WEBVTT

NOTE
This transcript was created on 2026-05-01 at 20:01:55

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Hey, Joe. Hi.

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So, we're back in the 1960s, and it's an episode of Star Trek, the

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original series from the 3rd season.

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It's season three, episode 20, The Way to Eden.

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What gave away the fact that we were in the 60s watching the way

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Sweden?

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I thought I would mention that that straight up.

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This is one that is very widely disliked.

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I think jammer gives it no stars.

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Everyone kind of really hates it.

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I have to say that I don't think it's the worst episode of series

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3 that we've done.

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It might be the 3rd worst because I do think whom gods destroy and

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Spock's brain are both worse than this.

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But there is something really unpleasant about it, which I will

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get into, I think, as we go along.

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You didn't have fun.

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No, and it was one of the 1st times ever, I considered not rewatch

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because we was going to do this last week, and then I thought, well

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I should rewatch it for this, and I had to actively force myself

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to sit in front of the TV this morning and press play again.

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I think the 2nd time around, I liked it even less because I knew

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what was coming this time, you know?

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So there was no surprises whatsoever.

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It's just even by TOS standards, this is slow.

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Like really slow, devoid of incident for the most part, lots of

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tedious conversations, horrible songs. like we did.

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His way recently, which was packed full of the most gorgeous

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songs.

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I mean, this is the 60s.

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They knew how to sing back then.

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What is happening, Nathan?

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Well, I'm going to talk about the songs and why I don't think

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they're quite as bad as you think they are.

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But they are still quite bad, obviously.

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This is an episode that I feel like we've done already, and one of

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the reasons that I can't hate this is because it has a functional

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plot where things happen, and it's an episode that's about

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something in a way that neither Spock's brain, nor whom Gods

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destroy manage.

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Not about something very nice though, is it?

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It's about anything very pleasant.

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No, no, I think it's quite nasty in all sorts of ways, but it is

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doing something.

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And what I think it's like is an episode of enterprise from series

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3 chosen realm.

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Oh, you're going to have to remind me of what that was.

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So in that, enterprise is taken over by a group of people who

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demand to be taken to a particular planet, which has religious

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significance for them.

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I think it might be the planet they were from or the planet that

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they were promised by the Sphere Builders or something like that.

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We examine their motivations and stuff.

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There's some sort of, you know, there's some conflict among them

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but we examine their motivations and stuff and then we take them

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to the planet and it ends up being a disaster that tells us

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something about their desire to reach the planet in the 1st

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place.

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And it seems to me that the writers of chosen realm could well

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have been literally inspired by this episode because it is so very

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similar.

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But I do seem to recall that we found the antagonist in Chosen

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Realm because of the performance really quite interesting, quite

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engaging.

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And the 1st half of the episode, it was doing that sort of equinox

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thing of these people are pretending for a while to be, you know

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oh, hi.

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Yeah, but it's a bit more blatant.

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I saw a new, very early on what was happening in this episode and

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it takes the Enterprise queue.

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A little while to figure out what's occurring.

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Whereas in Chosen Realm.

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That's only about 10 minutes in when he finally, you know, decides

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to blow up the Enterprise or whatever he does to make his move.

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I do think that was a better episode.

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And certainly in terms of visual interest, it was a better

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episode.

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Oh, yeah, yeah.

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It's a better episode in all sorts of ways.

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But there was something facile.

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I thought about the way that it dealt with their motivation.

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You know, they're just religious maniacs and that's how religious

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maniacs might be expected to behave.

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And coming so soon after 9-11.

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I guess it wasn't the time for Americans to be introspective about

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their position in the world or the history of their interventions

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in the Middle East or whatever.

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But this, as well, I think, presents a caricature of a group of

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people and doesn't properly examine their motivations.

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And in fact, is astoundingly nasty.

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So I think it's a functional bit of drama.

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I think it actually does some things, there's reversals.

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It has those beats that chosen realm has.

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But dismissive of the concerns of young people, and it caricatures

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them.

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And a lot of what we don't like about it is how dopey the young

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people are.

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And that's because this episode goes out of its way to make them

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seem dopey, you know.

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One example I can think of is the slang, you know, the way that

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they talk.

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I think the slang is quite well done, because we understand what

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they mean, and it does sound kind of like the slang that kids used

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in the 60s and early 70s without being that.

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And it reminded me more than anything of, you know, those jokes

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that they would have on the, Brady Bunch about how Mike and Carol

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couldn't understand what the kids were saying these days.

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So it seems to me to be really reactionary and dismissive in a way

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that I think is extremely nasty and unpleasant.

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And that's, I think, at the root of the problem with the episode.

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It's also very boring as well.

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Just very dull.

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There's very little entertainment value here.

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There's a fine line though, isn't it, between being very well done

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sort of slang and utter cringe.

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And I feel as if this... slingshots between the 2 on a regular

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basis.

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Also, what the hell do these writers in the 60s have against the

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hippies?

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There's a Doctor Who story called The Dominators, which does

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exactly the same thing as this.

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It's like the reactionary young people of the time are so stupid

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that they all deserve to be dead, you know, which is the

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conclusion that this, you know, at the end of the story, they're

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so stupid.

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They go down to this planet and start eating poison fruit without

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even thinking about the fact that it might be lethal.

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Yeah.

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So what's everyone got against the hippies?

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And remember what they had to protest about?

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So this is taking place in 1969, you know, Nixon is president, but

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America has been in Vietnam for much longer than that, and

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dropping like 1000000s of tons of explosives on Laos, and, you

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know, like being incredibly dreadful.

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Like the, and the young people who protested with their protest

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songs and their sit ins and all of the things that these kids do

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on board the Enterprise, those kids were right.

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You know, they had Vietnam.

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They had the civil rights movement.

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Those kids were on the right side of history, and so to have an

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episode of Star Trek saying, aren't kids stupid with all their

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protest songs and all of their sit ins, and aren't they arrogant

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and privileged and kind of disgusting?

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Nurse Chappell refers to them as animals at some point.

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Like, it's so brutal, and then it decides to kill them or to kill

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2 of them at the end.

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It's it's shockingly bad.

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They basically go, don't they?

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Oh, well, never mind.

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Let's go. yeah Yeah.

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And, and, and, you know, there's Dr. Severn, who is clearly just

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sort of Timothy Leary, who, you know, is a psychologist at Harvard

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who, who, um, advocates using hallucinogenic drugs, who's

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described by Nixon as the most dangerous man in America.

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And this, there's an, I don't want to go into it in too much

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detail because we've got to talk about it and it is very slow.

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We've got, you know, 50 minutes to feel.

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But, you know, he's just insane and that's the description he's

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just dismissed.

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Doctor Severin is insane.

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And so he's got nothing valid to tell anyone.

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And there's just all of these sort of indications that these kids

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are a threat to galactic peace.

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You know, the fact that we're heading into the neutral zone, kind

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of makes them by association communists.

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You know, we had balance of terror where the Romulans are

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positioned.

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Does the USSR?

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We're heading off to see the Romulans. kind of people, these

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hippies, aren't they?

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It's really bad.

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Like, I think that that's really bad.

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And I think I think otherwise, in a way, it's a functional piece

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of drama in the way that chosen realm is, but there's a real

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incredible kind of depth of nastiness to it, which I think makes

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it sort of unforgivably bad.

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But I also want to give the world sort of slowest hand clap, I

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could possibly give, because, you know, if they want to make these

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kids, you know, hideously unlikeable and pricks, and utterly

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arrogant and loathsome to watch. congratulations because they're

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all just terrible.

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I just hated all of these guest characters this week.

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And so, you know, to say, well, yes, well, they were supposed to

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be annoying.

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Well, thank you very much.

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You've made me hang out with annoying people for 40 minutes.

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That's not an enjoyable television experience, even if you have a

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point to make.

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Well, and but it's a bad point.

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And the episode was so determined to make me hate them that I

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refused to do that.

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And so there were moments where I thought I was determined to find

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them quite sweet and I managed it in places.

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I wish I was you, honestly.

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I mean, they could have eaten those poison apples in the 2nd scene

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and I would have been happy.

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Well, look, you know, you've got Eden behind you there.

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Fabulous mountainous vista.

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Should we head there now?

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I think we should.

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We didn't even get into the religious stuff, did we?

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We'll get there.

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We'll get there All right.

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I'll count us in. 5, 4, 2, one, and we're off.

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Now, this ship, we're watching the new version with the new

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special effects, and so that's not the ship from the original

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story.

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Originally, what they did was they took a Tholian ship, you know

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one of those triangle ones and put a couple of Nasselles on it and

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said, all right, that's the ship that's been stolen.

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So they're just...

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Are they running out of money at this point?

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I think they just could be.

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Just had a few pipe cleaners sort of models we've already got.

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We'll be all right.

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Yeah exactly.

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I mean, to be fair, do you look like that, though, because that

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was a really terrible bit of CGI.

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Yeah, no, it didn't look like that.

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Like I said, it looked like a wedge shaped folian ship.

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I actually quite like it.

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I think it's sort of fairly sympathetic to the design. you know

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aesthetic that they have.

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It looks very 60s and a bit crummy, which I think is actually

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pretty good.

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Oh boy, wait till we get to talking about Chekhov in this episode

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as well.

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I really mischaracterize him in this, don't they?

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Yeah, yeah.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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So, so, I mean, again, this is pretty great, and I don't know if

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this is the 1st time it happens where we see the explosion, but we

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don't know if the people have been beamed off.

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And that's the correct Star Trek order in which to do these.

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The only one be the last time. right.

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A shuttle explodes.

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Then we discover that they've been beamed off successfully.

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It never happens the other way.

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The amount of actors we've seen with a panic look on their face

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you get them?

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Did you get them?

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That's basically all of 90s track, isn't it?

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That's it.

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That's it.

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I mean, even now, can I just very quickly say, because people may

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not have listened to our last episode, but I do have borrowed

248
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hatred for the way to Eden, because back in the day, when I was a

249
00:12:37.440 --> 00:12:42.480
huge TNG fan and lover of Wesley Crusher, you know, age 13, I did

250
00:12:42.480 --> 00:12:47.460
ask for a VHS for Christmas, and I unwrapped it because the

251
00:12:47.460 --> 00:12:49.259
present was clearly a VHS.

252
00:12:49.320 --> 00:12:50.279
It was the right shape.

253
00:12:50.340 --> 00:12:52.799
You give it a little shape, you could hear the plastic rattling

254
00:12:52.799 --> 00:12:53.279
inside.

255
00:12:53.340 --> 00:12:56.940
My god, it must be lonelier among us and justice or something

256
00:12:56.940 --> 00:12:57.899
amazing like that.

257
00:12:57.960 --> 00:13:03.600
And I tore open the paper and fuck me, it was TOS, the way to Eden

258
00:13:03.600 --> 00:13:06.360
and whatever was on that, and I burst into tears.

259
00:13:06.419 --> 00:13:08.820
Well, I did force myself to watch it, right?

260
00:13:08.879 --> 00:13:12.000
And I never, ever watched it again.

261
00:13:12.059 --> 00:13:14.940
I was like, what is this fucking shit?

262
00:13:15.000 --> 00:13:18.120
And so now when the hippies beam in.

263
00:13:18.179 --> 00:13:22.860
I just automatically 13 again going, where's Wesley Crusher?

264
00:13:23.700 --> 00:13:29.820
So immediately, immediately Scotty says, oh, and there are nice

265
00:13:29.820 --> 00:13:30.720
lot too.

266
00:13:30.779 --> 00:13:37.679
And everyone's response to them is so disgracefully over the top.

267
00:13:37.740 --> 00:13:45.299
You know, it's like it's, they're so, um, they're so conservative

268
00:13:45.299 --> 00:13:46.860
and so backward.

269
00:13:46.919 --> 00:13:49.200
It's so awful.

270
00:13:49.320 --> 00:13:52.980
You know, like, like they're out here meeting alien cultures and

271
00:13:52.980 --> 00:13:57.360
stuff and forging relationships with people utterly unlike them.

272
00:13:57.419 --> 00:14:01.139
But, you know, give someone a midrift top and a sort of fancy

273
00:14:01.139 --> 00:14:01.620
fan.

274
00:14:01.679 --> 00:14:05.460
Even the aesthetics, even the, they've given ridiculous clothes.

275
00:14:05.519 --> 00:14:08.039
Someone's got a stupid purple wig on their head.

276
00:14:08.100 --> 00:14:11.279
One of them's got an enormous prosthetic ear for some reason.

277
00:14:11.340 --> 00:14:14.820
Like they all just look stupid.

278
00:14:14.879 --> 00:14:17.279
Yeah, they go really stupid.

279
00:14:17.340 --> 00:14:23.399
Again, though, like Irina doesn't look stupid and there's girl one

280
00:14:23.399 --> 00:14:24.899
and girl two.

281
00:14:26.220 --> 00:14:30.120
Please don't tell me that's a name in the cast list.

282
00:14:30.179 --> 00:14:32.279
Is it really their name?

283
00:14:32.340 --> 00:14:33.539
Girl, what a girl too.

284
00:14:33.600 --> 00:14:34.440
Right.

285
00:14:34.500 --> 00:14:37.080
From heads forth, they can only be referred to as that when

286
00:14:37.080 --> 00:14:38.220
they're on screen, okay?

287
00:14:38.279 --> 00:14:39.600
Is their official names?

288
00:14:39.659 --> 00:14:41.460
It's their official name.

289
00:14:41.519 --> 00:14:43.320
It's it's pretty bad.

290
00:14:43.379 --> 00:14:46.620
And of course, you know, the hippie movement was just as sexist as

291
00:14:46.620 --> 00:14:47.460
everyone else.

292
00:14:47.519 --> 00:14:49.620
So I guess that's sort of fair enough.

293
00:14:49.679 --> 00:14:52.320
Why are they sort of holding their hands in that sort of

294
00:14:52.320 --> 00:14:53.220
triangular fashion?

295
00:14:53.340 --> 00:14:59.340
So that's the one, you know, they and and this is the one thing

296
00:14:59.340 --> 00:14:59.639
right?

297
00:14:59.700 --> 00:15:00.480
This is the one thing.

298
00:15:00.539 --> 00:15:01.379
So they're doing a city.

299
00:15:01.440 --> 00:15:04.500
Look, they're doing a sit in. and this is the poor behaviour.

300
00:15:04.559 --> 00:15:06.299
They're sitting, they're refusing to be moved.

301
00:15:06.299 --> 00:15:08.159
And that's what university students would do.

302
00:15:08.220 --> 00:15:10.019
People would occupy offices.

303
00:15:10.139 --> 00:15:10.919
It was a form of protest.

304
00:15:10.980 --> 00:15:14.039
Are they reject are they rejecting being saved then?

305
00:15:14.100 --> 00:15:15.299
What are they complaining about?

306
00:15:16.139 --> 00:15:19.320
Yeah, yeah, but they're not, I don't know.

307
00:15:19.379 --> 00:15:22.679
I don't know. like they're not going to cooperate.

308
00:15:22.740 --> 00:15:26.340
They've just got to be immediately seem to being rebellious.

309
00:15:26.399 --> 00:15:27.960
Well, they were being chased.

310
00:15:28.019 --> 00:15:29.399
You know, they stole a thing.

311
00:15:29.460 --> 00:15:30.000
They've been caught.

312
00:15:30.059 --> 00:15:32.279
It's like being caught by the cops and so they're not going to

313
00:15:32.279 --> 00:15:32.879
cooperate.

314
00:15:32.940 --> 00:15:34.980
Oh actually, no, you're right.

315
00:15:35.039 --> 00:15:37.139
Irina does look quite sexy, doesn't she?

316
00:15:37.200 --> 00:15:40.080
Yeah, I think that's actually quite a good outfit.

317
00:15:40.139 --> 00:15:42.899
And what's going on with the fellow with the purple eyebrows

318
00:15:42.899 --> 00:15:43.080
though?

319
00:15:43.139 --> 00:15:49.500
So he's a Catullan, and he just looks like a gay Klingon to me.

320
00:15:49.559 --> 00:15:50.279
Do you know what I mean?

321
00:15:50.340 --> 00:15:51.720
Did you notice?

322
00:15:51.779 --> 00:15:55.019
He's sort of got a petticoat on as well under his costume. yeah

323
00:15:55.980 --> 00:15:56.639
conforming.

324
00:15:56.700 --> 00:15:58.919
So again, disgusting for that reason.

325
00:15:58.980 --> 00:16:02.639
And they've got sort of flowery tattoos on their arms as well.

326
00:16:02.700 --> 00:16:05.399
It's very clear what's going on here, isn't it, visually?

327
00:16:05.580 --> 00:16:07.320
Yeah, yeah.

328
00:16:07.379 --> 00:16:11.940
And so and so the hippies are not sort of proper grown-ups and the

329
00:16:11.940 --> 00:16:14.940
grown-ups are doing politics and stuff and they're imperilling

330
00:16:14.940 --> 00:16:18.480
that. and they're threatening the peace between the Romulans and

331
00:16:18.480 --> 00:16:22.019
the Federation as well. that comes later.

332
00:16:22.080 --> 00:16:23.460
Obviously.

333
00:16:23.519 --> 00:16:25.500
Chehov's quite young, isn't he?

334
00:16:25.559 --> 00:16:28.019
He's the youngest guy, certainly of the bridge crew.

335
00:16:28.080 --> 00:16:30.360
So surely this would be much more interesting if he was

336
00:16:30.360 --> 00:16:35.159
sympathetic with the hippies rather than he's the complete reverse

337
00:16:35.159 --> 00:16:36.720
isn't he, actually, which is very strange.

338
00:16:36.779 --> 00:16:41.100
In fact, there's a moment where Sulu is a bit sympathetic to them

339
00:16:41.100 --> 00:16:42.899
which is a thing.

340
00:16:42.960 --> 00:16:48.059
But the one thing, the one redeeming feature this episode has is

341
00:16:48.059 --> 00:16:55.139
Spock, because Spock actually, and Spock is right generally.

342
00:16:55.200 --> 00:16:55.980
Do you know what I mean?

343
00:16:56.039 --> 00:16:58.679
If there's an argument between him and anyone else, Spock is in

344
00:16:58.679 --> 00:17:04.559
the right, generally speaking, and Spock is open-minded and

345
00:17:04.559 --> 00:17:09.480
thoughtful, and he is the one who is sympathetic to them.

346
00:17:09.539 --> 00:17:12.240
And there's a moment which I think is actually really very sweet

347
00:17:12.240 --> 00:17:15.599
at the end where he says, I want you to continue looking for

348
00:17:15.599 --> 00:17:16.200
Eden.

349
00:17:16.259 --> 00:17:17.519
He says it to Irina.

350
00:17:17.579 --> 00:17:20.339
I want you to continue looking for Eden, and I have no doubt that

351
00:17:20.339 --> 00:17:22.859
you will be able to make your own if you can't find it.

352
00:17:22.920 --> 00:17:25.559
And I thought that was really properly positive in an episode

353
00:17:25.559 --> 00:17:27.299
that's generally nasty to these people.

354
00:17:27.359 --> 00:17:30.779
It should have said some, take this tricorder and just scan the

355
00:17:30.779 --> 00:17:31.380
fruit, though.

356
00:17:31.440 --> 00:17:33.299
All right, when you get there.

357
00:17:33.359 --> 00:17:34.920
I like that.

358
00:17:34.980 --> 00:17:36.960
And there was a bit later on when they're singing one of their

359
00:17:36.960 --> 00:17:41.640
interminable songs where Spot grabs his Vulcan instrument, you

360
00:17:41.640 --> 00:17:43.920
know, and sort of goes in there and joins them.

361
00:17:43.980 --> 00:17:46.859
I think he's thinking, look, I can only make this better.

362
00:17:46.920 --> 00:17:48.779
I can't make it worse, you know?

363
00:17:48.839 --> 00:17:50.519
But yeah, you're right.

364
00:17:50.579 --> 00:17:53.460
He is very welcoming and he's trying to understand them.

365
00:17:53.519 --> 00:17:56.940
Yeah, because he's an outsider as well and he even makes that

366
00:17:56.940 --> 00:17:57.900
point, doesn't he?

367
00:17:57.960 --> 00:18:01.740
He says something later about how these people regard themselves

368
00:18:01.740 --> 00:18:06.900
as sort of aliens, you know, that they don't belong somewhere and

369
00:18:06.900 --> 00:18:08.819
he feels the same thing.

370
00:18:08.880 --> 00:18:11.579
And I think that that's the one redeeming feature.

371
00:18:11.640 --> 00:18:14.700
I think, you know, the episode lands on the fact that these people

372
00:18:14.700 --> 00:18:20.220
will murder you if they get the chance and they're terrible people

373
00:18:20.220 --> 00:18:25.799
but Spock's sympathy for them does weigh in on the other column, I

374
00:18:25.799 --> 00:18:26.039
think.

375
00:18:26.099 --> 00:18:29.819
Do you know, I've been wanting to say this to you for a long time

376
00:18:29.819 --> 00:18:30.059
Nathan.

377
00:18:30.119 --> 00:18:33.180
And now, given we're in this episode with this slang, I finally

378
00:18:33.180 --> 00:18:34.380
have the opportunity to do it.

379
00:18:34.440 --> 00:18:37.799
Oh, no, you are stiff.

380
00:18:40.859 --> 00:18:41.880
I thought it was very now.

381
00:18:42.180 --> 00:18:46.680
Oh, you're very now. especially when you're stiff.

382
00:18:46.799 --> 00:18:47.400
Hang on.

383
00:18:47.460 --> 00:18:48.180
Move us on.

384
00:18:49.980 --> 00:18:52.859
All that dialogue's dreadful.

385
00:18:52.980 --> 00:18:53.400
Sorry.

386
00:18:53.759 --> 00:18:56.819
I actually think I actually think it's good.

387
00:18:57.599 --> 00:19:00.059
Because in the way that in what they're trying to do.

388
00:19:00.119 --> 00:19:00.599
Yes.

389
00:19:00.660 --> 00:19:01.680
I get it.

390
00:19:01.740 --> 00:19:03.599
And they're trying to give them an identity with language.

391
00:19:03.660 --> 00:19:04.619
I absolutely get it.

392
00:19:04.680 --> 00:19:06.420
But it's just so embarrassing.

393
00:19:06.480 --> 00:19:09.119
But that's the, but that is kind of the point.

394
00:19:09.240 --> 00:19:11.700
Like, that's the episode succeeding on its own terms.

395
00:19:11.759 --> 00:19:16.740
It wants the children to look to be, you know, children talk

396
00:19:16.740 --> 00:19:17.339
weird.

397
00:19:17.460 --> 00:19:20.039
And remember these are university students.

398
00:19:20.099 --> 00:19:20.880
Do you know what I mean?

399
00:19:20.940 --> 00:19:22.799
These are smart people who all have degrees.

400
00:19:22.859 --> 00:19:24.779
Arena was at Starfleet Academy.

401
00:19:25.619 --> 00:19:29.940
The term dropped out, Chekhov just described Arena as having

402
00:19:29.940 --> 00:19:32.400
dropped out of Starfleet Academy.

403
00:19:32.460 --> 00:19:37.079
Like that's a very loaded term, you know, um, So, you know, these

404
00:19:37.079 --> 00:19:42.420
are sort of middle class kids from university and stuff.

405
00:19:42.779 --> 00:19:43.920
I dont know where I was going with that.

406
00:19:43.980 --> 00:19:46.799
I don't think Kerk makes sense in this episode either.

407
00:19:46.859 --> 00:19:50.339
Because even though he has absolutely been, you know, revealed

408
00:19:50.339 --> 00:19:53.339
over 3 seasons to be a Starfleet man through and through.

409
00:19:53.400 --> 00:19:55.259
He's sort of relaxed.

410
00:19:55.319 --> 00:19:56.519
He's quite a loose bloke.

411
00:19:56.579 --> 00:19:59.700
And we've said it many times in episodes like, yeah, do you know

412
00:19:59.700 --> 00:19:59.940
what?

413
00:20:00.000 --> 00:20:01.680
He gets on board with people that come on.

414
00:20:01.799 --> 00:20:04.680
So the fact that he is so baffled by them in this.

415
00:20:04.980 --> 00:20:08.099
I was like, have they just forgotten how to ride these

416
00:20:08.099 --> 00:20:08.579
characters?

417
00:20:08.640 --> 00:20:13.740
They come across as really nasty because they're being put in the

418
00:20:13.740 --> 00:20:18.839
position of of hating the young people of the 1960s, you know, and

419
00:20:18.839 --> 00:20:20.400
so they just seem stupid.

420
00:20:20.460 --> 00:20:24.660
There's one moment where I think Kirk is slightly redeemed where

421
00:20:24.660 --> 00:20:29.640
he says to Scotty, I don't know when I was a kid, when I was their

422
00:20:29.640 --> 00:20:32.700
age, I got in a fair amount of trouble, didn't you?

423
00:20:32.759 --> 00:20:37.140
And so there is a moment where he has some sympathy for them as

424
00:20:37.140 --> 00:20:41.160
kids, which I thought was pretty good, but this stuff where we're

425
00:20:41.160 --> 00:20:42.539
sort of disgusted by them.

426
00:20:44.400 --> 00:20:46.079
No, go on.

427
00:20:46.140 --> 00:20:47.819
Well, I think I put my finger on it then.

428
00:20:47.880 --> 00:20:50.819
I think my issue with this character, I don't like anyone in this

429
00:20:50.819 --> 00:20:51.299
episode.

430
00:20:51.359 --> 00:20:54.779
They're all stuck up and horrible to their guests and the others

431
00:20:54.779 --> 00:20:56.880
are irritatingly reactionary.

432
00:20:56.940 --> 00:20:58.859
So I'm just not enjoying being around anyone.

433
00:20:58.920 --> 00:21:00.839
No, no, no, that's right.

434
00:21:00.900 --> 00:21:02.940
No, you are, yeah, you're right.

435
00:21:03.000 --> 00:21:05.700
Like, it is succeeding on its own terms, but that doesn't stop it

436
00:21:05.700 --> 00:21:07.319
being an annoying bit of telly.

437
00:21:07.380 --> 00:21:08.700
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

438
00:21:08.759 --> 00:21:11.099
I have to say that I watched it 3 times.

439
00:21:11.160 --> 00:21:12.839
By the 3rd time.

440
00:21:12.900 --> 00:21:17.460
I think I was probably a bit taken in by it because we have had

441
00:21:17.460 --> 00:21:20.940
Star Trek episodes, original series episodes where like nothing

442
00:21:20.940 --> 00:21:21.420
happens.

443
00:21:21.480 --> 00:21:25.200
And all I could think of was how superior this was to whom gods

444
00:21:25.200 --> 00:21:27.420
destroy, which is not a huge achievement.

445
00:21:27.480 --> 00:21:33.240
Um, but, and it's kind of less stupid than...

446
00:21:33.299 --> 00:21:35.819
If the couple on the hippies were put on rocks and forced to

447
00:21:35.819 --> 00:21:37.740
explode, it might have helped.

448
00:21:37.859 --> 00:21:38.579
Yeah, yeah.

449
00:21:38.640 --> 00:21:42.480
No, I mean, there is a lot of sort of claptrap in Star Trek. and

450
00:21:42.480 --> 00:21:45.480
sometimes Star Trek, you know, sometimes original Star Trek is

451
00:21:45.480 --> 00:21:46.019
brilliant.

452
00:21:46.079 --> 00:21:49.380
Sometimes it just fails even to be sort of a competent TV.

453
00:21:49.440 --> 00:21:51.839
I don't think this fails to be competent TV.

454
00:21:51.900 --> 00:21:56.460
I think it is slow, but I don't dislike the music.

455
00:21:56.519 --> 00:21:59.400
Some of the music numbers I'm actually happy, maps not this one.

456
00:21:59.460 --> 00:22:05.339
Um, but, um, uh, you know, things happen in it.

457
00:22:05.400 --> 00:22:08.519
I think it's it's being a Star Trek episode in a sort of

458
00:22:08.519 --> 00:22:09.720
successful way, I think.

459
00:22:09.779 --> 00:22:13.259
I just, I can't remember any of the songs of this.

460
00:22:13.319 --> 00:22:15.779
I don't want to remember any of the songs on this because whilst I

461
00:22:15.779 --> 00:22:20.099
were like playing out, I wasn't having a good time, you know, I

462
00:22:20.099 --> 00:22:23.339
kept looking at this fella, Adam, and I was going, I recognise you

463
00:22:23.339 --> 00:22:24.059
from somewhere.

464
00:22:24.119 --> 00:22:25.500
Where have I seen you before?

465
00:22:25.500 --> 00:22:30.480
and bugger me if he isn't the cigar chomping general from little

466
00:22:30.480 --> 00:22:31.200
green men.

467
00:22:31.259 --> 00:22:32.759
A completely different performers.

468
00:22:32.819 --> 00:22:36.480
And interestingly, there's a great quote on memory alpha where

469
00:22:36.480 --> 00:22:38.279
apparently for the 30th anniversary.

470
00:22:38.339 --> 00:22:41.039
They were determined to get that actor back because he was in the

471
00:22:41.039 --> 00:22:41.819
way to Eden.

472
00:22:41.880 --> 00:22:44.099
It's like, I have one more remember him.

473
00:22:44.160 --> 00:22:45.539
I mean, you're not going to forget him.

474
00:22:45.599 --> 00:22:46.440
Oh, you look him.

475
00:22:46.500 --> 00:22:51.119
And he said, I'll do it, but please put me in less ridiculous

476
00:22:51.119 --> 00:22:51.900
clothes this time.

477
00:22:53.160 --> 00:22:58.680
There is something where he, he sort of, they comment on the fact

478
00:22:58.680 --> 00:23:01.019
that Chekhov is wearing a lot of clothes.

479
00:23:01.380 --> 00:23:04.859
I actually, I actually quite like...

480
00:23:04.859 --> 00:23:08.579
Lucky, sexy sort of thigh height boots as well he's got on.

481
00:23:11.279 --> 00:23:14.700
I mean, I don't mind seeing a flash of chess. quite nice.

482
00:23:14.759 --> 00:23:16.500
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

483
00:23:16.559 --> 00:23:20.099
I mean, I think there's something kind of sweet about Adam.

484
00:23:20.160 --> 00:23:21.960
He looks too old.

485
00:23:22.019 --> 00:23:25.140
Like if he'd been a little bit more, you know, kind of

486
00:23:25.140 --> 00:23:25.980
convincingly young.

487
00:23:26.039 --> 00:23:27.839
I don't know how old the actor is at this point.

488
00:23:27.900 --> 00:23:29.640
No, struggle.

489
00:23:29.700 --> 00:23:31.980
She just walks in and soighed straight away.

490
00:23:32.039 --> 00:23:36.480
Well, she actually says, I thought the animals were all meant to

491
00:23:36.480 --> 00:23:38.339
be in cages, which one.

492
00:23:38.460 --> 00:23:41.220
No, animals are not meant to be in cages.

493
00:23:41.279 --> 00:23:42.299
Why are you saying that?

494
00:23:42.359 --> 00:23:44.759
Like, 16, remember, to say?

495
00:23:44.819 --> 00:23:46.140
The less progressive times.

496
00:23:46.200 --> 00:23:50.099
Yeah, and and why are these people animals?

497
00:23:50.160 --> 00:23:52.500
Why are you referring to people like that?

498
00:23:52.559 --> 00:23:54.059
Because they're not conforming.

499
00:23:54.119 --> 00:23:54.779
That's why.

500
00:23:54.839 --> 00:23:56.220
Yeah, that's right.

501
00:23:56.279 --> 00:23:57.420
Yeah.

502
00:23:57.480 --> 00:24:00.180
I reckon the new Nurse Chappel would never say that.

503
00:24:00.240 --> 00:24:01.380
They shouldn't be.

504
00:24:01.740 --> 00:24:03.240
They shouldn't be happy and sing songs.

505
00:24:03.299 --> 00:24:05.640
They should be miserable as the rest of the enterprise crew.

506
00:24:05.700 --> 00:24:07.619
Yeah, but that's the other thing.

507
00:24:07.680 --> 00:24:08.400
Do you know what I mean?

508
00:24:08.460 --> 00:24:11.220
Like, in a way, so this, how could you do this?

509
00:24:12.059 --> 00:24:13.799
She hasn't had a tattoo.

510
00:24:13.859 --> 00:24:16.259
She doesn't have any facial piercings.

511
00:24:16.319 --> 00:24:20.640
She's got a lovely 60s hairstyle and her midriff is showing.

512
00:24:20.700 --> 00:24:23.099
Like, what is going on?

513
00:24:23.160 --> 00:24:24.480
Why is he reacting like that?

514
00:24:24.599 --> 00:24:24.900
This?

515
00:24:24.960 --> 00:24:26.039
He just seems like a prick.

516
00:24:26.099 --> 00:24:29.339
Oh, she's doing is sitting on the floor and singing dreadful

517
00:24:29.339 --> 00:24:29.640
songs.

518
00:24:29.700 --> 00:24:31.680
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

519
00:24:31.740 --> 00:24:35.039
Like, I just, like, I just think that's awful.

520
00:24:35.099 --> 00:24:36.539
Everyone reacts so badly.

521
00:24:36.599 --> 00:24:39.960
And in fact, the last scene between these two, I think, is

522
00:24:39.960 --> 00:24:44.220
wonderful and she's quite charming in that final scene where they

523
00:24:44.220 --> 00:24:46.140
say goodbye to one another.

524
00:24:46.200 --> 00:24:47.940
She's hampered by the accent.

525
00:24:48.000 --> 00:24:50.579
And then, of course, there's that terrible scene later on where

526
00:24:50.579 --> 00:24:54.240
she's clearly just kind of getting information out of him and he

527
00:24:54.240 --> 00:24:56.339
doesn't realise it because he's stupid this week.

528
00:24:56.400 --> 00:24:57.660
Look at this.

529
00:24:57.720 --> 00:25:00.359
This fucking tall guy comes in and just looks at her.

530
00:25:00.420 --> 00:25:01.500
Like, it's like, what?

531
00:25:01.559 --> 00:25:03.839
Well, she has got her midriff showing.

532
00:25:03.839 --> 00:25:04.680
Come on, now.

533
00:25:04.740 --> 00:25:08.700
We know how loose they are, sexually speaking, on the enterprise.

534
00:25:08.759 --> 00:25:10.920
She's hampered by her dialogue as well, though.

535
00:25:10.980 --> 00:25:13.619
She just said, we should meet together again.

536
00:25:13.680 --> 00:25:14.220
Enjoy.

537
00:25:14.339 --> 00:25:16.440
Like, please, who talks like that?

538
00:25:16.500 --> 00:25:21.059
Well, hippies, she just looked, she looked off camera in a dreamy

539
00:25:21.059 --> 00:25:24.539
way and she goes, I remember the times we had together.

540
00:25:24.599 --> 00:25:25.079
Oh, please.

541
00:25:25.140 --> 00:25:26.579
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

542
00:25:26.640 --> 00:25:26.940
Yeah.

543
00:25:27.000 --> 00:25:27.599
Yeah.

544
00:25:27.660 --> 00:25:30.839
In fact, there's one thing which I think is actually kind of

545
00:25:30.839 --> 00:25:31.380
sweet.

546
00:25:31.440 --> 00:25:32.519
Here.

547
00:25:32.579 --> 00:25:34.440
Like, I dislike the Chekhov thing.

548
00:25:34.500 --> 00:25:40.079
But I get the idea that he, and it's not very well drawn. you know

549
00:25:40.079 --> 00:25:40.440
what I mean?

550
00:25:40.500 --> 00:25:44.700
But this stuff where he says you don't love the way that I do.

551
00:25:44.759 --> 00:25:46.980
I really felt something and you didn't.

552
00:25:47.039 --> 00:25:49.799
You are always somewhere else in our relationship.

553
00:25:49.859 --> 00:25:50.940
And I like that stuff.

554
00:25:51.000 --> 00:25:52.440
He's a little bit hurt, you know.

555
00:25:52.500 --> 00:25:55.259
I think that's kind of sweet and that's young people.

556
00:25:55.319 --> 00:25:58.319
They're weird and annoying, you know, like in a kind of cute way.

557
00:25:58.380 --> 00:26:00.839
Why did you leave me, arena?

558
00:26:00.900 --> 00:26:02.940
Because you disapproved of me, all right?

559
00:26:03.000 --> 00:26:04.440
I'm not sticking around.

560
00:26:04.500 --> 00:26:06.960
But I think that's lovely.

561
00:26:07.019 --> 00:26:08.579
Like, I think there's something about that.

562
00:26:08.640 --> 00:26:11.400
You know, like you disapproved of me.

563
00:26:11.400 --> 00:26:14.039
And she's right about all of these things.

564
00:26:14.099 --> 00:26:18.720
If this is how Chekhov is, and it isn't how it is.

565
00:26:18.779 --> 00:26:19.980
This is completely wrong.

566
00:26:20.099 --> 00:26:23.819
Chekhov was brought into be that sort of little rebel on the

567
00:26:23.819 --> 00:26:26.819
enterprise, you know, and say the awkward things and get them into

568
00:26:26.819 --> 00:26:29.279
bar fights into trouble and triples and all of that stuff.

569
00:26:29.700 --> 00:26:31.500
It's so weird.

570
00:26:31.559 --> 00:26:33.359
It's so weird seeing him.

571
00:26:33.420 --> 00:26:34.500
This stuck up.

572
00:26:34.559 --> 00:26:37.559
Although if you squint, you know, you could see Paul McCartney in

573
00:26:37.559 --> 00:26:38.339
Star Trek for a second.

574
00:26:38.460 --> 00:26:40.259
Yeah, that, yeah.

575
00:26:40.319 --> 00:26:42.059
He's wearing a lot of eyeliner as well.

576
00:26:42.119 --> 00:26:45.240
So I don't know why. fracas occur in here.

577
00:26:45.299 --> 00:26:49.559
Yeah, an end of, we're just leading into the commercial break with

578
00:26:49.559 --> 00:26:50.759
this fracas here.

579
00:26:52.319 --> 00:26:55.440
No, there's chapels there pushing them back.

580
00:26:55.500 --> 00:26:57.359
Get the animals in a cage quick.

581
00:26:59.460 --> 00:27:01.440
What is that ear?

582
00:27:01.500 --> 00:27:03.000
Will you please tell me what that is?

583
00:27:03.119 --> 00:27:04.380
I'm also kept in cages.

584
00:27:04.440 --> 00:27:06.000
Why are you saying that, Christine?

585
00:27:06.059 --> 00:27:07.140
For fuck's sake.

586
00:27:08.099 --> 00:27:13.140
So, again, so this is kind of interesting and it leads to an

587
00:27:13.140 --> 00:27:16.559
interesting thing, which is something that, you know, because it's

588
00:27:16.559 --> 00:27:17.339
still early days.

589
00:27:17.400 --> 00:27:20.880
I know it's near the end of the run of the original series, but

590
00:27:20.880 --> 00:27:23.700
it's early days for Star Trek as a whole.

591
00:27:23.759 --> 00:27:28.319
And the idea that there's something toxic about the environment

592
00:27:28.319 --> 00:27:32.279
that they've created for themselves and that there are people who

593
00:27:32.279 --> 00:27:35.640
rebel against it because they can't live in this sort of managed

594
00:27:35.640 --> 00:27:36.539
environment.

595
00:27:36.599 --> 00:27:41.220
And here you have McCoy saying that, and you also have Spock

596
00:27:41.220 --> 00:27:41.940
saying it.

597
00:27:42.000 --> 00:27:46.019
You know, Spock says that we've created this entire artificial

598
00:27:46.019 --> 00:27:47.099
world for ourselves.

599
00:27:47.160 --> 00:27:50.519
Atmosphere is controlled, all of that sort of stuff.

600
00:27:50.579 --> 00:27:51.420
We get that from Spock.

601
00:27:51.480 --> 00:27:54.900
Here we get it from McCoy, where where he says that this guy has

602
00:27:54.900 --> 00:28:01.259
been infected by a pathogen as a result of the artificial

603
00:28:01.259 --> 00:28:02.940
situation that he lives in.

604
00:28:03.000 --> 00:28:07.799
You know, like that's kind of weird and interesting, but the

605
00:28:07.799 --> 00:28:09.720
episode doesn't go anywhere with it.

606
00:28:09.779 --> 00:28:12.480
You know, they're not justified.

607
00:28:12.599 --> 00:28:16.619
You know, we never sort of say, well, actually, it's fair enough.

608
00:28:16.680 --> 00:28:21.359
You know, maybe if this is the case, maybe they have a point, you

609
00:28:21.359 --> 00:28:22.740
know, but no one ever says that.

610
00:28:22.799 --> 00:28:27.180
So not only are they reactionary and irritating, they're also

611
00:28:27.180 --> 00:28:28.859
diseased as well.

612
00:28:28.920 --> 00:28:30.960
Well, yeah, there's that too.

613
00:28:31.019 --> 00:28:32.279
And that's the other thing too.

614
00:28:32.339 --> 00:28:33.839
And particularly him.

615
00:28:33.900 --> 00:28:36.660
And that's, that's...

616
00:28:36.660 --> 00:28:37.500
Free love.

617
00:28:37.559 --> 00:28:40.380
Yeah, he's not a child.

618
00:28:40.440 --> 00:28:41.039
Do you know what I mean?

619
00:28:41.099 --> 00:28:42.240
Severin isn't a kid.

620
00:28:42.299 --> 00:28:48.299
He's a, he's a, you know, an academic, he's an expert in acoustics

621
00:28:48.299 --> 00:28:51.000
which I just think is hilarious because he's got those massive

622
00:28:51.000 --> 00:28:51.539
ears.

623
00:28:51.539 --> 00:28:55.259
It's a little bit later on where Spock is affected by the sound.

624
00:28:55.380 --> 00:28:56.880
Oh, he's got the ear.

625
00:28:57.900 --> 00:29:03.420
But later on, Spock reacts more badly to the ultrasonics or the

626
00:29:03.420 --> 00:29:08.099
infrasonics or whatever it is that causes them pain because he has

627
00:29:08.099 --> 00:29:09.000
big ears as well.

628
00:29:09.059 --> 00:29:10.619
So he must be...

629
00:29:10.680 --> 00:29:11.579
These the bit you were talking about.

630
00:29:11.640 --> 00:29:13.200
This must have entirely slipped me by.

631
00:29:13.259 --> 00:29:16.680
She goes, come on. you know you've won it. and he goes, oh, it is

632
00:29:16.680 --> 00:29:17.039
tempting.

633
00:29:17.099 --> 00:29:22.079
And then Carlo steps in and goes, no, you'd be a good Starfleet

634
00:29:22.079 --> 00:29:22.500
officer.

635
00:29:22.500 --> 00:29:23.400
Apologise or something.

636
00:29:23.460 --> 00:29:25.799
Yeah, he sort of stiffens up, doesn't he?

637
00:29:25.859 --> 00:29:27.180
Get that bug up your butt.

638
00:29:27.240 --> 00:29:28.680
Yeah, yeah.

639
00:29:28.740 --> 00:29:30.000
So that was gold too.

640
00:29:30.359 --> 00:29:32.819
God, these fucking kids sitting around the place.

641
00:29:32.880 --> 00:29:34.559
Oh, here comes another song.

642
00:29:34.619 --> 00:29:35.400
Marvellous.

643
00:29:35.519 --> 00:29:38.880
Yeah, but again, it's a protest song, isn't it?

644
00:29:38.940 --> 00:29:40.200
Like, it's a protest song.

645
00:29:40.259 --> 00:29:42.059
It goes for like 3 lines.

646
00:29:42.119 --> 00:29:46.200
It goes to the 3 lines. his hand gone or wag his tail.

647
00:29:46.259 --> 00:29:47.279
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

648
00:29:47.339 --> 00:29:50.279
Like, it's a proper protest song. works really well.

649
00:29:50.339 --> 00:29:52.140
It ain't a good reasonable.

650
00:29:52.200 --> 00:29:54.660
No, but it's 3 lines long.

651
00:29:54.720 --> 00:29:57.720
And we're presuming that he's just extemporising it.

652
00:29:57.779 --> 00:30:00.539
If only they were all free lines long, though, you know?

653
00:30:01.380 --> 00:30:05.460
I think I could improvise a song about you right now that we've

654
00:30:05.460 --> 00:30:06.240
better than any of these.

655
00:30:06.539 --> 00:30:16.500
So here there, um, Scotty says that they're trying to incite his

656
00:30:16.500 --> 00:30:20.400
team, his crew to disaffect.

657
00:30:20.460 --> 00:30:23.759
And Spock tells Severin that incitement to disaffection is

658
00:30:23.759 --> 00:30:24.240
criminal.

659
00:30:24.299 --> 00:30:26.519
And I'm kind of going, like, what the hell is happening here?

660
00:30:26.579 --> 00:30:28.619
We have court crime now in the Federation.

661
00:30:28.680 --> 00:30:30.660
Did you see the captain's log day, you know?

662
00:30:30.720 --> 00:30:33.180
The arrogance of Dr. Severance.

663
00:30:33.240 --> 00:30:36.000
It's creating an insufferable situation.

664
00:30:36.059 --> 00:30:37.319
Bless you.

665
00:30:37.380 --> 00:30:38.039
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

666
00:30:38.099 --> 00:30:40.440
Oh, poor Captain Kirk, you know, what a day.

667
00:30:40.680 --> 00:30:43.559
They're sitting around on the floor and everything.

668
00:30:43.619 --> 00:30:48.299
And I may have to break Starfleet's rules and mistreat them is

669
00:30:48.299 --> 00:30:50.279
what he's saying in that captain's log.

670
00:30:50.339 --> 00:30:51.000
It's really bad.

671
00:30:51.180 --> 00:30:53.460
No way, is he going to mistreat them?

672
00:30:53.519 --> 00:30:56.160
Well, he says I'm not going to treat them with a sort of tolerance

673
00:30:56.160 --> 00:30:58.500
that I'm required to treat them with.

674
00:30:58.619 --> 00:31:00.359
You know, it's just like, why is he saying that?

675
00:31:00.420 --> 00:31:03.539
They're kids with, you know, playing annoying music and sitting

676
00:31:03.539 --> 00:31:05.700
around and calling him her, but like just man up.

677
00:31:05.759 --> 00:31:09.059
The rise of this episode is happening. really hates the hippies

678
00:31:09.059 --> 00:31:09.539
doesn't he?

679
00:31:09.599 --> 00:31:11.279
Yeah, it hates the kids.

680
00:31:11.339 --> 00:31:12.779
That's what it hates.

681
00:31:12.900 --> 00:31:15.900
Well, it was originally a DC Fontana script, this.

682
00:31:15.960 --> 00:31:18.359
She was going to take it on and it was called Jo Ad.

683
00:31:18.420 --> 00:31:21.779
It was about something completely different about Dr. McCoy and

684
00:31:21.779 --> 00:31:25.680
one of his ex-loves, you know, one of his many... his daughter.

685
00:31:26.099 --> 00:31:26.759
Oh, yeah, yeah.

686
00:31:26.759 --> 00:31:29.099
And in the end, it was so rewritten.

687
00:31:29.160 --> 00:31:33.539
She said, take my name off this and I'm...

688
00:31:33.599 --> 00:31:34.259
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

689
00:31:34.319 --> 00:31:36.299
Well, I don't think there's much of her left in this.

690
00:31:36.359 --> 00:31:37.319
No.

691
00:31:37.380 --> 00:31:40.920
But, you know, it's possible the reason it functions is because

692
00:31:40.920 --> 00:31:43.380
she had some, so I don't know.

693
00:31:43.440 --> 00:31:44.880
Who knows how much is left?

694
00:31:45.480 --> 00:31:48.119
I will say this man, Dr. Sefford.

695
00:31:48.180 --> 00:31:49.500
He is given a bit of welly, you know?

696
00:31:50.339 --> 00:31:50.940
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

697
00:31:51.000 --> 00:31:55.140
I think it's a reasonable performance and like he's not a hippie

698
00:31:55.140 --> 00:31:56.579
you know, like he...

699
00:31:57.539 --> 00:32:01.500
And this thing that he says is what Spock was saying earlier.

700
00:32:01.559 --> 00:32:05.099
You know, the stuff you live in the stuff you breathe, all of this

701
00:32:05.099 --> 00:32:05.640
sort of stuff.

702
00:32:05.700 --> 00:32:06.779
This is poison to me.

703
00:32:06.839 --> 00:32:07.980
It's infected me.

704
00:32:08.039 --> 00:32:08.940
He's right.

705
00:32:09.059 --> 00:32:11.460
Like he's making a sound point.

706
00:32:11.519 --> 00:32:15.839
And all of the things that he's saying are reasonable, and then

707
00:32:15.839 --> 00:32:18.539
Spot goes straight back to the bridge and says he's insane.

708
00:32:19.500 --> 00:32:23.460
So even Spock, even Spock is guilty.

709
00:32:23.519 --> 00:32:28.140
No, because he looks up his records and apparently he's insane.

710
00:32:28.140 --> 00:32:32.279
And remember whom God's destroyed didn't have any real sense of

711
00:32:32.279 --> 00:32:33.900
what mental illness was.

712
00:32:33.960 --> 00:32:39.119
It was just mad, mad, mad, and so he's not insane in any

713
00:32:39.119 --> 00:32:39.839
particular way.

714
00:32:39.900 --> 00:32:40.859
There's no word for it.

715
00:32:40.920 --> 00:32:41.579
He's insane.

716
00:32:41.640 --> 00:32:44.460
And so he's going to lead them to do the wrong thing.

717
00:32:44.579 --> 00:32:48.240
So the political point that he seems to be making now, which is a

718
00:32:48.240 --> 00:32:52.980
reasonable position to take, even though, you know, like Spock is

719
00:32:52.980 --> 00:32:54.720
making some inroads here.

720
00:32:54.779 --> 00:32:58.259
You know, and Spock is saying sensible things, but this is a

721
00:32:58.259 --> 00:33:02.759
proper conversation about 2 different viewpoints, but no, he's mad

722
00:33:02.759 --> 00:33:05.339
and therefore, he's a bad guy.

723
00:33:05.400 --> 00:33:08.339
Well, trouble is at the end, he kind of proves that, doesn't he?

724
00:33:08.460 --> 00:33:11.640
When he just runs out the shuttle, realises that the fruit's

725
00:33:11.640 --> 00:33:14.339
killing people and goes right, well, I'm going to sacrifice myself

726
00:33:14.339 --> 00:33:15.779
because here I am on Eden.

727
00:33:15.839 --> 00:33:17.759
No, it doesn't even seem to be that.

728
00:33:17.819 --> 00:33:20.339
He just seems to be acting that way because they need him dead at

729
00:33:20.339 --> 00:33:21.480
the end of the episode, I think.

730
00:33:21.839 --> 00:33:25.500
Yeah, do you know, it is hard to take him seriously, though, with

731
00:33:25.500 --> 00:33:26.400
that grotesque ear.

732
00:33:26.460 --> 00:33:28.380
I'm sorry. is so bad.

733
00:33:28.440 --> 00:33:31.200
Is he supposed to be biology?

734
00:33:31.200 --> 00:33:34.380
Or is that like an artificial where he's put on?

735
00:33:34.380 --> 00:33:35.819
Yeah, he's put latex on.

736
00:33:35.880 --> 00:33:39.059
That's what he's, yeah, his culture.

737
00:33:39.119 --> 00:33:40.559
They wear big latex ears.

738
00:33:40.619 --> 00:33:42.240
They like the Ferengi.

739
00:33:42.299 --> 00:33:45.059
Doctor Severin is insane.

740
00:33:45.119 --> 00:33:46.259
Yeah.

741
00:33:46.259 --> 00:33:48.299
Yeah, Dr. Seven's insane.

742
00:33:48.359 --> 00:33:49.980
It's just like, where did that fucking come from?

743
00:33:50.039 --> 00:33:52.079
Like, why have we got that twist now?

744
00:33:52.140 --> 00:33:55.259
And he goes, I'll have bones check him out.

745
00:33:55.319 --> 00:33:56.160
What, for insanity?

746
00:33:58.380 --> 00:34:03.000
He'll be lying on his back pushing, pushing those boxes from his

747
00:34:03.000 --> 00:34:03.240
legs.

748
00:34:03.240 --> 00:34:06.119
Only an insane man would do it that way.

749
00:34:06.180 --> 00:34:08.820
Actually, that looks quite relaxing, you know, when they get

750
00:34:08.820 --> 00:34:09.599
people to do that.

751
00:34:09.659 --> 00:34:11.340
I'm not going to be good for the back.

752
00:34:11.400 --> 00:34:14.880
But here, look, there's no insanity in what they seek.

753
00:34:14.940 --> 00:34:18.480
He doesn't, you know, he doesn't think the kids are bad.

754
00:34:18.539 --> 00:34:22.440
And I think that that's the, like I said, the redeeming feature of

755
00:34:22.440 --> 00:34:25.079
the episode is that Spock is on the kid's side.

756
00:34:25.139 --> 00:34:29.219
But, okay, what's this, the whole muddy thing about Eden?

757
00:34:29.340 --> 00:34:30.840
What is this all about?

758
00:34:30.900 --> 00:34:33.960
Because at the end, like the depiction of Eden.

759
00:34:34.079 --> 00:34:38.099
I can see it behind you, this sort of lush idyllic land, but it's

760
00:34:38.099 --> 00:34:39.659
utterly toxic to people.

761
00:34:39.719 --> 00:34:40.440
Yeah, yeah.

762
00:34:40.440 --> 00:34:41.820
So what point are they trying to make?

763
00:34:42.000 --> 00:34:45.960
Yeah, well, I mean, it's the same as the point in promised, in

764
00:34:45.960 --> 00:34:46.679
promised land.

765
00:34:46.739 --> 00:34:47.519
Do you know what I mean?

766
00:34:47.579 --> 00:34:48.119
Promised land.

767
00:34:48.179 --> 00:34:50.400
There is no such place as Eden.

768
00:34:50.460 --> 00:34:52.199
Yeah, I think so.

769
00:34:52.260 --> 00:34:56.219
Like, so Eden, it seems to be from the way that that Chekhov is

770
00:34:56.219 --> 00:34:57.179
describing it.

771
00:34:57.239 --> 00:35:01.440
Oh, see, I actually quite like this scene, I have to say.

772
00:35:01.500 --> 00:35:04.380
So we're in Smock's quarters.

773
00:35:04.440 --> 00:35:07.739
Adam comes in, asks, am I crossing you?

774
00:35:07.739 --> 00:35:10.139
Spock doesn't go, what do you mean by that?

775
00:35:10.199 --> 00:35:11.519
Do you mean, are you annoying me?

776
00:35:11.579 --> 00:35:12.659
He just talks to him.

777
00:35:12.719 --> 00:35:16.619
And then Adam shows genuine interest in the instrument and is kind

778
00:35:16.619 --> 00:35:20.400
of excited by it and gives it a go, and then he asks Spock to play

779
00:35:20.400 --> 00:35:24.900
it and Spock plays it, and like they really kind of, like they

780
00:35:24.900 --> 00:35:27.780
connect in a way that I think is actually kind of sweet.

781
00:35:27.840 --> 00:35:31.860
And like I said, because the episode is so determined to make me

782
00:35:31.860 --> 00:35:32.579
hate the kids.

783
00:35:32.639 --> 00:35:37.199
I just don't want to do that And, you know, like, I, like, I liked

784
00:35:37.199 --> 00:35:41.880
this, and then the next thing that we hear is that that's him

785
00:35:41.880 --> 00:35:46.679
stringing Spock along, that none of this childlike stuff about

786
00:35:46.679 --> 00:35:51.960
music and and love and acceptance and stuff is to be taken at face

787
00:35:51.960 --> 00:35:52.500
value.

788
00:35:52.559 --> 00:35:58.860
Uh, these people are, are evil, um, and all of that stuff is a

789
00:35:58.860 --> 00:35:59.340
deception.

790
00:36:00.119 --> 00:36:02.159
See, isn't this nice?

791
00:36:02.219 --> 00:36:02.940
I think this is quite nice.

792
00:36:03.000 --> 00:36:06.059
I don't find his performance likeable in the way you do, though.

793
00:36:06.119 --> 00:36:08.340
And the dialogue.

794
00:36:08.400 --> 00:36:09.780
Wow, that's now.

795
00:36:09.840 --> 00:36:10.739
That's really now.

796
00:36:11.099 --> 00:36:12.960
Oh, shut up.

797
00:36:13.320 --> 00:36:15.480
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

798
00:36:15.539 --> 00:36:17.400
Although you are right.

799
00:36:17.460 --> 00:36:17.880
So, yeah.

800
00:36:17.940 --> 00:36:21.300
So we've had a moment that appeared to be 2 people connecting with

801
00:36:21.300 --> 00:36:25.139
Spock and Sevrin, which was then totally shattered in the next

802
00:36:25.139 --> 00:36:25.500
season.

803
00:36:25.559 --> 00:36:26.940
This happens again.

804
00:36:27.000 --> 00:36:27.420
Yeah.

805
00:36:27.480 --> 00:36:28.500
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

806
00:36:28.559 --> 00:36:29.039
Yeah.

807
00:36:29.099 --> 00:36:32.940
So it's not like you can really buy into the relationship set, is

808
00:36:32.940 --> 00:36:33.179
it?

809
00:36:33.239 --> 00:36:37.380
If nobody's really. the same, like, I think there's actually quite

810
00:36:37.380 --> 00:36:40.920
a nice bit, like, the bit of music that I quite like is where

811
00:36:40.920 --> 00:36:43.079
Spock and Girl one.

812
00:36:43.139 --> 00:36:47.639
Um, uh, playing it, he's playing his, whatever it is, he's either

813
00:36:47.639 --> 00:36:50.760
and she's playing a bicycle wheel of some kind of thing.

814
00:36:50.820 --> 00:36:54.000
Um, and, like, I think that's actually quite nice.

815
00:36:54.000 --> 00:36:58.739
And it's, like, them making a connection. girl one.

816
00:36:58.800 --> 00:37:01.320
She's particularly adept with a bicycle wheel.

817
00:37:01.440 --> 00:37:03.420
I like girl one, actually.

818
00:37:03.480 --> 00:37:04.980
She might be my favourite dippy.

819
00:37:06.780 --> 00:37:09.900
You only get that one on Star Trek popcorn.

820
00:37:09.960 --> 00:37:12.119
Girl one is my favourite hippie.

821
00:37:13.980 --> 00:37:17.940
Oh, check off, will you chill out already?

822
00:37:18.000 --> 00:37:21.840
And again, the same thing is happening here, but you see it

823
00:37:21.840 --> 00:37:25.860
happening here because it's so ineptly done, where the 2 of them

824
00:37:25.860 --> 00:37:28.860
like, she comes and apologises for calling him stiff and making

825
00:37:28.860 --> 00:37:32.639
fun of him, and then she shows some genuine interest in what he's

826
00:37:32.639 --> 00:37:36.000
doing, and, you know, they're connecting because he's actually

827
00:37:36.000 --> 00:37:37.500
really finding Eden.

828
00:37:37.559 --> 00:37:41.159
She doesn't believe him when he says it, that's about to happen.

829
00:37:41.219 --> 00:37:44.219
But then it becomes very clear that she's just pressing him for

830
00:37:44.219 --> 00:37:48.239
information and he sort of goes, yes, and here at this at this

831
00:37:48.239 --> 00:37:48.659
desk.

832
00:37:48.719 --> 00:37:51.840
I have the access to access to the sum of human knowledge, and I

833
00:37:51.840 --> 00:37:55.679
could just fly the ship, even if I had no skills at all and stuff

834
00:37:55.679 --> 00:37:58.980
and she's going, hmm, okay, and storing all that away.

835
00:37:59.219 --> 00:38:01.739
It's just not who he is though.

836
00:38:01.800 --> 00:38:05.099
I just was watching this going, who's right in this?

837
00:38:05.219 --> 00:38:08.099
They just haven't got the spec on Chekhov at all.

838
00:38:08.159 --> 00:38:11.699
What's the, what's the better outcome with this episode then?

839
00:38:11.760 --> 00:38:14.820
Say we did this episode, but we came to different conclusions

840
00:38:14.820 --> 00:38:16.619
about the hippies.

841
00:38:16.679 --> 00:38:20.099
Is it that members of the Enterprise crew start to see there is

842
00:38:20.099 --> 00:38:23.519
something in this and there's sort of like a shared learning

843
00:38:23.519 --> 00:38:25.440
throughout the episode and we leave?

844
00:38:25.739 --> 00:38:27.300
That way?

845
00:38:27.360 --> 00:38:31.019
But I mean, yeah, that's a boring episode though, isn't it?

846
00:38:31.079 --> 00:38:33.420
Like, um, it is a boring episode.

847
00:38:33.480 --> 00:38:34.199
It's a drama.

848
00:38:34.260 --> 00:38:35.340
Yeah, it is a boring episode.

849
00:38:35.400 --> 00:38:40.980
But, like, I can't imagine the crew of the Enterprise D reacting

850
00:38:40.980 --> 00:38:41.820
like that.

851
00:38:42.239 --> 00:38:45.300
No, maybe in series one.

852
00:38:45.360 --> 00:38:48.780
If they were taken over by a sex virus, possibly, you know, they'd

853
00:38:48.780 --> 00:38:50.219
all be very relaxed by the end of that.

854
00:38:50.460 --> 00:38:52.739
Maybe, but, you know.

855
00:38:52.739 --> 00:38:56.219
What was the episode where Dr. McCoy?

856
00:38:56.280 --> 00:38:58.320
Remember when he flooded the whole of the Enterprise with a load

857
00:38:58.320 --> 00:39:00.420
of drugs to sort of chill everybody out?

858
00:39:00.539 --> 00:39:02.820
I mean, they could have done with that in this, couldn't they?

859
00:39:02.880 --> 00:39:04.199
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

860
00:39:04.260 --> 00:39:06.000
Any episode could be improved by that.

861
00:39:06.119 --> 00:39:10.500
No, even worse, the hippies have flooded the ships with drugs.

862
00:39:10.559 --> 00:39:12.239
They poisoned us to their waves.

863
00:39:14.219 --> 00:39:17.880
You know, I'm quite surprised, you know, she doesn't get the sort

864
00:39:17.880 --> 00:39:20.940
of romantic filter that most women get on original strength.

865
00:39:21.059 --> 00:39:24.059
Because she's in the shot with Chekhov, I think, is the problem.

866
00:39:24.179 --> 00:39:26.159
It's so masculine.

867
00:39:26.219 --> 00:39:27.360
You can't use the mist on him.

868
00:39:27.420 --> 00:39:28.559
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

869
00:39:28.619 --> 00:39:31.559
Oh, that's a horrible kiss, isn't it?

870
00:39:31.619 --> 00:39:32.280
Yeah.

871
00:39:32.280 --> 00:39:34.800
We can't even see their lips.

872
00:39:34.920 --> 00:39:36.420
We just seen the back of his head.

873
00:39:36.480 --> 00:39:42.239
Do you know, I'm actually surprised that we that we see Irina's

874
00:39:42.239 --> 00:39:42.840
belly button.

875
00:39:44.219 --> 00:39:46.679
See, we see it all the time.

876
00:39:46.739 --> 00:39:48.239
There was something about that, wasn't there?

877
00:39:48.539 --> 00:39:51.719
you told me that you weren't supposed to know.

878
00:39:51.780 --> 00:39:53.280
You weren't supposed to show the belly button.

879
00:39:53.340 --> 00:39:54.539
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

880
00:39:54.599 --> 00:39:57.719
And certainly, you know, like Barbara Eden's belly button is never

881
00:39:57.719 --> 00:40:01.019
visible even though she's wearing a skimpy outfit in I Dream of

882
00:40:01.019 --> 00:40:01.559
Jeanie.

883
00:40:01.920 --> 00:40:04.320
So, yeah, yeah.

884
00:40:04.380 --> 00:40:05.039
So here we are.

885
00:40:05.099 --> 00:40:08.460
We're all meeting up in the quarters and we're all talking about

886
00:40:08.460 --> 00:40:15.179
how we're deceiving the crew, because we are not genuinely like

887
00:40:15.179 --> 00:40:21.119
kids who are enthused by, you know, something and who love music

888
00:40:21.119 --> 00:40:24.960
and stuff, we are here to take over the ship and we will kill

889
00:40:24.960 --> 00:40:25.500
everyone.

890
00:40:25.559 --> 00:40:26.280
Do you know what I mean?

891
00:40:26.340 --> 00:40:27.599
Like we can't be trusted.

892
00:40:27.659 --> 00:40:29.159
So it's being said here.

893
00:40:29.699 --> 00:40:33.000
It just feels to me that this dialogue has been written by

894
00:40:33.000 --> 00:40:35.460
somebody, you know, that serious brain damage.

895
00:40:35.519 --> 00:40:38.460
When will it be soonest?

896
00:40:38.519 --> 00:40:39.780
How can we make them swing?

897
00:40:39.840 --> 00:40:43.260
I know the swingest things they...

898
00:40:43.320 --> 00:40:44.159
Look at this, though.

899
00:40:44.219 --> 00:40:47.400
So we get them all talking, just go out and be friendly and we'll

900
00:40:47.400 --> 00:40:52.800
win the crew over, and then you cut to Severin in his cell smiling

901
00:40:52.800 --> 00:40:57.900
because he's satisfied with how devious they're all being, and now

902
00:40:57.900 --> 00:40:58.800
they're playing music.

903
00:40:58.920 --> 00:41:01.500
So this is the session that's in the rec room.

904
00:41:01.500 --> 00:41:05.460
And everybody on the Enterprise is German.

905
00:41:05.519 --> 00:41:06.780
Enterprise is super into it.

906
00:41:06.840 --> 00:41:09.599
The hot guy who is guarding Severn.

907
00:41:09.659 --> 00:41:11.219
Did you see Hot Guy Guarding?

908
00:41:11.280 --> 00:41:11.760
Was he dancing?

909
00:41:11.820 --> 00:41:12.539
Was it Dad Dancing?

910
00:41:12.599 --> 00:41:13.380
Yeah, you wait.

911
00:41:13.440 --> 00:41:18.300
We'll come back to him because little gay Klingon, little What's

912
00:41:18.300 --> 00:41:18.719
his face?

913
00:41:18.780 --> 00:41:22.500
Tongo will come in and give him a sort of Catullan neck pinch.

914
00:41:23.280 --> 00:41:27.179
Look at that guy in the purple wig with his little drum between

915
00:41:27.179 --> 00:41:27.599
his legs.

916
00:41:28.739 --> 00:41:30.119
It's a whole thing.

917
00:41:33.179 --> 00:41:33.960
Oh my god.

918
00:41:34.019 --> 00:41:36.239
I met a man called Nathan.

919
00:41:36.480 --> 00:41:39.239
He was so fucking hot.

920
00:41:39.300 --> 00:41:42.360
I fell in love immediately.

921
00:41:42.420 --> 00:41:44.820
Like, come on now, that's better than this song.

922
00:41:44.880 --> 00:41:47.400
Uh, yeah, maybe.

923
00:41:47.699 --> 00:41:50.940
Excuse me, it was very complimentary about you.

924
00:41:51.239 --> 00:41:52.800
It was.

925
00:41:52.860 --> 00:41:53.639
I like that part of it.

926
00:41:53.820 --> 00:41:57.000
But I think she's got a beautiful voice.

927
00:41:57.059 --> 00:42:00.539
I think the ADR is really terrible, like they're dubbed, so it

928
00:42:00.539 --> 00:42:02.940
never looks like he's actually seeing, which is kind of terrible.

929
00:42:03.000 --> 00:42:06.420
And they're sort of dorky and awkward and stuff and particularly

930
00:42:06.420 --> 00:42:07.739
by our standards now.

931
00:42:07.860 --> 00:42:10.619
But she's got a nice voice.

932
00:42:10.679 --> 00:42:13.679
Like when she comes in and starts seeing there's a mild, mild wide

933
00:42:13.679 --> 00:42:16.679
emptiness between you and me and she's singing about connection

934
00:42:16.679 --> 00:42:19.800
and all of those things that we love about Star Trek, but it's all

935
00:42:19.800 --> 00:42:23.699
a ploy because they're seriously, deeply evil.

936
00:42:23.760 --> 00:42:28.260
And now here's Spock coming to lend some sort of moral weight to

937
00:42:28.260 --> 00:42:29.219
the thing, you know.

938
00:42:29.219 --> 00:42:31.440
Oh, another devious close-up on Severn.

939
00:42:32.760 --> 00:42:35.099
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right.

940
00:42:35.159 --> 00:42:37.800
We've got you all dancing now.

941
00:42:37.860 --> 00:42:38.760
Yeah, yeah.

942
00:42:38.820 --> 00:42:39.719
Exactly.

943
00:42:40.139 --> 00:42:43.199
We already did that and we did that shot already.

944
00:42:43.260 --> 00:42:43.920
It's so shit.

945
00:42:44.039 --> 00:42:47.639
Not the most suspenseful threat we've ever had in Star Trek, is

946
00:42:47.639 --> 00:42:47.940
it?

947
00:42:48.000 --> 00:42:48.539
No, no.

948
00:42:48.599 --> 00:42:49.500
Yeah.

949
00:42:49.500 --> 00:42:55.199
But like, you know, like this is, you know, folk music and stuff.

950
00:42:55.260 --> 00:42:56.400
It's kind of embarrassing.

951
00:42:56.460 --> 00:42:59.099
I know, but you know, I was brought up on 60s music, yeah.

952
00:42:59.159 --> 00:43:00.900
I absolutely was brought up.

953
00:43:00.960 --> 00:43:03.900
And it's fantastic.

954
00:43:03.960 --> 00:43:07.679
This is shocking me bad compared to the music I would brought up

955
00:43:07.679 --> 00:43:08.039
on.

956
00:43:08.039 --> 00:43:11.699
Look at the fat guy on the bridge who's getting who's enjoying

957
00:43:11.699 --> 00:43:12.119
it.

958
00:43:12.179 --> 00:43:14.940
They should have just, you know, spent a bit of money and got a

959
00:43:14.940 --> 00:43:16.920
Helen Shapiro song in or something, you know?

960
00:43:16.980 --> 00:43:19.559
They never...

961
00:43:19.559 --> 00:43:20.460
Happiness.

962
00:43:20.460 --> 00:43:21.360
Whoop.

963
00:43:21.420 --> 00:43:22.440
Oh, yeah, yeah.

964
00:43:22.500 --> 00:43:24.000
Something like that.

965
00:43:25.199 --> 00:43:26.820
Do you know what?

966
00:43:26.880 --> 00:43:29.460
When you can't even hear the music and you can just see them doing

967
00:43:29.460 --> 00:43:31.320
their sort of free love dancing.

968
00:43:31.380 --> 00:43:33.059
Oh boy, it's even worse.

969
00:43:34.500 --> 00:43:38.039
Oh, I see.

970
00:43:38.039 --> 00:43:39.179
She is.

971
00:43:39.239 --> 00:43:40.380
She's playing a bicycle.

972
00:43:40.440 --> 00:43:43.199
She's genuinely stringing spoke right there.

973
00:43:43.260 --> 00:43:44.579
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

974
00:43:44.639 --> 00:43:48.000
But I think this is kind of cute, and it sounds really good, and

975
00:43:48.000 --> 00:43:50.219
like the 2 of them are, you know, into a...

976
00:43:50.579 --> 00:43:51.900
Come on, watch out.

977
00:43:51.960 --> 00:43:53.940
The man with the purple wigs coming up.

978
00:43:54.000 --> 00:43:56.340
He's really hard, isn't he?

979
00:43:56.400 --> 00:43:57.719
Like, he's super hot.

980
00:43:57.780 --> 00:44:01.079
Unusually for original Star Trek.

981
00:44:01.199 --> 00:44:03.659
Super hot, but not particularly observant.

982
00:44:03.719 --> 00:44:05.880
No, but that's it.

983
00:44:05.940 --> 00:44:10.860
These kids, you know, they pretend to be normal people.

984
00:44:11.519 --> 00:44:15.300
Well, that man on the bridge was just having a little jig, right

985
00:44:15.300 --> 00:44:19.559
to the dreadful song, and Scotty gave him a reproaching look, and

986
00:44:19.559 --> 00:44:21.900
he stiffened up immediately and went back to his console.

987
00:44:21.960 --> 00:44:24.239
No, everyone's into it.

988
00:44:24.239 --> 00:44:25.320
Sulu's into it as well.

989
00:44:25.380 --> 00:44:27.239
You know, like everyone's sort of enjoying it.

990
00:44:27.300 --> 00:44:29.340
Ahura's not in this episode.

991
00:44:29.400 --> 00:44:30.599
Maybe she was disgusted.

992
00:44:30.659 --> 00:44:32.639
Maybe Michelle said, fuck this.

993
00:44:32.699 --> 00:44:34.860
She read the script.

994
00:44:35.280 --> 00:44:38.460
Came down with a bowel of laryngitis.

995
00:44:38.519 --> 00:44:42.360
We had Lieutenant Palmer, who is also in the doomsday machine last

996
00:44:42.360 --> 00:44:42.840
season.

997
00:44:42.900 --> 00:44:44.880
So in the same role, I think.

998
00:44:45.000 --> 00:44:47.039
Oh my god, did you notice that?

999
00:44:47.039 --> 00:44:49.199
That bicycle, well, she can spin it as she's going.

1000
00:44:49.860 --> 00:44:51.780
Multifunction.

1001
00:44:51.840 --> 00:44:53.039
That's how works.

1002
00:44:53.099 --> 00:44:54.719
Do you know what, right?

1003
00:44:54.780 --> 00:44:58.139
Given that he's the one that has to creep around the ship, having

1004
00:44:58.139 --> 00:45:02.099
that purple wig, you know, it's not exactly how easy to hide, is

1005
00:45:02.099 --> 00:45:02.340
it?

1006
00:45:02.460 --> 00:45:04.320
Well, he's an alien, I think.

1007
00:45:04.320 --> 00:45:09.300
Severan and Tongo are aliens, and then the others are...

1008
00:45:09.300 --> 00:45:10.500
He naturally looks like you're saying.

1009
00:45:10.559 --> 00:45:11.579
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1010
00:45:11.639 --> 00:45:12.719
It's a less league.

1011
00:45:12.780 --> 00:45:14.519
Like I said, he's sort of gay Klingon.

1012
00:45:15.480 --> 00:45:18.900
Okay, so now they're taking over the ship.

1013
00:45:18.960 --> 00:45:23.639
Um, and he, like, we're heading into Romulan space.

1014
00:45:23.699 --> 00:45:26.940
And like I said, the Romulans are set up in a way that the

1015
00:45:26.940 --> 00:45:31.019
Klingons are sometimes, but it's more a Romulan thing, I think

1016
00:45:31.019 --> 00:45:32.880
after balance of terror.

1017
00:45:32.940 --> 00:45:35.460
That's where the, you know, the Cold War is.

1018
00:45:35.519 --> 00:45:39.360
And they're taking us into Romulan space and they're going to

1019
00:45:39.360 --> 00:45:40.440
inside an incident.

1020
00:45:40.500 --> 00:45:43.320
And I just think the fact that these kids get hold of this

1021
00:45:43.320 --> 00:45:46.619
starship and head it straight for the USSR.

1022
00:45:46.679 --> 00:45:48.420
Well, they trying to do that, though.

1023
00:45:48.480 --> 00:45:51.599
I thought they were all peace and free love. are they doing this?

1024
00:45:51.659 --> 00:45:55.380
Because all of the peace and free love and acceptance is all a

1025
00:45:55.380 --> 00:45:59.579
ruse, all of the money or all of the music, all of the protest, all

1026
00:45:59.579 --> 00:46:02.039
of that stuff is hiding, the fact that they are going to kill us

1027
00:46:02.039 --> 00:46:03.539
and create a galactic incident.

1028
00:46:03.599 --> 00:46:08.880
That's what I think is so horrible about this, that these kids, and

1029
00:46:08.880 --> 00:46:12.539
you know, by extension, the 60s kind of counterculture and stuff

1030
00:46:12.539 --> 00:46:18.059
that they are a threat to the stability of the planet, that they

1031
00:46:18.059 --> 00:46:20.760
are dangerous and they are liars.

1032
00:46:20.820 --> 00:46:22.920
And I think it's always...

1033
00:46:22.980 --> 00:46:23.579
Hang on a minute.

1034
00:46:23.639 --> 00:46:26.820
So these people, they're just like terrible terrorists, yeah, that

1035
00:46:26.820 --> 00:46:29.400
want to create destruction and awful things.

1036
00:46:29.460 --> 00:46:34.139
And in order to do that, to subdue people into thinking they're

1037
00:46:34.139 --> 00:46:39.420
noise, they go around pretending to be free loving hippies.

1038
00:46:39.480 --> 00:46:39.780
Yes.

1039
00:46:39.780 --> 00:46:41.940
But that just annoys everybody.

1040
00:46:42.000 --> 00:46:45.960
It's not exactly a great ruse, but it didn't, yeah, it did annoy

1041
00:46:45.960 --> 00:46:49.019
everybody, but the music thing worked, like the the concert

1042
00:46:49.019 --> 00:46:49.380
worked.

1043
00:46:49.440 --> 00:46:51.659
Only because they are also fucking stupid.

1044
00:46:52.199 --> 00:46:54.659
But do you know what I mean?

1045
00:46:54.719 --> 00:46:56.940
Like, and there were those moments of connection?

1046
00:46:57.000 --> 00:46:59.880
Like between girl one and Spock and between Spock and Adam?

1047
00:46:59.940 --> 00:47:03.780
You know, in between Spock and Severan, you know, but all of that

1048
00:47:03.780 --> 00:47:06.300
stuff is a lie.

1049
00:47:06.360 --> 00:47:07.559
Imagine the marriage.

1050
00:47:07.619 --> 00:47:10.500
Do you, Spock, take girl one girl?

1051
00:47:10.739 --> 00:47:13.380
I'm only assuming she's girl one.

1052
00:47:13.500 --> 00:47:18.059
I didn't actually look them up, but she gets more to do than girl

1053
00:47:18.059 --> 00:47:21.420
2 who just gets a couple of lines of dialogue with Sulu.

1054
00:47:21.480 --> 00:47:24.480
What's their motive for causing these incidents?

1055
00:47:24.539 --> 00:47:28.199
Well, because they want to go to Eden, like they want the ship to

1056
00:47:28.199 --> 00:47:29.159
take them to Eden.

1057
00:47:29.219 --> 00:47:31.440
And so that's why they stole their.

1058
00:47:31.500 --> 00:47:35.219
Unless you take us to paradise, we'll create a diplomatic

1059
00:47:35.219 --> 00:47:35.699
incident.

1060
00:47:35.760 --> 00:47:36.780
That would be quite basic.

1061
00:47:36.840 --> 00:47:40.679
But in fact, they decide that they will kill everyone on board the

1062
00:47:40.679 --> 00:47:43.619
ship in order to get to Eden.

1063
00:47:43.920 --> 00:47:46.559
The virus has been mentioned again.

1064
00:47:46.679 --> 00:47:48.960
Yeah, yeah, yeah, isn't it?

1065
00:47:49.019 --> 00:47:50.159
It's very confusing.

1066
00:47:50.219 --> 00:47:54.780
Well, yeah, again, like the virus doesn't kind of work and doesn't

1067
00:47:54.780 --> 00:47:57.239
fit into the episode in a way.

1068
00:47:57.300 --> 00:47:58.380
Do you know what I mean?

1069
00:47:58.440 --> 00:48:02.940
Like, and in a way, it supports uh, Severance points about Eden, I

1070
00:48:02.940 --> 00:48:03.420
don't know.

1071
00:48:03.480 --> 00:48:07.739
Probably spare our Spork trying to reach out with hippie speak.

1072
00:48:07.800 --> 00:48:09.960
Adam, I know how to reach you.

1073
00:48:10.019 --> 00:48:11.760
Oh, yeah, yeah.

1074
00:48:11.760 --> 00:48:12.840
God of mine.

1075
00:48:12.900 --> 00:48:13.679
I like this.

1076
00:48:13.739 --> 00:48:14.760
Do you know what I mean?

1077
00:48:14.820 --> 00:48:17.039
Like, I like that Spock cares about them.

1078
00:48:17.039 --> 00:48:22.619
And doesn't, you know, like he doesn't dismiss them the way that

1079
00:48:22.619 --> 00:48:23.460
everyone else does.

1080
00:48:23.519 --> 00:48:27.300
You're a very forgiving man, though, from Boston. you know that?

1081
00:48:27.360 --> 00:48:31.619
Well, like I said, I think this is a horrible episode in all sorts

1082
00:48:31.619 --> 00:48:34.199
of ways, but not for the reason that most people think it's

1083
00:48:34.199 --> 00:48:36.900
horrible or many people think it's horrible.

1084
00:48:36.960 --> 00:48:38.579
And there are things about it.

1085
00:48:38.639 --> 00:48:41.400
You know, like there's there's stuff that doesn't quite work, but

1086
00:48:41.400 --> 00:48:45.300
there's things in it and there's ideas in it and that makes a

1087
00:48:45.300 --> 00:48:47.880
change from something like wolf in the fold, which was just 50

1088
00:48:47.880 --> 00:48:50.340
minutes of tedious bullshit, you know?

1089
00:48:50.880 --> 00:48:55.139
Not wolf in the fold, whom gods destroy, although wolf in the fold

1090
00:48:55.139 --> 00:48:58.139
was hilarious, bullshit. do I have to keep mentioning that green

1091
00:48:58.139 --> 00:48:59.219
woman on the rock exploding?

1092
00:48:59.280 --> 00:49:01.199
No, that's whom God's destroyed.

1093
00:49:01.260 --> 00:49:01.920
That's right.

1094
00:49:01.980 --> 00:49:03.900
We per have a bit during that scene, didn't we?

1095
00:49:03.960 --> 00:49:04.800
that was awesome.

1096
00:49:04.860 --> 00:49:07.559
I can't say I perked up at all during this.

1097
00:49:07.619 --> 00:49:10.860
I think Adam is coming on to Tongo because there's a thing where

1098
00:49:10.860 --> 00:49:11.519
he's singing.

1099
00:49:11.579 --> 00:49:16.260
So this head now to Eden thing, the music comes in later when they

1100
00:49:16.260 --> 00:49:21.059
both die, when Severn and Adam die on the planet, we actually hear

1101
00:49:21.059 --> 00:49:24.960
that music queue again, and they all sing it together a little bit

1102
00:49:24.960 --> 00:49:25.440
later.

1103
00:49:25.500 --> 00:49:29.760
Um, but then there's, he's saying something about, you know

1104
00:49:29.760 --> 00:49:32.820
because everyone's brother, that's the other thing, because just

1105
00:49:32.820 --> 00:49:37.019
like proper hippies, they're super sexist, because it is still the

1106
00:49:37.019 --> 00:49:37.980
1960s.

1107
00:49:38.039 --> 00:49:42.059
Um, and, and I just thought he was coming onto Tongo there.

1108
00:49:42.119 --> 00:49:44.099
Tongo looked a little bit kind of...

1109
00:49:44.099 --> 00:49:45.179
Is that a you reading no?

1110
00:49:45.179 --> 00:49:46.860
Or do you think that's in the script?

1111
00:49:46.920 --> 00:49:48.119
What's that?

1112
00:49:48.179 --> 00:49:49.440
Well, you just said there.

1113
00:49:49.500 --> 00:49:52.260
Oh, I've just me reading for shot.

1114
00:49:52.320 --> 00:49:53.579
Just a little shot.

1115
00:49:53.579 --> 00:49:56.760
We've got a feel 50 minutes somehow, haven't we?

1116
00:49:56.820 --> 00:49:57.420
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1117
00:49:57.480 --> 00:49:58.139
That's it.

1118
00:49:58.260 --> 00:50:02.039
Oh, can we get down to this fucking planet already, please?

1119
00:50:06.480 --> 00:50:11.340
Did you see the maniacal look on Severance face when he realised

1120
00:50:11.340 --> 00:50:12.780
they were going to Eden?

1121
00:50:12.840 --> 00:50:14.760
There was this whopping great close-up on him.

1122
00:50:14.820 --> 00:50:19.320
There's no doubt in my mind that he's truly evil, this man.

1123
00:50:20.280 --> 00:50:23.880
Yeah, there's, but that's the that's the point, isn't it?

1124
00:50:23.940 --> 00:50:27.360
Like these are dumb children who are being led astray into this

1125
00:50:27.360 --> 00:50:30.780
hippie lifestyle by Dr. Timothy Leary.

1126
00:50:30.840 --> 00:50:31.500
Do you know what I mean?

1127
00:50:31.559 --> 00:50:36.900
Or whatever, enormous ear, with an enormous ear, and a really bad

1128
00:50:36.900 --> 00:50:37.860
bald wig.

1129
00:50:38.159 --> 00:50:41.940
Look at the joint on that purple wig. terrible.

1130
00:50:42.000 --> 00:50:43.800
It's really bad, isn't it?

1131
00:50:43.860 --> 00:50:48.059
Yeah, it probably wasn't as visible on a TV in 1969 though.

1132
00:50:48.119 --> 00:50:51.360
I might get us both a pair of those purple eyebrows, though, so we

1133
00:50:51.360 --> 00:50:53.880
can do a publicity shock, UTSP.

1134
00:50:55.019 --> 00:50:58.320
I feel like we need to sort of juice it up again, you know?

1135
00:50:58.739 --> 00:51:01.800
But you see, I think this is an interesting moment, right?

1136
00:51:01.860 --> 00:51:05.340
So they're going to use ultrasonics or something to disable the

1137
00:51:05.340 --> 00:51:08.940
crew so that they can get down to the shuttle bay and steal a

1138
00:51:08.940 --> 00:51:12.300
shuttle and 2 of them object.

1139
00:51:12.360 --> 00:51:20.880
First arena, and then Tongo object and say, that sound is not

1140
00:51:20.880 --> 00:51:23.639
going to just disable them.

1141
00:51:23.699 --> 00:51:24.659
It will kill them.

1142
00:51:24.719 --> 00:51:28.199
And they both object, but they may do it anyway.

1143
00:51:28.260 --> 00:51:34.320
And so, and so what's clear is that he is able to get them to

1144
00:51:34.320 --> 00:51:39.840
murder, you know, 400 people in order to get to Eden and that's

1145
00:51:39.840 --> 00:51:40.860
how they're depicted.

1146
00:51:40.920 --> 00:51:43.920
And there's no consequences because the episode's kind of a mess

1147
00:51:43.920 --> 00:51:46.739
but that's where we land with this.

1148
00:51:46.800 --> 00:51:50.940
Shut the starts off doing its reaction, sort of noise, like very

1149
00:51:50.940 --> 00:51:53.219
over the top, like he spends most of free.

1150
00:51:53.219 --> 00:51:56.519
And then decides, nosh, I can't be asking. just falls to the

1151
00:51:56.519 --> 00:51:56.760
floor.

1152
00:51:57.000 --> 00:51:59.639
But Nemoy is affected.

1153
00:51:59.699 --> 00:52:00.960
I watch...

1154
00:52:01.980 --> 00:52:02.340
Christine.

1155
00:52:02.400 --> 00:52:04.500
Magell, absolutely, guys.

1156
00:52:04.559 --> 00:52:05.340
That's so great.

1157
00:52:05.400 --> 00:52:07.079
Chepping into Eden.

1158
00:52:07.079 --> 00:52:11.280
Yeah, brother, stepping into Eden.

1159
00:52:11.340 --> 00:52:16.139
I mean, at this point, awful, I'd lost all sense when everyone was

1160
00:52:16.139 --> 00:52:18.780
unconscious and they're singing their hippie songs.

1161
00:52:18.840 --> 00:52:21.599
I was like, but that's a good, like, that's good.

1162
00:52:21.659 --> 00:52:23.039
Do you know what I mean?

1163
00:52:23.099 --> 00:52:24.659
They're singing?

1164
00:52:24.719 --> 00:52:29.400
Yeah, yeah, it's, it's, it's not quite as good as like home.

1165
00:52:29.460 --> 00:52:33.840
Do you remember when the sheriff gets killed and you get the song

1166
00:52:33.840 --> 00:52:35.940
the ironic song, but that's what it is.

1167
00:52:36.000 --> 00:52:38.940
It's an ironic song where they've just killed 400 people.

1168
00:52:39.000 --> 00:52:43.619
And they're singing this song about how great Eden's going to be.

1169
00:52:43.679 --> 00:52:45.780
And then it turns out it doesn't kill him after all.

1170
00:52:45.840 --> 00:52:49.800
I just figured that the cast had got to a point where they thought

1171
00:52:49.800 --> 00:52:53.699
well, I cannot act in this nonsense anymore and they all just fell

1172
00:52:53.699 --> 00:52:54.360
on the floor.

1173
00:52:54.900 --> 00:52:57.840
That was their protest to this episode.

1174
00:52:57.900 --> 00:53:00.300
But I mean, that's a good moment.

1175
00:53:00.360 --> 00:53:04.800
You know, like having them sing their utopian song while the

1176
00:53:04.800 --> 00:53:07.860
people that they've harmed, you know, where we get to see them

1177
00:53:07.860 --> 00:53:08.699
lying all over the ship.

1178
00:53:08.940 --> 00:53:11.280
I'll tell you what was a good moment.

1179
00:53:11.340 --> 00:53:13.980
I was super refreshed when we went down to the planet.

1180
00:53:14.039 --> 00:53:16.559
I mean, I realised this thing was going to wrap up pretty soon

1181
00:53:16.559 --> 00:53:20.760
because we only had 5 minutes left, but it was so nice to get out

1182
00:53:20.760 --> 00:53:24.659
of these enterprise sets and somewhere else for just 5 minutes.

1183
00:53:24.719 --> 00:53:27.059
And you know, it's quite a nice set, actually.

1184
00:53:27.119 --> 00:53:31.260
They put the whole shuttlecraft into the foreign set as well, which

1185
00:53:31.260 --> 00:53:31.739
is quite nice.

1186
00:53:31.800 --> 00:53:32.340
Yeah.

1187
00:53:32.340 --> 00:53:33.000
Yeah.

1188
00:53:33.059 --> 00:53:36.659
So I sent you the original picture.

1189
00:53:36.719 --> 00:53:38.099
I don't know if you noticed it.

1190
00:53:38.159 --> 00:53:41.460
So, um, yeah, later on.

1191
00:53:41.519 --> 00:53:47.519
Um, there's a beautiful um, computer generated image, which looks

1192
00:53:47.519 --> 00:53:53.460
a little bit like the painting that they do in um, in an early

1193
00:53:53.460 --> 00:53:53.880
episode.

1194
00:53:53.940 --> 00:53:56.820
It was in the closing credits for a while in series one.

1195
00:53:57.179 --> 00:53:59.699
But they had a big map painting that had, you know, mountains and

1196
00:53:59.699 --> 00:54:01.199
and a moon.

1197
00:54:01.260 --> 00:54:02.519
Oh, with the planets in the sky as well.

1198
00:54:02.579 --> 00:54:03.960
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1199
00:54:04.019 --> 00:54:06.300
And so, yeah, so they're doing something that's sort of

1200
00:54:06.300 --> 00:54:07.079
sympathetic to that.

1201
00:54:07.139 --> 00:54:10.679
Originally it was just some muddy fucking lake somewhere. just

1202
00:54:10.679 --> 00:54:13.260
outside LA, which looked so bad.

1203
00:54:13.320 --> 00:54:14.760
Like it was so terrible.

1204
00:54:14.820 --> 00:54:18.119
You can't tell me there's an even worse version of this episode

1205
00:54:18.119 --> 00:54:19.019
out there somewhere.

1206
00:54:19.079 --> 00:54:20.460
I don't believe you.

1207
00:54:20.519 --> 00:54:24.900
Well, Eden is not quite as idyllic in the transmitted version.

1208
00:54:24.960 --> 00:54:28.860
Oh, you think it gave it away in the original version that it was

1209
00:54:28.860 --> 00:54:29.880
a toxic landscape?

1210
00:54:29.940 --> 00:54:33.300
Well, no, I think I think they're intending to make it beautiful

1211
00:54:33.300 --> 00:54:35.760
but somehow didn't manage it.

1212
00:54:35.880 --> 00:54:38.760
Thank God for the restorers, eh?

1213
00:54:39.960 --> 00:54:43.559
Oh, I said God ironically then, by the way.

1214
00:54:44.760 --> 00:54:48.360
I mean, I do love seeing the Enterprise in CGI.

1215
00:54:48.420 --> 00:54:50.280
It is lovely. yeah.

1216
00:54:50.340 --> 00:54:52.019
So they beam down now.

1217
00:54:52.079 --> 00:54:56.340
Adam, they discover Adam, dead, and the poisonous fruit just out

1218
00:54:56.340 --> 00:54:56.880
of his reach.

1219
00:54:56.940 --> 00:54:59.039
Oh, you're right. beautiful.

1220
00:54:59.159 --> 00:55:03.059
Yeah, yeah, it's an amazing shot, isn't it?

1221
00:55:03.119 --> 00:55:04.260
Like, it's really something.

1222
00:55:04.320 --> 00:55:09.239
That's really... quite sort of 60s SF paw paw, isn't it?

1223
00:55:09.300 --> 00:55:10.619
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1224
00:55:10.679 --> 00:55:11.940
It's sympathetic with the period.

1225
00:55:12.000 --> 00:55:17.159
And even the fruit that Adam and Severn eat, they're visible on

1226
00:55:17.159 --> 00:55:17.820
the tree.

1227
00:55:17.880 --> 00:55:21.480
Fortunately, it's clearly a still though, because the water's not

1228
00:55:21.480 --> 00:55:22.199
moving at all.

1229
00:55:22.559 --> 00:55:26.039
There's no movement in the water. not, is it?

1230
00:55:26.099 --> 00:55:26.639
Whoops.

1231
00:55:27.480 --> 00:55:30.780
Oh, missing check off, what ails you?

1232
00:55:31.079 --> 00:55:32.519
Yeah.

1233
00:55:32.579 --> 00:55:35.219
They just stop beaming down on the planets.

1234
00:55:35.280 --> 00:55:36.539
Things don't go well, do they?

1235
00:55:37.440 --> 00:55:41.460
So this, I think this ending is properly good.

1236
00:55:41.519 --> 00:55:45.119
And even though it's nasty and mean-spirited in a way that the

1237
00:55:45.119 --> 00:55:46.440
rest of the episode is as well.

1238
00:55:46.500 --> 00:55:50.579
Like, this would have scared the living daylights out of me when I

1239
00:55:50.579 --> 00:55:51.119
was a kid.

1240
00:55:51.179 --> 00:55:54.000
Like absolutely terrifying, I think.

1241
00:55:54.059 --> 00:55:56.820
This very sort of succulent landscape proving deadly.

1242
00:55:57.719 --> 00:56:00.000
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1243
00:56:00.059 --> 00:56:00.539
Yeah.

1244
00:56:00.599 --> 00:56:02.519
Where everything is full of acid.

1245
00:56:02.579 --> 00:56:04.199
Like everything you touch.

1246
00:56:04.260 --> 00:56:06.239
And like the burns look horrible.

1247
00:56:06.300 --> 00:56:09.300
Later on when you see Severance feet, because of course they're

1248
00:56:09.300 --> 00:56:11.039
all fucking Ippies and they're not wearing...

1249
00:56:11.039 --> 00:56:11.880
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1250
00:56:11.940 --> 00:56:12.780
Yeah.

1251
00:56:12.840 --> 00:56:14.820
Like, I think that's really terrifying.

1252
00:56:14.880 --> 00:56:19.260
And then this thing with Adam, like, you don't even see his

1253
00:56:19.260 --> 00:56:19.559
death.

1254
00:56:19.619 --> 00:56:20.280
He's just dead.

1255
00:56:20.340 --> 00:56:22.500
Well, his fingers moving there.

1256
00:56:22.559 --> 00:56:30.840
But he, um, like we get, um, you know, Spock's a, his name was

1257
00:56:30.840 --> 00:56:31.320
Adam.

1258
00:56:31.380 --> 00:56:32.400
Do you know what I mean?

1259
00:56:32.460 --> 00:56:36.480
He ate from a fruit in Eden and then died.

1260
00:56:37.380 --> 00:56:40.800
So biblically, this is saying what?

1261
00:56:40.860 --> 00:56:42.900
Well, that sort of makes no sense either.

1262
00:56:42.960 --> 00:56:48.480
But, but, um, but, you know, like he's commenting on that thing

1263
00:56:48.480 --> 00:56:49.980
that they made up.

1264
00:56:50.099 --> 00:56:51.000
I was really confused here.

1265
00:56:51.059 --> 00:56:54.059
So they've gone on to display what realises it's toxic and they're

1266
00:56:54.059 --> 00:56:55.139
all hiding away in the shuttle.

1267
00:56:55.139 --> 00:56:56.460
Or have they not come out?

1268
00:56:56.460 --> 00:56:57.360
Yeah, I'm really confused.

1269
00:56:57.420 --> 00:57:00.360
No, because they've all been out and they've walked on the grass

1270
00:57:00.360 --> 00:57:04.019
because there's a line of dialogue saying everything is full of

1271
00:57:04.019 --> 00:57:05.579
acid, even the grass.

1272
00:57:05.639 --> 00:57:09.300
And so the kids, because they're hippies, they don't wear shoes

1273
00:57:09.300 --> 00:57:11.820
and they've gone out and trodden on the thing and they've burned

1274
00:57:11.820 --> 00:57:12.239
themselves.

1275
00:57:12.300 --> 00:57:15.360
And so they've somehow made it back into the shuttle.

1276
00:57:15.420 --> 00:57:18.420
But Adam has died 1st because he's had an apple.

1277
00:57:18.420 --> 00:57:21.360
And then Severn dies because no reason.

1278
00:57:21.360 --> 00:57:23.099
Because he's insane.

1279
00:57:23.099 --> 00:57:24.719
Because he's insane.

1280
00:57:24.719 --> 00:57:27.119
And insane people who can tell what they do.

1281
00:57:27.179 --> 00:57:28.860
They do insane things.

1282
00:57:28.920 --> 00:57:31.199
Oh, like...

1283
00:57:31.199 --> 00:57:34.019
No, I once went on a date with a really cute bloke, right?

1284
00:57:34.079 --> 00:57:38.460
properly gorgeous bloke, he had a terrible case of athlete's foot

1285
00:57:38.519 --> 00:57:39.300
looked a bit like that.

1286
00:57:39.360 --> 00:57:41.940
Unfortunately, it couldn't last between us.

1287
00:57:42.000 --> 00:57:42.840
Sorry.

1288
00:57:43.079 --> 00:57:44.699
Yeah, yeah.

1289
00:57:44.760 --> 00:57:47.760
I'm not taking it, she's greater to anyone's feet.

1290
00:57:48.960 --> 00:57:51.000
But that is nasty.

1291
00:57:51.059 --> 00:57:52.800
Yeah, look at what is going on now?

1292
00:57:52.860 --> 00:57:54.719
Yeah, that makes no sense.

1293
00:57:54.780 --> 00:57:56.159
We're not leaving.

1294
00:57:56.219 --> 00:57:58.199
We're in Eden, even though it's toxic.

1295
00:57:58.260 --> 00:58:00.780
I'm going to kill myself the end.

1296
00:58:00.840 --> 00:58:02.099
What?

1297
00:58:02.099 --> 00:58:02.579
Yeah.

1298
00:58:02.579 --> 00:58:04.500
But he they're saying you'll kill yourself.

1299
00:58:04.559 --> 00:58:05.460
Do you know what you're doing?

1300
00:58:05.579 --> 00:58:08.340
And then he kills himself, then he goes, wow, that's like acid.

1301
00:58:08.519 --> 00:58:12.659
And then they really mean to Irina. you know, like, don't be mean

1302
00:58:12.659 --> 00:58:13.980
to her like, that's terrible.

1303
00:58:14.760 --> 00:58:16.679
Dr. Severin.

1304
00:58:16.739 --> 00:58:20.699
I'm sorry, you were too evil to be allowed to stay alive. evil to

1305
00:58:20.699 --> 00:58:20.880
live.

1306
00:58:20.940 --> 00:58:21.539
Yeah.

1307
00:58:21.780 --> 00:58:24.000
I like his pants though.

1308
00:58:24.059 --> 00:58:26.820
I was thinking that as well, you know.

1309
00:58:27.059 --> 00:58:29.219
It's probably hippie stuff.

1310
00:58:29.280 --> 00:58:31.199
Like, I thought that were, you know, like the trousers.

1311
00:58:31.260 --> 00:58:34.260
We've got a hippie stall in the market in town.

1312
00:58:34.320 --> 00:58:36.539
When you come with it, you can get pants.

1313
00:58:36.599 --> 00:58:37.679
We'll go and get some pants.

1314
00:58:37.739 --> 00:58:39.119
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1315
00:58:39.179 --> 00:58:43.139
We'll have a dress up, wait to Eden day while you're here.

1316
00:58:43.199 --> 00:58:44.880
Yeah, absolutely. brilliant.

1317
00:58:46.199 --> 00:58:50.039
Okay, so are we going to reach a conclusion on the bridge now?

1318
00:58:50.039 --> 00:58:52.679
Like we normally do, look out off the camera and tell us the

1319
00:58:52.679 --> 00:58:53.039
moral?

1320
00:58:53.099 --> 00:58:58.860
No, but there is what I said before is actually a nice moment

1321
00:58:58.860 --> 00:59:03.179
which is Spock validating them, even though they've been

1322
00:59:03.179 --> 00:59:04.980
incredibly murderous.

1323
00:59:05.039 --> 00:59:08.280
You know, like even though she knew that everyone was going to be

1324
00:59:08.280 --> 00:59:08.639
killed.

1325
00:59:08.699 --> 00:59:10.619
We've forgotten that.

1326
00:59:10.619 --> 00:59:14.639
And we get a moment of generosity from Spock.

1327
00:59:14.699 --> 00:59:17.760
And a really cute moment with, um...

1328
00:59:17.760 --> 00:59:18.599
My mouth though, is there?

1329
00:59:18.659 --> 00:59:22.019
When everyone's been just horrid to them for a hour.

1330
00:59:22.079 --> 00:59:25.139
Oh, immediately, they have turned out to be evil, but...

1331
00:59:25.260 --> 00:59:27.659
Well, yeah, yeah, Spark hasn't been horrid to them, though.

1332
00:59:27.719 --> 00:59:30.360
He's been sympathetic all the way through and that counts for

1333
00:59:30.360 --> 00:59:30.659
something.

1334
00:59:30.719 --> 00:59:32.760
Except to Dr. Vedrin.

1335
00:59:32.820 --> 00:59:36.119
Yeah, yeah, but Jim, that man is insane.

1336
00:59:36.239 --> 00:59:37.019
Insane.

1337
00:59:37.019 --> 00:59:37.559
I know.

1338
00:59:37.619 --> 00:59:37.980
I know.

1339
00:59:38.039 --> 00:59:38.940
Yeah.

1340
00:59:38.940 --> 00:59:40.739
I think this is huge.

1341
00:59:40.739 --> 00:59:42.840
Oh, be incorrect.

1342
00:59:42.840 --> 00:59:43.559
Occasionally.

1343
00:59:43.619 --> 00:59:45.780
I think you say that to me every now and again, you know.

1344
00:59:45.840 --> 00:59:47.219
No, it's really cute.

1345
00:59:47.280 --> 00:59:52.199
She says be incorrect occasionally and he says you be correct and

1346
00:59:52.199 --> 00:59:56.639
she just smiles naughtily and says occasionally, which I just

1347
00:59:56.639 --> 00:59:57.719
think is adorable.

1348
00:59:57.780 --> 00:59:59.639
That's quite charming, you know.

1349
00:59:59.699 --> 01:00:04.139
And then what Spock says to her is, it's my sincere wish that you

1350
01:00:04.139 --> 01:00:06.900
do not give up your search for Eden or whatever.

1351
01:00:06.960 --> 01:00:09.780
I have no doubt, but then you will find it or make it yourselves.

1352
01:00:09.840 --> 01:00:10.800
I think that's beautiful.

1353
01:00:10.860 --> 01:00:11.880
You know, like that?

1354
01:00:11.940 --> 01:00:15.599
This doesn't work because she was part of the people that knocked

1355
01:00:15.599 --> 01:00:18.119
everybody out that was willing to kill everybody.

1356
01:00:18.179 --> 01:00:19.980
So why does she get a redemptive ending?

1357
01:00:20.039 --> 01:00:23.519
So the so the episode doesn't work.

1358
01:00:23.579 --> 01:00:26.159
There's 2 things happening in it.

1359
01:00:26.219 --> 01:00:27.179
Do you know what I mean?

1360
01:00:27.239 --> 01:00:31.079
And so it's super like hostile and the children are terrible and

1361
01:00:31.079 --> 01:00:31.500
all of that.

1362
01:00:31.559 --> 01:00:32.880
He's a crap joke at the end.

1363
01:00:33.000 --> 01:00:35.460
Produced by Fred Freiburger.

1364
01:00:35.519 --> 01:00:36.179
Yeah, we know.

1365
01:00:36.179 --> 01:00:36.840
All right.

1366
01:00:36.900 --> 01:00:37.920
We realise that.

1367
01:00:37.980 --> 01:00:39.659
You didn't have to put off the caption.

1368
01:00:39.719 --> 01:00:41.579
Jesus Christ.

1369
01:00:41.639 --> 01:00:43.380
Ooh, I don't know what?

1370
01:00:43.440 --> 01:00:45.300
The season three, let's see what we get.

1371
01:00:45.360 --> 01:00:48.239
We get the, the, is that Home Goss destroy?

1372
01:00:48.300 --> 01:00:51.000
No, who mourns for Adonise, I think.

1373
01:00:51.059 --> 01:00:53.880
Oh, a nice little sort of space station there with the enterprise

1374
01:00:53.880 --> 01:00:54.360
coming away.

1375
01:00:54.420 --> 01:00:55.440
Oh yeah, there you go.

1376
01:00:55.500 --> 01:00:56.760
Girl one and girl two.

1377
01:00:56.820 --> 01:00:57.480
You were right.

1378
01:00:57.539 --> 01:00:58.679
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1379
01:01:01.559 --> 01:01:05.280
Do you know the thing I'll probably take away from this beyond

1380
01:01:05.280 --> 01:01:08.940
those horrible scabby feet is girl number one on her bicycle

1381
01:01:08.940 --> 01:01:09.239
wheel?

1382
01:01:09.360 --> 01:01:11.579
Yeah, I think she is quite good.

1383
01:01:11.639 --> 01:01:13.679
I, like, I, that music wasn't terrible.

1384
01:01:13.739 --> 01:01:17.280
Like, you know, like I thought that was nice and at least they

1385
01:01:17.280 --> 01:01:19.679
weren't singing. she had a beautiful voice as well.

1386
01:01:19.739 --> 01:01:24.179
Do you know, in our discussions... girl one and girl two. did get

1387
01:01:24.179 --> 01:01:24.480
them right.

1388
01:01:24.539 --> 01:01:25.500
You did?

1389
01:01:25.559 --> 01:01:27.239
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1390
01:01:27.300 --> 01:01:28.980
Well done.

1391
01:01:29.039 --> 01:01:32.940
You won't just be dismissive in our very 1960s way.

1392
01:01:33.000 --> 01:01:34.320
You were in fact correct.

1393
01:01:34.380 --> 01:01:36.960
I knew that they were called go one and goal too, because I always

1394
01:01:36.960 --> 01:01:40.320
copy the cast down into my notes so that I kind of know who I'm

1395
01:01:40.320 --> 01:01:40.860
talking about.

1396
01:01:41.639 --> 01:01:46.679
And I just assumed that the blonde woman was girl one because she

1397
01:01:46.679 --> 01:01:50.159
gets to sing and is in it more, and I was right.

1398
01:01:50.219 --> 01:01:54.239
I looked up Deborah Downey on memory Alfred, and that was her.

1399
01:01:54.300 --> 01:01:55.980
She's 75 now.

1400
01:01:56.039 --> 01:01:59.400
Oh, I bet she's super proud that she...

1401
01:01:59.400 --> 01:02:01.619
I hope she strung her bicycle wheel.

1402
01:02:01.679 --> 01:02:02.699
No, no, no.

1403
01:02:02.760 --> 01:02:06.960
One thing you have revealed to me in our discussions today is, yes

1404
01:02:06.960 --> 01:02:11.280
there is the bare bones of something competent having in terms of

1405
01:02:11.280 --> 01:02:13.019
plotting in this episode.

1406
01:02:13.559 --> 01:02:18.480
But it doesn't, it doesn't really change my opinion that even

1407
01:02:18.480 --> 01:02:24.480
though it is deliberately making these people really annoying all

1408
01:02:24.480 --> 01:02:24.719
this.

1409
01:02:24.780 --> 01:02:25.860
It's still really annoying.

1410
01:02:25.920 --> 01:02:26.880
They're still annoying.

1411
01:02:26.940 --> 01:02:31.800
And frankly, I would be happy to never watch this episode again.

1412
01:02:31.920 --> 01:02:33.539
I think I would watch it again.

1413
01:02:33.599 --> 01:02:36.480
I would certainly watch it before I watched, you know, whom gods

1414
01:02:36.480 --> 01:02:37.199
destroy again.

1415
01:02:37.260 --> 01:02:40.500
But it is so mean-spirited.

1416
01:02:40.559 --> 01:02:43.260
That's the thing that I dislike about it.

1417
01:02:43.320 --> 01:02:49.739
It's dismissive of kids generally and dismissive of a generation

1418
01:02:49.739 --> 01:02:54.179
of kids who protested Vietnam and stuff like that while their

1419
01:02:54.179 --> 01:02:59.880
parents were voting for people who were carpet bombing Southeast

1420
01:02:59.880 --> 01:03:00.599
Asia and stuff.

1421
01:03:00.659 --> 01:03:03.900
It's sort of a famous failure, this episode, isn't it?

1422
01:03:03.960 --> 01:03:07.320
Like it is a one that people point at and go, that is a

1423
01:03:07.320 --> 01:03:09.300
particularly bad episode.

1424
01:03:09.360 --> 01:03:10.199
Jimmy doing.

1425
01:03:10.260 --> 01:03:13.320
There's a quote from him in Memory Alpha, Major L. Barrett.

1426
01:03:13.380 --> 01:03:14.760
She said this was terrible as well.

1427
01:03:14.820 --> 01:03:17.460
And I said to you in the chat.

1428
01:03:17.519 --> 01:03:22.679
I said, this is clearly the work of a studio that does not realise

1429
01:03:22.679 --> 01:03:25.500
what they have on their hands.

1430
01:03:25.559 --> 01:03:29.340
They realise once the show is cancelled and the sets are destroyed

1431
01:03:29.340 --> 01:03:34.019
but they've got something that's massively popular and deserves to

1432
01:03:34.019 --> 01:03:36.960
have the best, the best writers, the best directors and all of

1433
01:03:36.960 --> 01:03:37.739
that pumped into it.

1434
01:03:37.800 --> 01:03:41.460
And this is just a show on its dying legs.

1435
01:03:41.519 --> 01:03:43.139
No one's really putting much into this.

1436
01:03:43.260 --> 01:03:49.440
But I think that, I think the problem is too, that who, who is

1437
01:03:49.440 --> 01:03:50.579
this for?

1438
01:03:50.639 --> 01:03:56.699
Like, because the people watching Star Trek are not the mums and

1439
01:03:56.699 --> 01:03:59.699
dads who think that the hippies are disgusting animals who should

1440
01:03:59.699 --> 01:04:03.000
be in cages, their kids are...

1441
01:04:03.000 --> 01:04:04.679
Isn't Star Trek angry?

1442
01:04:04.679 --> 01:04:05.639
Kids?

1443
01:04:05.699 --> 01:04:09.780
So why are we having an episode about how shit kids are and how

1444
01:04:09.780 --> 01:04:13.679
they're all communists and they'll kill you given half a chance, no

1445
01:04:13.679 --> 01:04:16.619
matter how enthusiastic they are about playing the guitar?

1446
01:04:16.679 --> 01:04:19.260
Like that just, that's ridiculous.

1447
01:04:19.320 --> 01:04:21.360
But it's like I said, you're in the middle of the episode.

1448
01:04:21.420 --> 01:04:26.340
If you're, if you're the sort of serious adult that genuinely has

1449
01:04:26.340 --> 01:04:28.679
objections to this, you're not going to see yourself in the

1450
01:04:28.679 --> 01:04:31.440
enterprise crew here, they're all pricks.

1451
01:04:31.559 --> 01:04:34.260
Yeah, and if you're a kid, you're not going to see yourself in the

1452
01:04:34.260 --> 01:04:35.039
hippies here.

1453
01:04:35.099 --> 01:04:38.159
So it's just failing to appeal on either side.

1454
01:04:38.219 --> 01:04:39.420
It's very odd.

1455
01:04:39.480 --> 01:04:39.840
Yeah.

1456
01:04:39.900 --> 01:04:40.800
So odd.

1457
01:04:40.860 --> 01:04:45.659
It is a failure, but like I wasn't bored as much as...

1458
01:04:45.659 --> 01:04:52.380
And, you know, like it did seem to be doing something to be about

1459
01:04:52.380 --> 01:04:55.739
something and to have a plot and reversals and things that seemed

1460
01:04:55.739 --> 01:04:58.860
like a reasonably competent episode, but I just can't get over how

1461
01:04:58.860 --> 01:05:01.619
mean and miserable it is.

1462
01:05:01.679 --> 01:05:03.420
I think that's unforgivable.

1463
01:05:03.480 --> 01:05:07.079
I mean, I didn't get a huge amount of entertainment from this

1464
01:05:07.079 --> 01:05:11.039
aside from talking to you about it, but I did get an enormous

1465
01:05:11.039 --> 01:05:13.920
amount of entertainment from those enormous purple eyebrows.

1466
01:05:21.000 --> 01:05:25.019
All right, it's the end of the episode and it's time for us to

1467
01:05:25.019 --> 01:05:26.880
find out where we're going next.

1468
01:05:26.940 --> 01:05:32.340
This was my choice, the way to Eden, up to my usual standard, and

1469
01:05:32.340 --> 01:05:34.019
it's time for a course correction.

1470
01:05:34.079 --> 01:05:37.019
So it's your turn now.

1471
01:05:37.079 --> 01:05:39.480
What series are we choosing from?

1472
01:05:39.539 --> 01:05:43.320
I mean, if you want to go and make a cup of tea or something for

1473
01:05:43.320 --> 01:05:46.800
the next 5 minutes, because I want a better episode than the Way

1474
01:05:46.800 --> 01:05:49.860
to Eden, but I have chosen Star Trek Voyager.

1475
01:05:49.920 --> 01:05:51.420
So I may be here sometimes.

1476
01:05:51.480 --> 01:05:52.679
I don't know.

1477
01:05:55.500 --> 01:05:58.260
Okay, tea in hand, you're back.

1478
01:05:58.320 --> 01:05:58.739
Let's go.

1479
01:05:58.800 --> 01:05:59.400
Yeah.

1480
01:05:59.400 --> 01:06:03.539
Oh god, it's almost on par with the way to Eden.

1481
01:06:03.599 --> 01:06:05.699
No, we can't do this one, I'm afraid.

1482
01:06:05.760 --> 01:06:08.280
It's season seven, episode 18.

1483
01:06:08.519 --> 01:06:09.239
Season seven.

1484
01:06:09.300 --> 01:06:12.179
What is it about 90s trek and season seven?

1485
01:06:12.239 --> 01:06:13.800
Human error?

1486
01:06:13.860 --> 01:06:17.460
This is the great Chakotay 7 romance episode.

1487
01:06:17.519 --> 01:06:19.800
Yeah, that is a human era.

1488
01:06:19.860 --> 01:06:20.460
Don't do that.

1489
01:06:20.940 --> 01:06:23.280
We've already done this one.

1490
01:06:23.340 --> 01:06:26.219
We covered this episode on untitled Star Trek Project, episode

1491
01:06:26.219 --> 01:06:27.239
87.

1492
01:06:27.480 --> 01:06:31.739
That was season six, episode 22, Muse, which was a very good

1493
01:06:31.739 --> 01:06:32.159
episode.

1494
01:06:32.219 --> 01:06:32.940
Excellent.

1495
01:06:33.000 --> 01:06:34.079
Yeah.

1496
01:06:34.260 --> 01:06:38.940
Oh, no, we covered this one on title Star Trek Project episode

1497
01:06:38.940 --> 01:06:39.659
78.

1498
01:06:39.840 --> 01:06:41.760
We haven't done that many voyages.

1499
01:06:41.820 --> 01:06:42.300
Jesus.

1500
01:06:42.300 --> 01:06:42.960
No, no.

1501
01:06:43.019 --> 01:06:47.820
Season 6, episode 16 collective of the famous yellow lighting

1502
01:06:47.820 --> 01:06:48.300
gels.

1503
01:06:48.360 --> 01:06:49.500
You recall?

1504
01:06:49.500 --> 01:06:50.039
Boring.

1505
01:06:50.099 --> 01:06:50.940
Okay.

1506
01:06:51.000 --> 01:06:52.139
Oh no.

1507
01:06:55.739 --> 01:06:59.460
This is sort of infamously. a bit like I move along home

1508
01:06:59.460 --> 01:07:03.480
infamously like one of the least popular Voyager episodes.

1509
01:07:03.539 --> 01:07:06.900
Season two, episode six, twisted.

1510
01:07:06.960 --> 01:07:12.360
It's the one where the anomaly is moving really slowly through the

1511
01:07:12.360 --> 01:07:13.260
ship. the ship.

1512
01:07:13.320 --> 01:07:14.579
Yeah, less so boring.

1513
01:07:15.059 --> 01:07:15.239
No.

1514
01:07:15.300 --> 01:07:16.619
Oh what about this?

1515
01:07:16.679 --> 01:07:20.699
Season three, episode three, the shoot.

1516
01:07:20.760 --> 01:07:25.199
Now, this is the episode where they wanted to suggest there was

1517
01:07:25.199 --> 01:07:27.119
something a bit homerotic occurring.

1518
01:07:27.119 --> 01:07:28.920
Right.

1519
01:07:28.980 --> 01:07:33.480
Not quite, but I mean, we cut away. don't actually know.

1520
01:07:33.539 --> 01:07:37.440
It does have the wonderful bit where Kate jumps down the chute

1521
01:07:37.440 --> 01:07:39.179
with an enormous fucking gum.

1522
01:07:39.239 --> 01:07:41.159
It's kind of wonderful.

1523
01:07:42.179 --> 01:07:44.699
Unfortunately, I'll press the button again.

1524
01:07:44.760 --> 01:07:46.860
I'm sorry about that. miserable, I think, that one.

1525
01:07:46.920 --> 01:07:49.079
Oh, I thought we done this one.

1526
01:07:49.139 --> 01:07:52.139
Season three, episode 10 Warlord. we done that one?

1527
01:07:52.199 --> 01:07:55.380
Yeah, no, no, I think what happened was that we talked about it or

1528
01:07:55.380 --> 01:07:58.380
we would, there was a KS episode or something and I'd watched it

1529
01:07:58.380 --> 01:07:59.880
recently and so we did talk about it.

1530
01:07:59.940 --> 01:08:04.260
So we have mentioned it on the show, but we haven't done it.

1531
01:08:04.980 --> 01:08:09.059
I realise saying this after saying that Harry Kim and Tom Paris

1532
01:08:09.059 --> 01:08:10.980
may have got up to something in the shoe.

1533
01:08:11.039 --> 01:08:14.460
I could be wrong, but this is the episode that suggests there's an

1534
01:08:14.460 --> 01:08:18.239
element of bisexuality to Kez when she's taken over by the evil

1535
01:08:18.239 --> 01:08:23.220
Kieron and is having a relationship with both the mistress and the

1536
01:08:23.220 --> 01:08:24.359
husband. is amazing.

1537
01:08:25.020 --> 01:08:29.399
However, I have rolled again and I would like to do this episode.

1538
01:08:29.460 --> 01:08:33.180
I do remember it being great and it does feature Cisca.

1539
01:08:33.239 --> 01:08:36.060
So automatic gold star for that.

1540
01:08:36.119 --> 01:08:38.100
And she's great in it.

1541
01:08:38.159 --> 01:08:43.199
No, it's season two, episode 11, manoeuvres.

1542
01:08:43.260 --> 01:08:44.939
Ooh, excellent.

1543
01:08:45.000 --> 01:08:46.380
It's a great episode.

1544
01:08:46.439 --> 01:08:48.960
I think this is the one where she comes up at the end and goes

1545
01:08:48.960 --> 01:08:50.279
hello, Chakoti.

1546
01:08:50.340 --> 01:08:55.020
I just wanted to let you know I'm pregnant. wonderful.

1547
01:08:55.140 --> 01:08:56.699
Soap conference twist.

1548
01:08:56.760 --> 01:09:02.819
It's the one where where the Kazon do a terrorist raid on Voyager

1549
01:09:02.819 --> 01:09:08.819
and literally punch a shuttle into Voyager side and steal a load

1550
01:09:08.819 --> 01:09:09.420
of technology.

1551
01:09:09.479 --> 01:09:13.199
And it was the point where basically they said series 2 isn't

1552
01:09:13.199 --> 01:09:17.819
working. we need to up the action and make this show a bit more

1553
01:09:17.819 --> 01:09:18.600
exciting.

1554
01:09:18.840 --> 01:09:19.920
And this was the 1st one.

1555
01:09:19.979 --> 01:09:22.859
You got Deadlock and others coming after this.

1556
01:09:22.920 --> 01:09:26.460
But yeah, I think it's an interesting one to talk about.

1557
01:09:26.520 --> 01:09:28.680
And it's another season 21 and we do like season two.

1558
01:09:28.739 --> 01:09:30.180
That'd be fun.

1559
01:09:30.239 --> 01:09:31.680
Excellent, brilliant. lets do that.

1560
01:09:31.739 --> 01:09:32.460
Let's do it.

1561
01:09:40.260 --> 01:09:44.220
You've been listening to Untitled Star Trek Project with Joe Ford

1562
01:09:44.220 --> 01:09:48.359
and Nathan Bottomley, where online at Untitled Star Trek Project

1563
01:09:47.460 --> 01:09:51.000
com, where you can find subscription links and links to our social

1564
01:09:51.000 --> 01:09:51.840
media accounts.

1565
01:09:51.899 --> 01:09:56.159
Our podcast artwork is by Kayla Sisrin, and the theme was composed

1566
01:09:56.159 --> 01:09:57.600
by Cameron Lamb.

1567
01:09:57.659 --> 01:10:02.159
This episode was recorded on the 7th of January 2025 and released

1568
01:10:02.159 --> 01:10:03.479
on the 10th of January.

1569
01:10:03.539 --> 01:10:07.800
We'll see you next time for Star Trek Voyager, manoeuvres.

1570
01:10:25.859 --> 01:10:27.479
Now, he's been watching...

1571
01:10:27.479 --> 01:10:31.079
Don't come at me for this, all right?

1572
01:10:31.140 --> 01:10:35.579
He's been watching Heartstopper, and I just can't watch it.

1573
01:10:35.640 --> 01:10:38.939
I just did that. so sweet. fucking nice.

1574
01:10:39.180 --> 01:10:40.920
I hate them all.

1575
01:10:40.979 --> 01:10:44.579
I said, this would be the worst friendship group ever possibly for

1576
01:10:44.579 --> 01:10:45.000
the same reason.

1577
01:10:45.060 --> 01:10:47.579
He just hates it because everything's so nice.

1578
01:10:47.640 --> 01:10:52.560
I think the boy, the boy that was in the Agatha show, I just think

1579
01:10:52.560 --> 01:10:54.479
he's unbearably twee.

1580
01:10:54.899 --> 01:10:56.279
Yeah.

1581
01:10:56.340 --> 01:10:57.840
No, I mean, I really like it.

1582
01:10:57.899 --> 01:11:00.300
I think it is very sweet. and I think it captures something that

1583
01:11:00.300 --> 01:11:03.420
we never got to experience or I never got to experience, which I

1584
01:11:03.420 --> 01:11:04.020
kind of like.

1585
01:11:04.079 --> 01:11:05.340
I think that's sort of sweet.

1586
01:11:05.399 --> 01:11:08.819
And I always love the sort of school thing, but I liked, love

1587
01:11:08.819 --> 01:11:11.279
Victor better, which is on Disney.

1588
01:11:11.399 --> 01:11:14.340
Yeah, I saw a trailer for that and I thought...

1589
01:11:14.399 --> 01:11:17.220
Actually, I enjoyed the, because you know me, I don't really get

1590
01:11:17.220 --> 01:11:20.520
on with gay programs very much, but I really enjoyed that

1591
01:11:20.520 --> 01:11:23.640
ridiculous film he made me watch, red, white, and...

1592
01:11:23.640 --> 01:11:26.760
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1593
01:11:27.720 --> 01:11:31.619
But they just had such great chemistry in that movie, like hot

1594
01:11:31.619 --> 01:11:32.340
chemistry.

1595
01:11:32.399 --> 01:11:37.079
Well, so love Victor, like his kids at school and stuff, and there

1596
01:11:37.079 --> 01:11:40.020
was a, there was a show called Love Simon, which was based on this

1597
01:11:40.020 --> 01:11:40.500
book.

1598
01:11:40.680 --> 01:11:43.560
Um, you know, like a young adults book.

1599
01:11:43.560 --> 01:11:48.539
And it's like this kid who has an email relationship with this guy

1600
01:11:48.539 --> 01:11:50.880
and they eventually kind of fall in love, but he doesn't know who

1601
01:11:50.880 --> 01:11:51.300
he is.

1602
01:11:51.359 --> 01:11:54.060
They're both anonymous to each other and they know that they both

1603
01:11:54.060 --> 01:11:56.220
go to the same school, but they don't know who they are.

1604
01:11:56.279 --> 01:12:00.300
Um, and it's really good and it's very sweet and he comes out to

1605
01:12:00.300 --> 01:12:03.600
his parents and they're, everyone's sort of very middle class and

1606
01:12:03.600 --> 01:12:08.460
very kind of, you know, um, Jennifer Garner is his mother, for

1607
01:12:08.460 --> 01:12:09.000
God's sake.

1608
01:12:09.060 --> 01:12:09.720
Do you know what I mean?

1609
01:12:09.840 --> 01:12:11.640
Like, it's all fine.

1610
01:12:11.699 --> 01:12:19.260
Um, and so love Victor stars. with Victor talking to Simon.

1611
01:12:19.319 --> 01:12:22.680
So Simon's left and gone to university and stuff and Victor has

1612
01:12:22.680 --> 01:12:26.579
just moved from to Texas from somewhere.

1613
01:12:27.000 --> 01:12:28.680
No, they in Georgia.

1614
01:12:28.739 --> 01:12:30.180
I can't remember that, the southern state.

1615
01:12:30.239 --> 01:12:35.039
But he's family's Latino and he's can't come out and like he's

1616
01:12:35.039 --> 01:12:37.199
saying it's all right for you being this sort of white middle

1617
01:12:37.199 --> 01:12:40.739
class kid and everything turned out very well for you, but it's

1618
01:12:40.739 --> 01:12:42.479
actually harder for the rest of us.

1619
01:12:42.479 --> 01:12:43.560
And it's really good.

1620
01:12:43.619 --> 01:12:45.420
Like, I think that's really properly good.

1621
01:12:45.420 --> 01:12:54.239
And it's, um, got wrecks from, um, Torchwood Miracle Day, is the

1622
01:12:54.239 --> 01:12:55.680
father of one of the characters.

1623
01:12:55.739 --> 01:12:58.260
Um, what bit?

1624
01:12:58.800 --> 01:13:00.659
So one bit of really made me set up.

1625
01:13:00.720 --> 01:13:03.960
Because he's had been, what, he's watching series 3 now.

1626
01:13:04.020 --> 01:13:05.460
So he's been watching it for a couple of weeks.

1627
01:13:05.520 --> 01:13:09.300
I'm sort of in and out the room, but never really watching it. was

1628
01:13:09.300 --> 01:13:09.840
the brother.

1629
01:13:09.960 --> 01:13:10.979
It was such a prick.

1630
01:13:11.039 --> 01:13:14.340
And I was like, oh, finally, someone I can get beyond someone

1631
01:13:14.340 --> 01:13:15.300
instead of hosta.

1632
01:13:15.359 --> 01:13:16.319
Yeah, there's something.

1633
01:13:16.380 --> 01:13:23.579
But, but I mean, I think, like, I think because, like, it's the

1634
01:13:23.579 --> 01:13:26.399
1st kind of thing quite like this.

1635
01:13:26.460 --> 01:13:27.899
I for me.

1636
01:13:27.899 --> 01:13:29.460
It's for kids.

1637
01:13:29.460 --> 01:13:33.840
And it needs to be not, we're going to have a terrible time all

1638
01:13:33.840 --> 01:13:34.260
the time.

1639
01:13:34.319 --> 01:13:35.220
Do you know what I mean?

1640
01:13:35.279 --> 01:13:37.439
It's got to be, we will find nice people.

1641
01:13:37.500 --> 01:13:42.659
And, like, I even found that, like, he, like, I even found that

1642
01:13:42.659 --> 01:13:47.579
there's enough homophobia and stuff directed at him at least in

1643
01:13:47.579 --> 01:13:52.619
series one, um, that I actually found that kind of, oh, oh, still

1644
01:13:52.619 --> 01:13:57.119
you know, like, still, um, so there was some obstacles to

1645
01:13:57.119 --> 01:13:57.659
overcome.

1646
01:13:57.720 --> 01:14:00.659
But it is very gentle and very nice.

1647
01:14:00.720 --> 01:14:04.199
I like all the animation they put in.

1648
01:14:04.260 --> 01:14:06.899
That's really nicely done and it's genuinely emotional.

1649
01:14:07.020 --> 01:14:09.239
Obviously, they choose it for the right moments.

1650
01:14:09.359 --> 01:14:13.500
There's that, there was that great bit where, oh, God, hated the

1651
01:14:13.500 --> 01:14:18.420
speech where we went up to that kid outside the school and went

1652
01:14:18.420 --> 01:14:21.359
it's not okay for what you did to me and all that, and it's just

1653
01:14:21.359 --> 01:14:24.180
you know, triumphant moment where he finally stands up to this

1654
01:14:24.180 --> 01:14:24.960
awful kid.

1655
01:14:25.020 --> 01:14:30.720
And then this rainbow sort of road came towards the kids who was

1656
01:14:30.720 --> 01:14:34.319
pushing away his sexuality and he just sort of walks away from the

1657
01:14:34.319 --> 01:14:34.859
rainbow.

1658
01:14:34.920 --> 01:14:37.439
And I thought, that's really, that's very nice.

1659
01:14:37.500 --> 01:14:41.399
So it's a graphic series of graphic novels, which I've then read.

1660
01:14:41.460 --> 01:14:42.180
Do you know what I mean?

1661
01:14:42.239 --> 01:14:46.979
And they're great and um, And like I'm looking forward to the

1662
01:14:46.979 --> 01:14:49.199
final one, which is coming out later this year.