.479 --> 01:14:49.800
I love a...

1717
01:14:49.859 --> 01:14:50.819
Because it's Apollo.

1718
01:14:50.880 --> 01:14:51.840
And he's really tall.

1719
01:14:52.140 --> 01:14:54.720
But yeah, it's super weird.

1720
01:14:54.779 --> 01:14:55.739
It's not very good.

1721
01:14:55.800 --> 01:14:56.939
All right.

1722
01:14:57.000 --> 01:15:00.539
Well, it won't take us back to see season 3 of TOS in a heart

1723
01:15:00.539 --> 01:15:01.319
rate.

1724
01:15:01.319 --> 01:15:01.920
After this.

1725
01:15:01.979 --> 01:15:02.520
Yeah.

1726
01:15:02.520 --> 01:15:04.260
We still got to do that.

1727
01:15:04.319 --> 01:15:06.060
Ghastly one with the children.

1728
01:15:06.119 --> 01:15:07.199
Oh god.

1729
01:15:07.260 --> 01:15:09.119
The children shall lead.

1730
01:15:09.239 --> 01:15:11.159
Oh, is that series three?

1731
01:15:11.220 --> 01:15:12.659
Yeah.

1732
01:15:12.659 --> 01:15:16.979
With that comedy actor in it, who's not what, he's a comedian. not

1733
01:15:16.979 --> 01:15:17.520
an actor.

1734
01:15:17.579 --> 01:15:21.060
And he just sort of comes in going, my children.

1735
01:15:21.119 --> 01:15:22.859
I don't even know.

1736
01:15:22.859 --> 01:15:25.079
Attack everybody on the Enterprise.

1737
01:15:25.140 --> 01:15:26.579
Oh, it's just awful.

1738
01:15:26.699 --> 01:15:28.859
It's he's huge.

1739
01:15:28.920 --> 01:15:32.460
He's a big draw, but he ain't a good actor.

1740
01:15:32.520 --> 01:15:33.960
Well, he certainly ain't in that.