WEBVTT

NOTE
This transcript was created on 2026-05-01 at 19:52:47

1
00:00:21.899 --> 00:00:24.420
Hey, Joe. Hi.

2
00:00:24.480 --> 00:00:31.079
So, we are now doing our second enterprise episode, and in our 1st

3
00:00:31.079 --> 00:00:38.460
episode, Strange New World, I think we were a bit negative.

4
00:00:38.520 --> 00:00:39.539
Yeah, yeah.

5
00:00:39.600 --> 00:00:43.799
But we decided to go for it again because we really wanted an

6
00:00:43.799 --> 00:00:47.700
episode that kind of showcases, enterprises, strengths.

7
00:00:47.759 --> 00:00:52.020
How do you feel about this episode generally, do you think?

8
00:00:52.140 --> 00:00:56.880
Well, can, is it congenital or congenital?

9
00:00:56.939 --> 00:00:57.840
cogenitor.

10
00:00:57.899 --> 00:00:58.799
Yeah, co-genitor.

11
00:00:59.159 --> 00:01:00.420
You did that so well.

12
00:01:00.479 --> 00:01:04.620
I thought this was way better.

13
00:01:04.680 --> 00:01:06.000
Strange New Worlds.

14
00:01:06.060 --> 00:01:09.599
It provided you and me with a lot of talking points.

15
00:01:09.659 --> 00:01:11.700
We've already discussed this quite a bit.

16
00:01:11.760 --> 00:01:16.260
Whereas, you know, there was so little of substance to Strange New

17
00:01:16.260 --> 00:01:16.739
World.

18
00:01:16.799 --> 00:01:19.140
We couldn't even find anything to talk about whilst we were

19
00:01:19.140 --> 00:01:19.560
watching it.

20
00:01:19.620 --> 00:01:20.819
No.

21
00:01:20.879 --> 00:01:23.579
What's really interesting about cogenitories.

22
00:01:23.640 --> 00:01:28.379
I think this is the point where enterprise starts to tip in the

23
00:01:28.379 --> 00:01:33.659
other direction, quality wise, because this is followed up with, so

24
00:01:33.659 --> 00:01:34.500
the rest of the season.

25
00:01:34.560 --> 00:01:39.239
Yeah, uh, we're, it's what, season 2, episode 22.

26
00:01:40.260 --> 00:01:40.680
Yeah.

27
00:01:40.739 --> 00:01:42.180
I'm doing your bit now, sorry.

28
00:01:42.900 --> 00:01:46.859
But what comes next is Regeneration, which is a Borg episode, which

29
00:01:46.859 --> 00:01:47.700
is very strong.

30
00:01:47.760 --> 00:01:52.859
First flight, which explains a lot about Archer's past, and that's

31
00:01:52.859 --> 00:01:53.760
a really strong episode.

32
00:01:53.819 --> 00:01:59.280
There's bouncy, which is a bit... crap, if I'm modest, and then

33
00:01:59.280 --> 00:02:03.540
it's the expanse, which I've watched this week, and it's very much

34
00:02:03.540 --> 00:02:09.060
a bit of a jarring, like hard reboot for the series, but

35
00:02:09.060 --> 00:02:13.080
definitely like tips it in a very dramatic direction.

36
00:02:13.199 --> 00:02:18.539
So I watched the expanse, I watched the 1st 2 episodes of season 3

37
00:02:18.539 --> 00:02:23.699
and it's definitely the show turning a corner in a positive way

38
00:02:23.699 --> 00:02:27.599
and suddenly becoming TV that's actually genuinely worth turning

39
00:02:27.599 --> 00:02:27.960
up for.

40
00:02:28.020 --> 00:02:34.259
Uh, I watched the Zindi and anomaly, and anomaly is just a very

41
00:02:34.259 --> 00:02:36.659
very good episode of Star Trek.

42
00:02:36.719 --> 00:02:41.520
And during season three, I know there's a there's a 3 parter

43
00:02:41.520 --> 00:02:45.180
towards the end of series 3, which I remembered as I was watching

44
00:02:45.180 --> 00:02:49.439
anomaly, which features the Enterprise literally being blasted to

45
00:02:49.439 --> 00:02:54.539
buggery and them limping through this region of space, the Delphic

46
00:02:54.539 --> 00:02:58.620
expanse, basically coming apart of the seams and, you know

47
00:02:58.620 --> 00:03:03.180
completely, um, like it looks like it's all over, you know?

48
00:03:03.240 --> 00:03:05.159
It's really fantastic TV.

49
00:03:05.159 --> 00:03:09.000
And it's not the sort of thing you would expect Enterprise to

50
00:03:09.000 --> 00:03:13.139
deliver after the Yawnathon that is seasons one and two.

51
00:03:13.800 --> 00:03:19.500
And I think this is the point where they realised enterprise

52
00:03:19.500 --> 00:03:22.439
needed to have something to say in order to be good TV.

53
00:03:22.979 --> 00:03:24.360
And they do it in this.

54
00:03:24.419 --> 00:03:28.560
I'm not sure what they say in this is worth hearing because it's a

55
00:03:28.560 --> 00:03:31.979
bit troubling, as I'm sure you're going to talk about later on.

56
00:03:32.039 --> 00:03:36.360
But when they hit the expanse, they're absolutely doing a 911

57
00:03:36.360 --> 00:03:37.319
analogy.

58
00:03:37.439 --> 00:03:37.860
Yeah.

59
00:03:37.860 --> 00:03:43.259
And they are exploring the sort of the morally gray areas of

60
00:03:43.259 --> 00:03:46.620
reacting to that in season three.

61
00:03:46.680 --> 00:03:49.740
And so suddenly Enterprise is it's working on a different level

62
00:03:49.740 --> 00:03:50.520
than before.

63
00:03:50.580 --> 00:03:52.620
It's not just kind of vanilla Star Trek.

64
00:03:52.680 --> 00:03:55.560
It is saying something. that's a good thing.

65
00:03:55.680 --> 00:04:00.479
Yeah, no, and that's what we think the best of Star Trek does.

66
00:04:00.539 --> 00:04:04.259
I mean, you know, we forget that there's all sorts of terrible

67
00:04:04.259 --> 00:04:07.139
nonsense in there as well and space things and all of that.

68
00:04:07.199 --> 00:04:08.699
We love that as well.

69
00:04:08.759 --> 00:04:10.500
Well, of course we do.

70
00:04:10.560 --> 00:04:12.240
That's why we're here.

71
00:04:12.300 --> 00:04:16.259
But it also has things to say, and that's one of the things that

72
00:04:16.259 --> 00:04:17.759
we love about it.

73
00:04:17.819 --> 00:04:19.139
Here.

74
00:04:19.199 --> 00:04:23.279
I'm pretty certain the things that it has to say are really true.

75
00:04:23.459 --> 00:04:26.639
And I will get quite cross about it later, I think.

76
00:04:27.240 --> 00:04:30.779
This episode is written by Berman and Braga, isn't it?

77
00:04:30.839 --> 00:04:34.500
So this is, and, you know, and like I said, they wrote so much of

78
00:04:34.500 --> 00:04:35.459
the 1st 2 series.

79
00:04:35.519 --> 00:04:42.360
They also wrote stigma this season, which is the HIV AIDS story

80
00:04:42.360 --> 00:04:44.459
which they were asked to do.

81
00:04:44.519 --> 00:04:46.920
It shows you how much they were willing to do something like

82
00:04:46.920 --> 00:04:47.160
that.

83
00:04:47.220 --> 00:04:48.540
They were actually asked to do that.

84
00:04:48.600 --> 00:04:50.339
It wasn't anything they wanted to do.

85
00:04:50.399 --> 00:04:54.120
And the things they have to say about that, and I'm speaking as

86
00:04:54.120 --> 00:05:00.060
somebody whose ex-partner had HIV, I find it truly insulting.

87
00:05:00.120 --> 00:05:03.720
And there's a line at the end of this about a baby not being born

88
00:05:03.720 --> 00:05:05.339
which I think you're going to talk about.

89
00:05:05.879 --> 00:05:12.540
I mean, there's some there's some troubling opinions. embedded

90
00:05:12.540 --> 00:05:14.160
into Star Trek at this point, isn't it?

91
00:05:14.279 --> 00:05:15.779
Yeah, yeah.

92
00:05:15.839 --> 00:05:17.759
I think it is complex.

93
00:05:17.819 --> 00:05:22.860
Like, I think that the what the episode actually lands on is a

94
00:05:22.860 --> 00:05:30.660
problem, but it does at least properly present both ideas, you

95
00:05:30.660 --> 00:05:35.759
know, and it gives us perhaps the most sympathetic character to

96
00:05:35.759 --> 00:05:41.160
explore of the kind of idea that oppression needs to be remedied

97
00:05:41.160 --> 00:05:46.259
and and that it's not okay just because it's another culture or

98
00:05:46.259 --> 00:05:46.620
whatever.

99
00:05:46.680 --> 00:05:51.480
It's not okay to just sit back and you know, do nothing.

100
00:05:51.899 --> 00:05:56.939
It's a world away from the trip of strange new world.

101
00:05:57.000 --> 00:05:57.600
Yeah, isn't it?

102
00:05:57.660 --> 00:06:01.259
Horrible, angry, racist trip from a strange new world.

103
00:06:01.319 --> 00:06:03.480
What is strange you won't have to say anyway?

104
00:06:03.959 --> 00:06:07.439
Are the rock monsters of this away mission real or not?

105
00:06:07.500 --> 00:06:10.019
You know, like...

106
00:06:10.079 --> 00:06:12.899
Well, I mean, we talked about that, but yes, essentially it's just

107
00:06:12.899 --> 00:06:15.959
a procedural and it doesn't have a very interesting problem to

108
00:06:15.959 --> 00:06:16.560
solve.

109
00:06:16.620 --> 00:06:19.079
But also, very quickly before we jump in.

110
00:06:19.139 --> 00:06:20.399
Very, very quickly.

111
00:06:20.459 --> 00:06:23.279
Because I know I can see you on your face now, and that's what you

112
00:06:23.279 --> 00:06:24.000
were just about to say.

113
00:06:24.060 --> 00:06:25.319
Should we jump into the episode?

114
00:06:25.379 --> 00:06:28.319
I just want to very quickly talk about Archer.

115
00:06:28.379 --> 00:06:30.660
Now we'll talk about him within the episode itself.

116
00:06:30.720 --> 00:06:35.759
But I want to talk about what an incredible shithead that

117
00:06:35.759 --> 00:06:36.360
character is.

118
00:06:37.259 --> 00:06:41.519
Wherever you're watching in the show, I think it's the biggest

119
00:06:41.519 --> 00:06:46.079
sticking point of enterprise, that he is a nasty bit of work

120
00:06:46.079 --> 00:06:47.220
Archer.

121
00:06:47.279 --> 00:06:53.459
And it's very surprising to see somebody this unlikeable, um

122
00:06:53.459 --> 00:06:55.199
spearheading a Star Trek show.

123
00:06:55.259 --> 00:07:00.000
Now, within this episode, he has a lot of moments where I know you

124
00:07:00.000 --> 00:07:00.720
struggled with him.

125
00:07:00.779 --> 00:07:06.720
But then we hit the expanse and suddenly he's angry archer going

126
00:07:06.720 --> 00:07:11.819
after the people that set this weapon off and murders 7000000

127
00:07:11.819 --> 00:07:12.060
people.

128
00:07:12.120 --> 00:07:16.740
And suddenly he's shoving people into airlocks and sucking them

129
00:07:16.740 --> 00:07:22.560
out into space and he's in this whole sort of like morally greyer

130
00:07:22.560 --> 00:07:24.779
which one, you know, I've seen them touch upon with Janeway and

131
00:07:24.779 --> 00:07:29.759
Cisco before, but it goes way further than you ever went with

132
00:07:29.759 --> 00:07:30.720
Cisco and Janeway.

133
00:07:30.779 --> 00:07:33.000
He's actively violent and unpleasant.

134
00:07:33.180 --> 00:07:38.339
And I remember in season 4, when they come back to earth in, it's

135
00:07:38.339 --> 00:07:41.639
called home, the episode, he goes up into the mountains and

136
00:07:41.639 --> 00:07:46.379
actually has a good long think about who the hell he is and what

137
00:07:46.379 --> 00:07:47.160
he's become.

138
00:07:47.220 --> 00:07:50.100
And the character is a lot better kind of after that.

139
00:07:50.160 --> 00:07:54.180
But really, He's a douchebag, isn't he?

140
00:07:56.040 --> 00:07:58.079
Oh, we'll get there.

141
00:07:58.139 --> 00:07:59.579
We'll definitely get there.

142
00:07:59.759 --> 00:08:02.279
All right, let's get started.

143
00:08:02.339 --> 00:08:03.899
I'll count us in.

144
00:08:03.959 --> 00:08:14.339
I'm on the 1st frame. 5, 4, 3, 2, one, and we're off.

145
00:08:14.399 --> 00:08:16.379
We are off.

146
00:08:17.399 --> 00:08:19.500
That's a beautiful shot.

147
00:08:19.560 --> 00:08:23.100
And there are some, there's some nice direction in this.

148
00:08:23.160 --> 00:08:25.259
LeVar Burton is directing this episode.

149
00:08:25.500 --> 00:08:30.000
And as I said to you moments before we press record, I think his

150
00:08:30.000 --> 00:08:33.539
strengths are absolutely in directing character episodes rather

151
00:08:33.539 --> 00:08:34.620
than action.

152
00:08:34.679 --> 00:08:36.360
So this is his wheelhouse, for sure.

153
00:08:36.419 --> 00:08:42.659
So here is Tripp making some horrible banter with Tapol, which is

154
00:08:42.659 --> 00:08:46.200
still uncomfortable, but not as nasty as last time.

155
00:08:46.320 --> 00:08:49.379
There's kind of like knowing looks now, isn't it?

156
00:08:49.500 --> 00:08:54.059
raised eyebrows and it's a little less overtly racist and a little

157
00:08:54.059 --> 00:08:56.399
more it feels a bit more like banter.

158
00:08:56.460 --> 00:08:58.139
Yeah, yeah.

159
00:08:58.200 --> 00:09:01.620
I'd still found it just a little bit unpleasantly uncomfortable

160
00:09:01.620 --> 00:09:06.720
but it is the only thing in the episode about Tripp's performance

161
00:09:06.720 --> 00:09:07.799
that I dislike.

162
00:09:07.860 --> 00:09:10.980
I think he's magnificent in this, like really properly good.

163
00:09:11.039 --> 00:09:15.059
He's really sensitive in this, isn't he, Connor Trinit?

164
00:09:15.059 --> 00:09:18.000
and really sort of going forward from this point.

165
00:09:18.059 --> 00:09:21.059
Even when they try and make him angry because his sister dies in

166
00:09:21.059 --> 00:09:22.620
that terrorist attack.

167
00:09:22.740 --> 00:09:25.799
And they try and make him like this properly angry.

168
00:09:25.860 --> 00:09:31.679
But Conor Trinier is just so charming that he's still he's still

169
00:09:31.679 --> 00:09:32.460
quite likeable.

170
00:09:32.519 --> 00:09:34.080
What's that guy's name again?

171
00:09:34.139 --> 00:09:35.700
Travis.

172
00:09:35.759 --> 00:09:39.960
So Travis and Hoshi get nothing to do, Mayweather.

173
00:09:40.019 --> 00:09:41.220
Ah, goddamn it.

174
00:09:41.279 --> 00:09:42.179
You got it right, right?

175
00:09:42.600 --> 00:09:47.340
All right, so here we have Drenik, Captain Drenik, from the

176
00:09:47.340 --> 00:09:55.679
Visians, and he is Star Trek, um, sort of stalwart Andreas

177
00:09:55.679 --> 00:10:00.659
Katsulas, who played Tomalok in several episodes of Star Trek, The

178
00:10:00.659 --> 00:10:01.440
Next Generation.

179
00:10:01.500 --> 00:10:04.860
And he's in something called Babylon 5, which I've never heard

180
00:10:04.860 --> 00:10:05.100
of.

181
00:10:05.159 --> 00:10:07.559
He is the best thing about Babylon 5.

182
00:10:07.799 --> 00:10:12.299
The characters of Jakal Londo in, and it's the alien characters

183
00:10:12.299 --> 00:10:12.600
again.

184
00:10:12.659 --> 00:10:14.100
It's the Big Space 9 effect.

185
00:10:14.159 --> 00:10:16.379
It's the aliens characters that are the most interesting ones.

186
00:10:16.440 --> 00:10:23.639
Um, he's, he gives an incredibly subtle, incredibly nuanced

187
00:10:23.639 --> 00:10:24.960
performance in Babylon 5.

188
00:10:25.080 --> 00:10:28.919
And I don't often say nice things about that show, but he's very

189
00:10:28.919 --> 00:10:29.820
very good.

190
00:10:29.879 --> 00:10:30.659
Yeah.

191
00:10:30.720 --> 00:10:32.460
Well, he was always great in Star Trek.

192
00:10:32.519 --> 00:10:39.240
I think he's in 3 as a as a Romulan, as sort of very rare

193
00:10:39.240 --> 00:10:41.639
recurring character, and I think he's...

194
00:10:41.639 --> 00:10:42.240
Oh, here we go.

195
00:10:42.299 --> 00:10:43.080
Here we go.

196
00:10:43.919 --> 00:10:46.379
I love this road.

197
00:10:46.559 --> 00:10:49.799
Now my time is finally here.

198
00:10:49.860 --> 00:10:52.200
Just in case people can't, you know, obviously they can't hear

199
00:10:52.200 --> 00:10:52.440
this.

200
00:10:52.500 --> 00:10:54.720
So I'll just sing it for them.

201
00:10:54.779 --> 00:11:00.360
So I want to say, so I was super angry about this horrific

202
00:11:00.360 --> 00:11:05.700
colonialist, you know, great man, great white man of history, title

203
00:11:05.700 --> 00:11:06.360
sequence.

204
00:11:06.419 --> 00:11:08.399
You were pretty quiet about that, you know, last time.

205
00:11:08.519 --> 00:11:14.820
But I actually think that you can see where, you know, there are

206
00:11:14.820 --> 00:11:19.320
elements here that recur in the discovery titles, which I think

207
00:11:19.320 --> 00:11:22.799
are magnificent, but the idea that you have plans and blueprints

208
00:11:22.799 --> 00:11:23.580
and things like that.

209
00:11:23.639 --> 00:11:28.200
So you've got this archival footage, but there's these elements of

210
00:11:28.200 --> 00:11:34.379
sort of mostly maps, but also blueprints of flying machines and

211
00:11:34.379 --> 00:11:35.220
things like that.

212
00:11:35.279 --> 00:11:38.940
And I think that's really good and I love the discovery titles.

213
00:11:39.000 --> 00:11:41.940
So, you know, and they're trying something different.

214
00:11:42.000 --> 00:11:46.200
I just think having enterprise go past nebulas or something.

215
00:11:46.259 --> 00:11:48.000
They couldn't really do that again.

216
00:11:48.059 --> 00:11:50.519
And this is at least telling a story.

217
00:11:50.580 --> 00:11:54.960
What prodigy did, which was so interesting, I thought.

218
00:11:55.019 --> 00:11:59.220
It was, it let, and so the 2 things I love, you know, it was, um

219
00:11:59.220 --> 00:12:03.600
the ship's stately going through beautiful things, the Voyager

220
00:12:03.600 --> 00:12:07.379
effect, but also, as you pointed out to me, it's leaning to all of

221
00:12:07.379 --> 00:12:08.279
their characters as well.

222
00:12:08.340 --> 00:12:11.100
So it's saying something about all of their characters and I

223
00:12:11.100 --> 00:12:12.960
thought that was a really interesting approach.

224
00:12:13.019 --> 00:12:14.820
This, it's okay.

225
00:12:14.879 --> 00:12:17.220
I don't think it's ever going to be my favourite, especially

226
00:12:17.220 --> 00:12:18.120
because of that bloody song.

227
00:12:18.240 --> 00:12:19.740
I love the song.

228
00:12:19.799 --> 00:12:23.039
So you mentioned the lighting.

229
00:12:23.100 --> 00:12:26.940
So we actually have what looks like sunlight coming through the

230
00:12:26.940 --> 00:12:30.720
window and obviously that's what we do in discovery all the time

231
00:12:30.720 --> 00:12:34.440
but it isn't something that was done in 90s track.

232
00:12:34.559 --> 00:12:37.139
Well, I'm going to name 2 other episodes, right?

233
00:12:37.200 --> 00:12:40.860
Wrong starter than Deaf and Knight from DS9, which is set in

234
00:12:40.860 --> 00:12:45.899
during the occupation back when the station was orbiting Bajor.

235
00:12:45.960 --> 00:12:49.440
And it's even more striking than this because they used like a

236
00:12:49.440 --> 00:12:52.139
really strong light on the characters.

237
00:12:52.200 --> 00:12:54.899
So a lot of people are in silhouette in the sun.

238
00:12:54.960 --> 00:12:59.639
And also Voyager's survival instinct, which is the one episode

239
00:12:59.639 --> 00:13:05.220
that Ronald D.Moro for which are in series 6 and that's set in

240
00:13:05.220 --> 00:13:06.120
orbit of a planet.

241
00:13:06.179 --> 00:13:08.519
And every time they do it, it looks so good just like this.

242
00:13:08.580 --> 00:13:09.179
Yeah.

243
00:13:09.179 --> 00:13:13.320
Well, David Carson does it in generations and that team 10 forward

244
00:13:13.320 --> 00:13:13.980
looks amazing.

245
00:13:14.039 --> 00:13:21.059
So these 2 women, they're going for jobs as Fox News hosts, I

246
00:13:21.059 --> 00:13:21.299
think.

247
00:13:21.360 --> 00:13:23.639
We have these 2 extremely blonde women.

248
00:13:23.700 --> 00:13:26.700
They are sexually voracious as well.

249
00:13:26.759 --> 00:13:27.779
Honestly.

250
00:13:28.139 --> 00:13:32.879
You know, there is something about this that I actually like, and

251
00:13:32.879 --> 00:13:38.100
it's something that is to do with the premise of the show, which

252
00:13:38.100 --> 00:13:42.000
is this is the 1st ship that goes to explore.

253
00:13:42.059 --> 00:13:45.960
And this sort of thing where they're just discovering each other's

254
00:13:45.960 --> 00:13:48.899
culture, which looks like the B plot.

255
00:13:48.960 --> 00:13:53.039
I think it has an important function in the episode, but I also

256
00:13:53.039 --> 00:13:55.620
just think it gives so much texture.

257
00:13:55.740 --> 00:13:57.419
This is something that's different.

258
00:13:57.480 --> 00:14:01.620
You could sort of do the same thing with, say, uh, next

259
00:14:01.620 --> 00:14:02.340
generation.

260
00:14:02.399 --> 00:14:07.019
But the fact that these are the 1st people, I think, is really

261
00:14:07.019 --> 00:14:07.500
interesting.

262
00:14:07.799 --> 00:14:14.879
I, I quite like the fact that it's, it's an alien race similar but

263
00:14:14.879 --> 00:14:16.740
dissimilar to us.

264
00:14:16.799 --> 00:14:19.320
So like they're a humanoid, there's a little bit of latex there

265
00:14:19.320 --> 00:14:19.980
blah, blah, blah.

266
00:14:20.039 --> 00:14:22.679
The latex looks fucking stupid, by the way.

267
00:14:22.740 --> 00:14:23.820
It looks outrageous.

268
00:14:23.879 --> 00:14:24.659
It does.

269
00:14:24.720 --> 00:14:25.679
Well, yes.

270
00:14:25.740 --> 00:14:26.519
Ridiculous.

271
00:14:26.580 --> 00:14:29.220
But you've got this...

272
00:14:29.279 --> 00:14:29.820
They were trying us.

273
00:14:29.940 --> 00:14:30.960
They were trying us.

274
00:14:30.960 --> 00:14:35.399
You have a very, very pretty man there in the Visian chief

275
00:14:35.399 --> 00:14:38.340
engineer and he just looks absurd.

276
00:14:38.399 --> 00:14:39.120
All right.

277
00:14:39.179 --> 00:14:40.019
This scene.

278
00:14:40.080 --> 00:14:42.840
So Tucker has found Tucker.

279
00:14:42.899 --> 00:14:43.980
I keep calling him Tucker.

280
00:14:44.039 --> 00:14:46.200
No, he is Trip Tucker.

281
00:14:46.200 --> 00:14:46.379
Yeah.

282
00:14:46.440 --> 00:14:47.039
Trip.

283
00:14:47.100 --> 00:14:53.820
Tripp has encountered the cogenitor who is just a very quiet, sort

284
00:14:53.820 --> 00:14:56.100
of, I guess, we would say non-binary person.

285
00:14:57.779 --> 00:15:02.460
But, and now he's going to flocks to talk about it.

286
00:15:02.519 --> 00:15:07.500
And initially, he seems to be just a little bit confused and

287
00:15:07.500 --> 00:15:14.039
confronted by this kind of arrangement, that there are 3 genders

288
00:15:14.039 --> 00:15:15.299
or 3 sexes, rather.

289
00:15:15.360 --> 00:15:17.340
And the terminology is confused.

290
00:15:17.399 --> 00:15:19.799
We're a little bit more clear on the terminology than they were 20

291
00:15:19.799 --> 00:15:20.279
years ago.

292
00:15:20.340 --> 00:15:22.980
Well, he's determined, it is a woman, isn't it?

293
00:15:23.039 --> 00:15:23.519
He goes.

294
00:15:23.580 --> 00:15:26.519
She seems she seems like a woman.

295
00:15:26.580 --> 00:15:28.019
Yeah, yeah.

296
00:15:28.080 --> 00:15:29.759
But, yeah, yeah.

297
00:15:29.820 --> 00:15:31.500
So he's he's having difficulty doing it.

298
00:15:31.559 --> 00:15:36.000
What I love his flocks offers not only to explain how the Visians

299
00:15:36.000 --> 00:15:39.120
have sex, but he was about to show him a video.

300
00:15:39.179 --> 00:15:40.379
I've got pictures.

301
00:15:42.299 --> 00:15:44.879
Just goes, no, actually, I'll be fine.

302
00:15:44.940 --> 00:15:45.899
Isn't it wonderful?

303
00:15:45.960 --> 00:15:49.440
But he then says, look, you're our head to meet other species.

304
00:15:49.500 --> 00:15:50.700
Don't be so judgemental.

305
00:15:50.759 --> 00:15:52.799
Like, learn about this.

306
00:15:52.919 --> 00:15:56.159
Yeah, and he absolutely does that.

307
00:15:56.220 --> 00:15:58.679
And when he comes back to flocks to talk about it later.

308
00:15:58.740 --> 00:16:04.259
He has no problem with the fact that it's that race isn't sexually

309
00:16:04.259 --> 00:16:05.580
dimorphic or whatever.

310
00:16:05.639 --> 00:16:07.320
All right, now we're in this...

311
00:16:07.740 --> 00:16:09.840
So I think with flocks, you know, because I said to you before

312
00:16:09.840 --> 00:16:15.779
where they have the comedy polygamous plot line, um, in, I think

313
00:16:15.779 --> 00:16:19.740
that is bounty that's coming up, actually. that he, you know, he

314
00:16:19.740 --> 00:16:23.340
goes, you know, did you enjoy my wife because, you know, he's got

315
00:16:23.340 --> 00:16:24.539
several wives and husbands.

316
00:16:24.600 --> 00:16:26.220
So there is a voice.

317
00:16:26.820 --> 00:16:33.720
Between Bragger and Burman that is willing to to speak on behalf

318
00:16:33.720 --> 00:16:35.700
of, you know, differences.

319
00:16:35.759 --> 00:16:39.240
So that's why I find it even more troubling that they reach

320
00:16:39.240 --> 00:16:42.480
conclusions sometimes, which are a bit black and white.

321
00:16:42.539 --> 00:16:49.440
Well, I mean, the thing is that the 2 alien characters on the 2

322
00:16:49.440 --> 00:16:54.659
alien characters, crew members on Enterprise, both express the

323
00:16:54.659 --> 00:16:57.659
view that trip shouldn't get involved.

324
00:16:58.799 --> 00:17:00.720
This scene here.

325
00:17:00.779 --> 00:17:01.919
There's a moment here, right?

326
00:17:01.980 --> 00:17:07.920
So we're in here with Drenik, I want to call him, and with Andreas

327
00:17:07.920 --> 00:17:10.859
and Archer.

328
00:17:10.920 --> 00:17:16.440
And the Vician says that he's read all of Shakespeare and

329
00:17:16.440 --> 00:17:18.299
Sophocles, can you recommend something else?

330
00:17:18.359 --> 00:17:22.680
And because they don't want Archer to seem unrelatable, he just

331
00:17:22.680 --> 00:17:26.220
says, oh, I reckon you could find the classics all by yourself.

332
00:17:26.279 --> 00:17:30.720
And you, you know that Picard would have said, oh, you know, read

333
00:17:30.720 --> 00:17:34.859
I don't know, Jane Austen or something, but they don't want, they

334
00:17:34.859 --> 00:17:38.519
don't want Archer to exhibit any book learning, you know.

335
00:17:40.079 --> 00:17:41.880
Cisco would have been like, I've got these baseball matches that

336
00:17:41.880 --> 00:17:42.359
you can watch.

337
00:17:42.420 --> 00:17:43.140
There you go.

338
00:17:43.140 --> 00:17:44.279
Have a look at that.

339
00:17:44.339 --> 00:17:46.619
This guy here, F.J.

340
00:17:46.619 --> 00:17:47.700
Rio, his name is.

341
00:17:47.759 --> 00:17:50.160
I can't remember what the character's name is.

342
00:17:50.220 --> 00:17:52.019
I'm terrible with like one shot character.

343
00:17:52.079 --> 00:17:53.640
He's just called chief engineer.

344
00:17:53.700 --> 00:17:54.599
He doesn't get it.

345
00:17:55.440 --> 00:18:00.960
He's very good in this, I think, because he's called a con to be

346
00:18:00.960 --> 00:18:02.700
quite angry later on.

347
00:18:02.759 --> 00:18:06.539
But actually, it's quite, it's quite a subtle performance. doesn't

348
00:18:06.539 --> 00:18:07.740
really kind of lose it.

349
00:18:07.799 --> 00:18:10.619
He's been in Star Trek a couple of times before.

350
00:18:10.680 --> 00:18:16.680
And he played a semi-regular across series 4 and 5 of DS9.

351
00:18:16.920 --> 00:18:22.680
He was in Starship Down, Hard Time, and then he dies in the ship.

352
00:18:22.740 --> 00:18:24.480
I don't remember if you remember that one.

353
00:18:24.599 --> 00:18:26.279
It's the crash Jem'Hadar shit.

354
00:18:26.339 --> 00:18:27.000
Yeah, yeah.

355
00:18:27.000 --> 00:18:30.359
He gets shot and the whole, there's like a running character

356
00:18:30.359 --> 00:18:33.599
storyline of O'Brien trying to staunch the bleeding and he's

357
00:18:33.599 --> 00:18:34.319
getting worse.

358
00:18:34.380 --> 00:18:36.539
And as the situation's getting more claustrophobic.

359
00:18:36.599 --> 00:18:39.480
And the point where they all lose their shit with each other is

360
00:18:39.480 --> 00:18:41.339
the point where he actually dies.

361
00:18:41.400 --> 00:18:41.579
Right.

362
00:18:41.579 --> 00:18:43.859
And it's really, really affected.

363
00:18:43.920 --> 00:18:47.579
And it's effective because he's a likeable character and a good

364
00:18:47.579 --> 00:18:47.819
actor.

365
00:18:47.880 --> 00:18:49.980
Well, I mean, he's likeable here.

366
00:18:50.039 --> 00:18:52.319
He's pretty as well, but he's...

367
00:18:52.319 --> 00:18:54.119
Fucking ratex is so bad.

368
00:18:54.720 --> 00:18:58.740
You have to get used to it, you know. watching a lot of 90s trek.

369
00:19:00.240 --> 00:19:05.460
They still do it a bit in discovery anyway. part of the deal.

370
00:19:05.700 --> 00:19:10.920
But here he is, you know, like his absolutely charming trip is

371
00:19:10.920 --> 00:19:11.519
charming.

372
00:19:11.640 --> 00:19:12.960
He's trying to keep an open mind.

373
00:19:13.019 --> 00:19:16.920
He's been asking maybe some intrusive personal questions.

374
00:19:16.980 --> 00:19:22.259
Not quite, not quite like in the outcast where um, Soren asks

375
00:19:22.259 --> 00:19:24.180
Riker to describe his genital organs.

376
00:19:24.240 --> 00:19:24.960
Do you remember that?

377
00:19:25.019 --> 00:19:26.400
Yeah.

378
00:19:26.400 --> 00:19:27.180
Right, yeah.

379
00:19:27.240 --> 00:19:29.279
Normally he'd just be right in for it.

380
00:19:29.339 --> 00:19:30.720
I don't know why he doesn't do it.

381
00:19:30.779 --> 00:19:32.220
In fact, you know what?

382
00:19:32.279 --> 00:19:36.839
You make a really good point there that the outcast and what's the

383
00:19:36.839 --> 00:19:38.940
other one where they delved into issues.

384
00:19:39.480 --> 00:19:41.880
Oh, rejoin.

385
00:19:41.940 --> 00:19:44.160
No, no, rejoice the DS9 one.

386
00:19:44.220 --> 00:19:47.400
You're talking about the, if it's the true one, isn't it?

387
00:19:47.460 --> 00:19:49.440
where Beverly Crusher basically says at the end.

388
00:19:49.559 --> 00:19:50.700
Yeah, yeah.

389
00:19:50.759 --> 00:19:55.259
Humanity is not ready for bisexuality. what she says in the final

390
00:19:55.259 --> 00:19:55.740
scene.

391
00:19:56.880 --> 00:20:00.599
That just goes to show how far we've come, though, between then

392
00:20:00.599 --> 00:20:03.779
and this because this, like you say, at least offers both points

393
00:20:03.779 --> 00:20:04.140
of view.

394
00:20:04.319 --> 00:20:10.319
Yeah, but I think that it isn't, this isn't about Tripp's initial

395
00:20:10.319 --> 00:20:15.359
discomfort with, or, yeah, he has slight discomfort with this sort

396
00:20:15.359 --> 00:20:20.519
of, um, the sort of sexual, I don't know, the way that these

397
00:20:20.519 --> 00:20:24.240
people have sex or the way these people conceive children having a

398
00:20:24.240 --> 00:20:25.140
3rd gender.

399
00:20:25.200 --> 00:20:27.119
And but he's over it.

400
00:20:27.180 --> 00:20:28.079
He's over it now.

401
00:20:28.140 --> 00:20:30.660
He's asked the engineer some questions.

402
00:20:30.720 --> 00:20:32.819
He smiled and said, I'm keeping an open mind.

403
00:20:33.299 --> 00:20:38.279
So what you think this is more about fighting the oppression of

404
00:20:38.279 --> 00:20:40.859
this gender.

405
00:20:40.980 --> 00:20:42.839
Yeah, that's right.

406
00:20:42.900 --> 00:20:51.299
And so he's already concerned that she, you know, can't read.

407
00:20:51.359 --> 00:20:52.799
She's not allowed to read.

408
00:20:52.859 --> 00:20:59.400
And one of the things in the Handmaid's tale is that Offred isn't

409
00:20:59.400 --> 00:21:00.539
permitted to read either.

410
00:21:00.599 --> 00:21:04.019
And so she has to spend a lot of time in a room doing nothing

411
00:21:04.019 --> 00:21:05.880
because reading's illegal.

412
00:21:05.940 --> 00:21:11.279
And the Handmaid's Tale is just American slavery, but for white

413
00:21:11.279 --> 00:21:11.759
women.

414
00:21:11.819 --> 00:21:16.440
And so in the 18th and 19th centuries, a lot of southern states

415
00:21:16.440 --> 00:21:24.599
passed literacy laws that made it illegal for black people to be

416
00:21:24.599 --> 00:21:25.500
taught to read.

417
00:21:25.559 --> 00:21:27.599
And so...

418
00:21:27.599 --> 00:21:30.359
If you can see the look on my face right now...

419
00:21:30.359 --> 00:21:31.319
Absolute astonishment.

420
00:21:31.380 --> 00:21:32.460
Yeah.

421
00:21:32.519 --> 00:21:39.180
So, um, this thing about preventing her from reading is a real

422
00:21:39.180 --> 00:21:43.440
proper signifier that she is enslaved and oppressed.

423
00:21:43.500 --> 00:21:47.279
So what is, is it that, what, if they have knowledge?

424
00:21:48.240 --> 00:21:49.740
Yeah, exactly.

425
00:21:49.740 --> 00:21:52.980
They could learn, you know, there's a better life than this and

426
00:21:52.980 --> 00:21:54.660
there's more to life than, you know.

427
00:21:54.720 --> 00:21:56.220
Well, I mean, what is she?

428
00:21:56.220 --> 00:21:58.019
She's essentially like an incubator for children.

429
00:21:58.079 --> 00:21:59.640
That's what the...

430
00:21:59.700 --> 00:22:03.839
She provides an enzyme, but fortunately, fortunately, flux doesn't

431
00:22:03.839 --> 00:22:04.380
tell us how.

432
00:22:05.220 --> 00:22:07.079
Oh, I'm sorry.

433
00:22:07.140 --> 00:22:08.400
Okay, this whole city.

434
00:22:08.519 --> 00:22:09.660
Now, you and I, we talked about this.

435
00:22:09.720 --> 00:22:12.660
The cheese seduction scene.

436
00:22:12.720 --> 00:22:14.759
You quite like this, didn't you?

437
00:22:14.819 --> 00:22:17.279
Well, yeah, I kind of did.

438
00:22:17.339 --> 00:22:21.539
I, you know, it's, oh, God, I was going to say cheesy, but it is

439
00:22:21.539 --> 00:22:22.859
cheesy as hell.

440
00:22:22.920 --> 00:22:26.039
In the sense that, you know, they're putting food into each

441
00:22:26.039 --> 00:22:29.400
other's mouths and she kind of touches his lip and all of that and

442
00:22:29.400 --> 00:22:33.839
all of that seems like completely inappropriate in a, you know, but

443
00:22:33.839 --> 00:22:38.220
and, and it's, it's absolutely running out the clock, you know

444
00:22:38.220 --> 00:22:39.599
it's running out the clock.

445
00:22:39.660 --> 00:22:44.160
But I do like the very simple idea that pungent smells mean more

446
00:22:44.160 --> 00:22:46.019
to them than the taste of food.

447
00:22:46.079 --> 00:22:49.920
It's kind of simple and it's just a little bit off centre from

448
00:22:49.920 --> 00:22:50.640
what we're used to.

449
00:22:50.700 --> 00:22:54.900
But it's kind of enough to make this species a little bit unique

450
00:22:54.900 --> 00:22:57.000
because they do some jokes with it as well.

451
00:22:57.059 --> 00:23:00.480
Like when Trip goes to dinner and he smells the food and it's like

452
00:23:00.480 --> 00:23:01.079
oh, God.

453
00:23:01.140 --> 00:23:02.339
And then he tries it.

454
00:23:02.460 --> 00:23:04.559
Well, that's pretty mild compared to what I'm thinking it was

455
00:23:04.559 --> 00:23:05.160
going taste like.

456
00:23:05.460 --> 00:23:11.279
But that as well is not a cultural difference.

457
00:23:11.339 --> 00:23:14.519
It's a cultural difference in a biological difference, I guess, but

458
00:23:14.519 --> 00:23:19.259
it's something that they can bond over and that they there's

459
00:23:19.259 --> 00:23:20.940
something about this relationship.

460
00:23:21.000 --> 00:23:27.000
And this relationship has to be built up is important because it's

461
00:23:27.000 --> 00:23:30.000
destroyed at the end by trip's actions.

462
00:23:30.119 --> 00:23:31.140
Yeah.

463
00:23:31.200 --> 00:23:36.180
And so these people are getting on really, really well, they're

464
00:23:36.180 --> 00:23:37.740
absolutely bonding.

465
00:23:37.799 --> 00:23:47.099
Um, And the same with Drenik and Archer in that little ship and um

466
00:23:47.099 --> 00:23:50.400
trip and the chief engineer, and they're talking about sharing

467
00:23:50.400 --> 00:23:54.900
technology that we know that they won't get because we know the

468
00:23:54.900 --> 00:23:58.319
future history, you know, um, these people are vastly more

469
00:23:58.319 --> 00:23:58.980
advanced.

470
00:23:59.039 --> 00:24:03.059
I do nothing, though. you like it when they meet these species, but

471
00:24:03.059 --> 00:24:06.119
are just like, hello, and we want, we want to, you know, come and

472
00:24:06.119 --> 00:24:06.539
see you.

473
00:24:06.599 --> 00:24:07.680
We want to give you this.

474
00:24:07.799 --> 00:24:08.940
And there's no real tension.

475
00:24:08.940 --> 00:24:14.579
And it's really hard to play like super nice characters that are

476
00:24:14.579 --> 00:24:15.420
interesting.

477
00:24:15.420 --> 00:24:17.099
And they managed, they all achieve it here.

478
00:24:17.160 --> 00:24:18.359
Yeah, yeah.

479
00:24:18.420 --> 00:24:20.400
Because there's no conflict, there's no tension.

480
00:24:20.460 --> 00:24:24.240
They're not behaving in a particularly, you know, horrible way

481
00:24:24.240 --> 00:24:24.839
towards them.

482
00:24:24.900 --> 00:24:29.279
The only thing that's providing the tension is an element of this

483
00:24:29.279 --> 00:24:31.259
culture that's different from ours.

484
00:24:31.380 --> 00:24:33.779
Yeah, yeah, that's right.

485
00:24:35.460 --> 00:24:39.420
Yeah, see, look, he's offering the chief engineer, the Visian

486
00:24:39.420 --> 00:24:42.539
chief engineer is offering to share their warp technology, which

487
00:24:42.539 --> 00:24:46.740
is vastly advanced compared to what is on enterprise.

488
00:24:46.799 --> 00:24:50.339
And so this is going to be a really good productive relationship

489
00:24:50.339 --> 00:24:53.400
and we're rooting for it, I think, because it's fun to watch it

490
00:24:53.400 --> 00:24:53.880
happen.

491
00:24:53.940 --> 00:24:58.380
I think, um, and Andreas Katsulas is particular.

492
00:24:58.440 --> 00:25:03.599
Yeah, he's particularly good in this because his character is so

493
00:25:03.599 --> 00:25:04.380
amiable.

494
00:25:04.440 --> 00:25:08.220
And that could have been it could have been really boring, you

495
00:25:08.220 --> 00:25:08.460
know?

496
00:25:08.519 --> 00:25:10.500
But he's charming as hell, I think.

497
00:25:10.619 --> 00:25:11.279
Yeah.

498
00:25:11.339 --> 00:25:14.460
And he's always been, sorry, what you said there about the

499
00:25:14.460 --> 00:25:15.119
technology.

500
00:25:15.180 --> 00:25:19.980
Actually, it does come in because like I said, I watch the expanse

501
00:25:19.980 --> 00:25:23.339
and they talk about photon torpedoes in this.

502
00:25:24.180 --> 00:25:28.380
And they've got photon torpedoes come the expanse ready to go into

503
00:25:28.380 --> 00:25:28.619
there.

504
00:25:28.680 --> 00:25:31.619
So I think they must give them blueprints or something like that

505
00:25:31.619 --> 00:25:33.240
which they use.

506
00:25:33.299 --> 00:25:34.079
Yeah.

507
00:25:34.140 --> 00:25:35.400
It's funny, isn't it?

508
00:25:35.460 --> 00:25:39.539
Because they don't have photon torpedoes and he mentions them and

509
00:25:39.539 --> 00:25:42.119
they have been mentioned before, I think, in France.

510
00:25:42.180 --> 00:25:45.299
There's a there's a time travel episode when they come out of the

511
00:25:45.299 --> 00:25:47.220
Delphic expanse called Storm from.

512
00:25:47.279 --> 00:25:50.819
And I think, oh, yeah, a lot of stuff gets wiped away then, quite

513
00:25:50.819 --> 00:25:51.539
conveniently.

514
00:25:51.599 --> 00:25:51.839
Right.

515
00:25:51.839 --> 00:25:56.460
I absolutely hate these 2 now.

516
00:25:56.519 --> 00:26:00.839
Colour, the wife and the chief engineer.

517
00:26:00.900 --> 00:26:04.559
I just think they're absolutely smug and disgusting.

518
00:26:04.619 --> 00:26:07.319
And I think the fact that they're dressed in white.

519
00:26:07.380 --> 00:26:13.440
I just, like, it's awake.

520
00:26:13.500 --> 00:26:15.119
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

521
00:26:15.119 --> 00:26:18.960
I do like the fact that they're kind of presented as in this is

522
00:26:18.960 --> 00:26:20.279
all normal, you know?

523
00:26:20.339 --> 00:26:21.240
Yeah, yeah.

524
00:26:21.299 --> 00:26:21.660
Yeah.

525
00:26:21.720 --> 00:26:26.640
They're not presented like specifically unlikably, are they?

526
00:26:26.700 --> 00:26:30.599
They're just a bit arrogant and like this is our culture and, you

527
00:26:30.599 --> 00:26:30.839
know.

528
00:26:30.900 --> 00:26:31.380
Yeah.

529
00:26:31.380 --> 00:26:34.859
But I mean, it's like 3% of the population are essentially

530
00:26:34.859 --> 00:26:40.380
enslaved so that we can have procreative heterosexual

531
00:26:40.380 --> 00:26:41.400
intercourse.

532
00:26:41.460 --> 00:26:45.720
And I hate those 2 smug people.

533
00:26:45.720 --> 00:26:49.079
And particularly the wife.

534
00:26:49.140 --> 00:26:51.420
I just think I just think they're awful at this point.

535
00:26:51.480 --> 00:26:56.700
And that's a point that the episode doesn't properly make, and

536
00:26:56.700 --> 00:27:01.500
we'll get there, but I think that that's the problem here, that

537
00:27:01.500 --> 00:27:04.079
there's a real failure to acknowledge what's going on in this

538
00:27:04.079 --> 00:27:07.440
society and to just hand wave it away saying it's not our business

539
00:27:07.500 --> 00:27:08.220
you know.

540
00:27:08.279 --> 00:27:10.559
Yeah, well, we've talked about that as well, haven't we?

541
00:27:10.619 --> 00:27:14.279
That kind of arrogant tripping around the universe and not making

542
00:27:14.279 --> 00:27:15.660
a difference when you could.

543
00:27:15.839 --> 00:27:17.640
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

544
00:27:17.700 --> 00:27:20.099
And I mean, this is a very advanced race.

545
00:27:20.160 --> 00:27:25.799
The prime directive, which doesn't yet exist in 2153.

546
00:27:26.880 --> 00:27:32.160
But I think they are playing the show as if there is some kind of

547
00:27:32.160 --> 00:27:35.579
directive in place that says they cannot specifically involve

548
00:27:35.579 --> 00:27:39.839
themselves in like the cultural affairs of other people because

549
00:27:39.839 --> 00:27:41.039
they talk about it in this.

550
00:27:41.519 --> 00:27:46.920
Yeah, yeah, but I mean, this is a warp capable species that's

551
00:27:46.920 --> 00:27:48.119
technologically advanced.

552
00:27:48.180 --> 00:27:51.480
There's no kind of colonialism happening here from the humans.

553
00:27:51.539 --> 00:27:55.380
You know, they're not seeking to sort of subjugate or influence or

554
00:27:55.380 --> 00:28:00.359
colonise, uh, you know, a race that has less sophisticated

555
00:28:00.359 --> 00:28:03.660
technology or isn't aware of the galaxy around them.

556
00:28:03.720 --> 00:28:08.519
But you know, I think that um, the Federation, Starfleet Command

557
00:28:08.519 --> 00:28:12.720
whatever. is a bit more problematic than they would like to

558
00:28:12.720 --> 00:28:13.079
think.

559
00:28:13.079 --> 00:28:17.039
And if the option was to have these technological blueprints, but

560
00:28:17.039 --> 00:28:20.099
you've got to turn a blind eye to the slavery, they'd be like, well

561
00:28:20.099 --> 00:28:21.059
give us the blueprints then.

562
00:28:21.180 --> 00:28:22.319
We didn't see nothing.

563
00:28:22.799 --> 00:28:24.599
That's exactly it.

564
00:28:24.660 --> 00:28:26.220
How about would we have to go?

565
00:28:26.519 --> 00:28:32.220
Because my history is pretty terrible for slavery within a

566
00:28:32.220 --> 00:28:36.539
household and a very conservative couple like this, like in

567
00:28:36.539 --> 00:28:36.779
reality.

568
00:28:36.839 --> 00:28:40.619
So the 19th century, 19th century. appalling, isn't it?

569
00:28:40.680 --> 00:28:41.579
Yeah, yeah.

570
00:28:41.640 --> 00:28:43.079
Wow.

571
00:28:43.200 --> 00:28:47.579
Yeah, it's abolished earlier in England, but it's still going in

572
00:28:47.579 --> 00:28:48.720
America after that.

573
00:28:48.779 --> 00:28:53.099
So, and again, so this is the scene where he's teaching her to

574
00:28:53.099 --> 00:28:54.539
read, right?

575
00:28:54.599 --> 00:28:57.119
And we've already established.

576
00:28:57.180 --> 00:29:03.720
He went to dinner with the horrible couple in order to scan her, to

577
00:29:03.720 --> 00:29:08.700
do a neural scan on her, to take it back to flocks, so that flocks

578
00:29:08.700 --> 00:29:13.920
could determine that she wasn't not taught to read because she's

579
00:29:13.920 --> 00:29:17.579
incapable of it, and that she is as smart as them.

580
00:29:17.640 --> 00:29:22.140
And remember, Andreas read all of Shakespeare and Sophocles

581
00:29:22.140 --> 00:29:23.099
overnight.

582
00:29:24.720 --> 00:29:27.779
So she's incredibly smart.

583
00:29:27.839 --> 00:29:30.420
Okay, much smarter than them.

584
00:29:33.119 --> 00:29:37.680
I don't wonder, you know, if they couldn't have, oh, maybe this is

585
00:29:37.680 --> 00:29:41.279
me being a bit out of line, if they couldn't have made that

586
00:29:41.279 --> 00:29:43.740
character a little more androgynous.

587
00:29:43.799 --> 00:29:48.000
I think that, that she does look female.

588
00:29:48.359 --> 00:29:52.500
Yeah, I mean, they do try and make her as androgynous as possible

589
00:29:52.500 --> 00:29:54.299
but yeah, yeah.

590
00:29:54.359 --> 00:29:59.339
I think it's a bit of a shame that Tucker defaults to she, her

591
00:29:59.339 --> 00:30:04.319
pronouns, but, you know, that's better than it anyway, in any

592
00:30:04.319 --> 00:30:04.619
case.

593
00:30:04.680 --> 00:30:06.180
I just don't think...

594
00:30:06.180 --> 00:30:10.019
I just think like it would play more interestingly because to me

595
00:30:10.019 --> 00:30:14.339
it kind of feels like a male female relationship in how it looks.

596
00:30:14.400 --> 00:30:16.440
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

597
00:30:16.500 --> 00:30:20.339
But, you know, like it's not really romantic.

598
00:30:20.400 --> 00:30:20.940
Is it?

599
00:30:21.000 --> 00:30:22.500
No, no, no.

600
00:30:22.559 --> 00:30:24.720
It's like a very charming friendship.

601
00:30:24.779 --> 00:30:26.339
Yeah, yeah.

602
00:30:26.400 --> 00:30:26.700
Yeah.

603
00:30:26.759 --> 00:30:29.819
It's not like Soren and Riker who eventually kind of bone or

604
00:30:29.819 --> 00:30:30.180
whatever.

605
00:30:30.240 --> 00:30:33.839
This is different from that, I think.

606
00:30:33.900 --> 00:30:35.880
Oh, I need to.

607
00:30:35.940 --> 00:30:38.160
I need to just say there's an awful lot, I'll take that back with

608
00:30:38.160 --> 00:30:38.700
these scenes.

609
00:30:38.759 --> 00:30:39.779
A lot, you know.

610
00:30:39.839 --> 00:30:42.059
I was zoning out a lot during these scenes.

611
00:30:42.359 --> 00:30:47.460
Except that there is a character thing and it has something to do

612
00:30:47.460 --> 00:30:48.539
with the main plot.

613
00:30:48.599 --> 00:30:53.579
So I think it's important for the plot that we want this

614
00:30:53.579 --> 00:30:55.259
relationship to succeed.

615
00:30:55.319 --> 00:30:56.039
Yeah.

616
00:30:56.039 --> 00:30:57.720
That's a bit of a cartoon that shot.

617
00:30:57.839 --> 00:30:59.160
And he says as well, doesn't he?

618
00:30:59.220 --> 00:31:05.400
When kind of the shit hits the fan and trip goes too far and the

619
00:31:05.400 --> 00:31:07.680
congenitor asks for asylum.

620
00:31:07.740 --> 00:31:11.940
Yeah, Andreas, whose name, whose character name I've forgotten

621
00:31:11.940 --> 00:31:12.180
again.

622
00:31:12.240 --> 00:31:13.140
Drenik, I think.

623
00:31:13.200 --> 00:31:17.519
Drenik says, you know, we've developed more of a friendship and a

624
00:31:17.519 --> 00:31:20.880
relationship in a couple of days than some people do in a lifetime

625
00:31:20.880 --> 00:31:24.960
like let's not ruin this over this, over this little thing, you

626
00:31:24.960 --> 00:31:25.500
know?

627
00:31:25.559 --> 00:31:26.039
Yeah.

628
00:31:26.099 --> 00:31:28.680
He's still being genial and friendly.

629
00:31:28.740 --> 00:31:34.200
Even the fact that it's got to the point where the cogenitor has

630
00:31:34.200 --> 00:31:37.440
asked for asylum, he still isn't pulling out of the relationship.

631
00:31:37.440 --> 00:31:42.359
And it is only after the sort of terrible tragic ending, which is

632
00:31:42.359 --> 00:31:47.279
in no way Tripp's fault. that they pull the plug on it.

633
00:31:47.339 --> 00:31:49.500
And so these are the stakes.

634
00:31:49.559 --> 00:31:50.819
These scenes aren't filler.

635
00:31:50.880 --> 00:31:52.380
They're presenting the stakes.

636
00:31:52.440 --> 00:31:56.819
And I think they work because Drenik is, as you said, charming and

637
00:31:56.819 --> 00:31:57.420
amiable.

638
00:31:57.480 --> 00:31:58.799
He's really great.

639
00:31:58.859 --> 00:32:00.420
And it is nice. isn't it?

640
00:32:00.480 --> 00:32:04.079
For once, species has come along that just isn't firing phases at

641
00:32:04.079 --> 00:32:05.640
all, whatever at them straight away.

642
00:32:05.700 --> 00:32:06.960
You know, that's quite refreshing.

643
00:32:07.259 --> 00:32:09.420
Oh, this bit here.

644
00:32:09.960 --> 00:32:13.500
It's a very similar scene, you know, between O'Brien and a

645
00:32:13.500 --> 00:32:17.700
Cardassian in DS9 where they get this tube and she's just like, I'm

646
00:32:17.700 --> 00:32:18.240
going to have you.

647
00:32:18.299 --> 00:32:21.000
And actually, there's a scene between 7 and Harry, isn't there

648
00:32:21.000 --> 00:32:23.700
where she's like, you can remove your clothes now. you know.

649
00:32:23.759 --> 00:32:27.660
And he's so unused to women being this forceful with him.

650
00:32:27.720 --> 00:32:29.880
Harry basically pees his pants in the Jeffrey Zoom.

651
00:32:29.940 --> 00:32:30.480
It's really funny.

652
00:32:30.539 --> 00:32:34.619
Someone's so pretty, you would think they'd be lining up.

653
00:32:35.339 --> 00:32:38.519
Yeah, I actually really quite like this.

654
00:32:38.579 --> 00:32:41.640
And again, it's not really filler.

655
00:32:41.700 --> 00:32:42.420
I think.

656
00:32:42.480 --> 00:32:43.859
Oh, it's not really fun.

657
00:32:43.920 --> 00:32:45.000
Thor log again, though.

658
00:32:45.119 --> 00:32:49.140
Oh, I wish you were like, oh, usually you ask people for dinner

659
00:32:49.140 --> 00:32:50.339
you know, then you shag.

660
00:32:50.460 --> 00:32:54.299
And she goes, well, in our society, we shag and then decide

661
00:32:54.299 --> 00:32:55.319
whether you're worthy of dinner.

662
00:32:55.559 --> 00:32:57.119
That's right.

663
00:32:57.240 --> 00:32:58.799
So exciting.

664
00:32:58.920 --> 00:33:03.000
But again, it's that sort of cute cross-cultural thing.

665
00:33:03.059 --> 00:33:03.900
It's rather sweet.

666
00:33:03.960 --> 00:33:09.240
I mean, they're boning now while this conversation between Tripp

667
00:33:09.240 --> 00:33:11.279
and the cojenitor is happening, I suppose.

668
00:33:11.339 --> 00:33:13.920
Um, There is absolutely.

669
00:33:13.980 --> 00:33:19.680
There's a weird, there's a weird, um, contradiction here, though

670
00:33:19.680 --> 00:33:24.720
because I feel like the episode ultimately criticises what Tripp's

671
00:33:24.720 --> 00:33:29.940
doing, and yet it seems to play out in such a lovely way that you

672
00:33:29.940 --> 00:33:32.880
absolutely, you can't do anything, but be on board with what he's

673
00:33:32.880 --> 00:33:33.059
doing.

674
00:33:33.480 --> 00:33:39.359
I mean, the thing is right, that her, she starts to smile, like

675
00:33:39.359 --> 00:33:44.160
here, in a way that lights up the room, she's really happy that

676
00:33:44.160 --> 00:33:48.240
she's learning to read and at the prospect of doing something

677
00:33:48.240 --> 00:33:52.319
other than just sitting in a series of rooms like a handmaid.

678
00:33:52.380 --> 00:33:57.660
Remember Handmaid's Tale is about the fact that, you know, um, that

679
00:33:57.660 --> 00:34:03.000
women who are uh, fertile are very rare.

680
00:34:03.059 --> 00:34:07.859
And so they're an adjunct to the sexual relationship between, you

681
00:34:07.859 --> 00:34:09.599
know, married couples who want to have children.

682
00:34:09.659 --> 00:34:13.679
So there's very, very definite handmade tale stuff going on here.

683
00:34:14.460 --> 00:34:17.699
But are we supposed to endorse this?

684
00:34:17.760 --> 00:34:20.639
Or are we supposed to reject it?

685
00:34:20.699 --> 00:34:27.239
Because clearly, that's what's interesting about this is, is it's

686
00:34:27.239 --> 00:34:28.380
kind of given you both options.

687
00:34:28.559 --> 00:34:30.239
And you decide.

688
00:34:30.300 --> 00:34:32.099
I don't think it is.

689
00:34:32.159 --> 00:34:35.340
I think it comes down very, very heavily on the side that it's

690
00:34:35.340 --> 00:34:39.360
Troop's fault and there would have been some simple ways of

691
00:34:39.360 --> 00:34:41.519
mitigating that and we'll get to it.

692
00:34:41.579 --> 00:34:42.900
Yeah, that's a shame. a shame.

693
00:34:42.960 --> 00:34:45.840
Yeah, I think it's a real proper problem.

694
00:34:45.900 --> 00:34:49.260
And it's kind of like, well, we'll continue trading with Saudi

695
00:34:49.260 --> 00:34:52.019
Arabia because we need the oil and it doesn't matter how they

696
00:34:52.019 --> 00:34:53.639
oppress their women or whatever.

697
00:34:53.699 --> 00:34:55.079
You know, like...

698
00:34:55.559 --> 00:34:56.099
That federation.

699
00:34:56.159 --> 00:34:57.059
I don't care you know.

700
00:34:57.119 --> 00:34:58.679
That's right.

701
00:34:58.800 --> 00:35:00.780
Well, we don't have the Federation quite yet.

702
00:35:00.840 --> 00:35:02.219
That'll be in about 8 years time.

703
00:35:02.280 --> 00:35:06.420
The very fact that he says later on, you know, like, let's not

704
00:35:06.420 --> 00:35:09.539
fall out over this little thing and he's talking about oppressing

705
00:35:09.539 --> 00:35:09.840
people.

706
00:35:10.320 --> 00:35:12.059
Yeah, yeah.

707
00:35:12.119 --> 00:35:17.639
Well, no, when he says this little thing, he means trip taking the

708
00:35:17.639 --> 00:35:20.880
cogenitor on board and teaching her to read and showing her

709
00:35:20.880 --> 00:35:21.300
movies.

710
00:35:21.360 --> 00:35:22.500
That's the little thing.

711
00:35:22.619 --> 00:35:25.980
It's not the little thing is, let's not fall out over the fact

712
00:35:25.980 --> 00:35:29.280
that we keep 3% of our population in slavery.

713
00:35:29.340 --> 00:35:30.179
You know.

714
00:35:31.320 --> 00:35:34.739
These sequences now, yeah, where he's showing her around the

715
00:35:34.739 --> 00:35:35.219
ship.

716
00:35:35.280 --> 00:35:39.659
There's a subtle suspense to these scenes that I found absolutely

717
00:35:39.659 --> 00:35:40.619
gripping.

718
00:35:40.619 --> 00:35:43.199
Because basically all he's doing is what we see every other week

719
00:35:43.199 --> 00:35:46.619
is someone coming to the ship and walking around it.

720
00:35:46.679 --> 00:35:50.579
But there's a wrongness to it and you know you absolutely should

721
00:35:50.579 --> 00:35:51.300
not be doing this.

722
00:35:51.480 --> 00:35:52.860
No.

723
00:35:52.920 --> 00:35:55.619
I think there's a shame too, because they actually, there's a

724
00:35:55.619 --> 00:35:58.559
scene that they just decide not to do, which is obviously the

725
00:35:58.559 --> 00:36:03.420
scene, where we get the news or where he's found out or whatever.

726
00:36:03.480 --> 00:36:04.559
We don't get that.

727
00:36:04.679 --> 00:36:08.579
We just go straight to Tucker being chewed out by Archer.

728
00:36:08.639 --> 00:36:10.500
And I think that's a shame.

729
00:36:10.559 --> 00:36:13.079
I think they kind of pump on that and they punt on another

730
00:36:13.079 --> 00:36:15.119
development later as well, I think.

731
00:36:15.179 --> 00:36:19.559
There's 2 criticisms that we made in Strange New World, which I

732
00:36:19.559 --> 00:36:23.159
want to address here, because I think they have made massive

733
00:36:23.159 --> 00:36:23.820
strides.

734
00:36:23.940 --> 00:36:27.300
One is just how visually dull it was.

735
00:36:27.360 --> 00:36:29.039
Strangely world.

736
00:36:29.099 --> 00:36:31.860
And just how unambitious the visuals were.

737
00:36:31.920 --> 00:36:35.519
Whereas I feel like there's a lot of effect sequences here, you

738
00:36:35.519 --> 00:36:39.480
know, they're trying to make it look as fun and as engaging as

739
00:36:39.480 --> 00:36:40.679
they possibly can.

740
00:36:40.739 --> 00:36:43.559
The other thing is just how bloody dreary a lot of these sets

741
00:36:43.559 --> 00:36:44.159
are.

742
00:36:44.219 --> 00:36:45.900
Well, I'll tell you now, I watch Regeneration.

743
00:36:45.960 --> 00:36:49.920
I watched the expanse and I watched anomaly and they find a way of

744
00:36:49.920 --> 00:36:53.219
shooting those sets in a really dynamic way.

745
00:36:53.280 --> 00:36:54.719
There's some action in anomaly.

746
00:36:54.780 --> 00:36:57.599
There's a 5 minute action sequence in engineering and the

747
00:36:57.599 --> 00:37:01.800
corridors where cameras are swooping through those. like a drone

748
00:37:01.800 --> 00:37:04.679
or something and they absolutely make it work.

749
00:37:05.159 --> 00:37:08.880
I, I, I like this engineering set.

750
00:37:08.940 --> 00:37:13.800
So this is, you know, the horizontal warp core like they have on

751
00:37:13.800 --> 00:37:16.260
um, original series.

752
00:37:16.440 --> 00:37:20.639
But just the thing they're trying to sell it as a submarine.

753
00:37:20.639 --> 00:37:26.460
And I think, you know, I'm growing to like the sets a bit more.

754
00:37:26.519 --> 00:37:28.559
The problem is that gun metal gray everywhere.

755
00:37:28.980 --> 00:37:29.579
Gray.

756
00:37:29.639 --> 00:37:32.340
Yeah, along with those boring plumbers outfits.

757
00:37:32.400 --> 00:37:34.619
It's just all very montane looking.

758
00:37:34.679 --> 00:37:36.179
Is it?

759
00:37:36.239 --> 00:37:38.699
But there's always one thing I realised, though, watching kind of

760
00:37:38.699 --> 00:37:41.940
like a couple of enterprise episodes and, you know, good

761
00:37:41.940 --> 00:37:43.199
enterprise episodes.

762
00:37:43.199 --> 00:37:48.719
I realised my big problem with this show is I just don't care

763
00:37:48.719 --> 00:37:52.380
about these characters in the way I do Voyager, DS9, next

764
00:37:52.380 --> 00:37:53.340
generation.

765
00:37:53.400 --> 00:37:56.639
They're just not as likeable and they're just not as engaging.

766
00:37:56.639 --> 00:37:58.019
And for me, that is a problem.

767
00:37:58.079 --> 00:38:03.300
Just 12nd. trip, put the movie on full screen, you bastard.

768
00:38:03.360 --> 00:38:04.440
What's wrong with you?

769
00:38:04.980 --> 00:38:07.199
We have the technology.

770
00:38:07.500 --> 00:38:09.420
And now look at this.

771
00:38:09.480 --> 00:38:10.619
She's playing go.

772
00:38:10.679 --> 00:38:15.659
She's beating him at go and go is a much, much more complicated

773
00:38:15.659 --> 00:38:17.159
game than chess.

774
00:38:17.219 --> 00:38:20.400
Like she's already learned go in a day.

775
00:38:20.460 --> 00:38:24.239
So this is a woman who could a woman.

776
00:38:24.300 --> 00:38:27.900
This is a person who could do anything.

777
00:38:27.960 --> 00:38:29.639
Yeah, it's an actress though, isn't it?

778
00:38:29.760 --> 00:38:31.199
He's an actress. yeah.

779
00:38:31.679 --> 00:38:36.360
But who could do anything and she's just sitting in a room all

780
00:38:36.360 --> 00:38:36.659
day.

781
00:38:36.719 --> 00:38:39.300
She eats and sleeps sometimes.

782
00:38:39.480 --> 00:38:42.780
And look how animated she is.

783
00:38:42.840 --> 00:38:43.920
Yeah.

784
00:38:43.980 --> 00:38:47.340
Well, I think I think the feeling you get from all of these scenes

785
00:38:47.340 --> 00:38:51.059
is there's just enormous potential for this person to grow, you

786
00:38:51.059 --> 00:38:51.179
know.

787
00:38:51.239 --> 00:38:54.840
And so there's no way that this is, that's what, sorry, that's

788
00:38:54.840 --> 00:38:57.780
what's annoying about the ending is Archer basically says no.

789
00:38:57.900 --> 00:38:58.920
You know?

790
00:38:58.980 --> 00:39:01.019
We're not going to let you grow.

791
00:39:01.079 --> 00:39:03.719
We're gonna maintain this relationship when you're going back to

792
00:39:03.719 --> 00:39:04.079
your people.

793
00:39:04.199 --> 00:39:08.039
Well, I don't think I think the relationship's broken.

794
00:39:08.099 --> 00:39:12.840
I think, um, but we don't see it, which is a problem, but we're

795
00:39:12.840 --> 00:39:18.059
told that the captain, that Drenik is furious when he calls them.

796
00:39:18.119 --> 00:39:20.639
And so I think the relationship is called off at that point.

797
00:39:20.699 --> 00:39:24.000
And so this is the problem, that all of the toys and the

798
00:39:24.000 --> 00:39:28.739
technological advances and the cheese and the boning all stop

799
00:39:28.739 --> 00:39:30.599
because of what Tripp has done.

800
00:39:30.659 --> 00:39:35.579
But how could the Federation maintain an amicable relationship

801
00:39:35.579 --> 00:39:37.139
with a society?

802
00:39:37.199 --> 00:39:39.000
How have they kept 3?

803
00:39:39.360 --> 00:39:43.559
You know, now that they know, how are they doing?

804
00:39:43.619 --> 00:39:45.239
Yeah, yeah.

805
00:39:45.300 --> 00:39:48.659
So remember the trade in Voyager?

806
00:39:48.719 --> 00:39:49.800
Who are they?

807
00:39:49.860 --> 00:39:56.039
So they were a bunch of white people who, um, they initially

808
00:39:56.039 --> 00:39:56.460
liked.

809
00:39:56.519 --> 00:39:59.699
Yeah, and that they have caused the case on factions and stuff.

810
00:39:59.760 --> 00:40:03.599
And initially they're lovely and we can get on and we can have an

811
00:40:03.599 --> 00:40:04.619
alliance and stuff.

812
00:40:04.679 --> 00:40:07.860
And then Janeway discovers that they've oppressed the Kazon and

813
00:40:07.860 --> 00:40:09.059
then it's off, right?

814
00:40:09.119 --> 00:40:15.599
So having Drenik break the relationship off and not Archer, I

815
00:40:15.599 --> 00:40:17.039
think, is a problem as well.

816
00:40:17.099 --> 00:40:19.619
Well, do you know what?

817
00:40:19.679 --> 00:40:24.360
Actually, alliances, that the episode that the trade were in, I

818
00:40:24.360 --> 00:40:28.260
would say it's nowhere near as subtly done as this. very kind of

819
00:40:28.260 --> 00:40:28.860
comic book.

820
00:40:28.920 --> 00:40:30.059
But you know what?

821
00:40:30.119 --> 00:40:31.320
It's a lot more fun to watch.

822
00:40:31.380 --> 00:40:34.800
It's got a fabulous sequence at the end when occasion ship comes

823
00:40:34.800 --> 00:40:37.019
down or the tradeship comes down and tries to assassinate

824
00:40:37.019 --> 00:40:38.579
everybody and this piece comes from.

825
00:40:38.639 --> 00:40:39.300
I mean it's amazing.

826
00:40:40.739 --> 00:40:46.500
But also as well, I really like it when they box the captain into

827
00:40:46.500 --> 00:40:51.000
a corner where they've got to make a tough choice or make, you

828
00:40:51.000 --> 00:40:53.940
know, one of 2 choices and neither of them are a good choice.

829
00:40:54.000 --> 00:40:57.119
But you want them to make the better choice.

830
00:40:57.179 --> 00:40:58.079
Yeah.

831
00:40:58.079 --> 00:41:00.960
And no one more often than not, they do, you know.

832
00:41:01.019 --> 00:41:03.119
And I don't think that happens here.

833
00:41:03.179 --> 00:41:04.920
Obviously, we're not there yet.

834
00:41:04.980 --> 00:41:07.800
But like it's like in, um, do you remember Chuvic's?

835
00:41:08.880 --> 00:41:13.139
And I think that is a much better episode than people give it

836
00:41:13.139 --> 00:41:13.800
credit for.

837
00:41:13.860 --> 00:41:17.219
And Janeway's got to make, you know, he's basically saying, please

838
00:41:17.219 --> 00:41:17.940
don't kill me.

839
00:41:18.000 --> 00:41:18.900
I'm a person.

840
00:41:18.960 --> 00:41:20.219
Now I'm a unique person.

841
00:41:20.219 --> 00:41:23.159
And she literally walks him through.

842
00:41:23.159 --> 00:41:25.079
Just forcibly drags him to the, yeah.

843
00:41:25.139 --> 00:41:27.780
Yeah, like at gunpoint. you know.

844
00:41:27.960 --> 00:41:31.500
And he's like, you know, are you all going to stand there while

845
00:41:31.500 --> 00:41:35.039
she commits murder and he's crying and it's really, it's probably

846
00:41:35.039 --> 00:41:36.059
traumatic.

847
00:41:36.119 --> 00:41:40.619
Um, I mean, this is a bit more subtle than that as well.

848
00:41:40.679 --> 00:41:41.820
Maybe boy just...

849
00:41:41.820 --> 00:41:45.360
Yeah, yeah, maybe voyage is more of a cartoon than this.

850
00:41:45.420 --> 00:41:47.880
But that's not a criticism.

851
00:41:47.940 --> 00:41:53.760
So this, this is the 1st of 2 scenes where Archer choose, um

852
00:41:53.760 --> 00:41:55.440
choose trip out.

853
00:41:55.500 --> 00:42:00.119
And they're both super uncomfortable to watch.

854
00:42:00.179 --> 00:42:05.340
Um, and, you know, Scott Bacular is one of the most charming and

855
00:42:05.340 --> 00:42:07.199
genial actors you can possibly imagine.

856
00:42:07.260 --> 00:42:12.000
So I just don't understand why he's being such a prick here.

857
00:42:12.719 --> 00:42:20.699
Like the writing is so troubling, even bacular, can't salvage the

858
00:42:20.699 --> 00:42:21.059
character.

859
00:42:21.420 --> 00:42:25.980
I think he makes an acting choice a little bit later, which is

860
00:42:25.980 --> 00:42:28.500
attempting to remedy a script efficiency.

861
00:42:28.559 --> 00:42:33.780
But it's very subtle and I could just be imagining it, but I'll

862
00:42:33.780 --> 00:42:34.320
talk about it.

863
00:42:34.619 --> 00:42:37.800
I mean, at least in anomaly that I watched, you know, he's

864
00:42:37.800 --> 00:42:39.360
supposed to be being an asshole.

865
00:42:39.420 --> 00:42:43.320
Like, like he's angry and he's reacting against the situation.

866
00:42:43.380 --> 00:42:48.300
Like in a strange new world and in this, like we said in Strange

867
00:42:48.300 --> 00:42:51.179
New Worlds, I think our sympathy is kind of supposed to be with

868
00:42:51.179 --> 00:42:51.420
him.

869
00:42:51.719 --> 00:42:53.760
Yeah, yeah.

870
00:42:53.820 --> 00:42:57.239
So this like, did she ask you to teach her how to read?

871
00:42:57.300 --> 00:43:00.960
It's kind of like he is yelling at her, for teaching someone to

872
00:43:00.960 --> 00:43:06.000
read, someone who is intelligent, who could benefit from it, who

873
00:43:06.000 --> 00:43:13.619
is forbidden, for no reason, uh, to read, uh, a feature of slavery

874
00:43:13.619 --> 00:43:17.699
in America in the last, you know, few centuries at this point.

875
00:43:17.760 --> 00:43:19.920
You know, like, I think it's bad.

876
00:43:19.980 --> 00:43:21.480
I think it's a bad law.

877
00:43:21.539 --> 00:43:24.900
It is, but it does expose that, you know, the whole thing about

878
00:43:24.900 --> 00:43:28.739
Star Trek is to go out, seek out new civilisations, you know

879
00:43:28.739 --> 00:43:32.219
Boldigo, where no man has gone before, and they've boxed him into

880
00:43:32.219 --> 00:43:37.380
a situation here where the nature of doing that and and learning

881
00:43:37.380 --> 00:43:41.639
from that species means that you you have to turn a blind eye to

882
00:43:41.639 --> 00:43:43.920
something. sacrifice your morals, basically.

883
00:43:43.980 --> 00:43:44.760
Yeah.

884
00:43:44.820 --> 00:43:45.840
Yeah.

885
00:43:45.900 --> 00:43:48.000
And so she's asking to stay.

886
00:43:48.000 --> 00:43:53.219
And, like, why, why does he give her back?

887
00:43:53.280 --> 00:43:54.840
Why does he give Charles?

888
00:43:55.019 --> 00:43:59.340
Charles now even in the even in the subtitles I'm watching, which

889
00:43:59.340 --> 00:44:00.360
I just think is fantastic.

890
00:44:00.420 --> 00:44:02.280
I like how they've seen his play now.

891
00:44:02.340 --> 00:44:04.739
I know I know you're not keen on these 2 characters, these 2

892
00:44:04.739 --> 00:44:06.000
imperial characters.

893
00:44:06.059 --> 00:44:07.800
I like to be unlikeable.

894
00:44:07.860 --> 00:44:09.900
Well, it's not hysterical though, is it?

895
00:44:09.960 --> 00:44:12.599
It would have been very easy to play all this, you know, at a

896
00:44:12.599 --> 00:44:13.500
hysterical level.

897
00:44:13.559 --> 00:44:16.739
And yet it's all just, it's just like intelligent conversation.

898
00:44:16.800 --> 00:44:17.940
I quite like that.

899
00:44:18.480 --> 00:44:23.519
Yeah, I think, but I think too, it's kind of like, oh, well, you

900
00:44:23.519 --> 00:44:29.639
know, we have to enslave this person because we want to have

901
00:44:29.639 --> 00:44:30.300
children.

902
00:44:30.360 --> 00:44:35.219
You know, like I just think it's gross and she is so awful.

903
00:44:35.340 --> 00:44:36.719
Yeah, my goodness.

904
00:44:36.780 --> 00:44:39.599
The performance is great and they found someone with the most...

905
00:44:39.599 --> 00:44:40.920
The weirdest looking eyes.

906
00:44:40.980 --> 00:44:44.039
Yeah, yeah, yeah, plus the latest, doesn't she?

907
00:44:44.099 --> 00:44:47.039
I mean, she's such a fucking Karen.

908
00:44:47.099 --> 00:44:49.440
Like, she's such an entitled white lady.

909
00:44:49.500 --> 00:44:51.000
It's so bad.

910
00:44:51.059 --> 00:44:52.739
It's terrible.

911
00:44:54.900 --> 00:44:58.139
Oh, damn, a pair of them, honestly.

912
00:44:58.679 --> 00:45:03.719
Yeah, and I don't understand why Archer gives Charles back to

913
00:45:03.719 --> 00:45:03.960
them.

914
00:45:04.019 --> 00:45:05.460
I just don't understand it.

915
00:45:05.519 --> 00:45:09.119
You know, she's asked for asylum.

916
00:45:09.179 --> 00:45:11.099
She is oppressed.

917
00:45:11.159 --> 00:45:13.920
You know, she, they don't fear reprisals.

918
00:45:13.980 --> 00:45:16.980
Like Andreas isn't going to come after them with a gunship and

919
00:45:16.980 --> 00:45:17.519
kill them.

920
00:45:17.579 --> 00:45:19.440
So what's the point?

921
00:45:19.500 --> 00:45:22.860
You know, like we want to maintain the relationship with this

922
00:45:22.860 --> 00:45:26.460
incredibly toxic society?

923
00:45:27.539 --> 00:45:29.639
I said to you, didn't I?

924
00:45:29.760 --> 00:45:35.400
Picard, Kirk, Cisco, Janeway, they would have found a way, you

925
00:45:35.400 --> 00:45:35.639
know?

926
00:45:35.699 --> 00:45:40.139
And I, you know, you could point out loads of Star Trek episodes

927
00:45:40.139 --> 00:45:42.659
where people ask for asylum and they find a way.

928
00:45:42.719 --> 00:45:45.840
They find a way of resolving those stories unproblematic.

929
00:45:45.900 --> 00:45:46.260
Yeah.

930
00:45:46.260 --> 00:45:48.119
Do you remember, what's his name?

931
00:45:48.179 --> 00:45:55.079
Tosk in very early where he requests asylum and then O'Brien then

932
00:45:55.079 --> 00:45:58.980
releases him out of the prison so he can continue like the hum.

933
00:45:59.039 --> 00:46:03.360
And then Cisco, Cisco says at the end, you know, you've you've

934
00:46:03.360 --> 00:46:05.099
destroyed a relationship with these people.

935
00:46:05.159 --> 00:46:08.699
How dare you, you know, get out of my office.

936
00:46:08.760 --> 00:46:12.960
And then on the way out, he's like, um, O'Brien goes, well, how is

937
00:46:12.960 --> 00:46:15.719
it that you you didn't manage to stop us?

938
00:46:15.719 --> 00:46:17.940
Because I figured that as soon as you realised what I was doing, he

939
00:46:17.940 --> 00:46:19.920
was going, yeah, I guess that one got us by, didn't it?

940
00:46:19.980 --> 00:46:23.760
You know, and it's like, it's an acknowledgement that they did the

941
00:46:23.760 --> 00:46:24.179
right thing.

942
00:46:24.239 --> 00:46:25.380
Yeah.

943
00:46:25.440 --> 00:46:26.219
Yeah.

944
00:46:26.280 --> 00:46:30.059
So, look, this is sort of super genial, even though we've had, you

945
00:46:30.059 --> 00:46:32.159
know, like an incident and stuff.

946
00:46:32.219 --> 00:46:33.780
He's still super happy.

947
00:46:33.900 --> 00:46:37.320
Drenik is still happy to continue the relationship.

948
00:46:38.400 --> 00:46:42.000
Do you remember in, um, sorry, I've gone a bit everywhere else in

949
00:46:42.000 --> 00:46:44.039
this Star Trek apart from this episode, but it's an interesting

950
00:46:44.039 --> 00:46:44.760
parallel.

951
00:46:44.820 --> 00:46:49.199
In TNG season one, where I said they were, you know, off around

952
00:46:49.199 --> 00:46:52.559
the universe, civilising societies and turning a blind eye weather

953
00:46:52.559 --> 00:46:52.980
down.

954
00:46:53.039 --> 00:46:54.599
Well, they're basically these people, aren't they?

955
00:46:55.559 --> 00:46:57.599
This alien race.

956
00:46:59.400 --> 00:47:01.980
They can take a good look archer.

957
00:47:02.039 --> 00:47:04.920
This is what this is what the Federation is going to become, like

958
00:47:04.920 --> 00:47:06.119
this arrogant race.

959
00:47:06.719 --> 00:47:08.699
Oh here's the dog.

960
00:47:08.760 --> 00:47:09.179
Yeah.

961
00:47:09.900 --> 00:47:12.599
Well, he's very cute, the dog, though.

962
00:47:12.659 --> 00:47:17.400
But why is he sitting there with a fucking ball?

963
00:47:17.460 --> 00:47:20.940
Like an water polo ball on his stomach while he reads a ball?

964
00:47:21.000 --> 00:47:22.139
an all American hero.

965
00:47:22.199 --> 00:47:22.739
That's why.

966
00:47:22.800 --> 00:47:24.000
That's right.

967
00:47:24.059 --> 00:47:26.579
It's a lot too bookish.

968
00:47:27.480 --> 00:47:30.659
Yeah, he's got a book and a ball.

969
00:47:30.960 --> 00:47:33.840
He appears too intelligent, you know.

970
00:47:35.460 --> 00:47:40.199
And so we've now had the message, but we don't, again, don't get

971
00:47:40.199 --> 00:47:44.460
to see it and we don't get to see Drenik's reaction or anything

972
00:47:44.460 --> 00:47:45.000
like this.

973
00:47:45.059 --> 00:47:49.019
So this is the 2nd time that he gets chewed out.

974
00:47:49.079 --> 00:47:55.079
And why does the cogenitor kill herself?

975
00:47:55.079 --> 00:48:02.880
And the answer is, because Archer refused to grant her asylum and

976
00:48:02.880 --> 00:48:07.079
she was aware that the slavery that she was going to live under

977
00:48:07.079 --> 00:48:12.119
for the rest of her life was not all that she was capable of.

978
00:48:12.179 --> 00:48:17.519
And so Archer and the Vicians are responsible for the suicide.

979
00:48:17.579 --> 00:48:20.760
And we don't get a hint of that from Archer at all.

980
00:48:20.820 --> 00:48:23.280
Archer doesn't say, I understand.

981
00:48:23.340 --> 00:48:27.059
Archer doesn't say the conditions that the congenitor was forced

982
00:48:27.059 --> 00:48:28.500
to live underwear intolerable.

983
00:48:28.559 --> 00:48:31.679
He's just kind of there, another culture, and now I don't get to

984
00:48:31.679 --> 00:48:33.059
play with their toys anymore.

985
00:48:33.119 --> 00:48:35.099
And I think it's disgusting.

986
00:48:35.159 --> 00:48:36.840
I think it's so bad.

987
00:48:36.900 --> 00:48:41.280
And the episode itself, all the criticism is pointed at Tripp.

988
00:48:41.340 --> 00:48:42.539
Yeah.

989
00:48:42.599 --> 00:48:46.440
Archer doesn't even acknowledge what, you know, what trip was

990
00:48:46.440 --> 00:48:50.159
doing or that that was a competing and and, you know, possible

991
00:48:50.159 --> 00:48:54.179
ethical position to come to doesn't acknowledge it at all. doesn't

992
00:48:54.179 --> 00:48:57.659
say, I understand why you did this, but it was wrong.

993
00:48:57.719 --> 00:48:58.860
You know, like none of that.

994
00:48:58.920 --> 00:49:00.360
He just choose him out.

995
00:49:00.420 --> 00:49:02.940
You thought you were doing the right thing and now someone's

996
00:49:02.940 --> 00:49:03.300
dead.

997
00:49:03.360 --> 00:49:07.260
And that horrible fucking couple's child will never be born.

998
00:49:07.320 --> 00:49:08.760
That's the line, isn't it?

999
00:49:08.820 --> 00:49:10.199
That is the line.

1000
00:49:11.460 --> 00:49:14.880
Yeah, we've got moral obligations to people who don't even exist.

1001
00:49:14.940 --> 00:49:19.139
Like, what is going on over people that do?

1002
00:49:19.199 --> 00:49:21.239
Yes, that's right.

1003
00:49:21.300 --> 00:49:22.139
That's right.

1004
00:49:22.199 --> 00:49:25.380
The cogenitor, Charles has to sacrifice her freedom for the sake

1005
00:49:25.380 --> 00:49:26.940
of this child that doesn't exist yet.

1006
00:49:27.000 --> 00:49:30.659
I do, all of that, I acknowledge.

1007
00:49:30.719 --> 00:49:32.940
I do really like this scene now.

1008
00:49:33.000 --> 00:49:34.199
I don't like what it's saying.

1009
00:49:34.619 --> 00:49:38.280
But I do like, I like the scene because when I watched it

1010
00:49:38.280 --> 00:49:43.320
afterwards, I felt deeply uncomfortable about the episode and I do

1011
00:49:43.320 --> 00:49:46.440
like it when TV pushes me in an area where I'm feeling a bit

1012
00:49:46.440 --> 00:49:47.159
disconfident.

1013
00:49:47.219 --> 00:49:50.820
But also it really made me think about everything that had played

1014
00:49:50.820 --> 00:49:53.400
out and I'm like, well, who's right here?

1015
00:49:53.460 --> 00:49:54.119
Who's right?

1016
00:49:54.179 --> 00:49:56.699
And, you know, like we, and we had some discussion back and

1017
00:49:56.699 --> 00:49:57.059
forth.

1018
00:49:57.059 --> 00:49:58.739
And that's good Star Trek.

1019
00:49:58.860 --> 00:50:00.480
Yeah, yeah.

1020
00:50:00.539 --> 00:50:06.960
But also I do think that the politics of Voyager and Enterprise

1021
00:50:06.960 --> 00:50:13.860
are not really the utopian kind of, you know, the socialist utopia

1022
00:50:13.860 --> 00:50:16.980
of of Gene Roddenbury's Star Trek.

1023
00:50:17.039 --> 00:50:18.900
I think it is much more conservative.

1024
00:50:18.900 --> 00:50:23.099
And this becomes an analogue for America, I think.

1025
00:50:23.159 --> 00:50:26.099
You know, I mean, our fleet's always that.

1026
00:50:26.219 --> 00:50:28.199
The Federation's always America, really.

1027
00:50:28.320 --> 00:50:33.900
But here there's a sort of deeply uncomfortable unwillingness to

1028
00:50:33.900 --> 00:50:38.340
do anything about human rights in other countries that's being

1029
00:50:38.340 --> 00:50:41.940
expressed here in a sort of Star Trek way.

1030
00:50:42.000 --> 00:50:46.800
I think the shittiest line there, like the worst line is about the

1031
00:50:46.800 --> 00:50:47.760
unborn child.

1032
00:50:47.820 --> 00:50:53.340
That is just, I was just like, oh, no, really like that's your

1033
00:50:53.340 --> 00:50:53.820
argument.

1034
00:50:53.880 --> 00:50:55.679
It's not just unborn.

1035
00:50:55.739 --> 00:50:56.820
It unconceived.

1036
00:50:56.880 --> 00:50:57.960
Like there's no child.

1037
00:50:58.019 --> 00:51:00.900
It's just an idea at this point, you know.

1038
00:51:00.960 --> 00:51:06.900
See, I was I was reading like anti-abortion things into that and

1039
00:51:06.900 --> 00:51:09.719
that just made me feel super uncomfortable because I'm like, okay

1040
00:51:09.719 --> 00:51:12.360
these are the these are the people that have created this show, you

1041
00:51:12.360 --> 00:51:12.599
know?

1042
00:51:12.659 --> 00:51:13.380
Yeah.

1043
00:51:13.500 --> 00:51:18.840
And it's, it's, like, should Star Trek ever be, um, you know

1044
00:51:18.840 --> 00:51:21.659
creative and written in such a conservative way.

1045
00:51:21.719 --> 00:51:22.619
I don't think so.

1046
00:51:22.739 --> 00:51:24.119
No.

1047
00:51:24.179 --> 00:51:29.340
And I think increasingly, in the late 90s version of Star Trek

1048
00:51:29.340 --> 00:51:31.559
like in the late Berman era.

1049
00:51:31.619 --> 00:51:34.380
I think that the politics do get more and more conservative.

1050
00:51:34.440 --> 00:51:37.619
And like you were talking about, you know, we're responding to 9

1051
00:51:36.840 --> 00:51:40.920
11, and so it's okay for Archer to push people out of airlocks, you

1052
00:51:40.920 --> 00:51:43.980
know, that sort of behaviour is justified because of 9-11.

1053
00:51:44.159 --> 00:51:49.019
And given what happened after 911 and Abu Ghraib and all of those

1054
00:51:49.019 --> 00:51:49.440
things.

1055
00:51:49.500 --> 00:51:53.099
You know, it's a deeply problematic position to stake out and I

1056
00:51:53.099 --> 00:51:54.420
don't really like it.

1057
00:51:54.480 --> 00:52:01.079
But like also, Brannan Bragger had a big hand in latter-day TNG

1058
00:52:01.079 --> 00:52:03.360
and in a lot of Voyager as well.

1059
00:52:03.420 --> 00:52:06.239
And I don't think Voyages as conservative as this.

1060
00:52:06.480 --> 00:52:09.659
I think it's a bit isolationist.

1061
00:52:09.719 --> 00:52:12.239
I don't think it's deliberately conservative, but it's set in an

1062
00:52:12.239 --> 00:52:15.059
area where basically aliens are out to get you.

1063
00:52:15.119 --> 00:52:19.260
And so it doesn't have that internationalist sort of viewpoint

1064
00:52:19.260 --> 00:52:21.539
that discovery or next generation has.

1065
00:52:21.780 --> 00:52:26.039
Whereas I think enterprise is far more Burman's, maybe.

1066
00:52:26.099 --> 00:52:30.059
And this is this is the show he had the biggest creative hand in.

1067
00:52:30.119 --> 00:52:34.619
I don't think he wrote a script for DSI and Voyager, whereas he's

1068
00:52:34.619 --> 00:52:38.039
he's got a hand in writing probably about half the scripts of

1069
00:52:38.039 --> 00:52:38.880
Enterprise, you know.

1070
00:52:38.940 --> 00:52:40.619
This is his voice.

1071
00:52:40.679 --> 00:52:42.119
Yeah, yeah.

1072
00:52:42.179 --> 00:52:48.239
Well, and also Berman and Bragger remove themselves very much.

1073
00:52:48.300 --> 00:52:52.980
I think Bragger's got a slight, he's like reading over scripts and

1074
00:52:52.980 --> 00:52:57.719
things like this in season four, but essentially they have phoned

1075
00:52:57.719 --> 00:52:59.039
out the series at that point.

1076
00:52:59.099 --> 00:53:04.199
And that's the point where the show starts embracing a lot of the

1077
00:53:04.199 --> 00:53:08.880
Star Trek idea, starts taking on more of a TOS feel.

1078
00:53:08.880 --> 00:53:12.539
And it's probably the show at its absolute best.

1079
00:53:12.599 --> 00:53:16.019
And probably as Bragg assess himself, an interview that I read

1080
00:53:16.019 --> 00:53:18.780
this week, where the show should have started.

1081
00:53:24.840 --> 00:53:31.800
All right, it's time for us to choose our episode for next week

1082
00:53:31.800 --> 00:53:36.300
and I'm the one with my finger on the button today.

1083
00:53:36.360 --> 00:53:41.820
I'm at Untitled Star Trek project.com slash Randomiser.

1084
00:53:41.880 --> 00:53:43.260
I mean, you say episode.

1085
00:53:43.320 --> 00:53:47.639
We've just had a slight discussion here and I question whether we

1086
00:53:47.639 --> 00:53:49.980
are going to be watching an episode. of something.

1087
00:53:50.159 --> 00:53:52.260
More like a little vignette.

1088
00:53:52.800 --> 00:53:54.119
Yeah, yeah.

1089
00:53:54.179 --> 00:53:57.480
So what we're going to do is we're going to choose a random short

1090
00:53:57.480 --> 00:53:57.960
track.

1091
00:53:58.019 --> 00:54:00.539
I really like the short tracks.

1092
00:54:00.599 --> 00:54:03.900
I think probably this is going to end up being a shorter podcast

1093
00:54:03.900 --> 00:54:06.000
episode, but who knows what will happen?

1094
00:54:06.059 --> 00:54:09.360
And I think some of them are really clever.

1095
00:54:09.420 --> 00:54:13.920
I think some of them are funny and some of them, yeah, some of

1096
00:54:13.920 --> 00:54:14.639
them are beautiful.

1097
00:54:14.699 --> 00:54:16.739
So that's what we're going to go with.

1098
00:54:16.800 --> 00:54:18.780
Job knows nothing of these.

1099
00:54:18.840 --> 00:54:21.420
Oh, you know, 10 minutes, 15 minutes sometimes.

1100
00:54:21.480 --> 00:54:23.039
Wow, we're going to say...

1101
00:54:23.099 --> 00:54:25.019
You had to talk very quickly about them, then, aren't we?

1102
00:54:25.079 --> 00:54:27.539
Well, we'll debrief.

1103
00:54:27.599 --> 00:54:30.480
We'll talk about it going in and then debrief.

1104
00:54:30.539 --> 00:54:35.699
But I do think that they are an important feature of modern trek

1105
00:54:35.699 --> 00:54:40.559
that they have allowed trek the space to experiment a bit, and

1106
00:54:40.559 --> 00:54:43.679
they have actually introduced plot elements that have made their

1107
00:54:43.679 --> 00:54:44.760
way into discovery.

1108
00:54:44.880 --> 00:54:48.360
So I think that they are worth a look.

1109
00:54:48.420 --> 00:54:50.159
Are they broadcast?

1110
00:54:51.360 --> 00:54:54.719
I don't know Well, were they just online?

1111
00:54:54.719 --> 00:54:57.480
Because I do have a bit of an issue with this, you know, because

1112
00:54:57.480 --> 00:55:00.780
Doctor Who was doing this for a bit where they were writing like

1113
00:55:00.780 --> 00:55:05.579
DVD extras, which absolutely dealt with emotional ramifications

1114
00:55:05.579 --> 00:55:07.019
that should have been in episodes themselves.

1115
00:55:07.079 --> 00:55:07.860
In the show.

1116
00:55:07.920 --> 00:55:08.400
Yeah.

1117
00:55:08.460 --> 00:55:10.500
I think that this does a better job than that.

1118
00:55:10.559 --> 00:55:14.039
They are on when, well, when Discovery used to be on Netflix.

1119
00:55:14.099 --> 00:55:16.980
They were in the additional scenes section.

1120
00:55:16.980 --> 00:55:19.739
And so they have been on streaming.

1121
00:55:19.800 --> 00:55:23.280
And I'll check when I do the randomiser and see if a broadcast

1122
00:55:23.280 --> 00:55:26.400
date comes up because I think maybe they have broadcast dates.

1123
00:55:26.460 --> 00:55:28.199
We'll do it.

1124
00:55:28.260 --> 00:55:29.159
Okay.

1125
00:55:29.219 --> 00:55:30.239
Shall I press a button?

1126
00:55:30.300 --> 00:55:32.280
Just a very quick question.

1127
00:55:32.340 --> 00:55:36.659
Does he cover like the length and breadth of Kurtzman Trek or are

1128
00:55:36.659 --> 00:55:37.440
they just Discovery?

1129
00:55:37.500 --> 00:55:38.340
Short tracks?

1130
00:55:38.400 --> 00:55:40.199
No, there's a Picard one.

1131
00:55:40.260 --> 00:55:46.019
There's a, um, So they, they accompany series one on two, so

1132
00:55:46.019 --> 00:55:51.480
there's an introduction to Picard, and there are some animated

1133
00:55:51.480 --> 00:55:51.960
ones.

1134
00:55:52.019 --> 00:55:55.920
They're, yeah, it's it's mostly discovery, but it comes at it from

1135
00:55:55.920 --> 00:55:57.119
an interesting angle, I think.

1136
00:55:57.179 --> 00:55:57.900
Okay.

1137
00:55:58.019 --> 00:55:59.639
All right.

1138
00:55:59.699 --> 00:56:00.539
Okay.

1139
00:56:00.599 --> 00:56:02.760
So I'm going to press the button.

1140
00:56:04.079 --> 00:56:06.960
Runaway series one, episode one.

1141
00:56:07.019 --> 00:56:07.920
Okay.

1142
00:56:07.920 --> 00:56:09.119
Is that discovery?

1143
00:56:09.119 --> 00:56:14.039
Yeah, it's Tilly and then the princess who turns up at the end of

1144
00:56:14.039 --> 00:56:17.159
series one, I think.

1145
00:56:17.219 --> 00:56:22.079
It was 1st broadcast on Thursday, the 4th of October 2018.

1146
00:56:22.380 --> 00:56:24.119
So it does have a broadcast date.

1147
00:56:24.179 --> 00:56:25.800
I'm going to roll again though.

1148
00:56:25.860 --> 00:56:27.239
Oh, okay.

1149
00:56:27.300 --> 00:56:28.139
Well, not that one.

1150
00:56:28.199 --> 00:56:30.719
I don't really like it that much Oh my god.

1151
00:56:31.380 --> 00:56:34.920
I think that's what we call in the trade cheap, you know.

1152
00:56:34.980 --> 00:56:37.199
Well, this is the this is the thing.

1153
00:56:37.260 --> 00:56:38.820
We re-roll if we don't want to do it.

1154
00:56:38.880 --> 00:56:42.300
The girl who made the stars, that's animated.

1155
00:56:42.360 --> 00:56:42.719
Oh, great.

1156
00:56:42.780 --> 00:56:43.079
Yeah.

1157
00:56:43.260 --> 00:56:46.800
That was the 1st animated bit of trek, you know, I think.

1158
00:56:46.860 --> 00:56:49.260
Well, apart from the animated series.

1159
00:56:49.320 --> 00:56:50.460
Oh, yeah, whoops.

1160
00:56:51.059 --> 00:56:54.539
The 1st since the 90s 60s.

1161
00:56:54.599 --> 00:56:55.980
I'm going to roll just one more.

1162
00:56:56.039 --> 00:56:56.820
Okay.

1163
00:56:56.820 --> 00:57:01.860
I think that's very good, but, um, Huh.

1164
00:57:01.920 --> 00:57:03.900
This is one that I actually haven't seen.

1165
00:57:04.800 --> 00:57:10.320
It's called The Escape Artist, and it features Harry Maud as

1166
00:57:10.320 --> 00:57:11.940
played by Rain Wilson.

1167
00:57:12.000 --> 00:57:16.139
Oh, what leans into that fabulous season one episode of

1168
00:57:16.139 --> 00:57:16.619
Discovery.

1169
00:57:16.679 --> 00:57:20.099
Well, he's in a couple of episodes of Discovery, remember, in

1170
00:57:20.099 --> 00:57:22.619
series one because Jason Isaacs meets him in prison.

1171
00:57:22.679 --> 00:57:24.119
I can't even remember that character's name.

1172
00:57:24.179 --> 00:57:27.059
There's one with a time loop, which is just the best episode of

1173
00:57:27.059 --> 00:57:27.719
season one.

1174
00:57:27.840 --> 00:57:28.440
Fantastic.

1175
00:57:28.500 --> 00:57:29.460
It's fantastic.

1176
00:57:29.579 --> 00:57:31.320
I'm going to roll one more.

1177
00:57:31.380 --> 00:57:31.980
This is number four.

1178
00:57:32.039 --> 00:57:32.820
Oh, my God.

1179
00:57:32.820 --> 00:57:34.139
There's only 10 to seven.

1180
00:57:34.260 --> 00:57:36.360
We can't do this now record yet.

1181
00:57:36.420 --> 00:57:37.320
Go on.

1182
00:57:37.380 --> 00:57:39.780
Okay, we're going to do children of Mars.

1183
00:57:39.840 --> 00:57:40.679
Okay.

1184
00:57:40.739 --> 00:57:41.940
This is the last one.

1185
00:57:42.000 --> 00:57:47.760
Season two, episode six, 1st broadcast in 2020, January 2020, and

1186
00:57:47.760 --> 00:57:50.039
it is the one that leads into Picard.

1187
00:57:50.099 --> 00:57:52.139
Oh, how interesting.

1188
00:57:52.199 --> 00:57:53.460
Okay, yeah.

1189
00:57:53.519 --> 00:57:56.039
Well, that would be our 1st taste of Picard, won't it?

1190
00:57:56.099 --> 00:57:57.840
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1191
00:57:57.900 --> 00:57:59.460
I think that's going to be interesting.

1192
00:57:59.519 --> 00:58:01.500
And perhaps challenging to talk about.

1193
00:58:01.559 --> 00:58:04.619
Let's see how we go I'm there for it.

1194
00:58:11.820 --> 00:58:16.139
You've been listening to Untitled Star Trek Project with Joe Ford

1195
00:58:16.139 --> 00:58:17.400
and Nathan Bottomley.

1196
00:58:17.519 --> 00:58:21.000
You can find us online at untitledstar trekproject.com where you

1197
00:58:21.000 --> 00:58:23.699
can find links to our Twitter, Facebook, and YouTube channel.

1198
00:58:23.760 --> 00:58:27.719
Our podcast artwork is by Kayla Ciceran, and the theme was

1199
00:58:27.719 --> 00:58:29.519
composed by Cameron Lamb.

1200
00:58:29.579 --> 00:58:33.840
This episode was recorded on the 5th of January 2022 and released

1201
00:58:33.840 --> 00:58:35.340
on the 28th of January.

1202
00:58:35.400 --> 00:58:39.840
We'll see you next time for Short Treks, Children of Marlas.