WEBVTT

NOTE
This transcript was created on 2026-05-01 at 19:48:17

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Hey, Joe. Hi.

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So, we're back in the final series of Enterprise, and we've

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already done the last 3 episodes of Enterprise, but after this

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episode, we will have done the last five.

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So this is a 2 parter, at the end of series 4, and it just comes

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before Demons and Terra Prime, and then these are the Voyages.

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It's called Inner Mirror Darkly, and Inner Mirror Darkly, part 2.

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We're going to watch both of them because that's the rule.

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Um, and it's a pretty amazing two-parter.

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I really enjoyed it.

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What did you think?

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Proof conclusive that Enterprise was finally getting his act

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together in its final season, just as the curtains going down.

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I would quite like to issue an apology to the creators of

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Enterprise, the actors taking part, and to you, because when you

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predictably chose Enterprise to put into the randomiser, I was

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there rolling my eyes going, oh, God, you know, it's going to be

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terrible.

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It's going to be awful.

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I had a lot of fun watching this episode.

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For once.

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I feel like all the rules are off.

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All the enterprise rules are off and no one has to make any boring

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speeches and Archer can be as much of a prick as he likes and, you

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know, everyone's working true of a normal episode.

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But with a good reason this time.

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Yeah, I mean, we're supposed to like him normally.

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And yeah, I've got to say, I think this might be my favourite of

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all the enterprises we've watched so far.

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And I think it might be my favourite Mirror Universe episode we've

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done an untitled Star Trek project so far as well.

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It might be as well.

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So, yeah, yeah.

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This is Enterprise basically saying, or Manikoto saying, let's

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just tick off every box we want to, because the rules are off.

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We can have the gall.

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We can have the folions, we can have original series sets, you

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know, all those things that he probably would have liked to have

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seen in Enterprise, since series one.

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And now we're doing it.

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And boy, shoving it all in this two-parter. a riot.

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Well, I mean, I've watched a fair amount of series 4, but not all

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of it, and I've enjoyed everything.

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I think it's really sort of well told, um, the episodes are fun

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and eventful, interesting things happen.

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I think, like I think this is pretty dumb, but I really, really

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enjoyed it.

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There are things about it that I I still have some reservations

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about it.

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But it's the sheer audacity of the fan wank that's on display that

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I just think is so amazingly great.

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And he's clearly gone, all right, the Tholian Webb and Mirror

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Mirror.

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I will have both of those, somehow he weaves them together.

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So he makes the Tholian web into a kind of sequel to Mirror, Mirror

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without anything really in the original episode, kind of

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suggesting that.

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And then he creates a sequel to those.

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And I think that's magnificent.

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And it just has the sort of usual thing.

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There's reversals and exciting things.

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And of course, something, I think, and we're going to talk to you

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about this during the course of the episode.

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Something that I think Deep Space 9 loses is the original Mirror

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Mirror idea, which is our crew, but they all have the knife one

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another to survive and and kind of progress up the hierarchy.

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And that's the shocking thing about Mirror, Mirror, is that it's

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the enterprise, but it's that.

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And so this really leans into the original conception of the

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mirror universe in mirror, mirror.

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I'm actually kind of pleased this is the only chance because I

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read on memory alpha.

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Had series 5 come along, they would definitely, because the

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reception to this was huge.

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There definitely would have been another Mirror Universe

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enterprise episode.

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And I always feel like it's like the law of diminishing returns a

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lot of the time.

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And like you said, with DS9, it started off as this amazing

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holding up the mirror to our regular characters and continuation

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of Mirror, Mirror.

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And by the end of this on, in series 7, you know, going to the

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mirror universe just meant that you were a cartoon villain and

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gay.

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And that was it.

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You're like, that was as lazy as it got by the end there.

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Whereas this is, is still sort of comic book fun, but it, I think

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it does have something to say in a few pertinent scenes, which I

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appreciated because, I mean, I would have gone along with this if

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it was just knives coming out and foley and webs popping up in

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space and things like this.

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But actually, to have the thread of Tapal realising how things are

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different in the other universe and inciting her own rebellion

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that really boosted up that 2nd part and made me really pay

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attention.

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But just visually.

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This was an excitement to my eyeballs in a way that enterprise so

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rarely is.

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And I did send you a message during part one going, oh, God, I

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thought this was all TOS says, and I'm just stuck on these boring

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enterprise sets as usual.

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And then when that blew up, I literally jumped out the chair and

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went, yes.

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And twice is gone and we're on the Defiant for episode two.

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That's not DS9 is defiant by the way.

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Yeah, like, and the whole 2nd episode, visually, they brought in

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director of photography to do that one.

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And it just looks amazingly good, I thought.

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Yeah, I feel we're going to have so much fun watching this.

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And I would never, ever get to say that about enterprise ever

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again.

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So there's one other thing that I want to say, we did an episode a

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while ago of Discovery Series one called Vaulting Ambition.

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And we thought that was pretty boring.

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Yeah, that was like the 2nd last episode of their Mirror Universe

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Arc, which I think is generally good.

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To be fair, there are some good episodes.

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There's like 4 episodes, isn't there, in series one?

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A couple of them are pretty.

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We just chose the most boring one.

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We chose the worst one.

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I think it may be the worst episode of season one.

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The placeholder mirror episode, that one, isn't it?

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Because I think that's really great.

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But even in vaulting ambition, that episode, Giorgio is referred

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to by her full title, which is her most Imperial Majesty, Mother

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of the Fatherland, Overlord of Vulcan, Dominus of Kronos, Regina

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Andor, Philippa Giorgio, Augustus Yaponius Centaurius.

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And Japonius is Japanese.

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She gets that title from her predecessor, Koshisata.

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And it's a deliberate reference to it.

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And she says, so the crew of discovery, know about the Defiant

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going into the mirror universe, and they want to retrieve it in

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order to find out a way out of the mirror universe through

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interphase space.

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And so that's a reference to this episode.

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It's not really a reference to the Tholian web because it's this

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episode that establishes that the defiant ends up in the mirror

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universe, and she actually says, Giorgio says that she's read the

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files on the Defiant, and they're full of dangerous ideas like

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equality and freedom and cooperation.

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Yes.

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And she says, we won't let you infect us again, because the reason

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that there's no, there's no interaction with our regular crew.

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Like our crew don't find out about the mirror universe in this

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episode because they're not in.

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I want to talk about that in a second, but yeah.

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Yeah.

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But, but Giorgio knows about the Mirror Universe before the people

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on Enterprising Mirror, Mirror, find out about it, she knows about

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it because she's read the Defiance files.

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And she refers to how the defiant gets here through interphasic

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space, which resulted in a temporal anomaly, which sent the

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defiant back in time.

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And so there's a really, really detailed reference to this 2

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parter in vaulting ambition.

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And so I don't think I realised that at the time because I hadn't

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seen this.

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And so it's absolutely Kurtzman doing what he does with Enterprise

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which is, I think, taking an unloved and kind of unsuccessful

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series and giving it love and properly canonising it in a way that

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I think is really generous and wonderful.

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Yeah, I think it's awesome.

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It's so good, but it's still there and it's still Star Trek and

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we're still going to acknowledge it. basically what you say about

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it every time we watch one of these.

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That's right.

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What I think is wonderful about it is the Tholian web, mirror

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mirror, vaulting ambition, all kind of centre around this 2

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parter.

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And I think that's wonderful.

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I think that's really, really top quality fan wank of a kind that

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Manny Koto is, you know, fan wank guy, but, you know, he's

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excelled himself, I think, with this 2 parter.

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You're sorry to sound dangerously like one of those Star Trek fans

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that write spinoff books now, you know?

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loves all like your own personal folio and web of continuity

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threading through the series.

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I mean, you know me.

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I think that's wonderful and I think it is great that they are

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endorsing enterprise in a sort of backhand in kind of a way.

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But for me, less the continuity, more is this entertaining.

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Yes.

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This is really entertaining on its own.

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That would have been a flaw if it hadn't been entertaining on its

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own terms because it's fun.

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Well, I mean, there was a chance.

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This is still enterprise, you know.

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Yeah, very good chance.

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But because it's fun and because it relies on our memories of 2

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good original series episodes, you know, like I just think it

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works really well.

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There's not many times when you and I could talk about an

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enterprise episode and a Kurzman era episode and say the

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enterprise episode is more entertaining.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah.

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Yeah, I certainly think that, you know, this has nothing to say

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about the mirror universe and the only thing that's interesting is

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when Tapol reads the defiance files in part 2 and it inspires a

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rebellion.

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Um, you know, series one of discovery uses the mirror, a universe

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as a kind of...

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MAGA, parallel universe version of the uh, Trump Federation.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

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And so it's commenting on contemporary politics in a way that this

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doesn't do.

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And it has some great images.

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And even vaulting ambition ends with, you know, Gabriel Lorca

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stomping that guy in the head and killing him.

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Like it's pretty amazing.

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But yeah, this is just so far.

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Do you know what the inspiration was to do a Mirror Universe

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episode was originally?

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No.

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It was because they wanted to bring William Shatner into

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Enterprise.

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I'm sorry, we're like, oh, how could we possibly do this?

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Oh, let's do a mirror universe episode and we'll somehow, you know

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all rules are off and he can be in this.

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That all fell through, but they still wanted to do it, right?

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And then Manikoto says...

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Let's not do the usual mirror universe thing then of having our

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characters going into the mirror universe episode and judging

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everything that's going on because then we can avoid and how does

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he say it?

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What was great about our approach where people aren't crossing

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over to the universe is, we can avoid any of those moralising

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speeches where Archer or somebody waves their finger and leches

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these bad people about, well, you really ought to try this other

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way.

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And instead, instead, you just hang out with these dreadful people

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doing awful things.

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And Kel Suprees, that's a lot more fun to watch than our usual

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boar against prize characters.

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I mean, um, Hoshi Sato in this 2 parter.

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If she was like this all the time, I'd be all over that

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character.

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And they do it, they do prove in Kursman Trek, you'd think it

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would be an impossibility for a mirror universe character, like

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how they're characterised to work in the prime universe.

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They made it work.

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Yeah, twice.

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They've Gabriel Walker and then they have Philippa Jordan.

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There's absolutely a possibility that, you know, our regular

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enterprise characters, maybe not, you know, trying to kiss and

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knife each other and poison each other all the time and things

248
00:13:08.940 --> 00:13:09.299
like that.

249
00:13:09.360 --> 00:13:12.960
I don't know, just have getting their fucking hair down and having

250
00:13:12.960 --> 00:13:13.919
some farm, you know?

251
00:13:13.980 --> 00:13:14.700
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

252
00:13:14.759 --> 00:13:15.600
Oh, it's so great.

253
00:13:15.659 --> 00:13:16.799
Yeah.

254
00:13:16.860 --> 00:13:21.539
Well, like, in a way, they do get to have our prime universe

255
00:13:21.539 --> 00:13:26.879
judging the mirror universe because of the defiant files and the

256
00:13:26.879 --> 00:13:29.220
files about the federation that Tapole reads.

257
00:13:29.279 --> 00:13:33.779
But otherwise, her reading or fall is far less damning.

258
00:13:33.840 --> 00:13:34.320
Yes, exactly.

259
00:13:34.379 --> 00:13:34.980
You know.

260
00:13:35.039 --> 00:13:36.179
But can you imagine?

261
00:13:36.179 --> 00:13:37.919
Scott Back, you're like, oh, you're terrible.

262
00:13:37.980 --> 00:13:41.159
Although we do have Scott Bacular in a dual role in this in some

263
00:13:41.159 --> 00:13:45.720
very odd sequences where suddenly our universe archer is there

264
00:13:45.720 --> 00:13:49.500
like a forced ghost from Star Wars, saying to Mirror Universe

265
00:13:49.500 --> 00:13:51.059
Archer, you know, there's a better way than this.

266
00:13:51.120 --> 00:13:52.740
We still have a bit of that in here.

267
00:13:52.799 --> 00:13:55.019
I think that's different though.

268
00:13:55.080 --> 00:13:57.299
And when we get there, I'll talk about what I think's happening.

269
00:13:57.360 --> 00:13:59.759
I just figured it was his conscience tickling a little, you know?

270
00:13:59.820 --> 00:14:01.019
Not quite.

271
00:14:01.080 --> 00:14:07.019
I don't think that's quite But I guess the whole idea too is to

272
00:14:07.019 --> 00:14:10.139
just let the actors let their head down and have fun and that's

273
00:14:10.139 --> 00:14:12.179
the other thing that gets to happen here.

274
00:14:12.240 --> 00:14:14.279
Well, what I will say is this.

275
00:14:14.340 --> 00:14:18.000
Yeah, usually I'll lead this till the end, but let's do it at the

276
00:14:18.000 --> 00:14:19.080
start at this time.

277
00:14:19.440 --> 00:14:23.519
The reception of this episode.

278
00:14:23.639 --> 00:14:26.039
And bear in mind, the reception of Enterprise generally was

279
00:14:26.039 --> 00:14:29.700
everyone wanted to pour it down the plug-hole, you know, and put

280
00:14:29.700 --> 00:14:31.740
it, put it in a, been on fire.

281
00:14:31.799 --> 00:14:34.320
One of the most popular instalments they ever did.

282
00:14:34.379 --> 00:14:38.340
The New York Daily Time says the best hours of Enterprise yet.

283
00:14:38.519 --> 00:14:43.980
At a Star Trek convention for the 50th, it was chosen as part of

284
00:14:43.980 --> 00:14:47.879
the 10 best Star Trek episodes of all time, this two-parter.

285
00:14:48.240 --> 00:14:52.860
Newsweek says it was the best episode of Enterprise there ever

286
00:14:52.860 --> 00:14:53.159
was.

287
00:14:53.519 --> 00:14:59.519
City Fantastique, said it was number 4 of the top 10 television

288
00:14:59.519 --> 00:15:01.139
episodes of 2005.

289
00:15:01.139 --> 00:15:05.460
Wired named this two-part instalment as one of the 12 all-time

290
00:15:05.460 --> 00:15:07.860
best Star Trek episodes of all time.

291
00:15:07.919 --> 00:15:09.539
Star Trek 101.

292
00:15:09.659 --> 00:15:12.120
This is episode as one of the 10 essential episodes from

293
00:15:12.120 --> 00:15:12.960
Enterprise.

294
00:15:13.019 --> 00:15:16.559
So all of the critics at the time, we're watching this and

295
00:15:16.559 --> 00:15:19.259
probably going, geez, Louis, we could have had this all along.

296
00:15:19.320 --> 00:15:21.899
This is amazing. you know, her original series episode.

297
00:15:21.960 --> 00:15:27.179
Branham Braga was highly impressed by the episode's teaser

298
00:15:27.179 --> 00:15:31.740
sequence stating when I saw this two-parter, it was like, hmm, this

299
00:15:31.740 --> 00:15:35.039
should be a whole season, and I'll be behind that totally.

300
00:15:35.759 --> 00:15:37.200
Interesting.

301
00:15:37.259 --> 00:15:40.980
Scott Bacula described the two-parter as a favourite episode of

302
00:15:40.980 --> 00:15:41.279
his.

303
00:15:41.399 --> 00:15:46.919
Now, interestingly, John Billingsley and Conor Trinier were not

304
00:15:46.919 --> 00:15:48.720
fans of this 2 parter at all.

305
00:15:48.779 --> 00:15:53.159
Billings that he called the episodes banal, and Trinier described

306
00:15:53.159 --> 00:15:54.059
them as pandering.

307
00:15:54.120 --> 00:15:56.279
Yes, that's what we want.

308
00:15:56.340 --> 00:15:59.340
Pandaras, you know. that's so far.

309
00:15:59.399 --> 00:16:04.139
But we'll save the last word before we go into Linda Park. how she

310
00:16:04.139 --> 00:16:07.080
said to herself, finally being given something fun to do.

311
00:16:07.139 --> 00:16:10.440
She says, I think it's well known that these are my favourite

312
00:16:10.440 --> 00:16:12.059
episodes of all time.

313
00:16:12.299 --> 00:16:13.860
Brilliant.

314
00:16:14.279 --> 00:16:15.899
So I think the consensus is this is great.

315
00:16:15.960 --> 00:16:18.539
Billingsley likes being a bit controversial.

316
00:16:18.600 --> 00:16:21.659
Trinier, maybe it's because he didn't have such a big role and he

317
00:16:21.659 --> 00:16:23.279
usually gets a bigger role in enterprise.

318
00:16:23.340 --> 00:16:26.100
Well, I think it's because he didn't get to be quite as pretty as

319
00:16:26.100 --> 00:16:27.899
he normally is, is probably the thing.

320
00:16:27.960 --> 00:16:30.419
You didn't really get to fuck no one either.

321
00:16:30.480 --> 00:16:32.279
Bacular was having all the fun there, wasn't he?

322
00:16:32.340 --> 00:16:33.840
Yeah, yeah, yeah, for worlds.

323
00:16:34.019 --> 00:16:35.879
Well, what do you think?

324
00:16:35.940 --> 00:16:38.940
I think we go in Let's do it.

325
00:16:39.000 --> 00:16:40.259
Let's do it.

326
00:16:40.320 --> 00:16:40.980
All right.

327
00:16:41.039 --> 00:16:42.480
I will count us in.

328
00:16:42.840 --> 00:16:50.519
Five, four, three, two, one, and we're off.

329
00:16:50.700 --> 00:16:54.840
You know what's sad, Nathan. is we won't get to sing the song.

330
00:16:54.899 --> 00:16:57.059
I know, I know.

331
00:16:57.120 --> 00:16:57.899
We'll talk about that.

332
00:16:57.960 --> 00:16:59.039
Oh my god.

333
00:16:59.100 --> 00:17:00.659
This opening is so brilliant.

334
00:17:00.720 --> 00:17:03.179
So what do you think they're doing?

335
00:17:03.240 --> 00:17:09.299
Like, I think, like, like, what is this bit four?

336
00:17:09.359 --> 00:17:12.180
And the one thing that I try...

337
00:17:12.240 --> 00:17:14.160
Yes, I like that idea.

338
00:17:14.220 --> 00:17:18.240
I don't think it can really be that, but yes, it's like this is

339
00:17:18.240 --> 00:17:19.920
where it diverged.

340
00:17:19.980 --> 00:17:23.940
And so the mirror universe becomes just a sort of quantum parallel

341
00:17:23.940 --> 00:17:26.099
universe where things went another way.

342
00:17:26.160 --> 00:17:29.700
So is this the actual footage from 1st contact?

343
00:17:29.759 --> 00:17:33.299
Some of it, and it's the same actor, I think, isn't it?

344
00:17:33.359 --> 00:17:36.599
Attention to detail is great because I couldn't really see where

345
00:17:36.599 --> 00:17:37.859
they had entered 2 movies.

346
00:17:37.859 --> 00:17:40.140
Yeah, like wild show. where they had.

347
00:17:40.200 --> 00:17:41.579
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

348
00:17:41.640 --> 00:17:43.920
That shot there is from 1st contact, I think.

349
00:17:43.980 --> 00:17:45.240
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

350
00:17:45.299 --> 00:17:47.759
And so you've got Cromwell back.

351
00:17:47.819 --> 00:17:50.700
You know, who doesn't seem to be credited?

352
00:17:50.759 --> 00:17:54.599
No, this is from 1st contact because you only see the gun and not

353
00:17:54.599 --> 00:17:54.960
his face.

354
00:17:55.140 --> 00:17:58.259
So I think they just edited it really, really well.

355
00:17:58.319 --> 00:17:59.339
It's a shame.

356
00:17:59.400 --> 00:18:01.799
But come on, if you're going to start this, we're going to, what a

357
00:18:01.799 --> 00:18:02.519
fun way of doing it.

358
00:18:02.579 --> 00:18:05.759
Yeah, yeah, yeah. one of the most celebrating scenes in Star

359
00:18:05.759 --> 00:18:06.119
Trek.

360
00:18:06.240 --> 00:18:08.160
And then doing the music...

361
00:18:08.220 --> 00:18:09.480
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

362
00:18:09.839 --> 00:18:13.859
Yeah, so either it's just subverting it, but I do love the idea

363
00:18:13.859 --> 00:18:16.319
that this is where the universe is diverge.

364
00:18:16.380 --> 00:18:20.819
They even do the comedy bit where he's trying to do the voice.

365
00:18:20.880 --> 00:18:22.559
But it's much more ominous.

366
00:18:22.619 --> 00:18:23.339
Yeah.

367
00:18:23.339 --> 00:18:24.539
And now come, yeah.

368
00:18:24.599 --> 00:18:25.799
Yeah, so you look, our comes to go.

369
00:18:25.859 --> 00:18:26.940
You don't see his face.

370
00:18:27.000 --> 00:18:28.619
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

371
00:18:29.759 --> 00:18:32.160
This is very political right now.

372
00:18:32.220 --> 00:18:35.460
Look, I'm all writing, running in, to say, look, get whatever you

373
00:18:35.460 --> 00:18:35.880
can grab.

374
00:18:37.259 --> 00:18:41.700
So, and so what we get here, because, you know, Star Trek

375
00:18:41.700 --> 00:18:46.259
Enterprise, the opening titles tell the story of the various white

376
00:18:46.259 --> 00:18:50.640
men that are responsible for promonialism and then the

377
00:18:50.640 --> 00:18:51.059
federation.

378
00:18:51.660 --> 00:18:53.220
This is great.

379
00:18:53.220 --> 00:18:55.619
Dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun.

380
00:18:56.519 --> 00:18:57.359
Like, there's a nine.

381
00:18:57.359 --> 00:18:59.640
Biplane, a German biplane.

382
00:18:59.640 --> 00:19:02.640
And... the evil symbol of the, what they're called?

383
00:19:02.700 --> 00:19:05.940
the Terran the Terran Empire.

384
00:19:06.299 --> 00:19:10.140
Look, explosions, atom bombs going off.

385
00:19:10.200 --> 00:19:13.079
This is much more exciting than enterprise normally is.

386
00:19:13.140 --> 00:19:16.019
It's much cheaper than it is.

387
00:19:16.019 --> 00:19:16.920
Who cares about that?

388
00:19:16.920 --> 00:19:17.400
fair enough.

389
00:19:17.460 --> 00:19:18.420
It's only for 2 episodes.

390
00:19:18.539 --> 00:19:22.559
Excuse me, I think the general consensus is people prefer this

391
00:19:22.559 --> 00:19:23.279
theme tune.

392
00:19:23.339 --> 00:19:26.400
Oh, yeah, they're crazy.

393
00:19:26.460 --> 00:19:28.680
And that is so shit.

394
00:19:28.680 --> 00:19:29.940
CGI man on the moon.

395
00:19:30.359 --> 00:19:32.160
That is so bad.

396
00:19:32.220 --> 00:19:35.279
See, I thought it was going to end here with Enterprise bombing

397
00:19:35.279 --> 00:19:36.480
the planet and then it goes into more.

398
00:19:36.599 --> 00:19:38.460
And the cause comes in.

399
00:19:38.460 --> 00:19:40.500
There's the scenes from the building.

400
00:19:40.500 --> 00:19:43.259
That's dragon's teeth. final episode from the next episode.

401
00:19:43.319 --> 00:19:45.119
That's from Dragon's teeth in Voyager.

402
00:19:45.240 --> 00:19:48.119
Oh, yeah, that's I can voyage shots.

403
00:19:48.180 --> 00:19:51.839
I think the last bit there with all the ships coming in, that's

404
00:19:51.839 --> 00:19:54.539
from Sirius 3 of Enterprise during the Zindi Arc, you know, one of

405
00:19:54.539 --> 00:19:55.259
their space powers.

406
00:19:55.259 --> 00:19:57.240
No, but come on.

407
00:19:57.299 --> 00:20:03.180
As 2 ways to start this, one the 1st contact and then changing the

408
00:20:03.180 --> 00:20:06.420
title sequence, you're straight away on a footing of like, this is

409
00:20:06.420 --> 00:20:06.960
going to be great.

410
00:20:07.019 --> 00:20:08.579
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

411
00:20:08.640 --> 00:20:10.019
It is pretty good. isn't it?

412
00:20:10.079 --> 00:20:12.299
And I love how the enterprise looks.

413
00:20:12.359 --> 00:20:13.920
Okay, so we get a tellrite.

414
00:20:13.980 --> 00:20:15.299
Oh, you're right.

415
00:20:15.359 --> 00:20:16.319
I do look terrible.

416
00:20:16.380 --> 00:20:16.920
Don't they?

417
00:20:17.039 --> 00:20:18.720
Yeah, yeah, yeah. never work.

418
00:20:18.779 --> 00:20:22.140
I think that Janken Polk is the only one that doesn't look utterly

419
00:20:22.140 --> 00:20:22.559
terrible.

420
00:20:23.339 --> 00:20:30.839
So this is Malcolm Reed inventing the pain booths and the pain

421
00:20:30.839 --> 00:20:33.599
booths are the big thing, aren't they?

422
00:20:33.660 --> 00:20:36.539
They're kind of the most signature thing in mirror, mirror.

423
00:20:36.599 --> 00:20:38.039
So they're from Mirror, Mirror.

424
00:20:38.099 --> 00:20:40.380
That absolutely says the mirror universe.

425
00:20:40.380 --> 00:20:44.039
So there's probably tons of this, you know, in this that we didn't

426
00:20:44.099 --> 00:20:47.579
where they're sort of saying our stuff for mirror, mirror.

427
00:20:47.579 --> 00:20:49.619
That one is quite obvious.

428
00:20:49.680 --> 00:20:50.940
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

429
00:20:51.000 --> 00:20:51.900
It is great.

430
00:20:51.960 --> 00:20:54.960
You get lots of scenes of Conor Trinier later on, arriving about

431
00:20:54.960 --> 00:20:55.740
in agony.

432
00:20:55.799 --> 00:20:56.940
It's quite fun to watch.

433
00:20:57.000 --> 00:21:01.920
But, you know, you have, like, it's Reed invented it, which I

434
00:21:01.920 --> 00:21:02.880
think is pretty great.

435
00:21:03.000 --> 00:21:05.759
He doesn't quite know why he's torturing him.

436
00:21:05.819 --> 00:21:09.240
He's so horrible, he goes, I suspect he was late for his shift or

437
00:21:09.240 --> 00:21:09.539
something.

438
00:21:11.279 --> 00:21:15.539
Apparently, Mike Sussman, the writer of this, thought he was only

439
00:21:15.539 --> 00:21:19.259
writing a single episode and they were like, no, this is so

440
00:21:19.259 --> 00:21:19.500
great.

441
00:21:19.559 --> 00:21:21.480
We're gonna have to make it a 2 barter.

442
00:21:21.539 --> 00:21:23.579
And he was a bit overwhelmed.

443
00:21:23.640 --> 00:21:26.519
Apparently he had to have like the whole Christmas break away and

444
00:21:26.519 --> 00:21:28.440
he wrote it sort of over a couple of weeks.

445
00:21:28.500 --> 00:21:30.299
He did a great job though, I think.

446
00:21:30.359 --> 00:21:31.500
It is really good.

447
00:21:31.559 --> 00:21:33.299
And having Forrest as well.

448
00:21:33.359 --> 00:21:37.799
So we have Forest and then, you know, like in the next episode we

449
00:21:37.799 --> 00:21:42.839
have Soval, uh, and we have uh, an admiral who only gets mentioned

450
00:21:42.839 --> 00:21:46.140
by name and is never seen, except in the very universe.

451
00:21:46.200 --> 00:21:49.079
All far less tedious than they normally are as well.

452
00:21:49.140 --> 00:21:51.900
I thought, you know, whilst they're trying to incite rebellions

453
00:21:51.900 --> 00:21:52.259
and things.

454
00:21:52.319 --> 00:21:57.779
Well, I think James L. Conway directs this episode and he hasn't

455
00:21:57.779 --> 00:21:58.920
been around for some time.

456
00:21:58.980 --> 00:22:02.579
I think he did the very 1st Enterprise episode and then didn't

457
00:22:02.579 --> 00:22:05.039
direct Star Trek until this point after that.

458
00:22:05.099 --> 00:22:08.400
And they pulled him in because they knew this was going to be

459
00:22:08.400 --> 00:22:11.160
quite effects heavy and quite a big deal.

460
00:22:11.460 --> 00:22:16.140
He directed like some of the DS9 big hitters like Way, the Warrior

461
00:22:16.140 --> 00:22:17.759
and Shattered Mirror, and things like that.

462
00:22:17.819 --> 00:22:21.119
So he's quite a big deal getting him back.

463
00:22:21.180 --> 00:22:25.319
And I do think you can feel a lift in the production with this and

464
00:22:25.319 --> 00:22:26.160
with the 2nd part.

465
00:22:26.220 --> 00:22:27.240
Yeah.

466
00:22:27.299 --> 00:22:30.359
So he's Hashi, who just looks beautiful.

467
00:22:30.420 --> 00:22:32.220
Like, she's sort of drunk.

468
00:22:32.220 --> 00:22:33.059
Sexy in this.

469
00:22:33.119 --> 00:22:35.460
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

470
00:22:35.579 --> 00:22:36.960
She'd be great.

471
00:22:37.019 --> 00:22:39.119
Not to put too far apart a minute.

472
00:22:39.180 --> 00:22:40.619
She'll fuck anyone to get to power.

473
00:22:40.680 --> 00:22:42.660
She's all like that.

474
00:22:42.720 --> 00:22:44.460
All forests right now as it works.

475
00:22:44.519 --> 00:22:47.819
Shortly, she'll be all over Archer, and then by the end of it

476
00:22:47.819 --> 00:22:49.079
she's grabbing Mayweather.

477
00:22:49.140 --> 00:22:50.279
She's snogging in.

478
00:22:50.339 --> 00:22:53.519
Yeah, well, that's finally the one that she thinks is hot.

479
00:22:53.579 --> 00:22:54.240
Do you know what I mean?

480
00:22:54.359 --> 00:22:56.099
Well, no, she's wrong by then.

481
00:22:56.160 --> 00:22:57.000
She's right.

482
00:22:57.059 --> 00:22:57.960
Well, she's right.

483
00:22:58.019 --> 00:22:59.220
But she's won by then.

484
00:22:59.279 --> 00:23:01.859
She's going to be emperor so she can just pick someone pretty

485
00:23:01.859 --> 00:23:03.480
rather than someone powerful.

486
00:23:03.960 --> 00:23:06.119
What's lovely about her story?

487
00:23:06.180 --> 00:23:11.279
is unlike Norm Werns Prize, which signposts everything in every

488
00:23:11.279 --> 00:23:14.279
scene all the time and there are very few surprises.

489
00:23:14.339 --> 00:23:16.259
Her thread throughout this.

490
00:23:16.380 --> 00:23:18.539
It's quite delicately done.

491
00:23:18.599 --> 00:23:20.279
So at the end, when she takes power.

492
00:23:20.640 --> 00:23:23.519
The 1st time I watched it, I didn't see it coming.

493
00:23:23.579 --> 00:23:24.779
No.

494
00:23:24.839 --> 00:23:28.140
Do you know, one thing that I like is that little bit of dialogue

495
00:23:28.140 --> 00:23:31.079
too, where she talks about going back to Brazil to resume her

496
00:23:31.079 --> 00:23:31.559
teaching?

497
00:23:31.619 --> 00:23:35.880
You know, like, like, as if she had a normal life, there's

498
00:23:35.880 --> 00:23:40.019
something like there's something normal in the in the mirror

499
00:23:40.019 --> 00:23:42.119
universe, because this is the earliest that we've seen of the

500
00:23:42.119 --> 00:23:43.140
mirror universe, isn't it?

501
00:23:43.200 --> 00:23:44.339
Yes, I don't know.

502
00:23:44.400 --> 00:23:47.099
I mean, if the moon landing was the Terran Empire.

503
00:23:47.160 --> 00:23:51.000
Is that what we're supposed to see, the stupid CG moon landing at

504
00:23:51.000 --> 00:23:52.380
the end of the thing?

505
00:23:52.440 --> 00:23:54.240
Yeah, anyway, doesn't matter.

506
00:23:54.299 --> 00:23:56.700
That was the only part of the title circus where I burst out

507
00:23:56.700 --> 00:23:57.119
laughing.

508
00:23:57.119 --> 00:23:58.619
So bad, isn't it?

509
00:24:00.059 --> 00:24:02.279
They just can't do people.

510
00:24:02.339 --> 00:24:06.000
They have a good stab at the corn in this, but just put a person

511
00:24:06.000 --> 00:24:06.480
on there.

512
00:24:06.539 --> 00:24:07.319
You know what I mean?

513
00:24:07.380 --> 00:24:09.599
Just build a crappy moon set.

514
00:24:09.660 --> 00:24:10.680
Yeah, yeah.

515
00:24:10.740 --> 00:24:12.359
Oh, here he is.

516
00:24:12.420 --> 00:24:13.740
Captain Archer himself.

517
00:24:13.799 --> 00:24:15.000
Oh, no, he's not a caption, is he?

518
00:24:15.059 --> 00:24:15.900
He's a commander?

519
00:24:15.960 --> 00:24:17.460
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

520
00:24:17.519 --> 00:24:20.519
But, I mean, the great thing about it is that he's just a massive

521
00:24:20.519 --> 00:24:22.680
fucking loser.

522
00:24:22.740 --> 00:24:24.720
Oh, I mean, he usually is as well, remember?

523
00:24:24.779 --> 00:24:25.680
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

524
00:24:25.740 --> 00:24:28.259
But he's like, he's an angry loser.

525
00:24:28.319 --> 00:24:32.099
And then in episode two, he discovers that there is a much better

526
00:24:32.099 --> 00:24:37.980
archer who is famous and beloved and you know, is going to be

527
00:24:37.980 --> 00:24:38.819
remembered forever.

528
00:24:38.880 --> 00:24:40.619
So pissed about that.

529
00:24:40.680 --> 00:24:42.960
He wants all of those files destroyed, doesn't he?

530
00:24:43.019 --> 00:24:45.839
I don't want any record, but there's a better V out there.

531
00:24:45.900 --> 00:24:48.539
Oh, I love Mayweather with his earring.

532
00:24:48.599 --> 00:24:49.740
Doesn't he look hot?

533
00:24:49.799 --> 00:24:53.099
Yeah, although the wig is not doing in many favours.

534
00:24:53.160 --> 00:24:56.640
Now this, I think this is awful, right?

535
00:24:56.700 --> 00:24:58.079
Can I ask you about this?

536
00:24:58.140 --> 00:25:00.359
Because I kind of think she looks quite sexy.

537
00:25:00.420 --> 00:25:04.079
Say it with very uniform middle cutaway.

538
00:25:04.140 --> 00:25:05.099
Yeah.

539
00:25:05.099 --> 00:25:10.019
So, so we do see, do we see Ahura in Mirror, Mirror, and she has a

540
00:25:10.019 --> 00:25:16.500
sexy version of the, um, Star Trek, you know, of the, of the

541
00:25:16.500 --> 00:25:18.660
Starfleet thing, but yes.

542
00:25:18.720 --> 00:25:23.700
But it's camp and sexy, whereas this is just the, you know, the

543
00:25:23.700 --> 00:25:26.819
boring fucking overalls, but we'll just cut the middle out of

544
00:25:26.819 --> 00:25:27.059
them.

545
00:25:27.119 --> 00:25:31.619
Like it's not camp and it's like designed by a straight guy.

546
00:25:31.680 --> 00:25:37.259
Oh, this fucking, um, so Billingsley is playing evil flocks and we

547
00:25:37.259 --> 00:25:42.599
keep seeing flocks just chopping up animals every time you go back

548
00:25:42.599 --> 00:25:43.019
to him.

549
00:25:43.079 --> 00:25:45.059
He has an animal in my show.

550
00:25:46.019 --> 00:25:49.740
And they actually, they go to the legs of all the guts and all of

551
00:25:49.740 --> 00:25:51.599
that, you know, someone's made that prop.

552
00:25:51.660 --> 00:25:54.720
You got to remember, these are the same prop people that put that

553
00:25:54.720 --> 00:25:57.960
fake dog in liquid in a night in Sick Bay, you know?

554
00:25:58.319 --> 00:26:01.980
I will say one thing about these uniforms, yeah, is they're not

555
00:26:01.980 --> 00:26:03.480
designed to appeal to you and me.

556
00:26:03.539 --> 00:26:07.079
And I would imagine if a man is watching this.

557
00:26:07.259 --> 00:26:10.859
I imagine if they would enjoy this a lot.

558
00:26:10.920 --> 00:26:13.200
Yeah, but I think it's a bit gross.

559
00:26:13.680 --> 00:26:16.019
Yes, but then straight men are.

560
00:26:17.759 --> 00:26:22.799
No, like it should have been camp and fun and revealing, like

561
00:26:22.799 --> 00:26:24.900
absolutely do the revealing outfit.

562
00:26:24.960 --> 00:26:28.079
Certainly what Hoshi is wearing in that 1st thing, like, like

563
00:26:28.079 --> 00:26:31.619
there's something sexist and demeany about the plot about how she

564
00:26:31.619 --> 00:26:34.799
has to fuck her way up to power, but we'll go for it because

565
00:26:34.799 --> 00:26:37.740
that's kind of the, you know, the genre or whatever.

566
00:26:37.799 --> 00:26:41.640
I mean, you know when, you know, when men, you know, sort of, I've

567
00:26:41.640 --> 00:26:45.000
seen, you know, gay men proudly wearing tops where it just sort of

568
00:26:45.000 --> 00:26:47.220
comes up to just below their chest, you know.

569
00:26:47.279 --> 00:26:47.880
Sure.

570
00:26:47.880 --> 00:26:49.440
And I think that's really sexy.

571
00:26:49.500 --> 00:26:50.460
I think it looks lovely.

572
00:26:50.519 --> 00:26:56.039
No, but I just think the actual outfit itself is just the overalls

573
00:26:56.039 --> 00:26:57.299
with the middle cut out of it.

574
00:26:57.359 --> 00:26:58.799
It's so low effort.

575
00:26:58.859 --> 00:27:02.220
Like it's so much in the mind of a straight man, though.

576
00:27:02.279 --> 00:27:05.220
And, you know, you can sort of spangly shit on it and stuff.

577
00:27:05.279 --> 00:27:06.240
Like, make it fun.

578
00:27:06.240 --> 00:27:08.099
Like, you want to make it. make it gay.

579
00:27:08.160 --> 00:27:09.000
You want to make it cow?

580
00:27:09.059 --> 00:27:09.900
I want to make it.

581
00:27:09.960 --> 00:27:11.819
Yeah, but it's not funny, is it?

582
00:27:11.880 --> 00:27:12.660
It's a universe.

583
00:27:12.720 --> 00:27:14.099
It's supposed to be sexy.

584
00:27:14.160 --> 00:27:19.920
No, the origin of the mirror universe, I think, is a genre busting

585
00:27:19.920 --> 00:27:20.160
thing.

586
00:27:20.279 --> 00:27:24.720
Like, I think it is what if Star Trek, instead of being lots of

587
00:27:24.720 --> 00:27:28.799
people in uniforms and being terribly Siri and stuff, was lurid

588
00:27:28.799 --> 00:27:32.579
terribly serious and stuff, was lurid, ridiculous space opera

589
00:27:32.579 --> 00:27:37.200
where everyone was wearing, you know, like giant boots and...

590
00:27:37.200 --> 00:27:39.180
That's why I wish Star Trek was all the time.

591
00:27:39.240 --> 00:27:40.380
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

592
00:27:40.440 --> 00:27:41.160
Yeah, that's right.

593
00:27:41.220 --> 00:27:43.019
And that's what they do in Mirror, Mirror.

594
00:27:43.079 --> 00:27:44.759
Like there's something very camp about it.

595
00:27:44.819 --> 00:27:46.680
That is not can.

596
00:27:46.740 --> 00:27:50.099
They do take the baton in DS9 as well because, you know, everybody

597
00:27:50.099 --> 00:27:51.779
is hamming it up.

598
00:27:51.839 --> 00:27:57.299
Paul Garak, with his lines like, post you, you know, everyone's

599
00:27:57.299 --> 00:27:57.900
very camp.

600
00:27:57.960 --> 00:28:01.740
Look at what Philippa wears in the mirror universe as emperor.

601
00:28:01.799 --> 00:28:03.059
Ridiculous, isn't it?

602
00:28:03.119 --> 00:28:04.440
That's fabulous.

603
00:28:04.500 --> 00:28:07.079
Enormous gold lame gown.

604
00:28:07.140 --> 00:28:08.819
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

605
00:28:08.880 --> 00:28:13.079
You know, it needs to be more fun and that is not fun, I think.

606
00:28:13.140 --> 00:28:17.460
But the thing that we have identified in this show before is they

607
00:28:17.460 --> 00:28:20.460
are aiming for that heterosexual audience.

608
00:28:21.240 --> 00:28:22.619
And I think this is part of that as well.

609
00:28:22.680 --> 00:28:25.440
It's the same designers that are saying, yeah, great.

610
00:28:25.500 --> 00:28:27.900
Let's have them in their underwear doing that decontamination

611
00:28:27.900 --> 00:28:28.319
gel.

612
00:28:28.380 --> 00:28:29.279
Yeah, yeah.

613
00:28:29.279 --> 00:28:30.539
I kind of get it.

614
00:28:30.599 --> 00:28:31.740
I don't really like it.

615
00:28:31.799 --> 00:28:33.480
I don't like how exploitive it is.

616
00:28:33.539 --> 00:28:37.200
But I think for people that aren't you and me. would be very

617
00:28:37.200 --> 00:28:37.680
appealing.

618
00:28:37.799 --> 00:28:40.500
Yeah, yeah, I don't care about them, though.

619
00:28:40.559 --> 00:28:43.859
Like it needs to be camp.

620
00:28:43.920 --> 00:28:47.039
Anyone straight listening to this, all right?

621
00:28:47.099 --> 00:28:48.539
You're not welcome here.

622
00:28:48.599 --> 00:28:50.279
No, that's not true.

623
00:28:50.339 --> 00:28:52.079
We love you all.

624
00:28:52.140 --> 00:28:53.759
Just a bit less.

625
00:28:53.819 --> 00:28:55.559
Oh, sorry, don't move.

626
00:28:56.460 --> 00:28:58.619
What's going on now?

627
00:28:59.339 --> 00:29:01.380
Yeah, so...

628
00:29:01.380 --> 00:29:03.480
Oh, look, look at the guns on the wall.

629
00:29:03.539 --> 00:29:05.400
Yeah, yeah, he's got guns in the background.

630
00:29:05.460 --> 00:29:09.660
No, later on, he's or was it, is that how this scene opened?

631
00:29:09.720 --> 00:29:10.019
It is.

632
00:29:10.019 --> 00:29:11.519
Oh, no, it's closing.

633
00:29:11.579 --> 00:29:13.559
There you go. holding the gun now, alert.

634
00:29:13.559 --> 00:29:14.279
He's putting it on.

635
00:29:14.339 --> 00:29:18.599
That's the gun that Cromwell used to shoot that Zefron Cochran

636
00:29:18.599 --> 00:29:19.619
used to shoot the Vulcan.

637
00:29:19.680 --> 00:29:23.160
When Picard had a stab at doing. alternative universe.

638
00:29:23.220 --> 00:29:24.839
They were like, right, you want guns on the wall?

639
00:29:24.900 --> 00:29:28.680
No, we're going to display the heads of the people that are being

640
00:29:28.680 --> 00:29:31.440
killed in the mirror universe.

641
00:29:31.559 --> 00:29:34.319
Oh, it's so great. love that episode.

642
00:29:34.380 --> 00:29:37.619
No, that's an alternative 24th century.

643
00:29:37.680 --> 00:29:40.920
Can you believe this as an actual quote on memory alpha where they

644
00:29:40.920 --> 00:29:43.799
went, well, we don't usually give Mayweather too much to do.

645
00:29:43.859 --> 00:29:48.059
So we'll write him up in this episode and make him Scott Bakula's

646
00:29:48.059 --> 00:29:48.539
bodyguard.

647
00:29:48.599 --> 00:29:51.480
I'm like, so you know you're not getting...

648
00:29:51.539 --> 00:29:54.059
You know you're just neglecting this attractive man.

649
00:29:55.259 --> 00:29:57.240
What about both?

650
00:29:57.720 --> 00:30:00.180
Think how many episodes we've done where she has literally had a

651
00:30:00.180 --> 00:30:02.759
line or a reaction shot or something.

652
00:30:02.819 --> 00:30:06.660
Remember, these are the voyages where they had one scene with the

653
00:30:06.660 --> 00:30:09.119
riker on the holodeck and that was it.

654
00:30:09.180 --> 00:30:11.940
And look, I'm the universe.

655
00:30:11.940 --> 00:30:13.319
Porthos is a pit bull.

656
00:30:15.359 --> 00:30:18.240
I also prefer this stalk, you know.

657
00:30:19.680 --> 00:30:23.640
Imagine that pit bull suspended in liquid in fluxes.

658
00:30:23.700 --> 00:30:24.599
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

659
00:30:24.660 --> 00:30:26.220
You wouldn't tolerate it terrible.

660
00:30:26.339 --> 00:30:29.339
No, I'm not sort of listening.

661
00:30:29.400 --> 00:30:30.420
I've got the subtitles on.

662
00:30:30.480 --> 00:30:33.720
All I'm seeing is what's the actress's name who plays Sato?

663
00:30:33.779 --> 00:30:36.480
Linda Parks, her body language.

664
00:30:36.539 --> 00:30:40.200
Everything, her body language is sexualised.

665
00:30:40.259 --> 00:30:43.740
So when she walks towards him like that, she literally looks like

666
00:30:43.740 --> 00:30:45.119
she's about to bang bang him.

667
00:30:45.420 --> 00:30:50.759
Yeah, yeah, but she doesn't seem kind of downtrodden.

668
00:30:50.819 --> 00:30:51.480
Do you know what I mean?

669
00:30:51.539 --> 00:30:52.799
Like, I don't know.

670
00:30:52.859 --> 00:30:57.000
I think that when the Mirror Universe comes back, they drop the

671
00:30:57.000 --> 00:31:02.700
women fucking their way to the top idea and I think they're right

672
00:31:02.700 --> 00:31:03.180
to do that.

673
00:31:03.240 --> 00:31:08.940
And I think it's probably in 2005, it's probably they should not

674
00:31:08.940 --> 00:31:12.299
really be doing it, to be honest, I think it's bad.

675
00:31:12.359 --> 00:31:17.400
I mean, the intendant was highly sexualised, but she's already out

676
00:31:17.400 --> 00:31:19.200
the top when we 1st meet. right.

677
00:31:19.259 --> 00:31:20.880
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

678
00:31:21.000 --> 00:31:22.799
We don't need to find out how she got there.

679
00:31:22.859 --> 00:31:24.000
No.

680
00:31:24.059 --> 00:31:26.099
And she's just fucking away to the top.

681
00:31:26.099 --> 00:31:28.259
And to Paul accuses her of that, remember?

682
00:31:28.319 --> 00:31:30.059
Like, tells her off.

683
00:31:30.180 --> 00:31:34.140
I think Linda Park has a wonderful stab, but I think this

684
00:31:34.140 --> 00:31:34.740
character in this.

685
00:31:34.799 --> 00:31:39.299
I think that's, um, uh, oh, God, what's her name, cousin?

686
00:31:39.299 --> 00:31:40.259
Cousin Michelle.

687
00:31:40.319 --> 00:31:40.980
Michelle Yeoh.

688
00:31:41.039 --> 00:31:41.759
I can remember her name.

689
00:31:41.819 --> 00:31:47.400
She is outstanding as Giorgio. but nobody will ever quite top than

690
00:31:47.400 --> 00:31:50.700
our visitor as the attendant intendant.

691
00:31:50.759 --> 00:31:53.099
She is so outrageously over the top.

692
00:31:53.160 --> 00:31:56.940
Yeah, so I think I said to you on the chat that I think it lets

693
00:31:56.940 --> 00:32:00.420
offend everyone, that putting a bisexual woman on TV is the

694
00:32:00.420 --> 00:32:04.140
easiest sort of queer representation that you can do, which is why

695
00:32:04.140 --> 00:32:05.579
Deep Space 9 does it.

696
00:32:05.640 --> 00:32:09.059
It's the only queer rep that the show does in the 90s at all.

697
00:32:09.119 --> 00:32:12.660
And, you know, they don't make any of the men say in the merry

698
00:32:12.660 --> 00:32:13.019
universe.

699
00:32:13.140 --> 00:32:15.599
O'Brien and Bashir in series 7.

700
00:32:15.660 --> 00:32:17.880
Like where they're almost saying it, but no.

701
00:32:17.940 --> 00:32:19.799
But yes, I know what you're saying.

702
00:32:19.859 --> 00:32:22.680
Yeah, it's a bromance and that's very sweet.

703
00:32:22.740 --> 00:32:27.960
But, you know, like, sexualising Kira, and, you know, just making

704
00:32:27.960 --> 00:32:31.200
a beautiful woman bisexual and stuff and just sort of gesturing at

705
00:32:31.200 --> 00:32:35.039
it a little bit, like having 2 women kiss on tally, isn't that

706
00:32:35.039 --> 00:32:36.480
confronting, I think.

707
00:32:36.539 --> 00:32:40.680
I think they do a reasonable snipe with Darks in DS 9.

708
00:32:40.740 --> 00:32:42.839
They have clearly attracted to women.

709
00:32:42.839 --> 00:32:46.380
Well, in one episode in between, but Vanessa Williams, I'll keep

710
00:32:46.380 --> 00:32:47.819
mentioning it. that pottery scene.

711
00:32:48.900 --> 00:32:52.559
She's having a wonderful time with her arms around Vanessa

712
00:32:52.559 --> 00:32:53.160
Williams.

713
00:32:53.220 --> 00:32:58.799
That's awesome But I do think it is our problem. that the only

714
00:32:58.799 --> 00:33:02.759
truly acceptable way in this iteration of Star Trek.

715
00:33:02.819 --> 00:33:06.240
You know, Burman era is really going to an alternative universe

716
00:33:06.240 --> 00:33:08.160
where being gay is okay.

717
00:33:08.220 --> 00:33:09.599
Well, yeah.

718
00:33:09.599 --> 00:33:11.700
Well, it's a lazy shorthand, isn't it?

719
00:33:11.759 --> 00:33:13.740
It a lazy shorthand for this is how people are different.

720
00:33:13.799 --> 00:33:15.000
Yeah.

721
00:33:15.240 --> 00:33:17.940
Yeah, but also because it's camp.

722
00:33:18.000 --> 00:33:18.720
Do you know what I mean?

723
00:33:18.779 --> 00:33:19.500
That's fun.

724
00:33:19.559 --> 00:33:24.180
And the big thing that Deep Space 9 does, with the mirror universe

725
00:33:24.180 --> 00:33:27.299
it doesn't really use it to comment on politics, it doesn't really

726
00:33:27.299 --> 00:33:33.059
do it much beyond the 1st one or 2 to kind of refer to Star Trek.

727
00:33:33.059 --> 00:33:36.240
Because, you know, Deep Say sign does care about the original

728
00:33:36.240 --> 00:33:38.279
series and does reference it, doesn't it?

729
00:33:38.400 --> 00:33:40.079
in a way that, yeah.

730
00:33:41.099 --> 00:33:46.920
It's saying that if they had wanted to have, you know, like Tripp

731
00:33:46.920 --> 00:33:50.579
and Mayweather asset in this episode, I would not have objected at

732
00:33:50.579 --> 00:33:50.759
all.

733
00:33:50.819 --> 00:33:52.740
But they would never have done it.

734
00:33:52.799 --> 00:33:55.980
No, I know it's a shame. another dead animal. you know, he's

735
00:33:55.980 --> 00:33:56.940
carving up another animal.

736
00:33:57.240 --> 00:34:00.900
But that is strange because they don't do it at all in this two

737
00:34:00.359 --> 00:34:01.259
parture, do they?

738
00:34:01.319 --> 00:34:02.039
They don't do that.

739
00:34:02.099 --> 00:34:04.319
The bisexual thing.

740
00:34:04.380 --> 00:34:05.880
No, no.

741
00:34:05.940 --> 00:34:09.659
Which is odd because, you know, when we go across to Kurtzman. they

742
00:34:09.659 --> 00:34:10.500
are doing it.

743
00:34:10.500 --> 00:34:12.179
Giorgio's quite happy too.

744
00:34:12.239 --> 00:34:14.099
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

745
00:34:14.159 --> 00:34:17.340
Whatever comes her way, you know, she'll have fun with it

746
00:34:17.340 --> 00:34:17.760
somehow.

747
00:34:17.820 --> 00:34:19.139
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

748
00:34:19.199 --> 00:34:23.880
I think that's in the season finale where she has, she gets to, um

749
00:34:23.880 --> 00:34:26.280
Orion lap dancers or whatever.

750
00:34:26.340 --> 00:34:26.760
All right.

751
00:34:26.820 --> 00:34:29.099
So here we have Vitholian.

752
00:34:29.159 --> 00:34:35.400
And and as research, to prepare for this just before we record

753
00:34:35.400 --> 00:34:38.159
Nathan refuse to tell me anything about his research.

754
00:34:38.219 --> 00:34:40.139
Just so it could tell me that exciting.

755
00:34:40.199 --> 00:34:42.239
But I did watch Thetholian Web.

756
00:34:42.360 --> 00:34:46.980
Oh, did they look like that sort of weird crystal people?

757
00:34:47.039 --> 00:34:52.199
So all you get to see is kind of from the nose up, it's very

758
00:34:52.199 --> 00:34:59.099
static, and there is a kind of like flames background thing, but

759
00:34:59.099 --> 00:35:04.440
it's very kind of, there's a lot of effects over it, and it talks

760
00:35:04.440 --> 00:35:07.619
because they've got a universal translator, I guess, at this

761
00:35:07.619 --> 00:35:07.860
point.

762
00:35:07.920 --> 00:35:09.480
So it's got a name and it talks.

763
00:35:09.539 --> 00:35:14.039
Um, and, but you only see sort of the top of its head.

764
00:35:14.099 --> 00:35:14.940
It doesn't move.

765
00:35:15.000 --> 00:35:20.519
It's sort of spooky looking, but it had been decided, I think, that

766
00:35:20.519 --> 00:35:21.840
that was heat.

767
00:35:21.900 --> 00:35:26.579
And so sort of in, so, you know, sort of extra canonically the

768
00:35:26.579 --> 00:35:29.159
idea is that they lived in very hot temperatures and here they

769
00:35:29.159 --> 00:35:33.599
live, you know, 200 degrees hotter than us or something like

770
00:35:33.599 --> 00:35:33.960
that.

771
00:35:35.099 --> 00:35:38.699
What I love about that, because I don't think that's great, CGI.

772
00:35:38.760 --> 00:35:40.380
I think that does look pretty terrible.

773
00:35:40.440 --> 00:35:42.840
But it is weird and different.

774
00:35:42.900 --> 00:35:43.800
And I like that.

775
00:35:43.860 --> 00:35:45.000
You know?

776
00:35:45.059 --> 00:35:49.260
Yeah, it's not just someone slavered in latex. you know, with an

777
00:35:49.260 --> 00:35:50.460
extra nostril or something.

778
00:35:50.519 --> 00:35:51.420
It does look different.

779
00:35:51.480 --> 00:35:53.940
And the Tholians did look different.

780
00:35:54.000 --> 00:35:54.840
Do you know what I mean?

781
00:35:54.900 --> 00:35:56.340
And they did look spooky.

782
00:35:56.400 --> 00:35:59.639
And I think that this is a pretty good thing bringing them back

783
00:35:59.639 --> 00:36:02.280
and getting them to look weird getting them to like a video

784
00:36:02.280 --> 00:36:02.579
effect.

785
00:36:02.699 --> 00:36:03.539
Yeah, Nathan.

786
00:36:03.599 --> 00:36:04.559
I think the eyes are quite cool.

787
00:36:04.619 --> 00:36:06.239
The eyes are original.

788
00:36:06.360 --> 00:36:09.719
The sort of thing that you'd see in the 1st series of Next

789
00:36:09.719 --> 00:36:12.539
Generation, you know, before they learned to be embarrassed by

790
00:36:12.539 --> 00:36:13.199
that sort of thing.

791
00:36:13.260 --> 00:36:14.460
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

792
00:36:14.519 --> 00:36:16.079
Yeah, I think it's pretty good.

793
00:36:16.139 --> 00:36:21.960
And, um, Fox is there, ready to tear it apart. as soon as you

794
00:36:21.960 --> 00:36:22.139
can.

795
00:36:22.619 --> 00:36:26.039
It's so interesting, you know, it's so interesting that Andrew

796
00:36:26.039 --> 00:36:31.320
Robinson and John Billingsley, who are 2 of their strongest actors

797
00:36:31.320 --> 00:36:35.699
respectively, of their 2 shows, both hated doing the Mirror

798
00:36:35.699 --> 00:36:36.539
Universe episodes.

799
00:36:36.599 --> 00:36:37.199
Oh, did they?

800
00:36:37.199 --> 00:36:40.199
Yeah, but it might be just because those are doing the actors that

801
00:36:40.199 --> 00:36:42.000
get good work in the prime universe, you know?

802
00:36:42.059 --> 00:36:43.860
They get some decent material normally.

803
00:36:43.980 --> 00:36:48.239
So, because Billingsley is not being fun.

804
00:36:48.300 --> 00:36:52.559
Like, that's the thing that you don't get, like, I think...

805
00:36:52.619 --> 00:36:56.099
He's interesting in the 2nd episode when she's trying to show him

806
00:36:56.099 --> 00:36:58.920
how things could be and then when he makes his choices.

807
00:36:58.920 --> 00:37:03.539
But is it because he's trying to play, you know, like he's the fun

808
00:37:03.539 --> 00:37:05.519
character on Enterprise normally.

809
00:37:05.579 --> 00:37:09.599
And so even though he could be camping it up, he just decides to

810
00:37:09.599 --> 00:37:12.719
know I'm kind of Dr. Mangela and I'm not going to be any fun at

811
00:37:12.719 --> 00:37:12.960
all.

812
00:37:13.079 --> 00:37:16.619
I do still think the carving up animals thing is pretty funny

813
00:37:16.619 --> 00:37:16.980
though.

814
00:37:17.039 --> 00:37:21.900
I like watching him, you know, scrabbling about with Conor Trinier

815
00:37:21.900 --> 00:37:25.320
and the engineering section in episode 2 when he's trying to, you

816
00:37:25.320 --> 00:37:26.579
know, sabotage the ship.

817
00:37:26.639 --> 00:37:29.579
I think it's really fun But yeah, maybe you're right.

818
00:37:29.639 --> 00:37:32.340
And also, you know, Garak's really fun normally.

819
00:37:32.400 --> 00:37:37.739
And in the mirror universe episodes, he's very one note, you know

820
00:37:37.739 --> 00:37:41.519
he's just a boy that goes around screaming at people and desperate

821
00:37:41.519 --> 00:37:43.440
to have sex with the intendant and it's not going to happen.

822
00:37:43.500 --> 00:37:45.840
And that's just not very fun to play.

823
00:37:45.900 --> 00:37:47.039
Ooh, now look at this.

824
00:37:47.099 --> 00:37:52.920
I love this because in our universe, obviously, Tripping, I've had

825
00:37:52.920 --> 00:37:53.579
a relationship.

826
00:37:53.639 --> 00:37:54.659
Yeah, and they're very close.

827
00:37:54.780 --> 00:37:58.500
They managed to make that with their body language and how they

828
00:37:58.500 --> 00:38:01.559
play that scene really uncomfortable in a way that normally we

829
00:38:01.559 --> 00:38:03.179
watch them together and it's perfectly fine.

830
00:38:03.239 --> 00:38:05.219
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

831
00:38:06.480 --> 00:38:09.059
Okay, so this is the thing.

832
00:38:09.119 --> 00:38:10.139
So there's an explosion.

833
00:38:10.199 --> 00:38:12.960
So, what, they're trying to attach the cloak.

834
00:38:13.320 --> 00:38:16.380
They're trying to attach a cloaking device.

835
00:38:16.440 --> 00:38:20.579
It was Conor Trenier that came up with the explanation as to why

836
00:38:20.579 --> 00:38:24.059
his face is all scarred like that, with the radiation exposure

837
00:38:24.059 --> 00:38:29.039
because it's the same radiation that scars Captain Pike in the

838
00:38:29.039 --> 00:38:29.639
original series.

839
00:38:29.699 --> 00:38:33.239
Yes, I thought it was probably a reference to Captain Pike just

840
00:38:33.239 --> 00:38:34.739
from the look of the scarring.

841
00:38:34.800 --> 00:38:39.659
Uh, but he also says that there's radiation here and I guess

842
00:38:39.659 --> 00:38:41.880
because it's the Terran Empire and they don't give a shit about

843
00:38:41.880 --> 00:38:46.260
kind of occupational health and safety that it's not properly

844
00:38:46.260 --> 00:38:51.480
shielded and he says something like, you know, like every uh, so

845
00:38:51.480 --> 00:38:54.000
often, you know, like every decade you work on these things, you

846
00:38:54.000 --> 00:38:55.739
lose a year of your life or something like that.

847
00:38:56.039 --> 00:39:00.360
It's very sad. that pretty man and some mount is going to become

848
00:39:00.360 --> 00:39:02.219
scarred like that, isn't it?

849
00:39:02.280 --> 00:39:04.380
And it turns out okay in the end.

850
00:39:04.440 --> 00:39:05.579
I hope so.

851
00:39:05.699 --> 00:39:07.019
Yeah, yeah.

852
00:39:07.079 --> 00:39:08.579
No, I mean, it does.

853
00:39:08.639 --> 00:39:09.239
We've seen it.

854
00:39:09.300 --> 00:39:12.599
Usually I find this admiral character so dull.

855
00:39:12.659 --> 00:39:14.519
It's great, yeah, yeah.

856
00:39:14.639 --> 00:39:18.420
Well, doesn't he get killed next episode or, you know, the episode

857
00:39:18.420 --> 00:39:18.960
after this?

858
00:39:19.079 --> 00:39:22.320
He gets killed in the attack on the Vulcan embassy or something?

859
00:39:22.380 --> 00:39:24.239
They knew they were going.

860
00:39:24.300 --> 00:39:25.500
That was in Keshara.

861
00:39:25.559 --> 00:39:26.219
It was earlier.

862
00:39:26.340 --> 00:39:27.420
Wasn't it?

863
00:39:27.480 --> 00:39:29.340
Oh, so they brought him back.

864
00:39:29.400 --> 00:39:30.719
Is he dead at this point?

865
00:39:30.780 --> 00:39:31.920
Yeah I think he is.

866
00:39:31.980 --> 00:39:32.699
Yeah, you're right.

867
00:39:32.760 --> 00:39:35.460
It's the bombing of the Vulcan embassy, isn't it?

868
00:39:35.519 --> 00:39:36.119
Yeah.

869
00:39:36.179 --> 00:39:37.800
So he's dead.

870
00:39:37.860 --> 00:39:39.420
And because that's the other reason.

871
00:39:39.480 --> 00:39:44.699
In Discovery, at the end of series one, because Discovery

872
00:39:44.699 --> 00:39:47.699
encounters the Mirror Universe about 10 years before, the

873
00:39:47.699 --> 00:39:51.059
Enterprise doesn't, because no one's heard of it in Mirror, Mirror

874
00:39:51.059 --> 00:39:54.300
they're sworn to secrecy, they're not allowed to say anything

875
00:39:54.300 --> 00:39:54.960
about it.

876
00:39:55.019 --> 00:40:01.079
It's classified because dead people from our world are still alive

877
00:40:01.079 --> 00:40:05.219
like Philippa, are still alive in the mirror universe and we're at

878
00:40:05.219 --> 00:40:06.719
war with the Klingons, right?

879
00:40:06.780 --> 00:40:11.219
DS9 tried to do that and they chose the dullest character of all

880
00:40:10.739 --> 00:40:16.260
time barrile to bring back... my god.

881
00:40:16.320 --> 00:40:19.019
We're in the universe where Barile's still alive.

882
00:40:20.219 --> 00:40:25.619
But that is the all-time clangour of the alternative universe

883
00:40:25.619 --> 00:40:29.460
episodes because they bring 2 alternative universe characters into

884
00:40:29.460 --> 00:40:30.179
our universe.

885
00:40:30.239 --> 00:40:31.860
We don't want to hang out in our universe.

886
00:40:31.920 --> 00:40:33.239
That's where we normally are, you know?

887
00:40:33.300 --> 00:40:34.440
Yeah, yeah.

888
00:40:34.619 --> 00:40:36.059
Oh, look, the knives are out.

889
00:40:36.420 --> 00:40:39.900
He's going to murder Admiral Forrest or does that?

890
00:40:39.960 --> 00:40:40.380
Do you know what?

891
00:40:40.440 --> 00:40:43.079
This was the point where I remember messaging you and I was like

892
00:40:43.079 --> 00:40:46.260
okay, this is fun and they're all having fun playing evil versions

893
00:40:46.260 --> 00:40:51.000
of their characters, but we are still stuck on the same dull sets

894
00:40:51.000 --> 00:40:51.960
that we're normally on.

895
00:40:52.019 --> 00:40:55.079
And I remember the sort of TOS stance.

896
00:40:55.139 --> 00:40:57.659
I'm thinking, well, where's did I did I imagine all of that?

897
00:40:57.719 --> 00:41:01.920
And then when the Defiant shows up in that asteroid film or

898
00:41:01.920 --> 00:41:03.599
whatever it is, I was like, yes, here we go.

899
00:41:03.659 --> 00:41:05.820
It's so great, isn't it?

900
00:41:05.940 --> 00:41:09.539
Because obviously the set's on the defiant because we are on the

901
00:41:09.539 --> 00:41:13.619
defiant in the Tholian web at the very beginning before it

902
00:41:13.619 --> 00:41:15.780
vanishes into interphasic space.

903
00:41:15.840 --> 00:41:18.300
Is that what it's called, Nathan?

904
00:41:18.360 --> 00:41:19.320
into phasic space.

905
00:41:19.380 --> 00:41:22.679
Yes, they say it quite a lot in Matholic.

906
00:41:22.739 --> 00:41:24.059
They do.

907
00:41:24.119 --> 00:41:26.639
We've just thought, oh, this amazing new space.

908
00:41:26.699 --> 00:41:27.179
Yes, yeah.

909
00:41:27.239 --> 00:41:28.739
Into phasic.

910
00:41:29.820 --> 00:41:32.940
And it's a money saving thing, isn't it?

911
00:41:33.000 --> 00:41:36.059
Because we get to use the enterprise sets for the defiant.

912
00:41:36.119 --> 00:41:38.760
But here they have to build and they build more.

913
00:41:38.820 --> 00:41:42.059
Oh, look at...

914
00:41:42.119 --> 00:41:45.179
I'm not sure what it says about me. but watching Malcolm Reed

915
00:41:45.179 --> 00:41:48.480
torture trip like this and he's all sort of sweaty in the tube.

916
00:41:48.539 --> 00:41:51.300
Yeah, he's going to disagree on television.

917
00:41:51.420 --> 00:41:53.039
Well, he's a bit hideous though.

918
00:41:53.099 --> 00:41:54.360
It is a bit unfortunate.

919
00:41:54.420 --> 00:41:55.679
He is unfortunate looking.

920
00:41:56.639 --> 00:42:00.599
Yeah, they build more of the enterprise, don't they, than they

921
00:42:00.599 --> 00:42:01.019
ever have.

922
00:42:01.079 --> 00:42:07.139
Like they obviously had built the original enterprise set for

923
00:42:07.139 --> 00:42:10.920
relics in series 6 of Star Trek, the next generation.

924
00:42:10.980 --> 00:42:14.280
Corridor and the Bridge and that for trials and tribulations. for

925
00:42:14.280 --> 00:42:15.119
trials and tribulations.

926
00:42:15.179 --> 00:42:17.760
But you build everything way more.

927
00:42:17.820 --> 00:42:18.599
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

928
00:42:18.659 --> 00:42:21.719
And apparently, because, I mean, I couldn't read it all, but the

929
00:42:21.719 --> 00:42:25.800
laborious detail that they go into on memory alpha, talking to the

930
00:42:25.800 --> 00:42:29.519
designers about every single detail that they wanted to get, like

931
00:42:29.519 --> 00:42:30.900
this was a passion project.

932
00:42:30.960 --> 00:42:32.099
Yeah.

933
00:42:32.159 --> 00:42:33.659
But do you know what I mean?

934
00:42:33.719 --> 00:42:37.980
Even additional fan wank beyond what we really mentioned before we

935
00:42:37.980 --> 00:42:38.760
started watching.

936
00:42:38.820 --> 00:42:41.340
It's such fan service.

937
00:42:41.400 --> 00:42:45.780
You know what really shocks me right about Sato and Archer sort of

938
00:42:45.780 --> 00:42:46.800
in bed like this, yeah?

939
00:42:46.860 --> 00:42:49.920
And it's even more apparent in episode 2 when they have it off.

940
00:42:49.980 --> 00:42:54.539
Is they're really sweaty and messed up in a way that Star Trek

941
00:42:54.539 --> 00:42:55.079
never is.

942
00:42:55.139 --> 00:42:58.679
People make love in Star Trek and their hair is perfect and they

943
00:42:58.679 --> 00:43:01.619
have not one drop of sweat has broken from their brow.

944
00:43:01.679 --> 00:43:05.820
This actually feels like that, you know, having a bit of rough and

945
00:43:05.820 --> 00:43:06.179
tumble.

946
00:43:06.239 --> 00:43:07.139
Yeah.

947
00:43:07.199 --> 00:43:10.320
Archer's hair is really bad, isn't it?

948
00:43:10.800 --> 00:43:12.539
It's so bad.

949
00:43:12.599 --> 00:43:15.659
It's all feathered because it's so short, you know?

950
00:43:15.659 --> 00:43:20.639
It's like how mine looks, but it's too short because it, yeah, it's

951
00:43:20.639 --> 00:43:22.019
there's too much volume to it.

952
00:43:22.079 --> 00:43:22.800
I can't explain it.

953
00:43:22.860 --> 00:43:28.619
But he also looks kind of old and a bit pathetic, and he, like, you

954
00:43:28.619 --> 00:43:30.239
know, he's doing that.

955
00:43:30.239 --> 00:43:31.559
Dying, haven't they?

956
00:43:31.619 --> 00:43:34.139
Like a slightly darker hue to his hair as well.

957
00:43:34.199 --> 00:43:35.760
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

958
00:43:36.119 --> 00:43:38.340
You know what it reminds me of?

959
00:43:38.400 --> 00:43:42.300
It reminds me of a previously successful boy band member coming

960
00:43:42.300 --> 00:43:45.000
back together with the boy band and trying to recapture his

961
00:43:45.000 --> 00:43:45.360
youth.

962
00:43:45.480 --> 00:43:47.699
It's that sort of look.

963
00:43:48.119 --> 00:43:49.500
Yeah.

964
00:43:49.559 --> 00:43:53.639
Yeah, I mean, it's actually kind of a relief to see, oh, massive

965
00:43:53.639 --> 00:43:54.960
midrift shop on.

966
00:43:55.079 --> 00:43:57.420
Well, she's got a Pierce Navel.

967
00:43:57.480 --> 00:43:58.500
It pierced.

968
00:43:59.340 --> 00:44:01.619
Blow those bastards.

969
00:44:02.280 --> 00:44:04.440
When you hear her being interviewed.

970
00:44:04.500 --> 00:44:09.719
She's so shy Given, given some of the performances she gives.

971
00:44:09.780 --> 00:44:09.960
Yeah.

972
00:44:10.019 --> 00:44:11.039
Oh, here we go.

973
00:44:11.099 --> 00:44:11.760
Action at last.

974
00:44:11.820 --> 00:44:13.860
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

975
00:44:13.920 --> 00:44:14.519
Yeah.

976
00:44:14.519 --> 00:44:17.760
This is what you want from every Mirror Universe episode.

977
00:44:17.880 --> 00:44:19.139
Exactly.

978
00:44:19.199 --> 00:44:22.019
They're supposed to be stabbing one another, for God's sake.

979
00:44:22.139 --> 00:44:24.719
Archer looks like he's just gone down the high street and bought

980
00:44:24.719 --> 00:44:25.440
that t-shirt.

981
00:44:25.500 --> 00:44:25.920
Do you see him?

982
00:44:25.980 --> 00:44:26.760
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

983
00:44:26.820 --> 00:44:27.480
I quite like it.

984
00:44:27.539 --> 00:44:28.199
It's tied.

985
00:44:28.260 --> 00:44:29.940
He's wearing a tie T-shirt that looks good on him.

986
00:44:30.000 --> 00:44:33.179
Yeah, God, if they were doing this all the time, you know, double

987
00:44:33.179 --> 00:44:34.679
crosses and things on enterprise.

988
00:44:34.739 --> 00:44:36.119
This would be a great fun show to watch.

989
00:44:36.239 --> 00:44:41.039
Do you think that the set of the bridge set is more colourful than

990
00:44:41.039 --> 00:44:41.400
normal?

991
00:44:41.880 --> 00:44:44.760
I mean, it's not much more colourful than normal.

992
00:44:44.880 --> 00:44:47.099
But I feel there's a bit more red in there than usual.

993
00:44:47.159 --> 00:44:50.519
Yeah, and displays of stuff and stuff are a little bit more

994
00:44:50.519 --> 00:44:51.420
interesting.

995
00:44:51.480 --> 00:44:54.059
They know we're about to go to this amazingly colourful set.

996
00:44:54.119 --> 00:44:56.280
Yeah, maybe, maybe.

997
00:44:56.639 --> 00:44:58.980
I like the symbol on the door there.

998
00:44:59.039 --> 00:45:01.079
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

999
00:45:01.139 --> 00:45:02.460
I mean, it's very subtle, isn't it?

1000
00:45:02.579 --> 00:45:03.780
A huge knife going through the earth.

1001
00:45:03.900 --> 00:45:05.400
Going through the earth.

1002
00:45:06.539 --> 00:45:09.059
Oh, look at Archer at the door.

1003
00:45:09.480 --> 00:45:11.940
I really like how this works.

1004
00:45:12.000 --> 00:45:15.840
Like, again, he's clever at double crossing because he's from a

1005
00:45:15.840 --> 00:45:18.900
world that operates on those terms.

1006
00:45:18.960 --> 00:45:21.659
So he manages to make himself indispensable.

1007
00:45:22.079 --> 00:45:24.360
Is he wearing jaw girls?

1008
00:45:24.420 --> 00:45:25.679
Has he just come from his trailer?

1009
00:45:25.739 --> 00:45:27.179
Is it time for my shot?

1010
00:45:27.780 --> 00:45:30.239
Those clothes are so casual.

1011
00:45:32.039 --> 00:45:36.059
I do like, I love all of the, like, who can be trusted?

1012
00:45:36.119 --> 00:45:39.059
It's going to be murdered next all well. love all of that.

1013
00:45:39.119 --> 00:45:40.079
All of that's really fun.

1014
00:45:40.139 --> 00:45:42.360
This is how I imagine if we were going to have our sort of Klingon

1015
00:45:42.360 --> 00:45:44.280
series, we'd spend every episode, you know.

1016
00:45:44.400 --> 00:45:45.840
Yeah.

1017
00:45:48.239 --> 00:45:51.420
Oh, now I'm talking to you now.

1018
00:45:51.480 --> 00:45:52.139
Yes, good.

1019
00:45:52.199 --> 00:45:56.880
Excellent. 10 hours in the booth, says Dr. Flux.

1020
00:45:56.940 --> 00:45:57.659
Impressive.

1021
00:45:57.719 --> 00:45:58.559
Look at him.

1022
00:45:58.619 --> 00:45:59.400
It's so great.

1023
00:46:02.460 --> 00:46:05.039
He's a twisted also, isn't he?

1024
00:46:05.099 --> 00:46:05.639
Don't you float?

1025
00:46:06.360 --> 00:46:07.019
Yeah.

1026
00:46:07.079 --> 00:46:11.280
Maybe he's right to not like not chew the scenery to kind of just

1027
00:46:11.280 --> 00:46:12.539
rein it in a little bit.

1028
00:46:12.599 --> 00:46:13.920
Maybe that's the right decision.

1029
00:46:13.980 --> 00:46:16.679
Much like every episode of Event Prize.

1030
00:46:16.739 --> 00:46:19.679
Whenever he's on the screen in this super art up, my eyes go to

1031
00:46:19.679 --> 00:46:20.579
him straight away.

1032
00:46:20.639 --> 00:46:22.199
Oh no, he's great.

1033
00:46:22.260 --> 00:46:26.639
He has a weird way of owning every scene, even when he's not the

1034
00:46:26.639 --> 00:46:27.300
focus at all.

1035
00:46:30.360 --> 00:46:35.579
So Fleet Admiral Gardner does get a mention, I think, in other

1036
00:46:35.579 --> 00:46:37.980
episodes, I might have said this before, but he doesn't actually

1037
00:46:37.980 --> 00:46:42.119
appear in any episode other than, I think, next week.

1038
00:46:45.179 --> 00:46:46.440
You betrayed me.

1039
00:46:46.500 --> 00:46:48.659
Don't think for one moment I'm going to forget that.

1040
00:46:50.099 --> 00:46:52.079
And down he goes.

1041
00:46:52.139 --> 00:46:54.659
Yeah, you know, it's indispensable.

1042
00:46:54.719 --> 00:46:58.679
Like, you know, the phonia webs come in, the defiance come in, the

1043
00:46:58.679 --> 00:46:59.460
gaunts come in.

1044
00:46:59.519 --> 00:47:00.599
We do need it.

1045
00:47:00.659 --> 00:47:02.880
We couldn't have had 2 episodes of justice.

1046
00:47:02.940 --> 00:47:03.960
No, no, absolutely not.

1047
00:47:04.019 --> 00:47:06.059
I'm starting to kind of...

1048
00:47:06.059 --> 00:47:06.599
Yeah.

1049
00:47:06.599 --> 00:47:07.800
Well, I think we both are.

1050
00:47:08.340 --> 00:47:12.000
Yeah, it was at this point of the episode where I was going, come

1051
00:47:12.000 --> 00:47:13.320
on now. get things moving.

1052
00:47:13.380 --> 00:47:17.400
But I think if you just squeeze all of that, the corn, the folians

1053
00:47:17.400 --> 00:47:21.659
the defiant into one episode, it would have just gone by a bit too

1054
00:47:21.659 --> 00:47:21.840
fast.

1055
00:47:21.900 --> 00:47:23.760
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1056
00:47:23.820 --> 00:47:27.599
Well, I mean, what this, see, that image there, so that

1057
00:47:27.599 --> 00:47:31.199
description of interphasic space, that is based on a graphic

1058
00:47:31.199 --> 00:47:34.739
that's shown to the crew in the Tholian web, where they're

1059
00:47:34.739 --> 00:47:38.760
explaining where Kirk has gone, because the original thing is

1060
00:47:38.760 --> 00:47:42.719
Kirk's on the defiant, it disappears into interphasic space and

1061
00:47:42.719 --> 00:47:45.900
they think he's gone with it and they can't recover him.

1062
00:47:45.960 --> 00:47:50.039
And so that image there with those those lines, you know, like

1063
00:47:50.039 --> 00:47:55.079
creating a hole in space, that's actually from the folian ware.

1064
00:47:55.139 --> 00:47:56.400
Season is the folium web.

1065
00:47:56.460 --> 00:47:57.659
Season three.

1066
00:47:57.719 --> 00:47:58.739
It's three.

1067
00:47:58.800 --> 00:47:59.280
Is it good?

1068
00:47:59.400 --> 00:48:00.420
It's a good episode.

1069
00:48:00.480 --> 00:48:01.440
Yeah, yeah.

1070
00:48:01.500 --> 00:48:04.920
There's one or 2 unfortunate moments and it has some sexist

1071
00:48:04.920 --> 00:48:06.119
moments like this does.

1072
00:48:06.179 --> 00:48:08.820
But on the whole, it's pretty strong.

1073
00:48:08.880 --> 00:48:10.860
Freiburger could get it raw then.

1074
00:48:10.920 --> 00:48:13.019
Well, yeah, ish.

1075
00:48:13.079 --> 00:48:15.420
I mean, there are good episodes in series three.

1076
00:48:15.480 --> 00:48:16.320
They not all terrible.

1077
00:48:16.380 --> 00:48:17.280
We watch one, haven't we?

1078
00:48:17.340 --> 00:48:19.619
Spectra in the G. Spector of the Garden. great.

1079
00:48:19.679 --> 00:48:22.800
We've gone nowhere near than the deer yet though.

1080
00:48:22.860 --> 00:48:23.639
No.

1081
00:48:23.699 --> 00:48:27.360
And we did Spock's brain, which is somewhere near the Nadir, I

1082
00:48:27.360 --> 00:48:28.019
think, probably.

1083
00:48:28.079 --> 00:48:31.980
But, and certainly, I did have a little moment when I saw the

1084
00:48:31.980 --> 00:48:35.760
closing credits and the, like, the crap joke at the end and Kirk

1085
00:48:35.760 --> 00:48:39.780
smiling and then, uh, you know, produced by Freddie Freiberger

1086
00:48:39.780 --> 00:48:42.360
appears on the bottom of the screen, which is always upsetting to

1087
00:48:42.360 --> 00:48:42.480
see.

1088
00:48:42.539 --> 00:48:46.320
Imagine if you like just switched on now. like, oh, shit

1089
00:48:46.320 --> 00:48:46.980
enterprise is on.

1090
00:48:47.039 --> 00:48:48.179
I've missed a start.

1091
00:48:48.239 --> 00:48:48.599
Oh, well.

1092
00:48:48.659 --> 00:48:52.079
And it's them around the tactical table there, but they've all got

1093
00:48:52.079 --> 00:48:54.059
crazy hair and scars all over their faces.

1094
00:48:54.119 --> 00:48:56.099
Do you think people would realise straight away that this is

1095
00:48:56.099 --> 00:48:58.260
alternative universe or just go, what happened?

1096
00:48:58.320 --> 00:48:59.460
I was only gone half an hour.

1097
00:48:59.519 --> 00:49:00.840
No, no.

1098
00:49:00.840 --> 00:49:03.539
Anyway, Star Trek would know, I think.

1099
00:49:05.219 --> 00:49:07.920
And, you know, to Paul's makeup.

1100
00:49:07.980 --> 00:49:12.539
To be fun, this is still like, at this point, it's still within

1101
00:49:12.539 --> 00:49:14.699
the realms of a regular Star Trek episode, right?

1102
00:49:14.760 --> 00:49:17.940
Like we've done a bit of double crossing, but we've been on the

1103
00:49:17.940 --> 00:49:19.860
ship, we're investigating something.

1104
00:49:20.820 --> 00:49:24.900
Yeah, I think, you know, like it is the double crossing.

1105
00:49:24.960 --> 00:49:27.659
It's the, like, removing the captain and putting him in the brig

1106
00:49:27.659 --> 00:49:31.559
and then taking over and, you know, torturing people and stuff

1107
00:49:31.559 --> 00:49:35.099
like they've only got the one booth, but I, yeah, she does have a

1108
00:49:35.099 --> 00:49:35.760
pierce navel.

1109
00:49:35.820 --> 00:49:38.940
There was a very strange line, wasn't there, about the 2 of them

1110
00:49:38.940 --> 00:49:43.739
uh, to po and trip, him sort of saying how many times they've done

1111
00:49:43.739 --> 00:49:44.039
it before.

1112
00:49:44.099 --> 00:49:48.420
Yeah, he says I had a really good time or something like that.

1113
00:49:48.480 --> 00:49:49.500
Oh, here we go.

1114
00:49:49.559 --> 00:49:50.820
Yeah, here's a flashback look.

1115
00:49:50.880 --> 00:49:54.059
No, so that sort of flashback to their original thing.

1116
00:49:54.119 --> 00:49:57.659
That's a flashback to earlier during the time of the episode where

1117
00:49:57.659 --> 00:50:02.519
she, um, mind melded with him, uh, said she was gonna fuck him and

1118
00:50:02.519 --> 00:50:04.679
then got him to sabotage the thing.

1119
00:50:05.219 --> 00:50:10.500
So he he sabotages the thing and then she wipes his memory.

1120
00:50:10.619 --> 00:50:14.159
I thought her performance, Jolene Blaylocks was the closest to

1121
00:50:14.159 --> 00:50:15.719
what she normally plays.

1122
00:50:15.900 --> 00:50:21.599
Yeah, but remember the Spock, you know, we see Mirror Universe

1123
00:50:21.599 --> 00:50:24.360
Spock in Mirror, Mirror, and he is the same.

1124
00:50:24.360 --> 00:50:27.360
Because he's a Vulcan, you know?

1125
00:50:28.139 --> 00:50:30.420
So I think that's fair enough.

1126
00:50:30.480 --> 00:50:31.860
I don't know.

1127
00:50:31.920 --> 00:50:33.599
I think Linda Park's having all the fun though.

1128
00:50:33.659 --> 00:50:35.159
Yeah, she's so great.

1129
00:50:35.219 --> 00:50:38.219
I think that's why I prefer the 2nd episode.

1130
00:50:38.280 --> 00:50:39.659
She gets a lot to do with that 2nd episode.

1131
00:50:39.719 --> 00:50:40.500
Yeah, yeah.

1132
00:50:40.559 --> 00:50:41.460
Yeah.

1133
00:50:41.519 --> 00:50:44.340
Well, and just, and I'll just keep saying it.

1134
00:50:44.400 --> 00:50:46.679
It's just some nicer looking sets.

1135
00:50:46.800 --> 00:50:49.380
It's... eyeballs.

1136
00:50:50.639 --> 00:50:53.579
I mean, look, they're turning the lights down here on the

1137
00:50:53.579 --> 00:50:54.420
enterprise set.

1138
00:50:54.480 --> 00:50:55.440
Can you really tell the difference?

1139
00:50:55.500 --> 00:50:56.039
I can't.

1140
00:50:56.099 --> 00:50:57.599
No, no, it's so miserable.

1141
00:50:57.659 --> 00:50:57.960
All right?

1142
00:50:58.019 --> 00:50:58.619
They're cloaking.

1143
00:50:58.679 --> 00:50:59.820
Woo, that looks really cool.

1144
00:50:59.880 --> 00:51:00.900
That was awesome.

1145
00:51:01.619 --> 00:51:04.079
Okay, we've reached the coordinates.

1146
00:51:04.139 --> 00:51:05.699
I think this is really going to start picking up now.

1147
00:51:05.760 --> 00:51:06.960
Yeah, something's gonna happen.

1148
00:51:07.019 --> 00:51:10.079
Yeah, because we're gonna come across the defiant now, aren't we?

1149
00:51:10.139 --> 00:51:10.920
Mhm.

1150
00:51:10.920 --> 00:51:12.239
Yeah.

1151
00:51:12.300 --> 00:51:13.800
That's not a bad...

1152
00:51:13.800 --> 00:51:14.639
Oh, no.

1153
00:51:14.639 --> 00:51:16.260
Yeah, I think that looks pretty good.

1154
00:51:16.320 --> 00:51:19.260
The gas giant in the system that we heard about.

1155
00:51:19.320 --> 00:51:21.599
Magnify the moon to the far right.

1156
00:51:21.659 --> 00:51:22.320
There's something there.

1157
00:51:22.380 --> 00:51:23.400
OMG.

1158
00:51:23.519 --> 00:51:23.940
Yep.

1159
00:51:24.000 --> 00:51:24.719
And there it is.

1160
00:51:24.780 --> 00:51:25.440
He's found it.

1161
00:51:25.559 --> 00:51:26.940
The defiant.

1162
00:51:27.000 --> 00:51:27.599
Hooray.

1163
00:51:27.659 --> 00:51:28.679
So what is that?

1164
00:51:28.679 --> 00:51:31.320
What is that?

1165
00:51:31.380 --> 00:51:32.639
Where is that more?

1166
00:51:32.639 --> 00:51:33.659
The docking thing.

1167
00:51:33.719 --> 00:51:35.820
Like, it's in the moon.

1168
00:51:35.880 --> 00:51:39.539
They've dug a big hole in the moon and...

1169
00:51:39.599 --> 00:51:40.800
Yeah, look, it's great.

1170
00:51:40.860 --> 00:51:42.119
But those little shit.

1171
00:51:42.119 --> 00:51:43.920
This is what they can do with CGI.

1172
00:51:43.980 --> 00:51:45.360
The little ships running around.

1173
00:51:45.420 --> 00:51:47.219
The gridding everywhere.

1174
00:51:47.280 --> 00:51:48.300
They can do that detail.

1175
00:51:48.420 --> 00:51:49.739
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1176
00:51:49.800 --> 00:51:52.860
The little ships aren't taken directly from Natholeon Web.

1177
00:51:52.920 --> 00:51:55.139
That's what the ships look like in the Natholeon web too.

1178
00:51:55.679 --> 00:51:58.800
Oh, that's a really nice graphic on the wall there.

1179
00:51:58.860 --> 00:52:00.780
That sort of colourful graphic.

1180
00:52:00.840 --> 00:52:02.159
Yeah, it's cute.

1181
00:52:02.219 --> 00:52:04.320
I think the graphics are more colourful here.

1182
00:52:04.860 --> 00:52:09.900
We've detected no lie signs, but more visually arresting sets. lets

1183
00:52:09.900 --> 00:52:10.019
go.

1184
00:52:10.079 --> 00:52:10.440
Yeah.

1185
00:52:10.500 --> 00:52:11.579
Yeah let's go.

1186
00:52:11.639 --> 00:52:15.179
And so they're suggesting that the crew is executed, but of course

1187
00:52:15.179 --> 00:52:19.980
when the crew of the Enterprise go on board the Defiant, they

1188
00:52:19.980 --> 00:52:24.539
learn that the crew have all killed one another and everyone on

1189
00:52:24.539 --> 00:52:25.559
board is dead.

1190
00:52:25.619 --> 00:52:28.440
And that's what Giorgio says later.

1191
00:52:28.500 --> 00:52:33.119
So she says the defiant crossed through interphasic space and that

1192
00:52:33.119 --> 00:52:36.300
resulted in the temporal anomaly and had devastating cognitive

1193
00:52:36.300 --> 00:52:37.739
effects on every crew member.

1194
00:52:37.800 --> 00:52:38.519
They went insane.

1195
00:52:38.579 --> 00:52:39.719
They tore each other apart.

1196
00:52:39.780 --> 00:52:44.340
And it's actually one of the most upsetting things in Natholeon

1197
00:52:44.340 --> 00:52:46.619
Web is they're wandering through and there's just dead people

1198
00:52:46.619 --> 00:52:51.000
everywhere, including women with fabulous 60s hairstyles in those

1199
00:52:51.000 --> 00:52:52.139
minis comics.

1200
00:52:52.199 --> 00:52:53.639
Yeah, probably.

1201
00:52:53.699 --> 00:52:54.719
Yeah.

1202
00:52:55.739 --> 00:53:01.739
Come on now, we're heading over to the...

1203
00:53:01.800 --> 00:53:02.460
Not fight yet.

1204
00:53:02.519 --> 00:53:05.039
There it is It's like desperate for them together.

1205
00:53:05.099 --> 00:53:06.119
Yeah, Blaze.

1206
00:53:06.179 --> 00:53:06.840
Here we go.

1207
00:53:06.900 --> 00:53:10.079
Transportation effect was pretty great as well. great, doesn't

1208
00:53:10.079 --> 00:53:10.260
it?

1209
00:53:10.320 --> 00:53:11.280
It looks really good.

1210
00:53:11.340 --> 00:53:14.280
And it's really nice because you've got the enterprise sort of

1211
00:53:14.280 --> 00:53:15.300
space suits there.

1212
00:53:15.420 --> 00:53:16.800
The original series says.

1213
00:53:16.860 --> 00:53:20.460
I like it when it's sort of the 2 eras bleed together like that.

1214
00:53:20.519 --> 00:53:25.199
Oh my god, the spacesuits in the Thalian web are so bad.

1215
00:53:25.260 --> 00:53:27.179
Are they all really amazing?

1216
00:53:27.420 --> 00:53:32.280
They look like giant microphones on their heads.

1217
00:53:32.340 --> 00:53:34.440
Somebody tell me...

1218
00:53:34.440 --> 00:53:35.219
We want to see it.

1219
00:53:35.280 --> 00:53:39.420
Apparently, though, apparently the detail that they put into where

1220
00:53:39.420 --> 00:53:44.519
the bodies were and all of this on the Defiant, they watch that

1221
00:53:44.519 --> 00:53:47.280
episode again and again and again to get it right.

1222
00:53:47.340 --> 00:53:52.800
Yeah, because that line about the captain's neck being broken is

1223
00:53:52.800 --> 00:53:58.440
also what they say on, uh, on in the Tholian web.

1224
00:53:58.500 --> 00:54:03.780
They notice like the captains on the ground with someone's, you

1225
00:54:03.780 --> 00:54:07.079
know, hands around his neck and he's, say that's how we see him

1226
00:54:07.079 --> 00:54:07.380
here.

1227
00:54:07.559 --> 00:54:11.219
You know what he's got a look of, flocks, when he's evil like

1228
00:54:11.219 --> 00:54:11.400
that?

1229
00:54:11.460 --> 00:54:16.079
He reminds me a bit of when Bilbo Baggins goes bad in Lord of the

1230
00:54:16.079 --> 00:54:16.800
Rings, you know?

1231
00:54:16.860 --> 00:54:21.780
That sort of normally nice old man with a sadistic gleam in his

1232
00:54:21.780 --> 00:54:22.139
eye.

1233
00:54:22.920 --> 00:54:24.539
Look at that.

1234
00:54:24.599 --> 00:54:25.679
He's loving it, isn't he?

1235
00:54:25.800 --> 00:54:27.000
His contacts were amazing.

1236
00:54:27.000 --> 00:54:29.099
Yeah, he's doing really well, isn't he?

1237
00:54:29.219 --> 00:54:29.699
He's great.

1238
00:54:29.760 --> 00:54:33.179
Just so good. face is not moving at all, is he?

1239
00:54:33.539 --> 00:54:36.599
Will you kindly die, he says.

1240
00:54:36.659 --> 00:54:38.460
Yeah, yeah, he's doing really well.

1241
00:54:38.519 --> 00:54:39.539
There it goes.

1242
00:54:39.599 --> 00:54:41.400
Is it crystalline then?

1243
00:54:41.460 --> 00:54:42.300
It seems to shatter.

1244
00:54:42.360 --> 00:54:43.980
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1245
00:54:44.039 --> 00:54:46.619
But all of that, like all you get to see is the head.

1246
00:54:46.679 --> 00:54:49.559
You learn nothing about the Tholians from the episode at all.

1247
00:54:49.619 --> 00:54:55.800
And they are much quicker at building a web than they are in the

1248
00:54:55.800 --> 00:54:56.579
Tholian web.

1249
00:54:56.699 --> 00:55:00.719
Did you watch it with the new CGI web or the old?

1250
00:55:00.780 --> 00:55:03.239
But it is pretty sympathetic to the old one.

1251
00:55:03.300 --> 00:55:06.000
Like, basically they don't attempt anything too fancy.

1252
00:55:06.059 --> 00:55:09.900
It is just 2 ships slowly going across the screen laying the web

1253
00:55:09.900 --> 00:55:10.380
behind them.

1254
00:55:10.440 --> 00:55:12.840
You see where these bodies are on the bridge.

1255
00:55:12.900 --> 00:55:14.159
Is that where they were in the phone?

1256
00:55:14.219 --> 00:55:15.179
You've only just watched this.

1257
00:55:15.239 --> 00:55:18.420
I have only just watched it. sort of in the middle of the bridge.

1258
00:55:18.480 --> 00:55:21.780
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. near the near the thing, near the

1259
00:55:21.780 --> 00:55:22.679
captain's chair.

1260
00:55:23.280 --> 00:55:28.380
See, this is where I got really, Oh, look at this, the web.

1261
00:55:28.500 --> 00:55:29.159
Yeah, yeah.

1262
00:55:29.699 --> 00:55:33.300
Yeah, so this is more impressive.

1263
00:55:33.300 --> 00:55:34.980
Absolutely.

1264
00:55:34.980 --> 00:55:35.699
Napoleon web.

1265
00:55:35.760 --> 00:55:37.980
This is what Star Trek should always be doing.

1266
00:55:38.039 --> 00:55:40.679
It should always be, because that's quite simple, right?

1267
00:55:40.800 --> 00:55:43.079
I mean, I know it's an expensive effect, but it's quite a simple

1268
00:55:43.079 --> 00:55:45.480
idea, but it just looks so striking.

1269
00:55:45.539 --> 00:55:47.820
It's unlike anything you're gonna see elsewhere.

1270
00:55:47.880 --> 00:55:49.380
Yeah, yeah.

1271
00:55:49.440 --> 00:55:53.699
So not at all what you get in the Star Trek.

1272
00:55:53.699 --> 00:55:54.239
Oh, really?

1273
00:55:54.300 --> 00:55:55.619
show series episode.

1274
00:55:55.739 --> 00:55:57.420
What does that look like?

1275
00:55:57.539 --> 00:56:04.800
Slightly less 3D. Much less 3D, uh, and it is, it's the ship's

1276
00:56:04.800 --> 00:56:09.119
just slowly crossing back and forth over a period of about 20

1277
00:56:09.119 --> 00:56:11.699
minutes, uh, laying the web.

1278
00:56:11.760 --> 00:56:13.559
But somewhat more tellingly.

1279
00:56:13.619 --> 00:56:16.559
That's also more visually interesting than what we normally see in

1280
00:56:16.559 --> 00:56:17.400
Enterprise as well.

1281
00:56:17.460 --> 00:56:18.599
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1282
00:56:18.659 --> 00:56:22.380
And we've borrowed it. you know, 14 years later.

1283
00:56:22.440 --> 00:56:23.579
Yeah, exactly.

1284
00:56:23.639 --> 00:56:24.480
Yeah.

1285
00:56:24.539 --> 00:56:26.940
We should be doing that sort of weird all the time.

1286
00:56:27.000 --> 00:56:28.079
Yeah exactly.

1287
00:56:28.980 --> 00:56:32.519
Yeah, now my interest is I'm captured again now.

1288
00:56:32.579 --> 00:56:34.199
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

1289
00:56:34.260 --> 00:56:37.199
Because we are on the set and something exciting is happening.

1290
00:56:37.260 --> 00:56:40.019
And all the lights got on in the dead bodies there.

1291
00:56:40.079 --> 00:56:42.360
Are the lights gone on the outside?

1292
00:56:42.420 --> 00:56:46.500
This is everything I ever wanted from Enterprise, you know, walking

1293
00:56:46.500 --> 00:56:48.420
around on the original series bridge.

1294
00:56:48.719 --> 00:56:50.940
Look how colourful it is.

1295
00:56:51.000 --> 00:56:51.780
It looks so great.

1296
00:56:51.960 --> 00:56:56.820
And interestingly, Manikoto says he was really worried because of

1297
00:56:56.820 --> 00:57:01.559
our, the usual level of sophistication in our sets, he says that

1298
00:57:01.559 --> 00:57:04.619
you know, people would think it's quite plain and dull that we go

1299
00:57:04.619 --> 00:57:06.840
over to the TOS sets, are you mad?

1300
00:57:06.900 --> 00:57:09.300
Are you serious, make it?

1301
00:57:09.360 --> 00:57:10.079
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1302
00:57:10.199 --> 00:57:14.340
Your sophisticated governmental gray can bog off.

1303
00:57:15.119 --> 00:57:19.019
But you know you've got those big flats that are sort of fairly

1304
00:57:19.019 --> 00:57:21.960
featureless in the original enterprise corridors and stuff

1305
00:57:22.019 --> 00:57:23.400
brilliantly.

1306
00:57:23.460 --> 00:57:24.960
That's why all the gels come in.

1307
00:57:25.019 --> 00:57:25.800
That's exactly.

1308
00:57:25.860 --> 00:57:26.699
Yeah, yeah.

1309
00:57:26.760 --> 00:57:30.539
There's a bit less gels, I think, probably in this, like the way

1310
00:57:30.539 --> 00:57:31.079
they should.

1311
00:57:31.920 --> 00:57:33.900
Walk around there quite a lot.

1312
00:57:33.960 --> 00:57:37.559
This was when I got really excited when they blew up Enterprise.

1313
00:57:37.619 --> 00:57:38.280
I was like, yes.

1314
00:57:38.400 --> 00:57:40.920
Yeah, yeah, and blew up Forrester again.

1315
00:57:40.980 --> 00:57:43.920
It is another one of those trek cliches, isn't it?

1316
00:57:43.980 --> 00:57:47.039
We'll only blow up, you know, enterprise G in course of an effect

1317
00:57:47.039 --> 00:57:48.960
when we're in a time loop and we can undo it.

1318
00:57:49.019 --> 00:57:52.559
When I need blow up DS9, when O'Brien's having visions of the

1319
00:57:52.559 --> 00:57:55.260
future, and we'll change what happens in the future.

1320
00:57:55.320 --> 00:57:59.340
I have watched them crash the Enterprise, do you remember though?

1321
00:57:59.400 --> 00:58:02.219
Well, and we watched them Destroy the Defiant as well.

1322
00:58:02.340 --> 00:58:03.960
Change your face of evil.

1323
00:58:04.019 --> 00:58:06.000
Look at all this now.

1324
00:58:06.059 --> 00:58:07.320
This is where all the money's gone.

1325
00:58:07.380 --> 00:58:08.880
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1326
00:58:08.940 --> 00:58:11.519
The little, oh, look, some of them explode when they hit the web.

1327
00:58:11.579 --> 00:58:14.280
Do they have no, they don't like splash if they pick them up.

1328
00:58:14.340 --> 00:58:15.960
It's out of the enterprise sets now.

1329
00:58:16.019 --> 00:58:17.280
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1330
00:58:17.340 --> 00:58:17.820
It's awesome.

1331
00:58:17.880 --> 00:58:20.280
They saved it for the end of the season to shoot this.

1332
00:58:20.340 --> 00:58:21.780
Just before they tore them down.

1333
00:58:21.840 --> 00:58:26.099
Do you think the view thing comes out of the, uh, comes out of the

1334
00:58:26.099 --> 00:58:28.679
thing using a mechanism that must have been more expensive than

1335
00:58:28.679 --> 00:58:30.599
the whole original set?

1336
00:58:30.659 --> 00:58:32.820
There we go. explode.

1337
00:58:32.940 --> 00:58:36.780
So, I mean, can you think of anything more cool than that than

1338
00:58:36.780 --> 00:58:37.199
that way?

1339
00:58:37.199 --> 00:58:40.139
Yeah, that is great. away on a starship and the ship.

1340
00:58:40.139 --> 00:58:40.739
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1341
00:58:40.739 --> 00:58:42.420
Blowing to smithereens.

1342
00:58:42.480 --> 00:58:43.980
And then we're into the cliffhanger.

1343
00:58:44.039 --> 00:58:49.320
Yeah, yeah. awesome. that's so good Yeah, I did think that did get

1344
00:58:49.320 --> 00:58:50.340
a bit flabby in the middle.

1345
00:58:50.400 --> 00:58:52.139
Yeah, yeah.

1346
00:58:52.199 --> 00:58:55.619
I think it is the weaker of the 2 episodes, but I have to say that

1347
00:58:55.619 --> 00:58:57.599
I was pretty hooked by that point.

1348
00:58:57.659 --> 00:59:04.619
Um, but yeah, it perhaps is a little bit less interesting that I

1349
00:59:04.619 --> 00:59:07.860
remember from watching it uh, yesterday.

1350
00:59:07.980 --> 00:59:10.440
I only watched it yesterday as well.

1351
00:59:10.500 --> 00:59:15.300
I think effectively the 2nd the Defiant appears in that move.

1352
00:59:15.420 --> 00:59:20.099
This two-parter just runs right up until the very last scene.

1353
00:59:20.280 --> 00:59:25.500
And and I think this one, like I said, the 2nd one justifies its

1354
00:59:25.500 --> 00:59:34.019
existence as part of this show by having the, um, files on the, on

1355
00:59:34.019 --> 00:59:37.860
the defiant inspire a rebellion, I think.

1356
00:59:37.920 --> 00:59:42.360
I wonder if the if the original plan had gone ahead, and this had

1357
00:59:42.360 --> 00:59:46.980
just been one episode, we might have, they might have excised all

1358
00:59:46.980 --> 00:59:51.599
of that interesting subplot in part 2 about, um, to pull, trying

1359
00:59:51.599 --> 00:59:54.420
to pull together all the aliens and takeover.

1360
00:59:54.480 --> 00:59:58.260
We may have lost either the Foley and Webb or the gore, one part

1361
00:59:58.260 --> 00:59:58.920
of it or another.

1362
00:59:58.980 --> 01:00:03.119
So I think the extra time is good, but there is just 15 minutes

1363
01:00:03.119 --> 01:00:06.900
there where you're like, okay, where's this going?

1364
01:00:06.960 --> 01:00:11.579
Get moving Yeah, I mean, I don't think that we were ever in any

1365
01:00:11.579 --> 01:00:14.340
danger of getting less than 2 episodes, though, were we?

1366
01:00:14.400 --> 01:00:16.679
I mean, this is series 4 of Enterprise.

1367
01:00:16.739 --> 01:00:18.780
That's all they do is 2 and 3 parties.

1368
01:00:18.840 --> 01:00:22.139
Sussman says he was originally just put down to do one episode and

1369
01:00:22.139 --> 01:00:23.699
then they said they wanted to do two.

1370
01:00:23.760 --> 01:00:24.179
Yeah.

1371
01:00:24.239 --> 01:00:25.980
I think they made the right choice.

1372
01:00:26.039 --> 01:00:27.480
Yeah, I did too.

1373
01:00:27.539 --> 01:00:30.719
Because I do think, you know, we said that about Kashara, like we

1374
01:00:30.719 --> 01:00:34.260
only did Kashara because it's a three-parter, I think, and our

1375
01:00:34.260 --> 01:00:38.639
rule is, if it's an episode of a two-parter, we do both, but if

1376
01:00:38.639 --> 01:00:41.219
it's a three-parter, then we just do the one.

1377
01:00:41.579 --> 01:00:46.079
But we did watch it and we felt that it was a really just an

1378
01:00:46.079 --> 01:00:50.340
expansive story that having 3 episodes meant that they could reach

1379
01:00:50.340 --> 01:00:53.039
for something that changed the status quo and did something

1380
01:00:53.039 --> 01:00:53.579
interesting.

1381
01:00:53.639 --> 01:00:55.860
What's really sad?

1382
01:00:55.920 --> 01:00:58.500
I know we've talked about this before is obviously I know every

1383
01:00:58.500 --> 01:00:58.920
show.

1384
01:00:58.980 --> 01:01:01.079
It takes a little while to get going, right?

1385
01:01:01.139 --> 01:01:04.199
You learn what your cast can do.

1386
01:01:04.260 --> 01:01:07.619
You learn what your premise can do. you know, DS9 took a while.

1387
01:01:07.679 --> 01:01:09.539
TNG took a while. fair enough.

1388
01:01:09.599 --> 01:01:14.219
Man, oh, man, imagine if they got here in series 4, where we would

1389
01:01:14.219 --> 01:01:15.179
be in series 4.

1390
01:01:15.360 --> 01:01:23.460
Yeah, like in a way in year, you know, 15 or something of this

1391
01:01:23.460 --> 01:01:27.059
version of Star Trek, you know, this era of Star Trek.

1392
01:01:27.119 --> 01:01:30.300
They shouldn't really be failing.

1393
01:01:30.360 --> 01:01:31.559
Do you know what I mean?

1394
01:01:31.619 --> 01:01:33.719
Like they should really already know how to make it.

1395
01:01:33.780 --> 01:01:38.460
And because they've deliberately made some dumb creative decisions

1396
01:01:38.460 --> 01:01:43.199
because they think, you know, they're trying to sort of extricate

1397
01:01:43.199 --> 01:01:45.420
Star Trek from Star Trek.

1398
01:01:45.480 --> 01:01:47.639
I mean, they're not even calling it Star Trek at that point.

1399
01:01:47.699 --> 01:01:50.099
And those are dumb decisions that they have to walk back.

1400
01:01:50.219 --> 01:01:55.380
And then, you know, series 3 just goes off format altogether.

1401
01:01:55.619 --> 01:02:01.019
And so, you know, like, it's really only in four.

1402
01:02:01.139 --> 01:02:04.800
And it's not the 2 and 3 partners that I like about four.

1403
01:02:04.860 --> 01:02:07.500
It is just the sort of continual storytelling, which I just think

1404
01:02:07.500 --> 01:02:08.699
works really well.

1405
01:02:08.760 --> 01:02:10.679
I'm not the vibe before, though.

1406
01:02:10.739 --> 01:02:14.460
I just feel like there's a confidence in 4 that isn't there in the

1407
01:02:14.460 --> 01:02:17.579
rest of the series and that's come from Maniko, so I think.

1408
01:02:17.639 --> 01:02:20.280
The reason, we've talked about this.

1409
01:02:20.340 --> 01:02:24.539
The reason Enterprise technically failed is because 2 old hands

1410
01:02:24.539 --> 01:02:28.440
that they've been doing this show for over the franchise for over

1411
01:02:28.440 --> 01:02:29.159
a decade now.

1412
01:02:29.219 --> 01:02:32.519
They were just knackered and what else can you bring?

1413
01:02:32.579 --> 01:02:35.579
And yeah, they were making lots of stupid decisions.

1414
01:02:35.639 --> 01:02:38.760
Finally, someone comes in, a breath of fresh air who hasn't

1415
01:02:38.760 --> 01:02:42.300
showrun Star Trek ever before and said, right, let's go.

1416
01:02:42.360 --> 01:02:43.619
And then the blow comes.

1417
01:02:43.679 --> 01:02:46.199
Yeah, compared to shame.

1418
01:02:46.320 --> 01:02:51.480
The more I watch four, the more irritated I get because I think

1419
01:02:51.480 --> 01:02:53.099
there's huge potential in this show.

1420
01:02:53.219 --> 01:02:57.599
Do you know the thing that annoys me about it is that it's kind of

1421
01:02:57.599 --> 01:03:01.860
received fan wisdom that 4 is really great and it does sort of

1422
01:03:01.860 --> 01:03:04.079
things and it annoys me to agree with that?

1423
01:03:04.139 --> 01:03:06.900
But it is... a lot.

1424
01:03:06.960 --> 01:03:07.679
It is true.

1425
01:03:07.800 --> 01:03:08.760
I think it is true.

1426
01:03:08.820 --> 01:03:12.719
And even though they do like a stupid, you know, story about why

1427
01:03:12.719 --> 01:03:16.739
Klingons have ridges, which is such a dumb idea.

1428
01:03:16.800 --> 01:03:18.179
Do you know what I mean?

1429
01:03:18.239 --> 01:03:21.480
It's all just done with so much fun and so much love for the

1430
01:03:21.480 --> 01:03:22.320
original series.

1431
01:03:22.320 --> 01:03:25.619
And, you know, just...

1432
01:03:25.679 --> 01:03:26.579
Yeah, it is a confidence.

1433
01:03:26.639 --> 01:03:29.699
Like they just tell kind of fun stories.

1434
01:03:29.760 --> 01:03:30.599
Do you know what I mean?

1435
01:03:30.659 --> 01:03:33.539
without the chip on their shoulder about being Star Trek.

1436
01:03:33.599 --> 01:03:34.739
You know, I don't know.

1437
01:03:34.800 --> 01:03:35.460
I liked it.

1438
01:03:35.519 --> 01:03:37.320
Well, I like it too.

1439
01:03:37.380 --> 01:03:39.659
Should we go and watch an episode we both like?

1440
01:03:39.719 --> 01:03:43.079
I think we should watch episode two.

1441
01:03:43.619 --> 01:03:46.320
All right, so I'll count it in then.

1442
01:03:46.440 --> 01:03:52.380
Five, four, three, two, one, and we're off.

1443
01:03:52.440 --> 01:03:57.539
This might be my favourite episode of Enterprise that we've done

1444
01:03:57.539 --> 01:03:57.960
today.

1445
01:03:58.019 --> 01:03:59.639
I can't wait.

1446
01:03:59.699 --> 01:04:00.119
Really?

1447
01:04:00.119 --> 01:04:00.659
Yeah.

1448
01:04:00.719 --> 01:04:01.619
Yeah, yeah.

1449
01:04:01.679 --> 01:04:03.239
Yeah, no that's fair enough.

1450
01:04:03.300 --> 01:04:06.059
It's so nice to be able to say positive things about this show.

1451
01:04:06.119 --> 01:04:07.619
Yeah, yeah.

1452
01:04:07.679 --> 01:04:09.900
Because we usually so horrible.

1453
01:04:12.179 --> 01:04:16.559
Of course they got that midrift shot in the previously not

1454
01:04:16.559 --> 01:04:17.159
enterprise.

1455
01:04:17.219 --> 01:04:18.360
So upsetting.

1456
01:04:18.420 --> 01:04:21.840
Actually, look, it's very, it's very telling, you know, that the

1457
01:04:21.840 --> 01:04:26.039
larger percentage of the previously on is from the last 5

1458
01:04:26.039 --> 01:04:26.940
minutes.

1459
01:04:27.000 --> 01:04:28.139
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1460
01:04:28.199 --> 01:04:31.559
Yeah, when it's visually, really interesting and stuff.

1461
01:04:31.619 --> 01:04:33.059
Yeah, I love that way.

1462
01:04:33.900 --> 01:04:37.980
Yeah, it's great seeing a detailed version of the Little Tholian

1463
01:04:37.980 --> 01:04:41.880
ships as well. going through Enterprise being blown to shit.

1464
01:04:41.940 --> 01:04:44.280
Admiral Forrest, the explosion.

1465
01:04:44.639 --> 01:04:47.280
You'd think it couldn't get any better.

1466
01:04:47.340 --> 01:04:51.239
And then when they said the word gone, I was like, yes, I know.

1467
01:04:53.219 --> 01:04:58.139
And the Gordon is really just like, oh, we haven't done a Gordon.

1468
01:04:58.199 --> 01:04:58.980
Do you know what I mean?

1469
01:04:59.039 --> 01:05:00.840
We have to fit a Gordian somehow.

1470
01:05:00.900 --> 01:05:03.000
It's just like...

1471
01:05:03.000 --> 01:05:05.639
You could have just been a humanoid captain of...

1472
01:05:05.639 --> 01:05:08.099
That would have been so much more boring.

1473
01:05:08.880 --> 01:05:15.119
And and we've said it before. the gone in this, the CG gone in

1474
01:05:15.119 --> 01:05:18.059
this is the gone that's in Strange New World.

1475
01:05:18.119 --> 01:05:18.780
Yes.

1476
01:05:18.780 --> 01:05:22.260
The Gordian Strange Worlds don't look like the Gorn from Arena.

1477
01:05:22.320 --> 01:05:24.599
They look like the gone from this episode.

1478
01:05:24.659 --> 01:05:28.619
Neither Enterprise or Strange New Worlds was ever going to do that

1479
01:05:28.619 --> 01:05:30.179
cumbersome costume, were they?

1480
01:05:30.239 --> 01:05:34.679
Although it is pretty great. when they're talking about doing the

1481
01:05:34.679 --> 01:05:36.599
corn on memory alpha.

1482
01:05:36.659 --> 01:05:40.860
They said, can we do the costume and Manicoto was like, no.

1483
01:05:40.920 --> 01:05:44.519
No, will you do this as CGI or not?

1484
01:05:44.579 --> 01:05:46.380
Can we do it?

1485
01:05:47.820 --> 01:05:50.039
Oh, here we go into that.

1486
01:05:50.340 --> 01:05:54.300
The scary black credits with...

1487
01:05:54.360 --> 01:05:56.820
They did mention that that was deliberate, you know, to show just

1488
01:05:56.820 --> 01:06:00.179
how menacing everything's got Star Trek Enterprises no longer in

1489
01:06:00.179 --> 01:06:00.719
white.

1490
01:06:00.780 --> 01:06:01.980
It's black.

1491
01:06:02.039 --> 01:06:02.519
Yeah.

1492
01:06:02.519 --> 01:06:04.320
Don't even, all right?

1493
01:06:04.800 --> 01:06:07.079
Oh, here we go.

1494
01:06:07.139 --> 01:06:07.619
Yeah.

1495
01:06:07.679 --> 01:06:08.340
Yeah.

1496
01:06:09.539 --> 01:06:11.280
I really love this.

1497
01:06:11.400 --> 01:06:13.199
Yeah, I do too.

1498
01:06:13.260 --> 01:06:13.980
I think it's great.

1499
01:06:14.039 --> 01:06:17.219
It's always a fun thing. shows can almost never afford it.

1500
01:06:17.280 --> 01:06:22.559
The 2 title sequences show yours and mine approach to Star Trek

1501
01:06:22.559 --> 01:06:24.300
you know, you like it being optimistic.

1502
01:06:24.360 --> 01:06:27.900
You know, a view of humanity going out into space aspiring to

1503
01:06:27.900 --> 01:06:28.380
being better.

1504
01:06:28.440 --> 01:06:33.179
And there's me, the realist, watching the bombs falling.

1505
01:06:33.179 --> 01:06:34.800
Watching us, everyone's miserable.

1506
01:06:34.800 --> 01:06:39.000
People were destroying planets, the terrible CGI man on the moon.

1507
01:06:40.559 --> 01:06:44.340
What's making the flag ripple on the moon in that shot?

1508
01:06:44.400 --> 01:06:46.739
imagine if Bill Armstrom would look that bad.

1509
01:06:48.659 --> 01:06:51.539
It's not real dragon's teeth.

1510
01:06:51.599 --> 01:06:52.920
Is that what your best teeth?

1511
01:06:52.980 --> 01:06:53.280
Yeah.

1512
01:06:53.280 --> 01:06:53.639
Yeah.

1513
01:06:53.699 --> 01:06:56.880
And then obviously footage from other enterprise episodes, as they

1514
01:06:56.880 --> 01:06:59.699
are in stock cave set number four, sort of coming down.

1515
01:06:59.820 --> 01:07:00.900
It's number one.

1516
01:07:01.320 --> 01:07:05.219
And then, of course, the knife going straight through the earth.

1517
01:07:05.340 --> 01:07:06.719
Exactly.

1518
01:07:06.780 --> 01:07:07.920
So awesome.

1519
01:07:07.920 --> 01:07:08.699
Exciting.

1520
01:07:08.760 --> 01:07:10.800
Yes, look at this sad.

1521
01:07:10.800 --> 01:07:12.360
Enterprise is destroyed.

1522
01:07:12.420 --> 01:07:14.820
We're on safe territory now with the sets.

1523
01:07:14.880 --> 01:07:16.500
Yeah, on the defiant.

1524
01:07:16.559 --> 01:07:17.280
So good.

1525
01:07:18.599 --> 01:07:23.639
Alan, just watch the director of photography, Marvin Rush is

1526
01:07:23.639 --> 01:07:24.480
directing this now.

1527
01:07:24.539 --> 01:07:27.059
And as you and I have spoken about off Mike.

1528
01:07:27.119 --> 01:07:28.380
He's only done a couple of episodes.

1529
01:07:28.440 --> 01:07:30.000
He did the host for TNG.

1530
01:07:30.059 --> 01:07:32.699
The Thor for Voyager.

1531
01:07:32.760 --> 01:07:35.760
So they usually bring him in when there's some sort of visually

1532
01:07:35.760 --> 01:07:36.840
demanding things to do.

1533
01:07:36.960 --> 01:07:40.139
And he lights this episode brilliantly.

1534
01:07:40.199 --> 01:07:41.340
Yeah.

1535
01:07:41.400 --> 01:07:41.940
Yeah.

1536
01:07:42.000 --> 01:07:45.420
It's not quite lit like original trek, is it?

1537
01:07:45.480 --> 01:07:47.519
But that's okay, I think.

1538
01:07:47.579 --> 01:07:50.280
It's like you said, it's more than television.

1539
01:07:50.340 --> 01:07:54.360
It would be like if they, you know, where they did, um, when

1540
01:07:54.360 --> 01:07:56.940
they've done things in Kurtzman track, had they just made it look

1541
01:07:56.940 --> 01:07:58.920
like the original, they would do it, would they?

1542
01:07:58.980 --> 01:08:00.840
It's still modern television.

1543
01:08:00.900 --> 01:08:02.159
Well, this isn't now.

1544
01:08:02.219 --> 01:08:06.900
And in fact, when we go back to the Enterprise in series 2 of

1545
01:08:06.900 --> 01:08:10.559
Discovery, they make the decision to update it.

1546
01:08:10.619 --> 01:08:14.159
It's not just a copy like this or relics.

1547
01:08:14.219 --> 01:08:18.239
They decide to make it big and expansive and look modern and stuff

1548
01:08:18.239 --> 01:08:21.359
which is, of course, the right decision so many years later, I

1549
01:08:21.359 --> 01:08:21.539
think.

1550
01:08:21.840 --> 01:08:26.520
Not only did they steal the defiant, but they also fire off...

1551
01:08:26.520 --> 01:08:28.500
They do photon torpedoes to blow up the moon.

1552
01:08:28.560 --> 01:08:29.039
Yeah.

1553
01:08:29.039 --> 01:08:30.840
Yeah. true assholes.

1554
01:08:34.739 --> 01:08:39.420
Yeah, you can't help but really hate Archer.

1555
01:08:39.479 --> 01:08:41.819
Yeah, even more than usual.

1556
01:08:41.939 --> 01:08:44.159
Yeah, that's exactly right.

1557
01:08:44.220 --> 01:08:48.119
Maybe, maybe the alternative Archer should have been a really nice

1558
01:08:48.119 --> 01:08:51.060
guy like Scott Bakula, you know, really fun.

1559
01:08:51.119 --> 01:08:53.460
That's the alternative version.

1560
01:08:53.520 --> 01:08:56.699
Yeah, that's right, charming and likeable.

1561
01:08:56.760 --> 01:08:58.199
He rides horses.

1562
01:08:58.260 --> 01:08:59.579
He plays classical music.

1563
01:08:59.640 --> 01:09:01.020
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1564
01:09:01.079 --> 01:09:02.159
That's right.

1565
01:09:02.220 --> 01:09:04.140
He doesn't know what water polo is.

1566
01:09:04.260 --> 01:09:05.819
He still has a dog, obviously.

1567
01:09:06.300 --> 01:09:07.680
Yeah.

1568
01:09:11.520 --> 01:09:14.939
That would have been a proper insult, though, wouldn't it?

1569
01:09:15.000 --> 01:09:16.260
I don't think they'd go that far.

1570
01:09:16.319 --> 01:09:17.220
No.

1571
01:09:17.640 --> 01:09:25.439
No, I quite like what they do here, where, where in a way, they

1572
01:09:25.439 --> 01:09:30.479
get a kind of look into a world that's much better than theirs.

1573
01:09:30.539 --> 01:09:33.479
You know, where you're not constantly living in fear of being

1574
01:09:33.479 --> 01:09:34.739
stabbed.

1575
01:09:34.800 --> 01:09:41.220
Uh, you know, and where he is a good person who's famous and

1576
01:09:41.220 --> 01:09:42.000
recognised.

1577
01:09:42.119 --> 01:09:44.340
And because he is such a fucking loser.

1578
01:09:44.399 --> 01:09:46.619
You know, we, he's still a commander.

1579
01:09:46.680 --> 01:09:50.579
We don't see him in charge of the ship, you know, like that, it's

1580
01:09:50.579 --> 01:09:51.899
surprising, isn't it?

1581
01:09:51.960 --> 01:09:55.380
That 1st captain's log in the 1st episode where it's being read by

1582
01:09:55.380 --> 01:09:58.020
someone else and you kind of go, where's where's Archer?

1583
01:09:58.739 --> 01:10:03.659
And I really, really love the moment when Tapol goes up to flocks

1584
01:10:03.659 --> 01:10:07.680
and says, this is how things are, like, we're equals.

1585
01:10:07.739 --> 01:10:10.319
And flux is appalled, isn't he?

1586
01:10:10.380 --> 01:10:12.960
And he sort of holds back for quite a bit.

1587
01:10:13.079 --> 01:10:14.819
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1588
01:10:14.819 --> 01:10:18.479
As if, you know, he's been put in his place and he cannot imagine

1589
01:10:19.380 --> 01:10:22.439
that ever being the case where he's an E4?

1590
01:10:22.560 --> 01:10:23.039
that's right.

1591
01:10:23.100 --> 01:10:23.640
Yeah.

1592
01:10:23.699 --> 01:10:26.880
It's a lot more interesting than these alternative universe

1593
01:10:26.880 --> 01:10:28.500
episodes usually are, that's for sure.

1594
01:10:28.560 --> 01:10:29.640
Yeah, I think so.

1595
01:10:29.760 --> 01:10:30.779
I think so too.

1596
01:10:31.500 --> 01:10:36.840
But like, like, we've recently done an episode which we both

1597
01:10:36.840 --> 01:10:40.439
really, really hated about an alternative version of the crew

1598
01:10:40.439 --> 01:10:45.600
discovering that there is a better version of the crew elsewhere

1599
01:10:45.600 --> 01:10:47.100
and that was coarse oblivion.

1600
01:10:47.159 --> 01:10:51.000
Well, yeah, except that was an alternative version of the crew who

1601
01:10:51.000 --> 01:10:53.520
were better than our crew, like they were nearly home.

1602
01:10:53.579 --> 01:10:55.140
You know, they were doing a much better job.

1603
01:10:55.140 --> 01:10:57.899
But the normal crew, were they?

1604
01:10:57.960 --> 01:10:58.739
No, that's true.

1605
01:10:58.800 --> 01:11:00.119
That's true.

1606
01:11:00.180 --> 01:11:06.420
But what we watch there is lots of just kind of gross, ugly crap.

1607
01:11:06.479 --> 01:11:07.199
Do you know what I mean?

1608
01:11:07.260 --> 01:11:10.920
I just think that the reaction to learning is so much more

1609
01:11:10.920 --> 01:11:12.060
interesting here there.

1610
01:11:12.180 --> 01:11:15.119
It's like, well, we're just going to try and find them and accept

1611
01:11:15.119 --> 01:11:16.859
the inevitable eventually, you know.

1612
01:11:16.920 --> 01:11:18.960
Look at, look.

1613
01:11:19.020 --> 01:11:20.640
Oh, the uniform.

1614
01:11:20.699 --> 01:11:21.659
Oh, she.

1615
01:11:21.720 --> 01:11:24.659
Yes, that is such a great choice.

1616
01:11:24.720 --> 01:11:26.699
Holy crap, can we get ocean?

1617
01:11:30.659 --> 01:11:34.319
We have to go back to normal ball against Bryan's next week.

1618
01:11:34.439 --> 01:11:37.140
Oh, no, it's demons and terrible episodes.

1619
01:11:37.199 --> 01:11:37.680
That's true.

1620
01:11:37.680 --> 01:11:37.920
Yeah.

1621
01:11:37.979 --> 01:11:38.880
That is true.

1622
01:11:39.239 --> 01:11:43.380
It is quite telling though, isn't it, that, and they did know at

1623
01:11:43.380 --> 01:11:47.520
this point they were going out, that in the last 5 episodes, 3 of

1624
01:11:47.520 --> 01:11:48.779
the five.

1625
01:11:48.899 --> 01:11:54.060
Whatever you're going to say to me right now, pause it, are not in

1626
01:11:54.060 --> 01:11:55.859
our universe, you know?

1627
01:11:55.920 --> 01:11:57.119
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1628
01:11:57.180 --> 01:11:59.039
It's like, well, let's do all the things we could do.

1629
01:11:59.100 --> 01:12:01.739
We'll do a TNG episode, disguise us an enterprise episode.

1630
01:12:01.800 --> 01:12:04.680
We'll do an alternative universe episode. and we'll do a two-part

1631
01:12:04.680 --> 01:12:05.039
wrap up.

1632
01:12:05.100 --> 01:12:06.899
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1633
01:12:07.020 --> 01:12:10.800
Well, and it's a it's a good call because it's mostly all very

1634
01:12:10.800 --> 01:12:13.140
entertaining apart from the last episode.

1635
01:12:13.199 --> 01:12:14.640
But, yeah.

1636
01:12:14.640 --> 01:12:16.140
Yeah.

1637
01:12:16.199 --> 01:12:19.619
I just can't imagine any of the other shows going out on this

1638
01:12:19.619 --> 01:12:19.739
though.

1639
01:12:19.800 --> 01:12:21.000
No.

1640
01:12:21.060 --> 01:12:22.140
Yeah.

1641
01:12:22.199 --> 01:12:25.739
Oh, look, there's our little dorky Hoshi there.

1642
01:12:25.800 --> 01:12:30.119
A little picture of her being a bit dorky rather than our

1643
01:12:30.119 --> 01:12:33.060
incredibly sexy and self-confident one, I hear.

1644
01:12:33.180 --> 01:12:37.260
Well, they sort of conceptualiser in the prime universe as a

1645
01:12:37.260 --> 01:12:40.800
character who is obviously very smart, good with languages, but

1646
01:12:40.800 --> 01:12:45.720
very nervous of the transporters and a bit sort of socially

1647
01:12:45.720 --> 01:12:46.800
distant from everybody.

1648
01:12:46.859 --> 01:12:50.279
And whilst those are things to explore.

1649
01:12:50.340 --> 01:12:52.619
One, they don't do it much.

1650
01:12:52.680 --> 01:12:54.899
Maybe once a year, maybe once a year they do that.

1651
01:12:54.960 --> 01:12:59.039
And two, it doesn't make her very fun to be around.

1652
01:12:59.100 --> 01:13:01.199
Not like this character. that's go wrong.

1653
01:13:01.260 --> 01:13:04.439
Poisoning and fucking people left right in the centre.

1654
01:13:04.500 --> 01:13:08.460
But I don't think I'd ever realised how beautiful she is, and I

1655
01:13:08.460 --> 01:13:12.840
think it's the makeup, but more than that, it's just how relaxed

1656
01:13:12.899 --> 01:13:13.739
smile.

1657
01:13:13.800 --> 01:13:16.619
Look at that beautiful confident smile.

1658
01:13:16.680 --> 01:13:17.760
She's so gorgeous.

1659
01:13:17.819 --> 01:13:19.859
She's usually so mousey.

1660
01:13:19.920 --> 01:13:21.960
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1661
01:13:22.020 --> 01:13:26.039
And so reading this thing where she's reading what a great success

1662
01:13:26.039 --> 01:13:31.680
this version of Archer is from their world, whereas this guy is

1663
01:13:31.680 --> 01:13:33.119
such a fucking loser.

1664
01:13:33.180 --> 01:13:35.279
You know, look how angry he is.

1665
01:13:35.340 --> 01:13:36.899
Two planets were named after him.

1666
01:13:36.960 --> 01:13:40.859
I mean, I'm not entirely sure I recognise that other archer either

1667
01:13:40.859 --> 01:13:44.520
from the evidence that we've seen.

1668
01:13:44.579 --> 01:13:48.659
There is a planet called Archer 2 that gets mentioned in Star Trek

1669
01:13:48.659 --> 01:13:49.439
the next.

1670
01:13:49.800 --> 01:13:56.159
And they've taken the 4th last episode of this to, you know, to

1671
01:13:56.159 --> 01:13:59.640
make it canon that that planet is named after Jonathan Archer.

1672
01:13:59.699 --> 01:14:02.939
It's between Aldea and Denib 4.

1673
01:14:03.300 --> 01:14:05.399
Oh, Chitsu.

1674
01:14:05.460 --> 01:14:07.079
I'm looking it up.

1675
01:14:07.619 --> 01:14:12.840
But you can you can actually feel the actors responding to the

1676
01:14:12.840 --> 01:14:15.899
scripts in this in a way that you don't normally feel that

1677
01:14:15.899 --> 01:14:17.279
watching Enterprise.

1678
01:14:17.399 --> 01:14:19.979
Yeah, look at the light in there.

1679
01:14:20.039 --> 01:14:22.920
My God, all the shadows. so good.

1680
01:14:22.979 --> 01:14:27.479
Oh, there was one hilarious moment in this episode, Nathan.

1681
01:14:27.539 --> 01:14:31.079
When the gorn attacks the fella in the tube and lifts him up.

1682
01:14:31.140 --> 01:14:33.300
There's no resistance to him.

1683
01:14:33.359 --> 01:14:35.939
It just all goes, whoop, up tube.

1684
01:14:36.000 --> 01:14:37.680
It's really tight.

1685
01:14:37.739 --> 01:14:38.880
It's quite terribly dumb.

1686
01:14:39.600 --> 01:14:42.840
You know, Kurtzman would have gone, let's go for another take.

1687
01:14:43.680 --> 01:14:47.819
Um, no, I've just discovered the planet's called Archer 4.

1688
01:14:48.239 --> 01:14:51.300
Uh, and it is...

1689
01:14:51.300 --> 01:14:52.199
So is there's a four?

1690
01:14:52.260 --> 01:14:53.760
Does that then mean there's one, two, and three?

1691
01:14:53.819 --> 01:14:55.260
I think so.

1692
01:14:55.319 --> 01:14:58.800
And they call it Archer 4 and that's the planet that they land on

1693
01:14:58.800 --> 01:15:00.720
in Strange New World, apparently.

1694
01:15:00.779 --> 01:15:01.199
All right.

1695
01:15:01.260 --> 01:15:05.460
So here's this this guy, this red shirt here, although it's just a

1696
01:15:05.460 --> 01:15:09.539
little red stripe because it's enterprise, and he's the one who

1697
01:15:09.539 --> 01:15:10.680
gets killed by the gore.

1698
01:15:10.739 --> 01:15:12.899
He just has victims stamped on his forehead, doesn't he?

1699
01:15:13.020 --> 01:15:13.979
He does.

1700
01:15:14.039 --> 01:15:15.720
But look at the wonderful set.

1701
01:15:15.779 --> 01:15:17.819
It's a fantastic set.

1702
01:15:17.880 --> 01:15:19.560
Beautiful, yeah. awesome, isn't it?

1703
01:15:19.619 --> 01:15:21.600
You know, here we go.

1704
01:15:21.659 --> 01:15:22.500
Watch him going up the tube.

1705
01:15:22.560 --> 01:15:24.479
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1706
01:15:24.479 --> 01:15:25.140
His leg.

1707
01:15:25.199 --> 01:15:27.420
You know, when you sort of get an itch on your leg.

1708
01:15:27.479 --> 01:15:28.859
His leg just sort of wiggles like that.

1709
01:15:28.920 --> 01:15:30.659
Just wiggle your legs about it.

1710
01:15:30.720 --> 01:15:31.800
With your legs.

1711
01:15:31.859 --> 01:15:35.399
I think they said to him, don't struggle too much on the harness

1712
01:15:35.399 --> 01:15:38.159
or snap or something like that, you know. might be right.

1713
01:15:38.819 --> 01:15:42.840
But when I think of those people being dragged down corridors by

1714
01:15:42.840 --> 01:15:44.220
the Gordon in strange new worlds.

1715
01:15:44.279 --> 01:15:45.420
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1716
01:15:45.479 --> 01:15:50.939
Just leaving a giant trail of blood. blood. can't do that on

1717
01:15:50.939 --> 01:15:51.539
enterprise.

1718
01:15:51.600 --> 01:15:53.939
That was such a brilliant episode, wasn't it?

1719
01:15:54.659 --> 01:15:56.460
Because I love this.

1720
01:15:56.520 --> 01:15:59.100
I just love them all hanging out on this TOS bridge.

1721
01:15:59.159 --> 01:16:00.840
I could just watch this.

1722
01:16:02.640 --> 01:16:06.239
Please don't go back to the usual bore against prize.

1723
01:16:06.300 --> 01:16:06.960
I keep saying it.

1724
01:16:07.319 --> 01:16:09.840
Yeah, well, really.

1725
01:16:09.899 --> 01:16:11.699
This scene, I thought, was really well done.

1726
01:16:11.760 --> 01:16:16.500
As a as a one scene role for an actor, I think the actor in the

1727
01:16:16.500 --> 01:16:18.300
blue makeup there does a great job.

1728
01:16:19.140 --> 01:16:20.640
Yeah.

1729
01:16:20.699 --> 01:16:24.420
Oh, look, Travis looks so camp, doesn't he?

1730
01:16:24.479 --> 01:16:27.840
Like he's all sweaty and he's singlet and his little, like his

1731
01:16:27.840 --> 01:16:30.899
hair, like his wig that he's wearing and his earring and stuff.

1732
01:16:30.960 --> 01:16:32.579
Oh, my God.

1733
01:16:32.640 --> 01:16:34.380
He's so pretty, isn't he?

1734
01:16:34.439 --> 01:16:35.399
Look at that.

1735
01:16:35.460 --> 01:16:36.779
Oh he's so sweated up as well.

1736
01:16:36.840 --> 01:16:37.979
Yeah, yeah.

1737
01:16:38.039 --> 01:16:40.079
Why would you not focus on that man?

1738
01:16:40.140 --> 01:16:41.340
Just wasted.

1739
01:16:41.399 --> 01:16:42.659
Why would you ignore him?

1740
01:16:42.720 --> 01:16:43.920
Disgraceful.

1741
01:16:43.920 --> 01:16:46.020
It's so bad too.

1742
01:16:46.079 --> 01:16:48.060
Like, it's so upsettingly bad.

1743
01:16:48.119 --> 01:16:51.239
They waste the 2 non-white characters in this show.

1744
01:16:51.300 --> 01:16:56.460
In that, um, cool Brandon Braga's task interview that they did

1745
01:16:56.460 --> 01:16:58.079
when they brought the whole trip together.

1746
01:16:58.140 --> 01:17:02.460
You know, he's so humble and he goes, yeah, I didn't care too much

1747
01:17:02.460 --> 01:17:04.739
that I didn't get too much to do because I was just hanging out

1748
01:17:04.739 --> 01:17:06.359
with these amazing actors and having a great time.

1749
01:17:06.420 --> 01:17:09.180
What I wanted him to say was, what the fuck?

1750
01:17:09.239 --> 01:17:14.039
Like you gave me 3 lines a season. you know.

1751
01:17:14.100 --> 01:17:14.760
Yeah, yeah.

1752
01:17:14.819 --> 01:17:17.939
And Jolene Blaylock got to play every bloody moment.

1753
01:17:18.000 --> 01:17:19.859
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1754
01:17:19.920 --> 01:17:23.100
I actually think this is a little bit unpleasant to watch.

1755
01:17:23.340 --> 01:17:25.800
Oh, see, I love all this.

1756
01:17:25.859 --> 01:17:28.619
Well, I'm happy to play blood coming out his mouth.

1757
01:17:28.680 --> 01:17:29.819
Yeah, no.

1758
01:17:29.880 --> 01:17:32.520
When they put you in the tube and tort you, that's one thing.

1759
01:17:32.579 --> 01:17:33.899
They will do sausage.

1760
01:17:34.020 --> 01:17:37.619
It does look a bit like the blue man who was in the voice.

1761
01:17:38.460 --> 01:17:40.319
It's straight 2 hours episode, yeah.

1762
01:17:40.380 --> 01:17:43.979
He also looks a bit like the blue man in the Pal Moonlight.

1763
01:17:44.039 --> 01:17:44.460
Do you remember him?

1764
01:17:44.579 --> 01:17:46.260
Yeah.

1765
01:17:46.260 --> 01:17:50.460
I can't tell you how grateful I am to see you, captains, just go

1766
01:17:50.460 --> 01:17:51.119
about Villa.

1767
01:17:51.180 --> 01:17:53.220
He was wonderful, poor guy.

1768
01:17:53.279 --> 01:17:54.119
He gets blowed up.

1769
01:17:54.239 --> 01:17:56.819
Off screen, though. offscreen.

1770
01:17:56.880 --> 01:17:57.479
Offscreen.

1771
01:17:57.539 --> 01:18:00.960
I'll be along to say, hello, says Garak.

1772
01:18:01.199 --> 01:18:10.560
Oh, look, Anthony's changed into, into his, um, into his, uh, TOS

1773
01:18:10.560 --> 01:18:11.279
outfit there.

1774
01:18:11.340 --> 01:18:14.520
Why does everybody automatically look more hot in the TOS

1775
01:18:14.520 --> 01:18:15.000
uniform?

1776
01:18:15.060 --> 01:18:16.380
Yeah, yeah, they're great.

1777
01:18:16.439 --> 01:18:19.619
But can we not put Hoshi in in one?

1778
01:18:19.680 --> 01:18:21.779
Can't we see her in the miniskirt?

1779
01:18:21.840 --> 01:18:24.119
because they want to show off a midrift.

1780
01:18:24.180 --> 01:18:24.659
That the trouble.

1781
01:18:24.720 --> 01:18:26.039
Yeah, yeah.

1782
01:18:30.000 --> 01:18:30.779
Yeah.

1783
01:18:31.319 --> 01:18:33.899
I'm just watching the pretty pictures now.

1784
01:18:33.899 --> 01:18:36.479
I know, I know, it's amazing, isn't it?

1785
01:18:36.539 --> 01:18:40.619
But there's Mayweather in the background, Mayweather

1786
01:18:40.619 --> 01:18:41.159
Merriweather.

1787
01:18:41.220 --> 01:18:43.859
Oh my god, there's the gone.

1788
01:18:43.920 --> 01:18:46.199
And in sort of silhouette as well, you know?

1789
01:18:46.260 --> 01:18:47.340
Yeah, it's good though.

1790
01:18:47.399 --> 01:18:49.380
And it's not long enough for you.

1791
01:18:49.380 --> 01:18:50.939
It's kind of what he looks like.

1792
01:18:51.000 --> 01:18:52.380
So you're just like, no, no, no.

1793
01:18:52.439 --> 01:18:53.760
Turn around, turn the camera around.

1794
01:18:53.819 --> 01:18:54.359
I wanna see it.

1795
01:18:54.420 --> 01:18:56.640
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1796
01:18:56.699 --> 01:18:58.800
Yeah, well, sorry when they do that.

1797
01:18:58.859 --> 01:19:02.039
I think the bit where he struggles with archer and all of that.

1798
01:19:02.100 --> 01:19:04.739
I still think for the time it looks pretty impressive.

1799
01:19:04.800 --> 01:19:06.000
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1800
01:19:06.060 --> 01:19:06.479
Yeah.

1801
01:19:07.439 --> 01:19:11.159
I know I keep going on about the line and I'm going to again.

1802
01:19:11.220 --> 01:19:14.880
But just remember those scenes in episode one on the bridge where

1803
01:19:14.880 --> 01:19:18.539
it is that very flat lighting and there's no depth to the shots.

1804
01:19:18.659 --> 01:19:20.340
Just watch all these shots in this episode.

1805
01:19:20.399 --> 01:19:23.880
All the characters stand out because they're being lit so

1806
01:19:23.880 --> 01:19:24.420
effectively.

1807
01:19:24.479 --> 01:19:30.060
So I think our archer, that's just his ambition, isn't it?

1808
01:19:30.180 --> 01:19:34.140
Because our archer represents for him, represents success.

1809
01:19:34.199 --> 01:19:39.539
He's successful, and our archer is constantly telling him to, you

1810
01:19:39.539 --> 01:19:43.380
know, sees things and be impressive and stuff.

1811
01:19:43.439 --> 01:19:46.260
So it's it's a little bit odd.

1812
01:19:46.319 --> 01:19:48.659
Like, I'm not sure that it properly works.

1813
01:19:48.720 --> 01:19:53.699
And surprisingly, seeing our archer is actually quite a relief.

1814
01:19:53.760 --> 01:19:54.420
Do you know what I mean?

1815
01:19:54.479 --> 01:19:59.399
Because this version of Archer is so much more of an asshole, even

1816
01:19:59.399 --> 01:20:03.779
than our archer, who is a bit more relaxed. an impossibility.

1817
01:20:03.840 --> 01:20:04.859
There we are.

1818
01:20:04.920 --> 01:20:08.760
Yeah, because he's such a focussing they could have done. would

1819
01:20:08.760 --> 01:20:11.880
have been for him to have had a redemptive story where at the end

1820
01:20:11.880 --> 01:20:15.420
he's like, I'm going to be a better person now I've read this. and

1821
01:20:15.420 --> 01:20:18.119
you know, and he goes, instead, no.

1822
01:20:18.180 --> 01:20:19.500
He portrays everybody.

1823
01:20:19.560 --> 01:20:21.239
No, he's an absolute loser.

1824
01:20:21.239 --> 01:20:22.199
I'm going to be the emperor.

1825
01:20:22.319 --> 01:20:26.039
Yeah, I'm going to be the emperor and then he's dead and better

1826
01:20:26.039 --> 01:20:27.060
people take over.

1827
01:20:27.119 --> 01:20:29.880
Please, I can read.

1828
01:20:29.939 --> 01:20:32.579
Where did he learn to fucking use a gun like that?

1829
01:20:32.640 --> 01:20:34.380
That's the campus thing I've ever seen?

1830
01:20:34.439 --> 01:20:35.579
He's having fun.

1831
01:20:35.640 --> 01:20:37.199
He's having fun.

1832
01:20:37.380 --> 01:20:39.600
Again, I'm gonna say it.

1833
01:20:39.659 --> 01:20:42.300
Watch the framing, watch the camera movement.

1834
01:20:42.359 --> 01:20:45.720
There is some real effort going into this episode into how it

1835
01:20:45.720 --> 01:20:45.960
looks.

1836
01:20:46.079 --> 01:20:46.680
Yeah.

1837
01:20:46.680 --> 01:20:50.399
Yeah, they just want this to stand out a lot.

1838
01:20:50.460 --> 01:20:51.119
Come on, man.

1839
01:20:51.180 --> 01:20:52.140
I want to see the gourd.

1840
01:20:52.199 --> 01:20:53.100
Stop teasing me.

1841
01:20:53.159 --> 01:20:55.079
Yeah, yeah, yeah, come on.

1842
01:20:55.199 --> 01:21:00.060
Oh here we go. here we go Oh, his claw goes down on the button

1843
01:21:00.060 --> 01:21:01.800
when he talks.

1844
01:21:01.859 --> 01:21:02.520
Yeah, that's awesome.

1845
01:21:02.640 --> 01:21:07.020
That's really great Those guys get exploded.

1846
01:21:07.079 --> 01:21:08.880
Oh, does Reed get killed nearly.

1847
01:21:08.939 --> 01:21:09.659
No, that's right.

1848
01:21:09.720 --> 01:21:10.319
No.

1849
01:21:10.319 --> 01:21:13.079
It's left ambiguous because they wanted to bring it back for the

1850
01:21:13.079 --> 01:21:14.699
5th season Mirror Universe.

1851
01:21:14.699 --> 01:21:15.720
Okay.

1852
01:21:15.779 --> 01:21:17.159
So we're not too sure.

1853
01:21:17.220 --> 01:21:18.420
They're super callous about it.

1854
01:21:18.479 --> 01:21:24.899
Like, Archer could have looked over him. the captain just ignores

1855
01:21:24.899 --> 01:21:25.079
him.

1856
01:21:25.140 --> 01:21:28.739
I mean, I'm wondering if, because he is sort of very obsequious to

1857
01:21:28.739 --> 01:21:29.579
Archer.

1858
01:21:29.640 --> 01:21:32.640
I'm wondering if he's supposed to fancy him a little bit. looking

1859
01:21:32.640 --> 01:21:34.140
for a gay reading anywhere in this.

1860
01:21:34.199 --> 01:21:37.319
Yeah, I just don't think there is any in this thing.

1861
01:21:37.560 --> 01:21:41.579
We're well and truly alpha in enterprise, aren't we?

1862
01:21:41.640 --> 01:21:42.180
Yeah.

1863
01:21:42.180 --> 01:21:45.000
Oh, that's...

1864
01:21:45.060 --> 01:21:47.760
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1865
01:21:47.819 --> 01:21:52.920
It's still not as good as the massive blood that they normally

1866
01:21:52.920 --> 01:21:55.560
have in strangely worlds with the dawn, though.

1867
01:21:55.619 --> 01:21:57.960
If you sort of switch this on now, you could have sworn you were

1868
01:21:57.960 --> 01:21:59.699
in an original series episode, couldn't you?

1869
01:22:00.300 --> 01:22:02.939
Maybe not now.

1870
01:22:03.180 --> 01:22:07.020
Yeah, yeah, it really looks like an original series episode, but

1871
01:22:07.020 --> 01:22:11.640
those sort of plastic, you know, like mustard bottles stuck to the

1872
01:22:11.640 --> 01:22:13.319
wall and stuff, you know.

1873
01:22:13.380 --> 01:22:16.260
But they're stepping over bodies, left, right, and centre.

1874
01:22:16.560 --> 01:22:20.399
Huge close up on Archer's face as they're going down the darkened

1875
01:22:20.399 --> 01:22:21.000
corridor.

1876
01:22:21.060 --> 01:22:22.800
There's proper suspense in this.

1877
01:22:22.859 --> 01:22:28.319
But, I mean, that's the scene in in the Tholian Web where the

1878
01:22:28.319 --> 01:22:30.239
sheep is full of dead bodies, you know.

1879
01:22:30.659 --> 01:22:32.819
Oh my god, here we go.

1880
01:22:32.880 --> 01:22:34.859
Yeah, I know that Gordon's around here somewhere.

1881
01:22:34.920 --> 01:22:36.239
Yeah, come on.

1882
01:22:36.300 --> 01:22:38.039
I mean, we love all of this.

1883
01:22:38.100 --> 01:22:39.359
We love go. there he is.

1884
01:22:40.319 --> 01:22:42.180
He's above you.

1885
01:22:42.779 --> 01:22:46.680
Why isn't he wearing a cocktail dress, like the original gone?

1886
01:22:46.739 --> 01:22:48.659
Why isn't he wearing something spangled?

1887
01:22:48.720 --> 01:22:51.479
There's no need to protect his modesty, this call.

1888
01:22:51.539 --> 01:22:53.520
He is saying something.

1889
01:22:54.600 --> 01:22:54.960
Yeah, yeah.

1890
01:22:55.020 --> 01:22:56.039
No, but he is wearing something.

1891
01:22:56.100 --> 01:22:59.159
He's just not wearing something quite as fabulous as the born in

1892
01:22:59.159 --> 01:22:59.760
arena.

1893
01:23:02.340 --> 01:23:04.560
That's really terrible.

1894
01:23:05.340 --> 01:23:06.960
Come on.

1895
01:23:07.979 --> 01:23:10.500
Look at him punching it.

1896
01:23:10.560 --> 01:23:12.479
He has hold of him.

1897
01:23:12.539 --> 01:23:15.180
He should be able to just disembowel him in a second.

1898
01:23:15.300 --> 01:23:17.939
It's like it's in a completely different room.

1899
01:23:18.720 --> 01:23:22.619
That's because it is Look, he picks up that man.

1900
01:23:22.680 --> 01:23:23.699
Yep.

1901
01:23:23.760 --> 01:23:25.560
And they follow him against the wall.

1902
01:23:25.619 --> 01:23:27.479
They should bite his head off.

1903
01:23:27.539 --> 01:23:30.119
There, that shot where he turns around, though, is great.

1904
01:23:30.180 --> 01:23:31.439
Yeah that is pretty good.

1905
01:23:31.500 --> 01:23:33.239
And then POV shots.

1906
01:23:33.300 --> 01:23:33.960
Love it.

1907
01:23:34.020 --> 01:23:34.680
Yeah.

1908
01:23:34.739 --> 01:23:36.420
Cheaper POV shots.

1909
01:23:36.479 --> 01:23:39.420
You see the gravity on and squash him.

1910
01:23:39.479 --> 01:23:42.000
Yeah, he's got great hatting along the corridor.

1911
01:23:42.060 --> 01:23:42.899
Oh yeah.

1912
01:23:42.960 --> 01:23:48.300
Oh, see, he's not wearing the, he's wearing a dress, but it's not

1913
01:23:48.300 --> 01:23:50.760
the Spangly dress that gone from.

1914
01:23:51.000 --> 01:23:52.979
They can't get the lighting, right?

1915
01:23:53.039 --> 01:23:54.960
They can't get the texture right yet.

1916
01:23:55.020 --> 01:23:55.739
Do you know what I mean?

1917
01:23:55.859 --> 01:23:56.460
That's the problem.

1918
01:23:56.520 --> 01:23:58.859
So it never really looks like part of the scene.

1919
01:23:58.920 --> 01:24:01.560
But good on them for trying, I think.

1920
01:24:01.680 --> 01:24:02.640
Fabulous.

1921
01:24:02.640 --> 01:24:03.779
Oh, come on, yeah.

1922
01:24:03.840 --> 01:24:06.359
It's captured Archer, against Argor.

1923
01:24:06.420 --> 01:24:07.500
I know.

1924
01:24:07.500 --> 01:24:08.100
I know.

1925
01:24:08.159 --> 01:24:08.640
Absolutely.

1926
01:24:08.699 --> 01:24:09.600
It's terrific.

1927
01:24:09.659 --> 01:24:12.720
And then he just shoots the gun in the hand, which is pretty

1928
01:24:12.720 --> 01:24:12.960
awesome.

1929
01:24:13.020 --> 01:24:16.020
Things weren't going to get better than that phone and web being

1930
01:24:16.020 --> 01:24:18.119
spun in space. here we are.

1931
01:24:18.180 --> 01:24:19.140
Yeah.

1932
01:24:20.039 --> 01:24:21.960
Oh, glorious.

1933
01:24:22.079 --> 01:24:26.579
And it is like, it's like you said, it's total fan wank, but it is

1934
01:24:26.579 --> 01:24:28.739
sort of tickling all the right areas, isn't it?

1935
01:24:28.800 --> 01:24:30.000
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1936
01:24:30.000 --> 01:24:34.260
You know, you can't be a fan of Star Trek and not love the Folian

1937
01:24:34.260 --> 01:24:36.720
Web and the Gorn being in the same... episode.

1938
01:24:36.779 --> 01:24:37.560
Absolutely.

1939
01:24:37.619 --> 01:24:41.279
If you're universe. you don't, there is something very wrong with

1940
01:24:41.279 --> 01:24:41.460
you.

1941
01:24:41.699 --> 01:24:45.539
Oh, look, they're eating the space plaster scene, look.

1942
01:24:45.600 --> 01:24:46.859
Yeah, yeah.

1943
01:24:48.600 --> 01:24:51.539
That always looks so grim, doesn't it?

1944
01:24:51.600 --> 01:24:53.220
Yeah, doesn't it terrible?

1945
01:24:53.279 --> 01:24:53.939
Blue beers.

1946
01:24:53.939 --> 01:24:54.659
There's some fruit there.

1947
01:24:54.720 --> 01:24:56.819
I think he's got some mango on his plate.

1948
01:24:57.359 --> 01:25:02.640
I love this line where in the mirror universe, Shakespeare is

1949
01:25:02.640 --> 01:25:07.739
really grim and everyone dies. which I think is really great.

1950
01:25:07.800 --> 01:25:10.500
It's equally grim, equally grim.

1951
01:25:10.560 --> 01:25:16.560
And so that does break the idea that that scene, that 1st contact

1952
01:25:16.560 --> 01:25:20.399
is where the divergence happens because he's been reading

1953
01:25:20.399 --> 01:25:25.199
literature from earlier, which is different in the 2 universes.

1954
01:25:25.800 --> 01:25:30.840
Billingsley played this as he learned as she says that they're

1955
01:25:30.840 --> 01:25:31.140
equal.

1956
01:25:31.199 --> 01:25:35.939
He doesn't react, but his eyes move as if to say he's taking it

1957
01:25:35.939 --> 01:25:36.119
in.

1958
01:25:39.180 --> 01:25:40.079
Yes, yeah.

1959
01:25:40.140 --> 01:25:44.220
And he's kind of thinking of along the captain's lines, isn't he?

1960
01:25:44.279 --> 01:25:45.359
Do you know what I mean?

1961
01:25:45.420 --> 01:25:47.939
He saying if I was the captain, I'd restrict knowledge of that

1962
01:25:47.939 --> 01:25:48.720
database.

1963
01:25:48.779 --> 01:25:52.800
As if that's in his interest, which, of course, it isn't, you know

1964
01:25:52.800 --> 01:25:54.060
who's attacking us?

1965
01:25:54.119 --> 01:25:54.899
All Vulcans and stuff.

1966
01:25:54.960 --> 01:25:56.520
Oh, what was I in his head?

1967
01:25:56.579 --> 01:25:57.300
Did you see that?

1968
01:25:57.359 --> 01:25:58.199
Shrapnel in his head.

1969
01:25:58.260 --> 01:25:59.880
An outdoor rim?

1970
01:26:00.060 --> 01:26:01.979
Oh, here he is.

1971
01:26:02.039 --> 01:26:03.960
Captain, what's his fella's name?

1972
01:26:04.020 --> 01:26:10.020
Soval. but the Vulcan Saval, who is the captain.

1973
01:26:10.079 --> 01:26:11.579
Enterprise, isn't he?

1974
01:26:11.640 --> 01:26:14.460
Uh, no.

1975
01:26:14.520 --> 01:26:18.840
So, isn't this, so, I can't remember.

1976
01:26:18.899 --> 01:26:21.840
I think they're blowing the shit out of that ship.

1977
01:26:21.899 --> 01:26:23.340
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1978
01:26:23.399 --> 01:26:24.539
It's really great, isn't it?

1979
01:26:24.600 --> 01:26:26.819
we ever wanted from your enterprise.

1980
01:26:27.300 --> 01:26:33.359
So this is the ISS Avenger is the name of this show.

1981
01:26:33.479 --> 01:26:34.199
Avenger.

1982
01:26:34.260 --> 01:26:34.920
Yeah.

1983
01:26:34.979 --> 01:26:40.560
Notice that Soval, of course, has a goatee because Spock has a

1984
01:26:40.560 --> 01:26:42.359
goatee in Mirror, Mirror.

1985
01:26:42.420 --> 01:26:48.180
So obviously our Vulcan has to have a, has to have a goatee here

1986
01:26:48.180 --> 01:26:48.539
as well.

1987
01:26:48.600 --> 01:26:51.659
You know why I remember that fella, the captain.

1988
01:26:51.720 --> 01:26:53.640
It's not because he's a regular enterprise.

1989
01:26:53.699 --> 01:26:57.060
He's the guy who comes to the station to put Dax on trial in

1990
01:26:57.060 --> 01:26:57.720
series one.

1991
01:26:57.779 --> 01:26:59.159
Oh, really?

1992
01:26:59.220 --> 01:27:02.460
It's his father that he accuses Dax of murdering.

1993
01:27:02.520 --> 01:27:03.060
Yeah.

1994
01:27:03.119 --> 01:27:06.479
And he's one of those actors that just has lots of different roles

1995
01:27:06.479 --> 01:27:07.380
in Star Trek.

1996
01:27:07.439 --> 01:27:08.819
Right, right.

1997
01:27:10.560 --> 01:27:14.340
I want to find the other rebels where I feel like we're in Star

1998
01:27:14.340 --> 01:27:16.079
Wars territory now.

1999
01:27:16.380 --> 01:27:22.739
But there is something, I do think, certainly in, um, through the

2000
01:27:22.739 --> 01:27:26.039
Looking Glass, in DS9 series 3, where they're talking about the

2001
01:27:26.039 --> 01:27:29.760
rebel alliance, that there is something sort of Star Wars-y that

2002
01:27:29.760 --> 01:27:33.960
started to creep into those alternative universe episodes.

2003
01:27:34.020 --> 01:27:35.340
Yeah.

2004
01:27:35.399 --> 01:27:40.380
Yeah, so, so, like, that's what I was kind of wondering about what

2005
01:27:40.380 --> 01:27:45.420
I was asking you about earlier, like kind of off Mike, which is

2006
01:27:45.420 --> 01:27:46.920
that...

2007
01:27:48.600 --> 01:27:51.659
You know, the thing about the Federation, that, like, this is the

2008
01:27:51.659 --> 01:27:54.479
opposite of the Federation, and you, we, we had that scene earlier

2009
01:27:54.479 --> 01:28:00.300
where, um, where Archer scoffs at the idea that it's a federation

2010
01:28:00.300 --> 01:28:05.460
that's multiracial and based upon, um, you know, alliances and

2011
01:28:05.460 --> 01:28:10.739
equality and stuff because the Terran, uh, empire is supremacist

2012
01:28:10.739 --> 01:28:15.420
and it's human supremacist, you know, and it, it's a little bit

2013
01:28:15.420 --> 01:28:18.779
surprising in episode one how many aliens we see on board the

2014
01:28:18.779 --> 01:28:19.199
ship.

2015
01:28:19.319 --> 01:28:22.920
But here he puts the aliens off the ship, remember?

2016
01:28:22.979 --> 01:28:25.979
And there's one good alien as far as he's concerned, and that's

2017
01:28:25.979 --> 01:28:29.279
flocks, and he wants to put everyone else off the ship.

2018
01:28:29.340 --> 01:28:30.000
Yeah.

2019
01:28:30.000 --> 01:28:30.539
Yeah.

2020
01:28:31.319 --> 01:28:35.939
Yeah, Archer looks so much more chill, doesn't he?

2021
01:28:36.000 --> 01:28:40.619
People are saying that he's camp in this, that...

2022
01:28:40.619 --> 01:28:42.539
The dark archer.

2023
01:28:42.600 --> 01:28:44.039
But I don't think he's camp.

2024
01:28:44.100 --> 01:28:45.779
He's not scenery chewing.

2025
01:28:45.840 --> 01:28:48.119
He's just an angry asshole.

2026
01:28:48.180 --> 01:28:49.979
He's an angry loser, you know.

2027
01:28:50.039 --> 01:28:53.220
There was just something about him. just screamed pathetic in

2028
01:28:53.220 --> 01:28:53.939
every scene.

2029
01:28:54.000 --> 01:28:58.439
And I think that's that's quite hard because Scott Bacula. is an

2030
01:28:58.439 --> 01:29:00.359
effortlessly sort of charismatic bloke.

2031
01:29:00.420 --> 01:29:02.819
So he has to work hard to seem pathetic.

2032
01:29:03.420 --> 01:29:07.739
Yeah, and he said that line earlier where we've got these new

2033
01:29:07.739 --> 01:29:11.760
phases from the 22nd century and he and they can completely

2034
01:29:11.760 --> 01:29:13.560
disintegrate someone.

2035
01:29:13.619 --> 01:29:16.859
So he says, I want to try that.

2036
01:29:16.920 --> 01:29:18.420
And so he tries it on the captain.

2037
01:29:18.600 --> 01:29:20.399
You know what it is?

2038
01:29:20.460 --> 01:29:25.680
It's, it's the sort of, um, is, is basically stressing that he's

2039
01:29:25.680 --> 01:29:26.939
got ideas above his station.

2040
01:29:27.000 --> 01:29:28.619
That's the sort of performance he's playing.

2041
01:29:28.680 --> 01:29:33.060
He wants to be this and he's only capable of this, but he's going

2042
01:29:33.060 --> 01:29:33.899
to go for it anyway.

2043
01:29:33.960 --> 01:29:39.479
And so that's why he's so kind of, like, put himself in a position

2044
01:29:39.479 --> 01:29:40.560
of authority here.

2045
01:29:40.619 --> 01:29:44.159
He's walking above the walkway looking down at his entire crew.

2046
01:29:44.220 --> 01:29:45.960
Look at Jolene.

2047
01:29:46.020 --> 01:29:48.899
She's wearing she's wearing the she's wearing a miniskirt.

2048
01:29:49.020 --> 01:29:50.939
Oh, sexy.

2049
01:29:51.000 --> 01:29:54.359
Yeah, I've been a soldier for my life.

2050
01:29:54.420 --> 01:29:55.680
Yeah, yeah, loser.

2051
01:29:55.739 --> 01:29:56.699
You'll always be a soldier.

2052
01:29:56.760 --> 01:29:57.960
You'll never be a commander.

2053
01:29:58.020 --> 01:30:01.979
But, I mean, that's what's so great, is that that's why he's so

2054
01:30:01.979 --> 01:30:05.939
kind of destroyed by seeing Archer's file because the other

2055
01:30:05.939 --> 01:30:06.840
archer.

2056
01:30:06.899 --> 01:30:07.680
It's proper.

2057
01:30:07.739 --> 01:30:08.760
You know what really sells it?

2058
01:30:08.819 --> 01:30:11.039
Is that just for men hair dye he's got on?

2059
01:30:11.159 --> 01:30:15.300
Somebody who's got, yeah, got gray and really put in a terrible

2060
01:30:15.300 --> 01:30:15.960
cup.

2061
01:30:16.020 --> 01:30:17.579
I have to try.

2062
01:30:17.760 --> 01:30:18.960
He can't accept it.

2063
01:30:19.020 --> 01:30:22.260
He bought some supermarket hair tie.

2064
01:30:25.319 --> 01:30:28.260
He doesn't realise that going gray is very sexy.

2065
01:30:29.279 --> 01:30:33.779
Can I just say, um, Anthony Montgomery in the background looking

2066
01:30:33.779 --> 01:30:38.520
at, um, uh, it's actually Montgomery plays.

2067
01:30:38.579 --> 01:30:40.020
Yeah, yeah, Mayweather, yeah.

2068
01:30:40.079 --> 01:30:41.220
Pretty. yeah, yeah, yeah.

2069
01:30:41.279 --> 01:30:45.899
Looking with contempt at Archer, whose bodyguard he is.

2070
01:30:46.079 --> 01:30:47.880
I forgot.

2071
01:30:47.880 --> 01:30:48.420
Yeah, look at her.

2072
01:30:48.479 --> 01:30:48.899
Look at this.

2073
01:30:48.960 --> 01:30:52.020
I thought he had a bigger role in this, actually.

2074
01:30:52.079 --> 01:30:55.199
I think it's just because he's prominent in a few scenes that it

2075
01:30:55.199 --> 01:30:56.699
feels like he's got a big role.

2076
01:30:56.760 --> 01:30:58.260
Yeah, yeah, he doesn't really.

2077
01:30:58.319 --> 01:31:00.779
They just let him be in front of the camera a bit.

2078
01:31:00.840 --> 01:31:02.340
There is one wonderful moment.

2079
01:31:02.399 --> 01:31:04.260
I think it's towards the end of this episode.

2080
01:31:04.319 --> 01:31:07.680
You know, where that thing, that bit of technology that comes out

2081
01:31:07.680 --> 01:31:09.779
of the console on the bridge that you look through.

2082
01:31:09.840 --> 01:31:13.680
Yeah, it gets a big long shot looking through that and I was like

2083
01:31:13.680 --> 01:31:14.399
well, there we go.

2084
01:31:14.460 --> 01:31:15.359
He's doing something.

2085
01:31:15.840 --> 01:31:16.800
Good for him.

2086
01:31:16.859 --> 01:31:18.539
You patronising kit.

2087
01:31:19.560 --> 01:31:21.539
That's all he gets.

2088
01:31:21.659 --> 01:31:23.699
At least he's hanging out with his friends.

2089
01:31:23.699 --> 01:31:25.020
Yeah, that's true.

2090
01:31:25.140 --> 01:31:26.279
That is true.

2091
01:31:26.399 --> 01:31:28.199
Oh, here we go.

2092
01:31:28.260 --> 01:31:28.439
Right.

2093
01:31:28.500 --> 01:31:30.060
She's trying to incite rebellion now.

2094
01:31:30.119 --> 01:31:31.260
Yeah.

2095
01:31:31.319 --> 01:31:35.100
She's really great in this scene, I have to say, she's awesome.

2096
01:31:35.159 --> 01:31:36.779
She's so animated.

2097
01:31:36.840 --> 01:31:41.699
I could just imagine them all getting these scripts and going...

2098
01:31:41.760 --> 01:31:42.600
What's this?

2099
01:31:42.659 --> 01:31:43.680
these characters with life?

2100
01:31:43.739 --> 01:31:44.579
Let's go.

2101
01:31:46.500 --> 01:31:48.840
Oh, yi, yi.

2102
01:31:48.899 --> 01:31:51.060
I quite like her hair too.

2103
01:31:51.119 --> 01:31:51.899
Do you know what I mean?

2104
01:31:51.960 --> 01:31:54.659
I know what sort of blonde girl hair is sort of super boring and

2105
01:31:54.659 --> 01:31:58.800
kind of mid, but I think it's, he's an insane idea.

2106
01:31:58.859 --> 01:32:03.359
Do you think that a series could be sustained in the Mirror

2107
01:32:03.359 --> 01:32:03.899
Universe?

2108
01:32:03.960 --> 01:32:04.619
No.

2109
01:32:04.680 --> 01:32:06.180
Because what would it be about?

2110
01:32:06.300 --> 01:32:07.500
Do you know what I mean?

2111
01:32:07.560 --> 01:32:08.340
Like, what's it about?

2112
01:32:09.539 --> 01:32:12.119
I suppose it would be this, wouldn't it?

2113
01:32:12.180 --> 01:32:16.140
It would be trying to regain our humanity, create a federation in

2114
01:32:16.140 --> 01:32:17.340
this terrible place.

2115
01:32:17.399 --> 01:32:18.840
That's kind of boring, though.

2116
01:32:18.899 --> 01:32:23.399
I think, you know, like, I think that this works because it gives

2117
01:32:23.399 --> 01:32:29.039
our actors fun new things to do, and that's particularly waste

2118
01:32:29.039 --> 01:32:29.579
their excuse.

2119
01:32:29.640 --> 01:32:33.359
If they inadvertently say something thoughtful about Star Trek

2120
01:32:33.359 --> 01:32:37.140
then happy days, but it's actually, let's just let them have a

2121
01:32:37.140 --> 01:32:37.319
laugh.

2122
01:32:37.439 --> 01:32:37.979
Oh, yeah.

2123
01:32:37.979 --> 01:32:42.720
I mean, like, I think I think in discovery is where it has the

2124
01:32:42.720 --> 01:32:44.880
most clear political purpose.

2125
01:32:44.939 --> 01:32:49.380
Mirror, mirror, you know, like mirror, mirror is what if Star Trek

2126
01:32:49.380 --> 01:32:54.180
had been like a cheesy space opera and Star Trek, all the stuff on

2127
01:32:54.180 --> 01:32:58.380
DS9 is, let's put Nana Visitor in some leather and...

2128
01:32:58.380 --> 01:33:00.960
This scene here, which is all in silhouette, right?

2129
01:33:01.020 --> 01:33:06.060
You've got Linda, Linda Park and Scott Bacula, and they eventually

2130
01:33:06.060 --> 01:33:07.619
end up sort of fucking on the bed.

2131
01:33:07.680 --> 01:33:07.920
Yeah.

2132
01:33:08.039 --> 01:33:10.319
It's quite explicit.

2133
01:33:10.380 --> 01:33:13.319
It's sexy in a way this show never is.

2134
01:33:13.380 --> 01:33:16.380
But look at what she's talk- look at what he's talking about.

2135
01:33:16.439 --> 01:33:21.539
He's saying, we're going to put all the aliens off the ship, that

2136
01:33:21.539 --> 01:33:23.939
it's only going to be human beings on the ship.

2137
01:33:24.000 --> 01:33:27.779
Um, and then she says...

2138
01:33:27.840 --> 01:33:29.039
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2139
01:33:29.100 --> 01:33:30.899
But he's a good alien.

2140
01:33:30.960 --> 01:33:33.359
You know, that's the thing supremacist.

2141
01:33:33.359 --> 01:33:33.960
That's the thing.

2142
01:33:34.079 --> 01:33:35.100
Yeah, you know, yeah.

2143
01:33:35.159 --> 01:33:37.979
It's possible to be an acceptable.

2144
01:33:38.039 --> 01:33:39.479
Yeah, I've got nothing against flocks.

2145
01:33:39.539 --> 01:33:41.640
You know, it's possible to a mansion.

2146
01:33:41.760 --> 01:33:44.760
You just can't see what she's doing to him, but, you know, my

2147
01:33:44.760 --> 01:33:45.899
imagination is going crazy.

2148
01:33:46.619 --> 01:33:49.739
Yeah, they've got proper chemistry.

2149
01:33:49.800 --> 01:33:50.819
I'm like Jesus, who knew?

2150
01:33:50.939 --> 01:33:52.319
Yeah, yeah.

2151
01:33:52.380 --> 01:33:57.180
Well, no, we have talked a bit about romance in 90s trek lately.

2152
01:33:57.239 --> 01:33:58.859
This is quite sexy.

2153
01:33:58.979 --> 01:34:00.300
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2154
01:34:00.359 --> 01:34:00.720
Yeah.

2155
01:34:00.899 --> 01:34:03.840
Never been the consort of an emperor before.

2156
01:34:03.899 --> 01:34:06.720
And I don't plan to be the consort of an emperor.

2157
01:34:07.079 --> 01:34:10.020
I think they might actually be fucking right now.

2158
01:34:10.319 --> 01:34:14.279
Like, if you wanted to read that into that scene, then...

2159
01:34:14.279 --> 01:34:18.720
No, this is, they go discreetly out of shot, you know, the fuck.

2160
01:34:18.779 --> 01:34:24.180
I am so on board with Jolene wearing that Starfleet outfit there.

2161
01:34:24.239 --> 01:34:28.380
That's so much more fun and can than that couple things she's been

2162
01:34:28.380 --> 01:34:29.640
wearing.

2163
01:34:29.699 --> 01:34:31.920
Look at those coloured buttons.

2164
01:34:32.039 --> 01:34:34.199
And I love those cars.

2165
01:34:34.199 --> 01:34:37.380
They insert in.

2166
01:34:37.439 --> 01:34:39.539
And the plaster scene food.

2167
01:34:39.600 --> 01:34:41.460
We just want to watch the original series.

2168
01:34:44.880 --> 01:34:48.899
Enterprise, stop reminding us how much better things were back in

2169
01:34:48.899 --> 01:34:49.380
the day.

2170
01:34:49.439 --> 01:34:50.100
That's right.

2171
01:34:50.159 --> 01:34:51.000
That's right.

2172
01:34:51.060 --> 01:34:55.560
Doesn't Travis look so hot in the red uniform, too.

2173
01:34:55.619 --> 01:34:56.640
He just looks great.

2174
01:34:56.699 --> 01:35:00.239
But I'll tell you the difference is, like, you see, you see the

2175
01:35:00.239 --> 01:35:02.340
lighting at the back of the set there with the gridding on the

2176
01:35:02.340 --> 01:35:02.640
wall.

2177
01:35:02.699 --> 01:35:06.420
It's got a depth to it that the original series didn't have, you

2178
01:35:06.420 --> 01:35:06.600
know?

2179
01:35:06.659 --> 01:35:07.560
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2180
01:35:07.619 --> 01:35:09.479
It's like the best of both worlds.

2181
01:35:09.960 --> 01:35:12.960
Yeah, so who's this guy?

2182
01:35:13.260 --> 01:35:16.859
He's demanding unconditional surrender.

2183
01:35:16.920 --> 01:35:18.600
Yeah, I don't know.

2184
01:35:18.659 --> 01:35:21.960
But then it becomes, doesn't it, a battle between the 2 of them

2185
01:35:21.960 --> 01:35:23.039
and I love all of this stuff.

2186
01:35:23.579 --> 01:35:27.960
And then flocks is trying to sabotage one ship and they're trying

2187
01:35:27.960 --> 01:35:31.020
to get the other hand on the other and they're throwing the shit

2188
01:35:31.020 --> 01:35:31.680
out of each other.

2189
01:35:31.739 --> 01:35:32.760
Oh, it's just great.

2190
01:35:33.960 --> 01:35:36.659
And so this is him, isn't it?

2191
01:35:36.720 --> 01:35:39.539
It's him, you know, how far are we?

2192
01:35:39.600 --> 01:35:43.800
We're, you know, 10 minutes from the end and he's very, very close

2193
01:35:43.800 --> 01:35:48.239
to his sort of absolute final victory and he's going to blow the

2194
01:35:48.239 --> 01:35:49.680
shit out of earth and he's there.

2195
01:35:49.739 --> 01:35:51.539
He's saying, I'm going to destroy your cities.

2196
01:35:51.600 --> 01:35:53.760
You know, until you surrender to me.

2197
01:35:53.819 --> 01:35:54.479
It's so great.

2198
01:35:54.539 --> 01:35:57.779
Oh my god, I've got to stop talking about the lion.

2199
01:35:57.840 --> 01:35:59.279
That corridor looks so great.

2200
01:35:59.340 --> 01:36:03.180
I mean, only in a Star Trek podcast, because I probably say that

2201
01:36:03.180 --> 01:36:04.260
corridor looks great.

2202
01:36:04.859 --> 01:36:08.279
So they don't do the colour gels, do they?

2203
01:36:08.340 --> 01:36:12.119
But there's light spilling on the thing, you know, they have light

2204
01:36:12.119 --> 01:36:13.800
spilling on the, here we are.

2205
01:36:13.800 --> 01:36:14.760
So what are you doing here?

2206
01:36:14.819 --> 01:36:15.779
It's really moody.

2207
01:36:15.840 --> 01:36:17.819
Oh, yes, yeah.

2208
01:36:17.880 --> 01:36:20.340
We're going to sabotage the fire.

2209
01:36:20.399 --> 01:36:21.840
Because he trusts flocks.

2210
01:36:21.899 --> 01:36:24.600
He's the only one that could get in there and sabotage without

2211
01:36:24.600 --> 01:36:25.739
arousing suspicion.

2212
01:36:27.180 --> 01:36:27.479
Yeah.

2213
01:36:27.539 --> 01:36:29.939
And Flock's still, he can't quite...

2214
01:36:29.939 --> 01:36:32.819
No, no, break out of his chase, can he?

2215
01:36:32.880 --> 01:36:33.600
Yeah, exactly.

2216
01:36:33.659 --> 01:36:35.460
So what makes him do it?

2217
01:36:35.520 --> 01:36:38.699
Do we have, do we have sort of, it just makes a decision.

2218
01:36:39.239 --> 01:36:46.140
No, doesn't she say that if Archer fails?

2219
01:36:46.199 --> 01:36:52.260
If Archer fails to kill the emperor, then he will be tried. and

2220
01:36:52.260 --> 01:36:53.100
execute.

2221
01:36:53.159 --> 01:36:54.300
We would all be executed.

2222
01:36:54.359 --> 01:36:54.899
Yeah, yeah.

2223
01:36:54.960 --> 01:36:55.319
Yeah.

2224
01:36:55.380 --> 01:36:56.340
And so...

2225
01:36:56.340 --> 01:36:58.619
And what was the other one?

2226
01:36:58.680 --> 01:37:00.000
Oh, yeah, yeah, that's right.

2227
01:37:00.060 --> 01:37:01.979
And he'll get as many wives as he likes.

2228
01:37:02.039 --> 01:37:04.560
He'll get as many women as he likes if he saves the emperor's

2229
01:37:04.560 --> 01:37:04.800
life.

2230
01:37:04.859 --> 01:37:07.859
He'll be able to ask the emperor.

2231
01:37:07.859 --> 01:37:08.880
The facility of your own.

2232
01:37:08.880 --> 01:37:09.659
No, no.

2233
01:37:09.659 --> 01:37:12.239
Conduct experiments as you see fit.

2234
01:37:12.300 --> 01:37:15.300
You can carve up as many animals as you like.

2235
01:37:15.420 --> 01:37:17.640
And plus, lots of females.

2236
01:37:17.699 --> 01:37:19.020
And that's what he reacts to.

2237
01:37:19.079 --> 01:37:20.699
Look, even his tongue comes out.

2238
01:37:20.760 --> 01:37:23.760
Females, you can have as many concubines as you like. and we know

2239
01:37:23.760 --> 01:37:28.500
that he's Polly, so he's like, oh, well, in that case.

2240
01:37:28.560 --> 01:37:31.680
Torturing animals and women, you say.

2241
01:37:31.739 --> 01:37:32.939
Oh, yes.

2242
01:37:33.000 --> 01:37:38.880
Well, because our flocks is just lovely, and I have no doubt that

2243
01:37:38.880 --> 01:37:42.000
he has no difficulty attracting people.

2244
01:37:42.060 --> 01:37:44.340
Swinger uncle, isn't he?

2245
01:37:44.579 --> 01:37:47.699
Look at her swinging her hips there.

2246
01:37:47.760 --> 01:37:49.439
Oh, the guns are out now.

2247
01:37:49.439 --> 01:37:50.279
Confident as anything.

2248
01:37:50.340 --> 01:37:53.640
My God, can I just say this fight in a minute between Tapal and

2249
01:37:53.640 --> 01:37:56.699
good grief, what's her name?

2250
01:37:56.760 --> 01:37:57.600
Hoshi.

2251
01:37:57.659 --> 01:37:58.439
Hoshi?

2252
01:37:58.500 --> 01:37:59.939
It's so great.

2253
01:38:00.000 --> 01:38:00.960
It's vicious.

2254
01:38:01.020 --> 01:38:04.319
I love watching 2 women going at it like that.

2255
01:38:05.279 --> 01:38:09.960
Look at this. punches him in her face, grabs the gun.

2256
01:38:10.020 --> 01:38:11.159
Yep, yep.

2257
01:38:11.220 --> 01:38:15.000
She's got the knife out. green blood smear across her face.

2258
01:38:15.060 --> 01:38:16.739
Yeah, that's pretty good too.

2259
01:38:16.800 --> 01:38:19.680
And now look. look how excited she is.

2260
01:38:19.739 --> 01:38:21.539
Holy shit.

2261
01:38:21.539 --> 01:38:22.800
The park is so good.

2262
01:38:22.920 --> 01:38:24.420
They're in their teeth, aren't they?

2263
01:38:24.539 --> 01:38:26.880
Yeah, when they're up against the wall.

2264
01:38:26.939 --> 01:38:30.119
These carriages are so fucking boring normally.

2265
01:38:30.180 --> 01:38:30.779
What's going?

2266
01:38:31.079 --> 01:38:33.000
Yeah, that's right.

2267
01:38:33.060 --> 01:38:38.220
That's right So she's, she says something cruel to Hoshi about how

2268
01:38:38.220 --> 01:38:43.380
she's hopping from bed to bed and then, and then Hoshi says, yeah

2269
01:38:43.380 --> 01:38:46.859
um, Tucker told me that I should give you some tips because you're

2270
01:38:46.859 --> 01:38:49.260
really shitting bed, which I thought was okay.

2271
01:38:49.439 --> 01:38:52.920
That something did stand out for me in that scene, no.

2272
01:38:52.979 --> 01:38:55.800
And that is it's only in the alternative universe that they could

2273
01:38:55.800 --> 01:38:57.420
possibly have dialogue like that, right?

2274
01:38:57.659 --> 01:39:01.380
this show in this very boring show.

2275
01:39:01.560 --> 01:39:07.079
Whereas, come to us 9 series 7, Wharf was calling Ezra, Dax are

2276
01:39:07.079 --> 01:39:08.220
slut in every other episode.

2277
01:39:09.479 --> 01:39:12.180
Say, look at Ryan's a bag.

2278
01:39:12.239 --> 01:39:16.560
Like Enterprise brings Orion's back to Star Trek, which was a

2279
01:39:16.560 --> 01:39:17.819
thing that we should always have had.

2280
01:39:18.180 --> 01:39:21.899
There was a shot of the manacles there, but I think it was just an

2281
01:39:21.899 --> 01:39:23.399
excuse to get another shot.

2282
01:39:24.119 --> 01:39:24.720
Another.

2283
01:39:24.779 --> 01:39:25.439
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2284
01:39:25.500 --> 01:39:25.979
Yeah.

2285
01:39:26.159 --> 01:39:30.600
They're not quite out of that exploiting the ladies phase.

2286
01:39:30.600 --> 01:39:31.560
No, no.

2287
01:39:31.619 --> 01:39:33.359
They never break out of it.

2288
01:39:33.420 --> 01:39:34.680
No, no.

2289
01:39:34.739 --> 01:39:38.460
And they don't do it when the Mirror Universe comes back in

2290
01:39:38.460 --> 01:39:39.600
Discovery Series one.

2291
01:39:39.659 --> 01:39:41.159
No.

2292
01:39:41.220 --> 01:39:44.699
I mean, Emperor Giorgio's head to toe in chiffon, for goodness

2293
01:39:44.699 --> 01:39:45.180
sakes.

2294
01:39:45.239 --> 01:39:47.100
Yeah, yeah, yeah, looking fabulous.

2295
01:39:47.159 --> 01:39:48.479
Like, looking incredible.

2296
01:39:48.539 --> 01:39:49.920
Kicking people in the head.

2297
01:39:49.979 --> 01:39:51.060
You know what I mean?

2298
01:39:51.119 --> 01:39:54.840
I saw someone sword in one hand, a gun in the other. and she's got

2299
01:39:54.840 --> 01:39:55.619
more frills.

2300
01:39:55.979 --> 01:39:58.500
She's got an opera singer.

2301
01:39:58.560 --> 01:39:59.939
She looks fabulous.

2302
01:40:00.720 --> 01:40:02.460
Oh, dear.

2303
01:40:04.020 --> 01:40:07.319
Oh, yeah, this doesn't traumic module, is it?

2304
01:40:07.319 --> 01:40:11.579
So Geotronic, like there are Duotronic computers in original Star

2305
01:40:11.579 --> 01:40:12.060
Trek.

2306
01:40:12.119 --> 01:40:14.520
I think that's an original Star Trek reference.

2307
01:40:14.579 --> 01:40:19.020
And so he removes the power, doesn't he?

2308
01:40:19.079 --> 01:40:22.859
Like, he disengages the power, but then it doesn't work.

2309
01:40:22.920 --> 01:40:24.180
Trip comes and puts it all back.

2310
01:40:24.300 --> 01:40:25.619
Oh, I'm so sad.

2311
01:40:25.680 --> 01:40:26.760
There's only 6 minutes left.

2312
01:40:26.819 --> 01:40:28.020
Yeah, yeah.

2313
01:40:28.020 --> 01:40:29.460
And it's all going down at the moment.

2314
01:40:32.159 --> 01:40:35.579
This is like this battle in a minute, this space.

2315
01:40:35.640 --> 01:40:37.199
Oh look at Mayweather.

2316
01:40:37.260 --> 01:40:39.960
He's bulging out costume, isn't he?

2317
01:40:40.020 --> 01:40:40.920
he really is.

2318
01:40:40.979 --> 01:40:42.420
It's really working for him.

2319
01:40:42.479 --> 01:40:44.640
Oh, God, Trenier looks somewhat less attractive.

2320
01:40:44.699 --> 01:40:48.000
Yeah, we are getting his best side there.

2321
01:40:48.060 --> 01:40:48.720
Oh no, there we go.

2322
01:40:50.939 --> 01:40:53.819
Yeah, it is a pike thing, isn't it?

2323
01:40:53.880 --> 01:40:56.699
It's a very definite reference to Pike.

2324
01:40:57.180 --> 01:41:01.500
Come on, start the, oh, take a team aboard the Avenger. provide

2325
01:41:01.500 --> 01:41:02.579
every alien on that ship.

2326
01:41:02.640 --> 01:41:03.119
There we go.

2327
01:41:03.180 --> 01:41:04.619
Yep, yep.

2328
01:41:04.680 --> 01:41:05.520
Yeah.

2329
01:41:05.579 --> 01:41:06.899
So something's gonna happen.

2330
01:41:06.960 --> 01:41:11.460
And um, Hoshi is determined to have Tapole killed now for having

2331
01:41:11.460 --> 01:41:14.279
the nerve of uh, does she get murdered?

2332
01:41:14.340 --> 01:41:15.060
fighting her.

2333
01:41:15.180 --> 01:41:18.180
No, we don't see it, do we?

2334
01:41:18.239 --> 01:41:21.119
We can assume that's the case though after the last scene.

2335
01:41:21.899 --> 01:41:23.939
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2336
01:41:24.000 --> 01:41:28.920
But like you said, if they imagined a series 5 and they wanted to

2337
01:41:28.920 --> 01:41:31.380
do a sequel, they can't have her killed on camera.

2338
01:41:34.439 --> 01:41:36.359
There we go. shit versus shit.

2339
01:41:36.420 --> 01:41:40.199
Like they, they have, they have poured a lot of money into this 2

2340
01:41:40.199 --> 01:41:41.100
part, haven't they?

2341
01:41:41.159 --> 01:41:45.720
We've had, you know, hand-hand fights, CGI monsters, a ton of

2342
01:41:45.720 --> 01:41:48.300
makeup, lots of different aliens, new sets.

2343
01:41:48.420 --> 01:41:49.680
Yeah, yeah.

2344
01:41:49.680 --> 01:41:51.659
They've really gone to town.

2345
01:41:52.319 --> 01:41:54.000
Good on them.

2346
01:41:54.060 --> 01:41:56.100
Good on them for doing that in this bit of fluff.

2347
01:41:56.159 --> 01:41:57.000
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2348
01:41:57.060 --> 01:41:58.439
Well, at the end, at the end.

2349
01:41:58.500 --> 01:41:59.039
Why not?

2350
01:41:59.100 --> 01:41:59.939
Let's go crazy.

2351
01:42:00.000 --> 01:42:03.420
But what I really just thought was like, let's do lots of Star

2352
01:42:03.420 --> 01:42:05.460
Trek shit, this is our last chance.

2353
01:42:05.520 --> 01:42:08.460
So let's make it a Star Trek as we possibly can.

2354
01:42:08.520 --> 01:42:09.720
You know what, right?

2355
01:42:09.779 --> 01:42:11.760
They're literally blowing the shit out of these sets now.

2356
01:42:11.819 --> 01:42:14.100
Every time it happens, your face lights up.

2357
01:42:14.159 --> 01:42:17.279
I didn't think you could look at any more beautiful than you

2358
01:42:17.279 --> 01:42:20.520
usually do. every time there's an explosion, here we are.

2359
01:42:20.939 --> 01:42:24.239
Yes, there, there, Connor's putting them all back.

2360
01:42:24.300 --> 01:42:28.079
Lots of exciting thing trying to shove rubber tubes into...

2361
01:42:28.079 --> 01:42:30.420
They're fluorescent, they're fluorescent lights.

2362
01:42:30.479 --> 01:42:32.220
He's putting fluorescent lights back in.

2363
01:42:32.579 --> 01:42:34.500
Shit versus shit.

2364
01:42:34.560 --> 01:42:36.420
And do you know what was really exciting about this battle?

2365
01:42:36.479 --> 01:42:38.579
Because this is the alternative universe?

2366
01:42:38.640 --> 01:42:40.079
Because all bets are off.

2367
01:42:40.140 --> 01:42:41.159
Anything could happen.

2368
01:42:41.220 --> 01:42:42.300
I didn't know.

2369
01:42:42.300 --> 01:42:45.479
Enterprises already been destroyed. always know Enterprise is

2370
01:42:45.479 --> 01:42:46.260
going to win, don't you?

2371
01:42:46.319 --> 01:42:47.640
Whereas in this, I didn't have a clue.

2372
01:42:47.699 --> 01:42:50.520
So I was like, okay, so is this going to be, are they going to

2373
01:42:50.520 --> 01:42:53.100
kill off all of the alternative regulars?

2374
01:42:53.159 --> 01:42:55.920
No, but we are going to kill Sauval though.

2375
01:42:55.979 --> 01:42:57.600
Oh, look, it's great.

2376
01:42:57.659 --> 01:43:01.079
We're blasting the hell out of those enterprise sets again.

2377
01:43:01.140 --> 01:43:04.020
Again, yeah, we blow up the Enterprise twice.

2378
01:43:04.079 --> 01:43:07.260
I genuinely think they did wait till the end of the season to

2379
01:43:07.260 --> 01:43:07.979
shoot this, you know.

2380
01:43:08.039 --> 01:43:09.359
Well, we don't need these sets anymore.

2381
01:43:09.420 --> 01:43:10.380
Go to town.

2382
01:43:10.800 --> 01:43:14.399
Oh my god. saw some rocks on the floor.

2383
01:43:14.460 --> 01:43:16.859
There are rocks on the floor.

2384
01:43:16.920 --> 01:43:17.460
Absolutely.

2385
01:43:17.699 --> 01:43:19.260
There we go.

2386
01:43:19.319 --> 01:43:21.600
Oh, that blows up getting prop up.

2387
01:43:21.659 --> 01:43:25.619
And then in exactly the same time, Archer has an extreme orgasm.

2388
01:43:25.680 --> 01:43:26.819
Did you notice them?

2389
01:43:26.880 --> 01:43:27.239
right.

2390
01:43:27.300 --> 01:43:29.819
They can only really do it in metaphor win.

2391
01:43:29.880 --> 01:43:31.020
No, he's trekk.

2392
01:43:31.079 --> 01:43:31.439
Yes.

2393
01:43:31.500 --> 01:43:32.579
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2394
01:43:32.640 --> 01:43:34.920
Not a very subtle metaphor, but there you go.

2395
01:43:34.979 --> 01:43:36.180
He really is quite sweaty.

2396
01:43:36.239 --> 01:43:37.680
They both are.

2397
01:43:37.739 --> 01:43:43.680
And Hoshi has been pouring drinks quite a bit throughout this two

2398
01:43:42.960 --> 01:43:43.680
parter.

2399
01:43:43.680 --> 01:43:45.420
Yeah.

2400
01:43:45.479 --> 01:43:50.039
So how do you see him a bubbly now is not unusual.

2401
01:43:50.159 --> 01:43:54.119
Actually, the bit that I think is really funny that made me twig

2402
01:43:54.119 --> 01:43:59.460
that was poison is her reaction when he pours it on himself and

2403
01:43:59.460 --> 01:44:03.359
it's almost like you watch what she does because he pours the wine

2404
01:44:03.359 --> 01:44:04.199
on his face.

2405
01:44:04.260 --> 01:44:05.640
Like he drinks some of the wine.

2406
01:44:05.699 --> 01:44:11.159
She's, then he pours it on himself and she reacts as if it's like

2407
01:44:11.159 --> 01:44:13.199
oh, I hope none of her got on me, you know?

2408
01:44:13.680 --> 01:44:17.579
But that's like the last pathetic act he did, just literally

2409
01:44:17.579 --> 01:44:19.380
pouring it all over his body.

2410
01:44:19.439 --> 01:44:21.060
Yeah, yeah, yeah. there he goes.

2411
01:44:21.119 --> 01:44:22.260
What a twat.

2412
01:44:22.319 --> 01:44:23.699
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2413
01:44:23.760 --> 01:44:24.899
Yeah.

2414
01:44:24.960 --> 01:44:25.800
Look, yeah.

2415
01:44:28.260 --> 01:44:30.060
I love it, love.

2416
01:44:30.119 --> 01:44:31.800
Because he's going to be dead.

2417
01:44:31.859 --> 01:44:33.840
She still has a little sip.

2418
01:44:33.960 --> 01:44:34.680
She's so cool.

2419
01:44:34.739 --> 01:44:37.199
She's like, I'm going to drink some of this champagne, you know?

2420
01:44:38.220 --> 01:44:41.520
And then hot Mayweather walks in in a second.

2421
01:44:41.579 --> 01:44:42.539
Yeah.

2422
01:44:42.600 --> 01:44:43.680
There he goes.

2423
01:44:44.159 --> 01:44:49.079
Before he dies, she lets him see her kissing Mayweather.

2424
01:44:49.140 --> 01:44:49.739
Yeah.

2425
01:44:49.739 --> 01:44:54.899
You're pathetic, and look at this hunk I've got.

2426
01:44:54.960 --> 01:44:56.399
Here's my hot boyfriend.

2427
01:44:57.060 --> 01:45:01.500
I don't I don't think your chances are very high on survival

2428
01:45:01.500 --> 01:45:02.640
frankly, if you're gonna...

2429
01:45:02.640 --> 01:45:03.600
I don't know.

2430
01:45:03.659 --> 01:45:05.340
Remember, she's at the top now.

2431
01:45:05.399 --> 01:45:07.979
She doesn't have to knife her way any further up and he is

2432
01:45:07.979 --> 01:45:08.520
pretty.

2433
01:45:08.579 --> 01:45:10.979
I mean, I think if I was emperor.

2434
01:45:11.039 --> 01:45:12.300
I would keep him around.

2435
01:45:12.420 --> 01:45:17.039
Love this last scene where she walks in and says on the emperor.

2436
01:45:17.159 --> 01:45:19.439
Emperor Sato.

2437
01:45:19.500 --> 01:45:21.659
It's such a girl.

2438
01:45:21.720 --> 01:45:22.979
Look at this.

2439
01:45:23.340 --> 01:45:25.859
No wonder she loved this episode.

2440
01:45:25.920 --> 01:45:27.300
Yeah, yeah.

2441
01:45:27.359 --> 01:45:31.500
Well, she's having fun and she's so, she gets me attractive.

2442
01:45:31.560 --> 01:45:33.539
Look at the sexy makeup she has.

2443
01:45:33.600 --> 01:45:34.800
So good.

2444
01:45:35.279 --> 01:45:37.920
That's it. end it there.

2445
01:45:37.979 --> 01:45:40.079
We don't ever need to go back here.

2446
01:45:40.140 --> 01:45:41.399
What a great place to end.

2447
01:45:41.460 --> 01:45:46.560
Prepare to receive instructions and then a little smile and then

2448
01:45:46.560 --> 01:45:46.979
we're out.

2449
01:45:47.100 --> 01:45:50.159
I just don't think anything good's going to happen with her being

2450
01:45:50.159 --> 01:45:52.439
in charge, but boy, 0 boy, what an idea.

2451
01:45:52.739 --> 01:45:53.880
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2452
01:45:53.939 --> 01:45:54.899
That was pretty great.

2453
01:45:54.960 --> 01:45:59.220
And it is nice to know that her descendant, the fabulous Empress

2454
01:45:59.220 --> 01:45:59.760
George.

2455
01:45:59.819 --> 01:46:03.779
Not her descendant, but her successor, let's say.

2456
01:46:03.840 --> 01:46:10.619
And so has the kind of triumphal name that Hoshi adopts when

2457
01:46:10.619 --> 01:46:11.640
she...

2458
01:46:11.699 --> 01:46:15.359
You know, one day Emperor Sato is going to wear costumes as

2459
01:46:15.359 --> 01:46:17.340
fabulous as Giorgio.

2460
01:46:17.399 --> 01:46:23.279
I'm sure she does. in a palace full of scantily dressed men with a

2461
01:46:23.279 --> 01:46:24.300
huge whip, you know?

2462
01:46:24.359 --> 01:46:26.039
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2463
01:46:26.100 --> 01:46:28.859
Sorry, I've got back into my fantasy land again.

2464
01:46:29.939 --> 01:46:33.359
I just want to be empress of the alternative universe.

2465
01:46:33.359 --> 01:46:37.140
That was great.

2466
01:46:37.199 --> 01:46:39.239
I have really enjoyed that.

2467
01:46:39.300 --> 01:46:41.939
Like, like, like you said, you could pull up the threads of that

2468
01:46:41.939 --> 01:46:45.119
and they're also really much to it.

2469
01:46:45.119 --> 01:46:49.260
And even like the subplot of them, you know, forming a rebellion

2470
01:46:49.260 --> 01:46:50.520
is half-assed.

2471
01:46:50.579 --> 01:46:52.439
And doesn't go anywhere.

2472
01:46:52.500 --> 01:46:53.880
They lose, but that's okay.

2473
01:46:53.939 --> 01:46:57.119
Like that's, you know, the mirror universe, you know, they're

2474
01:46:57.119 --> 01:46:57.960
never going to win.

2475
01:46:58.020 --> 01:47:01.859
It does inspire a rebellion, but this is the mirror universe and

2476
01:47:01.859 --> 01:47:04.380
we know what the mirror universe is like in the future.

2477
01:47:04.439 --> 01:47:04.920
It terrible.

2478
01:47:04.979 --> 01:47:06.300
They're not going to fix anything.

2479
01:47:06.359 --> 01:47:11.039
But, like, it's so rare for me to watch Enterprise, I just have a

2480
01:47:11.039 --> 01:47:12.239
big smile on my face.

2481
01:47:12.300 --> 01:47:15.180
Yeah, yeah, yeah. and just have a blast with it and just, you know

2482
01:47:15.180 --> 01:47:18.779
just for once, I'll push any sort of criticisms I've got to one

2483
01:47:18.779 --> 01:47:21.180
side, that deserves its place.

2484
01:47:21.239 --> 01:47:24.899
Maybe not on the all of the, you know, best Star Trek episodes

2485
01:47:24.899 --> 01:47:25.319
ever.

2486
01:47:25.380 --> 01:47:28.680
That might be grading on the curve a little bit, I think.

2487
01:47:29.760 --> 01:47:33.539
In your terms, they definitely have a ceiling and they don't ever

2488
01:47:33.539 --> 01:47:35.220
really bumper above that.

2489
01:47:35.279 --> 01:47:37.199
But on the enterprise scale.

2490
01:47:37.260 --> 01:47:39.840
Yeah, that is way up there.

2491
01:47:39.899 --> 01:47:44.460
I don't think there's anything wrong with aspiring to be fun and

2492
01:47:44.460 --> 01:47:45.180
entertaining.

2493
01:47:45.239 --> 01:47:46.619
Do you know what I mean?

2494
01:47:46.680 --> 01:47:49.199
Like, so often enterprise doesn't manage that?

2495
01:47:49.260 --> 01:47:52.680
And sometimes all kind of TV shows fail at that and no one's ever

2496
01:47:52.680 --> 01:47:54.300
intending not to be that.

2497
01:47:54.359 --> 01:47:57.420
But this is just solidly entertaining.

2498
01:47:57.479 --> 01:48:01.500
There's explosions and fights and and battles and people get to

2499
01:48:01.500 --> 01:48:04.260
camp it up and, you know, fun things happen.

2500
01:48:04.319 --> 01:48:05.579
Like I just thought it was really good.

2501
01:48:05.640 --> 01:48:09.659
In terms of alternative universe episodes, and there's a lot of

2502
01:48:09.659 --> 01:48:13.199
them now, you know, there's like, there's a half season of them in

2503
01:48:13.199 --> 01:48:14.460
90s strict terms.

2504
01:48:14.520 --> 01:48:20.640
I'd say I would probably put Mirror, Mirror, and Crossover, the

2505
01:48:20.640 --> 01:48:22.739
1st DS91, like top tier.

2506
01:48:22.859 --> 01:48:25.260
I think they're both astonishing.

2507
01:48:25.319 --> 01:48:28.680
But this might be sort of my 2nd one.

2508
01:48:28.739 --> 01:48:32.579
And then and then I do think some of the discovery stuff is good.

2509
01:48:32.640 --> 01:48:34.319
But there's so much of it.

2510
01:48:34.380 --> 01:48:36.600
Like there's 4 or 5 episodes of it, isn't there?

2511
01:48:36.659 --> 01:48:39.539
And so it's sort of hard to grapple.

2512
01:48:40.020 --> 01:48:42.779
There's moments where it's not so great and there's moments where

2513
01:48:42.779 --> 01:48:43.380
it's brilliant.

2514
01:48:43.439 --> 01:48:46.560
I think, you know, it ends tremendously well.

2515
01:48:46.560 --> 01:48:48.119
The beginning of it is really great.

2516
01:48:48.180 --> 01:48:53.819
You know, there's a fight sequence between Jorjo and what's the

2517
01:48:53.819 --> 01:48:54.420
fella's name?

2518
01:48:54.479 --> 01:48:56.520
Lorkar. which is amazing.

2519
01:48:56.579 --> 01:49:01.800
You know, like the scene where Ash sees Volk, you know, like the

2520
01:49:01.800 --> 01:49:06.899
Klingon version of himself, all of that sort of stuff happens in

2521
01:49:06.899 --> 01:49:07.619
the mirror universe.

2522
01:49:07.680 --> 01:49:10.260
Like, I think it's a really fun sequence, but it's not a story.

2523
01:49:10.319 --> 01:49:14.460
It's 5 episodes in the Mirror Universe, which is a strange thing

2524
01:49:14.460 --> 01:49:16.979
to do, but I'm glad that they attempted it.

2525
01:49:17.039 --> 01:49:19.260
And it does fit into the themes of the show.

2526
01:49:19.319 --> 01:49:24.060
So, you know, it's doing something quite different using Star Trek

2527
01:49:24.060 --> 01:49:27.720
stuff and repurposing it for something different.

2528
01:49:27.779 --> 01:49:30.300
And I think that's a good thing to do.

2529
01:49:30.359 --> 01:49:36.239
But what I do love is how much it draws from this 2 part story

2530
01:49:36.359 --> 01:49:37.380
terrific.

2531
01:49:37.439 --> 01:49:40.920
What I love about this two-part story is how much it's willing to

2532
01:49:40.920 --> 01:49:42.300
draw from TOS.

2533
01:49:42.359 --> 01:49:45.720
Some of the most memorable TOS as well.

2534
01:49:45.779 --> 01:49:48.180
Yeah, and do it pretty well.

2535
01:49:48.239 --> 01:49:53.640
Um, sort of my ultimate accolade for this two-parter is, and I

2536
01:49:53.640 --> 01:49:57.180
will very, very rarely make this comparison.

2537
01:49:57.239 --> 01:50:01.020
It takes hold of something, the alternative universe, that DS9

2538
01:50:01.020 --> 01:50:06.180
basically pissed all over and spoiled by overexposure, and

2539
01:50:06.180 --> 01:50:09.899
actually pulled it back into something that's really worth

2540
01:50:09.899 --> 01:50:10.260
watching.

2541
01:50:10.319 --> 01:50:16.739
So Bravo, Manikoto, Bravo Enterprise, you went out on a bit of a

2542
01:50:16.739 --> 01:50:16.920
high.

2543
01:50:16.979 --> 01:50:17.399
Yeah.

2544
01:50:24.000 --> 01:50:27.899
All right, it's the end of the episode and it's time for us to

2545
01:50:27.899 --> 01:50:29.579
find out where we're going next.

2546
01:50:29.699 --> 01:50:33.000
A rare success for you this time, I thought.

2547
01:50:33.060 --> 01:50:37.859
Yes, it doesn't happen very often, but I feel like I'm vindicated

2548
01:50:37.859 --> 01:50:39.479
in my choice last time.

2549
01:50:39.539 --> 01:50:41.340
So good for me.

2550
01:50:41.399 --> 01:50:43.619
How are you going to ruin it all for us?

2551
01:50:43.920 --> 01:50:50.579
Well, I've chosen one series from sort of each iteration of Star

2552
01:50:50.579 --> 01:50:51.119
Trek.

2553
01:50:51.180 --> 01:50:52.739
Just totally randomly.

2554
01:50:52.800 --> 01:50:53.039
Okay.

2555
01:50:53.100 --> 01:50:54.960
The animated series?

2556
01:50:55.079 --> 01:50:57.539
No, I have actually put in the original series.

2557
01:50:57.960 --> 01:50:59.340
Okay.

2558
01:50:59.340 --> 01:51:05.279
I've put in DS9 from 90s track. and Discovery from Kosman's

2559
01:51:05.279 --> 01:51:05.579
track.

2560
01:51:05.640 --> 01:51:05.880
Okay?

2561
01:51:05.939 --> 01:51:06.600
Okay.

2562
01:51:06.659 --> 01:51:08.520
We're going to bat about all over the place now.

2563
01:51:08.640 --> 01:51:09.539
Okay.

2564
01:51:09.600 --> 01:51:15.359
Your random Star Trek discovery episode is season four, episode

2565
01:51:15.359 --> 01:51:16.199
four.

2566
01:51:16.260 --> 01:51:18.000
All is possible.

2567
01:51:19.140 --> 01:51:25.920
So this episode is, I think, the inspiration or possibly a kind of

2568
01:51:25.920 --> 01:51:29.340
weird backdoor pilot for Starfleet Academy.

2569
01:51:29.399 --> 01:51:31.859
So we've talked about it before on here.

2570
01:51:31.920 --> 01:51:40.020
It's the episode where Tilly takes a shuttle full of cadets and it

2571
01:51:40.020 --> 01:51:43.800
crash lands on an ice planet and they have to deal with a monster

2572
01:51:43.800 --> 01:51:47.159
and stuff and they learn a valuable lesson about themselves and

2573
01:51:47.159 --> 01:51:48.659
you know, the usual thing.

2574
01:51:48.720 --> 01:51:52.979
So it is a sort of, it's a Star Trek standard, I think, like

2575
01:51:52.979 --> 01:51:57.840
learning curve or something, but not crap, you know, done well.

2576
01:51:57.899 --> 01:52:00.539
It could be worse than learning curves.

2577
01:52:00.600 --> 01:52:01.560
No that's right.

2578
01:52:01.619 --> 01:52:05.939
But it's Tilly and Adira in one of those beautiful future shuttles

2579
01:52:05.939 --> 01:52:10.859
landing on a planet with a fabulous, convincing monster and kids

2580
01:52:10.859 --> 01:52:15.659
that have kind of political issues with each other and stuff and

2581
01:52:15.659 --> 01:52:18.000
who learn something about one another.

2582
01:52:18.060 --> 01:52:22.380
So a very standard, very Star Treky thing done well, you know

2583
01:52:22.380 --> 01:52:25.560
unfortunately, I have already pressed the button again, although

2584
01:52:25.560 --> 01:52:28.920
that was thinking...

2585
01:52:28.979 --> 01:52:29.819
Not really.

2586
01:52:29.880 --> 01:52:32.760
Well, I mean, I'm not sure I want this one either, but I'll see

2587
01:52:32.760 --> 01:52:33.359
what you think.

2588
01:52:33.420 --> 01:52:37.079
Your random Star Trek D Space 9 episode is season five.

2589
01:52:37.140 --> 01:52:39.539
So that's usually a good bit for me.

2590
01:52:39.600 --> 01:52:44.220
Episode 24 Empoc nor.

2591
01:52:44.939 --> 01:52:51.359
Oh, this is like the sex cult and the great tradition of reusing

2592
01:52:51.359 --> 01:52:53.819
our sets to be something else.

2593
01:52:53.880 --> 01:52:55.380
See, also the defiant.

2594
01:52:55.380 --> 01:52:59.399
You're thinking of the confident from episode series 7.

2595
01:52:59.460 --> 01:53:05.039
This is the one where O'Brien needs some technobabble technology.

2596
01:53:05.039 --> 01:53:09.000
So we go to Empoc Nor, because covenant's on Empoc Nor, but it's

2597
01:53:09.000 --> 01:53:10.319
not the episode Empoc Nor, right?

2598
01:53:10.380 --> 01:53:13.560
We take Garak with ours because there's bound to be Cardassian

2599
01:53:13.560 --> 01:53:14.340
booby traps.

2600
01:53:14.399 --> 01:53:15.720
Okay.

2601
01:53:15.720 --> 01:53:19.619
And it turns out it's an experimentational facility to create

2602
01:53:19.619 --> 01:53:24.779
Cardassian psychopaths and Garak gets infected with the thing.

2603
01:53:24.779 --> 01:53:28.560
And stars get...

2604
01:53:28.619 --> 01:53:32.220
And Andrew Robinson gets to do what he does in every other thing.

2605
01:53:32.279 --> 01:53:33.479
Let's kill a load of people.

2606
01:53:33.539 --> 01:53:34.319
Wow.

2607
01:53:34.380 --> 01:53:37.619
And there's a ton of sort of red shirts there that die in various

2608
01:53:37.619 --> 01:53:38.640
spectacular ways.

2609
01:53:38.699 --> 01:53:42.960
It's very well directed, but it's like, it's just like a, it's

2610
01:53:42.960 --> 01:53:43.619
like a horror movie.

2611
01:53:43.800 --> 01:53:45.000
Right, okay.

2612
01:53:45.060 --> 01:53:45.840
What do you think?

2613
01:53:45.899 --> 01:53:47.579
I don't mind.

2614
01:53:47.640 --> 01:53:48.840
I'd be I'd be up for it.

2615
01:53:48.960 --> 01:53:52.619
I think it's probably sort of mid as well, and we haven't done a

2616
01:53:52.619 --> 01:53:53.399
lot mid, have we?

2617
01:53:53.460 --> 01:53:54.600
We haven't done any mid ones.

2618
01:53:54.659 --> 01:53:58.920
Maybe it's a work of challenges. one great jump scare in it that I

2619
01:53:58.920 --> 01:53:59.399
remember.

2620
01:53:59.460 --> 01:54:00.600
I'll screw it.

2621
01:54:00.659 --> 01:54:01.140
Let's do it.

2622
01:54:02.880 --> 01:54:05.640
And plus we'll get to see those fabulous sets with just the light

2623
01:54:05.640 --> 01:54:06.779
down a little bit more.

2624
01:54:06.840 --> 01:54:09.300
Lie down, camera on a bit of an angle.

2625
01:54:09.359 --> 01:54:10.920
I'm thinking, perhaps.

2626
01:54:10.979 --> 01:54:15.000
I think the station's on an angle, just a differentiator from our

2627
01:54:15.000 --> 01:54:16.140
usual station.

2628
01:54:16.199 --> 01:54:17.939
I mean, it's like Brian.

2629
01:54:18.000 --> 01:54:19.859
Oh, and knock goes as well.

2630
01:54:19.920 --> 01:54:22.859
And terrible things happen to porn.

2631
01:54:22.979 --> 01:54:24.420
Oh, yes.

2632
01:54:24.479 --> 01:54:26.760
You remember when we watched Rox and Shoals and he wouldn't go

2633
01:54:26.760 --> 01:54:27.720
behind Garak?

2634
01:54:27.720 --> 01:54:30.539
That's right. he'd been torturing him.

2635
01:54:30.600 --> 01:54:31.260
Okay.

2636
01:54:31.319 --> 01:54:34.619
Well, let's go watch a load of Starfleet cadets getting murdered

2637
01:54:34.619 --> 01:54:35.100
horribly.

2638
01:54:35.159 --> 01:54:36.180
Okay.

2639
01:54:36.239 --> 01:54:38.699
Not learning available lesson about themselves.

2640
01:54:38.760 --> 01:54:39.239
Anything at all.

2641
01:54:39.300 --> 01:54:40.560
No, okay, good.

2642
01:54:46.619 --> 01:54:50.579
You've been listening to Untitled Star Trek Project with Joe Ford

2643
01:54:50.579 --> 01:54:51.779
and Nathan Bottomley.

2644
01:54:51.779 --> 01:54:55.439
We're online at Untitled Star Trek Project.com where you can find

2645
01:54:55.439 --> 01:54:58.079
subscription links and links to our social media accounts.

2646
01:54:58.140 --> 01:55:02.039
Our podcast artwork is by Kayla Ciceran, and the theme was

2647
01:55:02.039 --> 01:55:03.779
composed by Cameron Larm.

2648
01:55:03.840 --> 01:55:07.920
This episode was recorded on the 6th of August 2024 and released

2649
01:55:07.920 --> 01:55:09.359
on the 16th of August.

2650
01:55:09.420 --> 01:55:13.920
We'll see you next time for Star Trek Deep Space 9 and Pop Nore.

2651
01:55:34.979 --> 01:55:36.840
God, it's been so long since I've seen that.

2652
01:55:36.899 --> 01:55:37.739
It might be great.

2653
01:55:37.800 --> 01:55:39.180
I can't even remember.

2654
01:55:39.420 --> 01:55:41.399
Charles is off.

2655
01:55:42.479 --> 01:55:46.680
I seem to remember it's fairly well directed.

2656
01:55:46.739 --> 01:55:50.460
I think that's Mike Vajar, who did, like, change your face of

2657
01:55:50.460 --> 01:55:50.699
evil.

2658
01:55:50.760 --> 01:55:54.000
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. mention him several times, I think.

2659
01:55:54.060 --> 01:55:56.159
Oh well, let's find out.

2660
01:55:56.220 --> 01:55:57.060
All right.

2661
01:55:57.119 --> 01:55:57.600
Okay.

2662
01:55:57.659 --> 01:56:01.680
He won't have to phone in web and he won't have the corn in it.

2663
01:56:01.739 --> 01:56:03.060
But it does have Garak.

2664
01:56:03.119 --> 01:56:04.859
Yeah, that's something.

2665
01:56:04.920 --> 01:56:05.819
He's pretty great.

2666
01:56:05.880 --> 01:56:07.020
Have we outed yet?

2667
01:56:07.079 --> 01:56:09.539
I'm not entirely sure How did what?

2668
01:56:09.600 --> 01:56:10.380
The episode.

2669
01:56:10.500 --> 01:56:12.659
Choosing this episode.

2670
01:56:14.039 --> 01:56:16.079
Have we out of there?

2671
01:56:16.140 --> 01:56:18.420
Yeah, have we, you know, the bit where we stopped talking about

2672
01:56:18.420 --> 01:56:19.319
choosing the episode.

2673
01:56:19.380 --> 01:56:21.420
Have we reached the end of that?

2674
01:56:21.479 --> 01:56:22.199
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2675
01:56:22.199 --> 01:56:23.100
And now we're just talking?

2676
01:56:23.100 --> 01:56:24.659
Or are we just talking?

2677
01:56:24.659 --> 01:56:25.800
No, no, no.

2678
01:56:25.859 --> 01:56:26.939
I noticed a bit.

2679
01:56:27.000 --> 01:56:29.819
I noticed a bit, which I e-marked for the end of it.

2680
01:56:29.880 --> 01:56:30.539
Oh, okay.

2681
01:56:30.600 --> 01:56:31.140
Yeah.

2682
01:56:31.199 --> 01:56:32.699
Yeah, murder we loaded.

2683
01:56:32.760 --> 01:56:34.920
Starfleet cadets Yeah.

2684
01:56:34.979 --> 01:56:37.260
And none of them learning available lesson about themselves.

2685
01:56:37.319 --> 01:56:38.579
Oh, yeah, that's great.

2686
01:56:38.640 --> 01:56:39.840
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2687
01:56:39.899 --> 01:56:40.920
Yes.

2688
01:56:40.979 --> 01:56:43.920
Yeah, we should, I mean, we'll do all this possible at some point

2689
01:56:43.920 --> 01:56:48.060
because it is pretty good, and it is a standalone in series four

2690
01:56:48.060 --> 01:56:49.859
which is a thing.

2691
01:56:50.220 --> 01:56:52.020
Discovery is now.

2692
01:56:52.079 --> 01:56:53.220
Now we've got...

2693
01:56:53.279 --> 01:56:56.760
We've got our actual finite amount of discovery episodes.

2694
01:56:56.819 --> 01:56:58.800
So the percentage will now only go down.

2695
01:56:58.859 --> 01:57:00.060
It can never go up.

2696
01:57:00.119 --> 01:57:00.600
Yes.

2697
01:57:00.659 --> 01:57:01.260
Well, up.

2698
01:57:01.319 --> 01:57:03.960
It'll go up to the percentage of ones that we've done.

2699
01:57:04.079 --> 01:57:04.739
Yeah, yeah.

2700
01:57:04.800 --> 01:57:09.479
Yes, but that's true of all of the series, except for lower text.

2701
01:57:09.600 --> 01:57:13.319
And Strange New Worlds. and Stranger Worlds.

2702
01:57:13.380 --> 01:57:17.760
And Star Trek Academy, which will eventually end up on the random

2703
01:57:17.760 --> 01:57:18.779
which is going to come.

2704
01:57:18.840 --> 01:57:19.260
Thatll be cool.

2705
01:57:19.380 --> 01:57:20.279
Yeah.

2706
01:57:20.340 --> 01:57:21.300
Yeah.

2707
01:57:21.420 --> 01:57:24.600
And we've got we've got one more series of lower decks coming

2708
01:57:24.600 --> 01:57:25.319
later this season.

2709
01:57:25.380 --> 01:57:29.279
Oh, and only murders and only murders in the building is out in

2710
01:57:29.279 --> 01:57:33.840
October on August the 27th, like in just a couple weeks.

2711
01:57:34.199 --> 01:57:36.600
I'm so enjoying that and I don't know why we stopped watching it.

2712
01:57:36.659 --> 01:57:40.680
I think it's because we've got we've got all of these shows we're

2713
01:57:40.680 --> 01:57:43.739
juggling and none of them, we just need to watch one.

2714
01:57:43.800 --> 01:57:44.699
You know?

2715
01:57:44.760 --> 01:57:47.640
I've watched the 1st episode of this Obi-Wan Kenobi.

2716
01:57:47.699 --> 01:57:50.520
And like in central, I want to watch the next one because I know

2717
01:57:50.520 --> 01:57:51.119
what a happen is.

2718
01:57:51.180 --> 01:57:53.460
You'll go, oh, let's try this and then that's another one that

2719
01:57:53.460 --> 01:57:55.319
will get shelved for 10 years.

2720
01:57:55.380 --> 01:57:58.859
Um, that was...

2721
01:57:58.859 --> 01:58:01.260
Well, because when I go to Robert's place, That was our show.

2722
01:58:01.319 --> 01:58:04.260
Like we would watch only motors in the building when it came out.

2723
01:58:04.319 --> 01:58:07.800
And, you know, it's so clever and so funny.

2724
01:58:07.920 --> 01:58:13.439
Yeah, I love wonderful. name director I love him so much.

2725
01:58:13.500 --> 01:58:15.779
Oh, Martin Short's character.

2726
01:58:15.899 --> 01:58:16.859
Did you say that again, please?

2727
01:58:16.920 --> 01:58:17.939
But with more meaning?

2728
01:58:18.359 --> 01:58:19.920
So good.

2729
01:58:19.979 --> 01:58:23.640
But just Selena Gomez is kind of going, oh my god.

2730
01:58:23.699 --> 01:58:27.960
Like these weird octogenarians that I'm kind of lumbered with is

2731
01:58:27.960 --> 01:58:28.319
so funny.

2732
01:58:28.380 --> 01:58:29.819
So great.

2733
01:58:29.880 --> 01:58:37.739
But I've got to say, I could not believe how visually stunning Obi

2734
01:58:36.720 --> 01:58:38.399
Wan Kenobi was.

2735
01:58:38.460 --> 01:58:41.340
I just was like, I kept saying to Mark, I can't believe this is

2736
01:58:41.340 --> 01:58:41.880
telly.

2737
01:58:41.939 --> 01:58:44.880
I cannot believe I'm watching TV.

2738
01:58:44.880 --> 01:58:45.779
Mandalorian.

2739
01:58:45.840 --> 01:58:49.619
Well, that's on this run, so I will watch the Mandalorian because

2740
01:58:49.619 --> 01:58:51.539
we're doing the whole lot through in order.

2741
01:58:51.960 --> 01:58:57.479
Okay, because I, I mean, I like the Mandalorian until it gets too

2742
01:58:57.479 --> 01:58:59.399
Star Wars, Ian, and I don't give a shit.

2743
01:58:59.699 --> 01:59:03.119
I was so drab looking.

2744
01:59:03.180 --> 01:59:05.100
I couldn't believe it.

2745
01:59:05.220 --> 01:59:07.500
Yeah, blue, you know?

2746
01:59:07.560 --> 01:59:09.539
It was like series 9 of Doctor Who.

2747
01:59:09.600 --> 01:59:10.619
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2748
01:59:10.680 --> 01:59:11.579
Show me some green.

2749
01:59:12.899 --> 01:59:19.739
The, like, like, I thought, you know, because you've got Tandy

2750
01:59:19.739 --> 01:59:24.300
Newton and you've got, you know, um, Woody Harrelson and you've

2751
01:59:24.300 --> 01:59:26.579
got all of these people who are actually really good actors and

2752
01:59:26.579 --> 01:59:26.939
stuff.

2753
01:59:27.539 --> 01:59:30.060
He's Woody Harrelson, isn't he?

2754
01:59:30.119 --> 01:59:31.260
Is he in it?

2755
01:59:31.319 --> 01:59:33.000
Oh, in a dreamy?

2756
01:59:33.060 --> 01:59:33.960
Yeah, no, he is, yeah.

2757
01:59:34.020 --> 01:59:35.880
Yeah, like it's got good actors, isn't it?

2758
01:59:35.939 --> 01:59:37.800
Mia Clark was good in it as well, I thought.

2759
01:59:37.859 --> 01:59:43.500
Beautiful, um, um, what's his face, who plays Lando?

2760
01:59:43.619 --> 01:59:46.260
Oh, Donald Glover.

2761
01:59:46.319 --> 01:59:47.279
Donald Glover.

2762
01:59:47.340 --> 01:59:47.579
Yeah.

2763
01:59:47.640 --> 01:59:49.079
I think he's tremendous.

2764
01:59:49.140 --> 01:59:51.180
He was the best thing, isn't it?

2765
01:59:51.239 --> 01:59:52.619
His lando was so accurate.

2766
01:59:52.680 --> 01:59:54.060
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

2767
01:59:54.060 --> 01:59:59.819
I didn't think the solo man, though, was...

2768
01:59:59.819 --> 02:00:03.779
I think just, yeah, I think recasting, like, if you're going to

2769
02:00:03.779 --> 02:00:07.619
keep hauling these characters out, you have to recasting.

2770
02:00:07.619 --> 02:00:09.720
It's so interesting here, because that one bombed.

2771
02:00:09.779 --> 02:00:13.380
And so they were going to do 2 sequels and then, yeah, yeah.

2772
02:00:14.039 --> 02:00:20.039
Well, like, people think Rogue One is better, but I think, like

2773
02:00:20.039 --> 02:00:22.859
Rogue One's visually more interesting, but there's so many men in

2774
02:00:22.859 --> 02:00:25.680
it, and like, it's been cut to ribbons, so I don't know what

2775
02:00:25.680 --> 02:00:30.779
Felicity Jones's character stands for or is doing.

2776
02:00:30.840 --> 02:00:34.619
And then they get those elements and they bring them all, like, and

2777
02:00:34.619 --> 02:00:36.359
Cassian Andor is super boring.

2778
02:00:36.420 --> 02:00:42.840
And then they make Fiona Shaw, his mother, and they bring, you

2779
02:00:42.840 --> 02:00:47.640
know, those elements into Andor, and I think Andor's just

2780
02:00:47.640 --> 02:00:48.420
terrific.

2781
02:00:48.539 --> 02:00:52.380
We watched all the trailers for all the shows and that one was the

2782
02:00:52.380 --> 02:00:54.300
one visually, the trailer stood out to me.

2783
02:00:54.420 --> 02:00:58.199
Yeah, and Mon Mothma's in it, like the woman who plays Mon Mothma

2784
02:00:58.199 --> 02:01:00.060
in...

2785
02:01:00.060 --> 02:01:02.760
It might be a bit too much of a reference for me. don't know who

2786
02:01:02.760 --> 02:01:03.119
that is.

2787
02:01:03.180 --> 02:01:07.560
The woman who plays, so Monmouth is in Return of the Jedi, and

2788
02:01:07.560 --> 02:01:11.159
she's the woman who says, Benny Botham's died to bring us this

2789
02:01:11.159 --> 02:01:11.760
information.

2790
02:01:11.819 --> 02:01:18.659
You know, the woman who gives the briefing, you know, um, and then

2791
02:01:18.659 --> 02:01:24.659
she, she's like, um, Felicity Jones's antagonist in Road Guan, and

2792
02:01:24.659 --> 02:01:28.020
she's Senator Monmoutha, and she's super posh with this sort of

2793
02:01:28.020 --> 02:01:28.920
cut glass accent.

2794
02:01:28.979 --> 02:01:30.779
Oh, even though I think Oh, I remember.

2795
02:01:30.840 --> 02:01:35.520
Yeah, and she's played by an Australian hilariously. and she's

2796
02:01:35.520 --> 02:01:40.439
fucking fabulous in in Andor.

2797
02:01:40.500 --> 02:01:41.159
She's so good.

2798
02:01:41.220 --> 02:01:42.960
And the new companion.

2799
02:01:43.020 --> 02:01:48.779
And the new Doctor Who companion is also in it as a, um, you know

2800
02:01:48.779 --> 02:01:49.319
character.

2801
02:01:49.380 --> 02:01:57.899
She's, she's the girlfriend of Shona from last Christmas, who is

2802
02:01:57.899 --> 02:02:04.319
also a very posh rebel who, um, yeah, like, I think it's really

2803
02:02:04.319 --> 02:02:06.899
good, and it's so beautifully written.

2804
02:02:06.960 --> 02:02:09.659
There's some great speeches and some terrific acting in it.

2805
02:02:09.720 --> 02:02:11.520
Like I just thought it was fucking great.

2806
02:02:11.579 --> 02:02:14.100
And I don't care about any of the law heavy stuff.

2807
02:02:14.159 --> 02:02:16.619
And like I wasn't going to watch Obi-Wan.

2808
02:02:16.680 --> 02:02:18.899
I wasn't going to watch the book of Boba Fett. like I just thought

2809
02:02:18.899 --> 02:02:20.279
those are for other people to enjoy.

2810
02:02:20.340 --> 02:02:23.640
But people started talking about Andor and I believed them and

2811
02:02:23.640 --> 02:02:25.140
they're fucking so good.

2812
02:02:25.439 --> 02:02:31.020
I think it, like, Ewan McGregor wants to be there, you know, what

2813
02:02:31.020 --> 02:02:31.500
can I be?

2814
02:02:31.560 --> 02:02:33.239
And the difference in his performance.

2815
02:02:33.300 --> 02:02:38.039
Yeah, he's like, that would be properly acting in that, you know?

2816
02:02:38.100 --> 02:02:39.659
Yeah, okay, which is great.

2817
02:02:39.720 --> 02:02:44.159
But just a little girl that they've got playing Leia, it's

2818
02:02:44.159 --> 02:02:45.600
sublime.

2819
02:02:45.960 --> 02:02:50.699
She's like 8 years old and she's acting all of these adults off

2820
02:02:50.699 --> 02:02:51.119
the screen.

2821
02:02:51.180 --> 02:02:52.260
She's amazing.

2822
02:02:52.319 --> 02:02:54.960
And she's a total cow as well.

2823
02:02:55.619 --> 02:02:57.420
Really fun.

2824
02:02:57.479 --> 02:02:59.819
I was like, I wasn't sure what to expect.

2825
02:02:59.880 --> 02:03:00.960
I got to go to that episode.

2826
02:03:01.020 --> 02:03:02.279
I was like, yeah, next one please.

2827
02:03:02.399 --> 02:03:04.739
Yeah, okay. that's really good